Tol-in-Gaurhoth XV-The Villagers Strike Back!

[Boromir88]

The thing is if you are Dragluin you cannot be sure of Farael's guilt. I would surely love to put my trust in you Alpha Female, but seeing as you say you are Dragluin, there is no way you can be sure of Farael's guilt. Also, no one's stepped out to refute Farael's claim, so it makes me thinks he is indeed our Hunter. Though I have been fooled in the past.

Farael's action yesterday of going against Meneltarmacil seemed to be based off of that he attacked me for attacking him, then all of a sudden Menel started attacking him. Which either seems like Menel is Sauron or Menel is a hero. Again, I stick to it that what a blunderous slip up it would be if a hero disguising as Carcharoth would "take down" the very person they unsuccessfully killed the night before.

It's pretty clear and evident that the Heroes thought Meneltarmacil was Sauron, and is a noble sacrifice. To be able to pull off a successful Sauron guise like Menel has done, he had to be right about something. Perhaps we should look through his posts to see what there is?

[Mithalwen]

Well I don't trust him and I can't know true... but basically now even if he is Carcaroth the only way he is any use is if we lynch him. The heroes aren't going to touch him during the day IF he is innocent. Maybe the true Carcharoth hasn't been back yet or seeing how I have been treated doesn't trust you guys.

[Mithalwen]

MEnel led the second attack on Rune. He was on the money. That is why I realsied my mistake and protected him.

Farael made him his target after I had givcen an enormous hint. Therefore I felt (in the 30 minute of seriously slow connection I had before voting closed) I had to protect the know innocent. You cannot be surprised that he is not my favourite person.
Even if he is ?Carcharoth he will be as much use as a chocolate teapot now. As a device to survive until the end it works well.i

[mormegil]

GARN! Well I'm glad they didn't kill Sauron the idiots. But everything went horribly wrong yesterday. Had Menel been Sauron we would have lost a lot of information. Whatever happens today I would like to see a double devouring which includes Wayne. His lack of attention to any detail annoys me and is worthy of death. I really didn't think Nonna was guilty, but I felt forced to vote for him because of Wayne's vote for Farael. It appears at a minimum idiotic and at worst heroic. I say he MUST die today.

Mithalwen I do believe you and Farael and unless somebody claims otherwise I will look to you two for guidance and some clairvoyance to our council. Dependent upon what Sauron knows it may be prudent for him or her to step forward. Unless the moronic heroes have a better idea of who Sauron is than currently they will more than likely go for you Mith. A very sad and tragic loss indeed however you served a very good purpose and have been noble in you sacrifice. No longer will I insult you for you are worthy of praise.

[Boromir88]

Well, if Farael isn't the real Carcharoth and the "true" Carcharoth steps out obviously one of them is a hero. So, we either lynch the hero, or lynch Carcharoth and command him to take down the hero. So, it does no good if the real Carcharoth is simply staying back and hiding.

If Farael is the real Carcharoth then you probably are right in that the heroes aren't going to go after him, so why lynch a gifted? And the reason I didn't want Farael lynched yesterday was because if he was Carcharoth the last person he chose to go down most likely would have been Meneltarmacil. So, we would be down the hunter and what we all feared the loss of Sauron.

Though you are right unless the heroes spot Sauron, you will probably be dead tonight Mith.

[Mithalwen]

Well even I started to doubt Menel was Sauron but he was clearly the most vulnerable. I ma so angry that I was forced out for nothing. The wolves may not have Sauron but they will surely take out the certain gifted tonight before I can protect anyone else :rolleyes: .

I have admitted that I was wrong in voting for Menel bu tI redeemed myself. IU alone spotted that SpM was not a good wolf. All Farael has done is vote for innocents & force me to break cover. Why don't you start looking at him a bit closer? So many people suspected him early, why do you all accept his word instantly.

Don't you think it was a bit sus that he suggested that a hero might pretend to be a gifted, was told it was a ridiculous idea noone would believe it and then pretended to be a gifted?

[Boromir88]

We have 11 villagers left (not including myself, because this is my own theory). 11 villagers left...

I trust Mith and Farael as innocent and their claims true. Giving me 9 unknowns.

If Sauron steps out it will be 8 unknowns. However, I don't think Sauron should step out unless he has spotted another hero, or atleast 2 living innocents. If he knows a hero, we will have 1 to go.

If he knows 2 live innocents we will have 6 unkowns, with 2 heroes amongst them, giving us a good advantage as to who to go after. Without their Huan, while the heroes pick off the gifteds it should give us enough time to find the two remaining heroes. However, I don't think Sauron should reveal himself if he hasn't spotted a hero, or if he doesn't know currently 2 living innocents.

[Mithalwen]

If Farael is the real Carcharoth then you probably are right in that the heroes aren't going to go after him, so why lynch a gifted? And the reason I didn't want Farael lynched yesterday was because if he was Carcharoth the last person he chose to go down most likely would have been Meneltarmacil. So, we would be down the hunter and what we all feared the loss of Sauron.

[/B].

Well If you had bothered to read the rules before you threw that spanner in the worksyou would have seen that if Carcharoth is devoured by night he gets to choose a new wolf to die with him. It is only by day when there going to be no new information that he submists a fixed choice.

[Mithalwen]

"Carcharoth- chooses every Day one Werewolf to die with them if they are killed by the Heroes. If the Carcharoth is devoured by Night, they can choose a new werewolf to die with them, who is then killed automatically"

[Boromir88]

"Carcharoth- chooses every Day one Werewolf to die with them if they are killed by the Heroes. If the Carcharoth is devoured by Night, they can choose a new werewolf to die with them, who is then killed automatically"

Yes, but it goes by the last submitted name to be taken down with him. If Farael had not been around during all that hoopla, my guess wash is last submitted name was Meneltarmacil, seeing as Farael wasn't around during all that hoopla.

[Mithalwen]

Where exactly does it say that? My reading of the quote is that IF they are devoured they get a choice subsequent to the devouring. Therfore if eaten Farael, if Carcharoth would be able to choose.

[Boromir88]

Ok, here's how it goes. All through the Night Carcharoth can change who gets taken down with him, if Carcharoth is devoured.

Let's say if Carcharoth is devoured by us. The last name he had submitted before voting, and ending of the night, would have been the one to go down with him. He doesn't get to submit a new name in the middle of the day if he's been devoured. The Last name he turned in during the NIGHT PHASE, is the one that goes down with him.

My guess was the last name he submitted was Meneltarmacil, and Farael (if indeed Carcharoth) wasn't around to hear the pleas for us to change it.

[mormegil]

Mith don't get down. You've done wonderful. It's an amazing feat to protect even one innocent and you were able to throw the Heroes off the trail of Sauron and preserve him/her for a while longer.

Now if there is a true Carcharoth out there and they know that Farael is lying it is your duty to step forward. Unless this happens I will take Farael at his word.

I do agree with Boromir about Saruon, while his/her death is rather doubtful at this point perhaps one extra day of dreaming is worth the risk. Though I say if Sauron only knows of 2 innocents and Mith or Farael is in the group don't come out.

It seems to be a Mith/Boromir show right now with me as a side act, meaning I'd like to hear from others.

[Mithalwen]

I understand what you think - what I want is proof that you are right. What you say contradicts the rule I have quoted.

[Mithalwen]

Morm - I have done my best. Noone thinks I will survive the day. Noone listens to me during the night. I might as well wash my paws of the whole thing and prepare for my long rest.

[Boromir88]

I'm sure Anguirel can come in and back me up, as this is how it's worked since the rule change. If Carcharoth is devoured during the Night Phase, he doesn't get to submit a name during the Day Phase, because of course we get the narration of that Night's devouring.

[Mithalwen]

Well that ain't what it says. Why say they can choose if they are devoured if when they are devoured the last person they nominated dies. I am fairly confident of Anguirels capacity to construct a grammatically and syntactically correct sentence. And the one he has written doesn't tally with what you say.

[Anguirel]

The black whirlwind swirled up, rather annoyed to be disturbed during its dormant hours.

"Mithalwen, I must admit that the grammatically correct sentence was in thank purloined from dancing spawn's edition of the rules with a few names changed, and I cannot take credit for it."

There was a pause as the whirlwind pondered the dispute. Its head was hurting. This was not an ideal situation. It had chosen to oversee the assault on Tol-in-Gaurhoth because it liked torturing and puppeteering helpless victims with suspenseful description, not because it wanted to consider points of rule ettiquette.

Eventually, it decided.

"Purely in order to pluck an answer out of the air, I declare that Carcharoth can change his target if devoured. It increases his power to a reasonable extent and makes things slightly more unpredictable. SO IT IS DOOMED."

[Kath]

I want to trust Mith and I can see where she's heading with killing Farael. He escaped by the skin of his teeth yesterday and is, as has been said, more use to us dead than alive. Since we now have a bit more time and know he will turn up eventually we can decide who we think is still a hero and see if Farael will agree to kill the one who most people are suspicious of. I don't really like encouraging the killing of a 'known' innocent, but unless someone has an absolute and proven suspicion of someone being a Hero it seems the best option. Except of course if our guess is wrong - that's two innocents gone.

So, is it better to:
Kill Farael today and hope he takes a Hero with him.
Not kill him and kill someone we think to be a Hero.

As for my own thoughts, I feel these people (yes including myself!) are innocent:
Eomer
Oddwen
Kath
Mithalwen
Farael
Spawn

Possible Hero's:
Wayne (based on the fact that he hasn't given any clues to his identity)
Mormegil (sorry, I just never trust him and the continual insults are getting on my nerves!)

Completely unsure:
Gurthang
Formendacil
Lhuna
Boromir

So, if we were to kill Farael tonight I would advise against a double lynching as it is possible that we would lose 3 innocents in one Night!

[mormegil]

Ummm, this talk of killing Farael is absurd! He's a known innocent and that in and of itself carries power. Now we are killing him so he can kill another? Why that's ridiculous. Why not merely ask him who he would kill and kill that person leaving a known innocent? Kath this seems a bit too elvish to me. And you suspect me based on my insults? Bah!

[Mithalwen]

No he isn't "known" - he is self proclaimed. I still think he is bluffing but devouring him is win win. I will still probably vote for him but this post ressurrects my suspicions of you mormegil. It was your confess all idea that started this mess.

Kath I think is innocent. Dear little runt, you are the heir of my heart. Alas we shall part soon...

[Kath]

morm, I was simply trying to work out why Mith was quite so insistent on killing Farael. I believe that she is Draugluin and that she has a good brain on her, so I wanted to work out her reasoning.

Now you on the other hand. The brain is there but it is very guarded by this crabby wolf act. And you have not admitted to being a Gifted, and accuse practically everyone else of being a Hero. Just feels like a cover to me.

I don't want to kill Farael. Not today at least. Even if he dies toDay it's better since we'll have had the chance to kill a Hero toNight.

[mormegil]

Mithalwen, how can we believe him to be a hero unless somebody refutes his claim?

[Mithalwen]

Well Farael hasn't posted anything remotely gifted so far has he?

I knew Menel was innocent.

Menel was threatened without foundation.

I identified myself to protect him.

You must understand why I think Farael a hero. He has ruined my success.

I have to go in a few minutes. Please reread through my eyes before you make up your minds.

Kath, I do not suspect anyone who voted for Rune.

Only if the Seer has dreamt about Farael can he be deemed a known innocent.

[Mithalwen]

Well why would they? You don't believe your gifteds when they speak. There is NO POINT IN CARCHAROTH REVEALING HIS IDENTITY . Ergo I do not believe Farael.

My death is near certain today. The other gifteds cannot help me: I can no longer help them. They may not have posted since Farael made his claim. They may as well keep quiet.

[Kath]

Well Farael hasn't posted anything remotely gifted so far has he?
Mith, I'm not sure you can use that as an argument because being who he is gives him no special insight, so there is nothing he can really say.

I would prefer to kill morm or maybe Wayne today and leave Farael for tomorrow, if he doesn't die by Hero hands. Mostly I would like to kill morm.

Any tips wolves?
This comment of his caught my eye yesterday and sent up my morm radar. Sure, yeah, it could be innocent, but then maybe it isn't.

[Kath]

Oh in which case Mith I see your point. Farael has no special insight so where was the point in revealing himself? Farael, when you appear, want to answer that?

[mormegil]

Well why would they? You don't believe your gifteds when they speak. There is NO POINT IN CARCHAROTH REVEALING HIS IDENTITY . Ergo I do not believe Farael.

But there is a point, we have a known innocent and he can play mind games with the wolves. If I were Carcharoth I would not reveal who I would kill with me but I would take suggestions. That way the heroes would be loath to kill him during the day, being an unknown as to who he will kill with him. Therefore it will likely give us a known innocent for the remainder. Now if Farael is not the true Carcharoth then it would be prudent for the true one to reveal him/herself at this time. However if that does not happen I see no need in eliminating somebody I feel is a known innocent. It would be like killing you just so we don't let the Heroes do it.

[mormegil]

This comment of his caught my eye yesterday and sent up my morm radar. Sure, yeah, it could be innocent, but then maybe it isn't

Care to explain why? I was merely looking for insight from my fellow wolves on who I should vote for. Mainly because I believe Nonna innocent but had more certainty of Farael's innocence. I wanted to vote Gurthang but did not want a 3 way tie and likely loose two innocents and give Gurthang a chance to slip away.

We seems to be squandering a great opportunity here. I believe that two people are innocent yet we are talking about killing one of them. Let's leave that for the Heroes to do, let's not kill one ourselves.

[Mithalwen]

It would be like killing you just so we don't let the Heroes do it.


which is what Farael wanted to do to Menel if you recall.

[mormegil]

In post 219 Farael proclaims himself Carcharoth and then says this about Menel

Still, unless someone convinces me of Meneltarmacil's innocence, I shall take him down with me when I'm dead. I have no hopes of surviving to-morrow, but I will gladly give my life for my Dark Lord.

You didn't post your confession until 227 and Farael did not post the rest of the night. I think you are jumping too far ahead Mith and assuming things that just aren't true. If Farael is, as I believe, Carcharoth then he would not have chosen to kill Menel had he seen your confession. I believe you did the right thing in coming forward but it was after Farael's proclaimed himself. In rereading it I believe Farael was certain he was going to die and told us in advance so there was no surpirse.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Farael suspected Menel of being a Hero. What's so difficult here? Farael is an inexperienced wolf and has made mistakes, but it would be madness to slay him today. At least leave him alive for a few more days. We will take a few days to catch both heroes anyway AND by that time Farael will have a much better idea of who to bring down with him if he is the Hunter.

Mith, I am listening to you but I think you're wrong in this matter and shouldn't be taking this opposition too personally. Some of us have made mistakes in this game, Farael more than most. But I will certainly argue against killing Farael today.

All this is, I fear, a collosal waste of time. By the way I, like Morm, am quite eager to kill Wayne today. If he's not going to catch up with the discussion then he is a total liability to our cause, whether Hero or no.


(And now for something completely stupid) Kath, can I ask why you think I'm innocent? If you want my opinion of my performance I'm doing a pretty bad job! :p I suppose that, in all my past treachery, I've been pretty smart and collected, in stark contrast to this Isle of Werewolves. Can it truly be said that a Warg feels more at home amongst Men than he does amongst Wolves? :D

One more thing: Could someone please explain the case against Gurthang? I'm quite surprised that he's getting all this suspicion.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Just read Morm's post and he basically said something which I forgot to post just there.

Being: Farael the inexperienced thought he was going to die and wanted to save himself for another day, whilst affording the island one extra chance of lynching a Hero. The more I think about it, the more mundane it appears.

[Farael]

Mithalwen, breath. I did not jump out of the blue saying I'm Carcharot, Gurthang made a comment saying that I was probably gifted and pretty much left me out in the open. Now I must say, I had no idea whom to hunt during the night. Menel was the one I suspected the most for some of the things he said and did. I was not as sold on his guilt as I made it sound, but I needed information and I wanted to start some kind of a reaction. Sadly, it was not what I expected.

I know who I am and therefore I know I'm innocent, I guess you all could have been swayed by Menel appearing as Sauron but now we know that he was not and are you going to tell me that his arguments made sense?

I gambled last night. I figured if I made a strong enough case that I'd hunt Menel then should the wolves want him dead, they'd get rid of me and possibly get two gifteds in one day. If neither Menel nor I had been killed then who among you can tell me that it would not be clear evidence against him?

Now that you know that Menel was indeed NOT Sauron, as I knew all along for he suspected me for more than one night, won't you listen to my words at least? you can get rid of me now and I won't have any good clues on who to hunt down with me. You know one innocent on me and maybe another in Mithalwen, but her saying that you guys MUST kill me tonight is starting to look suspicious.

You know you'll be dead Mithalwen? then help us. You are being just as destructive as I might have been. I never asked you to come out on the open, I even said that I did not expect other gifteds to say who they were, but I was flushed out by Gurthang and I felt I could risk admitting being Carcharoth so that we could get some things going. If you recall correctly, last night the top suspects were Nonnadeck (who now we know was innocent) and myself. I know I'm innocent so at least I tried to get something going.

I just want to make this very clear. I never said that Menel was as good as dead. I said that he was unless someone showed me I was wrong. Right away you jumped up and said you were Dragulin. Why? you could have argued your case in favour of Menel just as I argued mine against him. If you don't like my arguments I do not care, but I happened to have some. He is not the Seer, my arguments hold fairly true right now at least for suspecting him. But then, why would Mithalwen have any arguments in favour of Menel? Mithalwen voted for Menel the night before she says she protected him, if I'm not mistaken. I do not suspect Mithalwen right now because as Morm said when talking about me, it would only take the 'true' Dragulin (if there was another than her) to come out and she'd be as good as dead.

Sincerely, you called me stupid last night and I am quite offended by it, but is it any smarter what you did? Menel was not the Seer but even if he had been you could not protect him again. The Heroes wanted him dead but they can't control me or my thoughts. If they were all-but-certain that Menel was the Seer and they did not want to risk me changing my mind, they would have attacked him straight away. This which is what happened. As a bonus, now I look more suspicious. Hey, I challenge anyone who wants to claim to be Carcharoth to come forward!! There are only two heroes left and Sauron is still alive. If "another" Carcharoth shows up, then he must be a hero and therefore after the night only one hero will be left, Sauron would still be alive and with some luck, the game will be over before the moon sets tomorrow night.

Think of this as excuses and cover-ups if you may, but sooner or later you will see the truth. Let's hope for the former.


I hope I argued my innocence well enough, but I should start putting forward at least some ideas of who may be guilty.

Mormegil- Can't see him being too suspicious. He has cut back on his posting from the beginning but that's not evidence by itself. He was one of the last to vote for Nonna, making sure he'd be devoured but he said he was trying to avoid someone organizing a double-lynch. If he had been a Hero, wouldn't he want to get rid of possibly three innocents?

Gurthang- Many seem to suspect him, I'm not convinced yet.

Formendacil- Is it me or has he talked fairly little?

Farael-That's me, I'm obviously not suspecting myself

Lhuna- Timezones can be a killer, but she seems pretty innocent right now.

Eomer- I'm not going to comment right now, I'm still chewing my thoughts over.

Boromir- He is an intelligent wolf, which could mean he's a cunning hero, but I am not going to suspect him just yet

Spawn- I suspected her for being in the Nonnadeck bandwagon a couple nights ago, I'm still not sold on her innocense but I shall look elsewhere tonight.

Oddwen- She casted the last vote for Rune, if that doesn't clear her it surely brings her close to.

Kath-No comments... not yet at least.

Mithalwen- Ms. Dragulin... I'd love to see someone come up with a good claim at being the true Dragulin and get my paws on her, but it might just be the anger talking. I do not suspect her even though she does seem to hate me.

Wayne- He can get away with anything because "Wayne is Wayne" I don't know if we should devour him just yet.


A lot of posting has gone before I could wrap up my ideas. I hope I clarified why I admitted to be Carcharoth even if I am not the greatest threat of all the gifteds.

And Mithalwen, I did not know Menel was innocent, and you thought him Sauron so I believe you weren't any more correct than myself. I did not want to kill him only so that the heroes did not get to him first, I wanted to start controversy. Sadly, you commited yourself in a rather short-sighted way, but now you can't turn back.

[Farael]

Adding something, I did not try to save myself, for I was convinced I was as good as dead. I wanted to make clear what my acts would be so that I'd take away the guessing game after I was dead. You'd know who I was, you'd know what I thought and you'd hopefully been able to make some assumptions into who was the most benefited by my death.

Am I inexperienced? sure. Did I make mistakes? obviously. Should I be murdered for it? well, that's up to you wolves to choose. I gave you an oportunity, I'm a known innocent. Take it or leave it, it is not up to me.

[Mithalwen]

I gave a huge hint in my first posts after I saved him. I had no time to argue further because I was at work on a slow connection.

I have no feelings or knowledge of you beyind the Island. Naturally therefore I deleted your PM unread. If you chose to take my comments further well sorry.

Once I saw Rune was a hero I read back and thought he might be the seer. It was obvious to me he was the one to protect. And I was right.

I still think you are a hero but if you are not then I don't exactly think you have don the pack a lot of favours do you?

And I have not said we MUST kill you tonight. I said we don't lose anything by doing so and if you want to be any good as Carcharoth we have to kill you. So basically I feel nothing you say is trustworthy. Either you are lying or your reasoning is flawed.

[dancing spawn of ungoliant]

Just to keep the statistics straight, here are last night's votes:

Menel -> Farael
Formendacil -> Nonnac
Nonnac -> Gurthang
Lhuna -> Gurthang
Farael -> Menel
Eomer -> Wayne
Gurthang -> Nonnac
Mith -> Farael
Boromir -> Nonnac
Wayne -> Farael
Kath -> Nonnac
Mormegil -> Nonnac
Spawn -> Nonnac

And now, my own ponderings:

Mith, I could to vote for Farael just to salute you for your excellent contribution to this community, but I can't do that because I still think that Farael is Carcharoth as he claims to be. If he wasn't, sure someone would already have stepped forth and said something. Then we had two Carcharoths and if we couldn't decide which one is lying, we'd arrange a double devouring and the real Carcharoth would kill the false one (ie. choose not to hunt, or then pick a third person to die with them).

I'm sure I'll be crudely insulted for saying this, but there are a few things that morm has done that make him look pretty suspicious right now. I'm very well aware that he was a cranky person before we knew that there were heroes among us, so I won't use that against him although it would be a nice cover for him.

But: I found (and still find) it strange that morm defended Nonnac before he had even posted and morm stood up for him every now and then ever since. Now, of course, we see that he was right about Nonna's innocence, but how did he know? Only the heroes know who are innocent and who are guilty from the beginning.

Another thing is his comment about me voting for Kitanna, which I already wondered in my post #193 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=435798&postcount=193) . I was back then one of last Night's most unpopular villagers. His comment looked, at least to me, like he would have tried to get other people with him to get me back on the menu again that Night.

And now the double devouring idea of his which includes Wayne is a bit odd. If he thinks Wayne is a hero, won't one hero at a time be enough when the odds are that we'd take a regular wolf down with him - or even worse, our Seer - and the last hero would have one less innocent to worry about. If morm, however, thinks that Wayne is just annoying, he'd be eliminating an innocent vote and the heroes' chances to survive would grow better. Or am I just missing something?

edit: Oh, wow, you guys have turned a completely new page while I was writing... so, cross-posting once again

[Formendacil]

GARN! Well I'm glad they didn't kill Sauron the idiots.

Unless the moronic heroes have a better idea of who Sauron is than currently they will more than likely go for you Mith.

THEY are idiots? THEY are morons?

It is you, Master Mormegil who merits that title most in the eyes of Sauron! Who are you, little Werewolf, that you should direct the actions of Sauron and his most trusted Servants? You are fortunate that no ultimate harm has been done by your incessant clamouring for revelation. Did it not occur to you that Sauron, in his wisdom (much greater than that of any mere Werewolf) would not have a plan of his own? Who made you the one to direct the actions of this village?

Dependent upon what Sauron knows it may be prudent for him or her to step forward.

What Sauron knows has nothing to do with this matter! What Sauron, the Lord of Tol-in-Gaurhoth chooses to do, in his sublime wisdom, is what matters!

And I am Sauron.

Let this be quite clear, Master Mormegil, I am most displeased with your attempts to manipulate this island as if you were the Lieutenant of Melkor, the Guardian of Angband. It is very fortunate for you that the hubbub you created served to keep me hidden rather than to expose me, for my plans were not yet ripe.

And yes, Master Mormegil, I had plans- plans not unlike your own, in that I planned to reveal myself at a certain time and tell you, my minions, what the Great Lord Melkor had revealed to me. But MY plan, the plan of your master, was not to reveal all yesterday, but to reveal all today.

And that difference of one day makes a great difference in the information I now impart to this village of foolish and misguided fools!

Did you think the Lord Sauron such an idiot that he would allow himself to be devoured before he could tell his loyal servants what they needed to learn? Had my life ever been in grave danger, I would have done just that. But as my life was never in grave danger, I choose, in my wisdom, to keep my secrets hidden until this day.

But although I remain most displeased at your presumptions, Master Mormegil, let us move on to the guaranteed truths that I will now tell you.

During the first day, the day of the death of Anguirel, I spread my mind over the village, and the Lord Melkor opened to me the secrets of YOUR mind, Master Mormegil, and though you have incurred my wrath, you remain my loyal servant. Foolish and arrogant, but loyal.

On the second day, following our first foolish lynching of Glirdan, I inquired of the Lord Melkor into the mind of the Saucepan Wolf. As the entire village soon learned, thanks to the blundering of the, as Master Mormegil so aptly puts it, "idiotic morons" who are our hidden Heroes, this Big, Bad Wolf was none other than Huan in disguise.

How I gloated over THAT particular death!

After our killing of the second night, the Lord Melkor granted me insight into the mind of the great she-wolf, Mithalwen. As with yourself, Master Mormegil, she is a loyal servant of mine.

You would do best to work together.

And finally, on the day that has just passed, I requested of the Lord Melkor insight into the mind of the suspicious one called Gurthang. He too is my loyal servant.

Go ahead, you moronic Werewolves, and put me to the test with lynching, if you so desire! I can assure you that though you may, for a time, divest me of my body and this village, that this little golden ring on which I have been working, shall see me safely back to this tower of mine ere long- though you may all be dead!

No matter what decisions you make, you shall know, before the end, that I am Sauron and I speak true! Heed my words, ye Werewolves, and ponder them!

~Saurondacil~

From the desk of Formendacil, Sauron's scribe: No offense is truly intended to any denizens of Tol-in-Gaurhoth, saving perhaps the nasty heroes. All overtones of sarcasm, anger, and scorn are presented for dramatic effect.

[Mithalwen]

I am Draugluin not Dragulin I am not Ms. anything (hideous title that I abhor).

Personally

How else am I meant to take it? I have risked all for nothing. You will disregard a vote for Farael so I won't bother.

Since this will surely be my last post I will speak though it is obvious now I have served the heroes purpose my opinions are disregarded. I fear you will live to regret your behaviour but it is no longer my problem.

Gurthang I think is AT LEAST innocent. Morm's attact on Gurthang makes me think that he may well be a hero in cahoots with Farael. He hasn't been playing as well as I would expect if he were a wolf but I know he is a fiendish plotter and would not put this bravura stunt beyond him.

Kath and Oddwen I think are innocent.

You all think I am a batty old "female dog" and I no longer care.

I so nearly voted for Mormegil on day one ... may as well do now.

Thank goodness I didn't!!!!

[Farael]

My reasoning might be flawed, no one is perfect and I can't stay silent after someone calls me stupid. The PM you commented about was because I am quite upset over that as this is a game and you can "insult me" in game without using words that are an insult in real life. Hey, I'm a begginer in this game and I made (and will probably keep on making) bad choices. If you call my choices stupid, you are calling me stupid. Now, I PM'd you over it because I felt there was no point in bringing a personal 'miscomunication' into the game, but as you won't read my PM I guess I have to say it here.

Shall we move on? I don't like you any better than what you seem to like me, but I thought we could try to keep this game civilized. If you have anything further to answer regarding this, I suggest you PM me. I don't want to waste any more time of those reading this for fun.

Finally, and to make at least one comment regarding this game, by having your heart set on (or rather against) me, you are not helping much either. You got lucky saving Menel once and congratulations over that, but I suggest you listen to everyone else's arguments, not just mine and yours.

[Mithalwen]

Could you confirm I am Draugluin my Lord? And advise which of the people you haven't voted for I should cast my vote for?

I do not suspect Kath or Oddwen. But I will do as my lord requires as a last act of Fealty.

[Farael]

Aye, cuadruple posting or so.

[dancing spawn of ungoliant]

Formendacil, thank you for revealing yourself! We have now five proven wolves (I'm not doubting Farael) and a couple of others who are likely to be true lycans as well.

So, the heroes are on this list (right?):

Boromir
Eomer
Kath
Lhunardawen
Oddwen
spawn
Wayne

edit: Corrected a mistake on the list.

[mormegil]

Spawn, No I am an innocent while I justly incurred the wrath of Lord Sauron he knows I am his loyal servant.

Lord Sauron *muttering* Sorry Lord...I was merely trying to help.

Will you help to organize some devourings so that we can increase our chance of surviving. If we have some known innocents double devourings make sense because we need to capilalize on this advantage while we have it.

Formendacil
Mithalwen
Gurthang
Mormegil

Truly known innocent.

Farael

Most likely innocent

That is 5. Let's use this to our advantage.

And now the double devouring idea of his which includes Wayne is a bit odd. If he thinks Wayne is a hero, won't one hero at a time be enough when the odds are that we'd take a regular wolf down with him - or even worse, our Seer - and the last hero would have one less innocent to worry about. If morm, however, thinks that Wayne is just annoying, he'd be eliminating an innocent vote and the heroes' chances to survive would grow better. Or am I just missing something?

It's a matter of principle if one truly isn't actively participating I don't feel that they should be alive to participate. That is why I say off with Wayne.

One the plus side we will have at least one more dream from Sauron as Mithalwen can protect him...if you happened to last night don't say so please.

[Farael]

Formendacil, thank you for revealing yourself! We have now five proven wolves (I'm not doubting Farael) and a couple of others who are likely to be true lycans as well.

So, the heroes are on this list (right?):

Boromir
Eomer
Kath
Lhunardawen
mormegil
Oddwen
spawn
Wayne

Spawn, I think Formendacil said Mormegil was innocent.

Having Sauron step forward and Morm being disregarded, Boromir is looking more suspicious right now. He did insinuate he had some 'inside knowledge' from Melkor but I disregarded that as keeping in character. Maybe he was trying to hint being someone he was not? He was also defending me and even if I was killed, he'd not only look alright but he would make sure I did not choose him to die along with me.

Correct me if I'm wrong, Dragulin may now protect Formendacil which means we'd have him for at least another night, we can devour someone and therefore that list of seven (taking morm out) turns into a list of five possible heroes. Right now things don't look as dire as they did, do they?

I might have not played the best game, but killing me for revenge's sake will only help the heroes. As I said before, if there's another one willing to claim to be Carcharoth, step forward!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Very interesting. I suppose Mithalwen dies tonight and Formendacil the next night. I wonder who he will use his last dream on...

I know who I want Formy to dream about; but I'll keep this wish to myself until later. I'm not sure if he'll want me trying to change his mind so I'll keep quiet for now.

I'm less worried about all this revealing of the gifteds now. We have a huge advantage in numbers and it looks as if we can take excellent advantage of this. I'll be back before the deadline to cast my vote. At this stage, I think I'll vote for Wayne again.

[Formendacil]

Could you confirm I am Draugluin my Lord? And advise which of the people you haven't voted for I should cast my vote for?

I do not suspect Kath or Oddwen. But I will do as my lord requires as a last act of Fealty.

That is correct. You are my trusted servant, Draugluin. Let there be no doubt about that.

As regards the rest of the village, I believe the inner eye has clouded the use of my outer eye, since I am very hesitant to call any of them either Heroes or Innocents thus far. Let us see what this day brings...

And perhaps a double-lynching is wisest. Even if we lose two innocents, I deem it no great loss.

Lord Sauron *muttering* Sorry Lord...I was merely trying to help.

You are forgiven. For now.

But it is not forgotten.

[Mithalwen]

Certainly it will be me or him. And I can protect him and noone can protect me. Obviously it is better that he survives than I do..... and so yes.. though they will surely go for me knowing Sauron is protected.

[Mithalwen]

Right really have to go so ... on my "early posting is suspicious" - I must revert to my earlier reasoning before the red mist settled.

Glirdan proved innocent by his death.

Mormegil proved innocent by the word of Saurondacil

... so Wayne..... the only doubt is would a wolf be so disinterested? Saying he forgot ...... but I cannot wait any longer .... he hasn't actually contributed a lot but a known tendancy to be erratic is a useful cover ....... and so no offence

++ WAYNE THE GOBLIN

[Kath]

Right, excuse the list repeating but I need to get some things clear in my head.

Innocent (including me):
Formendacil
morm (darn)
Mithalwen
Farael
Gurthang
Kath

Possible Heroes:
Eomer
spawn
Wayne
Oddwen
Lhuna
Boromir

However, I'm still finding Eomer and spawn innocent and now Oddwen - and sorry Eomer I can't really explain why. Most of my game has been based on feelings, some wrong admittedly, but some right.

So that leaves:
Wayne
Lhuna
Boromir

I certainly don't want to kill Lhuna before she's had a chance to speak for herself, but since Wayne is unlikely ever to really speak for himself past maybe a quick list with no reasons and a random or bandwaggoning vote, I would be fine voting for him. So, unless he appears and gives one hell of a reason not to vote for him, that's where mine will go toDay.

Also, by the look of what's been happening toNight, Mith will protect Formendacil toDay and be killed by the Heroes, and then Formendacil tomorrow. So, if he's around, I'd like to know who Formendacil is planning on dreaming about. If he tells us we can make sure we don't kill that person toNight, he can dream about them toDay and tell us tomorrow. Since there are only two Heroes left they can't affect the voting too much so there shouldn't be a danger with that idea.

[Gurthang]

One the plus side we will have at least one more dream from Sauron as Mithalwen can protect him...if you happened to last night don't say so please.

You took the words right out of my mouth.

Thank you Lord Sauron! It's nice to know that people can trust me for a change. I'm also very relieved to be sure of mormegil's innocence, I already believed Mith completely.

Now, to business. We have, as other's pointed out, 5 known innocents. I believe Farael, for now at least, as we have no one coming against her. Leaving those five out, we've got:

Boromir
Eomer
Kath
Lhunardawen
Oddwen
spawn
Wayne

Kath and Oddwen voted for Rune rather late on the Night of his death. They seem innocent (for this awhile at least). Leaving:

Boromir
Eomer
Lhunardawen
spawn
Wayne

So, we kill one toNight. Sauron dreams of another. Leaving us with just three unknowns tomorrow(providing Kath and Oddwen are truly innocent).

I'm alright with getting rid of Wayne toNight. Now that all three gifteds have come forward, I'm thinking Wayne might actually be a hero. Rather than retype my reason, I'll just quote myself.

Let me explain. Usually, in his first post of a game, Wayne hints what his role is, usually with capital letters or bolded letters spelling something out. I specifically noticed that he did not this game. The only reasons he wouldn't are if he were a hero or Sauron. I know he's been a Ranger or Hunter before and still gave his hint.

Okay, suddenly, while finding the above quote from myself, I fell across this from Wayne.

Werewolfs take the lead yae it looks like menel is innicent for being first to vote for rune i think the heros might of gone for him. i do not suspect kath as much now i didnt know that was the reason she didnt vote on night 1.that is all i have to say good bye.
This didn't make sense to me before, so I just passed it off, since I usually can't make sense from what Wayne says. Now it's much clearer. If Wayne was a hero, he would of course know that Menel was innocent, and he would have known that the heros went after him. It makes all too much sense looking back with that knowledge, so I now am pretty certain Wayne is a hero.

So, quoting myself again:

But which is he? I'm not sure, but I do find it a bit strange that Wayne first mentions Eomer, and now Eomer is suddenly making a case against Wayne. If Wayne is a hero, then Eomer is likely innocent. If Wayne is Sauron, then perhaps Eomer is a hero.

Yet now I'm wondering if perhaps Eomer wasn't going to try to start a case against Wayne just to make himself look innocent. Try to get him killed and then say that he was the first to suggest it. Strangely, Eomer's comment was lost in all that happened last Night, and I notice now that he hasn't really said anything about Wayne. It's not a lot, but it make sense to me.

I'm really thinking that Wayne and Eomer might be the two remaining heroes. I think we should kill Wayne toNight and kindly (;))ask the Lord Saurondacil to dream of Eomer.

[WaynetheGoblin]

I already posted my reasons before.

++fearel

[mormegil]

I already posted my reasons before.

++fearel

With this it is clear that either Wayne is a hero or somebody who cares not to read anything that has been written. Which is it Wayne? Guilty or hopelessly obtuse?

What we need to do is orchestrate a double devouring. The reason is we have 5 innocents, including Farael, and 7 unknowns. We kill 2 unknowns leaving it 5 to 5 (with the chance of getting a Hero or two). Heroes will kill one tonight but we dream of one so it is 5 known and 4 unknown. One more double devouring should take care of it if not next day the numbers are still in our favor. Even if the kill Farael who takes down another unknown innocent we still have the numbers, but these must be utilized while we still have them. As Lord Sauron states these lives are sacrificial and acceptable to do. Formendacil can you please help orchestrate this. It would be best to kill Wayne today for many reasons, not least because one of our innocents already voted him.

[Boromir88]

I don't expect anyone to believe me, but I'm going to say it anyway and you will be held accountable for your own actions. I am a regular wolf, accept it, or don't, you will be held accountable, so to me this leaves:

Eomer
Kath
Lhuna
Oddwen
Spawn
Wayne

Ok, so as long as Mith didn't protect Formendacil last night, we can still get one more day from our Sauron, and he can dream of one of the 6 above (Or even me if he wants to confirm my innocence for everyone).

It looks to me like Wayne is going to be one of the candidates tonight, as I do fully agree with Mormegil in that his actions deserve his devouring.

Another one who hasn't gone much talked about and I'm worried about is Eomer. I don't really know why, can't really explain it, but Day 1 he voted for Morm, day 2 he voted for Kitanna. Both now known innocents, also his vote for Kitanna came at a time when Spawn was in the lead, Mormegil

So right now,

Wayne, Eomer, and Spawn are my targets.

Wayne's vote for Farael only makes me think more of his guilt.

[Formendacil]

It seems that Wayne's death, with Mithalwen having already voted for him, is a foregone conclusion, for whether he be guilty or no, I think purpose to use that vote as the platform of at least one of our devourings.

But who should be Wayne's partner in death? Our list of "not-innocents" includes:

Boromir
Eomer
Kath
Lhunardawen
Oddwen
spawn

And although I will be sorely humiliated if Farael is, in fact, guilty, I am inclined to agree with my servant Morm and think him innocent.

So, of these six potential death-mates for Wayne, I am thinking that Lhuna, Kath, and Oddwen are to be put in one camp: the quieter, less guilty-seeming, while Eomer, Boromir, and Dancing Spawn belong to the "coming up on more possibly guilty lists, and are very dangerous if they are heroes" party.

I am thinking that I would prefer to arrange a double-lynching that culls the second party rather than the first. This means that I thinking that I wish to pair Wayne with either Boromir, Eomer, or Dancing Spawn. With the mention that has been made thus far of Eomer, he seems the most likely to merit my wrath, but I am open to discussion on the subject.

~Saurondacil~

[Kath]

Woah! Woah woah woah - since when are we definitely doing a double lynching! I know it's unlikely now that Farael will be killed toDay and so take another innocent with him by accident but even so! Double lynchings should be used in last resorts surely.

I want Wayne gone and perhaps one of the group you just mentioned but isn't it better to wait out the Day? I mean yes it might make the whole thing take longer but the risk of taking out innocents ourselves is surely too high! I'd prefer to see if Wayne is guilty and then go back and look at who voted for him (or not) to determine who we should consider next.

[mormegil]

I would say, if we are to choose from the second list, that Boromir goes first.

Kath seems a bit petulant to be a runt but perhaps that would be more of a spite vote.

[Farael]

I would probably object a double devouring if it wasn't because of Wayne. The guy has said nothing and helped in nothing.... there is absolutely no evidence against him, conversely there is no evidence for him. If anything, there's a little evidence against.

I think Wayne has annoyed too many people, we've had a known innocent voting against him so It'll be hard to find out anything from the rest of the people voting against him.

I'd guess that everyone wants to vote for him. Innocents because his lack of writing (and perhaps reading?) is fairly suspicious and annoying at best and the remaining Hero because Wayne will be short lived and it's a good chance to look innocent to the rest of us.

I say those more experienced than myself organize a good double-devouring, getting Wayne out of the way and hopefully a hero. I guess I shall defer to Sauron and Morm, for they are experienced and insightful... but of course, anyone else (who dares) is welcome to offer better grounds for tonight's action than myself.

[Gurthang]

I guess I'm okay with a double devouring. I've already picked who I think the heroes are, so that is who I'd support doing a double to: Wayne and Eomer.

Simply awaiting orders on who to vote for.

[Farael]

Cross posted with morm... as you are more experienced in this kind of things than myself, would you care collecting some evidence against Boromir if you really suspect him? I would not know where to start.

[Gurthang]

Farael, I'm not for voting for Wayne just for a lack of writing. I would even say I'm against that (voting just cause he's quiet and sometimes annoying). The reason for my suspicion of him has nothing to do with his lack of speaking; it is because I believe I have found a slip-up in the words he has said. Specifically, the post I quoted where he clears Menel for an extremely flimsy reason that would make a lot more sense coming from a hero.

[Boromir88]

I would say, if we are to choose from the second list, that Boromir goes first.~Mormegil
That's your choice, but in your end you will have to hold yourself accountable and answer yourself to Lord Melkor for killing one of his faithful servants and worshippers.

[Farael]

And actually, I suspect him in the (very loose) grounds of him being able to get away with anything.

He did say "everyone can be a hero" and perhaps he was playing with fire on that one.

He has not pulled his act together at all, I might be wrong but either he's not reading or he's playing fool. Why would an innocent play fool? and why would you sign up for this game if you are not willing to read? I don't know, it might be the 'annoyment' talking, but all the tidbits of evidence against him, plus the argument that "Wayne is Wayne" is probably the best clue we have so far.

[Boromir88]

This may make me look more like a hero, but who cares...I won't mind a double lynching, we have what is it 7 unknowns? And some of which, seem pretty innocent (Oddwen and Kath), plus excluding myself leads it down to 4 people to pick from. A double lynch will improve our chances greatly.

I will go along with Gurthang and say Eomer and Wayne as our two candidates up for a doubledouble devour. Though, I don't care if I'm a candidate, I don't see a reason why to vote for me. I thought besides my Nonna nonsense (haha) I have seemed pretty reasonable. Though, if I am the other devouree, all I can tell you is you will be reducing your chances of catching a hero, for I am not one, but everyone has a decision to make and in our decisions we must hold ourselves responsible.

[Kath]

I want to just take a quick look at Lhuna. I suddenly realised that I've been putting her in the presumed innocent category when I suspected her earlier. All these lists :rolleyes:

Lhuna:
Night 1 - suspected Glirdan and immediately wanted to kill Wayne. Then goes straight back against what she said of Glirdan (now saying he's not a Hero) and still wants to kill Wayne, before finally voting for him. Definitely some odd backtracking there.
Night 2 - Rams the fact she thought Glirdan an innocent at us. Suspects no one, giving reasons for possibly suspecting morm and Mith (now known innocents) but won't make an opinion one way or the other. Decides the Heroes would likely be hiding in the Glirdan votes. Makes a list of those who voted for Glirdan - and all except two are now considered innocents (Wayne and Oddwen). Still wants to kill Wayne but votes for Oddwen. So she rags at Wayne all day but never actually votes for him - possibly attacking to distance herself but not really putting him in danger on this Night when he might actually accumulate some votes, unlike the Night before.
Night 3 - Tries to distance herself from Rune and suspects Gurthang for his comments about Menel. Picks apart Rune's posts but says she has found nothing there to go on. Decides Farael is innocent. Votes Gurthang - with very little reasoning that I can see. Mentions that Wayne seemed the most suspicious based on some of Rune's comments, but then seems to leave off him entirely, so not consistent at all.

Also, she is barely mentioned, a great thing for a wolf trying to fly under the radar. She was put about in the middle of Wayne's little suspect list, and Rune (our only known Hero) mentioned that he did not trust her but did not suspect her either. Though spawn also seems to support her.

Looking at that I wouldn't be half surprised if Lhuna were a Hero if Wayne actually is one. But I still don't like this double lynching idea - at least not toNight. We should first find out if Wayne is a Hero.

And please, would someone show me what it is Eomer has done to warrant the suspicion against him?

[mormegil]

But I still don't like this double lynching idea - at least not toNight. We should first find out if Wayne is a Hero.

Please explain why? I have explained the reasons for it but I would like to know why you are so against it. It seems to me that the only people against it should be a Hero. This is the kind of activity that makes me think that you are perhaps guilty. It matters not if some of us die to save the island, the point is to eliminate these heros and gain victory, which can best be achieved by double killings. Plus it will provide extra meat. ;)

and why would you sign up for this game if you are not willing to read?

I ask myself that everytime I play with him :rolleyes:

[Farael]

I ask myself that everytime I play with him :rolleyes:
Does he actually not read every game? I'm basing my suspicions in that he at least READS. Maybe he doesn't talk but he reads and so makes choices, disguising his colours under his.... how to say it? Wayneness??

[Kath]

It matters not if some of us die to save the island, the point is to eliminate these heros and gain victory, which can best be achieved by double killings.
How? I'm sorry if you've explained it before but if you did then I didn't understand.

Look I'm not against them altogether, I just feel that we should at least find out first whether Wayne is a Hero because everyone is assuming that he is and basing their attacks on others by the way they have been regarding him (as well as other stuff) when there is no point in doing so because we don't yet know if he is guilty!

[Gurthang]

I'm with morm in this. Kath, why don't you like double killings? True, it may not be the essence of the game and it is likely that we will get two innocents, but looking at it in a broader perspective, we can afford that risk and still win fairly easily.

And I still think that if we do away with Wayne we will be rid of one hero. So if we lose an innocent, it will be just like normal, except the heroes have taken a major shot. And we just might get lucky and kill both heroes toNight. That would be spectacular. :D

[mormegil]

We have 5 known innocents today and will have 5 tomorrow. We need to eliminate the unknown quicker than they eliminate the known. We have the advantage of being able to kill 2 the Heroes can only kill 1. We therefore can eliminate the unknown element quicker than they can the known. With such great luck that we had they eliminated Huan for us so the only people that can interfer with this plan is the Heroes and that will expose them and I truly am beginning to think that you are one of them.

I suggest that we vote Kath and Wayne.

If not Kath then Eomer of Boromir will be fine.

[Boromir88]

I'm with morm in this. Kath, why don't you like double killings? True, it may not be the essence of the game and it is likely that we will get two innocents, but looking at it in a broader perspective, we can afford that risk and still win fairly easily.

Not to mention hopefully Mithalwen can still protect Formendacil during the day, giving us one more chance with our Seer.

[Oddwen]

I fear that eating that scavenger has made me quite ill...

So much has happened...head spinning...

All hail Sauron, Lord of the Earth, etc.-

A rather radical idea to propose - you'll probably all hate me but...

Since we're talking about a double lynch, if we lynch Farael and (say) Wayne, providing Farael is the hunter he could take one more possible hero down...it's not likely he'll be chosen by the heroes the next DAY, it would cut the odds for the next NIGHT...

Oww...I might have to vote in an hour. Ow. Ow. Ow.

[Boromir88]

Since we're talking about a double lynch, if we lynch Farael and (say) Wayne, providing Farael is the hunter he could take one more possible hero down...it's not likely he'll be chosen by the heroes the next DAY, it would cut the odds for the next NIGHT...

Problem is as mormegil says our goal is to kill off the unknowns faster than the heroes can kill the knowns.

Right now, this is just hypothetical but there are 7 unknowns:

Boromir
Lhuna
Kath
Oddwen
Eomer
Wayne
Spawn

Two of these are heroes. Let's say we do a double lynch of Wayne and Eomer and neither of them happen to turn out to be heroes. The following day (assuming Mithalwen can protect Formendacil) worst case scenario we'll have 5 knowns and 5 unknowns. Two of the unkowns being heroes (or perhaps Formendacil is able to spot another hero).

But let's say he doesn't find a hero, this leaves two heroes amongst 5 unkowns. Then the next day we can probably kiss Sauron goodbye.

If we double-lynch Farael and he takes down another innocent. (It's possible he picks a hero, but I'm just simply going by worst case scenarios). This leaves us with 4 knowns and 5 uknowns. I agree with mormegil in that it's not a good idea to kill off our known innocents, though he be Carcharoth. And our best chances lie in killing off the uknowns faster then the heroes can kill the knowns.

[mormegil]

A rather radical idea to propose - you'll probably all hate me but...

Since we're talking about a double lynch, if we lynch Farael and (say) Wayne, providing Farael is the hunter he could take one more possible hero down...it's not likely he'll be chosen by the heroes the next DAY, it would cut the odds for the next NIGHT...

No I don't hate you but I do hate the idea. It makes no sense to take down a known innocent so he can kill somebody. All we do there is help the heroes by eliminating one more known innocent from the pool. We could kill 2 on our own and not have to kill Farael to get another.

It just doesn't make any sense to me.

[Gurthang]

Killing Farael puts us at one less known innocent. The heroes aren't likely to kill him, not for a couple Days at least, but by then it will be narrowed down enough that he can probably get a hero when he hunts. It is really better not to kill him, not now at least.

[Farael]

I will gladly do so if that's what the majority says, Oddwen but there's one little problem. If you get rid of me and ask me to get rid of another suspected individual, you might be loosing three innocents. If that happens, the Heroes will take out a fourth one and the odds will be strongly in their favour. How many of us are there left? twelve? They'd get rid of A THIRD of the innocents in one strike.

I think it's too risky but I don't want to sound as if I'm trying to protect my own skin. As I said before, if that's the general agreement then I shall accept it.

[Farael]

Cross posted with Gurthang... and sorry my friend but I'm a he

[Gurthang]

Yes, apologies about that... it has been changed.

[Boromir88]

Farael, our advantage is we can still keep Sauron for one more day. So, if the heroes do kill another innocent, Formendacil can either spot a hero or another innocent. So, the heroes kill tonight will not play a big factor.

[Farael]

True, but what I was saying is that if we followed Kath's plan, we'd risk loosing three innocents tonight and a fourth one during the day. If my math is not wrong we are 12 left but 2 of those are the Heroes therefore they'd actually get rid of almost HALF of the opposition in one night-day cycle.

[Farael]

I'm raelly sorry fellow werewolves but it seems Nonnadeck's flesh was not as well conserved as I thought... I'm afraid this big wolf has fallen with a bit of a stomach ailment. I shall cast my vote now, for the only wolf whom I have a clear suspicion against.

++Wayne

I hope you guys make the right choices for tonight's devouring, but I cannot stay to join you.

[mormegil]

Innocents
Formendacil
morm
Mithalwen
Farael
Gurthang


Unknowns
Kath
Eomer
spawn
Wayne
Oddwen
Lhuna
Boromir

One unknown and one innocent have voted.

Wayne 1
Farael 1

What needs to be done, and quickly, is decide who the other candidate is besides Wayne and establish the plan. Out of the unknowns I would be in favor of leaving Oddwen and eliminating any other. That leaves

Kath
Eomer
Spawn
Lhuna
Boromir

Kath made a good case against Lhuna. Eomer is oddly silent. Boromir is vocal and willing to die but somewhat threatens us that it will be on our hands. Spawn hasn't been seen too much. Kath has been rather vocal today and seemingly heroish with her attempt to prevent the double killings.

Out of these I'm thinking the Heroes would be silent today so even though killing Kath and feasting on her carcass would bring me great delight I think the little runt may be innocent but misguided. Now that leaves Eomer and Spawn (as well as Lhuna but I'll give her time) each can be crafty. So if Formendacil has no objection I would think Eomer or Spawn should go today as well as Wayne. I will be willing to be here near the deadline, unless unforseen problems arise, to ensure the success of our double kill.

I would put us in the following camps

Wayne vote
Mithalwen
Spawn or Eomer
Lhuna
Kath


Spawn or Eomer vote
Farael
Boromir
Spawn or Eomer
Oddwen

It would be nice to have Gurthang, Formendacil and me hang around unil the last hour to clean things up as needed. Let me know if that works.

[mormegil]

Wayne vote
Mithalwen
Spawn or Eomer
Lhuna
Farael



Spawn or Eomer vote
Kath
Boromir
Spawn or Eomer
Oddwen



A revision was needed to account for Farael's cross post.

Wayne has 2 votes. We need to get started on the next candidate.

[Gurthang]

Sounds good morm, especially saving a few votes as a safety. I'll make sure I'm here till the end of the Night.

Unfortunately, with Farael voting for Wayne, it puts a lot of unknown's voting in one group. So unless we can get most of them to vote very soon, we might be getting too close to the end of the Night to pull it off.

I'd strongly advise everyone on morm's lists to vote as he has said, and do it as soon as possible. If you still don't like the double kill idea, well, say so, but I think we're doing it anyway. I think most of the wolves has voiced their willingness to follow that course of action. I think that Kath has voiced her dislike for the plan, but I think she'll go along with the pack; I know Boromir is. We haven't heard Spawn or Eomer's comments on doing a double. Oddwen posted but said nothing for or against. Lhuna hasn't been here yet toNight, and I'm not really expecting her. Wayne has voted, so we don't have to worry about him.

Morm, I think we need to specify between Spawn and Eomer. I'd prefer Eomer, but I'm not the best in picking out who's guilty. In other words, just pick whoever.

[mormegil]

Okay I agree I just hope we are correct in this. I will say Spawn unless Formendacil disagrees. Mainly because Eomer wanted to know why he looked innocent which I don't see why a guilty would ask that. He could either be killed tomorrow or dreamt of tonight depending upon Formendacil

SO EVERYBODY THE VOTE NOW IS FOR SPAWN!!!

[Gurthang]

So shall it be. I'm going to go take a nap now. I'll be back again before the Night is over. When I do get back, I expect to see that everyone who needs to has voted for their appointed person.

(900th post! :D )

[Formendacil]

Woah! Woah woah woah - since when are we definitely doing a double lynching!

Since I gave my assent to the plan.

Or are you questioning the Lord Sauron's wisdom?

Dancing Spawn of Ungoliant is just as acceptable to me as the others. The official changing of the plan to become a double-lynching of Wayne and Dancing Spawn is herewith given Angbandian approval.

It would be nice to have Gurthang, Formendacil and me hang around unil the last hour to clean things up as needed. Let me know if that works.

I would that I could, but alas, the Lord Melkor calls me away to dreams, and I shall not have time to awaken ere hated Arien rises in the East.

If thou two, Mormegil and Gurthang shalt guard the surety of this double-lynching, then I shall take me to my rest, safe in the knowledge that my loyal servants serve me well.

And I shall personally start the Dancing Spawn end of the double-lynch.

By the Power of the Lord Melkor, be she foul Elfling or loyal Werewolf, I cast my vote for the death of

++Dancing Spawn of Ungoliant

[dancing spawn of ungoliant]

SO EVERYBODY THE VOTE NOW IS FOR SPAWN!!!
Well, thanks a lot. What if I disagree, does that count? :p Although morm is a proven wolf, I think it's unfair that he gets to decide alone, who'll end up devoured.

I'm being suspected again because I don't stay up all Night discussing with you. Hmph. Well, shall I vote for myself or Wayne, then?

[Lhunardawen]

Sorry, dear fellow wolves and hidden *bleh* heroes. I have forgotten to post a note on the village bulletin board that it will be hard for me to be around toNight since Gaurhothmas falls at least 6 hours and at most 15 hours earlier for me than all of you. It's a good thing that I managed to be around and see that Kath is already suspecting me. I'll answer that in a bit, after I've finally understood all that's going on.

[Lhunardawen]

Well, thanks Kath. I was actually feeling a little weird without anyone suspecting me.

So I see I really have been a bit inconsistent about Wayne. Believe me, I really want him devoured just to spare us all the confusion he's causing, but somehow I'm still hoping he'll speak up a bit more. :rolleyes: In any case, I would want him to be one of our devourees toNight because I think I finally had enough of him.

As for Glirdan, I did NOT suspect him the way I think you meant. I was actually trying to tell you all that for me, he doesn't seem to be heroic. I can't see any backtracking that I did that Night, because I was fully consistent (or at least as much as I can possibly be without any certainty) with my opinion that Glirdan is NOT a hero.

I'm a werewolf, I tell you. I wouldn't ask the now-revealed Lord Saurondacil to dream of me, as I think that would be a waste of a dream. But if he would, then by all means. I have nothing to hide. And I mean nothing.

[Lhunardawen]

Gaurhothmas draws near...and so I must vote.

++WaynetheGoblin

I fully intend to vote for him, anyway.

I hope I can still be here when the Night comes to an end.

Last thing. Someone who has the time and the will, please look closely at Eomer of the Rohirrim. Sorry dearie, but you're not sitting well with me. It's just that there's something...different about you.

[Kath]

Fine, I'll vote

++SPAWN

But I'm not happy about it!

[Lhunardawen]

Mainly because Eomer wanted to know why he looked innocent which I don't see why a guilty would ask that.Don't you see? A wolf like Eomer can pull this kind of question off as a hero. Not that I have any real reasons to suspect him but this very nearly counts as one.

Seriously, I still don't understand why dancing spawn is a devouree all of a sudden. Anyone care to explain?

[WaynetheGoblin]

well well you want to kill me 3 days from my birthday fine but you will not win werewolfs.

[Lhunardawen]

well well you want to kill me 3 days from my birthday fine but you will not win werewolfs.We (exclusive) will not win against you heroes, is that what you mean?

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

I think you're wrong Wayne. Us Werewolves (yes: US—including myself, though I won't live long enough for the party) are going to win this unless a miracle happens.

By the way, I've been quiet because I was, er, having fun last night. :D

It was rather amusing to read all those pages of working out how to carry out this plan, when the plan was blindingly obvious the whole time. We are assured a win because of the allowed double-lynchings.

Check it:

Innocents- Mithalwen, Mormegil, Gurthang, Farael, Formendacil.

Unknowns- Eomer, Boromir, Spawn, Lhuna, Kath, Oddwen, Wayne.

Order of death (say):

Wayne, Spawn-------Mithalwen

Eomer, Boromir-------Formendacil

Lhuna, Kath-----------Gurthang

Oddwen-------------leaving Mormegil and Farael as winners.


There it is. Game over.

[Gurthang]

I'm back from my 'nap'. There are not nearly as many votes as I had hoped.

Voting:
Farael - 1
Wayne - 3
Spawn - 2

I believe that's right. Tell me if it isn't.

Eomer, I notice that you didn't tag a vote onto that last post. Why? If you see that this is the way to insure victory, why have you not followed the plan?

Is there any doubt left that Wayne is a hero? Even if he's not, he's acting like one and will die toNight regardless.

Morm, just wanting to see if you're still here.

[Boromir88]

So far votings stands:

Wayne- 3
Spawn-2

Just so, there's not a mass confusion around here.

With

Myself, Mormegil, Eomer, Gurthang, Spawn, and Oddwen left to vote I think that's all names

[mormegil]

I'm tired but present. Your count is correct. 3 for Wayne and 2 for Spawn I would like to see the next vote be for Spawn and then an alternating vote for Wayne then Spawn.

Spawn, sorry about that but somebody had to pick and it wasn't easy but yes you will die and if you are innocent know that you will leave on...for you see you will become part of me as food.

Oh and Wayne, yes we do want to devour you so close to your birthday.

[Boromir88]

With an even amount left to vote, someone will have to sit out or vote for someone else. Anyway we should set this up so we don't botch it in the end:

For Wayne:
Mormegil
Spawn

For Spawn:
Boromir88
Gurthang
Eomer

With Oddwen to vote for anyone besides those two, or not vote at all. Hopefully we're all here, if we're not then, I guess something new will have to be tried.

[mormegil]

No Boromir. Gurthang and I will be voting last. That way we can clean up any mistakes and flush out any hero that may try and mess up the voting at the end. So like I said. Boromir why don't you vote for Spawn, thus tying up the count. Then we need the next two votes to go alternating between Wayne and Spawn.

[Gurthang]

I'm pretty sure Wayne has voted for Farael, so he has one vote(which doesn't come into play, really).

By the way, thank you Kath. ;)

It's nice to know I'm not alone Boromir, but I'd prefer a plan that leaves me and morm at the end.

You, Boromir, and Eomer need to both vote Spawn. Spawn will vote for Wayne. Oddwen will not vote toNight.

That leaves morm and I around to make sure that everything goes according to plan. I don't see why it shouldn't, unless we're killing both heroes. If that is the case, then it's a lost cause, because you'll die the next Night, even if we do screw this up.

[Boromir88]

I'll vote for Spawn, morm, more than glad to. Problem is with cross-postings, and anything that can happen these last minutes could cause us to botch it. I think it would be much wiser to assign votes, so you know who you're voting for, instead of saying alternate. It would be much easier to botch.

Also, I wasn't giving the order in which to vote, just basically assigning people on who to vote for. Of course I figured of anyone you two would hold your votes to the end.

++Spawn

[mormegil]

Why hasn't anybody voted. If it continues like this until near the deadline I may get worried.

[mormegil]

Thanks for the vote Boromir.

We still lack voted from Spawn, Eomer, and Oddwen.

I'm beginning to think that they will not be voting, which I say is fine. We have a tie let's leave it as is!

THAT IS NOBODY ELSE VOTE PLEASE.

[Lhunardawen]

You, Boromir, and Eomer need to both vote Spawn. Spawn will vote for Wayne. Oddwen will not vote toNight.

That leaves morm and I around to make sure that everything goes according to plan. I don't see why it shouldn't, unless we're killing both heroes. If that is the case, then it's a lost cause, because you'll die the next Night, even if we do screw this up.Does this mean we're actually going with Eomer's suggestion? Not that I have a problem with that, but we don't know what could transpire during the accursed Day.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

But I am right. There is no way the Heroes can win now.

[Gurthang]

One last thing morm. Just to make sure that you or I don't blow it here at the end, who should vote, you or me, first if someone else does vote? I'm willing to vote or hold whichever you say. We simply need to have it agreed so that we both don't jump in and put someone else ahead. Time's running out, we might not have time to decide then if it happens

[mormegil]

Good idea Gurthang.

You take Wayne I'll take Spawn

AGAIN NOBODY VOTE!

[Gurthang]

Eomer: you look more heroish every time you post. Tomorrow Night you'll be dead, I'll make sure of that.

Lhuna: I don't trust him either. The worst that could happen is that they kill the Hunter to try to get two innocents dead. That wouldn't really be so bad, because it's down to a game of unknowns versus knowns. The Hunter simply chooses from the unknowns, so there really is no way that Heromer can pull it off.

Good, morm, if somebody jumps in with a spawn vote, then I'll vote Wayne.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

For a wolf you are wise, Gurthang. ;)

I can't believe I'm going to have to put up with this for another day. Any chance of mercy, O omnipotent one?

++WAYNE

[Gurthang]

I hope that wind comes soon...

[Gurthang]

morm, I believe this is yours.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Couldn't we die side by side? It would be more poignant.

[mormegil]

I believe that vote was late Eomer and will be cut off. If not then that is fine for you will die tomorow and to think I nearly killed you today too.

[mormegil]

++Spawn

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Double lynchings, eh? :rolleyes:

The vote won't be cut off surely. Rune died by a late vote.

[Lhunardawen]

My, Eomer, you're getting scarier by the post.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

May I choose death now, Anguirel?

Lhuna, I'm especially sorry for hiding the truth from you. I can't seem to help it. ;)

[Lhunardawen]

Lhuna, I'm especially sorry for hiding the truth from you. I can't seem to help it. ;)I guess that explains something...

[Gurthang]

Thank you morm. Wayne's dead. Sorry spawn, but that's just the way the cookie crumbles. Eomer is the other Hero, there's no chance he'll survive tomorrow. :p

Oh, and, Eomer, waiting for the deadline never works... trust me, I know firsthand. *coughWW8cough*

[Lhunardawen]

Farael, I guess you know what to do the next Day. Just in case.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

You are not as wise as I thought you were Gurthang. :p

This is so painful! Where is Anguirel?

[Gurthang]

May I choose death now, Anguirel?

Kill Farael if you want to die. I'm sure he'd enjoy killing you back.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

But the way it was scheduled means that the next night isn't for—I think it's 2 RL days? What's the point? We might as well end it now.

[Lhunardawen]

Kill Farael if you want to die. I'm sure he'd enjoy killing you back.Not to mention the possibly beautiful ending narrative that could be created from such a scenario...

[mormegil]

Eomer are you the Elf or the Man?

[Lhunardawen]

But the way it was scheduled means that the next night isn't for—I think it's 2 RL days? What's the point? We might as well end it now.Geesh. Then you should have come out with it earlier during the Night. :rolleyes: :p

[Gurthang]

I don't think that ending's coming for a little while.

You are not as wise as I thought you were Gurthang.

Eomer, just what is that supposed to mean?

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

You'll see very soon, Gurthang.

Elf? Man? Um....I think I'm Captain of the Rohirrim, disguised by the arts of Galadriel. :D

Or whatever Anguirel thought of. :)

[Anguirel]

And in-for one of the last times, it seemed increasingly, and late as usual-swirled the whirlwind with its usual tidings of discomfort and gloom.

"Death! Death! Death!"

Voting closed.

[mormegil]

Eomer, just what is that supposed to mean?

I believe he meant that Spawn is his fellow hero and that is why he wanted to die side by side with her. See I was correct in thinking the Heroes would be quiet tonight.

[Gurthang]

I believe he meant that Spawn is his fellow hero and that is why he wanted to die side by side with her. See I was correct in thinking the Heroes would be quiet tonight.

Ah! In which case I would point to:

I'm not the best in picking out who's guilty.

At least I know I'm not as smart as I sometimes sound, even if everybody else doesn't know that. :p ;)

(Oooo... I like that. :D )

[Anguirel]

The snarling and arguing of the wolves claiming to be Draugluin and Carcharoth and their supporters was abruptly cut short as a formerly mostly overlooked wolf, the quiet and subtle Lobo, made his voice heard.

"Lord Sauron would disapprove of all this discord," Boromir88 was saying.

"In Sauron's name, cease your squabbling!" mormegil seconded.

"And who are you," Lobo remarked slyly, "to interpret the word of Sauron?"

All yellow, weary, bloodthirsty eyes turned straight to the unassuming, small, soft-voiced lurker. mormegil's mouth was open to scoff, when the creature's appearance began to alter somewhat. In moments he stood before the company, a tall, terrifying apparition in dark armour, with a cloak sweeping behind him; until his form coalesced into that of a wolf larger even than Mithalwen, saliva leaking from his unholy jaws.

"For I," he explained, "am Sauron."

In a moment the Lord of Tol-in-Gaurhoth's commands had been obeyed. All resistance was quelled, all dispute uncompromisingly crushed. The feared and fallen Maia spirit condemned Wayne the Fairy Hunter and the wolf o' nine tails, dancing spawn, to lengthy torture, that they might reveal all they knew, before execution.

Wayne went first. But his torture revealed few results, only the occasional pained yelp. When at last he expired from the hideous methods the Dark Lord's minions employed, it was found that most of his tongue was missing, ripped off in some long ago fight.

"That explains the worm's silence," Sauron murmured, displeased. "Now the nine-tailed traitor."

dancing spawn was tied to the stake on which Meneltarmacil had been impaled, and flayed, very slowly, with her own severed tails. At last she gave an excruciating gasp of agony and her wolf form slid from her, her mind unable to maintain it longer. A She-Elf stood, at her enemies' mercy, lashed to the post.

But as Sauron advanced on her, preparing to rend her to shreds in his fearsome wolvish aspect, the Black Warg of Rhun, Eomer of the Rohirrim, leapt between them.

"You will abandon the Lady Spawnowen," he cried, "or you will fall by my blade!"

A bold human, unarmoured but with a broadsword carried in two hands, stood between Gorthaur and his prey, and the Dark Lord felt fear in his heart, and retreated. Ever eager to safeguard her Lord, Draugluin leapt into the sword's whirring path, and the steel blade struck her hard, sinking deep into her torso; but her vast claws forced Eomer down. The human Hero and the wolvish one died in the same breath.

"The Man was courageous, but rash," Sauron concluded. "Now, my loyal servant Carcharoth, the Elf-witch is your plaything. But do not slay her. I wish you to take her to the deepest cell in the Tower, and there to spread the Curse of the Werewolf into her spirit..."

So ended a valiant, but hopeless enterprise, the first assault on the Isle of Werewolves; the Dwarf Lord drowned; the Mannish warrior slain; and the Elf Spawnowen cursed to existence as Sauron's minion.


Dead

Anguirel (Werewolf)-throat cut as he slept on Day 1
Glirdan (Werewolf)-devoured on Night 1
The Saucepan Man (Huan)-murdered by mischance on Day 2
Rune Son Of Bjarne (Dwarven Hero)-drowned in the Sirion through Kitanna's treachery on Night 2
Kitanna (Werewolf)-beheaded in Rune's last act of vengeance on Night 2
Nonnacedak (Werewolf)-mauled mercilessly on Night 3
Meneltarmacil (Werewolf)-hacked to pieces and impaled by Heroes on Day 4
Wayne (Werewolf)-tortured to lingering death on Night 4
Mithalwen (Draugluin)-slain by Eomer's sword-stroke on Night 4
Eomer of the Rohirrim (Hero)-rent in the death-throes of Draugluin on Night 4
Dancing Spawn of Ungoliant-tortured and infected with lycanthropy by Carcharoth on Night 4


Living

Mormegil-Crabby Old Wolf
Gurthang-Gil-Gurth
Formendacil-Lobo
Farael-Werewolf In Denial
Lhuna-Girl-Who-Cried-Wolf
Boromir-Exorcist Specialising in Heroes
Oddwen-Bloodthirsty Whelp
Kath-Runt of the Litter

Happy Gaurhothmas one and all, and don't forget to howl at the moon occasionally.

I hope to produce a sequel at some point!

WOLVES OF TOL-IN-GAURHOTH WIN!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Congratulations Anguirel. Even as I expected, you were a tremendous moderator. :)

I'm very glad you saw the sense in ending the game early. Lhuna, I didn't reveal myself earlier on the last night because I was still eagerly racking my brains for a way out. You can even see that where I laid out the Order of Death post where I yet claimed to be a werewolf.

Is this where someone totally humiliates me by pointing out a way I could have won?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

My fellow Heros you played a good game. . .

I must confess that I feel responsebil for us loosing this game.

On day one we were all set to kill Formendacil when I said somthing I will regret for a long long time. We could kill saucepan instead, he has used the eye of Sauron over every post exept the last one. This could be a hint (allthough we doubtet it) and if not it will still be nice to get rid of one so giftet in ww. Well the rest is history!

I did not say it like that, but you get the picture. . . :(

[Lhunardawen]

Well, well, so it ends. I see the game didn't end the way its title hoped it would. :D

Eomer, I still had no idea you were a hero until the final minutes. Couldn't you have just stuck it out for even just a Night? I could have protected you.. ;) (Or at least died with you. That would have been fun.) So that explains the absence of my protection, but oh well.


And yes, great job all. It was mind-boggling and nerve-wracking, but fun nonetheless.

Well, Happy Gaurhothmas for me in less than an hour! :)

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

That's very true. We suggested Formendacil because he was being very calm and quiet, just the sort of behaviour a gifted would display. But Rune's suggestion of SpM seemed very insightful. SpM had hinted at his role before by using the post icons.

And to think we spent two nights chasing after Menel the Ordinary!

As Werewolf players become more experienced and cleverer, the set-up of this game favoured the wolves. So many gifteds, so few Heroes, and double lynchings. But the major factor in the wolves' victory was the brilliance of Formendacil. His dreams and his timing were spot-on. The perfect Seer.

I'm sorry, Lhuna, but these games never go as we plan them. Still, at least I can PM you now. :)

[Boromir88]

Wow, I enjoyed this role-reversal as my last game for a few months...it was different, yet in a good way.

Menel and Formendacil get big congrats. Menel for successfully looking like Sauron (and kudos to Mithalwen for sniffing that out). Also, Formendacil for being able to stay hidden and choose the perfect moment to reveal all.

Despite sometimes my...frustration towards Gurthang and mormegil, the wolves couldn't have survived without you two there in the end. ;)

And to our heroes, despite your loss you really had me fooled. I wasn't onto any of you per say, maybe the most evil looking would be Eomer and I would have gladly voted for him that day, just because it felt to me like he wasn't a loud mouth like he normally did. And I really had no strong suspicions towards Rune or Spawn.

[Lhunardawen]

Maybe just a dozen more games and we'll have the "perfect" one, big bro. ;)

And hush! I can almost feel Formendacil's ego bursting from the monitor... :D

[mormegil]

Well done all. I have to admit that while it was fun playing crabby, it was at times rather difficult too. I really had a hard time insulting people at times. Of course I meant no hard feelings.

It's amazing that we had all three gifteds alive at the end. Had it not been for Formendacil stepping forward I think our hope would have been dwindled and victory would not have been certain.

Well done all and thanks for the great modding Ang!

[The Saucepan Man]

Grrrr! Schtoopid Heroes! ;)

http://forum.barrowdowns.com/ubb/icons/icon8.gif = Eye of Huan disguised as Big Bad Wolf.

http://forum.barrowdowns.com/ubb/icons/redeye.jpg = Eye of Sauron.

Grrrr!

[Meneltarmacil]

Well, good game to be sure. It looks like my theory wasn't exactly correct, as none of the Heroes were in the Glirdan bandwagon after all. To tell you the truth, I wasn't actually trying to look like Sauron, though. My votes for Rune and Farael were based primarily on voting patterns.

Anyway, thanks, Mithalwen, for saving me earlier. And Eomer, I don't think I'd ever have guessed you were a Hero.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

arrgh how could I make such a common mistake. :p

I would like to appologise to Ang. for the angry/desperate/loaded with self pity PM's I sent when I was about to die.

The thing was that 1 min. before what I thought was deadline I was not in any danger, and all of the sudden I was about to get lynched. I acctually got really mad and wantet to strike somebody down in anger. Instead I desided to go to work and be mean to all of my coworkers. The anger was not directet at anybody, but the randomness of the votes I recived.

Menel had a theory, but the other just came out of nowhere and with out me having any chance to defend my self. The fact that I thought the game Night had allready ended when this happend did not help at all.

This has been the best game of ww I have ever played, for the first time I was not worried about making mistakes and just enjoyed my self until I got killed. (another reason fot beeing so upset about beeing killed)

- Rune

P.S. I am sorry I had you killed Saucepan

P.P.S. Me and Eomer actually agreed on not killing Lhuna because we like to have her in the game.

[Lhunardawen]

P.P.S. Me and Eomer actually agreed on not killing Lhuna because we like to have her in the game.Because I'm the perfect suspicious innocent yada yada yada. :p

Saucie, I did not notice those at all. Still, good thing you were killed early. I can imagine a confusion equal to or greater than the magnitude of that which Fordim caused in XIV.

And Rune, what was the whole "I think Lhuna is innocent" thing about? That had me a bit scared for some reason.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

And Rune, what was the whole "I think Lhuna is innocent" thing about? That had me a bit scared for some reason.

I thought you were innocent and I was right ! :p

Actually there was several resons.

1. If I got killed it would look odd and maybe cause some confusion.

2. It is what I would have said if I was a wolf.

In our last game I noticed how much I agreed with you, then in this game I looked at the post's and tried to find out who I would find suspecios if I was a wolf and yet again you came to the same conclution. :)


How come you guys thought that I had mentioned one of my fellow heroes? When you look at my ignore list it is way longer than the one with people I mention.

[Lhunardawen]

:eek:

I'll do my best to think (and post) more randomly next time. :D

[Anguirel]

All my notes for this game are on another computer, but maybe Cailin has them? Anyway, I'll post them all a few days after Christmas when I'm back at home.

[Cailín]

And suddenly it's all over. That was certainly unexpected, though I doubt the Heroes could have won after mistaking Menel for Sauron. :rolleyes:

Since I'm at my parents' house right now, I also don't have any notes - I did save PMs though, so there might be some after Christmas.

Though it was indeed pleasant to know exactly what is going on for a change, I could hardly resist interfering with discussions sometimes. Well played, everyone, I fear you are all becoming far too good at this game. And Anguirel - excellent modding.

Happy Gaurhothmas, dearest wolves.

[Gurthang]

How come you guys thought that I had mentioned one of my fellow heroes? When you look at my ignore list it is way longer than the one with people I mention.

That's actually why I abandoned that train of thought. You hadn't actually spoken of many people, so the lists were rather lopsided. You did a good job in my eyes; I was almost surprised to find you as a hero.

Eomer, I think I was the first to start looking into you (when you out of nowhere accused Wayne), but now it's obvious that I had you for the complete wrong reason! I'm still a little confused as to why you said I was 'wise for a wolf' then 'not as wise' as you had thought. Did mormegil already give the answer or is there another reason?

Spawn, I don't think I had ever seriously suspected you. I didn't think you innocent, but that was largely for everyone else's suspicion. Anyway, that was a great job. I just should have stuck with someone in the Nonna bandwagon.

morm, fantastic job getting everyone together at the end. We had a few absentees, but you pulled it off. I enjoyed playing with you.

Menel, I see you have a new signature (thank you!), I really was wondering if you were just trying to copy my ideas. I guess it was just coincidence, right?

Formendacil, great, great job. I don't think I've ever been so relieved in my life. If you hadn't dreamed of me, I'm sure that morm would have had me dead that Night. It was really nice to know that I could trust him and that he could trust me. Rather a freeing feeling, in my mind at least.

Anguirel, words can't express. This was a great game. I'm almost sad to say it falls just shy of being number one. I doubt that any game will be able to outdo my Beorning role in WW8. Anyway, that was a spectacular twist, switching wolves and villagers, and a whole lot of fun. :D

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Well, Gurthang, you guessed my secret. Wise.

But then you apologised to Spawn because 'that's the way the cookie crumbles' and she had to die. I voted for Wayne in the hope that Spawn and I could die side-by-side! So it appeared you thought Wayne was my ally. Not wise. (If I'm wrong here then apologies; and 'very wise' you remain. :p ;) )

Great job all round by the wolves. Very efficient.

It was quite a funny game. In the end it was a veritable slaughter, but I think we Heroes only made one poor decision: that being attacking Meneltarmacil when we should have guessed he would be protected. Truly, Eru does not will the Werewolves to be destroyed yet! :D

[Gurthang]

Yeah, that's pretty much it. I was actually more sure Wayne was a hero than I was of you!

So, as it turns out, no matter who morm would have picked, we would have put up a hero! Man it's good to know there wasn't a wrong answer.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

I'm relieved that no-one has yet pointed out a way I could have escaped capture. To be honest, I was kind of expecting Saucepan Man or some other clever person to come in and say "Why didn't you just do this..."

There was no way out, right?

[Meneltarmacil]

Menel, I see you have a new signature (thank you!), I really was wondering if you were just trying to copy my ideas. I guess it was just coincidence, right?
Apparently. I'm pretty sure I wasn't stealing your ideas, and so that's most likely the case.

[Gurthang]

Well, that's a relief.

That line almost has a story behind it, well a short one at least. From my point of view, I was seeing a lot of similarities between our posts. Now, I didn't want to just jump out and say 'Menel is copying my posts' as such an accusation often isn't true and leaves the accusor feeling rather embarassed. Still, I wanted to somehow get my message across without seeming too accusatory/offensive. I had to think of a funny way to tell people I had noticed, what I thought, was strange behaviour. And so the quote was born. I'm glad to see you found it amusing. :D

[Formendacil]

I'm relieved that no-one has yet pointed out a way I could have escaped capture. To be honest, I was kind of expecting Saucepan Man or some other clever person to come in and say "Why didn't you just do this..."

There was no way out, right?

With the Lord Sauron orchestrating your demise, how could there have been? :D

Seriously, I had WAY too much fun coming out in the open with that post... way too much fun. So kudos, kudos, kudos, to Anguirel for giving me the opportunity to be the Dark Lord.

My strategym such as it was, was to get a list of "proven innocents (or proven Heroes) and present them to the village after four dreams or so. Had I been in apparent danger, I would have revealed all earlier, but luck was on my side.

The night that I voted for Mithalwen, I really and truly had absolutely no idea who in the place was a Hero. I was just really grateful that Huan was dead- since it meant that I couldn't be mistaking about any of my real villagers. My vote for Mith was, as someone pointed out, a cop-out. However, it did a VERY good job of putting me back on the "suspicion list", which assured (in my mind) that the Heroes would leave me be for a while.

Then came the Meneltarmacil debacle and Morm's great plan- which irked me because it was too similar- and too soon- to my plan. However, it gave me the perfect cover. Not to mention the perfect set up for the post of Lord Sauron's fury!

And, to Morm:

Consider it a mark of my highest esteem for you as a Tol-In-Gaurhother that I dreamed of you at the very beginning. I wanted to know from the outset who's side you were on.

[WaynetheGoblin]

well i guess thats good i mean i wanted revenge on the wolfs and hope that the hero would have won but hey i won.

[Farael]

Aye, Yaye!!!!!! Wake up at 1 PM ready for lunch, feeling great and find that the game is already over!

First of all, congratulations to everyone for a fun game... Even to Mithalwen, will you forgive me now that we've won and I've been proven innocent???

I swear to you guys, for a moment you had me wanting to admit being a Hero... just for fun's sake EVERYONE WOULD HAVE LOOKED SO SILLY!!! alas, I was who I said I was

Even though I suspected spawn in the beginning, if I had orchestrated the double devouring it would have been Wayne and Boromir, Eomer and someone else in the next opportunity... I don't know what you said Boro, but I suspected you.

I wish you all a merry Christmas or Janukah!! and a happy new year just in case I don't get another chance to say so =)



And for the last time GRRRRRRRAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRR I'M CARCHAROTH!!!

[Kath]

Eomer, all I can say is congratulations. No you couldn't have got out of dying but what an innocent you seemed!

Also Form, yes I can still say you are wrong even when playing Sauron!

But thanks to Anguirel for a fantastic game. Villagers against werewolves with a twist. Wonderful!

[Boromir88]

I don't know what you said Boro, but I suspected you.

Even when I actually am helpful to the innocents and actually am key to the lynching of a wolf (in this case it would be a hero) I get suspected, so no need to fret. This one I really wasn't too helpful so it comes to no surprise that I would be suspected. :p

[Meneltarmacil]

Yes, I admit I've often suspected you, even in my very first game when I was Ye Olde Knighte. I'm not sure what it is about you, but you just seem to look suspicious to me often for a variety of reasons specific to each game.

[mormegil]

This was rather fun for me for multiple reasons.


The role reversal
My characterisation was a blast even though I had difficulty insulting people because I like you so much.
Playing on the edge and being suspected was great!
I survived until the game was over (that is a first for me).


I must admit that when I found out SpM was Huan I was disappointed that he died so early. I was excited to see how he would perform in such a role. :(

Very enjoyable all.

Oh and Eomer there was a way to win...magically convince us that you were innocent. Really there was no possible way, so well done.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

A question to you beasts who killed me:

Did you really suspect me? I was feeling kind of safe, no one but Menel had raised suspision about me. You votes seemed to me rather random or at least beeing based on allmost nothing. (like when you really don't know who to vote for and just decides that because of this tiny thing I am going to vote for him/her)

[The Saucepan Man]

To be honest, I was kind of expecting Saucepan Man or some other clever person to come in and say "Why didn't you just do this..."

There was no way out, right?Well, if you hadn't gone and killed your faithful hound, you would have had a "proven innocent" on your side, given that Formy dreamed of me early on. :rolleyes:

Well, it was fun while it lasted. My strategy was to play as normal and try to stay around to cause some havoc near the end. Perhaps, knowing my (ill-deserved) "reputation", I should have just gone all out to confuse from the outset. But I was rather surprised to be killed on Day 2, as I thought that there were some prospective Saurons around (none of whom turned out to be Sauron, although I had Mithalwen down as a possibility).

The "slips", by the way, were entirely genuine and nothing to do with my role. I missed Morm's reference to Elves and "of" in my first post should have been "from" - a simple mistype. As for not posting as much as normal, I rarely post as much at weekends as I do during the week.

Still, good game all round. I enjoyed reading along after my death, most particularly when everyone was trying to read something into my vote for Nonnacedak, when I was simply trying to vote as I thought a genuine Wolf might. Glad he turned out not to be a hero, though.

Excellent modding job, Ang. I really enjoyed the write-ups. Particularly the little "dig" at the Heroes for killing me. :D

Merry Christmas all! :smokin:

[Farael]

I'm relieved that no-one has yet pointed out a way I could have escaped capture. To be honest, I was kind of expecting Saucepan Man or some other clever person to come in and say "Why didn't you just do this..."

There was no way out, right?

Probably not, but I would have tried going for Morm the night after spawn got killed, pray formen didn't dream about you to confirm the suspicions and then get him... then get Boro. They were the leaders and the pack might have sunk into anarchy. After that I'd go for Kath and don't kill Mithalwen as long as we are both alive, just start up some more arguments... keep

Of course, if you were asking how to avoid being suspected... well, trying to bring other people to the spotlight is not always the wisest calls so... prayer? I don't know, but you did give up before the game was over.

[Oddwen]

Yay! Good game, all! I had fun. Especially the role-reversals of it all, the only time I got it mixed up was when Nonna was lynched...I looked at the list and it said "Nonna (Werewolf) lynched" and I was like "Yay! Got a Werewolf...oh." Anyway. Being a Wolf actually helped me this game, every other game I've ever played I've just felt so frantic and stressed...not this one. Thanks, guys!

Oh, and sorry I couldn't get back to vote last night, I was so sick I lost track of time and had to go to bed. :(

Again, good game, and Merry Christmas to all!

[mormegil]

Spawn how many times now have you been a werewolf/hero role? I remember at least 3 or 4. I think you may have the record number.

[dancing spawn of ungoliant]

I believe he meant that Spawn is his fellow hero and that is why he wanted to die side by side with her. See I was correct in thinking the Heroes would be quiet tonight.
Heh, I had it all planned out, I intended to be quite vocal and do some mischief or at least insult you all in Quenya before my death, but I was so caught up with Christmas stuff that I couldn't get on Downs.

Spawn how many times now have you been a werewolf/hero role? I remember at least 3 or 4. I think you may have the record number. Three. 2/3 of the games my team has won (though I can't claim much credit for the victory in WW14), but we were just about the unluckiest bunch of miscreants here. *sigh* In the end, it was just comical, though.

Anguirel, thanks for great modding, though your PMs were rather annoying... Those with less clear eyesight often spot many things before those with sharp eyesight.-Plato, Republic X I mean, seriously, that's just twisting the knife. :D

Eomer and Rune, special thanks to you, my fellow heroes. After all gifteds had stepped forward and with so many proven innocents, I don't see how we could have won, but it was fun, nonetheless. :)

This was probably the most draining game in which I've ever played and part of me is glad that it's now over. The other part can't wait 'till a new WW game begins. ;)

[Mithalwen]

This will be quick .. but ..wow... and Ang was right about Draugluin being difficult...

I so nearly protected SpM on Day 1!!! SO ironic I went for Eomer who I though innocent at first and then suspected when his hint about being gifted failed to make sense....



SO why I was wrong about Farael (we have made peace privately btw) I still think he looked shifty!! At least I made two good calls when it really mattered... but I take this game far too seriously....

[Boromir88]

Yes, I admit I've often suspected you, even in my very first game when I was Ye Olde Knighte. I'm not sure what it is about you, but you just seem to look suspicious to me often for a variety of reasons specific to each game.
I remember that game, ahh...my first one. And I know I suspected you there at the end and actually wanted to lynch you until Sauce told me no, no, no, here's the way to win it. :p


The role reversal
My characterisation was a blast even though I had difficulty insulting people because I like you so much.
Playing on the edge and being suspected was great!
I survived until the game was over (that is a first for me).
Yes, I definitely enjoyed this switch for my last game in a while. Also morm, I really was wary of you until Formendacil came out, because of your insulting. Reminded me of my "insulting man from Dor Lomin" in Phantom's awesome game, though I was innocent in that, I constantly comtemplated that you are just using your insults for cover so people would think "why would a hero be so shrewd...", since that worked in my favor when I was the insulter.

[Kath]

well i guess thats good i mean i wanted revenge on the wolfs and hope that the hero would have won but hey i won.
Umm, Wayne was an innocent right? Anyone know what this post is saying?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I guess it means that he has lost to wolves many times and would like to see them get a good beating, but if this does not happen he does not really care because then he would win.

Of this we can conclute that this game was a win, win situation.

[Lhunardawen]

Also morm, I really was wary of you until Formendacil came out, because of your insulting. Reminded me of my "insulting man from Dor Lomin" in Phantom's awesome game, though I was innocent in that, I constantly comtemplated that you are just using your insults for cover so people would think "why would a hero be so shrewd...", since that worked in my favor when I was the insulter.So I guess everyone would choose to be an insulting character from now on... :eek:

That would be a painful game.

[Boromir88]

Umm, Wayne was an innocent right? Anyone know what this post is saying?
I think it means since we (meaning innocents) lynched him, he wanted revenge on us and for us to lose, but he ended up winning (being that he was an innocent).

So I guess everyone would choose to be an insulting character from now on...

That would be a painful game.
True that. :p

I find it rather funny that if anyone's been the "Three wolves/heroes" you know it's vital as to what you say and you have to really kind of watch what you say. But, also even as an innocent ordinary villager (these last to games especially) I had to refrain from saying a few things. For example, it was when I was getting suspected for voting for Nonnacedak the first Night, I just wanted to say "Hey you don't think if I bandwagoned like everyone else onto Glirdan that I wouldn't beable to get myself out of that vote?" But, I just had to refrain from that, thinking it would just make me worse off. I just find it amusing that no matter what role you are, what side you're on, it's a game where you have to watch what you say, even if you aren't one of the three.

[Lhunardawen]

I find it rather funny that if anyone's been the "Three wolves/heroes" you know it's vital as to what you say and you have to really kind of watch what you say. But, also even as an innocent ordinary villager (these last to games especially) I had to refrain from saying a few things. For example, it was when I was getting suspected for voting for Nonnacedak the first Night, I just wanted to say "Hey you don't think if I bandwagoned like everyone else onto Glirdan that I wouldn't beable to get myself out of that vote?" But, I just had to refrain from that, thinking it would just make me worse off. I just find it amusing that no matter what role you are, what side you're on, it's a game where you have to watch what you say, even if you aren't one of the three.Very true. That's why I'm inclined to suspect those who play very clean...right, Eomer? ;) *coughcoughWerewolfVIIcoughcough*

[Holbytlass]

Anguirel, superb modding, I wanted to see a role reversal and this was better than anything I ever thought of. Well done!

To the players, I never laughed so hard at first day fun and arbitrary finger pointing! Thank you all for fine entertainment.

[Mithalwen]

[QUOTE=The Saucepan Man]
Well, it was fun while it lasted. My strategy was to play as normal and try to stay around to cause some havoc near the end. Perhaps, knowing my (ill-deserved) "reputation", I should have just gone all out to confuse from the outset. But I was rather surprised to be killed on Day 2, as I thought that there were some prospective Saurons around (none of whom turned out to be Sauron, although I had Mithalwen down as a possibility).

The "slips", by the way, were entirely genuine and nothing to do with my role. I missed Morm's reference to Elves and "of" in my first post should have been "from" - a simple mistype. As for not posting as much as normal, I rarely post as much at weekends as I do during the week.

QUOTE]

Well I know only too well it is difficult to play "normally" when you aren't in a normal role :rolleyes: but while I did feel a bit mean, you did seem off your game and the first day is so random that you have to pick on someone and I knew you would be able to cope and fend off a bandwagon if I were wrong.... I was aware that the" one day SpM HAS to be one of the 3" factor was good cover for a semi-random vote.

As it was you did nearly convince me and I did nearly protect you and thanks to a internet connection which is incredibly slow at lunchtimes (due to colleagues downloading music and the whole thing being run from a server in Austria), I spent a guiltridden afternoon when I knew you had been killed but I didn't know that you were Huan. I couldn't believe my eyes when I finally got to read the whole truth.

[The Saucepan Man]

I was aware that the" one day SpM HAS to be one of the 3" factor was good cover for a semi-random vote.Ah, 'tis my fate always to be on the side of the Villagers ... :rolleyes:

Actually, I was quite happy with your vote as I thought it gave me a better chance of not being killed overnight. So much for that theory ...

I don't know. Only the second time that I have been anything other than an Ordo, and I get killed on the first (game) night. :( :D

[Lhunardawen]

Actually, I was quite happy with your vote as I thought it gave me a better chance of not being killed overnight. So much for that theory ...

I don't know. Only the second time that I have been anything other than an Ordo, and I get killed on the first (game) night. :( :DI suggest you try dumbing yourself down a little. ;)

[Mithalwen]

But that would be folly.... what is more suspicious than a professional wordsmith renowned for their intelligence playing dumb? Apart from anything else it would freak everyone out so much that they would lynch him anyway....

My own theory is that SpM should stop worrying about whether he will be able to commit for the full duration of the game. I haven't checked to verify but it does seem the more concerned he is that he might be unavailable later on the more likely it is that he won't survive 36 hrs....

[Anguirel]

Drumroll...


Sauron Gazes

Day 1-Mormegil-You stare across into the lowest pits of the tower, where your lowliest minions bide. There you see Mormegil, cuffing another wolf, probably Glirdan, as they squabble over an Elven corpse. You stare into the darkness of Mormegil's twisted mind, but he is truly focused on obtaining the corpse-meat. It seems that, if somewhat unintelligent, this pawn of yours is at least loyal-an ordinary werewolf.

Day 2-The Saucepan Man-Your impenetrable gaze trains its power on the largest of your remaining minions, the brash and boastful Big Bad Wolf, the Saucepan Man. Your powers sink into his savage animal mind-and find something you did not expect-the hated symptoms of Valinorean influence.

This is unmistakable the pawn of Orome, Huan the great Hound!

But at that point, there is a flash of steel and the singing of a bowstring! Three cloaked figures close in on Huan as he urgently bids them stop:

"You're making a terrible mistake!"

The vision cuts off...

Day 3-Mithalwen-Your Gaze extends to Mithalwen's lair, relatively high up in the Tower due to her standing as the largest female wolf. Examining it, you see it is a rather less gory and depressing habitat. No skulls and bones litter the ground; no flesh festers. Could this be an indictment against her? Perhaps the supposed great wolf eats only...elf-food?

However, as the time you stare lengthens and the sun beats stronger, weakening your will to continue looking, you realise something striking. Mithalwen is not, in fact, in any of these chambers. Searching for the threads of her mind, you detect her far below in the caves of your lesser servants! Surely a tell-tale sign: she must be a Hero, prowling among them to slay them...

Yet wait! You find her at last, and she has taken no Heroic shape. Quite the reverse; she looks larger and brawnier than ever. What fangs that she-wolf has!

And at last it dawns on you. Whoever owns this meagre billet is being watched unerringly as they sleep. Mithalwen is truly Draugluin, and she does not intend to fail you, her Master.

Day 4-Gurthang-Gil-Gurth, one of the few werewolves permitted to hold audiences with you due to his keen mind and brute cunning, flaunts his loyalty to you whenever possible. Yet this does not allay your suspicions; rather, spurs them on.

You stare with unfathomable intensity as his tower room swims into your vision. He is within, on a pallet of rags and bones; he has just sunk into slumber. You examine him carefully for signs of pretence. There are none.

Gil-Gurth is an ordinary werewolf.


Draugluin Guards

Eomer of the Rohirrim (a Hero!)
Meneltarmacil (saved!)
Kath



Heroes Slay

Anguirel
The Saucepan Man
Meneltarmacil (failed)
Meneltarmacil


Carcharoth Hunts

Boromir88
Gurthang
Wayne

I enjoyed this tremendously and I hope that, in quite a few moons, I will have its sequel prepared. The story will continue with Carcharoth the new wolf pack leader and Spawnowen among the werewolves (though of course Spawnowen will not necessarily be played by Spawn!)