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Old 04-29-2018, 06:58 AM   #1
R.R.J Tolkien
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The Army of the Dead- Movie vs Books

So i read a great essay on the army of the dead found here.


Answerer: can the Dead Men (Army of the Dead) kill people?
https://terpconnect.umd.edu/~jkeener...n/deadmen.html

"There has been considerable pushback from book fans to the depiction of the Dead Men as an essentially invincible force. To be clear, there is nothing in the books to suggest that the Dead had the ability to slaughter tens of thousands of soldiers in a matter of minutes. "

So what are everyone thoughts, did the movies portray the army of the dead in a lore accurate manner [besides them fighting at the battle of the pelennor fields] or did they overpower them for movie effects.
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Old 04-29-2018, 07:07 AM   #2
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I only saw the PJ movies once, so my memory of the scene is (thankfully) hazy.

The book, however, seems to indicate the Dead, like the Nazgūl, relied primarily on the dread that accompanied them to achieve victory.

Gimli described the scenario:

Quote:
'Pale swords were drawn; but I know not whether their blades would still bite, for the Dead no longer needed any weapon but fear. None would withstand them.'
ROTK The Last Debate

Since they were dead, unlike the Ringwraiths, they should not have still had physical bodies. That would preclude any ability to actually fight.
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Old 04-29-2018, 07:50 AM   #3
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A sea of green slime that overwhelms enemies by swarming over them like an army of ants and... what exactly? How is it that movie-army of the dead kills their victims? Seriously, they reminded me of some termite or piranha attack, where they cover a victim completely and in two seconds there's nothing left. My memory of the movie isn't best either, so if the movie actually shows how the dead kill people please correct me.


As for the book-army of the dead, I agree with Zil. The dead inspire fear. They did not directly kill anyone - the corsairs just fled from terror, and the Gondorian slaves would have fled too if not for their chains. Certainly everyone on land would have fled if it wasn't for Aragorn. It's a fear that doesn't discriminate.

Now the Nazgul also work by fear, but that fear does discriminate. Their foes drop their weapons, fall down helplessly, lose their purpose, but their armies rush forward madly because even sure death is better than facing the Nazgul's wrath. It is curious - a hypothetical scenario - what would happen to the fear balance if the book dead did come to Pelannor Fields. Probably nothing good to the men fighting outside the walls of the city, but what about Sauron's army?
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Old 04-29-2018, 08:04 AM   #4
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On the point that essay makes about who broke Baldor's legs, I must say that I never thought the Dead did it, but rather, as the essay itself considers, individuals from the still-living remnant of their society (which had completely died out by the end of the Third Age several centuries later). It never even crossed my mind that the Dead were responsible.

The film isn't exactly clear on how the Dead hurt anyone anyway. They seem to just sort of wash about like the tide and things fall over. Then again I could be misremembering. I haven't watched Jackson's Return of the King in about ten years.
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Old 04-29-2018, 11:05 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Zigūr View Post
The film isn't exactly clear on how the Dead hurt anyone anyway. They seem to just sort of wash about like the tide and things fall over. Then again I could be misremembering. I haven't watched Jackson's Return of the King in about ten years.
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Old 05-02-2018, 12:02 PM   #6
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I know a lot of book fans weren't fans of it. But it was the only way to have Aragorn and Co. arriving to save the day without introducing either Elrond's sons or a lot of Gondorian nobles and their retinues and having the audience go "who are these people?"

So it was a creative choice I understand.
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