Werewolf XLII, Mist in the Barrow Downs

[Farael]

It was a dark, misty night. The wind was howling on the Barrow Downs and a deep sense of foreboding seemed to fill the air. Breathing deep sense of foreboding in is something that most species of living creatures find awfully displeasing and so they run away, coincidentally finding safer places (after all, anywhere is safer than a place where the air is full of a deep sense of foreboding.)

However, humans are notoriously lacking on deep sense of foreboding senses. An elf would’ve looked up and muttered “my heart is filled with dread, let us be wary and be away from this place”. A Dwarf would’ve growled in deep tones, ran his fingers through his beard and doggedly crossed the place without ever stopping to admire the scenery (which was covered by mist anyway). A hobbit with good hobbit-sense would’ve simply ran away.

But humans? They lacked the common sense of a good squirrel, the keen heart of an elf, or even the sense of purpose and determination of a dwarf. Curiously enough, the fact that they were all braver than an average hobbit was a problem this time around. Instead, a group of men (and women) from all sorts of places and all sorts of lifestyles came together at the precise centre of the Barrow Downs, all at the same time. It was a most curious phenomenon, since none of them had any idea that the others were near-by and they had –of course- not agreed to meet there at all.

One elderly man looked around the faces and frowned. Then he opened his
mouth. Closed it again. Then he sighed and with a resigned sigh he said:

-“Let me guess. We are a ragtag bunch of companions who need to come
together and overcome their differences in order to defeat a common enemy.”

The mist stopped dead on its tracks. The sense of foreboding disappeared all of a sudden, and a deep, loud voice boomed “Well, I was planning on that...you know, throwing a few random encounters at you, causing a little drama, before having you all fight the most scary-looking monster in the Dungeon Master Boo- I mean in Middle Earth! Now I suppose I shall do something different something much more worse. Laughs evilishly”

-“You are supposed to laugh, not just say it” Said the old man

-“Farael! Stop this, I’m trying to set the mood here”

-“and you su-“ But lightning and thunder cut-off Farael’s very witty remark.
The fog was back, and so was the deep sense of foreboding which once again the men and women in the group failed to notice. However, some in the group did feel a slight tingling sensation. “hehehe it tickles” said one of them, but unfortunately the mist was so thick that no-one could see who it had been.

Alright, that was an intro for the game. You are all invited to post here to sign up for the game. The theme is a mix of pen and paper Role Playing Game and the Mist in the Barrow Downs chapter of the books. A group of travellers come to the barrow downs by chance and they are attacked by the Ghost Prince of Cardolan and his minions. Or would’ve been, hadn’t one of them spoken out and challenged the mod. Now he has thought of a much more cunning plan.

Werewolves

I know, I didn’t see it coming either. The game will be a regular Werewolf game, with two or three wolves and one or two gifted. There will be a bit of a twist actually, and it is that there will be two awards at the end of the game (other than you know, the winner of the game).

*First of all, there will be an award for the player who has chosen a character and done the most effort to stay in-character for as long as possible, as good as possible.

*Second, there will be an award for the player who makes me laugh the most. I want the game to be friendly and light-hearted, so being funny is a plus.
There are no real benefits to the awards, other than a bit of recognition. However, if I feel a player is taking advantage of this to be nonsensical and avoid suspicion (while effectively avoiding contributing anything to the game) this player will be warned and if the behaviour continues s/he will be removed through a freak accident on space-time continuum.

So if you’d like to try it out, you are welcome to join! Post here to sign up, and when we have close to enough people we’ll discuss a start date.

[Roa_Aoife]

Roa sighed and began to look over her character sheets again. I don't have any ranks in survival, of course. Why did I choose a Duskblade over a Ranger? Oh that's right, Duskblades rock.... She chuckled a littled bit as she stroked her dice bags. When Farael had asked her along, she'd agreed as a favor. She'd thought co-mod was like a co-DM. It was looking less and less likely, however. She could only hope there wouldn't be a TPK.

This mist kept swirling, and some got into her eyes and mouth. Roa coughed violently for a minute, before recognizing the way it smelled. Covering her nose and mouth, she moved towards the thickest spot of the mist. She felt around for a minute, and then found what she was looking for.

"Aha!" she cried triumphantly as she held up a power cord. The mist began to dissapate and a small fog machine appeard at the base of the tree. "That's much better. Now we can all breath while... we..." Roa dropped off as mist swirled ominously about her feet. A deep chuckle sounded through the woods, and she groaned.

"Don't tell me," she began.

"That's right," boomed the voice, "I picked up a few spares. Now stop ruining the Scene."

"Scene? What gaming system are we using here?" Roa desperately began to look for her other set of rule books.

"What else?" said the voice, "This is Werewolf, after all." Roa began to panic as she realized she'd left most of her d10's at home...

To be continued....

[Gwathagor]

Is this where we sign up?

[satansaloser2005]

Is this where we sign up?

"Ah, it is our friend Gwathagor, bringer of rhetorical questions," said Sally with a laugh. "Yes, my dear friend, if you think you are able to handle a task such as this Werewolf game, you shall notify our mod-gods Farael and Roa at this location. Might I suggest you bring an offering of sarcasm or silly banter to please them?"




OOC note: you all KNOW my duck's a-coming back in this game, right? Because I didn't do her justice in the last game. :p

[Gwathagor]

Gwathagor ShadowBlade, Scourge of the North, Defender of Truth, Terror to the Lawless, Friend to the Fatherless and the Oppressed was sick and tired. Despite being a level 41 Ninja-Elf (Sign: Thief, Class: Scout, Guild: Warrior), who could do 1,305 damage to all enemies (save the Grand Half-Orc Claw-of-Doom-bearing Wizard of the Fourth-and-a-Quarter Dungeon) within a 30-foot x D20 radius with his favored Sword of the Godly Winds ability, he found himself bored. In addition to be being bored, he had a stuffy nose. He had just slain 3 armies of 500 and their gryphotaur captains on an unspecified hill-top, and had sat down to catch his breath, when he discovered that he wasn't having fun anymore.

The realization hit him like a thunderbolt. He wiped his nose. Sniff.

"What am I doing here? Am I really happy? Did I miss my true calling? Is this a mid-life crisis? Hold on....I'm immortal, that's impossible. I don't have a mid-life."

This wasn't strictly true. ShadowBlade was not an elf; he only played one in D&D.

One of the abject gryphotaur minions was still alive. He leapt up and ran at ShadowBlade with a blood-curdling screech. Absent-mindedly, Gwathagor ShadowBlade flung his Battle-Axe of Cold Northern Death 100 feet or so, splitting the beast cleanly in two.

"I need a holiday," he declared.

However, he only thing his travel agent could find was a Werewolf game taking place in the Barrow-Downs. He packed immediately, and caught the nearest stagecoach to the Downs, ignoring several pleas for help along the way.

He thought it would be fun.

He had no idea it would be dangerous.

[Note: I prefer to be referred to as Gwathagor, BUT if you INSIST on finding something shorter, then I will settle for Gwath, as that seems to be a common truncation of the full name. As long as you don't call me Gwathy, we can be friends.]

[satansaloser2005]

Suddenly Sally realized what she had signed herself up for, and she momentarily considered withdrawing from her obligation. "Such a strange event, to play a game where the players hunt each other at night, and lynch each other at sunset! A game where the object is to murder other players viciously without a second thought as to their feelings, ambitions, or lives outside the situation." Sally paused a bit to reflect upon her thoughts. "Sounds like Christmas with my kinsmen at home," she admitted flatly.

Sally turned around to see Gwath arriving across the way. "Interesting, another victim, erm, I mean player. Nice to meet you." Sally extended her hand to Gwath, but he stood motionless, save for his eyes darting around the Barrow-Downs, taking in that which surrounded them both. "Are you all right, sir? You seem shaken up. This is the Barrow-Downs, host site for our game of Werewolf. Does the scenery surprise you?"

Gwath's bags dropped to the ground, and Sally hastily picked them up for him, noting that he seemed to have packed lightly for such an adventure, and led him to the nearest place to sit. "Here, sit down, rest awhile. Would you like something to-" Gwath finally spoke to her. Only three words, but after hearing them Sally knew it was okay to leave Gwath to his own devices. "This....This....," stammered Gwath. "What is it?" probed Sally. Gwath looked her square in the eye and replied, "This....is....AWESOME!"



OOC note: yeah, I'm too lazy to type it all out. Tried ShadowBlade for a post since it was in yours, but still too much ;)

[McCaber]

McCaber, the new guy in the group, was sitting off to the side with a glum expression on his face. "Seriously, why do we have to do D&D now? I've been waiting for the 40K game for five years, I get one of the last copies ever, and to add insult to injury they shut down the company within hours of when I finally got my book. No, I'm not bitter at all about that."

The DM spoke to him with displeasure in his voice. "If you really want to leave, you may. But everyone else will get all of the treasure and XP ever."

"You wouldn't!"

"Try me. If you leave, Roa gets double experience for every encounter, just to make up for last time."

McCaber struggled to contain his fury. "Fine, I'll play," he said, "but let's make it a quick game. All right, my character is a cleric named Richard the Unobscure. He's Lawful Evil, despises the rest of the party, has no qualms with manipulating others to get his way, and may even resort to sm- "

"Now that's enough. Please, this is a serious game."

"Alright, but I'm keeping the class and name. I can come up with background for him on the fly, if I really need to." McCaber grabs a book, his dice, and character sheets. He is ready for the challenge.

[Thinlómien]

A merry-looking young woman appeared from nowhere.

"Well, she couldn't have been there before, for otherwise she would have already joined in the discussion as she's such a chatterbox", her player said defensively, expecting the game master/dungeon master/whatever he should be called to protest to her character Thinlómien appearing from nowhere.

"Hello. I'm Thinlómien of the Dúnedain. You may wonder why do I have a Sindarin name. That's simply because I'm named after my Elven grandmother." Oh, now I sound like I was bragging about my bloodlines... not a good start of making friends... Thus she turned to the others, smiling a bit apologetically. Still, she couldn't help feeling a bit superior. Or maybe it was just her player feeling superior. "Richard? Is that a proper ME name? I don't think so. I mean, I confess giving some minor NPCs uncanonical names when I was a GM but you... you name your character Richard. Now I'm glad the Prof is already dead and doesn't need to hear of such a horrible crime." But unfortunately Thinlómien's player, like her character, had never been good in faking anything. A mischevious smile in her eyes revealed that she was only bantering with this new McCaber guy.

Then she turned to Sally and Gwathagor. She exchanged conspiratory glances with Sally. "Last game was excellent, my friend", she grinned, "let's be as excellent this time."

"Gwathagor? Unless I'm mistaken, you're new here. Welcome. It is more fun that you can even imagine."

"Roa, Farael, are you there? I think Thinlómien should receive extra bonuses to her wisdom and intelligence, being of Elvish descent... oh, and also to dexterity and charisma... and maybe strength and constitution too? You know, Elves are so good at everything..."

[Roa_Aoife]

"Roa, Farael, are you there? I think Thinlómien should receive extra bonuses to her wisdom and intelligence, being of Elvish descent... oh, and also to dexterity and charisma... and maybe strength and constitution too? You know, Elves are so good at everything..."

I object, as I have a grudge against Elven characters. Can't stand them, infact.:p I might have to give you some penalties....;)

[Thinlómien]

I object, as I have a grudge against Elven characters. Can't stand them, infact.:p I might have to give you some penalties....;)Thinlómien's player's brow furrowed and then her expression turned to a (rather uncomfortable) smile. "But Roa, my friend. She is only 1/4 elf so surely that makes her count as a human, right?"

[Roa_Aoife]

Thinlómien's player's brow furrowed and then her expression turned to a (rather uncomfortable) smile. "But Roa, my friend. She is only 1/4 elf so surely that makes her count as a human, right?"

Alright, I'll let it slide.... THIS time. :p

[Nogrod]

It seemed no one had noticed the stout elderly man who carried his Rolemaster-books under his arm. He followed the discussion for a while before entering it.

"Brains, not bonuses my friends...", he began. Then he pulled the d10's from his pockets and shook his hand before throwing the dices to the ground. "And a little luck to be sure...", he smiled after recognising the result.

After picking the d10's up he took his character sheet and marked the result of his throw into it looking at the sheet thoughtfully for a moment. He adjusted a few stats and folded the sheet back in between the pages of his Character law & Campaign law. He looked around pleased.

"Okay I'm called Nogrod. That's not my real name to be sure as that is Akseli but you need not bother yourselves with it."

Suddenly he recognised a most familiar looking face among people gathered around. "Ahh, Thinlómien of the Dúnedain! How nice to see you! And already bantering about things with weak arguments. What's wrong with Richard when the prof. himself used names like Bill and Sam? I mean even if someone wishes to be called Timmy that should be okay. It's their own shame." He smiled heartily to the Dúnedain.

"I'm in. But don't expect me to flood the discussion this time. I think it's a high time for me to try and change my tactics in these Werewolf games. Let's see if I manage to do that..." There was an ironic smile in his face as he shook his head. "Let's see..."

[Volo]

"I'm in. But don't expect me to flood the discussion this time. I think it's a high time for me to try and change my tactics in these Werewolf games. Let's see if I manage to do that..." There was an ironic smile in his face as he shook his head. "Let's see..."

"Haven't you said that in the planning stages of four or five preveous games?" said a very self-content voice.

Nogrod turned towards the voice and saw a large black shape lumbering through the fog.

Whoever this gigantic person was, he was now talking in a rather impatient fashion to someone else. "Slow down Bungo! You don't want to give a bad impression of me, do you? Now, now set me down so I can see them all".

"Ook", answered a deep inhuman voice, which suited better to the big lumbering creature.

A black gorilla entered the circle and took off the painting that hung on his neck on a heavy golden chain. He sat down with a thump and set the painting in front of himself.

"And so we meet again, Nogrod!" said the self-content voice of the painting. The painting was of a man with a broad moustache, wearing an odd light brown jacket and hat. The painting turned his gaze away from Nogrod and said, "As you all know, I am Volo and I detest funny people. I want to get this over with as quickly as possible because my team will leave to explore the Alps in exactly two weeks".

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

A pair of dice gently rolled down the steep hill. The pips on their sides kept flashing with bright yellow colors on the deep purple background.

"Smoke on the waa..."

I said background.

"Stop that CD player," the DM said, pointing to the other side of the room. "We are not going to hear a word. We'd better prepare everything - should I make a recapitulation of the last session?"
"I can hear you well even with the CD playing," spoke the player sitting on the DM's right. "And besides, we need to wait still for Viktor and Milan to come."
"Viktor wrote that he's coming late," said a voice from the kitchen. "But I say we start without him. Do you want the crisps now or later?"
"Whose is this dice?" the DM asked.
"Probably mine," said the youngest and smallest of the players. "Then put it away from the map," the DM ordered him. "This is the steep hill you camped upon the last time. The trolls you spotted..."
"Look, I managed to catch the net here! Is that wi-fi of yours fixed?" one of the players screamed.
"No, you are catching the neighbour's."
"Viktor just wrote that he is stuck in a traffic jam."
"Oh yes, I don't want crisps, do you happen to have some jam?"
"...as I said, the trolls..."
"And Milan, as I know him, is coming at least an hour later. That's typical. Did he ever come on time?"
"...the trolls you spotted..."
"I think he didn't. Oh, look, it runs perfectly smoothly. How fast connection does your neighbour have?"
"...trolls are down there. Look, if you don't want to listen to me..."
"Well, I don't know about jam, but I could call Viktor to buy something when he's on the way."
"Where's your tortoise? He's not inside the vivarium anymore."
"He's crawling on the map. Isn't he going to eat the dice?"
"Not sure. Can we use him instead of a troll figure? What do you say, DM?"
"DM?"
"Where is DM?"
***
The mist did not move even by the slightest breath of the wind. The Barrow Downs were covered in an impenetrable veil of cold vapours, and the shadowy figures speaking softly with each other were almost unseen on further distance than a few yards. The character of the ex-DM stepped as close as he dared and lifted a hand in greeting. "Salutations, good people. Am I on the right place for hunting Werewolves? Or, being hunted, for that matter?" When he did not get immediate answer, he continued. "Silence gives consent, I take it, so I'm glad to join you." He reached his hand in turn to each of the present ones. "I am called Grimburgoth, son of Herion and Peath. I come from Geann A-Lisch. You never heard of it? It's in the Drúwaith Iaur, a mighty fortress of the Dark Lord. Well, more like a ruin now." He looked around at the stern faces. "Well, as I said, they call me Grimburgoth, but that's secret - not for you, because it does not concern you. My current mission is to act as an agent and pretend that I am certain... Legate of Amon Lanc. You can call me Legate if you wish, at least it will help me if there are opposing forces around and listening. I know you are going to call me that anyway." He winked at one of the bystanders. "I am having a break currently from my mission, because -" a chuckle louder than thunder resounded all over the place and Grimburgoth looked up into the mist "- well, because my opponents are not ready to face me yet."

[Aganzir]

With a loud pop, the fat highwayman Dúnadan turned into a young Rohir man who was stroking his little grey kitten with one hand and his chin with the other, and then into a young and rather short she-creature with a hooknose, long nails and a wide grin.

"Sorry if you were scared by the noise," Aganzir said in a charming, Northeastern accent and didn't sound sorry at all. "It took me a while to decide which of these wonderful persons I'd like to play... And I ended up with the most wonderful, of course."

She took her crumbled and stearin-stained character sheet from her pocket and tore it into pieces, then looked at her two pretty-coloured d10's almost sadly and threw them away.

"I am fed up with rules and restrictions. And besides, if I have played Rolemaster for all my life (well, almost), I'm not going to change that to D&D. I will do without."

She looked around her and counted quickly those that weren't still lurking in the mist.

"One, two, three... seven. Plus Grandpa Farael and Lady Roa," she nodded at them courteously. "It seems that almost half of us are here already."

Then she bothered to look with whom she would be playing.

"I'm actually a bit scared of Uncle Gwathy..." She stressed word Gwathy. "He looks so... violent. And- it can't be sally and Lommy!" She blinked her eyes innocently. "Have we met one another before? No? I'm surely just mixing you up with some of my old... friends. Oh well. Cab, do you mind if I call you Wagner?"

Aganzir looked at the man who bore noticeable resemblance to one Alastor Moody she had once seen long ago. "Akseli had a good point about names the Prof used. And I have a bad feeling about Lommy. Really, she's accusing someone of something she's doing herself as well!"

Aganzir smirked nastily when she noticed the gorilla and the painting. The gorilla didn't do a thing to stop her when she took a brush and a little tube of Alizarin Crimson and painted the man's lips and cheeks. Then she clapped her hands, seemingly delighted.

**

Farael, shouldn't you add an I in the title? :)
And what will be the deadline?

edit: xed with Leggy

[Farael]

Farael, shouldn't you add an I in the title? :)
And what will be the deadline?


The mist swirled, twirled and... hmm... got thicker-ed? Bolts of lightning were seen on the distance. Or would've been if it wasn't for the mist, but still, the light of... well, you know what I mean.

The Mod was displeased

"Where is my I?" boomed his voice.

The players looking at each other with fear on their eyes. They were so fearful that they even started laughing. And pointing. It was high school all over again!

------------------------------------------------------

It seems I've forgotten to add an extra I to the title. Does anyone know how to fix that?

Also, I was waiting until more people were around to set the deadline. It would probably be later-ish in the evening on North American times, as I cannot guarantee I'd be around at any other time. I'm thinking 7 or 8 PM CT (which I think is GMT-6) would work best for me. However, should we have (as it looks likely now) a large amount of European players, I might make the deadline 9 AM CT, which would be 3 PM GMT.

So, to make this fair, I'll give you folks two times and we'll see which one works better for most

First one is 7 or 8 PM CT

Second one is 9 AM CT

Also, here's the list of who has signed up so far... Let me know if I left anyone out:

Aganzir
Legate
Volo
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor (oh the wonders of copy+paste)

For a total of eight players. And of course
Roa and Farael as co-mods.

We still need at least four more people. As an incentive, for every player over 12 that signs up, I will add a number of half-werewolves who have repented from their werewolvish ways. In essence, they are just like an ordo, but with another name. However, you know you want to be a half-werewolf... so tell your friends to join in!

[Nogrod]

It seems I've forgotten to add an extra I to the title. Does anyone know how to fix that?Yep. PM Morm to do it. The mods can change the titles of the threads. We ordinary deceased have no power over a title that we let go from our hands... They are the final GMs. :D

I'm thinking 7 or 8 PM CT (which I think is GMT-6) would work best for me. However, should we have (as it looks likely now) a large amount of European players, I might make the deadline 9 AM CT, which would be 3 PM GMT.
So, to make this fair, I'll give you folks two times and we'll see which one works better for most
First one is 7 or 8 PM CT
Second one is 9 AM CTDo you mean with CT actually CST which is GMT(/UTC) -6?

That would mean in Finland either 4AM (8PM CST) or 5PM (9AM CST). So you can just guess which one we would support... :D
(Legate's hours are -1 to Finland so I guess he might side with us here.)

Adding Legate to the tally we have 5/8 (as far as I know) coming from these East-European time-zones... Well just recruit more Americans to shift the balance... :)

And anyways: traditional Werewolf on offer which everyone were waiting for. C'mon people!

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

(Legate's hours are -1 to Finland so I guess he might side with us here.)
Right you are.

One more thing. Please, I don't want to be disturbing, but for all further American Mods, I'd have a pleading request: I don't know how you are accustomed to count the time, but I would like to kindly ask you to try and post all times in GMT! As far as I know, GMT is worldwide-used main time (why, since it's called MAIN time), and for us Europeans, and mainly for us who are on bad terms with maths, it is terribly difficult to count anything on other terms! Surely everyone knows, or can very easily check, what his time is in relation to GMT; but I have never heard about things like CT before so I don't even know what it is and where it is used (well, I have an idea, but you got the point). I could also formulate it the way that we are lucky we don't have Asian Downers playing, though what is not now, may come in the future, and for this reason things like main time have been invented. Of course Farael did include GMT, but that is also for other people who read this (and, to be picky, even you, Farael, first wrote CT and GMT mentioned only once as a side issue and not in the main proposal of yours where it sticks out).

[Roa_Aoife]

That will be 8 AM for me. I can be there at deadlines if that's the time. I may only post who died and then come back with a story later (after I wake up more) but I can do it.

[satansaloser2005]

"Roa, Farael, are you there? I think Thinlómien should receive extra bonuses to her wisdom and intelligence, being of Elvish descent... oh, and also to dexterity and charisma... and maybe strength and constitution too? You know, Elves are so good at everything..."


"Seems to me like Miss Lommie may be getting a bit of a big head, which I can unsterstand for someone of her breeding," quipped Sally.






Ummmmm well.... neither of the deadlines are particularly attractive to me, but I would vote for the 7-8pm CT DL because it's the better of the two by a slight margin. The mornings I'll be in class (or on my way to class I should say) but the evenings I'll be gone half the time and would have to post/vote like 3-4 hours pre-DL.

[Farael]

Well, we can't decide until we have everyone on board, but right now it's looking like 9 AM CST (3 PM GMT if my complex mathematical models* are correct).

The question is, will you Europeans be able to contribute at that time? It may very well be during work-hours for you folks, so keep that in mind. The game will not have retractable votes, so being around at the deadline won't be as crucial.

------------------------------------------------------------
*By complex mathematical models, Farael means five fingers in one hand and the thumb on the other.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well, we can't decide until we have everyone on board, but right now it's looking like 9 AM CST (3 PM GMT if my complex mathematical models* are correct).

The question is, will you Europeans be able to contribute at that time? It may very well be during work-hours for you folks, so keep that in mind. The game will not have retractable votes, so being around at the deadline won't be as crucial.

Speaking just for myself, as long as we have the exam time, which is still for some two weeks into the future, I should have time to appear around the DL, as my time is technically not limited by anything (and certainly not in the afternoons).

[Nogrod]

Ummmmm well.... neither of the deadlines are particularly attractive to me, but I would vote for the 7-8pm CT DL because it's the better of the two by a slight margin. The mornings I'll be in class (or on my way to class I should say) but the evenings I'll be gone half the time and would have to post/vote like 3-4 hours pre-DL.The one you like with "a slight margin" would be something like 3 or 4 AM in our time (four to five players this far of those enrolled would have that middle of the night then) so if that margin really is slight let's make it the other one?

Okay we still need a few players and let's see from wherever they come from...

[satansaloser2005]

The one you like with "a slight margin" would be something like 3 or 4 AM in our time (four to five players this far of those enrolled would have that middle of the night then) so if that margin really is slight let's make it the other one?

Okay we still need a few players and let's see from wherever they come from...

That's what I figured. Hence why it was a slight margin, if at all. Either one is fine with me. I may just have to vote before I go to bed or whatnot because I'm not a morning person, which shouldn't be that big of a deal anyway.

[Gwathagor]

Let me make sure I understand this: Is the "deadline" we choose the time at which the Day ends and the Night begins? If that's the case, I'd vote for 9 pm Central Time (that is what CT stands for, isn't it?). Sorry. It's my first game. I don't know what I'm doing.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Let me make sure I understand this: Is the "deadline" we choose the time at which the Day ends and the Night begins? If that's the case, I'd vote for 9 pm Central Time (that is what CT stands for, isn't it?). Sorry. It's my first game. I don't know what I'm doing.

Yes, the Deadline is the time when Day ends and Night begins and in fact, also the time when Night ends and Day begins.

[Aganzir]

The question is, will you Europeans be able to contribute at that time?
I have exams next week, but after that Tuesday and Thursday may prove a little problematic for me (assuming it's day, not night, that is ending then). But if the deadline was 8 pm ct, my contribution would stop about eight hours before the deadline every day (well, except weekends).

I know this thread hasn't been up for long yet, but should you start sending some invitations? I guess there should be several people who are interested in a simple game but don't know about this.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

The fates are conspiring against me to make me eat my words, it seems.

I'll help you fill a spot if you can't find anyone else. Consider me a reserve?

[Farael]

I know this thread hasn't been up for long yet, but should you start sending some invitations? I guess there should be several people who are interested in a simple game but don't know about this.

Yes, I will do it this afternoon... the problem for me is that I haven't really been around much and the people I used to talk to are no longer here, or are here very rarely. Still, I'll see what I can come up with.

Players are also welcome to invite other people if they'd like!

[satansaloser2005]

Let me make sure I understand this: Is the "deadline" we choose the time at which the Day ends and the Night begins? If that's the case, I'd vote for 9 pm Central Time (that is what CT stands for, isn't it?). Sorry. It's my first game. I don't know what I'm doing.



Hate to ask a silly question, but is the proposed deadline 9am CT or 9pm? Just to ensure that I know when I need to be around.

[Volo]

Hate to ask a silly question, but is the proposed deadline 9am CT or 9pm? Just to ensure that I know when I need to be around.

I think 9am CT is winning at the moment because of these nassty European Downers. :rolleyes:


Farael, could you please put a questionmark after my name. Playing this game might not work as I have my calender fully booked for the next two weeks after which I'm leaving to Switzerland where I might not be able to play. But because I'd really love to do some wolf-hunting I won't say "no" yet.

[A Little Green]

"Oooh!"

The fat, lazy cat (that was neither particularly little nor green) that had been lurking by the edges of the crowd suddenly transformed into an evil stepmother, a tall woman with pinned-up black hair, a fancy dark green dress, a sour face, and, most importantly, bony hands with unnaturally long fingers.

"So. What naughty have you done behind my back?" Her gaze swept the crowd, icy-cold. "Arguing about time zones, are you? Asking silly questions? Tearing character sheets to pieces? Bragging about family lines? Uncivilised, shameful kids. As a punishment, you shall all be locked into... into..." She looked around, desperately trying to find some place where she could lock the naughty kids in, but found nothing suitable. "...into hell when you die", she finished, straightening the hem of her gown.

"I am your stepmother, though I dislike the task even more than I dislike you. My name is Anjelica Primadonna Alexandra Lilia Isabella Serafina Victoria Geri Whatever Whatever. You may call me Stepmother, but if you want a shortening for my name it shall be Lily, or Greenie, after the shade of my dress, see." She pointed at her hem.

"Deadlines. Do they mean the time when naughty kids should be home...?"


--------

Both of the deadlines are a little problematic, but I suppose I can cope with them. the 3 PM GMT would be 5 PM in here, so... Well I have lessons until 4.15 every day I think, so I'll be home around 4.45, so I'll have a good fifteen minutes before the deadline. I'd rather have that than the other, though, because it is indeed 4 AM in here and I'm not very intrigued by that option.

So, either way, I probably won't be around at the deadline every Day. Nevertheless I'd vouch for the 3 PM GMT.

And, out of curiosity, what is a DM? Is it something important? :confused:

[Farael]

And, out of curiosity, what is a DM? Is it something important? :confused:

Nothing to worry about, DM = Dungeon Master... the "mod" in pen and paper Role Playing games.

The list so far

Aganzir
Legate
Volo
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Shasta?
Volo?

We are getting closer to my (lowest) goal of 12 players. I'd like to clarify one thing though

There is no need to stay in character, nor there is need to be funny in all of your posts. As I said, the "awards" at the end of the game are mostly meaningless, other than a little recognition. However, I remember a time when Werewolf was fun to play throughout, not just fun to play in those last exciting moments when the game comes down the line. I'm doing my best to make it a little more fun Farael style.

Finally, it looks like you bunch of Europeans are going to rule over us North Americans with regards to the deadline. However North Americans do not despair! It is not the end of the world if a few of us are not around for the deadline.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Farael was frowning. "Hey, Misty where was the fun on your last post?"

-"If you must know, I am not your personal clown Master Farael"
-"But you said"
-I KNOW WHAT I SAID!
-"Hey, cool, how do you do that voice?" Said the old man
-"... Something tells me you are not long for this word" Answered the voice
-"What?"

A sigh was heard, and then the unthinkable happened. A giant, green hand materialized from the mist and smacked Farael on the back of the head.

[A Little Green]

Nothing to worry about, DM = Dungeon Master... the "mod" in pen and paper Role Playing games. Ah well some Dungeons and Dragons thingy, then? :D I'm used to the term Game Master (or is that actually a term at all...?) but I suppose they are the same. :rolleyes: Sorry for the confusion.

[Farael]

I think there has been a misconception I'd like to clarify

Players are encouraged but by no means forced to post in character

If you want to play and not post IC for more than a (game) day, be my guest! Or my player for that matter :p

[Nerwen]

A tall, gaunt figure wandered through the mist. A barrow-wight? No! A sudden thinning of the fog revealed a pale, thin face that might have that of an Elf– if not for the pointy nose.

"Hello..." Nerwen called in despairing tones, "Is there anyone out there?"

[Thinlómien]

A Little Green,

I use the term GM instead of DM. You can use it too and then we can fight those heretics! ;)

Secondly, if school ends at 4.15 and the deadline is 5, why not spend jolly 45 minutes in the school library playing werewolf? ;) That's what I'm going to do, at any rate...

[Volo]

Secondly, if school ends at 4.15 and the deadline is 5, why not spend jolly 45 minutes in the school library playing werewolf? ;) That's what I'm going to do, at any rate...
I wonder if all three of us doing that will work... :D

[Nogrod]

I wonder if all three of us doing that will work... :DI could come out from the teachers' workroom and join you guys in the school library... That would be a nice sight indeed! :)

I think there has been a misconception I'd like to clarify
Players are encouraged but by no means forced to post in character
I'm afraid this has indeed been the problem. I remember that there has been this discussion around before and there seems to be a lot of people who do not feel comfortable with RPG-style of Werewolf.

Let's throw a few invitations around everyone so we can get the game started before fex. Volo (or indeed Farael himself) need to quit

I'll send one to five... let's say Rikae, Mac, Valier, Naria and... Lalaith (yes it would be real fun to see her around for a long time).

Okay? You try some others...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I could come out from the teachers' workroom and join you guys in the school library... That would be a nice sight indeed! :)

In that case I suggest you ask someone around there to take a photo of you and then send it here so that we may share this funny sight :D

By the way... it still isn't clear when the game is going to start, but anyway, I would like to post a warning here that I am not going to be at home whole Saturday this week. I will be at my cousin's, and I probably will have chance to at least take a peek at the Downs and post during the day, once, or even twice - but I won't be probably for long reading any posts etc. Just saying this in forward, because I know it in forward :) I will repeat it later to make people aware of it on the actual day...

[Farael]

You folks are more than welcome to send invitations. I've already sent quite a few, but I won't tell you to whom for obvious reasons.

That way you guys can bug them into joining without feeling guilty that I already have ;)

And yes, if the game hasn't started by Friday I might have to start considering either starting with whomever we have or just canceling it.

[Nogrod]

And yes, if the game hasn't started by Friday I might have to start considering either starting with whomever we have or just canceling it.I sent those "invitations" I said I would - and I underlined the fact that there is no "in character play" required. I also said we're going to start any day now.

Let's hope they - or some others - will take the bait.

[Volo]

Friday... I'm going to play in a mad way then to get myself lynched early on so that I don't have to retreat. maybe... ;)

[Volo]

I have to retreat, unfortunately. :( I'd probably be away from the game for more than one Day and even otherwise would be able to be around only for a few hours per Day. I don't want to take the risk.

Have a great game!

[Nogrod]

Sorry to see you go Volo

But this came from Macalaure:
If we only start on Friday with a Night phase, I'm going to think about it. Consider me an inofficial question mark.

Lalaith sadly said she doesn't have the time now.

So one out, one in?

Let's see a few more in.

[Farael]

Updated List:
Aganzir
Legate
Volo
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure?
Shasta?

We have 9 yes and two ?... I think we could get a game going, though it'd be smaller in scope. I'll PM the roles and start the game officially on Friday morning, unless we have more people drop out.

It should be fun, it's a shame that some people were put off by the idea of posting In Character.

[Meneltarmacil]

All right, I'm convinced. I'll join the game.

[Roa_Aoife]

You forgot Nerwen. She signed up to play with out a question mark. Post #36.

[Rikae]

I think I'll sign up, if I still can.
At least then I get to mention that, as someone who's learning German, the title of this game makes me snicker every time I read it!

[Farael]

You forgot Nerwen. She signed up to play with out a question mark. Post #36.

You are co-mod here, you could've just posted an updated list :p sheesh kids these days. Though I'm pretty sure I'm younger than you.

*ahem* anyway,

The new, updated list with 200% more Nerwen

Aganzir
Legate
Volo
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure
Nerwen
Meneltarmacil
Rikae
Shasta?

Which if I'm not mistaken means we have 13 1/2 players. As to my promise earlier, that means that we'll have 1 1/2 half-werewolves. These characters are just like ordos in every way or fashion, essentially they are there for write-up purposes.

It also means that we have enough for two wolves and a ranger (no seer, no hunter, no crazy roles). If we get to 15 before friday morinng I may decide to add another wolf and a Seer.

The game will start on Friday, February 8th at 9 AM Central Time, or 1 PM GMT

So if there's anyone else looking to join, now's the proper time to do it!

[Meneltarmacil]

With 15 players, I'd suggest three wolves. As I recall, there were only about 12 players in Werewolf I, and that game had three wolves and a Seer.

Not to step on the mod's toes, mind you.

EDIT: Oops, misread the original post. I still think we could manage three wolves with only 13 players, but it would be tricky. With 14, we should certainly be able to get three wolves though.

[Farael]

No toe-stepping! This game is ultimately supposed to be fun for the players. I'll have my mod-fun whether we have 5 wolves or 1. So if you folks have any ideas or concerns, do voice them.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I suppose I'll go ahead and commit, if you're dithering whether or not to add a third wolf. :P

[Thinlómien]

I think we should have one more wolf. I'm afraid it will be too easy and non-challenging if we have only two culprits to catch (and I'm of course concerned that if I had the bad luck of ending up being a wolf I'd rather have two companions than one ;)).

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

The game will start on Friday, February 8th at 9 AM Central Time, or 1 PM GMT
And that will be Night 1, right? So Day 1 starts on Saturday. That means I am probably not going to be able to post on Day 1 much, if at all (see my post above).

[Aganzir]

At least then I get to mention that, as someone who's learning German, the title of this game makes me snicker every time I read it!
Let's just hope that in this case the name isn't omen. ;)

Farael, you still have Volo in the list.

[Thinlómien]

Rikae and Aganzir, you're evil - you forced me to find a web dictionary and look that up. Are you content now, huh? :p I must say that German people give ugly meanings for beautiful words - and vice versa, from the little German I know. ;)

And I guess I might have to be slightly absent during Day1 too... but I'll be there.

[Aganzir]

The game will start on Friday, February 8th at 9 AM Central Time, or 1 PM GMT
Isn't it 3 PM GMT I think?

And I think three wolves would be fine, whether there are 13 (like now) or 15 players.

[Farael]

Isn't it 3 PM GMT I think?

And I think three wolves would be fine, whether there are 13 (like now) or 15 players.

Ach, 3 PM GMT (see why I like using MY timezone?)

Ok, official list again

Aganzir
Legate
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure
Nerwen
Meneltarmacil
Rikae
Shasta

That's 13 players. I guess due to popular vote we'll go with three wolves and a seer. I'd much rather have 15 players if we're gonna have 3 wolves, so if you can think of anyone else to bug into joining the game, do bug them.

[Farael]

After a lengthy discussion, the mist seemed to return, thicker than ever. There was no sound other than the voices of the participants on this ‘new’ kind of game designed by the Dungeon Master

-“GAME Master” Said Thinlomien. Rikae began to answer “Well, in German it would actually be..” but she was cut-off by a guttural voice that seemed to raise from the soil itself

-“Silence you fools do you not recognize death when you see it?”

-“Well, not to be difficult, but it is hard to see much in this mist. “ said a voice, but no-one seemed to recognize Macalaure speaking.

-“Does anyone have a cookie? I am starving over here” added Farael seemingly oblivious to the supposed dark, threatening ambience that the D/GM was trying to establish.

-“Well” said the voice “You leave me no other choice... It seems you will not be quiet on your own” and began to chant

Stiff be limbs and cold be bone

Dead the heart and flesh of stone

Gather all ‘round my dark throne

Speak no more, light be-gone

And right there and then a deep sleepiness overcame all of them. With one last mighty effort of will, Farael summoned all his remaining and quickly waxing strength to mutter “creepy...” but all the others were fast asleep and did not hear him say so.

Night 1 has started Please, do not post on this thread until the beginning of Day 1

Game information:

Three wolves

One Seer

No other game-relevant roles. No twists. No double-lynches (in case of a tie, the one to be lynched will be chosen by a coin toss).

Should me and Roa fail to be around for the Deadline (3 PM GMT) posting will be allowed, but no late votes (going by the time-stamps on the posts) will be accepted. Announcements (such as “I’m going to miss Day x “ or “Sorry I missed voting on day z, my dog ate... Farael :S We got him out, but now he’s rambling-mad. Well, even more than before) should be made on this thread.

Behaviour that the co-mods decide may affect the enjoyment of the game by other players will not be accepted and the player will be warned first and removed if the behaviour continues. A clear example would be an unexplained, prolonged lack of participation, but any other behaviour that may disrupt the game will be addressed.

If you have not received a PM with a role when you read this, you are an ordo. Please make sure you are set as invisible throughout the duration of the game.

Wolves, you may PM to each other and plot. Half werewolves do not get to PM each other. Being a half-werewolf does not ensure that you cannot be another role (i.e. one can be a half-werewolf and a "werewolf" at the same time... or half-werewolf and Seer.)

Finally, Seer and Wolves, before the end of the Night, send both me and Roa your chosen kills/dreams (the Seer gets a dream tonight, but the wolves do not get a kill)

[Farael]

The day dawned bright and lovely. Grass grew on the barrows and the birds sang. Unfortunately for the players, they were now trapped inside one of those nasty barrows.

"Why are we all dressed like this?" Asked Lommy
"Oh, it must be the curse of the Barrow Wights" Said Farael
"What are you doing here? you are supposed to be dead!" replied the penguin lady.

"Well, that's a nice thing to say... hey Roa... Roa?" Then they noticed that there was someone missing indeed.

They searched the barrow up and down, and all they found was a note. Nogrod picked it up and read "You thought a normal D&D game was too easy for you. Now you shall face the horrors of... werewolves in the barrow downs"

"NouuuuuuuUUUUUU" screamed he. "My half-brethen are here. I must confess to you all, I was sired by a werewolf myself. Fear not, I do not turn murderous every night, but shaving in the mornings is always a pain. However, it seems that some of us have turned into real wolves"

"Fear not! I know the way out of this place" said Farael "Then we can each go our own way and we'll be safe. Or at least, safer than being trapped in a small space with three werewolves"

"How do you know there are three of them?" Replied Rikae.

"eh... uh...."

"That IS fairly odd of you to say" added Gwathagor "Get him!!"

"Wait, wait! I can explain!" And he did. He talked for an hour, then answered fifteen minutes of questions, and at the end of his talk everyone was reassured that Farael was not a Werewolf. Then, due to a structural mishap with the ceiling of the barrow, there was a small cave-in... RIGHT where Farael was standing. Everyone was shocked, and then a voice said

"Deus ex machina, we meet again. Now you should all probably get to work and find yourself someone who IS a werewolf" And no more was heard of Farael.
--------------------------------------------------------
The living:

Aganzir
Legate
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure
Nerwen
Meneltarmacil
Rikae
Shasta

The dead
Roa: Eaten by werewolves, or otherwise gone missing
Farael: Killed by a convenient plot-twist

The tally
Three Werewolves
One Seer

The note

You may all post now. Keep in mind the half-werewolves are not necessarily anything special.

[Aganzir]

"Oh well. If he thought a normal D&D game was too easy, why on earth didn't he try Rolemaster with all those additional rules first?" Aganzir stepped on a stony bed that made a nice stage. She rolled her eyes at the blank-faced spectators who were sitting in a row on the other side of the barrow.

"My mother, grandmother, great-grandmother, and even older relatives have always complained about normal day 1 topics, but it's only now that I understand why they exist. Someone always has to be the first one to start discussing and things like the quiet/loud discussion are easy and safe ways to do that.
However, each and every one of us already has some experience about a situation like this, even if it wasn't more than the tales told by ancestors, so our opinions should be known by now..." she was interrupted by the angrily waving Gwathagor, "oh, except Gwathy's! Well, I won't forbid you to share your opinion about whether you think quiet or loud wolves are more dangerous, whether quiet or loud players should be lynched first and so on... But I don't really expect to see you others wasting a day discussing only that."

Aganzir sighed and sat down on the edge of the bed. "Well, not that I have said anything more useful then, either. I'm just trying to get things rolling. It's rather boring to have a monologue if the audience is sleeping."

She rose and walked to a corner. "I must go now for a while and see that my little pets are alright - my squirrel and frog are surely already missing me, and my water buffalo hopefully also. But I hope to hear all your pretty voices when I return."

With that, she disappeared into the shadows. "How rude! She doesn't even bother to practise what she preaches," the others said.

[Rikae]

"Thank you, Agan, for putting words in our mouths" said the lady with the turquoise skin in a voice sweet as honey. "How rude of her..."
She smirked, then went on:
"Mist! Here I thought I overslept, and no one has spoken yet save that Aganzir person! Something has to be done to rouse this village... now what could I do? Oh, I know:

I am the weaver!

No, wait, how about this:
Nogrod is a wolf! I know it! Look at him skulking there in the corner, I can just see his fangs gleaming.

Well, seriously, we have our work cut out for us in this game, with three wolves among thirteen (why couldn't we have a lucky-number burgler in the mix?) I know it's intimidating to start speaking early in the day, but we must if we're going to get anywhere. I believe we can catch a wolf toDay if everyone talks and we use our logic and intuition together (and avoid frivolous bandwaggons) so c'mon, people, wake up and give us your thoughts, hunches, what have you.
I'm going to have to wander off the downs in a couple hours to take my daughter to a birthday party in Buckland, but I'll return well before sundown.

What do you mean I should show you the way out too? You're not invited to the party!"

The turquoise lady sat down with her back against a comfy standing-stone, took a sandwich out of her bag and proceeded to eat her very late breakfast.

[Rikae]

Three hours since dawn and still nothing? Come on, people - this is ridiculous. You ought to be ashamed of yourselves.

[Nogrod]

Finally Nogrod entered the larger chamber holding a towel to his cheek. There was something red in the towel.

"Sorry being this late fellows but this shaving thing is just becoming a real pain in the... well you know."

But everyone seemed to either just mind their own bussinessess or were sleeping.

"WAKY-WAKYYY!!!", he shouted as loud as he could. Some people turned to look but others just continued not doing whatever it was they were not doing.

"Okay then. Aganzir kind of pre-empted the discussions... hmm... like she clearly tried to pre-empt any actual suspicions towards herself as well. Very careful, veery ceerfull indeed.

And Rikae! How on earth did you manage to expose me already? Dratted... :) But as they say it takes one to know one. And this Macalaure fellow surely is your friend in crime as he always is... :p

Gah..."

Nogrod picked his dices and rolled them to the floor: "not the quiet/loud discussion... not the helpful/substantial discussion... not the overall strategy discussion... not the special roles speculation..."

Finally he tucked the dices back to the pouch and sat down looking quite unhappy

"Heck, why bother..."

[Macalaure]

Macalaure lazily woke up and gazed through the room with narrowed eyes. What is this? The day is indeed already several hours old. I expected the general turmoil to wake me. How come there is so little talking? he thought. Defying the heavy burden of a bad conscience, he lifted himself up.

"Strangely, everybody seems reluctant to discuss the useless things and remains quiet because there is yet nothing useful to be said. While it is doubtlessly honorable to focus on what's important, it's not actually helping us today. As contradicting as it may appear, we need to discuss futile topics in order to be productive and make at least an educated guess when twilight comes.

"not the quiet/loud discussion... not the helpful/substantial discussion... not the overall strategy discussion... not the special roles speculation..."

Shall we lynch the helpful or the substantial?? Now if that wasn't a slip, dear Nogrod, if that wasn't a slip. ;)

Anyway, let's try it in a slightly different way. What about this:

Shall we lynch a weird-looking member of our group, or a conventional-looking? I say we go for the latter. My lorebook tells me that in dire situations like ours, the strange have been lynched early on more often than they deserve, and with very poor results usually. Let us go for one who flies under the radar, one who doesn't say anything controversial, one who seems eager to not rub people the wrong way. Sure, those people are difficult to catch since it requires a sharp eye to discern them from someone who says nothing because s/he just has nothing to say. But come on! Let us give effort and lynch one who is most eager not to be pinned down!

And if we can't find one, we can still abide by the first law of werewolf-disposal:"


§1 - When in doubt, lynch Nogrod.:p

[satansaloser2005]

Sally was startled by Nogrod's yell, and out of habit threw her pillow at him. Fortunately for Nogrod, she had brought her pillow made of a ton of feathers, rather than the one made of a ton of bricks.
"Why do you feel the need to wake me at such an hour?" she snapped. "Do you realize that it's...." Nogrod shot Sally a look and showed her the time. "....Oh, quite right then. Perhaps I should count myself among the awake. But where are all the others? Alas, you must scurry along to wake them as well. Feel free to take Emily with you. She's very good at biting people....not to mention that she's a bit scary at times." With those words, Sally walked away to freshen up and prepare herself for the heated discussion which would (eventually) ensue.



Now, onto business. Nogrod has made his first blunder, and I shall be the first to call him on it. You see, last night this man, erm, wolf, and his fellows slaughtered our lovely Roa, and yet this morning he happily carries the evidence with him in the form of this bloody towel. He attempts to be clever, to say he has made a mess of his daily shave, but we who are non-hairy know better and thus we must punish him for his oversight.


Sidenote: I may be less of a participant in the game than I originally planned. I was rather ill the last several days, and as a result am far behind in class work, so that'll be taking up a lot of my time. But never fear, Sally will still be here! :)

[Shastanis Althreduin]

"I do of course wonder how Mistress Sally detected the bloody towel, given that Nogrod left it in the bathroom.... maybe she detected it by smell? In which case...." Shasta lithely swung himself out of bed and promptly fell on his face.

"Who tied my sheets to my ankles?" he asked, rolling over and blinking. "Is this yet more devilish wolf-work?"

[satansaloser2005]

Ah, but perhaps you did not notice, he brought it with him, as you can plainly see here:

Finally Nogrod entered the larger chamber holding a towel to his cheek. There was something red in the towel.

"Sorry being this late fellows but this shaving thing is just becoming a real pain in the... well you know."


"Perhaps our dear friend Shasta is trying to cover for his fellow Nogrod's mistake?" reasoned Sally. "Maybe I should look into this a bit, but for now I am a bit peckish, so I shall go to hunt down some food....literally...." :P

[satansaloser2005]

"Who tied my sheets to my ankles?" he asked, rolling over and blinking. "Is this yet more devilish wolf-work?"

....Well, Shasta, while I am not of the wolvish persuasion, I do enjoy a good practical joke. ;)

[Aganzir]

"Aye, this is ridiculous. Besides, I couldn't find my water buffalo anywhere. I bet she is somewhere drinking beer again." Aganzir appeared from the corner. A faint click was heard, as if a door closing, and then the corner was as dark as it had been.

"I, for one, don't believe this Rikae person. Mainly because Farael said there is no weaver. Or... maybe it was Farael who was lying... Who knows? One can never be sure about these mods nowadays.

"But yes, I agree with you that Nogrod looks very wolfish! When I was little, my ancestors told me stories about those of Nogrod's, and his whole kin is supposed to be extremely loud and aggressive, not of the type to be snoring in the corner for the first part of the day. Oh, good morning Noggins, he-he, a beautiful morning, isn't it!

"And why that blood on your towel? (Good find, sally, by the way!" Aganzir winks at her.) "You know, I wouldn't put it past you to come with a clear evidence here, counting on that we wouldn't believe you did it.

"Good morning, Mac. If I don't have problems with hearing, you are saying it's strange that some people don't want to discuss certain futile things that have been chewed over and over. Well, I think we can discuss about something else this time. When enough people have spoken, we can talk about them instead of futile things. This seems to be 'enough', since we can soon start arguing properly.

"And do you think Nogrod suggested lynching also the overall strategy because he said 'not the overall strategy discussion'?

"I can tell even now that I'm going to lynch the most suspicious-looking, and I don't care if that person is quiet, loud, substantial, conventional or whatever. There are usually better chances that the most suspicious-looking is a wolf than that the quietest is one."

Aganzir sniggered when Shasta fell. "I confess! I did it! Not in the night, though, but in the morning when I was bored.

"But... I wonder why you are saying Nog left his towel in the bathroom as we all can see that he didn't. Maybe it was a part of your original plan and Nog, for some reason, forgot it... Maybe..."

edit: xed with two sallys

[Aganzir]

....Well, Shasta, while I am not of the wolvish persuasion, I do enjoy a good practical joke. ;)
Liar! I did it! It was me! Lynch her! She's lying!

[A Little Green]

Lily the Stepmother got to her feet, gracefully hiding a yawn behind one of the famous long-fingered hands. She eyed the awoken ones suspiciously, and those still asleep even more so.

"What have you been doing behind my back, you ill-bred scums? Killing mods, eh?" Her gaze swept to Nogrod's bloody towel. "For heaven's sake, child, get that awful bloody thing out of my sight! What were you thinking, spoiling a good towel? Besides, Nogrod, yelling is certainly not proper behaviour for a boy of your age. I also demand an explanation for this statement: not the special roles speculation... What do you mean by special roles speculation? Speak plainer, or I'll lock you to... to..." She shrugged, trying to remain dignified. "...somewhere."

"And you, Aganzir! Your ancestors hardly matter to us. Stop gloating about your fine grandmothers and concentrate on yourself and your own situation. Silly kid. I don't think you are dangerous, though, only another ill-bred child. On the other hand you are so wicked that I never can be too wary with you. But doing evil things to Shasta was very naughty of you in any case. Though he is as ill-bred as you are, you are to apologise to him. And see that you don't let the buffalo of yours in here. Those creatures smell awful bad."

"Rikae! What was the substance of what you said? Of course I can't expect much more from such silly children in such a silly situation, but your speech seemed nonsensical all the same. I'm watching you..."

"And Macalaure. You look merely ill-bred, not necessarily dangerous. You speak as good sense as you are ever likely to in your statement about the weird-looking people, though generalising is a naughty habit. Your fellow ill-bred kid Agan has a good point about simply lynching the most suspicious-looking of you naughty children."

"Sally... I don't like your easy joining to the suspicion of Nogrod. Also, throwing pillows is a very bad thing to do. Apologise to Nogrod! In addition to this, you are very evil to think Agan's little trick on Shasta a good joke. She did a very naughty thing, and it's nothing to laugh at. You look like an evil child to me. I'll be having a tight eye on you." With that, she gave Sally a taste of her "tight eye".

She glanced around the room with cold, measuring eyes. "Wake up, you lazy bastards. We have work to do."

[Rikae]

"I can tell even now that I'm going to lynch the most suspicious-looking, and I don't care if that person is quiet, loud, substantial, conventional or whatever. There are usually better chances that the most suspicious-looking is a wolf than that the quietest is one."


I don't like this at all. I don't know about you, Agan, but from what I've seen, more often than not, the person who seems most blatently "suspicious" on day one turns out to be an ordo. That is, the person who attracts the most unanimous suspicion usually does so for acting oddly and being difficult to grasp (I don't see one of those here yet, but there are usually one or two in a village), and that is not behavior that a wolf would generally engage in. Remember, ordos have less to lose, and therefore tend to post more freely.

I find Macalaure's words about "conventional" versus "weird" to be the sort of solid good sense I expect from him - although, of course, being too dogmatic about this or any other theory tends to backfire. I'd actually like to advocate using our gut feelings more, as any theory is easily turned by the wolves to their own advantage, but there is a certain evil "feel" one can detect on a wolf's posts, and I have found that to often be a reliable guide. (Case in point, Greenie in the trials in Volo's game...)

I'm not saying we should refrain from giving reasons for our suspicions, only that we might benefit from allowing our intuition to start the process, and then looking at the evidence to see if it backs up the hunch. I say this because if we simply look for conventional wolves now, everyone (wolf or no) will make themselves more unconventional - but if we're clever, we may catch the wolves doing so more self-consciously than the others (for example).

Now, one thing I would like to ask about - Greenie, do you actually see Sally's "suspicion" of Nogrod as serious? I'm quite sure it isn't, and the fact that you use it as a basis to suspect Sally doesn't look good.

[Meneltarmacil]

Quite a lot of strange joking-around here, which makes it easy for a wolf to hide behind the "I was just joking" excuse.

Frankly, I think that lynching anybody based on his or her playing style is unlikely to accomplish anything. People tend to use their own styles regardless of whather they be Wolf or Innocent, or at least I tend to. A loud person plays a loud wolf, while a quiet person plays a quiet wolf. Macalaure looks rather suspect to me due to his suggestion that we should start such a debate, but it's a shot in the dark.

Plus, I believe that lynching Nogrod is a very bad idea. True, he can make a dangerous wolf, but if he's innocent we'd be losing one of our best. And thus far, what he's said has made a lot of sense, unlike some around here.

Rikae would seem to be the one most guilty of this "nonsense posting". She makes a post full of jokes, then asks that others contribute to the discussion which she hasn't contributed much to herself.

EDIT: Cross-posted with Rikae.

[Macalaure]

"I can tell even now that I'm going to lynch the most suspicious-looking, and I don't care if that person is quiet, loud, substantial, conventional or whatever. There are usually better chances that the most suspicious-looking is a wolf than that the quietest is one."

Your fellow ill-bred kid Agan has a good point about simply lynching the most suspicious-looking of you naughty children.

And the shared First Prize for the most uncontroversial argument to my statement goes to Aganzir and Lily! I hoped to get some better responses to it, but you seem to be persistent not to discuss senseless things. At least now I can put your names on the top of my very premature list of suspects. :rolleyes:

Don't get me wrong: Your points are undeniably true, of course. However, as Rikae already said, "S/he simply looked most suspicious to me" is the most common (to both, innocent and wolf!) Day Two response to the lynching of yet another misguided innocent.

[Aganzir]

What do you mean by special roles speculation?
I think he's just sorry he can't speculate which weird roles there are as Farael said there are none. My great-great-grandmother has told me she has lived in villages with weird roles but you don't probably know anything about those since she died long long before you were even born. And if I want to speak about my ancestors I will! They are a much less futile thing than some quiet/loud debate.

And nay, I don't think I'm going to apologize. Shasta called it upon himself. It's his own problem if he has a habit to sleep too long.

I don't know about you, Agan, but from what I've seen, more often than not, the person who seems most blatently "suspicious" on day one turns out to be an ordo.
I think I should have said "the one who looks the most suspicious to me". Funny that you should advocate using gut feeling more in the next paragraph after saying that.

edit: xed with Menel & Mac

[Rikae]

I think I should have said "the one who looks the most suspicious to me". Funny that you should advocate using gut feeling more in the next paragraph after saying that.


Not at all, there is a world of difference between gut feeling and going along with some bandwagon for somebody who simply stands out from the crowd.

[Aganzir]

Rikae would seem to be the one most guilty of this "nonsense posting". She makes a post full of jokes, then asks that others contribute to the discussion which she hasn't contributed much to herself.
Which I find quite understandable. Contributing may be a little difficult at times, one occasion being when only one people has posted before you.

I hoped to get some better responses to it, but you seem to be persistent not to discuss senseless things.
And if we had started to discuss about it, you would have put our names on your suspect list, saying "they are discussing senseless things". Tsk tsk.

Not at all, there is a world of difference between gut feeling and going along with some bandwagon for somebody who simply stands out from the crowd.
Well, it's the former that I intended and still intend to do. Sorry if I was being unclear.

[satansaloser2005]

"Sally... I don't like your easy joining to the suspicion of Nogrod. Also, throwing pillows is a very bad thing to do. Apologise to Nogrod! In addition to this, you are very evil to think Agan's little trick on Shasta a good joke. She did a very naughty thing, and it's nothing to laugh at. You look like an evil child to me. I'll be having a tight eye on you." With that, she gave Sally a taste of her "tight eye".


"But dear 'stepmother,' it is Nogrod who committed the offense of waking me, and a child such as I can not be held responsible for her reflexes. Thus I refuse to apologize." Greenie started to reply, but Sally quickly raised a hand to silence her and continued. "As for your 'tight eye,' I think it loose, as you seem to have lost your ability to separate accuastion from good fun. I quite like Nogrod, and if my suspicions are correct and he IS indeed of the furry variety I shall be quite sad to see him go, but I must tease him nonetheless in case he has made such a clumsy error. And so I say to you, oh bossy one, be gone, and find yourself some nice prunes upon which to feast. Perhaps then you may be fully awake and able to join our discussion." Sally lowered her hand and waited for Greenie's response, but the stepmother simply stared at her, mouth agape, then collected herself, huffed angrily, and stormed off.

[Macalaure]

And if we had started to discuss about it, you would have put our names on your suspect list, saying "they are discussing senseless things". Tsk tsk.Nopes. Since I was the one who started it, I could hardly do it without looking seriously evil. In fact, I was looking for people who sneakily furthered the senseless discussion without giving their own opinion on it (to maintain a helpful image). But now nobody looks moderately suspicious to me, yet. Ah, well....

*makes himself a werewolf dowsing rod*

[Aganzir]

Nopes. Since I was the one who started it, I could hardly do it without looking seriously evil.
You could always have said you were just trying us.

Anyway, Mac's response is the most innocent-looking thing I have seen about him thus far.

[McCaber]

Richard the Unobscure strode in from the southern fields, imposing in his priestly robes and massive warhammer.

"Asleep for this whole time? Not I. While you were here jawing, I was out hunting ... wolf."

He threw down a large sack and five wolf heads spilled out onto the ground.

"Now, to business. Though the Day is not yet half gone, some have stood out as suspicious to me so far. I am not in favor of Menel simply agreeing with an earlier post and not bringing anything new to the table. I also did not like the sound of Macalaure's speech, up until this last post, which might do much towards changing my mind.

EDIT: crossed with Aganzir

[Meneltarmacil]

I wasn't just repeating others' arguments there, at least I don't think so. True, I agreed with Nogrod that Rikae was talking nonsense, but the part about people using their own playing styles regardless of their role hadn't been brought up here. I argued against Nogrod's lynching using my own arguments.

Now, I'm not sure what to make of Mac's declaration that he was only trying to get a wolf to slip up. It's most likely genuine, but it could be a trick by a wolf to avoid being caught. Rikae continues to worry me, though. She apparently thinks a "conventional vs. weird" debate has merit, and also advocates using gut feelings. Not that there's anything wrong with using instinct, but "I have a gut feeling about him" would be a good way for a wolf to sway the voting without having to make up a reason.

[A Little Green]

Now, one thing I would like to ask about - Greenie, do you actually see Sally's "suspicion" of Nogrod as serious? I'm quite sure it isn't, and the fact that you use it as a basis to suspect Sally doesn't look good. Well, this could be answered with another question: are any suspicions here (including mine, mind you) actually serious, or rather, well-based or truly substantial? I should guess they aren't, which of course makes suspecting people at this phase no less important. My point is: though our suspicions at this point (generally) cannot have a good basis, it doesn't mean that we shouldn't suspect people at all. On the contrary, we should suspect as much as we can, to gather some substance to plant better suspicions on.

I didn't answer Rikae's question straightly, though... Was that answer enough, or do you want me to explain some more? :)

Now, then, about the whole "let's lynch the one who looks most suspicious" -theory-thingy. While I understand the point that the one who is considered suspicious-looking is often an ordo, I could respond by asking what do people mean by the term suspicious-looking. I understand it simply as who do I suspect to be a wolf, and logically I vote for one I suspect. What is the other option? Vote for the one I find least suspicious? Or rather, choose randomly?

[Rikae]

She apparently thinks a "conventional vs. weird" debate has merit, and also advocates using gut feelings. Not that there's anything wrong with using instinct, but "I have a gut feeling about him" would be a good way for a wolf to sway the voting without having to make up a reason.

I'm surprised you, of all people, should think that a theory arguing against lynching the odd and conspicuous doesn't have merit, Menel! You are exactly the sort of player I was thinking of as being frequently, and wrongly, lynched on day one.

As for gut feelings, if you'll reread my post you'll see that I actually said I don't want people voting or suspecting without giving reasons. Still, gut feelings can help us decide whose posts to examine more closely, and exploring why the person in question "feels furry" can be useful. Are they cautious? Overly friendly? Forced?

Well, you can take or leave my advice as you will; this is what has worked best for my ancestors.

A few preliminary thoughts:

Aganzir - I'm a bit uneasy about her. She seemed to go from being eager to start arguments, to being eager to smooth them over. Then again, I don't want to be hasty - I've suspected her in every game we've played together, I think, so it may be that her style bothers me.
Legate - Is absent.
Nogrod - Shockingly quiet. I find nothing to suspect in his post, but he is, of course, a wolf. :p
Lommy - Where oh where is dear little Lommy? Way down yonder in the pawpaw patch... (note: this is just a song, so Nogrod need not get himself lynched over it.)
McCaber - Five wolves, eh? I guess we're all set, then, and then some... hmm. I'm not sure going after Menel right now is really justified - these accusations seem almost deliberately weak.
Sally - Sally is being silly - nothing wrong with that - but if she doesn't get down to the serious business at hand soon, I shall become concerned about her.
Gwathagor - Apparently lost in the mist.
A Little Green - As I said before, her failure (deliberate?) to see that Sally was joking is worrisome.
Macalaure - His talk about "senseless things" is odd. I don't know what he's trying to say, honestly... he seems to be determined to be one of those "weird" players he advocated not lynching. Mac, what do you mean by:
"In fact, I was looking for people who sneakily furthered the senseless discussion without giving their own opinion on it (to maintain a helpful image)."? It sounds like you're trying to back out of something, actually -you're going to have to clarify this.
Nerwen - Where oh where can she be?
Meneltarmacil - I don't find him suspicious... I find him confused (it wasn't Nogrod he was agreeing with, but Greenie, I think) - he seems uncautious and innocentish.
Shasta - Somewhere out there, beneath the pale moonlight... (sunlight?)

Well, conclusions: I'm uneasy about Agan, Greenie, and McCaber at the moment and would like some clarification from Macalaure, while Menel and Nogrod look relatively innocentish.

EDIT: X'd with Greenie's ... um... well. As far as I know, only wolves are interested in promoting baseless suspicions - if you didn't want to direct suspicion toward Sally, you certainly didn't indicate this. I suppose you can say it was an attempt at getting a wolf to follow, but then again, that's easy to say.
As for most suspicious - I think people have already discussed their definitions of that at enough length and there's no further point in it unless it is connected to someone's actual suspicions.

[Gwathagor]

I'm sorry I haven't been involved in the discussion yet; I'm still getting a feel for the game at this point. However, I have been reading through the thread and taking notes, and I'll try to make some educated suggestions after dinner. I'm bringing my Colt Python .357 magnum...loaded with silver bullets. Let's kill us a werewolf!

[A Little Green]

Just briefly: Where oh where is dear little Lommy? Lommy is having a party-party time.. :smokin:

A Little Green - As I said before, her failure (deliberate?) to see that Sally was joking is worrisome. Of course she was joking. But there can be evil intentions behind a joke... :rolleyes: Okay, let's be frank: I didn't read it as carefully as I could have. The first (but not last, mind you) impression I got from the post was that she was airing a slight, half(or should we say quarter)-serious suspicion in-character. Now that I read it again, I see it as a joke.

Bah. I'd better get some sleep, I fear I'm being both confused and confusing. :D

x-ed with Gwath(y)

[Macalaure]

And there's was me, thinking that my discussion hook went unnoticed. :)


Aganzir's backing off from me just after I backed off from her was unexpected. I'll have to make up my mind about her thoroughly tomorrow.

Menel is innocent.

A Little Green is extremely confusing in her response to Rikae. Surely you know there's a difference between a suspicion based on very little and a suspicion based on nothing - and Sally's joke was nothing. I first thought your suspicion was in fun as well, but now I'm wondering about you.
(I wrote this before I read Lily's last post. I'm not sure what to think of this now)

Mac, what do you mean by:
"In fact, I was looking for people who sneakily furthered the senseless discussion without giving their own opinion on it (to maintain a helpful image)."? It sounds like you're trying to back out of something, actually -you're going to have to clarify this.My lorebooks tell me that early-Day-One-senseless-discussion is usually a good start of a game and the way people argue is often a good indicator of guilt. In this village there was nothing of the kind, so I felt like initiating it. Wolves obviously like senseless discussion, so they like to encourage it. On the other hand, they dislike being caught in it themselves - it makes them look unhelpful. That was the stereotype I was looking for.

he seems to be determined to be one of those "weird" players he advocated not lynching.That, too. :p

I'm tending towards innocence with Rikae.

[Aganzir]

Aganzir's backing off from me just after I backed off from her was unexpected. I'll have to make up my mind about her thoroughly tomorrow.
What? Were you backing off? Where? Had you even been really suspecting me?
I don't think I was backing off either (and backing off what? Throwing suspicions around at the beginning of day 1 seldom means that I am all for lynching that person) - I just have the habit to speak what occurs to me, and if your post looked more innocentish than your earlier posts I do tend to mention it. Unexpected, yeah. I have a feeling werewolf is nowadays played with some certain formula and everything that doesn't happen as it's supposed is weird.

Rikae looks rather innocent, but then again that's what I always think.

McCaber - Five wolves, eh? I guess we're all set, then, and then some... hmm. I'm not sure going after Menel right now is really justified - these accusations seem almost deliberately weak.
I agree with you about him, but on the other hand, it's easy to find Menel suspicious, especially if one hasn't played with him that much. I would rather have liked to hear what he thought was wrong with Mac's posts (and it doesn't matter if someone has already said it- better to repeat than say nothing at all).

Greenie looks innocentish also, though I am aware of her ability to fool me.

Of the others I don't know yet.

Anyway, I shall go and have some sleep now.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta, having freed himself from the prison of bedclothes, blinked at Aganzir. "Let us hope you enjoy being wet," he promised, a glint of righteous retribution in his eye, before stalking off.

"Such a mean woman, where I'm concerned," he muttered to himself. "Always doing things to me, threatening me... Remember, the last time she threatened me, she'd been infected by that horrible Lycanthropy... I wonder if the same thing has happened here?"

Tripping over one of the wolf heads laying about the floor, Shasta glared at McCaber. "My good huntsman, these are clearly the heads of Lowland Timberwolves. Any huntsman with a grain of sense would know that this particular type of wolf has its habitat nowhere near our location.... which begs the question, how did you manage to find five where none should be? It makes me think that you're sending off a bit of a Hunter's Hint... but given that poor Farael gave no indication to the presence of a Hunter..."

Shasta trailed off, a wary look on his face.

[Nogrod]

I have promised not to flood-post and o'boy this is hard... :eek:

But then again I can make a few longer ones then... So here are some thoughts before I go to bed.

Even though I think the most Mac says is reasonable I find this one quite eyebrow-raising:I'm tending towards innocence with Rikae.Not because I'd suspect Rikae any more than I do others but because this followed Rikae's post where she made a few questions about Mac's standing and it was left alone as the ending comment on it's own.

What bothers me is the question: why say it after defending oneself from the points Rikae had made? Mac is skilfull enough to post as a believable sense-making ordo if a wolf so at this point his sensibility can't be taken as a proof of his innocence but this kind of "being extra-careful" not to make enemies or to appease others when there is no need for it kind of stand out.

Mac is a questionmark to me right now.

I'm also a bit puzzled of all this discussion on LG's suspicion of Sally. If I just read what she said early toDay I see no problem there: saying that jumping on / chorusing an early suspicion looks wolvish indeed is just plain making sense. Let's go back to it for a moment: "Sally... I don't like your easy joining to the suspicion of Nogrod. Also, throwing pillows is a very bad thing to do. Apologise to Nogrod! In addition to this, you are very evil to think Agan's little trick on Shasta a good joke. She did a very naughty thing, and it's nothing to laugh at. You look like an evil child to me. I'll be having a tight eye on you." With that, she gave Sally a taste of her "tight eye".Rikae's reaction to this was (the very next post in the thread):Now, one thing I would like to ask about - Greenie, do you actually see Sally's "suspicion" of Nogrod as serious? I'm quite sure it isn't, and the fact that you use it as a basis to suspect Sally doesn't look good.
Re-reading Greenie's points about Sally above kind of make this comment of Rikae to appear in a new light. Now who was jumping on jokes and taking them seriously? :rolleyes:

But there's worse to come. Mac followed Rikae's course this way:Surely you know there's a difference between a suspicion based on very little and a suspicion based on nothing - and Sally's joke was nothing. I first thought your suspicion was in fun as well, but now I'm wondering about you.Still carrying this initial - and wrong - suspicion that Greenie had kind of seriously accused Sally of werewolvery which she hadn't as you all can see from above quotation.

So why were Rikae and later Mac so ready to go after Greenie who had just posted sense and a few jokes?

But then again - and this is even more disturbing - why did Greenie back off from what she had said after being pressured by Rikae and Mac?

She says: Of course she was joking. But there can be evil intentions behind a joke... Okay, let's be frank: I didn't read it as carefully as I could have. The first (but not last, mind you) impression I got from the post was that she was airing a slight, half(or should we say quarter)-serious suspicion in-character. Now that I read it again, I see it as a joke.This I find the most wolvish this far toDay (it's not much but something). She first made sense - like any decent wolf would - but after questioned she was a bit too happy to change position to talk herself out from suspicion and thence her preliminary sense get's viewed from a different angle... an ordo - if she had spoken honestly in the first post - would have defended her sensible position but a wolf needs to talk herself out from situations she feels are dangerous and can contradict her own earlier positions "admitting" things she has not said.

*Gah, I hope at least someone was able to follow that reasoning...*

Third thing. It's interesting how some people seem to speak against the better knowledge about things toDay.

Shasta said I had left my towel in the bathroom (a bathroom in the Barrow Downs?) after I had myself written that I had it with me. Now why on earth? It's mostly jokes and banter that early in the game but still that kind of made me wonder as he had to have read the few posts there were at that moment to be able to refer to it in the first place. So why on earth? I'm looking forwards to an explanation Shasta.

I was a bit worried about Menel after he said that: I believe that lynching Nogrod is a very bad idea. True, he can make a dangerous wolf, but if he's innocent we'd be losing one of our best. And thus far, what he's said has made a lot of sense, unlike some around here.It felt just like feel-good -factor stuff. Yes it's nice to hear things like that but just because that it raises eyebrows... But the problem I have with Menel is his next one: True, I agreed with Nogrod that Rikae was talking nonsense , which I did never say. I did answer Rikae's banter with banter but there was not a single line there suggesting that I was saying Rikae was someone specially talking nonsense...

So I'm quite worried with Menel as well. But with him I'm somewhat hesitating knowing the history of his family. He just ends up being suspected everytime and with my latest experiences (lynched on Day1 three times in a row) I can relate to that. ;)

EDIT: X'd with Shasta...

[Gwathagor]

When do we have to decide who to lynch?

I feel as though Aganzir and A Little Green are quite eager to NOT be associated with one another, while, at the same time, each one protests the other's innocence. Examples: (from Aganzir) "Greenie looks innocentish to me." and (from A Little Green) "I don't think you are dangerous, though, only another ill-bred child."

Their plan would seem to be to defend each other without appearing co-conspirators; the worst thing that could happen to a band of werewolves would be for them to be clearly in cahoots with each other. Am I right?

A case of "the lady doth protest too much, methinks"? I'm sure that line is never quoted in here...

I also think Nogrod and Macalaure have been talking a lot of good sense.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta said I had left my towel in the bathroom (a bathroom in the Barrow Downs?) after I had myself written that I had it with me. Now why on earth? It's mostly jokes and banter that early in the game but still that kind of made me wonder as he had to have read the few posts there were at that moment to be able to refer to it in the first place. So why on earth? I'm looking forwards to an explanation Shasta.

Shasta laughed. "Simple, my dear Nogrod!" he chuckled. "There were two towels!"

[Meneltarmacil]

Shasta, I'm kind of worried about you here. As far as I can tell, all your posts lately have been in-character banter, with little, if any, substance.

[Thinlómien]

A broadly smiling young Dúnadan lady entered the scene. "Water buffalos? Smelly? My apologies, Stepmother, I guess you just have to stay away from me." Her grin was even broader when she finished her sentence and sat next to Aganzir. "I'm not yours, though", she added in a self-important tone.

She cast another look at the dwarf-like being next to herself. "You are... odd. You are suspicious. I have a vaguely bad feeling about you." She stood up and wiped dust off her skirts. "I don't think I'd like to sit by you... wolf." Then she laughed. "Though I always think you're innocent, and you're always a wolf. So now that you seem suspicious, should I consider you innocentish?" She produced a flask from her pocket and took a long sip of blackcurrant juice. "Yes, you're a wolf and your fellows are Legate and Shasta. I've seen it in a dream (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=546415&postcount=1112)."

Then the Dúnadan's expression grew a bit more serious. "I don't trust this Macalaure guy. While I agree that he talks, in a way, sense here
Shall we lynch a weird-looking member of our group, or a conventional-looking? I say we go for the latter. My lorebook tells me that in dire situations like ours, the strange have been lynched early on more often than they deserve, and with very poor results usually. Let us go for one who flies under the radar, one who doesn't say anything controversial, one who seems eager to not rub people the wrong way. Sure, those people are difficult to catch since it requires a sharp eye to discern them from someone who says nothing because s/he just has nothing to say. But come on! Let us give effort and lynch one who is most eager not to be pinned down!I still don't like it. Why? Something in the way that this comes so suddenly yet carefully formed just doesn't sit right with me. Besides, it urges people to act oddly and cause confusion. And most importantly, like Rikae here said, he takes care of acting somewhat weirdly himself - a great way of avoiding getting lynched, isn't it?"

She looked at the two she had just talked about. "Mac and Rikae... I'm afraid I don't like the way you court and trial each other. Careful agreements, defenses and accusations to balance it out. It looks quite fishy. But I think the most probable scenario is that one of you is a wolf and he or she is trying to get the another one to his or her side or win his or her trust. I don't like it..."

"Stepmother Green then... She doesn't alarm me in general, but her post #85 was just horrible. I didn't answer Rikae's question straightly, though... Was that answer enough, or do you want me to explain some more? :)That kind of friendliness (note the smiley) just seems all too wrong to me, it actually reminds me of my wolf attitude - I've made a post just like that as a wolf. There's something quite feigned in the tone and that "did I explain understandably?"+smilie combination."

Thinlómien sat down on the floor and after a little while, settled down to lay on the ground. She looked at the roof above and smiled. "I'd love to see the sky..." she mumbled, "But anyway, what did I want to say? Oh, probably that this Day has been weird - but I like it - and Gwathagor and Nogrod seem innocentish for now and I just really never can understand Menel."

edit: xed with Menel

[Nerwen]

Nerwen yawned and stretched herself. "Dear me, I have slept in!" She stood up and knocked her head on the ceiling. "Was this barrow designed for short people or something?"

Rubbing her head, she continued, "Now, it seems to me that whilst I slumbered I was dimly aware of a lot of arguing going on... some of which confused me.

Macalaure, you early on said:

Let us go for one who flies under the radar, one who doesn't say anything controversial, one who seems eager to not rub people the wrong way.

But now it seems you didn't mean any of your earlier statements– in fact, you were just trying to see if any of the wolves took the bait:


My lorebooks tell me that early-Day-One-senseless-discussion is usually a good start of a game and the way people argue is often a good indicator of guilt. In this village there was nothing of the kind, so I felt like initiating it. Wolves obviously like senseless discussion, so they like to encourage it. On the other hand, they dislike being caught in it themselves - it makes them look unhelpful. That was the stereotype I was looking for..

Okay, that's not a bad plan for getting the wolves to reveal themselves... but what I'm curious about is what you would have done had it worked?

Edit: X'd with Menel and Lommy.

[Gwathagor]

I've seen it in a dream (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=546415&postcount=1112)."

Do you dream frequently?

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta, I'm kind of worried about you here. As far as I can tell, all your posts lately have been in-character banter, with little, if any, substance.


I rarely like to read too much into Day 1, as there isn't much concrete evidence to go on, and there's a far more likely chance to be wrong than there is to be right.

[Meneltarmacil]

And, if I may ask, Lommy, since I was apparently there, what was my role in this dream of yours?

Oh, and so as to not wander too far from today's business, if Mac was trying to catch a wolf in his net, Rikae appears to have taken the bait.

*sigh* I really don't want to be in the position of concentrating on a single suspect all Day. My ancestors have made that mistake before, and when their suspect died, their elaborate thory collapsed and they were left with nothing.

Shasta is still a bit of a concern, due to the reasons I mentioned earlier, plus his suspicions of people because of their in-character actions don't strike me well either.

And yes, Rikae, that was Greenie's post I was agreeing with and not Nogrod's. Sometimes I need to pay more attention.

EDIT: Cross-posted with Shasta.

[Nerwen]

Nerwen lounged against the icy stone wall of the barrow. "Well, now the conversation's getting a bit more interesting. But why is everyone so nervous?" She glanced around the dank, dripping chamber, with its ancient treasures gleaming eerily in the chill green light. "Sorry. Dumb question."

I feel as though Aganzir and A Little Green are quite eager to NOT be associated with one another, while, at the same time, each one protests the other's innocence. Examples: (from Aganzir) "Greenie looks innocentish to me." and (from A Little Green) "I don't think you are dangerous, though, only another ill-bred child."

Their plan would seem to be to defend each other without appearing co-conspirators; the worst thing that could happen to a band of werewolves would be for them to be clearly in cahoots with each other. Am I right?

Yes... but actually, even casually stating your belief in a fellow-wolf's innocence can be rather risky. Once you're lynched and proven a wolf, anyone you said nice things about gets looked at very carefully.

On the other, A Little Green's last post does come across a bit... sugary. Hmmn.

Tip: you also want to watch out for people whose interactions seem "staged", if you know what I mean. Wolves quite often claim to suspect one another.

Oh, and so as to not wander too far from today's business, if Mac was trying to catch a wolf in his net, Rikae appears to have taken the bait.

I don't have time now to re-read the early posts, but I thought Rikae was already lauding the virtues of gut-feelings before Mac started on his "let's suspect anyone who sounds sensible" thing.

I'm still not sure what to make of Mac. Was he trying to set a wolf-trap, as he claims? Or is he furry himself, and backed away from his scheme when he saw ii wasn't working? Either way, it was a rather dangerous ploy. If he's a wolf, he risked drawing suspicion on himself– if not, he risked giving the wolves the go-ahead to lynch helpful innocents.

Shasta is still a bit of a concern, due to the reasons I mentioned earlier, plus his suspicions of people because of their in-character actions don't strike me well either.

I'd put a question mark over him– but he might have simply been carrying on the role-play a bit longer than everyone else. His "suspicions" sounded pretty jokey to me.

Well, now I'm going to take a walk in the fog. Perhaps it will clear my head.

[Gwathagor]

Yes... but actually, even casually stating your belief in a fellow-wolf's innocence can be rather risky. Once you're lynched and proven a wolf, anyone you said nice things about gets looked at very carefully.

On the other, A Little Green's last post does come across a bit... sugary. Hmmn.

Tip: you also want to watch out for people whose interactions seem "staged", if you know what I mean. Wolves quite often claim to suspect one another.

I agree whole-heartedly with you here.

EDIT: How many werewolves are there?

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta is still a bit of a concern, due to the reasons I mentioned earlier, plus his suspicions of people because of their in-character actions don't strike me well either.

Pfft. This is how I start off every game. You may not have noticed, since I die at the beginning every game. :p

[satansaloser2005]

Sally stumbled into the room with a look of utter exhaustion on her face. "How much I have done today, and yet nothing accomplished, especially in the way of finding werewolves! For this I do apologize, but my logic is not up to its usual standard Perhaps if you gave me a minute I could....What was I talking about again?"
She stood in the middle of the group, raking through her hair with her fingers and staring at her fellow players' faces, then to the surprise of everyone slumped down on the floor and fell unconcious.
The others, though concerned, had bigger fish to fry and continued their discussions, frivolous though they may prove to be, and set Sally carefully aside so that she could rest for a while. Once, she sat up suddenly and shouted "KEEL! Keel won vif neem oof soooodaaaa...." then flopped back down again.
"What was that she said?" asked Nerwen.
"Haven't the slightest," admitted Shasta. "Something about a keel and a soda....maybe she went out for a boat ride and had something bad to drink?"
"Hush, you two," remarked Greenie the Stepmother. "We must get back to business. We have a wolf to catch yet before the sunset. Concentrate, you slackers, and leave that silly one to her sleep, or I'll-"
Her scolding was interrupted when Sally leaped up from her resting place, eyes wild and clearly not awake, and screamed....

++Shasta

....then ran toward the object of her rant and looked him square in the eye, opened her mouth to speak to him privately, and....passed out, not to be awakened again until the dawn of the next day.


Note: Hopefully I won't start a bandwagon on this poor guy but I feel useless if I don't vote and I've been completely out of whack the last couple days so I haven't been able to sort out a lot of today's posts. Besides, I know that if I don't vote before I go to bed (for I really am sick and therefore need to get some sleep) I won't vote at all because I won't want to get up in the morning. Here's hoping that the rest of you all enjoy the rest of your Day though, Shasta included (and for the record, I felt the urge to random since I couldn't come up with anything at the moment, so I figured I may as well give someone a good giggle with the pop/soda joke. I promise a substantial vote the next Day.)

EDIT: Oh, by the way, I don't know if it was mentioned, but are there retractable votes? Just for future reference

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta laughed. "Oh dear, it seems to be happening yet again... Something tells me maybe I shouldn't have caved in and joined this ragtag band."

He stood up on a rock and surveyed everyone.

"Given what I've heard from everyone today, and that I seem to be catching a bit of a cold, and that it's gone two in the morning, I'm going to have to vote now. The lucky recipient of my vote is -

++Menel

simply because I think he should know by now, given the number of games we've both participated in, that this is how I begin every game, and his reason for suspecting me has been echoed by at least one person Day 1 in every other game."

Shasta then jumped down off the rock and headed for his bed.

[Macalaure]

I read over Aganzir's posts again and decided that whatever I saw yesterday isn't there anymore.

Of McCaber I'm really not sure.

Shasta is a question mark, but he deserves to be left alive for a second Day once in a while.

Menel, Rikae, and Sally are innocent. Reason: feeling.

Gwatha hasn't said much and what he said wouldn't be overly alarming if only he hadn't played the "I'm confused about the rules"-card a little too often.

I just tried to paraphrase Nogrod's position on Lily, but it was not as easy as I thought it would be, so I'll just say I agree with him. Nogrod is making a lot of sense (although I disagree with many of his conclusions). Being "concise" suits him. :)


Something in the way that this comes so suddenly yet carefully formed just doesn't sit right with me. Besides, it urges people to act oddly and cause confusion. And most importantly, like Rikae here said, he takes care of acting somewhat weirdly himself - a great way of avoiding getting lynched, isn't it?"Eh? What do you mean by "suddenly yet carefully formed"? And "Making people act oddly" is exactly what I had in mind. I never claimed it was otherwise.
Anyway, what's more suspicious is that this was preceded by

While I agree that he talks, in a way, sense

, which is a relativization of the suspicion that followed. Relativated suspicion manages to make me feel quite uneasy about people.


I'm still not sure what to make of Mac. Was he trying to set a wolf-trap, as he claims? Or is he furry himself, and backed away from his scheme when he saw ii wasn't working? Either way, it was a rather dangerous ploy. If he's a wolf, he risked drawing suspicion on himself– if not, he risked giving the wolves the go-ahead to lynch helpful innocents.Of course, this is exactly what I did not have in mind. I was looking for those who were most eager to keep themselves out of trouble while adding tinder to the flames. For example, persons who ask questions without giving their own opinion hoping that other make up their minds to answer them in order to lynch an innocent without making ones hands bloody. Wait....

what I'm curious about is what you would have done had it worked?ummm, lynched the wolf? :confused:
...and what do you mean, had it worked. ;)


Right now, I'm suspicious of A Wolfy Green, Thinwólfien, and Nerwolf, in a slight Day-One-ish way. In the same manner, I think Rikae, Nogrod, Menel, and Sally are innocent. Of the rest I'm unsure.

[Nerwen]

Like Sally before her, Nerwen staggered into the chamber, bruised and bleeding. "Curse this mist!" she muttered. "I must have walked into dozens of standing stones, not to mention rolling down a hill at one point.

But I thought I heard a voice– or voices– asking about the rules?

Delving in the depths of my Elvish memory, I seem to recall that there are three werewolves, no retractable votes (or if there are, the mods forgot to tell us), and that if there's a tie, the result will be decided by coin-toss. Everyone happy now?"

Note: Hopefully I won't start a bandwagon on this poor guy but I feel useless if I don't vote and I've been completely out of whack the last couple days so I haven't been able to sort out a lot of today's posts. Besides, I know that if I don't vote before I go to bed (for I really am sick and therefore need to get some sleep) I won't vote at all because I won't want to get up in the morning. Here's hoping that the rest of you all enjoy the rest of your Day though, Shasta included (and for the record, I felt the urge to random since I couldn't come up with anything at the moment, so I figured I may as well give someone a good giggle with the pop/soda joke. I promise a substantial vote the next Day.)


Anyone else not like that last post of Sally's? She seems very eager to cover herself, doesn't she? (On the other hand, if she's indeed sick she may not be thinking clearly.)

Edit: X'd with Macalaure.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

A group of people was walking down a half-empty street in the low light.
"It was a good game," one of them said.
"Anyway, the Elves part was the best," said the once-again DM, "or at least I liked it the most."
"Yea, definitely. Well, I was almost dead all the time."
"How comes you picked the worst spots in the battle?"
"No idea. We crossed the river and I run just into the swordsman who hit me for 30 damage in one round. Then I chose to search just under the tree on which that sniper was sitting. Then..."
"Hey, it's my bus. All right, see you later."
The party disbanded. Everyone went to their homes, by bus, by tram, by walk... only the DM did not do so. He knew, when this was over, that he has to go back.
He turned his back on the city and walked away, and soon, the chill and the fog appeared and the DM was no more.
***
"They are waiting for you, Grimburgoth," the voice from above spoke. The Chieftain of the Dark Rangers nodded, took on his black hood and using a 5th level spell he should not have in his list, he transported into the enclosed barrow.


All right, friends. I just read what happened around here, and I am not going to be around for long, as I am here just to come and go. But as it has been said elsewhere, that's only today. I haven't read all as deeply as I would like, but I hope to be able now to voice the things that made impact on me when reading now in a short (edit: *ahem* looks at the post below: well...) and comprehensible way.

I am a little concerned by the way the things went toDay this far. I mean, from what I read, I got the impression that lot of the talk on the first page went only around half-joking suspicions, which in some mysterious way turned into serious ones. Or maybe not, that's the worst thing about it, I can't tell: maybe they were supposed to be (or to look) serious from the start, which would be indeed critical. It started with Nogrod having something red in his towel, to which - a normal in-character thing - a load of responses mainly from sally, a little also Shasta and consequently more from LG followed. Let me see - there are two options. A) Either they are jokes, then I say there is too many of them and no real substance in almost all posts of the named people. Not necessary to say that such a way of playing is absolutely unproductive. One or two joking or in-character things are no problem, but when there is a fifty-post dialogue made from them, you know. B) They are serious, then obviously it's silly as well - basing suspicions on Nogrod on the fact that he carried a red towel doesn't need any comment, I believe.

Otherwise, there was this thing about Mac saying we lynch a conventional type person. I believe Aganzir responded to it quite right and I can't see how it could have been misinterpretated: focusing on certain "ideology" is not a way to really look for wolves. It is an individual focus on each person, and everyone choosing to lynch the one who, to him, seems suspicious. That does not mean "odd-behaving", that means, well, suspicious. Even behaving "conventionally" may be considered suspicious, sometimes, and sometimes "odd-behaving" beople are suspicious.

Concerning people, just what I got from what I read: I mentioned already above the strange joke-or-not-joke talkers, i.e. Sally, LG and to lesser extent, Shasta. About Mac I don't know. Rikae's posts look more like in her normal unpleasant style, so nothing particularly suspicious on her this far. Likewise, Aganzir this far looks quite fine, and I daresay not in her typical innocent-looking way, but she's kinda bit, how to say it, aggressive, so I would like to hope at last once I could think her innocent and be right about it. Lommy posted just once, but her one post looks also quite like a normal innocent Lommy. I must say also that this far, Gwathagor makes the impression of an innocent newbie rather than a wolf-newbie, although of course not knowing him, I am not setting it as standard. About Menel, McCaber and Nerwen I can't say anything, and strangely, also about Nogrod who made a lot less input that I would expect from him. What's going on, Noggins? (Not that I don't like having less and shorter things to read, but... ;) Or is there anything more sinister in the background, Nog?)

One more serious matter to solve. Although I'd like to hear about all of this, I am most worried about Sally, because of what I said above and because of the last post:
Hopefully I won't start a bandwagon on this poor guy
Here's hoping that the rest of you all enjoy the rest of your Day though, Shasta included (and for the record, I felt the urge to random since I couldn't come up with anything at the moment, so I figured I may as well give someone a good giggle with the pop/soda joke. I promise a substantial vote the next Day.)

So, wait- do I understand correctly, you say that your vote is merely a random one? I can understand that you have to vote now, for I have as well, as I won't be around till DL, but surely there can be something more than just voting randomly? I don't like also the "hopefully I won't start a bandwagon" thing. A person who wants to get someone lynched in fact wants to start a bandwagon - well, not a bandwagon, but in the meaning that she wants to find support if she thinks she has found a wolf. And of course, mainly, for a wolf it's an alibism: the more if you say you vote randomly! Therefore, my vote today is

++Sally

Anyway, I will be leaving now, so that's about it. As I said, nothing much from me toDay, but I hope it will be better in the future and hope to see you toMorrow. I will have a lot more time to participate and with more time to make my mind on things. Good luck.

EDIT: x-ed since shasta

[Nerwen]

ummm, lynched the wolf? :confused:
...and what do you mean, had it worked. ;)

I mean, if your idea was to encourage the wolves to act silly, and to go after anyone who was being helpful (thus revealing themselves), how did you plan to accuse them– when you'd previously said what they were doing was the hallmark of innocence?

Edit: X'd with Legate.

[Aganzir]

Of those who have spoken this far, Mac looks the most suspicious. The way he seems to have decided to play is beyond my comprehension, and, well, he seems to be giving an over-honest impression. I said that his response (#81) to me was the most innocentish thing he had said during this day, but it really isn't, at least it's not somehow more innocent than his other posts. It's... when a wolf is trying people, it's more important than it is for an innocent to let everybody know that he wasn't being serious. I think Mac's eagerness to explain what he was doing looks like that.
He is saying things like "a wolf would have a reason to do what I did". When he's saying that while doing those things, it's easy to get the first impression that he can't be a wolf because if he was he wouldn't have said that. And that's the thing that worries me most about him.

On the other hand, I'm afraid that if Mac isn't a wolf he would be an easy day 1 lynch for the wolves.

When do we have to decide who to lynch?
All votes should be cast before the deadline (which is 3 pm gmt / 9 am ct).

"Though I always think you're innocent, and you're always a wolf. So now that you seem suspicious, should I consider you innocentish?"
Quite right. I am deeply amused if you've got so used to my playing as a wolf that the first time I'm innocent since Rikae's game I look suspicious.

I don't know about Lommy... She looks mostly innocent but on the other hand she doesn't.

Do you dream frequently?
Tsk tsk, that's something you should never ask a lady.

I don't like Shasta posting just in character, but that's not a reason to suspect him. At least he's posted more than usually on day 1s.

Sally is being quite much her normal self, which doesn't mean anything.

EDIT: How many werewolves are there?
With how many persons were you plotting last night?
There are three. It's stated in the post that started night 1. Asking that isn't going to make me think you must be innocent because you don't know that.

I have to vote, well, soon, and at the moment my vote is likely to go to Mac.

edit: xed since Mac

[Aganzir]

++ Macalaure

Have to go now.

[Thinlómien]

Thinlómien's player yawned and then she tried to cast a critical look at herself. "When I went to sleep and set the alarm clock, I did not of course realise that the deadline is so early that I have to play werewolf and vote before I leave to my little art thing..." she mumbled, looking at the computer screen. "Let's go then, and no novels this time."

Yes... but actually, even casually stating your belief in a fellow-wolf's innocence can be rather risky. Once you're lynched and proven a wolf, anyone you said nice things about gets looked at very carefully.Yes, but often they're just disregarded as possible double bluff.

Eh? What do you mean by "suddenly yet carefully formed"?I really can't explain it better than that.

And "Making people act oddly" is exactly what I had in mind. I never claimed it was otherwise.Does the fact that you admit you try to put this village into a state of confusion make the act less suspicious? :p I don't think so.

which is a relativization of the suspicion that followed. Relativated suspicion manages to make me feel quite uneasy about people. That is jolly true, but you ought to know by now that I do it always. ;)

I still think there's a wolf hiding among Mac and Rikae and therefore I'm going to vote

++Macalaure

because he seems more suspicious of the two.

And don't worry, if I'm still alive, I will be able to contribute more on the Days to come.

EDIT: xed with Agan x2

[Macalaure]

I mean, if your idea was to encourage the wolves to act silly, and to go after anyone who was being helpful (thus revealing themselves), how did you plan to accuse them– when you'd previously said what they were doing was the hallmark of innocence?

You misunderstood me. The weird/conventional-thing was indeed only a bait. Once more, I was looking for people trying to encourage others to discuss that thing without getting involved and giving an opinion themselves. I was not looking for the helpful ones, I was looking for the uncontroversial (just to put a label on it) ones. I planned to accuse them exactly because of their behavior, and I don't think this would have been contradicting at all.
Legate is right: This stereotype isn't failsafe - of course not - but it's good enough until something really suspicious comes up from somebody.

Of those who have spoken this far, Mac looks the most suspicious. The way he seems to have decided to play is beyond my comprehension, and, well, he seems to be giving an over-honest impression. I said that his response (#81) to me was the most innocentish thing he had said during this day, but it really isn't, at least it's not somehow more innocent than his other posts. It's... when a wolf is trying people, it's more important than it is for an innocent to let everybody know that he wasn't being serious. I think Mac's eagerness to explain what he was doing looks like that.
He is saying things like "a wolf would have a reason to do what I did". When he's saying that while doing those things, it's easy to get the first impression that he can't be a wolf because if he was he wouldn't have said that. And that's the thing that worries me most about him.

Aganzir, I don't understand what you're trying to say. I never said anything like "a wolf would have a reason to do what I did". That's how some have interpreted me, and I jokingly agreed to it once. I'm eager to explain myself? Well, people have been eager to ask me to. And why do you say I was not serious just because I admitted I was laying out a bait for the wolves on a slow-going Day One? That doesn't make sense.

I re-revise my opinion of Aganzir: Possible wolf.

I also revise my opinion of Lommy: Misled innocent.

[Macalaure]

A minor, but interesting thing:

I said before I've been wondering about the rules-questions of Gwathagor. I think Gwath's questions (deadline, number of wolves) are strange because the answers can easily be taken from Farael's rules-post just before the game starts. If he listened to what has been spoken so far as attentively as he claims, how could he have overlooked it?

I think it's interesting to see that the only ones answering him are Nerwen and Aganzir (cross-posting their replies!), who happen to be my top suspects. Oh surprise. :D

It's probably pre-mature to construct such a thing, but I think it's possible that Nerwen and Aganzir told Gwath to act newbie-ish and ask questions. But when they realized that nobody is answering him, they took the duty onto themselves. Of course, it would have been silly for both of them to do it: that's where the cross-post comes into play. Evil minds think alike.

[Nogrod]

This is a weird Day indeed. Or then I just manage to read things in totally different way... :rolleyes:

Firstly all those counterfactual oddities in which I see no sense for either an ordo or a wolf to say (Shasta and the towel, Menel referring to me saying Rikae talks nonsense, Gwatha not "knowing" how many wolves there are, what is the deadline...).

Secondly people backtracking or reinterpreting themselves in a hurry, like Greenie and Mac. Now what do I mean by that? I'll try to say it short and clear if I can.

Greenie made jokes to Sally and promised to "give a tight eye to her" but after being suspected on making serious suspicions on weak grounds she goes on to "admit" she had made them because she had read Sally carelessly. So why didn't she just say it was a joke as it clearly was one?

Mac's suggestion that we should look at those who try to avoid "rubbing people the wrong way" or those trying to be uncontroversial is all fine and dandy. It is a most reasonable stance indeed. But then suddenly everyone is talking about schemes to try and lure the wolves into being controversial and Mac behaving oddly - even Mac himself does it. Now am I the only only one who thinks this is fishy indeed? Why did Mac back away from a most reasonable position into this scheming-thingy after being suspected?

Maybe I'm just reading things in some warped way...

There are many whom I should take a closer look as they clearly have flown under my radar but I need to go shopping. I wil be back before deadline though.

And just to add... taking the feelings / intuition stuff in as well I do share Mac's bad feeling about Aganzir. I hope I can elaborate that when I come back.

EDIT: x'd with Mac

[Nerwen]

It's probably pre-mature to construct such a thing, but I think it's possible that Nerwen and Aganzir told Gwath to act newbie-ish and ask questions. But when they realized that nobody is answering him, they took the duty onto themselves. Of course, it would have been silly for both of them to do it: that's where the cross-post comes into play. Evil minds think alike.

Well, you ought to know. :D But why– in your scenario– would we need to answer him?

This does strike me as a little odd, though:

With how many persons were you plotting last night?
There are three. It's stated in the post that started night 1. Asking that isn't going to make me think you must be innocent because you don't know that.

Could that be a wolf trying to cast suspicion an an ordo? Or a wolf warning her fellow that he's over-doing it? What do other people think?

Mac will probably jump on me now, and announce that I'm obviously trying to distance myself from my wolf-colleagues. :rolleyes:

Edit: X'd with Nogrod.

[Rikae]

I had to get up early on a weekend... *grumbles*

I'm not sure why Legate finds me so unpleasant, but I'm getting a little tired of comments of this sort in every game, I must say. Oh well...

It seems to me that people are misinterpreting Macalaure's behavior - if I understand it correctly (as I think I now do), he was basically trying to stir the proverbial pot. Am I correct in thinking, Mac, that you didn't intend the content of your conversation-starter to be misleading, but rather were looking for wolvish behavior of hovering around the edges of a debate?
That's a noble endeavor, and one that does run the risk of attracting dangerous attention to oneself - my opinion at this point is that Macalaure is innocent as a little lamb.
As I'm confident in my assessment of Macalaure, the misrepresentation of his stance I see from Nerwen is alarming. For example:
his "let's suspect anyone who sounds sensible" thing.
and
if your idea was to encourage the wolves to act silly, and to go after anyone who was being helpful (thus revealing themselves),
I also don't feel too comfortable with this:
Mac will probably jump on me now, and announce that I'm obviously trying to distance myself from my wolf-colleagues. :rolleyes:

This is just too defensive and self-conscious. I daresay it's not the sort of thing that innocents usually come up with.
Aganzir is troubling as well, as she seems to be putting words in Mac's mouth.

What else? I don't find Menel suspicious, though he certainly makes it difficult with his single-minded and poorly-supported attacks on me. Still, that's like him, which, I fear, is why he tends to be lynched early on so often - giving flimsy reasons for his suspicions. From someone else it would be worrisome, but not from Menel.

Shasta - well, I'm tempted to vote for him simply because "I'm not going to be helpful and you can't make me... lalala" attitude (my interpretation) is downright annoying. No one likes day ones, but making an effort is, to my mind anyway, a responsibility to one's fellow players (even if they call you unpleasant... :(.) Still, I don't think it's necessarily wolfish behavior (and if he is a wolf, he can hardly use the same excuse toMorrow), and I wouldn't like to waste my vote.

Nogrod, I have to disagree that Greenie's comment about Sally was clearly a joke. The line in which she says it seems perfectly serious - I'm perfectly capable of following a serious suspicion with a joke, so I assumed Greenie was as well. After all, if there was nothing serious in her post, it would be decidedly unhelpful, so I assumed she was using the in-character stuff as a vehicle to voice a few suspicions.

Well, that's all for now, I guess... I'm leaning toward casting my vote for Nerwen at the moment, or possibly Aganzir.

[A Little Green]

Greenie made jokes to Sally and promised to "give a tight eye to her" but after being suspected on making serious suspicions on weak grounds she goes on to "admit" she had made them because she had read Sally carelessly. So why didn't she just say it was a joke as it clearly was one? You got me wrong, I'm afraid. I didn't say it was a joke because it wasn't just a joke. Of course I wasn't being entirely serious, and was posting in-character (and having a character which might seem, well, joke-ish). Bah. I might as well explain it thoroughly, since you guys don't seem to understand just how trivial this matter is.

I read Sally's post (not quite as carefully as I maybe should have) and interpreted it as a semi-serious suspicion behind a joke-ish in-character post. I wasn't sure at all, that early in the game, and her "suspicion" of Nogrod seemed fishy to me. Therefore I mentioned it in my post. However, my in-character role and the insignificant details of the post (like the "throwing pillows is evil behaviour" -thing and all that stuff) might have made it look like a joke among jokes. I keep wondering how certain people could interpret it as a serious suspicion on Sally. Though I found her statement about Noggins slightly fishy, it doesn't mean I think she is a wolf, it was just a detail I paid attention to. Then when I was accused of "failing to see that Sally was joking", I re-read her post and concluded that she probably was.

Is that enough?

Also, to Lommy: That kind of friendliness (note the smiley) just seems all too wrong to me, it actually reminds me of my wolf attitude - I've made a post just like that as a wolf. There's something quite feigned in the tone and that "did I explain understandably?"+smilie combination."
Well. If you want me to explain why I used a smilie, then I can tell you that it was because I thought "Was that answer enough, or do you want me to explain some more?" sounds much more aggressive and annoyed than I felt.

Then to business.

Mac's theory on Nerwen, Agan and Gwath being the wolves was very interesting, but I don't think it is a valid reason to suspect Nerwen or Agan that they answer Gwath's inquiries about game rules. I would have done the same had I been online then. Nevertheless I'll probably be watching the interactions between the three of them more closely after Mac's find.
Even though I don't find Nerwen and Agan's behaviour especially wolvish, I do find Gwathy's questions a little disturbing. Why not read things like that from the rules post? That reminds me of my first game ever as a wolf, when I wanted to underline my newbieness to use it as an explanation for my oddities ("I'm just a silly newbie, I don't know how the game works!"). Otherwise he looks quite genuine except for his slight eagerness to agree with more experienced players.

Agan looks innocentish, which in her case means that she is probably a wolf. :p She is perhaps a bit less wary or, should we say, neat (if you get what I mean) than she has been in the two other games I've had with her (and she was a wolf in both). Leaning towards innocent, I guess.

Sally's apparently random vote on Shasta was really weird, as was her regretful tone of "I hope there won't be a bandwagon on this poor fellow". It was like "I don't want you lynched but I vote for you all the same". I would definitely like to have an explanation from Sally on Day 2 if she doesn't appear before DL and doesn't get lynched. I don't think a wolf would have acted that way - though I don't understand behaviour like that from an ordo, either. So, I'm very confused about her.

Rikae's overall confidence is slightly alarming, especially in Mac's case. my opinion at this point is that Macalaure is innocent as a little lamb. Just a trivial matter, but the "innocent as a little lamb" brings me in mind of some big bad wolf in a fable prowling around little lambs.

Also Legate's post made me uneasy, I can't put my finger on it but there was a sense of falseness in it, be it the over-cheerful "All right, friends!" -attitude or something else.

That's about all I have in mind for now. I'll be back to vote before the deadline, though I don't know who I'm going to vote for yet. The people I'm most uneasy with at the moment are probably Sally, Gwath, Rikae and Legate. I reserve the right to change my opinion on them if they give me reason to change it. :D

[Rikae]

Rikae's overall confidence is slightly alarming, especially in Mac's case. Just a trivial matter, but the "innocent as a little lamb" brings me in mind of some big bad wolf in a fable prowling around little lambs.


I haven't been wrong about Mac in ages. That's why I focus on "testing" him early on - he's the easiest person to read, for me.
As for the little lamb, I was indeed thinking of wolves and lambs, as in "either Mac is an innocent lamb or a wolf in sheep's clothing."
My first phrase was "pure as the driven snow and innocent as a cute little lamb. With a ribbon around its neck. In a field of daises. With a halo." But I thought that might be a tad over-the-top. :D

[Nogrod]

(OOC: LG and I are sharing the computer so we'll be able to post less than we might otherwise do...)

I quess I'm buying Greenie's explanation for the moment but I'm still a bit worried about Mac - and Rikae's latest confidence in Mac didn't ease my situation a bit as the old idea I thought I could get myself rid of ("when they both are in a game they are either wolves or lovers of which at least the other one is a wolf") started emerging in the back of my head.

Still I do agree with Rikae on Shasta - and about Nerwen, especially on the "too self-conscious" thing.

Also Sally's vote kind of makes me think about suggesting lynching her just out of pure annoyance. When one declares that one's vote is random there is nothing anyone can think or say about that "choice" as it is no choice and thence it leaves no tracks. That is either a cowardly way of playing or a clumsy trick by a wolf.

Also it's interesting that while announcing her vote to be random that random vote was indeed Shasta. Now with no disregard to Shasta I'd say that was the easiest or smoothest choice, something she might have thought wouldn't be jumped on by anyone... or a vote someone she voted for would come back at her. So was it a random-vote at all or just claimed random-vote? I'm thinking it was the latter and if I'm correct that looks very bad indeed.

You others have already pointed out all the backtracking she made alongside her vote (all the sorrys & hopefully I'm not starting a bandwaggon etc...).

[Macalaure]

Good to see I'm not alone with my suspicions.


Am I correct in thinking, Mac, that you didn't intend the content of your conversation-starter to be misleading, but rather were looking for wolvish behavior of hovering around the edges of a debate?

I have been understood! :)

my opinion at this point is that Macalaure is innocent as a little lamb.

Meeh. :p


I'm pretty much in agreement with Rikae's thoughts in her last post.


I would prefer voting for Nerwen or Aganzir, probably Aganzir more. I would like to vote right away, but I'm afraid I need to be careful since I might need to vote Sally in order to save myself. Since I think Sally is innocent, I'm not very eager to do that.

The third wolf next to Nerwen and Aganzir could be Gwatha or Lily, or somebody else who's been hiding well so far. We'll have time to find him.

[A Little Green]

I have to vote now because Noggins needs time to post as well. So without further explanations,

++ Gwath

Simply because he looks most suspicious to me at the moment.

ToMorrow I promise to look at those who have slipped completely under my radar (meaning at least Lommy, Menel, and Noggins).

[Macalaure]

Sally -> Shasta
Shasta -> Menel
Legate -> Sally (Sally 2, Menel 1)
Aganzir -> Mac (Sally 2, Menel 1, Mac 1)
Lommy -> Mac (Sally 2, Mac 2, Menel 1)
Lily -> Gwath (Sally 2, Mac 2, Menel 1, Gwath 1)

left to vote: me, Nogrod, McCaber, Gwathagor, Menel, Rikae

Half of us still need to vote and only 15 minutes left! :eek:

[Macalaure]

Voting a newbie with that little suspicion?

*writes "has some explaining to do tomorrow" next to Lily's name*

[Nogrod]

Mac 2
Gwath 1
Menel 1
Sally 1
Shasta 1

Right?

And where are all the people?

I would be quite uncomfortable voting for Mac on these basis alone.

Sadly I haven't had time enough to read Nerwen and Aganzir to actually form a reasoned opinion on them even if I feel there might be something wrong there.

Of those already gaining votes I might be persuaded to vote for Sally (look at my last post for reasons).

EDIT: x'd with Mac

[Macalaure]

Gwathagor, Menel, and McCaber haven't showed up yet, so unless they plan to give a last-minute rogue vote, they're going to miss it.

Nogrod, Rikae? What are your preferences?

[Gwathagor]

I'm here, I'm here.

[Macalaure]

I'm here, I'm here.

Then tell us what you think! :)

[Rikae]

I would really rather vote for Nerwen, but not if it means Mac gets lynched, as I would rather save him than Sally.
I don't see how Sally's so suspicious, though, either - random votes are unfortunate and useless, but sometimes can't be helped.

[Gwathagor]

Hey, I have at least five minutes.

[Rikae]

So, you refuse to let anyone know your thinking process beforehand, Gwath? Hmm...

[Rikae]

Can I get any support in voting Nerwen?

[Macalaure]

I'm more confident about the innocence of Menel than I am of Sally's. I think Shasta and Gwath deserve another Day.

But I would still prefer Nerwen or Aganzir. :(

[A Little Green]

A very quick response to Mac: I vote people based on their suspiciousness, not the length of their werewolf career. He is wolvish-looking for other reasons than being a newbie.
I know he is a newbie but he is the most wolvish-looking so I voted for him. Clear?

[Gwathagor]

OK, here we go.

I am going to vote

+ + Aganzir

because she is Pretty Suspicious, whereas everyone else is either Fairly Suspicious or Not Very Suspicious.

[Macalaure]

Rikae, could I persuade you to vote Aganzir?

[Nogrod]

I'm afraid I have too little to go for Agan or Nerwen even if I do appreciate the points made.

So I'll go for

++ Sally

[Rikae]

++Aganzir

No persuasion needed, Mac, I already suspected her.

[Macalaure]

++Aganzir

[Macalaure]

phew....

that axe in my neck started to feel uncomfortable...

[Farael]

TIME IS UP

Narration coming up shortly

[Nerwen]

Okay, I guess I'm going to be voting for either Mac or Sally. A Little Green sounds better to me after her last post, and I don't want to lynch Gwathagor toDay, since he's new. Besides, I don't really find him that suspicious.

I can't understand why Rikae is so convinced Mac is innocent or why she claims to suspect those who suspect him. I'm trying to be as objective as I can, and I think he's been behaving in a notably peculiar way. And far from "misrepresenting" him, I was simply honestly saying what I thought he meant.

Sally's vote for Shasta was perhaps the single most wolfish thing anyone has done today. Or rather, not the vote itself, since Shasta was already under a bit of suspicion, but the reasons she gave for it. On the other hand– this is Sally we're talking about. She's always weird. Also, it seems she's ill, which may account for some of the extra weirdness.

I'm still not sure what to do.

Edit: ran out of time. Sorry.
2nd edit (at peril of modwrath): X'd with everyone since Mac at #121.

[Farael]

The villagers... *Bonk*... Adventurers I mean!!... were lost and confused.

Shasta!! said one of them amid a bad dream. “Well, that’s not helpful... I say YOU are a wolf” “No, YOU Are!” “YOU!” and so on and so forth for most of the day. The deadline was nearing, and it seemed Macalaure was going to be the one

“Now, now, my friends let’s be reasonable... there is no need to lynch anyone, after al--“

“I’m voting for Aganzir said Rikae”

“AGANZIR IS A WOLF!!! LYNCH HER! LYYYNCH HEEER” said Macalaure

“Wait a moment,” spoke Lommy “Mac is right!”

“I’m not a wolf!”

“Quiet Aganzir that’s not what I mean... I meant that he was right when he started to say there is no need to lynch anyone. I have just what we need.”

“Those half-elves always so smug, we should lynch Lommy just for that!”

“Roa you are a co-mod, you don’t get to vote” answered the resident penguin lover, who had surprisingly not mentioned penguins once this time around. “Anyway, I have a giant, hollow d2. I never knew why I bought such thing as no game seems to ask for it, but we can probably lock our suspects there and then see. If one of them is a wolfie then we’d probably notice it the morning after!”

It seemed sensible enough and Aganzir was forced into the giant d2 dice which somehow no-one had noticed was sitting right there all along.

All along, Gwathagor had refused to participate. “Something feels off” he thought to himself, and then said aloud “Wait a minute, I know why d2 are not used; they don’t exist! You see, a d2 would be like a coin, thin and...”

“Thin?!” Aganzir began to look worried “Wouldn’t that mean that...”

*Squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee SLPORCH*
No-one heard the end of Aganzir’s plead. Due to the laws of cartoon-reality* the d2 turned into a, more reality appropriate, coin. This had the unfortunately side effect of compacting the day’s top vote-getter into nonexistence. A little shocked and confused, the adventurers decided to go to sleep, forgetting that there were still werewolves around.

*Law of cartoon-reality: Anything, no matter how impossible it may be, will continue to exist and or happen up until one of the parties involved realize its lack of sense.

-------------------------------------------------------
The Living

Legate
Nogrod
Lommy
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure
Nerwen
Meneltarmacil
Rikae
Shasta


The dead
Roa: Eaten by werewolves, or otherwise gone missing
Farael: Killed by a convenient plot-twist
Aganzir: Squished into non-existance inside a d2

The tally
Three Werewolves
One Seer

The note
Post at your own peril of modwrath, wolves may PM, Seer may dream.

[Farael]

Yikes!! Sorry for the late start

Lommy (ordo) has been voted out of th-... i mean eaten. I'll put up a narration later, you may post.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“There’s something wrong” said the half-ish elf. “I feel like we’ve forgotten about something. Sure, seeing Aganzir squished into nonexistence was rather disturbing and I sure wanted to close my eyes and forget all about it... however, there is something else I remember being worried about” Then she felt a soft stubble suddenly noticeable on her chin “Ach, cursed curse... how could this happen to me? Half-elf, yes, but not half-human but rather half-Werewolf.” Lommy sat up suddenly and yelled out

“WEREW-“ but a dark, furry (far furrier than hers) hand covered her mouth. “Quiet wee one...” it whispered to her ear “there’s no need to wake up all the others! Come along now, let’s go for a walk” and a heavy hand grabbed Lommy by the shoulder and lead her through dark passages and hidden doors. On and on she walked, the hand’s firm grasp all that her bewildered senses felt.

Suddenly, she felt (or rather did not feel) something under her. She had walked right over the edge of a precipice, guided by that accursed hand.

“Well, at least I took one of them down with me” she thought, still falling and falling. She turned to see whom it had been the one to betray them, and much to her horror there was no werewolf falling along with her. A green, rotten hand was still grabbing on to her shoulder. It also held a little note tattooed to the back of the hand. “I guess the Last Prince of Cardolan still had a little mischief left in him”. If Loomy ever hit the bottom of the precipice or if she is forever falling, the accursed hand her lone companion, this story does not tell.

The Living

Legate
Nogrod
McCaber
Sally
Gwathagor
A Little Green
Macalaure
Nerwen
Meneltarmacil
Rikae
Shasta


The dead
Roa: Eaten by werewolves, or otherwise gone missing
Farael: Killed by a convenient plot-twist
Aganzir: Squished into non-existance inside a d2
Loomy: May not be dead, but she's sure too far from the game to be of much help

The tally
Three Werewolves
One Seer

[Meneltarmacil]

OK, everyone. I'm sorry, the no-vote was a mistake on my part. I forgot the game was going on until the deadline was already over. In any case, know that I would have voted for Rikae.

I'm even more suspicious of her now than before, come to think of it. The Aganzir bandwagon looks more than just a little fishy to me. Macalaure's lynching is coming closer, and then Gwathagor votes for the suspicious-but-most-likely-innocent Agan. That's fine; Gwath is rather new here and it's an honest mistake. Then, seeing a vote in play, Rikae jumps in to save Macalaure, followed by the would-be lynchee himself.

Aganzir was hardly considered a genuine target before, mainly being placed in the "suspicious-looking innocent" category. A sudden turn of the votes toward her at the end does not appear to be a good sign, as far as I can see.

[Rikae]

Aganzir was hardly considered a genuine target before, mainly being placed in the "suspicious-looking innocent" category. A sudden turn of the votes toward her at the end does not appear to be a good sign, as far as I can see.

By whom? Menel, you certainly seem eager to put your own spin on things - if anyone cares to look at yesterday's posts, they should see in plain green and black that I suspected Aganzir - I mentioned it several times - and Mac did as well, as far as I can see.
If my desire had been only to save Mac, I could have voted for anyone else who had one vote, after all.
I'm still inclined to trust him - his behavior yesterday struck me as an honest attempt to stir the pot. I wonder if it wasn't entirely fruitless, and whether the choice of Aganzir at the end allowed Nerwolf to escape the net. She was the most suspicious person, to my mind, yesterday, and I hope she isn't overlooked toDay.
Now, why did the wolves target Lommy? They can't possibly have taken her dream remark for a seer hint, as it was clearly a joke (then again, we seem to have quite a bit of misunderstanding going on in this game.) It may well be that she was killed simply for being generally trusted in a village where most people have gained some suspicion.
Now, I have to go to class (yes, there is a university in the barrow) so I'll catch up on the discussion in a few hours.

[Gwathagor]

I AM sorry for my part in Aganzir's death. It does make me look suspicious, but I'll try to make amends by not making any more lame mistakes.

Since Aganzir was innocent, and the wolves knew she was innocent, it seems likely that one or more of them would have voted to execute her. So, if I'm right, either myself, Rikae, or Macalaure could be a wolf.

On the other hand, the wolves might have scattered their votes early on, in the hope that they would go unnoticed and the ords would lynch one of their own kind, of their own accord.

Rikae: what are your reasons for suspecting Nerwen? I haven't caught any traces of wolf yet in her posts, but I'm willing to be convinced.


EDIT: X-ed with Rikae

[satansaloser2005]

Sally hobbled in, took one look around at the tired faces, and decided she had some splaining to do....


First of all, thank you SO much for taking pity on a sickie and not killing me yesterday. For the record, I voted Shasta because I figured that he was a safe vote (aka I could vote him and I was pretty sure he wouldn't actually die.) I found him perhaps a bit off the wall, but not completely suspicious, so of all the people I could vote in good conscience, I chose him. End of story. Past that, I feel no need to explain myself because as I mentioned I had been sick and my brain simply couldn't put a logical thought together this weekend to save my life, so if you find my illness to be an indication of guilt then feel free to accuse me.

How did we come to the conclusion that Agan was wolfy anyway? I didn't find her suspicious in the least (but I am still a bit loopy) so I'm not quite sure why she died. But it was the first day, and thus there wasn't much to go on, so it's understandable. Happens to the best of us.

Lommie kill? Allow me to ponder that for a bit, and then I will re-emerge with a possible explanation....

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

btw - Gwath - you should not edit the content of your posts except for marking x-posting, otherwise it might get pretty confusing.

Well. So Lommy is dead. I read through her yesterDay's posts and she did not post much. Very little, indeed, though she said she will be more active toDay - maybe someone was afraid of it and get rid of her? (Though I don't find it as probable.) Another thing I can think of right now as reason for her kill is her remark about the dream she had on the Dreams thread:
"Yes, you're a wolf and your fellows are Legate and Shasta. I've seen it in a dream (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=546415&postcount=1112)."
But even this thing indeed does not seem to me worth thinking about. Or is it possible that the wolves really took it as a Seer hint? Well, anything is possible. Otherwise, it may be that she simply was picked to leave little or no tracks.

As for yesterDay's votes, this is how it went. I noticed that Mac yesterDay repeatedly posted the voting list wrong - he counted Sally's vote for Shasta later as a vote for Sally, so he kept posting the list saying "Sally 2". This version is corrected:

Sally -> Shasta (Shasta 1)
Shasta -> Menel (Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Legate -> Sally (Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Aganzir -> Mac (Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Mac 1)
Lommy -> Mac (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Lily -> Gwath (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)
Gwath -> Aganzir (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1, Aganzir 1)
Nogrod -> Sally (Mac 2, Sally 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1, Aganzir 1)
Rikae -> Aganzir (Mac 2, Sally 2, Aganzir 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)
Mac -> Aganzir (Aganzir 3, Mac 2, Sally 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)

Did not vote: McCaber, Nerwen, Menel. Menel already explained himself, I'd like to hear an explanation from the other two.

Now what can be deduced from that. The end was very dramatic. It went for Mac, then after Nogrod's vote it seemed to be a toss-up between him and Sally, but immediately and in a few last minutes Aganzir was lynched. I don't like that and let me also use this opportunity to say that we should avoid things like that. Last-minute vote frays happen, and in fact it's pretty normal, but generally it's at least some shot-up between two or three people about whom we know. This time, suddenly a candidate who did not have a single vote 5 minutes before the DL was lynched. That's not a way it should be generally done, I'd say, and I believe no one would like if such a thing happened to us.

About those voters. I think it's probable that there could be a wolf among Aganzir-voters. Gwath, despite the fact he started this bandwagon, still seems rather like a genuine innocent to me. And if not, then I'd say he's playing an innocent newbie pretty well. I'm leaving him out of my suspicions right now. Now, the other two, Mac and Rikae. Of them I am more aware of Mac, from the general behavior of him in this game. On the other hand if Sally were a wolf, there could have been a connection between her and Rikae and thence the eagerness of her to join Mac's vote.

Further thoughts coming from me later. I will have plenty time toDay, unlike yesterDay, so I hope to be more productive.

[Nogrod]

Lommie kill? Allow me to ponder that for a bit, and then I will re-emerge with a possible explanation....Don't waste your time on it. She was a safe kill and a good player - and with no ranger to protect her... easy and a good choice. She was ashtonishingly little talked about yesterDay.

Rikae mentioned her dream-stuff though and with wolves you can't ever discount the possibility that they want to make sure as the seer is normally their worst enemy. But then again it would be quite convenient for the wolves if we believed that was the reason while those she mentioned in her RL-dream were all innocents in the game...

EDIT: x'd with Legate

[McCaber]

Richard the Unobscure rose from his meditations.

"I would also apologize for my lack of vote yesterday. I lost myself in my evening prayers and forgot the time. I will not let it happen again.

Now, let us descend upon these wolves with fire and holy writ.

My suspicion (and my would-be vote) was cast on Sally yesterDay, but she claims a weakness of the body was at fault. I shall therefore wait and reevaluate my thoughts.

I believe that brother Gwathagor is sincere in his repentance, and in the words of the Scriptures, "Let not the noobs be ganked without reason, but have pity on them and nurture them until they may learn their way."

It is a pity that Lommy is no longer with us, but mayhap it was simply a random choice by the wolves. Or something as simple as half-elf penguins taste better.

Macalaure gave me an uneasy feeling towards the end, but that seems to be mere panic rather than an actual wolf, and I still wonder about this Little Green.

[satansaloser2005]

About those voters. I think it's probable that there could be a wolf among Aganzir-voters.

Quite possible it is indeed, Legate. In fact, I think it's possible there's a wolf among all three voting groups, since there are three wolves. But perhaps that would be spreading them a bit thin. :p

Honestly, I don't think there's a wolf in that group. I think there's two. Gwath, innocent and new though he may be, seemed to set that situation up quite nicely. However, I believe he just made an innocent mistake, emphasis on innocent, and that a wolf (or wolves for that matter) jumped on the chance to get Agan out of the way. I especially dislike that five minutes before deadline, Mac basically said to Rikae, "I know we have other people we can vote for, but let's just get Agan out of the way while she's not looking. Want to help me out love?" I just don't like it. I don't like it one little bit.


"And we know who the third is of course. Stepmother Lily, come forward," Sally requested. "I believe it is you, oh mis-interpreter of posts, who mistook our fair Lommie as a seer and chose to seal her fate. Confess now, and we shall be kind to you and make your death as swift and painless as possible."

[Macalaure]

Aganzir was innocent. Dammit.

I guess Lommy has been killed because I was her main suspect. She yet did not do any harm to a wolf, so better get rid of her before she eventually starts to. It sadly means that we can deduce little to nothing from her death.


Rikae: what are your reasons for suspecting Nerwen? I haven't caught any traces of wolf yet in her posts, but I'm willing to be convinced.

Don't you think that's a tad convenient? ;) Why don't you reveal a little bit of your own thought processes first. I'm very curious what exactly it was that made you vote Aganzir yesterDay. The way I see it, you could very well be a wolf (together with Sally?) who took advantage of the possibility to start a bandwaggon against an innocent.

Then, seeing a vote in play, Rikae jumps in to save Macalaure, followed by the would-be lynchee himself.

I think this would only make sense in the case of a wolf trio Rikae-Mac-Sally (as Legate has already pointed out). Otherwise, Sally would have been the far easier option for her to save me.

I noticed that Mac yesterDay repeatedly posted the voting list wrong - he counted Sally's vote for Shasta later as a vote for Sally, so he kept posting the list saying "Sally 2".Yep, I noticed it. Sorry about that. But why do you say "repeatedly" when it was obviously only once? :confused:

This time, suddenly a candidate who did not have a single vote 5 minutes before the DL was lynched. That's not a way it should be generally done, I'd say, and I believe no one would like if such a thing happened to us.You're right, but keep in mind that, even though she did not receive a vote until the end, she had been mentioned as a possibility for far longer than 5 minutes.

I disagree with keeping Gwath out of the considerations for the wolf among the Aganzir-voters. He's genuine, yes, but he's new, so that says little. In my opinion, he yet simply has not given enough input to be judged. I think you're being hasty there.


I still think Rikae, Nogrod, and Menel, are innocent, A Little Green fishy, and Nerwen suspicious. I need to rethink my opinion of Sally.

I need to see more posts from Legate, more details from Gwathagor, more sense from Shasta, and more of all of these from McCaber toDay before I can make up my mind about them.

[satansaloser2005]

I disagree with keeping Gwath out of the considerations for the wolf among the Aganzir-voters. He's genuine, yes, but he's new, so that says little. In my opinion, he yet simply has not given enough input to be judged. I think you're being hasty there.



Sally's head tilted as she considered this. "You're right, Mac. Perhaps I am a bit too trusting. I will look more into this innocent-seeming child."



note: in class right now, so really can't post much more than that. back in about an hour, unless I break down and stealth-post again.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Yep, I noticed it. Sorry about that. But why do you say "repeatedly" when it was obviously only once? :confused:
Oh, sorry. For some reason I thought you posted twice. Must have mistaken it with Nogrod or I just need my eyes checked.

You're right, but keep in mind that, even though she did not receive a vote until the end, she had been mentioned as a possibility for far longer than 5 minutes.
Yes, you are right. However, I am aware of the fact that it might have suited a wolf to raise such a last minute bandwaggon - and imagine what would've happened if for example Aganzir were a Seer.

I disagree with keeping Gwath out of the considerations for the wolf among the Aganzir-voters. He's genuine, yes, but he's new, so that says little. In my opinion, he yet simply has not given enough input to be judged. I think you're being hasty there.
Well, of course I am not totally leaving him for the whole game. But I said for now, I am giving him the benefit of doubt. If in the future there is something sinister about him, I will of course reconsider even his role in yesterDay's events. But now, you or Rikae to me look like more probable wolves among Agan-voters.

Anyway, Mac, I am keeping you in my orange zone. You seem to be reasonable on one side, on the other, you post things like this:
Aganzir was innocent. Dammit.

I guess Lommy has been killed because I was her main suspect. She yet did not do any harm to a wolf, so better get rid of her before she eventually starts to. It sadly means that we can deduce little to nothing from her death.
I know as innocent, you could be cursing yourself over lynching a bad person as well, but I am getting a bad feeling from your posts in general. And that Lommy thing - I am not sure if I understand you. Why should she have been killed because you were her main suspect? Anyway, by saying "She yet did not do any harm to a wolf", you also set yourself as an innocent, because if she suspected you, then she did you "harm", and therefore you don't count as wolf. I don't think there was much in her death either, but I am worried if you are not a wolf and as a side-effect it suited you to kill her because she suspected you. Oh, or is that what you meant by that "main suspect" thing? Anyway in that case you could be double-bluffing that, cf. what I said before.

And I must say if I am baffled by anyone, it is Sally. After her last but one post (that longer one), I really don't know what to think. Not that the theories she brings are not interesting, but I am quite baffled by the way she seems to be so sure of her suspects. Or am I missing a joke once more?

[Macalaure]

I know as innocent, you could be cursing yourself over lynching a bad person as well, but I am getting a bad feeling from your posts in general. And that Lommy thing - I am not sure if I understand you. Why should she have been killed because you were her main suspect? Anyway, by saying "She yet did not do any harm to a wolf", you also set yourself as an innocent, because if she suspected you, then she did you "harm", and therefore you don't count as wolf.Of course I'm setting myself as an innocent - that's the only thing I know for certain. Since I was Lommy's main suspect, no wolf was, but since she's a crafty player, she was going to be a problem for one or more wolves eventually. It seems like a pretty straightforward kill to me.

I don't think there was much in her death either, but I am worried if you are not a wolf and as a side-effect it suited you to kill her because she suspected you. Oh, or is that what you meant by that "main suspect" thing? Anyway in that case you could be double-bluffing that, cf. what I said before.Now, this I don't understand. First you say there's not much in her death, then you say I could be a wolf. But if I was a wolf, then there is something in her death, namely that I got rid of her because she was dangerous to me. If this was the case, then obviously getting rid of someone who suspected me was not a side-effect, but the main goal.

[A Little Green]

Alright, then.

After reading toDay's posts I find my thoughts very contradictory. There are three people I find suspicious, but according to my reasoning all three can't be wolves.

In addition to the troublesome Aganzir-voting issue, Mac's latest post seemed very fishy to me. First of all, the beginning Aganzir was innocent. Dammit. looks, sorry to say, just false. Secondly, Don't you think that's a tad convenient? Why don't you reveal a little bit of your own thought processes first. I'm very curious what exactly it was that made you vote Aganzir yesterDay. The way I see it, you could very well be a wolf (together with Sally?) who took advantage of the possibility to start a bandwaggon against an innocent. This looks... bad. Though he's got a point, the way he very quickly, almost aggressively, turns the suspicion from himself to Gwath looks furry to me. To start a bandwaggon? While Gwath's post was OK, here we go.

I am going to vote

+ + Aganzir

because she is Pretty Suspicious, whereas everyone else is either Fairly Suspicious or Not Very Suspicious. your next one was Rikae, could I persuade you to vote Aganzir? Which one looks more like the start of a bandwagon, may I ask?

Rikae's confidence not only in Mac's innocence but also in Nerwen's guilt (her reference to "Nerwolf" in her latest post) strikes me as very weird. How can she be so certain, especially after being mistaken about Agan? I don't know what to think about her. Her behaviour looks suspicious, but somehow I'd think that she was more careful if she were a wolf.

Gwath is still fishy-looking, not because of the Agan-vote but because of his Day1 behaviour (the same reasons I suspected him for then), and because there was something weird in his toDay's post. I don't suspect him as much as I did on Day1, however.

I'm quite convinced one of these three is a wolf, probably Rikae or Mac, most probably Mac. Though Rikae and Mac are my main suspects at the moment, I don't think both of them are wolves. They would be playing a very bold game indeed if they were. But which one of them is, I cannot say. Mac looks both more and less suspicious, if you get what I mean.

And Sally, I'd appreciate it if you stated why do you suspect me, so I could better defend myself.

EDIT: x-ed with Legate and Mac

[Nogrod]

I just got back reading things and noticed - the same one I see Legate pointed out as well - but let me take one fresh look at it with a slight bolding...
Aganzir was innocent. Dammit.

I guess Lommy has been killed because I was her main suspect. She yet did not do any harm to a wolf, so better get rid of her before she eventually starts to. It sadly means that we can deduce little to nothing from her death.I do agree with Legate (if I understood him right) that your cursing about Agan's innocence looks anything but sincere. The whole sentence about Lommy not yet doing harm to a wolf is more than fishy: now why an ordo would think it that way - if Lommy had not spotted a wolf yet why should they be in a special hurry to get her killed instead of me, Legate, Rikae, Mac himself just to name a few good candidates? This whole approach looks pretty suspicious.

But take the bolding then. So we can't deduce anything about her death and still the two who suspected you the most: Aganzir and Lommy are now dead... How convenient. Or are they framing you? That's possible but somehow your way of trying to downplay everything we can read from Lommy's death (and "dammitting" Agan's) just looks lycantrophic.

I'll be back with more things...

EDIT: X'd with Mac and LG

[satansaloser2005]

Aganzir was innocent. Dammit.


I know others have said it, but I must echo it. That sounds so very false. It's like he's saying "Yes! We've killed one with ease, but I've been caught in the act. Backpeddle! Backpeddle!" I do have a random thought though. Would you care to hear it? *waits, but no response* Good, no one objects.
Okay, let's assume he's being sincere, that he's upset because Agan was an innocent. Perhaps he is angry because he was hoping to rid our group of its seer? I'm sorry, I know it's a bit out there, and I'll have to look at Agan's posts to see if that's even a plausible theory, but I'll put it on the table for everyone to look at. I'm going to read some more posts and pet my duck. She's slightly angered at me because I ran too far ahead of her earlier and she wants some company. I'll return soon.

[Macalaure]

Lily, I'm not turning against Gwathagor. I only want to know the reasoning behind his decisions. I can decide whether he's suspicious or not only when I know what he had been thinking.

Which one looks more like the start of a bandwagon, may I ask?Mine.

I campaigned for the lynching of one of my main suspects. The fact that I was wrong obviously makes me look suspicious, but I don't think the fact that I urged a bandwaggon does. Gwathagor, on the other hand, could have known there was a potential for a waggon against her and then initiated it. Without his reasoning I have no idea what to think of this.

How can she be so certain, especially after being mistaken about Agan?The suspicions against the two were independent of one another, so there's no necessity to back off from Nerwen now - at least from my perspective.

if Lommy had not spotted a wolf yet why should they be in a special hurry to get her killed instead of me, Legate, Rikae, Mac himself just to name a few good candidates?Of course it would also make sense for them to kill someone who's on their track, but apparently these wolves did not think so. I see three possibilities:
a) Lommy was killed due to the utter lack of trails to the wolves.
b) I'm a wolf and wanted to rid myself from her.
c) The wolves are trying to frame me.
b) I know is not the case and c) I doubt.

[Meneltarmacil]

I have noticed, disturbingly, that Rikae and Macalaure have been defending and supporting each other during the entire game and coming up with the exact same suspects, Aganzir and Nerwen.

I do know that there are RL reasons for this, but this goes beyond what I would normally expect. Mac, as I've pointed out, Rikae fell right into your trap when you asked for a "conventional vs. weird" debate, and yet you dropped the idea and never called her on it. You later said that if a wolf had fallen for it, that wolf would be lynched. Yet you let Rikae go. Why?

[Macalaure]

I don't think Rikae took my bait. She said the debate made sense (or rather that I made sense when I started it), but she didn't further it in any other way. Later she only mentioned it again because she thought I had been misrepresented (which I had been).

It was Nerwen who, indirectly, stepped into it by posting very vague and fishy things about what I had been trying to do (#101).

Rikae and I have the same suspects, that is true, but as far as I can see, we came to our conclusions independently. From my part, the fact that her opinions are the same as mine is a big factor in why I find her to be unsuspicious. Hesitating to lynch the other or defending the other from seemingly unjust suspicions could surely be explained by RL reasons alone, but declaring the other innocent indeed would go a bit too far, (edit: ) it would not be in the spirit of the game.

[Nogrod]

Of course it would also make sense for them to kill someone who's on their track, but apparently these wolves did not think so. I see three possibilities:
a) Lommy was killed due to the utter lack of trails to the wolves.
b) I'm a wolf and wanted to rid myself from her.
c) The wolves are trying to frame me.
b) I know is not the case and c) I doubt.If you're innocent indeed why do you doubt c)? I mean if you're innocent that would be just the perfect kill for the wolves! Maybe I need to go back to see who else Lommy suspected to see who you are covering right now?

*just a moment*

Well, no actual suspicions but Mac and Rikae. And possibly LG - it's hard to say if that was an actual suspicion.

Aganzir (known innocent), Legate and Shasta were her "dream-wolves".

I've been giving this some thought. Maybe her "dream-thing" actually startled the wolves after all? Funny you Mac don't mention it in your list of possibilities but only speak of you as a wolf wanting to rid yourself from her in general... just like you tried to downplay any information we might gather from Lommy's death in the beginning of the Day? If you're an ordo you're mind takes paths quite unfathomable to me.

~*~

Okay I almost opened the Day screaming that Mac and Rikae share the responsibility of my daughter's death. Happily I reread the thread before I posted that. But then again I must say I'm a bit confused about this.

Sometimes Mac posts like a truest innocent and at other times his posts just scream a WOLF. ToDay Mac's post have had an air of coming from the dark side alone... Rikae looks and even feels pretty straightforward reasoned innocent - except her overconfidence on Mac's innocence and maybe on Nerwen's lupinity. (I need to try and read Nerwen's posting the next...)

Here I think I agree with Lommy (bolding mine): "Mac and Rikae... I'm afraid I don't like the way you court and trial each other. Careful agreements, defenses and accusations to balance it out. It looks quite fishy. But I think the most probable scenario is that one of you is a wolf and he or she is trying to get the another one to his or her side or win his or her trust. I don't like it..."Neither do I as losing either of you as innocents if we tried it would be very bad indeed.

So please you two open your eyes and forget the rosegarden for a moment - or at least until you can actually be sure... :rolleyes:

EDIT: x'd with Mac

[Farael]

We interrupt your regularly scheduled Werewolf day for this important announcement:

The narration including Lommy's sad demise is now up.

Also, there was a mild confusion about the role of the half-werewolves.
BEING A HALF WEREWOLF DOES NOT GIVE THE PLAYER ANY NON-ORDO QUALITIES, UNLESS S/HE HAPPENS TO BE A WOLF/HALF-WW OR A SEER/HALF-WW

Also, there are no hints on the narrations. Really. None.

Now baaaaaaaaaack to the game!

[Gwathagor]

Ok, it sounds like I need to explain a little bit. YesterDay, I had the wolves all figured out. I was pretty certain about a triumvirate involving Aganzir, A Little Green, and Macalaure. I voted for Aganzir at the end of the day, first, because I found her the more suspicious than A Little Green (and I wanted to wait before I accused Macalaure), and, second, because no one else had voted for her and I didn't want to just be a follower. I hope that's fairly clear and doesn't seem like an over-reaction (those are always suspicious).

Obviously, I was wrong about Aganzir, and, consequently, I am rethinking my suspicion of A Little Green as well.

I'm going to reread today's posts again and see if I can find anything that feels phony.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Now, this I don't understand. First you say there's not much in her death, then you say I could be a wolf. But if I was a wolf, then there is something in her death, namely that I got rid of her because she was dangerous to me. If this was the case, then obviously getting rid of someone who suspected me was not a side-effect, but the main goal.
I believe the sentence is clear: I am inclined to think Lommy was killed simply to leave no track, and as side effect, you eliminated a person who suspected you.

Okay, speaking of Mac - I am also somewhat concerned by the way he treats Rikae this time, though I am very well aware that Mac might simply be a little more knightly than usual, but what of things like this:
The suspicions against the two were independent of one another, so there's no necessity to back off from Nerwen now - at least from my perspective.
Here Mac speaks about Rikae. I know, there are these RL things - but come on, defending each other in this way? This is just not normal and I don't like the idea of these two really being wolves together. Well, as we all know, nothing is impossible. I am beginning to seriously think about this possibility.

I must say Noggins makes pretty much sense and looks also far more active than yesterDay. On the other hand, Sally keeps me wondering about her daring playing style.
I know others have said it, but I must echo it. That sounds so very false. It's like he's saying "Yes! We've killed one with ease, but I've been caught in the act. Backpeddle! Backpeddle!" I do have a random thought though. Would you care to hear it? *waits, but no response* Good, no one objects.
Okay, let's assume he's being sincere, that he's upset because Agan was an innocent. Perhaps he is angry because he was hoping to rid our group of its seer? I'm sorry, I know it's a bit out there, and I'll have to look at Agan's posts to see if that's even a plausible theory, but I'll put it on the table for everyone to look at.
I know it can be an innocent playing, but the style... I am just worried about it. These are all sort of a half-fun but very daring theories which the poster herself immediately relativises. And that itself stirs my attention. Yes, worrying is the right word. If I were to form a conspiracy theory around here, I could imagine a Mac-Rikae-Sally wolf pack right now.

Well, I am probably going to sleep now - will be back in about nine hours at maximum. Hope to see more people posting around.

[satansaloser2005]

Quick announcement!

Apologies. I know I said I'd post again in a second, but I nodded off, and I need to rush to work. I'll be back sometime tonight, and will most likely have time to post quite a bit ahead of the deadline again. Faretheewell all!

[Macalaure]

While I have to admit that I cannot follow your logic, Gwath, ;) I think your explanation looks innocently genuine enough to make me less suspicious for now.

I believe the sentence is clear: I am inclined to think Lommy was killed simply to leave no track, and as side effect, you eliminated a person who suspected you.Your sentence is clear, but it's completely illogical:
If I was a wolf, then she does leave a highway of a track - towards me! ;)

I know, there are these RL things - but come on, defending each other in this way?No RL whatsoever. By defending her continued suspicion of Nerwen, I also defend my continued suspicion of Nerwen.

[Nerwen]

First off, I should apologize for the no-vote yesterday. I messed up the timing– my computer clock is apparently slow, plus I had an RL emergency to deal with.

The way the votes went was odd. Given that Rikae was, for whatever reason, determined to save Mac– why did they not vote Sally?

Are they all wolves together? If so, why didn't they go for Shasta, Gwath or Menel?

Are Rik and Mac wolves who wanted at all costs to eliminate Aganzir as a threat (maybe the Seer)? Or are they innocents who were, for some reason, absolutely sure she was a wolf?

Reading the lasts posts (didn't have time until after the DL), I noticed that people didn't seem to realize I hadn't voted yet. I need to think about how this might have affected things.

Now, as to what Macalaure says about me: I did not post "vague and fishy" thngs at all. I just asked him to explain his peculiar behaviour. The way he went for me (and everyone else who questioned him) suggests a high degree of paranoia to me. Fact is, he was acting strangely enough to virtually ensure that people would wonder about him.

Funny thing is, in the previous games I've played here, he was much cooler– and he was a wolf in all of them. So what's going on now?

Now I'd like to hear from Gwathagor.

Edit: X'd with everyone since Gwath.

[Gwathagor]

Gwath is still fishy-looking, not because of the Agan-vote but because of his Day1 behaviour (the same reasons I suspected him for then), and because there was something weird in his toDay's post. I don't suspect him as much as I did on Day1, however.

Today's post was convoluted because I added stuff when I edited it. So the natural flow of thought got kind of screwed up.

EDIT: X-ed with loads of people

[Nerwen]

Gwathagor, you shouldn't edit your posts, except for stuff like mentioning you x'd with people. Posts are all the evidence we have to go on– and people can think you changed something incriminating.

Well, your explanation sounds innocent enough (if you're a wolf you're doing well)– and also pretty straightforward. I don't know why Macalaure can't follow it.

[Gwathagor]

Sorry. I won't do it anymore.

[Nogrod]

Nerwenalysis
+ various thoughts in brackets...

#97
Points on Mac being somewhat confusing while first asking people to concentrate on those flying under radar and avoiding controversiality and then telling he had only wished to trigger “senseless” discussion to reveal the wolves. Says it’s a handy plan but asks how Mac would have proceeded if it had worked.

(I’m still a bit loss with this one. Do you people mean that when Mac says in his first post that: "Strangely, everybody seems reluctant to discuss the useless things and remains quiet because there is yet nothing useful to be said. While it is doubtlessly honorable to focus on what's important, it's not actually helping us today. As contradicting as it may appear, we need to discuss futile topics in order to be productive and make at least an educated guess when twilight comes.” then this is a masterplan after which all the wolves jump in joy and go forwards talking nonsense? I mean c’mon people!)

#101
Answers Gwath’s suspicion on Agan (known innocent) and LG with: "even casually stating your belief in a fellow-wolf's innocence can be rather risky". But then again says LG’s last post was sugary. Gives a tip (to Gwath I suppose?) to look at “staged” suspicions as they may be wolfy.

Points on Menel’s suspicion that “Rikae appears to have taken the bait” that Rikae had started talking about gut feelings already before Mac started his "let's suspect anyone who sounds sensible thing”.

(I’m totally baffled about this. How does this relate to anything that was said?)

Then adds the following: I'm still not sure what to make of Mac. Was he trying to set a wolf-trap, as he claims? Or is he furry himself, and backed away from his scheme when he saw ii wasn't working? Either way, it was a rather dangerous ploy. If he's a wolf, he risked drawing suspicion on himself– if not, he risked giving the wolves the go-ahead to lynch helpful innocents.

Counters Menel’s suspicions of Shasta for him just being in-character longer than others and his suspicions being pretty jokey.

#107
Clarifies the rules to Gwath’s questions.

Makes a very roundabout notice of Sally’s vote-explanations: not liking it, Sally looking too eager to cover herself – but if sick then possibly not able to think clearly.

#109
Answers Mac: I mean, if your idea was to encourage the wolves to act silly, and to go after anyone who was being helpful (thus revealing themselves), how did you plan to accuse them– when you'd previously said what they were doing was the hallmark of innocence?

(I admit I have totally lost my track trying to follow this logic... and what’s worse I’m not sure anymore if it is Mac’s logic, Nerwen’s logic or my own that is the weirdest.)

#116
Counters Mac’s conspiracy-theory of herself and Agan trying to help Gwath-wolf by asking why would they need to answer him. But questions Agan’s answer to Gwath as possibly wolf-matish (trying to indicate the other one is overdoing the “not knowing anything” -stuff) – or a wolf trying to lay suspicions on an ordo.

(This indeed looks somewhat suspicious. She ducks the initial question by Mac by kind of “re-asking” why would they need to answer Gwath and then goes on suspecting the other side to the suspicion who is now a known innocent...)

Adds the now famous: Mac will probably jump on me now, and announce that I'm obviously trying to distance myself from my wolf-colleagues.

(A conscious ordo or a bold wolf pre-empting her stance?)

#142
Late from voting but still posting.

Would vote for Mac or Sally. Feels LG is better now and Gwath is a newbie so she wouldn’t like to vote for him either.

(Quite easy choices at that point of the Day – but admittedly the very same I thought the most suspicious by then.)

Questions why Rikae trusts Mac who acts “in a notably peculiar way”. Says that: “far from "misrepresenting" him, I was simply honestly saying what I thought he meant.”

Says: “Sally's vote for Shasta was perhaps the single most wolfish thing anyone has done today.” The problem was the reasons given but again backs off from it with: “this is Sally we're talking about. She's always weird. Also, it seems she's ill, which may account for some of the extra weirdness.”

DAY2

#169 You can read it just up above so comments only...

There's nothing to apologise for with RL-emergencies but why add the clock thing? Also I tend to disagree with her about Mac acting strangely. Mac has been more active participant than in a long time but not strange - wolvish to be sure but also innocentish. I quess this is again one of those things I don't get in this game: why do you think Mac acts weirdly?

~*~

Summa summarum: I don't know. I can now surely see where Mac and Rikae are coming from when suspecting her. The question to me remains which side of the argument is the true one. I have had my doubts, mostly on Mac, and I do have them still. But this needs to be thought of.


Just ot add a few short ones in the end.

I'm continuing to feel Sally's vote yesterDay a suspicious one. Most strongly the fact that her self-proclaimed "random vote" yesterDay hit Shasta and changed toDay into the "safely-picked one" as no one would vote for Shasta. I'm afraid there might be something fishy in there.

I'm lowering my suspicions on LG a bit as her first post yesterDay was just too aggressive - throwing suspicions all around - to be a wolf-post. And she has made a lot of sense since then.

EDIT: x'd Gwath x 2 + Nerwen

[Rikae]

Rikae's confidence not only in Mac's innocence but also in Nerwen's guilt (her reference to "Nerwolf" in her latest post) strikes me as very weird. How can she be so certain, especially after being mistaken about Agan?

I am not certain about Nerwen. I said “It may be that Nerwolf escaped” (italics added). The words “may be” clearly indicate uncertainty, but there is no uncertainty about whether Nerwen escaped, so clearly the uncertain possibility is whether, in fact, Nerwolf escaped, ie, whether Nerwen is a wolf. I do think it's likely, for reasons I'll explain in a moment.


Now, regarding Macalaure, I am indeed quite confident about his innocence, and it has nothing to do with “the rose garden.” Mac is a good player, but I don't think he's good enough to hide his role from me. I know him better than anyone, and I can spot a wolvish Mac. If we had one of those on our hands, I'd be the first to point it out and call for his lynching (as I did in Nogrod's game) I find the implication that I wouldn't vaguely insulting.


Now, why I find Nerwen suspicious (although she is not the only one, especially after some of the nonsense I've witnessed toDay), also concerns Macalaure, because the main thing that bothers me about her is the way she seemed to try and paint his attempt to start a debate as something it wasn't – it didn't read like normal misinterpretation to me, but as misrepresentation.
Added to that is the way she avoided voting, while still managing to look as though she tried to vote. Sure, it could be an honest debate – but wouldn't it be convenient, especially in the light of the fact that the Agan-voters seem to be the only ones under scrutiny toDay? It actually doesn't make sense, because the last place a wolf generally wants to be is in a small group that lynches an innocent. It suits them much better to throw their votes away and remain untraceable – and if they can get away with not voting, they get to cast accusations anywhere they like without having the suspect's innocence revealed.


Speaking of this, I find it extremely unnerving that all the suspicion toDay is directed at the Agan voters while those who did not vote, or who voted safely, get a free ride. I can imagine the wolves laughing in the shadows, while everyone focuses on Mac and I – in fact, I'm the only person, yesterday, who took any risk at all, and yes, my vote basically decided the lynch. I voted for the person who looked most suspicious out of those I could vote for and prevent the lynching of the person who looked most innocent, and that's, after all, all I could do. I'm confident I can read Mac, but this doesn't mean I can read everyone. Still, I'll post my impressions of everyone in a minute, and see if that gets us anywhere.

EDIT: X'd with Noggie/ added spaces (typo)

[Meneltarmacil]

While I believe you would point out a wolfish Mac under normal circumstances, Rikae, I still consider you to be my prime suspect. A wolf would, at best, send a subtle hint to her fellow wolf to get him to keep his head down, or would do nothing at all until she had a chance to PM him at Night. If Mac is not a wolf, you would simply let him live so he'd draw suspicion away from you.

[Nogrod]

I can spot a wolvish Mac. If we had one of those on our hands, I'd be the first to point it out and call for his lynching (as I did in Nogrod's game) I find the implication that I wouldn't vaguely insulting. It's not only money that makes the world go around... :D

I do agree with Rikae that those laying the last and / or deciding votes are normally the most scrutinised the next Day and careful wolves will do anything to avoid getting into that situation. But bold wolves will take it as a test, or excitement, and to further their goals - in a word to have fun. I know it as I've done it myself a few times.

But even you Rikae can't deny that Mac's first posts toDay were terribly wolfy. Check them again if you don't see it. He did indeed get better later the Day but those first ones... I might have let him go and concentrate on other areas if not for those posts.

Still just looking at the situation right now I'd be very happy to see fresh openings. I need to go to sleep myself though (1 AM here).

Losing innocent Agan and Lommy has been bad as they are ones who can make a difference with their keen eyes. I'm getting very careful with my votes and whom I would suggest people should vote - if that had any consequence in the first place. :rolleyes:

[Rikae]

Legate - He's giving me a bad feeling, and it has nothing to do with his insolence. He encourages the focus on the Agan-voters --- which is not particularly good wolf-hunting strategy and something he should know better than to join. He has a way about him that seems to twist people's intentions and describe situations in slanted ways.
McCaber - At this point, he's getting away with lurking in the shadows and contributing exactly nothing.
Sally - I still find her innocentish, though strange and misguided.
Gwathagor - He hasn't done anything to make me think he's a wolf, but he hasn't done anything to make me think him innocent either. I don't find his vote for Aganzir suspicious because she was suspicious, but I do find the sudden way he placed it somewhat questionable.
A Little Green - The whole joking/not joking business yesterday was questionable, and toDay she seems to bring up flimsy reasons for her suspicions.
Macalaure - As I've said, he reads as sincere to me. A word about his 'dammit' - he curses that odd way often, and I thought it was insincere at first too, seeing it in print. You see it isn't when you've heard him speak, and I don't think anything of it.
Nerwen - As I said in my previous post - she looks wolfy to me.
Meneltarmacil - I was determined not to suspect him yesterday, simply because he's easy to wrongly suspect, mostly because of the absolute and determined attitude he takes. I don't know what to make of him --- when he says things like "Aganzir was hardly considered a genuine target before" or "Rikae fell right into [Mac's]trap", I have to think that he couldn't possibly be *that* confused, and that there may be malicious intent there.
Rikae - Hey, that's me!
Shasta - He, even more than McCaber, is getting away with flying under the radar, big time. In such a small village, it really shouldn't be tolerated.

Wolfyest:

Nerwen
Greenie
Legate

Wolfy:
McCaber
Menel
Shasta

Unwolfy:
Sally
Gwath
Mac

EDIT: X'd with Menel and Nogrod

[Rikae]

Whoa - I just left Nogrod off my list! :eek:
Somehow it got erased when I was typing Legate's entry, I think.
Well, there isn't really much to say. I'm glad to see he's posting more toDay, as I was beginning to miss the old Nogrod - he seems up to his old tricks re: Mac and I, but I don't find him suspicious... he goes in the "Unwolfy" category.

[McCaber]

'Tis true, I have been rather close-lipped of late, but that is really due to a lack of time and content then any wolvery on my part. So here I try to provide content:

I suppose it's a cliche to say this now, but I also suspect Nerwen of wolvishry, for much the same reasons as others have said.

Sally still seems off to me, but that may just be Sally being Sally. Sometimes she baffles me.

Menel seems a bit less suspicious now than on the last Day. Something of what he says makes sense, and he conveys what seems to be an honest opinion. He is rather single-minded, but I believe he raises some decent points.

Macalaure and Rikae as a wolf team would be worrying, but I believe Mac is more likely to be one.

This Little Green creature worries me the most. Her speakings yesterDay and toDay do not seem to match up.

And I also await for Shasta to appear. In the meantime, I will rest and think. I will come back with clearer opinions and methodology. Peace in Our Lord.

[Rikae]

McCaber, could you elaborate? Why do you find both Nerwen and Mac suspicious? What doesn't match up about Greenie's posts?

[Gwathagor]

Both Thinlomien and Aganzir voted to execute Macalaure yesterDay, and now both of them are dead. I find this suspicious. Granted, I cast the first vote against Aganzir, but the decisive votes were Macalaure's and Rikae's. Maybe werewolf Macalaure (and possible compatriot Rikae?) found it in their best interests to eliminate his chief accusers?

Sally's over-the-top posting style is so completely impenetrable and obscure that I really don't know what to make of her; however, it would be a decent disguise for a werewolf, if one was to maintain it consistently, as one could simply attribute any discrepancies or oddities to one's posting style.

Shasta and McCaber are only suspicious because they haven't said much, and I'm inclined to think that at least one of the werewolves would be hiding in the shadows, rather than in the midst of the discussion with its fellows. It stands to reason that they wouldn't be found all in one place.

I don't know what to make of the others yet.

[McCaber]

But of course, sister Rikae. First, on Nerwen. Her posts such as I mean, if your idea was to encourage the wolves to act silly, and to go after anyone who was being helpful (thus revealing themselves), how did you plan to accuse them– when you'd previously said what they were doing was the hallmark of innocence? and Sally's vote for Shasta was perhaps the single most wolfish thing anyone has done today. Or rather, not the vote itself, since Shasta was already under a bit of suspicion, but the reasons she gave for it. strike me as a wolf trying to cast suspicion on innocents. She seems waiting for a mistake to pounce on it to try to make an issue of it.

Nogrod and Menel have raised the possibility of a Mac/Rikae wolf team. I do not say that this is impossible, but I think that it is unlikely. Rikae strikes me as slightly more innocent, because such as Let us go for one who flies under the radar, one who doesn't say anything controversial, one who seems eager to not rub people the wrong way. seems too perfect a wolf scheme to pass up. I do realize that this point has been argued about, but it and everything which comes after does not change my suspicions much. Perhaps the interplay between Nerwen and Mac is merely wolves trying to throw the village off. It seems much too serious for that, but perhaps ...

And about this Lily Green. I do not know why she found Gwathagor suspicious on the last Day, and she explained it not. Admittedly, she changed her focus, but it would still be the best to know why she suspected him and not others. That is not the main reason I look at her, but a factor nonetheless. I just find some quality missing in her posts toDay that was there on the last. It seems as if she realized something was not working in her schemes and suddenly switched tactics.

[Gwathagor]

And about this Lily Green. I do not know why she found Gwathagor suspicious on the last Day, and she explained it not. Admittedly, she changed her focus, but it would still be the best to know why she suspected him and not others. That is not the main reason I look at her, but a factor nonetheless. I just find some quality missing in her posts toDay that was there on the last. It seems as if she realized something was not working in her schemes and suddenly switched tactics.

It's possible that A Little Green voted for me because earlier I had voiced suspicions about her. Also, I have been a little erratic thus far; the newbie mask would fit a wolf very well.

[Rikae]

Both Thinlomien and Aganzir voted to execute Macalaure yesterDay, and now both of them are dead. I find this suspicious. Granted, I cast the first vote against Aganzir, but the decisive votes were Macalaure's and Rikae's. Maybe werewolf Macalaure (and possible compatriot Rikae?) found it in their best interests to eliminate his chief accusers?


Well, I think you already said that, actually, Gwath, but I can see why you find it worth repeating, since everyone seems to agree with you.

Actually, I've been wondering how this "meme" of "a wolf among the Aganzir voters" got started, so I think I'll look a little closer at its development.

Gwath started it (in fact, he really started it yesterDay, as he knew Mac and I would both prefer voting for Aganzir to any of the other options):

Since Aganzir was innocent, and the wolves knew she was innocent, it seems likely that one or more of them would have voted to execute her. So, if I'm right, either myself, Rikae, or Macalaure could be a wolf.
I didn't respond to this at the time, because I thought it was an obvious newbie-blunder and didnt need a response. I mean, any experienced player would recognize the likelihood of innocents lynching innocents, especially on day one, right? Not to mention the absurdity of assuming that wolves would vote for someone "because they knew she was innocent", when they knew 10 people were innocent...
but it appears not, because:
About those voters. I think it's probable that there could be a wolf among Aganzir-voters.
No reason given - I suppose you agree with Gwath's reasoning, then, Legate? Or does it just suit your purposes to ensure that the voting is focused on innocents again toDay?
Then Sally decided to one-up Legate and Gwath with:

Honestly, I don't think there's a wolf in that group. I think there's two.
Her explanation being:
a wolf (or wolves for that matter) jumped on the chance to get Agan out of the way.
Now, why exactly the wolves would want to get Agan out of the way, she doesn't say. Why exactly she thinks it's wolfish that I chose to vote for someone I found suspicious, rather than unsuspicious, I don't know -- nor why it's wolfish for Mac to save himself. I'm not saying Sally is a wolf -- I think she probably isn't -- but this is really not good reasoning.
Still, Gwath has said it and Legate gone along with it --- so why shouldn't Sally follow suit?

When corrected by Mac about his "5 minutes" statement (a twisting of the facts that has gone ignored), Legate replies:
Yes, you are right. However, I am aware of the fact that it might have suited a wolf to raise such a last minute bandwaggon - and imagine what would've happened if for example Aganzir were a Seer.

Yeah, sure, but was there, as I said before, any more reason to think Agan was the seer than that Sally, Shasta, Menel or Gwath was? Not that I can see. This is not an argument at all, but amid all the mist that seems to be floating around toDay, it passes for one.

Greenie then joins the crowd -- clearly the "troublesome Aganzir voting issue" needs no further clarification, as it's obvious at this point that a wolf will be found among the Aganzir-voters. Greenie then goes on to raise very insubstantive points against all three... actually, if there were ever a case of a wolf riding the waves in the most deliberately uncontroversial way possible, Greenie's post is a perfect example.

Anyway, from that point forward, almost no one has looked at anyone but Mac. Nogrod seems to think he's a wolf primarily for "downplaying anything we could learn from Lommy's death", but really, Noggie, do you think a wolf-Mac would be so foolish as to kill both people who suspect him? I'm not saying he mightn't do it for other reasons, but he certainly wouldn't do it to eliminate them, and therefore isn't any more likely to be a wolf on that basis than not. I also can't see him saying, under any circumstances, "The wolves tried to frame me!" I wouldn't, anyway, regardless of my role -- it's a silly and defensive thing to say. Open your eyes, Nogrod.

Well, I've written another novel, I fear... but I'm becoming very frustrated with this village. Everyone seems to be piling nonsense on top of nonsense and I'm fairly sure the real wolves are slipping through our fingers (while adding just the right twisted words, here and there, to keep the nonsense going.)

I think we have too many people allowing their suspicions to be influenced by others' opinions rather than by actually reading the posts. For me, the most evil looking players here are those who repeat others' words, or give flimsy reasons to suspect those already suspected - those are wolvish behaviors, and the parties most guilty of this are Greenie and Legate.

EDIT: X'd with McCaber and Gwath

[Gwathagor]

Well, I think you already said that, actually, Gwath, but I can see why you find it worth repeating, since everyone seems to agree with you.

Nope, first time I've mentioned it. It only just occurred to me.

[Rikae]

Sorry to double post, but something just occurred to me:

Gwath started it (in fact, he really started it yesterDay, as he knew Mac and I would both prefer voting for Aganzir to any of the other options):

Why did Gwath choose Agan, after all? He could have voted for anyone -- he hadn't listed any previous suspicions, after all, so he had a "clean slate". However, regardless for which of the people already on the list he voted, he could be pretty sure Mac would follow his vote to save himself. Now, if Gwath knew they were all innocent, he wouldn't want to put himself in a position of being responsible for an innocent's death, would he?

But by choosing someone who didn't have a vote yet, he basically absolved himself of responsibility for anyone's death. It wouldn't be possible for Mac to save himself that way until I followed Gwath's vote, and thus the choice became mine and Mac's rather than Gwath's. He seems to have been well aware of that, too, because he made sure to mention it right off the bat toDay.

I'm beginning to reconsider my suspicions...

EDIT: X'd with Gwath - I suppose that's partly true, since before you only claimed we wanted to eliminate Aganzir because she was innocent, rather than because she suspected Mac - still, same old tune: "Mac and/or Rikae is a wolf". Besides, Nogrod, I believe, already brought up the point of Aganzir and Lommy both suspecting Mac.

[Gwathagor]

Ok, what I meant is it hadn't occurred to me before that the two who voted to execute Macalaure are now dead.

EDIT: Xed with Rikae just now

[Meneltarmacil]

The situation I'm seeing here is this:

We've got a Rikae-Macalaure-Sally team of wolves going on here,.

Rikae was suspicious enough yesterDay, and my suspicion level has jumped quite a bit toDay. She and Macalaure constantly defend one anoother, and as Nogrod and I have observed, they've both been doing a good job of overlooking each other's wolfish aspects.

Sally has been suggested before as a possible third wolf, and I'm inclined to agree based on the voting patterns of Rikae and Mac, something that has been pointed out.

I'm convinced that Rikae is a wolf, and Macalaure is a close second. Sally is a distinct possibility, but I suspect the other two more.

[Rikae]

The situation I'm seeing here is this:

We've got a Rikae-Macalaure-Sally team of wolves going on here,.

Rikae was suspicious enough yesterDay, and my suspicion level has jumped quite a bit toDay. She and Macalaure constantly defend one anoother, and as Nogrod and I have observed, they've both been doing a good job of overlooking each other's wolfish aspects.

Sally has been suggested before as a possible third wolf, and I'm inclined to agree based on the voting patterns of Rikae and Mac, something that has been pointed out.

I'm convinced that Rikae is a wolf, and Macalaure is a close second. Sally is a distinct possibility, but I suspect the other two more.

Menel, yes, we know - but could you explain one thing? Why would Mac and I have voted as we did yesterday if we were wolves together?
Why, in fact, wouldn't I have voted for you? Mac would have followed, and you'd be off my back. :rolleyes:

[Meneltarmacil]

You voted to save your fellow wolves; Macalurefollowed suit. You couldn't vote for me because killing someone who suspected you would make you look like you had something to hide, so you'd been hoping people would have thought it was "Menel being Menel," which is why you'd been calling me a misguided innocent for most of the Day, and since Gwath had voted for someone you'd frequently mentioned as suspicious, voting for Aganzir would have looked legitimate for both of you.

As to why you didn't vote for Sally, it's simple: She's the third Wolf.

[Nerwen]

Rikae, at #184 you're saying that it's pointless to examine the Aganzir votes .

In your next post (#186) you start examining Gwath's vote for Aganzir– saying you're starting to "reconsider your suspicions".

Explain, please.

And also

I mean, any experienced player would recognize the likelihood of innocents lynching innocents, especially on day one, right?

Indeed– and also the likelihood of wolves lynching innocents. Are you seriously surprised that people are looking into it? Really?

Edit: X'd with Menel, Rikae and Menel again.

[Rikae]

Menel, you've suspected me from your very first post, and there has never been a bit of reason in it. I've ignored it until now, but it's getting on my nerves, so let's see – of what does this “wolvishness” of mine consist?


Rikae would seem to be the one most guilty of this "nonsense posting". She makes a post full of jokes, then asks that others contribute to the discussion which she hasn't contributed much to herself.


EDIT: Cross-posted with Rikae.


Yeah, that's right, you cross-posted with me contributing. However, this doesn't change the fact that you find me guilty because (gasp) I didn't post something substantive in the second post of day one.


Now, what could I have posted that would have had substance? Theory, perhaps? No, Menel dislikes theory, apparently:


Rikae continues to worry me, though. She apparently thinks a "conventional vs. weird" debate has merit, and also advocates using gut feelings. Not that there's anything wrong with using instinct, but "I have a gut feeling about him" would be a good way for a wolf to sway the voting without having to make up a reason.


Yep, theory is out. He also seems to think I advocated using “I have a gut feeling” as a reason, when I had specifically said:


I'm not saying we should refrain from giving reasons for our suspicions


Then he goes on to claim:


Oh, and so as to not wander too far from today's business, if Mac was trying to catch a wolf in his net, Rikae appears to have taken the bait.


This is obviously a complete misunderstanding of what Mac said, as Mac explained, but Menel still holds to it as valid, I suppose. Apparently, his reasoning is that because I thought it was reasonable to say conventional, uncontroversial behavior is suspicious, I must be a wolf. Now, if that isn't ridiculous... it *is* reasonable. Uncontroversial behavior *is* suspicious, always has been, always will be, and if this makes me a wolf, it's because I was being uncontroversial by agreeing with it! Of course, I don't think anyone can call me uncontroversial in general...

ToDay, he comes up with:


Then, seeing a vote in play, Rikae jumps in to save Macalaure, followed by the would-be lynchee himself.


Apparently this is why he finds me even more suspicious toDay. Well, I made it clear that I wanted to make sure I could save Macalaure with my vote at the time. Honestly, no other action would have made sense at the time (I can say this until I'm blue in the face and no one will hear me, will they?) I suspected Agan, not Menel, Shasta, Sally or Gwath, and thought Macalaure was the most innocentish of all. I did *not* “jump in” to save Macalaure, though, as I waited for a chance to do so by voting for an actual suspect.



I have noticed, disturbingly, that Rikae and Macalaure have been defending and supporting each other during the entire game and coming up with the exact same suspects, Aganzir and Nerwen.




Well, I've been defending him since I made up my mind he was innocent. I never hid this, and I've explained my thinking already...

EDIT: Crossed with Menel and Nerwen; fixed spacing.

[Rikae]

So, Menel, it makes sense for Mac to lynch someone who suspects him, but not for me to do so?
I could have easily come up with reasons to suspect you if I had wanted to, trust me.:rolleyes: It's coming up with reasons not to that's difficult, but my gut feeling tells me you're innocent.

[Gwathagor]

Rikae seems to be in a bit of a panic; at any rate, she's posted a lot in the last hour or so. Is this because she is innocent? Or is it because I struck a nerve in post #181?

Regarding Rikae's post #186: that is a very good plan that I thought of. Diabolical, in fact. :)

[Rikae]

Rikae, at #184 you're saying that it's pointless to examine the Aganzir votes .

In your next post (#186) you start examining Gwath's vote for Aganzir– saying you're starting to "reconsider your suspicions".

Explain, please.

I didn't say being an Aganzir voter made one innocent. I didn't even say it was pointless to examine us. What I disagree with is the fact that onlyAganzir voters are being examined, and everyone seems to have made up their minds (against all reason I can see), that there must be a wolf among them.


Indeed– and also the likelihood of wolves lynching innocents. Are you seriously surprised that people are looking into it? Really?


I am definitely suprised that people seem to be dead certain there is a wolf among the three of us. If you honestly think that an innocent being lynched on day one means wolves must have voted for her, you haven't played much Werewolf. It would have been the easiest thing in the world for the wolves to avoid that spotlight- - it only took three votes. To put that in perspective, three people didn't vote at all (and you were one of them, no?) I wouldn't be surprised if there was a wolf or two among the non-voters (Nerwen, Menel & McCaber) and one or two among the safe-voters. That is, after all, where wolves generally prefer to be.

Remember, wolves don't really care who gets lynched, as long as it isn't one of their own (and even then, they're liable to turn on the one who's going down.) They don't need to jump into the middle of close races... they can sit back and watch the innocents lynch each other, which is statistically more probable than lynching a wolf.

[Rikae]

Rikae seems to be in a bit of a panic; at any rate, she's posted a lot in the last hour or so. Is this because she is innocent? Or is it because I struck a nerve in post #181?


You absolutely did - my last nerve. There's only so much balderdash and group-think I can tolerate before I get annoyed.

[Meneltarmacil]

No, it would certainly make sense for both you and Mac to lynch somebody that you'd been frequently mentioning as being suspicious. Aganzir featured regularly in both of your suspect lists, while you kept saying that I was innocent. Suddenly reversing direction on me would look really suspicious, like you were going after me solely because I suspected you, and flip-flopping like that is hardly considered a good sign. Voting for Aganzir, whom both of you had been building a case against, looks a lot better.

Edit: Cross-posted with Rikae.

[Rikae]

No, it would certainly make sense for both you and Mac to lynch somebody that you'd been frequently mentioning as being suspicious.
Maybe because we found her suspicious? :eek:

Aganzir featured regularly in both of your suspect lists, while you kept saying that I was innocent.
That certainly wasn't something I had to do, as you were saying weird things from your very first post.

[Gwathagor]

You absolutely did - my last nerve. There's only so much balderdash and group-think I can tolerate before I get annoyed.

The feel of the noose settling about one's neck would be enough to make anyone panic, whether wolf or human, but maybe your distress was a bit premature for an innocent human? It's hard to say, and I'm not certain either way. Let the wise confer.

[Gwathagor]

I am definitely suprised that people seem to be dead certain there is a wolf among the three of us. If you honestly think that an innocent being lynched on day one means wolves must have voted for her, you haven't played much Werewolf. It would have been the easiest thing in the world for the wolves to avoid that spotlight- - it only took three votes. To put that in perspective, three people didn't vote at all (and you were one of them, no?) I wouldn't be surprised if there was a wolf or two among the non-voters (Nerwen, Menel & McCaber) and one or two among the safe-voters. That is, after all, where wolves generally prefer to be.

This is a good argument.

[satansaloser2005]

Why does Menel seem to like this strange pairing of Mac, Rikae, and I? It truly makes no sense. Yes, I did say that it was possible, even probable that they were werewolves together. Why is that conceivable? Because no one would guess that they would do something so obvious as to vote together and watch each other's backs, etc.


As to why you didn't vote for Sally, it's simple: She's the third Wolf.

....Or because, as I've stated before, I'm too juicy to get rid of. If Rikae and Mac are two of the wolves, there's basically no chance I'm the third. It doesn't fit together at all, if you think about it more. They can't let one of the other top suspects die; it would be foolish.



Quite a post from Rikae back there. I do believe she's flustered, which you already knew, but I'd like to know why. Everyone seems to be catching their share of suspicions today, so why should you (or I for that matter) be any different?

Sorry, need to go through the posts again. I just keep scrolling down and responding to what catches my eye. Lots of good points made since I went to work, and I'll need a bit to sift through them all. Back in a bit. I need to prepare some tax stuff and maybe get a bit of Theraflu before my throat decides to wreak havoc on the whole campus.

[Rikae]

The feel of the noose settling about one's neck would be enough to make anyone panic, whether wolf or human, but maybe your distress was a bit premature for an innocent human? It's hard to say, and I'm not certain either way. Let the wise confer.

That is a strange thing to say when the noose was around Mac's neck, as far as I can see, and not mine.

I am getting so fed up with this game. I'm really on the verge of quitting - I mean, what's the point? I talk and talk, and everyone ignores me. It doesn't matter how many times I've been right in the past, everyone goes along with some wacky argument someone else comes up with, even though it has no substance to it. When you lynch Macalaure and find him innocent, will you remember what I said? Oh no, I'm just blinded by my emotions; I don't know what I'm talking about. Bah -- I'm sick of it. No one listens to reason, dammit (boy am I glad to know I can get away with saying that here!)

EDIT: X'd with Sally

[Meneltarmacil]

Aye, let the wise confer. I'll be leaving this place for the night ('tis looking much like a battlefield lately, I might add)

(OOC: I'm sorry if I'm really being too hard on you, Rikae, regardless of the fur and fangs.)

EDIT: Cross-posted with Rikae.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Personally, at the moment I'm seeing Rikae's irritation with the village as a whole to be quite innocent. However, I'm not quite sure what to make of her absolute assurance that she can spot a lycan Macalaure. The killing of Lommy left a solid trail right back to Mac, this is true. In my opinion, though, Mac's experienced enough and daring enough to attempt such a bold double-bluff.

Sally and Lily seem to be at each other's throats - in a civilized manner. Or rather, Lily is defending herself against Sally; I wonder how much of what Sally says we can actually trust? She said yesterday that her vote on me was random, yet today she says she purposely did it because it was a "safe vote", that she was sure I wouldn't get lynched. Most of that can probably be put down towards her sickness... but one does wonder, doesn't one?

I do have to say, Nogrod could be considered to be "flying under the radar" in terms of post content, if not numbers. In all the controversy I've observed today (Rikae-Mac-Nerwen, Sally-Lily, Rikae-Menel) I don't recall him being in the middle of anything, but rather on the edges.

I'll come up with more in a bit; I'm pretty sick right now, so I'm lying here in bed with nothing to do but read the thread. :) Sorry for being gone so long; I've been at rehearsal since 4:00 PM, and it's now nearly 10:00 PM.

Edit: X'd with Menel, Rikae, Gwath x2, Sally, Rikae, and Menel again.

[Rikae]

Quite a post from Rikae back there. I do believe she's flustered, which you already knew, but I'd like to know why. Everyone seems to be catching their share of suspicions today, so why should you (or I for that matter) be any different?


I'm not different, but Mac is, maybe. Sorry about it, but it really gets me riled to see him being framed like this (that's how I see it), when he really made more effort to help than anyone. Maybe I am a bit touchy, where he's concerned. I can't help it... :(

EDIT: X'd with Shasta

[Meneltarmacil]

Excuse the double-post.

Rikae[/B]]When you lynch Macalaure and find him innocent, will you remember what I said?
Now I had been considering the idea that Mac was innocent and being misled by wolf-Rikae, but decided it better not to mention it then and see how things went. Now, though, I think it's best to say it.

I'll excuse myself for now.

EDIT: Cross posted with Rikae and Shasta.

[Rikae]

Excuse the double-post.


Now I had been considering the idea that Mac was innocent and being misled by wolf-Rikae, but decided it better not to mention it then and see how things went. Now, though, I think it's best to say it.

I'll excuse myself for now.

EDIT: Cross posted with Rikae and Shasta.

As if it would help me as a wolf. :rolleyes:
I would just like a little credit once in a while.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Question, Menel.

Why Aganzir? If Rikae and Mac are wolves together, and Mac was about to be executed, why wait for Gwath to vote Aganzir? Why not just vote you or me? We both had one vote at that point. It seems like waiting for another execution-option, when there were at least two readily available, would have been a bit risky, time-wise, if Macwolf's life was on the line and Rikaewolf could have saved him.

[satansaloser2005]

As if it would help me as a wolf. :rolleyes:
I would just like a little credit once in a while.

Quick post, the calm before the storm.

Think on the bright side, love. YesterDay I almost got lynched because I had a high fever. :mad: Now THAT would have been another reason to be quite perturbed. Moving on then....expect a double post my friends....probably some silliness too. It is me after all.... ;)



edit just to avoid a triple post: Shasta, in the event you have the flu that's been going around (don't know what part of the country you're in, but it's been around the midwest something terrible) drag yourself down to Walmart and buy some Halls Breezers cough drops, a bit of Theraflu, and an expletive ton of Vicks. You'll be feeling back to your old self by Friday. In the event that doesn't work, simply accept my wishes that you feel better.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Double post, my apologies. I went back to get the full voting record.

Sally -> Shasta (Shasta 1)
Shasta -> Menel (Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Legate -> Sally (Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Aganzir -> Mac (Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Mac 1)
Lommy -> Mac (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1)
Lily -> Gwath (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)
Gwath -> Aganzir (Mac 2, Sally 1, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1, Aganzir 1)
Nogrod -> Sally (Mac 2, Sally 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1, Aganzir 1)
Rikae -> Aganzir (Mac 2, Sally 2, Aganzir 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)
Mac -> Aganzir (Aganzir 3, Mac 2, Sally 2, Shasta 1, Menel 1, Gwath 1)

So you see, even more than myself or Menel, it would have been extremely easy for a wolfish Rikae and Mac team to slam votes on Sally and save Mac from the Gallows. Gwath was also a choice.

Say the wolves are Rikae, Mac, and Sally. Mac is close to being executed. Obviously, Rikaewolf and Macwolf are the only ones in position to save Macwolf, since Sallywolf voted early, and votes aren't retractable. So piling votes on Sally is out. Probably not a smart idea, either, to double-vote me, since that would place all three wolfish votes on the same person, leading to suspicion. That leaves Aganzir, Menel, and Gwath. Aganzir was the last of those three to even become a voting option, so why would Rikaewolf and Macwolf wait until the last second to lynch Aganzir when it would have been much safer to do the same thing to Menel or Gwath?

I apologize if my posts seem to be redundant, I just keep finding better and better ways to say what I mean.

Edit: X'd with Sally. *adopts an Okie drawl* Actually, I live in Oklahoma, that's part of the Midwest. Thank y'all frr that home remedy, I maht just trah that. ;)

[Meneltarmacil]

Gah! Why do I keep checking this thread? It's late! I should be taking a shower and getting to bed!

(By the way, staying up late on the Downs when I should be getting sleep was assigned to Orthanc by me quite a while ago.) :rolleyes:

...Oh well. I guess I'm just too interested in the game. As I've said before, Aganzir was on both of their suspicion lists. Voting for anybody but Aganzir or Nerwen would attract suspicion for flip-flopping, as Rikae had said I was innocent, and I don't recall either her or Mac saying much about Gwath. Having two people flip-flop onto the same person would look too wolfish.

OK, I'm really leaving this time! And I'm turning off the computer too!

[Gwathagor]

Rikae's distress sounds genuinely innocent to me. I can't help thinking that a wolf would be much calmer. Anyway, it won't do to let the other players avoid scrutiny. We have 10 possible wolves here, let's consider them all.

[Rikae]

...Oh well. I guess I'm just too interested in the game. As I've said before, Aganzir was on both of their suspicion lists. Voting for anybody but Aganzir or Nerwen would attract suspicion for flip-flopping, as Rikae had said I was innocent, and I don't recall either her or Mac saying much about Gwath. Having two people flip-flop onto the same person would look too wolfish.


There isn't really an answer to this, as it applies to any responsibly-voting ordo. If voting for someone one suspects is wolfish, well, heaven help us.

At any rate, if, after I've gone to all this trouble for his sake, Mac turns out to be a wolf, he will be in the proverbial doghouse. :p

And now, I'm off to bed too... let the midwesterners confer...

EDIT: X'd with Gwath

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I guess Lommy has been killed because I was her main suspect. She yet did not do any harm to a wolf, so better get rid of her before she eventually starts to. It sadly means that we can deduce little to nothing from her death.
Of course I'm setting myself as an innocent - that's the only thing I know for certain. Since I was Lommy's main suspect, no wolf was, but since she's a crafty player, she was going to be a problem for one or more wolves eventually. It seems like a pretty straightforward kill to me.
Of course it would also make sense for them to kill someone who's on their track, but apparently these wolves did not think so.
Your sentence is clear, but it's completely illogical:
If I was a wolf, then she does leave a highway of a track - towards me! ;)

Mac, all these quotes say the same thing to me; that you're making awfully certain that we know that Lommy's death makes you suspicious. Support for a double-bluff theory?

Edit: X'd with Gwath and Rikae.

[Rikae]

Mac, all these quotes say the same thing to me; that you're making awfully certain that we know that Lommy's death makes you suspicious. Support for a double-bluff theory?

Edit: X'd with Gwath and Rikae.

(I'm never going to get to bed either, Menel.)

It's funny you should say that, Shasta, when Nogrod said the opposite (that Mac downplayed the idea of Lommy's death pointing to him.) I don't know what to make of it, just thought I'd point it out. Of course, I think he's actually responding to Nogrod in some of those.

(You won't get an answer from him soon - it's 5:30 am where he is!)

[Gwathagor]

It wouldn't surprise me.

EDIT: Cross-posted with RIkae; I was replying to Shastanis

[Shastanis Althreduin]

((In character altruistic post coming up. :O))

Shasta jumped nimbly down from his boulder, where he'd been standing for the past half hour. "You should get some sleep, Rikae," he said worriedly, taking her temperature. "No sense catching some bug that could float... across the sea, but still!"

[Nerwen]

Rikae's distress sounds genuinely innocent to me. I can't help thinking that a wolf would be much calmer.

Not necessarily, by any means.

Anyway, it won't do to let the other players avoid scrutiny. We have 10 possible wolves here, let's consider them all.

Yes... but we can only lynch one at a time. However:

I do have to say, Nogrod could be considered to be "flying under the radar" in terms of post content, if not numbers. In all the controversy I've observed today (Rikae-Mac-Nerwen, Sally-Lily, Rikae-Menel) I don't recall him being in the middle of anything, but rather on the edges.


There's one little thing I noticed. YesterDay Nogrod said this:

Now am I the only only one who thinks this is fishy indeed? Why did Mac back away from a most reasonable position into this scheming-thingy after being suspected?

But toDay he says this:

Also I tend to disagree with her [me] about Mac acting strangely. Mac has been more active participant than in a long time but not strange - wolvish to be sure but also innocentish. I quess this is again one of those things I don't get in this game: why do you think Mac acts weirdly?

Otherwise Nogrod has sounded innocent enough– but that seems like a pretty glaring contradiction. I’d like to hear what he has to say about it.

Now I had been considering the idea that Mac was innocent and being misled by wolf-Rikae, but decided it better not to mention it then and see how things went. Now, though, I think it's best to say it.

I’ve been considering it too. Also the reverse case– i.e. an innocent Rikae and a wolvish Mac. That’s the trouble. Lynching one of them may not shed much light on the other’s rôle.

Edit: closed tags.
Edit 2: fixed wrongly-attributed quote.

[Gwathagor]

Not necessarily, by any means.

Hmm. Ok.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Nerwen, one of those posts you quoted isn't mine, it's Gwath's.

[satansaloser2005]

Sally took a sip of her lovely raspberry tea and looked at the confused, tired, and increasingly aggravated faces around her.

"What seems to be the trouble all? Having difficulties detecting the wolves? Perhaps I can be of assistance, as my senses are slowly returning to me." She looked around and saw several people looking at Rikae with suspicious eyes, as the woman sat by Mac, making quite a nice-looking pair of suspects. Rikae stared the others down as if to tell them she had about had it with their accusations. "Isn't anyone going to listen to me? Okay fine, you asked for it...." Sally began to sing. "I can see wolfies now, the fever is gone. I can see all the arguing in my way. I can see baddies now, my eyes will (sort of) focus again. It's going to be a cold, wonderful barrow downs sort of day." The others settled into their seats and (finally) took a serious look at what Sally had to say. "That's right, little ones. I have something to say. Some wolfies and their allies thought they'd shut me up yesterDay while I was still sick, but I shall prevail, and now the furry ones will pay. Allow me to address you individually, starting with one of you who seems to be at odds with me. This is not the case, Stepmother Lily. I think you possess the potential to be furry, but at the moment you seem to be innocent, or at least to have shaved yourself quite nicely. As for the rest of you, I have brought flashcards and diagrams so that you may understand my points better, as several of you seem to have trouble following my logic. So begins my lesson...."



Shasta: I know you weren't complaining, but I want to clear this crap up once and for all and for everyone. I voted you yesterday because like I said it was a safe vote. Let me explain that to you all, just in case you missed it the last two or three times I explained it. Since I've been sick, I didn't want to risk not voting yesterDay and then have some kind of unfortunate circumstance and be unable to vote again toDay (thus risking modfire), so I had to vote in one form or another. I was not in my right mind, and so I didn't want to vote for anyone who I knew I could absentmindedly hand over to the wolves. Shasta had garnered a bit of attention, but not enough I thought (correctly mind you) to be killed, so he seemed like a good choice. I still think he's innocent.

Agan: yes, she's dead I know. I still can't get over it. Rikae, I know you're getting sick of the attention, but I just find that SO bloody wolfish. You can't deny it. I'm going to table that little incident for now, but unfortunately I just can't shake it. Sorry.

Noggie: He's been too quiet. Granted, it's really easy to get lost in all this banter and frustrated arguing, but he slips in commentary here and there and it's not even necessarily consistent, saying one thing and then endorsing the opposite. This bothers me much.

Mac and Rikae: I've talked about them, so have the others, so I'm leaving them out of my analysis, at least for the most part. Comes down to this: they are indeed defending each other and sharing suspects, but perhaps great minds just think alike? I think at this point I'm just mad that people aren't listening to poor Rikae, as she has made some good points, so as I mentioned above, I'm backing off (at least from her) for now and letting her have some time to collect more thoughts and convince me one way or the other about her role. Mac, though? I'm still leaning majorly toward wolf. I still don't like the whole "Five minutes until deadline? Plenty of time to bump off Agan! C'mon, Rikae, help me out here. Let's kill her while she's not looking." That's just the impression I'm getting. I know he mentioned her being suspicious before, but the vote itself comes out of the blue.

Menel: He rubs me the wrong way. I don't think it's because he's after me, because that normally wouldn't phase me, but he just seems to want me in a wolf trio really REALLY badly. And the one he puts me in doesn't make sense, so I'm inclined to believe that he could be of the furry persuasion.

Nerwen, Legate, Cabbie: I'm leaning innocent, if only because I can't get a read off them. I'll know more about Cabbie once he posts more stuff, and Legate and Nerwen seem confused by everything that's going on, so I'm inclined to think them innocent just based on their naivete.

Greenie: Just in case you missed it. Putting Greenie in as a third was a joke, as earlier she had made that error misjudging my post and I felt like teasing her for it. I'm leaning innocent on her too, although she seems too eager to be able to defend herself, so I may have to rethink this one.

Gwath: Poor kid's a victim of circumstance, or at least that's my view so far. I'm not saying he's innocent necessarily, but if he is he got played by the wolves when it came to yesterDay's votes.


Okay, then. That's all I have for now. I've probably left someone out, for which I apologize, but at least now no one can say that I haven't been clear.

[Nerwen]

Nerwen, one of those posts you quoted isn't mine, it's Gwath's.

Oh dear. You're quite right. I'll fix it. I don't know how that happened. Sorry about that. I've had a lot of distractions today.

Edit: There. Fixed.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

It's midnight. The deadline (for me) is 10 AM. Normally, I would be in class, so I would have to vote now. However, today's class was cancelled, so I'm going to do my damnedest to be on again before execution. However (again), I'm so tired that I may not wake up, and if I do wake up, I may not remember to check BD. (Sorry again!)

I was going to give out my MSN here in case someone who lives in the same timezone as the host would like to poke me (actually, with the number of WW games I've played here, everyone should have it, but the only person I've used it with is Diamond18), but I didn't know if that would be rule-breaking of some sort. Could someone clarify for me?

[Roa_Aoife]

So long as you don't discuss anything, it would be fine to ask another player to wake you up. I'd do it, but I'm 3 hours behind you and far more likely to be asleep.

[satansaloser2005]

I'd be happy to help you out. I have to be to work around DL time, so I'd be checking right before then and could foist you out of bed. ;)

[satansaloser2005]

Hmmmmm. Alrighty then. It seems as though everyone has gone to bed, or whatever it is you do at this time of day/night. I'm going to head to bed. Unless my phone dies in the night, I'll be back to vote, hopefully with Shasta in tow. :P

Night all :)

[Macalaure]

Very good analysis of Nerwen by Nogrod. I'm less convinced of her guilt today, actually, and more confused by her.

The way Rikae has been defending me further convinces me of her innocence. She wouldn't do it like that if she was a wolf. Even if we both were wolves (which some suspect) she wouldn't do it that way. There's been a lot of misunderstandings and misrepresentations in what has been said about her and my positions, and while I've grown tired of defending myself against them, I can certainly understand why it's so unsettling for Rikae.

It's worrisome that some people exclusively focus on Rikae and me. Doing it is not necessarily suspicious, but in any case it is not sensible. One of these cases would be Menel. I think his tone is very innocent-sounding, but his one-sided approach toDay isn't going to actually help us. More diversity and objectivity, please. :)

Now that McCaber has spoken more, I can say I'm not worried by him. Gwathagor is somehow confusing to me, but I don't think he's too suspicious.

Something strikes me wrong about Legate. I cannot put my finger on it yet. I think that Rikae raised some good points on him in #184 which might get overlooked because of her defensiveness.

(ps: I only read til the end of page 5 yet)

[Nerwen]

If the stone burial chamber had seemed forbidding before, it was doubly so now that Nerwen was alone in it.

"Or– am I?" She glanced quickly over her shoulder. Had she seen a flicker of movement out of the corner of her eye? A trace, perhaps, of something furry? "Just imagining things," she decided.

Shivering with more than just the cold, she continued, "Seems I'm talking to myself here... They say it's the first sign of madness. Ah well. Can't be helped."

Now, as to Rikae– I share her frustration with the way toDay has gone. We seem to have spent most of it debating possible Mac-Rikae scenarios, and not much else. The thing is, though, that much of that is due to Rikae herself, arguing on and on and on and making herself look worse and worse in the process.

The general impression I’m getting is that their main goal is simply to keep each other alive at all costs. By which I mean, more than you’d expect even from a pair of wolves.

So what’s going on? Is RL playing a part?

Is it possible that Farael has included secret roles (e.g. Lovers)?

Is Sally on to something when she suggests:

Yes, I did say that it was possible, even probable that they were werewolves together. Why is that conceivable? Because no one would guess that they would do something so obvious as to vote together and watch each other's backs, etc.

This is worth thinking about. They're certainly bold enough to try a double-bluff– and dare we ignore the fact that both Mac-voters are now dead? (But of course, it could as easily be a frame-up.)

I will look at some other people next.

Edit: X'd with Macalaure.

[Nerwen]

To clarify something in my previous post, when I say "a frame-up" I am of course talking about Lommy's death.

[Nerwen]

Something strikes me wrong about Legate. I cannot put my finger on it yet. I think that Rikae raised some good points on him in #184 which might get overlooked because of her defensiveness.

Are you referring to this?:

For me, the most evil looking players here are those who repeat others' words, or give flimsy reasons to suspect those already suspected - those are wolvish behaviors, and the parties most guilty of this are Greenie and Legate.

It's a thought. I'll have a look at those two.

[Macalaure]

I don't see the sense in Sally's post #201. If Rikae and I were wolves, it would make perfect sense that she's the third one. I know of course that the premise is wrong, but her argument is not valid in my opinion. Not only because of this Sally no longer gives me that innocent feeling anymore. I can't elaborate at the moment (ooc: I'll be posting from my office til the deadline).

I am getting so fed up with this game. I'm really on the verge of quitting - I mean, what's the point? I talk and talk, and everyone ignores me.No reason to quit. Things like that have happened to many others before, too. Frustrating, yes, but part of the game. :)

I see Shasta as innocent and sensible.


Right now I have a bunch of semi-suspects (Legate, Lily, Nerwen, Sally), but nothing solid. Unfortunately, while being around, I won't have the opportunity to look into anything more deeply...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Oh my, who is supposed to read romans like that?

Okay, following what I picked during the course of reading and noted down, so there may be a little mess in it:

I think Noggins makes good sense, only is somewhat unnecessarily picky in his analysis of Nerwen. Things like this:
There's nothing to apologise for with RL-emergencies but why add the clock thing?
Why not? I don't see anything on that and if it is not anything (and I doubt it is), then why are you mentioning it?

Good to see both Shasta and McCaber is participating more now, and they look that they are trying at least to be helpful. I don't notice anything particularly suspicious on either of them, but still, if possible, I'd like to see more input from them.

I find it hard to make any opinions on Nerwen and LG. I would like to see them posting more, as it is hard to make much about them from the little they post.

All right, now I am getting to the part about Rikae. First and foremost, Rikae, I would like to say that I don't mean anything here against you personally and so I hope you also do not/did not take anything I say/said offensively, because anyway, I don't mean it like that - I am merely stating my in-game opinions (and if I seem to hold to an opinion that is different from yours, you can simply say to yourself: "well, he obviously is totally out of his mind" and that's it).

I am not sure where Rikae took the suspicion of me from. I just wanted to write that her post #175 looks innocentish to me, and then I read this.
He has a way about him that seems to twist people's intentions and describe situations in slanted ways.
May I ask what exactly did I seem to twist, or what I described in slanted ways?

Actually, I've been wondering how this "meme" of "a wolf among the Aganzir voters" got started, so I think I'll look a little closer at its development.
I said it's probable not because I'd agree with Gwath. I think his explanation is somewhat too easy, I mean, I find it somewhat improbable that wolves would say: "This one suspects us, let's kill him." It will immediately point to them. This is also what I meant when replying to Mac - and that I hope to be the final answer to your question, Mac - that the primary reason was not simply "Hullo guys, I need to get rid of someone". Speaking of it, the way Mac kept bringing up this makes me think that it is on purpose and that there may be indeed double-bluffing by saying "It would point to me".

Yeah, sure, but was there, as I said before, any more reason to think Agan was the seer than that Sally, Shasta, Menel or Gwath was? Not that I can see. This is not an argument at all, but amid all the mist that seems to be floating around toDay, it passes for one.

Oh my, what's THIS? Rikae, you either totally misunderstood me, or you are simply twisting the facts! I was not saying Agan was voted for because someone thought she was the Seer. I spoke about the danger of such voting happening IF the voted person were a Seer. This was totally unrelated to the topic. What are you trying to make of it?

And Rikae, I am not "dead certain" that there is a wolf among Agan-voters, I only said I find it likely. If only statistically.

Is it possible that Farael has included secret roles (e.g. Lovers)?
In the rules there is plainly written "no twists", so I think it's safe to assume there's nothing like that.

Okay... there has been a lot said and I can't react to everything. I hope to have time to go through everything yet, but for now, my main suspicion stays where it was with Mac and I hope to have some responses from Rikae. However, and this is what I would like to end, it has been rightly pointed out here that we should not concentrate only on several subjects, as there has been a lot going on toDay only around some people, and wolves may be hiding also elsewhere. That much I acknowledge and I hope now to heed this myself and look more deeply on those I have less idea about.

[Meneltarmacil]

I think I'll vote somewhat early; most of my points have been said already and mornings aren't exactly the best times to analyze things.

I'm quite convinced that

++Rikae

is a Werewolf here.

[Macalaure]

Oh my, who is supposed to read romans like that?

I'd like to see more input from them.
..
I would like to see them posting moreThis just made me grin. :D

RL is keeping me from elaborating on it. I can only say now that I don't find Legate's points too convincing. I'll say more about it tomorrow if I still live and it's still relevant.

[Nerwen]

Analysis of Legate of Amon Lanc:

Only one post on Day 1 (#108):

Expresses concern about "the strange joke-or-not-joke talkers" (Sally, Little Green and Shasta). Agrees with Aganzir that Mac's idea of lynching a "conventional" person is a bad one. Says that Rikae, Aganzir, Lommy and Gwathagor seem innocent, and that he is unsure of Mac, Menel, McCaber, Nogrod and me.

Votes Sally because her explanation of her vote for Shasta sounds wolfish.

This post comes straight after mine (#107), in which I said:

Anyone else not like that last post of Sally's? She seems very eager to cover herself, doesn't she?

But Legate says his post crossed with mine (and others). Besides, I don’t think it took much to see Sally as suspicious at that point. I see it as not so much an easy vote as a logical one.

Day 2.

(#149)
Speculates why Lommy was killed– to leave no tracks, because ahe was dangerous to the wolves, or perhaps as a suspected Seer.

Posts a voting list for the previous Day. Says there might have been a wolf among the Aganzir voters– If so, it was probably not Gwathagor and was most likely Mac– on the other hand Sally and Rikae could be wolves together, with Rikae jumping on the Aganzir wagon.

(#155)
(Replying to Mac, who pointed out that Aganzir was already under suspicion) says that "it might have suited a wolf to raise such a last minute bandwaggon - and imagine what would've happened if for example Aganzir were a Seer." Says that he does not rule Gwathagor out, but repeats that Mac and Rikae are more likely to be wolves.

Says Mac gives him "a bad feeling" because of his comments about Lommy and Aganzir. [I agree with this.] Suggests that Lommy's death was a double-bluff.

Is still puzzled by Sally.

(#166)

(Replying to Mac, who said he did not understand his position on the Lommy kill) Says that he thinks Mac killed Lommy both to leave no tracks and to eliminate someone who suspected him. [Note: this appears to be self-contradictory and needs further explanation.]

Draws attention to the way Mac and Rikae defend each other. [Already noted by Menel and Greenie.]

Says Nogrod makes sense but that Sally makes him wonder.

Suggests that Mac, Sally and Rikae might be the wolves.

General comments: Plays it very safe indeed. This would be a good strategy for a wolf, yes– but also just a good strategy. There's really nothing there to seize on. As it stands, I'll pass Legate.

Edit: X'd with Mac, Legate, Menel and Mac again.

[Nerwen]

I find it hard to make any opinions on Nerwen and LG. I would like to see them posting more, as it is hard to make much about them from the little they post.

What? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!:D

[Nogrod]

Oh my Gawd you've been productive while I've been away!

I try to get myself level with the discussion but it may take a few moments...

[Nogrod]

Well, Rikae you must now understand how I feel sometimes during a game when there seems to be an andless flow of "points" coming from left and right and no reasonable explanation seems to work... :confused:

If Rikae and Mac indeed are wolves they are gaining my appreciation of a very-very bold and convincing play.

I do have my doubts about Mac still. My strongest point against him seems to be that the wolves needed to get rid of a possible seer (the thing both Rikae and Mac tried to downplay as the very first things when the Day broke!). Remember the seer had a dream on Night1 before the game actually started and if Lommy was right the wolves needed to check it and silence her. Mac's posts in the beginning of the Day just suited perfectly a wolf trying to clean his trail which he was forced to leave - so it's not a question whther he chose to be bold but that he couldn't aford not killing Lommy. Suggesting Agan was convenient as he was well aware Rikae suspected her.

But I'm inclined to think that Rikae sounds quite genuine indeed - or then she fakes it in a superb fashion.

But it's only Day2 and I'm still a bit reluctant to lynch Mac either because were he innocent we would suffer a great loss. I know this might be stupid. He's the one I really know why to vote at this point but it's perfectly possible we're being messed up here.

To me it depends on the choises we have toDay. But I'd love to see new ideas - or to get them myself.

One hour then. I'll try to look after a few hunches.

PS. To all you questioning my relative silence... "I'm in. But don't expect me to flood the discussion this time. I think it's a high time for me to try and change my tactics in these Werewolf games. Let's see if I manage to do that..." There was an ironic smile in his face as he shook his head. "Let's see..."I didn't quite manage it last night (RL) though. As I quessed.

[Gwathagor]

Unfortunately, I have to vote now, as my geology lab will keep me occupied until well after the deadline. So:

++Sally

[Macalaure]

Maybe I'm starting to see ghosts (who'd be surprised, given our setting), but Nerwen's rather toothless analysis/summary of Legate gives me the bad feeling that the two could be in cahoots.

[Nogrod]

Gwath's choice of Aganzir yesterDay in the end of the Day is neatly safe as Rikae suggested. I also find her tune Rikae seems to be in a bit of a panic; at any rate, she's posted a lot in the last hour or so. Is this because she is innocent? Or is it because I struck a nerve in post #181?quite bad. Like a wolf who gets a bit carried away seeing his target in trouble. Just adding wood into the fire without actually committing anything? The wolves love to do this kind of pushes.

In #183 he says, answering why LG voted for him: Also, I have been a little erratic thus far; the newbie mask would fit a wolf very well.I do find it interesting that he first of all goes on to explain why LG voted him (McCaber had been suspecting LG for her vote) and this self-conscious talk about newbie mask fitting a wolf looks... well, odd.


I still dislike the way Sally changed her "random vote" to a "deliberate pick causing the least damage" after the Night had passed. Like she was advised or tohught the bettr of it after eeing how much she was susected because of that random vote.

Oh my... so little time left. Ideas anyone? We should not wrtie novels at this time as no one has time to read them until later.

[satansaloser2005]

Well, that came out of nowhere. Anyway, moving on....



I still find Noggie a bit odd. Thanks for (sort of) explaining your lack of whirlwind posting though. Puts me at ease a tiny bit, or at least enough to not vote you today. Ack, what to do, what to do? I need to take a brief pause for thought....

[Nogrod]

Now this is ridiculous! Twenty minutes left and two votes given!

Menel -> Rikae
Gwath -> Sally

Or have I missed something?

Speak your minds people. We don't need any last minute frenzies.

[Nerwen]

I wanted to look at A Little Green, Nogrod and Sally, but time is running out.

I will say now that, unless I can find some compelling reason to do otherwise, I will vote for either Mac, Rikae or Sally.

Mac sounded horribly wolfish at the start of the Day. But if anything, Rikae was even worse later, what with all the thrashing around and the sophistry. I mean, sure, all three Agan–voters might easily have been innocent. But the rest of us can hardly be expected to assume that! (see #184)

On the other hand, she was under fire from Menel from the start of the Day, and other people, so maybe she just panicked. The frustration in her last posts sounds rather genuine.

Sally continues to confuse the hell out of me, and I don’t like either her original explanation of her Shasta-vote, or the new improved version.

So... which?

Edit: X'd with Nogrod, Sally and Nogrod again.

[satansaloser2005]

I still dislike the way Sally changed her "random vote" to a "deliberate pick causing the least damage" after the Night had passed. Like she was advised or tohught the bettr of it after eeing how much she was susected because of that random vote.

I'm sick of explaining myself for that, because I didn't do anything wrong. So I'm not doing it anymore. If you don't like the way my brain works when I'm ill, kill me. Sorry to be rude, but I've had about enough of people finding me suspicious because I found my recovery sleep more important than explaining a vote which I'd already sort of explained. Hehe. That and I'm really not a morning person. *shuts up about it for now*



I just can't decide, and I need to because if I don't leave in like ten minutes I'll be late for work. Any last minute weigh-ins from the group? After all, the deadline is in twenty minutes and there have been only two votes. Come on people, don't delay too much. *mutters* Like I should talk....

[Rikae]

Well – Legate:

First, the “repeatedly” about the vote count. It may have been a mistake, but it could also be a way of wording the intro to the corrected vote count to insinuate it was deliberately posted wrong.



I am aware of the fact that it might have suited a wolf to raise such a last minute bandwaggon - and imagine what would've happened if for example Aganzir were a Seer


I see what Legate's saying now. I read this at first as a suggestion that Aganzir was lynched for looking seerish (since he already said he suspected her voters), but now I see he's referring to the fact that she couldn't have revealed at the last minute if she were, right? My mistake.

This is contradictory:




I believe the sentence is clear: I am inclined to think Lommy was killed simply to leave no track, and as side effect, you eliminated a person who suspected you.



Then there's this stuff:

Here Mac speaks about Rikae. I know, there are these RL things - but come on, defending each other in this way? This is just not normal and I don't like the idea of these two really being wolves together.



This sentence does two things – brings up the “RL things” and dismisses them. That way he can both discredit and suspect at once... very nice for a wolf who hopes to get one, but better both, of us lynched.

But, having gone over Legate's posts again, I've come to the conclusion that the main thing that I find creepy about him is not so much what he says, as what he doesn't say. He follows other people's track (he seems to have predetermined that Mac would be an easy lynch toDay) or says uncontroversial things. I'm used to a more verbose, and more helpful, Legate.

EDIT: Spacing, x'd with Noggie, Sally, Nerwen

[Nogrod]

It's not your brain-functions r recovery sleeps Sally but the fact that you first claimed it to be a random vote and then changed the reason for the vote later into a "safe for the village" vote.

[satansaloser2005]

Okay, that's it. Expletiving kill me! I'm an ordo, a plain, simple, snazzy ordo, but you are wasting your time discussing me, and I'd much rather see you talk about and find the wolves, so get me out of the way so you can stop babbling about "she's an idiot" and talk about someone else. And be nice to Shasta when he gets on. I'd hate to see you all pick on him because he's sick too. So yeah. I've said it. KILL ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I DARE YOU!!!!

[Rikae]

I mean, sure, all three Agan–voters might easily have been innocent. But the rest of us can hardly be expected to assume that! (see #184)


So you assume there must be wolves there? And you accuse me of sophistry...

EDIT: x'd with Sally... whoa.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Great, my browser just crashed and restarted and I lost all I was writing about an hour if not more, about LG and Nerwen and Menel and McCaber and Shasta. Shortly:

LG's yesterDay's start was hard to decipher and not much from her toDay, or at least it did not help me to say black or white. I am worried about that Sally-joke thing and while she is explaining it, I am not sure whether there can't have been a wolfy intention to start a half-joky suspicion and let others follow it. The same can be said about Sally, as I mentioned earlier, and speaking of that, I am still worried about her.

Nerwen posted far more than I thought, though many of her posts have just very little substance or are just questions or reactions with not many own constructive opinions. Nevertheless, nothing specially suspicious on her and no reason for me to be worried about her.

McCaber and Shasta I spoke about earlier and it did not change - both post less, though it looks they are trying to be helpful, both; even in the little they do. Nothing special, though little more posting would do good.

Menel is a little complicated persona, and I think I'll re-make the post I lost now and post a longer one, but that would have to wait for toMorrow, as the DL is nearing and I have to see what's happening and vote. Oh, my.