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Pervinca Took 07-01-2013 08:52 AM

If Elrohir was slightly close, I'm wondering about Elured and Elurin.

I wonder if the "record" part is an element like LP or EP.

It can't be Ereinion - no h. Actually no h in the others, either!

No, none of them work. ;)

Mithalwen 07-01-2013 11:10 AM

You wonder correctly about the record. But that isnt the way that Elrohir was close...he was warm but Elladan, Elured and Lurin and even my current darling would be rqually tepid.

Pervinca Took 07-01-2013 11:49 AM

ELPHIR - eldest son of Prince Imrahil.

(Courtesy of Tolkien Gateway).

Mithalwen 07-01-2013 11:53 AM

Bingo...yes on the greyscale minute font om my kindle I nearly read Elphir for Elrohir. Well done ! And to Nerwen and Galadriel .

Pervinca Took 07-01-2013 12:43 PM

Thank you - that was a good password! And excellent clues.

Here's one I made earlier:


1. Highway disturbed for a prolific writer.
2. Ethic shaken to shed light.
3. Gulf around complicated blow for this further complicated maiden.
4. Fairiesí midwife adds breathing organ for a purposeful wanderer.
5. Soared around to locate a mead-hall.
6. Hair loss from anxiety reveals a rare female.

Mithalwen 07-01-2013 01:14 PM

I will guess Mablung for four. Bit of Shakespear I do remember! Queen Mab ..ranger of Ithilien or Thingol's lieutenant.

Pervinca Took 07-01-2013 01:36 PM

Well done! I will edit your answer in later. Have to pop out for an hour or so.

Edit: now done.

1. Highway disturbed for a prolific writer.
2. Ethic shaken to shed light.
3. Gulf around complicated blow for this further complicated maiden.
MABLUNG: Fairies’ midwife adds breathing organ for a purposeful wanderer.
5. Soared around to locate a mead-hall.
6. Hair loss from anxiety reveals a rare female.

Mithalwen 07-02-2013 03:37 AM

Might one be Dora Baggins recipient of the wastr paper basket? Dora is an anagram of road.

Galadriel55 07-02-2013 04:45 PM

5. Edoras (anagram of soared)

Galadriel55 07-02-2013 05:15 PM

And is the password Dolmed?

Pervinca Took 07-03-2013 12:23 AM

Well done, all correct. Sorry guys, the computer was playing up last night and I couldn't get in and post.

DORA (BAGGINS): Highway disturbed for a prolific writer.
O: Ethic shaken to shed light.
L: Gulf around complicated blow for this further complicated maiden.
MABLUNG: Fairies’ midwife adds breathing organ for a purposeful wanderer.
EDORAS: Soared around to locate a mead-hall.
D: Hair loss from anxiety reveals a rare female.

Mithalwen 07-03-2013 02:00 AM

I had to look up Dolmed... bad Tolkienista...

Is 2 Ormal...anagram of moral and after a bit or memory digging the lamp that wasn't Iluin
And I fear 3 could be She who raises my blood pressure, anagram of lune and hit, dozy selfish Felagund murdering canary daughter of Thingol.

Pervinca Took 07-03-2013 02:46 PM

Both correct. I came across Dolmed when looking through the names index of The Silmarillion, and liked it so much I wanted to make a password out of it.

anagram of lune and hit, dozy selfish Felagund murdering canary daughter of Thingol.

Yes, put "Lune" around a mixed up version of "hit," then complicate it a bit further by shifting around the n and the e.

Luthien doesn't make my blood boil, but she and Beren aren't my favourites, and neither is their story. Nor is Turin.

It's the Fins who really move me and are my favourites in the Sil. Fingolfin, Finrod Felagund, and I have a lot of time for Fingon, too.

There's something rather special about guys with names beginning with F in Tolkien.

And now: over to Galadriel! Whoops - hang on - not just yet - there's one more clue to be guessed:

DORA (BAGGINS): Highway disturbed for a prolific writer.
ORMAL: Ethic shaken to shed light.
LUTHIEN: Gulf around complicated blow for this further complicated maiden.
MABLUNG: Fairies’ midwife adds breathing organ for a purposeful wanderer.
EDORAS: Soared around to locate a mead-hall.
D: Hair loss from anxiety reveals a rare female.

Mithalwen 07-03-2013 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took (Post 684775)
Both correct. I came across Dolmed when looking through the names index of The Silmarillion, and liked it so much I wanted to make a password out of it.

Luthien doesn't make my blood boil, but she and Beren aren't my favourites, and neither is their story. Nor is Turin.

It's the Fins who really move me and are my favourites in the Sil. Fingolfin, Finrod Felagund, and I have quite a lot of time for Fingon, too.

There's something rather special about guys with names beginning with F in Tolkien.

!

What about the last D?

Yes..I would add Finellach to that list.. and Finarfin for having the courage to turn back. Glorfindel is good too..no wonder elves hace a thing about nice hair... Tuor wins over his cousin for me..

Pervinca Took 07-03-2013 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen (Post 684776)
What about the last D?

Yes..I would add Finellach to that list.. and Finarfin for having the courage to turn back. Glorfindel is good too..no wonder elves hace a thing about nice hair... Tuor wins over his cousin for me..

Yes, it often takes more courage to turn back than to go on. It did feel just a little like he was deserting his son and brother, though ... I'll have to read it again and think what I feel next time.

Would agree. Always been fond of Gil-Galad. The G's are mostly a great bunch too (the best villain is one of them, but also Grima, who doesn't really have any redeeming features at all).

And of course there is Faramir - and my favourite of the whole lot, Frodo.

Tuor's cousin - is that Turin? Feeling dim today.

Mith - see my edit, made once I'd realised there was still the last clue to go.

Galadriel55 07-03-2013 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took (Post 684777)
Would agree. Always been fond of Gil-Galad. The G's are mostly a great bunch too (the best villain is one of them, but also Grima, who doesn't really have any redeeming features at all).

Hmm, I wouldn't say that. I think he gets his fair share of pathos at the end of the book.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca
Tuor's cousin - is that Turin? Feeling dim today.

Yes. Turin's my favourite, but no one shares my POV. :)

I'll guess DIS for the last one, simply because her name starts with D and she's the only known Dwarf female. I guess it's distress - tress = dis.

Pervinca Took 07-03-2013 03:30 PM

Indeed it is - over to you, Galadriel!

Hmm, I wouldn't say that. I think he gets his fair share of pathos at the end of the book.

OK - I admit that Lotho probably didn't taste very nice.

DORA (BAGGINS): Highway disturbed for a prolific writer.
ORMAL: Ethic shaken to shed light.
LUTHIEN: Gulf around complicated blow for this further complicated maiden.
MABLUNG: Fairies’ midwife adds breathing organ for a purposeful wanderer.
EDORAS: Soared around to locate a mead-hall.
DIS: Hair loss from anxiety reveals a rare female.

EDIT:

Yes. Turin's my favourite, but no one shares my POV.

I don't dislike Turin. Actually, I really want to slap his mum, for loving one child more than another and for telling him that Laughter is dead in the house because Urwen is dead and then saying in what seems to me like mardy resentment: "But you live still, son of Hurin (or was it Morwen?), and so does the enemy that has done this to us." And yes, I know she's just lost her daughter.

Mithalwen 07-03-2013 03:45 PM

Turin's is a great story but he is ao bloody minded it ia hard not to think s ome of his woes are down to self not Morgoth. AND HE KILLS BELEG..Beleg another noble self sacrificing elf.. Finarfin at least returns to wife....

Pervinca Took 07-03-2013 03:55 PM

Well, like I said (sort of), I in part blame his mother for the personality he developed.

Actually, I wonder if there's a very slight tone of the goading mother/wife figure of the Norse sagas in Morwen.

Mithalwen 07-03-2013 04:11 PM

Oh Morwen is a pill...ugh

I know Tolkien idolised his own mother but there are so many mothers who fail their children albeit often inadvertantly by dying that I can't help wondering if there was some latent resentment. Mind you for a good catholuc there is quite a bitvof wife abandonment too.

Galadriel55 07-03-2013 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took (Post 684779)
I don't dislike Turin. Actually, I really want to slap his mum, for loving one child more than another and for telling him that Laughter is dead in the house because Urwen is dead and then saying in what seems to me like mardy resentment: "But you live still, son of Hurin (or was it Morwen?), and so does the enemy that has done this to us." And yes, I know she's just lost her daughter.

Ah well. I rather like Morwen too, but no one really shares that POV either. :)

I actually don't have anything prepared, but I will in less than a day or two. I'll put it up ASAP.

Pervinca Took 07-04-2013 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen (Post 684782)
Oh Morwen is a pill...ugh

I know Tolkien idolised his own mother but there are so many mothers who fail their children albeit often inadvertantly by dying that I can't help wondering if there was some latent resentment. Mind you for a good catholuc there is quite a bitvof wife abandonment too.

Perhaps still a part of his being a good Catholic - not ignoring sin and showing the devastating consequences of it?

Then there is Miriel, who (in a sense) abandons both husband and child - perhaps with the worst consequences of all the deeds of someone not actually evil.

Look forward, Galadriel. :)

Mithalwen 07-04-2013 01:24 AM

I don't know. I wonder if Sam and Merry and Pippin's families minded that they chose to spend their final years with their friends not them..and sam is ready to abandon Rose and baby Elanor when Frodo.

Pervinca Took 07-04-2013 09:51 AM

When does Sam show himself ready to abandon Rose and baby Elanor? He says "And I can't come." He knows he can't leave them, and so does Frodo.

Sam doesn't sail west until Rosie is dead. Yes, he leaves his chidren, but most if not all of them are settled, with families of their own. And losing Frodo sixty years earlier was a pretty big deal. He only leaves baby Elanor for a fortnight.

I suppose we're supposed to assume that Merry and Pippin's wives are already dead too.

Mithalwen 07-04-2013 12:20 PM

Maybe I have been unfair since I have been misreading that as a question. It could be can't as in not permitted to take the straight road. Frodo's response hints at that interpretation as does Sam's original statement of well I've come back...

Galadriel55 07-04-2013 06:16 PM

Ok, here it is... with a twist. Hope it was worth the wait.

1. Confused others swallow black on veiled river
2. MORANNON Girl in insult in gate
3. FORNOST Wood looses direction but gains negative city
4. One uncooked Vala
5. Ancestor of such points to half-elf
6. One point surround gift under water

Happy riddling!

Pervinca Took 07-05-2013 12:03 AM

2. Girl in insult in gate
 
Just wondering if that could be MorANNon.

I saw the word "moan" and thought "that's not really an insult," but now I've just typed it above, I see "moron," which definitely is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen (Post 684794)
Maybe I have been unfair since I have been misreading that as a question. It could be can't as in not permitted to take the straight road. Frodo's response hints at that interpretation as does Sam's original statement of well I've come back...

Sam could possibly mean both at once, but I think his main weighting would be that he can't go now he has a wife and child. As Frodo said earlier, "You can't go far or for a long time now, of course." Also Frodo knew that sailing west when he still had most of his life ahead of him was not right for Sam, family or no family, and was happy and I think relieved that Sam wanted to marry Rose and had so much "to enjoy, and to be, and to do."

I would guess that the issue of Sam also being permitted passage west as a Ringbearer would have come up in the talks JRRT tells us must have taken place between Frodo and the various bearers of the Three in Minas Tirith and (more especially) in Rivendell), and perhaps along the road between the two. There is a strong sense of knowing when a person's time has or hasn't come and respecting and honouring that in Tolkien (amongst the wise, with a capital and with a small W). It's when, for instance, Numenoreans try to cling on to life for too long that decay is setting in and disaster isn't that far away.

Quote:

Maybe I have been unfair since I have been misreading that as a question.
Well, I remember that William Nighy's Sam pronounced it as a question. ;)


5. Ancestor of such points to half-elf

If you remove the geographical points (N E S W) from ELROND you get "lord," and if you do the same to EARENDIL you get "laird" (Scottish for "lord.")

That doesn't really mean ancestor, though ... one might almost called a forefather one's "lord," but it's stretching it a bit. Hmmm ....

Unless AR can be short for ancestor (first and last letter) plus WEN (three of the main compass points).

Ah hang on - the ancestor of the half-elf is the one we're looking for. Back to drawing board.


3. Wood looses direction but gains negative city

I'm going to guess FORNOST for this.

FOREST for wood, lose the E for direction, gain NO for Fornost.

Galadriel55 07-05-2013 03:33 PM

2 and 3 are correct (to be edited in later). Don't overthink 5. You understand the clue, you just need to find the right ancestor and the right half-elf.

Mithalwen 07-06-2013 05:38 AM

Wondering about Elrohir for 5 though I my be fixating on the lord from Pervinca's thoughts on elrond.Take the S from Elros and you get Elro. Hir means lord and it also aounds like here which could be a point since it indicates location.

Mithalwen 07-06-2013 06:05 AM

More confidently Araw for one uncooked Vala..I discover it is the sindar name for Orome.

Oh and the twist means we aren't looking for initials, yes?

Galadriel55 07-06-2013 06:51 AM

1. Confused others swallow black on veiled river
2. MORANNON Girl in insult in gate
3. FORNOST Wood looses direction but gains negative city
4. ARAW One uncooked Vala
5. Ancestor of such points to half-elf
6. One point surround gift under water


Not Elrohir, but continue looking around his folk. Remember, you're looking for the ancestor.

Mithalwen 07-06-2013 07:33 AM

Ah could it be Earwen, great grandmother of Arwen losing E to form name?

Galadriel55 07-06-2013 12:55 PM

Indeed it could.

1. Confused others swallow black on veiled river
2. MORANNON Girl in insult in gate
3. FORNOST Wood looses direction but gains negative city
4. ARAW One uncooked Vala
5. EARWEN Ancestor of such points to half-elf
6. One point surround gift under water

And forgot to say this last time - yes, the twist is that the letters aren't arranged in the typical manner.

Mithalwen 07-09-2013 04:04 AM

I think Gwathlo can be interpreted as veiled river but I can't get it to eork in any of its names...nor morthonf.

Galadriel55 07-09-2013 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen (Post 684928)
I think Gwathlo can be interpreted as veiled river but I can't get it to eork in any of its names...nor morthonf.

Here's a hint: the clue says on veiled river. But either way, neither Gwathlo nor Morthond and the river.

Mithalwen 07-09-2013 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55 (Post 684929)
Here's a hint: the clue says on veiled river. But either way, neither Gwathlo nor Morthond and the river.

I did wonder about the on but having wrong river srtymied..

Pervinca Took 07-09-2013 08:13 AM

There's Esgaroth on the Long Lake, which contains "others" mixed up. Does "gar" mean black in Elvish? I was looking for ebon in a name for a while - or jet, (but to a lesser extent, because there aren't that many J's in Tolkien's names, IIRC).

Mithalwen 07-09-2013 08:16 AM

Mor is dark or black. Dur can be dark too.

Pervinca Took 07-09-2013 08:22 AM

You're right Mithalwen - have been looking in an online Elvish dictionary, and neither gar, rag nor arg mean black. Back to drawing board.

Galadriel55 07-09-2013 02:05 PM

Here are more clues.

1. Think "Black" in a European language.
2. Think First Age.
3. Think of how you can refer to others.

That should help.


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