WW LXXVII: The Metamorphs of Wolf-562-e

[Isabellkya]

Rikae. That quoted portion was a general statement to the at least three people whom seemed like they were looking to place their vote on whoever had the most potential to be lynched - as opposed to their top suspicions. Most often when I am saying something directly to a person, I put their name first. Like I did here.

WW here is essentially the same basic concept as traditional mafia - which I have played. The WW that I have previously played - and got started on; is different. However the concepts are all the same. If I thought I could teach everyone a thing or two - I would say so. But thank you once again for putting words into my mouth. Regardless of what styles I have played - it all boils down to the same basic concepts. Informed minority versus an uninformed majority. The fact of the matter is - which can be proven. That people easily slip into habits in terms of what innocents should do, shouldn't do, what they won't do, will do.. the same goes for wolves. We make assumptions based on what we think the mod will/not do.. etcetera. Anything which is different from the 'standard' or 'habitual' actions - is deemed wrong, or bad play. It all boils down to - having closed minds.

Newbie players have a much higher probability of making mistakes; because they are learning. Newbie wolves much more so - they have to learn the rules along with being a wolf. You don't have to be under pressure to make a mistake. A mistake can happen in any type of situation. Who really knows the reason for why she voted for Loslote? She stated she didn't even want to copy the list in the first place - so why do it, if you don't want to?

So wolves never have to vote accordingly on Day One because of threat of modfire? That really is a null tell. Anyone can be under threat of modfire on the first Day - and thus have to make a vote because of it. It isn't just going to be innocents whom are under the modfire hammer. Modfire is not alignment specific.

[Pitchwife]

Just popped in to check the narration, have to be off to work in a minute. Noia, I'll answer you (and Rikae) in full when I get back (in about 9 or 10 hours). It sucks that our timezones are so different that we can rarely talk directly, so apologies for voting you in your absence, but that's how it is... Till later!

[Isabellkya]

Players Alive:
Dun
Noia
Pitch
Izzy
Shasta
Winty
Rikae

Roles Alive:
1 Metamorph
1 Traitor
1 Secret Role
1 Assassin
3 Ordo's

Metamorphship
Dun
Pitch/Paranoia
Rikae
Shasta
Winty
Izzy
Innocent

[wintywinty]

Players Alive:
Dun
Noia
Pitch
Izzy
Shasta
Winty
Rikae

Roles Alive:
1 Metamorph
1 Traitor
1 Secret Role
1 Assassin
3 Ordo's

Metamorphship
Dun
Pitch/Paranoia
Rikae
Shasta
Winty
Izzy
Innocent

I was just going to do that

[wintywinty]

Lottie got killed last night. There is two probable reasons for this. One, the wolves discovered her Gifted-ness. Or Two, her list of Suspects was close to dead-on. I didn't include her not being traced to anyone, because with Lottie's plethora of posts, someone could easily find a connection. Because I can not find no connection and so far no one has pointed out the possibility of Lottie being the Defender, then I am going with the assumption that reason two is correct, then the three Lottie listed yesterday as Morphish or Possible Morphish were Wilwa, Izzy, and Pitchwife. Wilwa was lynched, therefore my top two candidates for Morph/Traitor are Izzy and Pitchwife, with Pitchwife being on top, due to the fact that it seems as though Wilwa was almost following his lead, voting for her 4th option, and only 4 minutes after Pitchwife voted Paranoia.

[Rikae]

Izzy, I think it basically comes down to you and I having different philosophies of WW. My track record over the last three and a half years is not entirely horrible, so I'd appreciate it if you would stop talking to me as though I knew nothing. Putting words in your mouth? No, but I'm reading your attitude, as it comes through in your posts. Often I find attitudes more revealing than words in this game, and when something works, I use it. I couldn't disagree more with your philosophy, which seems to hinge on "anything's possible", which is true enough, but useless - and some things are more likely than others. It's far more likely for an innocent to make silly blunders, flip-flops, etc. than a wolf, and the difference can usually be detected with close observation. But don't listen to me. *shrug* As for you, you don't seem, to me to be quite as defensive as you would be if evil; plus, I don't want to allow philosophical differences to cloud my judgment. I'm a bit more concerned about Pitch at the moment, and await his answers.
Wintywinty - I actually tend to think the morphs suspected Lottie as the defender. I know I did. A while back, she asked quite a few questions about the ability of the gifteds to find each other - she seemed a bit too interested, if you know what I mean. At least she was able to successfully protect the... what? werebear's?... target last night.

[Inziladun]

Wilwa was lynched, therefore my top two candidates for Morph/Traitor are Izzy and Pitchwife, with Pitchwife being on top, due to the fact that it seems as though Wilwa was almost following his lead, voting for her 4th option, and only 4 minutes after Pitchwife voted Paranoia.

That would have been a pretty bold move if Pitch was Wilwa's packmate, and it doesn't seem likely they would have taken such a risk. Wilwa knew she'd been under suspicion most of the Day, and she had to have known it was at least possible she would be lynched, so I find it hard to believe she would have been so quick to link herself with Pitch.

[Pitchwife]

Right, I'm here at last.
You know, reading this over, Pitch, I'm finding you really intersting right now.

Let's start with your analysis of yesterday's votes and actions, and your, you know, overall willingness to attack someone who so far hasn't posted or said anything at all today. Yes, lets.
Noia, I agree it was bad form to vote you without letting you answer to my suspicion before, but I waited for you to show up as long as I reasonably could, and indeed a bit longer. My problem is that DL in my timezone is 5am, which is an hour before I have to get up for work, so except for weekends, I have to vote hours before you come online. As deplorable as this is, I don't think it should keep me from voting you if I think I have good reasons to do so. Nor vice versa.

So the question remains whether I really had good reasons. I thought I had at the time, but looking back, I'm a lot less confident about them now than I was yesterDay. Anyway, I'll try to explain how I got there.

I don't think I really have to defend myself on the BG vote; I put down why I voted her, reasons beyond the "omg the lists didn't match up" and I did indeed look at both lists; the explanation made absolutely no sense to me and it still doesn't, because the titles were different, and she had obviously reworked bits and pieces of it. There was simply no other conclusion I could come to in my mind. And I honestly think the person who looks the worse out of what happened in the last 20 or so minutes is Willwuffin, because no matter how I read her posts there it all felt like the same thing.

"I really think BG is innocent but I'm not going to deign to tell you guys why I think so, despite how blatantly suspect she is being. I'm going to blithely throw my vote away on sally, and continue saying that even though I think BG is really innocent, I'm not going to meaningfully help her in any shape or form."
Yes, you gave reasons beyond the list issue, and I believe I said in my summary yesterDay that your vote actually looked the best in terms of reasoning. And about wilwa, she definitely looked the worst, but I thought there was a meager chance that she'd been actually trying to help but gave up because no one was listening (her throwaway vote would still have been bad, of course). Thankfully, that's cleared up now.

Still, I thought and think it was reasonable to assume that at least one of the morphs was involved in the process of lynching BG (to avoid the word bandwagon, if you object to it), simply because of the other players alive yesterDay (beside wilwa), only Lottie had made a vote at all, and I didn't see her as morphish. That left of course the non-voters, but how do you draw conclusions from a non-vote?

From there on, it was basically a process of elimination, as Rikae put it... although I'm afraid the last stages of it weren't entirely logical.
On another note, when Shasta and Izzy showed up to defend themselves, you were readily willing to relent; you went from one to the next and then finally me, but as interesting as that is, you completely ignored Zul. It's one thing to vote an innocent with a reason and turn out wrong. It's another thing to vote an innocent without saying a bloody thing, being wrong, and skating by. Something's off there.
I don't believe I 'entirely ignored' Zil. I noted the lack of a reason given in his vote post, and his sealing BG's fate; he replied to that and explained himself, and it made sense to me. Also I didn't and still don't see him acting the way I think a Zilmorph would. (Add with hindsight that our late and lamented Lottie, who claims she can 'totally read him', had him in the 'probable innocent' category in her last list.)

Shasta's defense convinced me; Izzy's not so much, at least initially; but as she got more and more exasperate, I started developping doubts about her, and likewise with wilwa.

And there was the point which you adress here:
Also, to those who are going "He was in the middle of the BG voters where he can skate on by!!!!" Really let me ask you; are you just trying to get on my nerves with that logic? Morphs, Wolves, and Mafia will vote in any order they please. And I don't really call it bandwagoning when someone can provide decent reasoning; bandwagoning to me is just simply voting for someone with an overall rehashed reason.
But let's have a hypothetical situation. Let's say I was a morph. Would I have any reason to vote BG, or further add fuel to the fire when it looked like she was going to get lynched on her own anyway? Nope. It's like last game. Every post of her's added fuel to the metaphorical fire, and the more I looked at her the worse I felt about her. I said as much, and I gave reasoning for why I felt the way I did. If I was Morphanoia, I would have known she was innocent. I probably would have thrown an insubstantial vote on someone I was more suspicious earlier in the day on say... Eomer. That way I have a throwaway that isn't a, you know, obvious throwaway.
Well, the thing about morphs in the middle isn't of course a universal truth, but still I think it rather more probable than anything else, given that scum of any description don't want to stick out. And saying 'If I were a morph I wouldn't have done x but rather y' is a standard wolfish defense, as you mention yourself.

Another thing is your basically list topping suspicion of Wilowil.. and yet you still vote me. Something's off there, considering you've basically link her with me/shasta/izzy as the definite member of whatever morphpack is on the ship. Care to explain why you voted me above the one constant amongst your conjecture?
OK, what happened in my head in the final two or three hours before my vote was that on the one hand I was becoming more and more confused about Izzy and wilwa, while on the other hand the suspicion I had against you went into a sort of feedback loop and developped into something not entirely dissimilar to a certain psychic disorder from which your nick is derived - to the point where I actually saw wilwa sharing my suspicion of you as a point for her innocence, instead of the other way round, as would have been more reasonable.

"Well well if you're a wolf you're dangerous!" Doesn't cut it. That is always a horrible reason, because you are basically bringing a justification into the game that boils down to "what if they're a wolf?"
I stand corrected, sir.

All in all, I think I had some valid points against you. Whether they really added up to a conclusive case at the time... I thought they did, but I'm not that sure anymore. If I could have read your response before having to vote, I most likely wouldn't have voted you. What I probably should have done is stick with the 'one constant', wilwa, and give you the benefit of doubt till toDay.

And now that we know wilwa was indeed a morph, you obviously look a lot better - I have a hard time seeing her bandwagoning on my vote as morph-on-morph; have to think it through, but at the moment it doesn't seem likely to me.

Rikae, I hope this also answers your question about my vote. As for the other one: of course the Defender or Assassin wouldn't have known any morphs. What I was trying to say in the post you quoted were two independent points:
1. If Eomer happened to be right about another morph beside sally, that would have been a good reason for them to get rid of him.
2. Whether 1. is true or not, they may also have thought him one of the remaining Agents. He certainly behaved mysteriously enough on Day 1 to smell gifted.
Sorry if I didn't make that clear enough.

Phew. This took me ages to write, now let me see what happened in the meantime.

[Pitchwife]

winty - if I understand you correctly, you're saying that I first killed Eomer because he suspected me and next killed Lottie because she suspected me. Now my reasoning may not always be flawless, but I like to believe that I wouldn't be daft enough to leave such a clear trail. Especially not since I could have foreseen that I'd be in for some scrutiny toDay after my vote and wilmorph 's wagoning on it. (And yeah, I realize I've just used the classic "I wouldn't do that as a wolf" defense I talked about above. Nevertheless.)

[wintywinty]

That would have been a pretty bold move if Pitch was Wilwa's packmate, and it doesn't seem likely they would have taken such a risk. Wilwa knew she'd been under suspicion most of the Day, and she had to have known it was at least possible she would be lynched, so I find it hard to believe she would have been so quick to link herself with Pitch.

But if Wilwa is an experienced wolf, then she will know that everybody will discount that possibility, simply because it was "too simple", thereby allowing her to do it.

X'd with Pitchie

[wintywinty]

winty - if I understand you correctly, you're saying that I first killed Eomer because he suspected me and next killed Lottie because she suspected me. Now my reasoning may not always be flawless, but I like to believe that I wouldn't be daft enough to leave such a clear trail. Especially not since I could have foreseen that I'd be in for some scrutiny toDay after my vote and wilmorph 's wagoning on it. (And yeah, I realize I've just used the classic "I wouldn't do that as a wolf" defense I talked about above. Nevertheless.)

But you would know as a wolf that everyone would discount this trail for being too easy, that everyone would think "no wolf would do that" thereby allowing you to do that.

[Rikae]

Pitch, I'm a bit uneasy about the way you used the "exasperated innocent" explanation for both Izzy and Wilwa, and then lump them in similarly together toDay. I thought Wilwa and Izzy's behavior was quite different, and absolving two players with that one reason? Well, I don't know if I really buy it in Wilwa's case.
As for Wilwa bandwagoning on a fellow morph's vote, I think it's possible. She's been around long enough to see that it wouldn't *necessarily* leave a trail.
As for Pitch killing Eomer and Lottie because they suspected him - that's not even necessary. Whoever the last morph is, as I said before, I'm almost certain they killed Lottie as a suspected gifted. I don't know about Pitch, but when I'm evil, getting the gifteds is priority number one. Trails? Those are nonsense anyway. There are very few wolves out there any more who will simply and straightforwardly kill those who suspect them (too obvious) or avoid killing them even if they think they're gifted (because of point #1 - there's nothing terribly risky about killing someone who suspects one. Everyone will just call it a framing attempt anyway).
Thus, in response to Pitch's points here:
1. If Eomer happened to be right about another morph beside sally, that would have been a good reason for them to get rid of him.
2. Whether 1. is true or not, they may also have thought him one of the remaining Agents. He certainly behaved mysteriously enough on Day 1 to smell gifted.
Sorry if I didn't make that clear enough.
I say:
1. I don't think that's any more or less likely than the opposite. Since Pitch was one of those suspects, it makes him look nice and honest... a bit too much.
2. Eomer is always mysterious. However, it's nice to know that you, Pitch, found him giftedishly mysterious!

[Inziladun]

But if Wilwa is an experienced wolf, then she will know that everybody will discount that possibility, simply because it was "too simple", thereby allowing her to do it.

I didn't say that was out of the question, but I still think it unlikely.

Additionally, I think Pitch's words toDay thus far seem pretty reasonable.

Para looks fairly clean at the moment for his Wilwa vote, and his explanations yesterDay.

I don't agree with the majority of winty's points, but that doesn't mean he's evil.

Rikae? Always a tough one for me to figure out. She was laying low early on, at least more so than I might expect. However, yesterDay she looked more like the Rikae I remembered. She seemed to make some good points about Izzy. Her vote for Izzy seemed well-reasoned enough.

Izzy and Shasta were the other two (along with Lottie and me) in the BG wagon. It's quite obvious everyone who voted BG wasn't a Metamorph, but I do think it's highly improbable there were no Metas involved.

Shasta didn't vote, saying in the Admin Thread that he forgot about DL. Well, I guess it happens. He had been saying Wilwa would have been his vote. Anyone can say that, granted, but he'd also been suspecting her before, as I recall. Is wolf-on-wolf out of the question? No, but with only two of them left it would seem unnecessarily risky.

Which leaves Izzy. The sudden vote against Rikae bothers me somewhat. It might have been a knee-jerk reaction of an innocent against suspicion, but it could also have been a seizure of opportunity in finding a plausible reason to vote for someone besides Wilwa.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Here and reading.

[Isabellkya]

Okay. So I'm guessing that the secret role is indeed akin to a WereBear or simply a third party. They hunt someone/thing specific; yet aren't adverse to killing anything in their path?

This third party attacked Loslote, and the remaining Metamorph finished her off, in some sort of revenge kill? Or just plot to show that the Third Party & Metamorph both chose to kill Loslote.

Dun. If Wilwa and I were morphmates. Why throw my vote away on Rikae? Why not 'seize opportunity and find a plausible reason to vote for someone other than Wilwa', whom would keep her away from the noose? Some one like.. Paranoia for instance. I was the last vote, why not try and save her?

[Pitchwife]

But you would know as a wolf that everyone would discount this trail for being too easy, that everyone would think "no wolf would do that" thereby allowing you to do that.
And I would also know that they know that I know, and they would know that I know that they know, that I know, etc. etc. This isn't getting us anywhere.

Pitch, I'm a bit uneasy about the way you used the "exasperated innocent" explanation for both Izzy and Wilwa, and then lump them in similarly together toDay. I thought Wilwa and Izzy's behavior was quite different, and absolving two players with that one reason? Well, I don't know if I really buy it in Wilwa's case.
Yeah, it was different - Izzy lashing out at whoever was questioning her (first me, then you), wilwa more like pleading "why don't you all see what a good girl I've really been". What I said in that neverending post above was from memory, which can be deceiving. Looking at wilwa's later posts now, up to the point of my vote and hers, she actually became less defensive and seemed to be pulling herself together (which I liked at the time), until she was questioned again for her vote. The latter was after I'd left, but I'd read it up in the meantime and got the chronology mixed up. My bad.

As for yesterDay - yep, I used the same expression in both cases. I guess the best I can say is that at the moment I'm not terribly proud of my reasoning yesterDay. Pitch enamoured with his Paramorphia theory, believing he's had a stroke of genius while everybody's concentrating on Izzy and wilwa , and getting carried away so far that he lets the real morph off the hook... and in the process drawing enough suspicion to himself that the last morph is probably leaning back with a bowl of popcorn right now. Not to mention the Cyberbear, or WereCyborg, or whatever it is whose kill Lottie managed to prevent last Night. :(:o:(

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I'd like to say day 3, and two metamorphs down; fantastic work, crew.

There's that word again. "Fantastic". Wilwa said it too, you know. :p

There is a hitch in whatever killed "Lieutenant Sally" But that's not our primary concern as of this moment; if it's not obvious.

Now this is certainly an eyebrow-raiser. Whatever killed Sally and attacked Lottie last night is pretty obviously some kind of were-Bear role. And in my experience, singular were-Bears generally have something going for them besides a simple nightkill to help them with survivability. Now, we've taken out two of the three Morphs, which leaves us with one Morph with a nightkill. Now, what I'm wondering is - why try to get us to discount the wereBear, who is clearly more dangerous than the lone Morph, completely?

That would have been a pretty bold move if Pitch was Wilwa's packmate, and it doesn't seem likely they would have taken such a risk. Wilwa knew she'd been under suspicion most of the Day, and she had to have known it was at least possible she would be lynched, so I find it hard to believe she would have been so quick to link herself with Pitch.

Interesting and slightly expected, given that I still think Zil is the traitor and suspect Pitch. :p

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Alright, I'm caught up. Now I'll finish that analysis of Pitch from yesterday.

[Nerwen]

This third party attacked Loslote, and the remaining Metamorph finished her off, in some sort of revenge kill? Or just plot to show that the Third Party & Metamorph both chose to kill Loslote.

The "third party" tried to kill the person Lottie was protecting; Lottie then fought it (made a save). The Metamorph killed Lottie in the usual way. (The bit about being Wilwa's mate was just for narrative purposes– it wasn't really a Lover's revenge kill). I realised after I'd posted that it's a bit misleading.

[wintywinty]

People keep talking about a Werebear, or BearCyborg, or something as being the thing that killed Sally. Could someone please describe to me the details of what a Werebear role does?

[Inziladun]

Interesting and slightly expected, given that I still think Zil is the traitor and suspect Pitch. :p

I could be the Traitor. So could you. :rolleyes:

Pitch could be the last Meta, certainly. But do you really think it's likely Wilmorph would have been so blatant as to follow his vote on Para so quickly? If she'd waited a bit to test the wind, then done it if no one else questioned Pitch about it, I'd think it more plausible.

EDIT: to respond to winty, a werebear kills at Night like a wolf, but he's by himself. He only wins if all the wolves die and he's left alive.

[wintywinty]

EDIT: to respond to winty, a werebear kills at Night like a wolf, but he's by himself. He only wins if all the wolves die and he's left alive.

Ok, Thanks

[Pitchwife]

Para looks fairly clean at the moment for his Wilwa vote, and his explanations yesterDay.
Yep. I forgot to mention his own vote in my reply to him above, but that's another point for him.

I don't agree with the majority of winty's points, but that doesn't mean he's evil.
I obviously don't agree either. It bothers me a bit that he's been so goddamn convinced of my morphishness basically ever since he first showed up and no matter what happens, it always seems to fit his Pitchmorph theory, but up to now, he may be an innocent suffering from the same kind of tunnel vision and over-confidence that led to my vote yesterDay.

Rikae? Always a tough one for me to figure out. She was laying low early on, at least more so than I might expect. However, yesterDay she looked more like the Rikae I remembered. She seemed to make some good points about Izzy. Her vote for Izzy seemed well-reasoned enough.
She looks decent enough to me. Neither morph nor traitor, I think (certainly not the latter, or she wouldn't have grilled me like that toDay). Could possibly be the CyberBear, or whatever it is, if anything.

Izzy and Shasta were the other two (along with Lottie and me) in the BG wagon. It's quite obvious everyone who voted BG wasn't a Metamorph, but I do think it's highly improbable there were no Metas involved.
I thought, and still think, so too... Let's not ignore the Day 1 non-voters, though.

Shasta didn't vote, saying in the Admin Thread that he forgot about DL. Well, I guess it happens. He had been saying Wilwa would have been his vote. Anyone can say that, granted, but he'd also been suspecting her before, as I recall. Is wolf-on-wolf out of the question? No, but with only two of them left it would seem unnecessarily risky.
I asked myself the same question about wilwa and Noia. In any other village, I wouldn't have ruled it out completely, but with a third party involved, I think they wouldn't have risked one of them being left alone. Another point for both Shasta and Noia.

Which leaves Izzy. The sudden vote against Rikae bothers me somewhat. It might have been a knee-jerk reaction of an innocent against suspicion, but it could also have been a seizure of opportunity in finding a plausible reason to vote for someone besides Wilwa.
I don't at the moment know head from tail about Izzy.

EDIT: x-ed with Shasta, Shasta, Nerwen, winty, Zil and winty.

[Rikae]

Now this is certainly an eyebrow-raiser. Whatever killed Sally and attacked Lottie last night is pretty obviously some kind of were-Bear role. And in my experience, singular were-Bears generally have something going for them besides a simple nightkill to help them with survivability. Now, we've taken out two of the three Morphs, which leaves us with one Morph with a nightkill. Now, what I'm wondering is - why try to get us to discount the wereBear, who is clearly more dangerous than the lone Morph, completely?


Good point, Shasta, and especially interesting considering that I started thinking Paranoia looked a bit werebearish yesterDay. When I get a chance I'll have to dig up the quotes that set off the alarm, but for now I'll just say the overall detached-but-cautious vibe is worrisome, as well as the smug tone this morning.
The situation as it stands now is ideal for a bear: only one competitor-morph left, but that one means the number of innocents decreases quickly - and, out of the gifteds, only the one who can't do the bear any harm left (and who might even end up treating the bear as a sort of "known innocent"!)

[Isabellkya]

Scratch my thought that the 3rd party and Metamorph were both after Loslote. She merely blocked the thirds attack.

known innocent known morph

Day 1:
Loslote -> Pitch
BG -> Loslote
Izzy -> BG
Shasta -> BG2
Paranoia -> BG3
Dun -> BG4
Wilwa -> Sally

Day2:
Pitch -> Paranoia
Wilwa -> Paranoia
Rikae -> Izzy
Paranoia -> Wilwa
Winty -> Pitch
Dun -> Wilwa2
Loslote -> Wilwa3
Izzy -> Rikae

Pitch -> Paranoia.
If you're wondering why, you haven't read my posts toDay. I'm not comfortable with voting him before he's had a chance to respond, but given our different time zones, it can't be helped. He looks like the most suspicious of the BG voters to me, and I'm not that confident about voting anybody else. And if he's indeed a morph, he's a dangerous one, so get rid of him NOW.

Wilwa -> Paranoia
I'm not going to vote for Inzil, because I have the feeling no one will go along with that. Ditto for Lottie and Shasta. So I'll go with my fourth option, though I wasn't originally planning on voting him, I'm willing to since I do find him suspicious and I'd rather not waste my vote toDay.

Rikae -> Izzy
#205 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631973&postcount=205). Yeah, Izzy's pretty suspicious, indeed. I don't see anyone more
suspicious around, so:

Paranoia -> Wilwa
#211 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631979&postcount=211) Should I get lynched in the interrim, I'm laying down my suspicions as Pitch, Wilwarin, and Zul as a possibility. I am uneasy about Izzy but I don't feel too bad about her at the moment. I believe Shasta, Lottie, and Rikae as town.

Winty -> Pitch
Most Suspicious:
Pitchwife, Wilwa, Noia, and Zil

Dun -> Wilwa
For previously stated reasons.

Loslote -> Wilwa
For, of course, previously stated reasons...

Izzy -> Rikae

You can deem it as OMGUS I suppose, though that isn't the reason. Yes we interpret what others do - but blatantly spinning it to fit your vote.. come on.


- I could not find a reason for why Paranoia voted for Wilwa. Unless I am remembering wrong, one or two people have said that he looks good because he voted for WIlwa. Yet.. where is the reason for it? I actually don't see him discuss her at all in regards to his suspicions towards her. The previous Day, he had no read on her. Was this an OMGUS vote for her Paranoia? Or were you simply preemptively voting for her, because she looked like she might be in trouble? In the post you voted for her, you listed as you were suspicious of Pitch more thanyou were of Wilwa. So why vote her over him?

-Winty's official vote was posts later after his list. If I remember correctly, he was having issues with the tagging. Again, where is the reason for your vote?

-Dun. What previously stated reasons on Wilwa? I looked through all of yours posts from yesterDay and couldn't find a single instance of where you described your suspicions upon Wilwa. #221 you said she was still 'tops on your list'. Am I missing a page or something?

X'd with every thing after #266

[wintywinty]

I obviously don't agree either. It bothers me a bit that he's been so goddamn convinced of my morphishness basically ever since he first showed up and no matter what happens, it always seems to fit his Pitchmorph theory, but up to now, he may be an innocent suffering from the same kind of tunnel vision and over-confidence that led to my vote yesterDay.



After my analysis of the first day, it seemed to me that You, Noia, and Zil were the most suspicious. That after the second day and night, your name appeared on Lottie's list, and then she was killed, and it appears as if Wilwa was following your lead, knowing that nobody would suspect of her leaving such a simple trail. Neither Noia nor Zil have not done anything extremely suspicious, so they have gone down on my suspicion list. I am not fitting the data (what people say and do) to my theory, but rather reassessing the data after each Night, and it so happens that what I found who I found as suspicious today was the same one who I found suspicion with yesterday.

X'd with Rikae and Izzy

[Shastanis Althreduin]

On Pitch -

#18 - Banter. Asks Eomer what's suspicious about BG.

#22 - Banter. Laments the fact that the Assassin can't reveal and act as a pseudoSeer. Asks Eomer if he's just stirring the pot.

#26 - Tries to turn discussion away from the rules.

#28 - Disagrees with Rikae about the effectiveness of a revealed Hunter.

#39 - IC flattery of Inzil that I mentioned earlier, which fits my current working theory of Inziltraitor and Pitchmorph. Also flips a bit on his thoughts on discussing game mechanics in response to Lottie's suspicion of Wilwa...

That's the problem with discussing game mechanics: it can be useful, giving people something to talk about on Day 1, and sometimes is indeed necessary, but it's also something to hide behind if you're trying to look helpful but are reluctant to actually suspect somebody.
So much in general. As for wilwa, don't know... Though it seems to me that a Morph has more reason to be happy about the Agents' deep conditioning than anybody else. I'd like to see what she's got to say when she's back, if I manage to stay awake that long.


Now, this could be an honest suspicion of Wilwa, but I think it's too vague for that. It looks more like preparatory morph-on-morph suspicion - very light, but something to be pointed to once the morph in question is revealed.

#40 - Asks BG what she has to say about Eomer's suspicion of her.

#42 - Numbered points in response to BG. This post seems almost naggy, and kind of nitpicky. Now, granted, several people (myself included) began pressing BG later in the day (about her list), but this is earlier in the day, and looks sort of like a preparatory witch-hunt. The question is, would a Pitchmorph be this obvious?

#54 - Responses to Eomer. Ends up deciding not to vote him. Mentions that BG was a "loudmouth wolf[/b] in the previous game.

#55 - Notes that Eomer's vote isn't highlighted.

#158 - Analyzes the BG wagon (or at least relates it). Here's the bit I find fishy.

About that Seer-wagon: having read the last game, I see how her behaviour could have been seen as repeating her wolvish preincarnation, and honestly I'm not sure how I would have reacted to it myself if I'd been around to vote, but I find it noteworthy how everybody (that is, Izzy, Shasta, Noia and Zil) jumped on her blunder like wolves on a tasty bit of lynch-meat, without even considering the possibility that she'd just made a noobish mistake.

And I find it noteworthy that you immediately jumped on the four people in that wagon hardcore. Lots of lynch-fodder in a group of four, surely one will take, right? :p Especially since you badgered her just as much previously, while you were still around.

#159 - Analyzes the other votes of the day. States what he calls "obvious" -

With hindsight, obviously a morphish camouflage manœuver.

If I remember correctly, Sally's done the same thing when innocent if she doesn't have time to participate day one, so calling it an "obvious camouflage maneuver" seems a bit overly-eager. Also builds on his suspicion of Wilwa based on her vote for Sally. Apparently everyone who's still alive who voted is suspicious, now, save Lottie (who voted for Pitch himself!)

#162 - Analyzes Eomer and his death. Suggests that he was killed because he had another Morph among his top suspects, or that he appeared Gifted (although this seemed to be an afterthought). Then says it would have made sense for Lottie and/or Wilwa to have killed Eomer to frame said top suspects. Then says it could have even been both.

#165 - Responds to Izzy, but finds the fact that she voted BG so quickly suspicious. Doesn't think we should concentrate on the BG voters to the exclusion of all else, but doesn't think we should ignore them (no one really was, at this point).

#166 - More "feelgoodery" in response to Inzil.

#168 - Details his thoughts on Noia. This bit right here is interesting...

All in all, he's a hard one. Hands-on approach and some good points, but telling Eomer not to make unreasoned accusations while doing it himself? His vote on BG looks the most well-reasoned of the four, but I gather he's an experienced player, if new to the Fleet, and therefore perfectly capable of making a good-looking case against an innocent if he's a morph.

Now, I believe that the word "unreasoned" refers to Noia's IC "suspicion" of Rikae, but as that was IC it's pretty safely disregarded, especially since Noia later said he considered Rikae innocent. So immediately calling his vote for BG "well-reasoned" right after he suspects him for being "unreasoned" comes out looking odd.

#171 - Details his thoughts on me. I've responded to most of this already, but it's worth noting that Pitch also takes the opportunity to plug his wilwa-suspicion here. There are several things in this post, as well, that make me think that this was preparatory to becoming an actual case on me, but was later aborted. I could, however, just have a tremendous ego.

#172 - Asks if Mira was modfired.

#173 - Details his thoughts on Lottie, Winty, Zil, Rikae, and Izzy. Trusts Lottie, sees nothing morphish about Winty, trusts Zil (of course), sees nothing morphish about Rikae, and suspects Izzy.

#178 - Considers the most likely morphs to be Wilwa, Noia, me, and Izzy. Is set on Wilwa being a morph, quite firmly so. Starts pondering if Wilwa might be the Traitor instead.

#187 - Mr. Agreeable rears his head again. Thinks I look better after my responses to his earlier post.

#190 - Two things interesting here.

So what are you going to do? Just ignore it all for fear of exposing the Seer, at a time when there was nothing else of any note happening? Or question player 1, hoping to get a better read on them?

Well, given that it was Eomer... Seriously, though, given that you put EomerSeer in your list of scenarios, the thought had to have crossed your mind. The fact that there was "nothing else going on" doesn't excuse the fact that you could have outed the Seer there. That's all I'm saying.

Also...

Nah, sorry, that seems to have been constructed with hindsight. Don't buy it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Izzy
Again. I did not vote BG because of previous game behavior. K. Thanks. I've seen this said more than once - that I voted for her because of last game. This is the second (going to be third) time I think I even said it - I did not vote her because of previous game behavior.
No, you didn't. I've noted you haven't used that excuse, I'll hand you that.

Hmmm. This post of Izzy's has some marks of an exasperated innocent. I'm inclined to move her to the lower end of my suspicion list, along with Shasta. (Zil is already there)

Now, hold on. Just three lines above, you said you didn't buy Izzy's explanation of her thoughts on BG, but you immediately turn around and label her "exasperated innocent"? There's something off there.

#191 - Responds to Inzil's explanation of the flattery earlier. Also mentions that a Pitchmorph and a Zilmorph working together would look like Lottie's game (because playstyles never, ever change, right?) Also, starts trying to alleviate suspicion on Wilwa - this could be a Pitchmorph realizing that his morph-on-morphery has worked a little too well and trying to do damage control.

#193 - Votes for Paranoia. Now there's a lot wrong with this. Rikae's gone through some of it, but I'd like to add that earlier on in the day Noia was apparently the least suspicious of the [b]BG]/b] voters, according to Pitch.

#252 - Pops in to read the narration.

#258 - A long post that basically comes down to "Oops." Pitch analyzes his own reasons for voting Paranoia yesterday and finds them to be not as great as he'd originally thought they were.

#259 - Notes that he wouldn't be daft enough to leave a clear trail to himself as a morph with the kills. Then invalidates his post completely by noting that he used a defense that's not a defense at all.

#266 - An extension of #259, basically, combined with an "Aw, shucks, they done fooled ol' Pitch again" vibe. Not buying it.

Conclusion - After going through Pitch's posts individually I'm really thinking he's our last Morph.

Also, something we're forgetting - a werebear tends to act exactly like an innocent would in any given situation, because they have no ties to anyone. That's what makes them so hard to catch. "Clearing" someone because of how they interacted with Wilwa, for instance, doesn't "clear" them at all.

That took forever.

[wintywinty]

-Winty's official vote was posts later after his list. If I remember correctly, he was having issues with the tagging. Again, where is the reason for your vote?



Bottom of Page 4

X'd with Shasta

[Inziladun]

Dun. What previously stated reasons on Wilwa? I looked through all of yours posts from yesterDay and couldn't find a single instance of where you described your suspicions upon Wilwa. #221 you said she was still 'tops on your list'. Am I missing a page or something?

See here (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631866&postcount=128), here (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631962&postcount=195), and here (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631970&postcount=202).

No, I didn't come out and say "I think Wilwa is a Metamorph". However, she was the only one I'd really suspected all day, so I didn't think I needed to spell it out.

x/d with all since Izzy's last.

[satansaloser2005]

Oh Moddess, dear, am I allowed to tease them? Just a little? Just to make them come out of hiding, of course, so they'll vote and discuss and such. Please? ;)

*dashes back into the shadows before the sun burnssssss her skinsssssss*

[Rikae]

I may not get a chance to post again toDay, and at this point I still find

++Pitch

the most suspicious.

If Pitch isn't, I really don't know who else even could be the final morph. Might as well go by reverse alphabetical order, it's as good as anything. Too many submarinish players on this ship!
Promised discussion Paranoia and werebearery will have to wait until another time (or not, if I don't survive toNight, and I don't really expect to). A lot of that is based on a feeling/werebear experience, anyway. I'm confident, at this point, that Izzy is not the final morph, at any rate.

[satansaloser2005]

Huzzah!


Rikae-->Pitch

[Pitchwife]

Shasta - impressive case. Very impressive. So impressive that I'm almost convinced myself. What really sucks about it is that I think you're doing this with the best intentions, and I've given you all the fuel for it, and none of us is going to find the true morph like that.
Right now I'm seriously tempted to Nilp myself and help you lynch me (I'm sure winty will be glad to assist), just so that is cleared up and you can move on. Only it's not the best option with two killers still running loose toMorrow.
And now I'm thinking in circles and cirles and circles, and have no clue what I can possibly say that won't make everything worse, and no idea whom to vote in good conscience.

Bah.:confused:

[Isabellkya]

Winty. I am assuming you are referring to your post #155 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631895&postcount=155[/url)? Uhm, unless I'm completely failing. How is that a reason for your vote? Because you found them suspicious? Which you found them suspicious because Eomer had them on his suspicion list? If so.. why are you essentially taking the suspicions of dead innocents and going off of them? Why not have your own original thought?


Dun. I am assuming these are the relevant bits..
#128: Actually, Wilwa's vote for Sally seems to make her look a bit worse toDay. Keeping away from the BG wagon when Wilwa knew she was already done for would have been a very smart move for a Wilwamorph.

#195: I still feel that your making a throwaway vote like you did looks worse than the BG voters. (in response to/about Wilwa.)

#202: The difference between yesterDay's voting and toDay's is that toDay Paranoia doesn't look nearly as bad as BG did. In the case of BG, it's difficult for me to see how anyone could have backed away from voting her under those circumstances without having some knowledge she was innocent.


Why didn't you simply say.. 'I suspect Wilwa and here is why:' Instead of making people search for it? Essentially your suspicions upon her were based on her Sally vote? Which you were planning on doing yourself. "Since I saw no chance of getting Sally lynched, I went ahead with BG."
If you were town, you would be wanting to vote your suspects.. not whoever had the highest potential of being lynched. Obviously you don't seem to be concerned about that - since you've been on both lynch wagons.. Your fur itching yet?

X'd with every thing after #280.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Well, Pitchmorph, if it's any consolation, I'm not certain I advocate lynching you today. I'm fairly sure, based on the numbers, that we have a shot at trying to lynch the more-dangerous wereBear today, and I'm wondering if that wouldn't be more profitable. :p

[wintywinty]

Winty. I am assuming you are referring to your post #155 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631895&postcount=155[/url)? Uhm, unless I'm completely failing. How is that a reason for your vote? Because you found them suspicious? Which you found them suspicious because Eomer had them on his suspicion list? If so.. why are you essentially taking the suspicions of dead innocents and going off of them? Why not have your own original thought?


If the innocents who suspect morphs are killed off, then the only innocents left are ones who suspect other innocents. This is good for the morphs, which provides them with good reasoning to kill these innocents who suspect morphs. Both Eomer and Lottie were Innocents who were killed, so I am assuming that the morphs killed them because they (Lottie and Eomer) were suspecting other Morphs.

X'd with Shasta

[Shastanis Althreduin]

On Paranoia - An analysis of Bear-ery

Now, this analysis will be shaded a bit differently than my previous ones. Given that bears are much harder to catch than wolves, this analysis will concentrate more on underlying attitudes than hard cold data.

Before I even start with the post-by-post analysis, Paranoia has the least amount of posts of any player, living or dead, save Mira who was modkilled for not being able to participate. That seems to be a point against him already, since bears are likely to not want to draw attention to themselves.

#30 - IC banter. In it, he scolds Eomer for his baseless accusations against BG, mentions that BG's alignment will be known "sooner or later", and IC-accuses Rikae.

#99 - Kind of comes down hard on BG here.

I bet a metamorph version of her couldn't resist the same urges to act like a plum fool.


Also claims Eomer's vote is "OMGUS" (translated as "Oh my gosh, you suck" and is commonly used to denote a vote for personal reasons rather than game-related ones... i.e. revenge votes), but it's not, not really. Explains that he "didn't have much time", which may be true, but it also offers a reason for a wereBear not to be as active as he/she might be normally. Puts suspicion on Sally's vote. Ends up voting BG, and does a list. Puts myself and Izzy both in the "Mostly Harmless" category. This is slightly meta and possibly a disregardable point, but I can't help but wonder if a Bearanoia wasn't making an attempt there to butter up the two people he knows outside BD.

#105 - Continues explaining why BG's explanation of her list isn't satisfactory. I can't say much about this, given that I did the same thing, but I've noticed that a commonly-used Bearish tactic is to concentrate on one subject to the exclusion of all else to give the appearance of being helpful.

#211 - Mega-post, defending himself against Pitch and condemning Wilwa. He didn't do too much else during this day, and this was an awfully zealous defense... over-zealous, maybe? Were-Bears can't afford to gather too much suspicion - they're their only chance to win, after all. Maybe Noia was trying to defuse suspicion of him at the root. He also is "very much inclined to think" Lottie innocent. Lottie was a pretty clear discussion leader, given how much she posted - possibly more buttering-up?

#217 - Helps winty with coding.

#222 - Helps winty with coding.

#248 - Several things here, so let me quote:

I'd like to say day 3, and two metamorphs down; fantastic work, crew. i'd also like to say losing Lottie is quite a blow; two gifted down in two days does not make me a happy camper, though losing the telepath was partially my bad.

There is a hitch in whatever killed "Lieutenant Sally" But that's not our primary concern as of this moment; if it's not obvious.

Now, I'd like Pitch to pop up and answer my questions to him in that big rambling nightmare of a post I made at the end of day 2.

I'd also like to see more of Shasta's analysis. And Rikae's.

In the meanwhile, I'm going back to Lottie's posts to see if there's much of anything there that might be of use; with only one metamorph left, I doubt she would have been murdered to redirect suspicion as much as it's likely she was murdered to get suspicion off of someone. And last I checked, she had definite suspicions of Izzy.

First off, I get what Rikae said about the "smugness". It's almost as if a bearaNoia is congratulating us for getting rid of threats to him.

Secondly, the "oh the bear's not a threat" tone of his second line.

Thirdly, how he asks Pitch, myself, and Rikae for such-and-such. This is a tactic I've used before myself - it's a way to look like you're participating, but actually you're getting others to act as your smokescreen.


Conclusion - well, I can't see any reason for Noia to not be the bear, and I've got a pretty good feeling based on what he's said that he is... so I'm thinking I'll probably vote him today and Pitch tomorrow.

[Pitchwife]

Well, Pitchmorph, if it's any consolation, I'm not certain I advocate lynching you today. I'm fairly sure, based on the numbers, that we have a shot at trying to lynch the more-dangerous wereBear today, and I'm wondering if that wouldn't be more profitable.
Yeah, and go through it all again toMorrow, and still be no closer to finding the morph? How is that any consolation?

And you'd have to be damn sure you've spotted the CyberBear correctly to pass up the lynching of your chief morph suspect, if I may say so. Which makes me wonder... either you're very very very confident about your notorious psi powers (in which case you're in for a nasty surprise as soon as I'm dead or this is over, whichever happens first), or you don't really care.

By the way, Izzy had a good point in her last about winty basically echoing dead innocents, but his answer still looks like he believes what he's saying. Another one.:eek:

(x-ed with Shasta's last)

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Yeah, and go through it all again toMorrow, and still be no closer to finding the morph? How is that any consolation?

And you'd have to be damn sure you've spotted the CyberBear correctly to pass up the lynching of your chief morph suspect, if I may say so. Which makes me wonder... either you're very very very confident about your notorious psi powers (in which case you're in for a nasty surprise as soon as I'm dead or this is over, whichever happens first), or you don't really care.

By the way, Izzy had a good point in her last about winty basically echoing dead innocents, but his answer still looks like he believes what he's saying. Another one.:eek:

(x-ed with Shasta's last)

Not so, unless I've done my math wrong. Look -

Scenario 1 - lynch Morph (six), bear kills (five)

Leaves us tomorrow with 4 on 1. Good odds, but who knows what the Bear has up his/her sleeve?

Scenario 2 - lynch bear (six), Morph kills (five)

4 on 1 again, BUT the Assassin has a chance to kill the Morph, ending the game automatically, plus the Morph's only got their kill left (unless our moddess snuck something in under our noses).

Scenario 3 - lynch innocent (six), Morph kills (five), Bear kills (four)

Not the greatest odds, true. BUT - the Assassin could still kill the Morph, OR the Bear could kill the Morph, OR the Morph could kill the Bear, OR they could kill each other (maybe?). And even if none of the above happens, the Bear and Morph won't be working together. (Note - Traitor not factored into above calculation because he's counted as innocent)

Of the above scenarios, I'd say Scenario 2 is the best and Scenario 3 the worst, but we'd have to be extremely unlucky for nothing good to come out of Scenario 3. I'm not as sure of Para's bear-ness as I am about your Morphery, that's true... but I am pretty darn sure.

[Inziladun]

Why didn't you simply say.. 'I suspect Wilwa and here is why:' Instead of making people search for it? Essentially your suspicions upon her were based on her Sally vote? Which you were planning on doing yourself. "Since I saw no chance of getting Sally lynched, I went ahead with BG."

Once again, I was leaning toward Sally until BG made her slipup, and eveyone started voting for her. I found BG's behavious highly suspect myself, so I went with her. Since Wilwa's ignoring said slipup looked worse to me than any of the people who had voted BG, I went with Wilwa yesterDay for making a throwaway vote. And it appears to have paid off.
As for searching, was it really that difficult to see, or do you have you furry blinders on?

If you were town, you would be wanting to vote your suspects.. not whoever had the highest potential of being lynched. Obviously you don't seem to be concerned about that - since you've been on both lynch wagons.. Your fur itching yet?

No fur here, thanks. And yesterDay's lynch wagon led to a Metamorph, a path you (and Rikae) avoided by voting one another.
How many times must I say that BG's behaviour looked highly suspicious? She easily trumped my mild suspicion of Sally, who I had nothing on but her wasted Day 1 vote. I never said I was dead set on Sally's furriness; just that I'd intended to vote for her.

Actually, you're sounding a bit like the late Wilmorph herself.

I didn't really have too many other options. No Sally wasn't really that suspicious, but she was moreso then anyone else from what I could see. If I had voted BG I would like a bandwagonner taking the safe way out.

x/d with Shasta

[Pitchwife]

OK, that looks pretty impressive too. Only I'd feel worse than bad voting him in his absence twice, and be wrong again. And my time's running out (RL-wise), and I've no clue about the last morph, having spent all Day reacting to suspicion, and I don't care that much anymore whether I get lynched or modfired or whatsoever...

(x-ed with Shasta again)

EDIT: and x-ed with Zil too

[Shastanis Althreduin]

In fact, I think I'll put my money where my mouth is, in this case.

++Paranoia

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia

[wintywinty]

I have prior engagements that will hold me until the DL, so I must vote now.

Because of reasons previously stated:

++Pitch

[Pitchwife]

Shasta - I see.

I'm not as sure of Para's bear-ness as I am about your Morphery, that's true... but I am pretty darn sure.
As for Morphery, it's largely my own fault, but we're going to have an interesting after-game discussion.

OK, what the heck, I haven't got that much to lose, have I?

++Para-whatever-in-space-he-is-Noia

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)



Well that's interesting....

[Paranoia]

On Paranoia - An analysis of Bear-ery

Now, this analysis will be shaded a bit differently than my previous ones. Given that bears are much harder to catch than wolves, this analysis will concentrate more on underlying attitudes than hard cold data.

Before I even start with the post-by-post analysis, Paranoia has the least amount of posts of any player, living or dead, save Mira who was modkilled for not being able to participate. That seems to be a point against him already, since bears are likely to not want to draw attention to themselves.
And I had the least amount of posts last game too; post count != bear or Morph, Tanner.

#30 - IC banter. In it, he scolds Eomer for his baseless accusations against BG, mentions that BG's alignment will be known "sooner or later", and IC-accuses Rikae.

#99 - Kind of comes down hard on BG here.



Also claims Eomer's vote is "OMGUS" (translated as "Oh my gosh, you suck" and is commonly used to denote a vote for personal reasons rather than game-related ones... i.e. revenge votes), but it's not, not really. Explains that he "didn't have much time", which may be true, but it also offers a reason for a wereBear not to be as active as he/she might be normally. Puts suspicion on Sally's vote. Ends up voting BG, and does a list. Puts myself and Izzy both in the "Mostly Harmless" category. This is slightly meta and possibly a disregardable point, but I can't help but wonder if a Bearanoia wasn't making an attempt there to butter up the two people he knows outside BD.


In case you hadn't noticed by the nice little note next to Eomer's name, I was basing a whole lot of my suspicions based on BG's roleflip; bg flipped town. People shifted spots.

#105 - Continues explaining why BG's explanation of her list isn't satisfactory. I can't say much about this, given that I did the same thing, but I've noticed that a commonly-used Bearish tactic is to concentrate on one subject to the exclusion of all else to give the appearance of being helpful. Uh, I did a whole lot more than just explain why BG's explanation was unsatisfactory. I explained what else about her I found suspicious. read things through before condemning me on one point.


#211 - Mega-post, defending himself against Pitch and condemning Wilwa. He didn't do too much else during this day, and this was an awfully zealous defense... over-zealous, maybe? Were-Bears can't afford to gather too much suspicion - they're their only chance to win, after all. Maybe Noia was trying to defuse suspicion of him at the root. He also is "very much inclined to think" Lottie innocent. Lottie was a pretty clear discussion leader, given how much she posted - possibly more buttering-up? Well let's see. Of course it's going to be a zealous defense, considering I am my only 'for sure' innocent. Who else can I rely on to defend myself except myself? Again, defending oneself is all well and good; if you have an issue with me, pick out how I was suspicious in defending myself. And yeah, I was. Based primarily on interactions with her and how she was handling herself this round rather than the last one just made me instinctively think she was innocent.

#217 - Helps winty with coding.

#222 - Helps winty with coding.

#248 - Several things here, so let me quote:



First off, I get what Rikae said about the "smugness". It's almost as if a bearaNoia is congratulating us for getting rid of threats to him.
[/quote] Why yes, I am congratulating you on getting rid of threats to the, you know. town.

Secondly, the "oh the bear's not a threat" tone of his second line.
I said there was still the issue of what killed Sally. I, however, believe the potential for the traitor to meet up with the morph to be a more pressing threat. Which it is.

Thirdly, how he asks Pitch, myself, and Rikae for such-and-such. This is a tactic I've used before myself - it's a way to look like you're participating, but actually you're getting others to act as your smokescreen.
Fun fact. I work from 8 until 4:30. I leave my apartment at about 7ish in the morning. I usually don't get time to get online until late. I asked pitch to respond to my accusations at the end of day 2. I asked you and Rikae to keep it up because I liked what you were doing.


Conclusion - well, I can't see any reason for Noia to not be the bear, and I've got a pretty good feeling based on what he's said that he is... so I'm thinking I'll probably vote him today and Pitch tomorrow.

You could at least wait for me to respond, you know; your points are all really based on taking me out of context and using one post, and moreover, one line in specific to condemn me as the bear.

[Rikae]

Hm... now, actually, I quite like Shasta's plan, especially since if we can assume the assassin will go for Pitch toNight, a living Pitch is an innocent Pitch toMorrow. If the morph kills the assassin and xe left a decent trail, there will be two essentially "known non-morphs" among the remaining players.

Edit: X'd with Paranoia

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Paranoia, my analysis was based mainly on attitudes rather than actions, as that is how one catches a Werebear. And in my opinion, your attitudes have been pretty Bear-ish. You don't have to get all sarcastic the moment someone suspects you, you know. That's another evil tactic - "everyone who suspects me is an idiot".

[Rikae]

Should have said "a living Pitch is a non-morphish Pitch". "Of course he could still be the traitor.

[Paranoia]

Paranoia, my analysis was based mainly on attitudes rather than actions, as that is how one catches a Werebear. And in my opinion, your attitudes have been pretty Bear-ish. You don't have to get all sarcastic the moment someone suspects you, you know. That's another evil tactic - "everyone who suspects me is an idiot".

Okay tanner. You've played with me before. You have been wrong about me before. You are wrong once more, and while you do have legitimate points, I don't like the fact you're ignoring counter points because you are once more so sure I'm evil. and is no one else worried about Patch voting me just as soon as he got a second vote? Self preservation is fine and all but it didn't even read like that, more like he was trying to follow behind Shasta.

[satansaloser2005]

Who is this Tanner person? Shasta, do you know him/her? I'm very confused! :(

[Paranoia]

Who is this Tanner person? Shasta, do you know him/her? I'm very confused! :(

gah. More of my time from Spies interfering with how I refer to people. :x

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Okay tanner. You've played with me before. You have been wrong about me before. You are wrong once more, and while you do have legitimate points, I don't like the fact you're ignoring counter points because you are once more so sure I'm evil. and is no one else worried about Patch voting me just as soon as he got a second vote? Self preservation is fine and all but it didn't even read like that, more like he was trying to follow behind Shasta.

That's because the counter-points you've given have all been to defend your actions. A bear's actions are basically unimpeachable - they can play the game like an innocent with a nightkill. I think you're a bear because of your attitudes. Two entirely different things. And bringing past games into your defense is not helping you.

[Rikae]

Okay tanner. You've played with me before. You have been wrong about me before. You are wrong once more, and while you do have legitimate points, I don't like the fact you're ignoring counter points because you are once more so sure I'm evil. and is no one else worried about Patch voting me just as soon as he got a second vote? Self preservation is fine and all but it didn't even read like that, more like he was trying to follow behind Shasta.
Hm, so sure that Shasta isn't evil, are you?

As for Pitch... not only self-preservation, but the morph's gotta get rid of the bear eventually, too, doesn't xe?

[Inziladun]

To be honest, I hadn't given much thought to the space-bear or whatever it may be. Sorry. I got cought up looking for the Metamorph. I still don't think it's likely to be Pitch.

Paranoia as a bear would be more plausible than his being a Meta, at least.

Shasta's voted for him, getting it started. And Pitch followed suit.

To put my money where my mouth is, I intend to vote for one of those two instead of wasting my vote.

[Isabellkya]

Winty. Have you thought about the possibility that both Eomer and Loslote were killed because they gave off Gifted vibes?

Shasta.
"OMGUS" (translated as "Oh my gosh, you suck" and is commonly used to denote a vote for personal reasons rather than game-related ones... i.e. revenge votes..
Is this your definition of OMGUS? If it is, then you are slightly off. OMGUS votes are game related, and are chiefly meant as person B voting for person A; solely because person A voted for person B. That is how the entire 'phenomenon' began in the first place.

In regards to Paranoia attempting to butter us up. He would more than likely kill the both of us off first.

Your entire analysis on Paranoia looks more like you are trying to fit what he has said/done to fit your WereBorg theory. As opposed to reaching that conclusion after you analyzed him.

You seem to be confident that what powers the WereBorg may or may not have, are more powerful than what the Morphs have. Is there anything to back this up? Or pure speculation?
Is there also some clear statement that the Assassin can not do anything to the WereBorg? Or more speculation?

Have you factored in the possibility that the Assassin perishes?
"plus the Morph's only got their kill left"
Did the morphs have something more than a Night kill?


Dun.
"Dun. If Wilwa and I were morphmates. Why throw my vote away on Rikae? Why not 'seize opportunity and find a plausible reason to vote for someone other than Wilwa', whom would keep her away from the noose? Some one like.. Paranoia for instance. I was the last vote, why not try and save her?"

I copy/pasted my own for your benefit. Seems you missed it somehow. Care to answer? ;)


Shasta. Not even going to give Paranoia a chance to respond? Or.. anyone else really for that matter? You can not fit under timezone differences; because I believe you and Paranoia are in the same one...

Paranoia. Pitch apparently is unconcerned with his survival. I call bluff tactic. Appeal to emotion?

Shasta. Are you saying his past game defense is not helping, because of what happened in the past games? Or because meta is not so ehm relevant? The inner judge in me would say - you opened that door, first.

I rather dislike this current position we are in.

Last two votes.. myself and Dun?. I was planning on voting for Dun. plgh.

X'd with Dun.

[Isabellkya]

Paranoia, Dun, and myself left to vote. Plgh more!

[Isabellkya]

What do people think of Shasta?

I may be incorrect, but he seems to of gone largely unnoticed. Winty to an extent himself.

[Rikae]

I have no arguments for or against Shasta, basically, except thinking he was a bit quick to push the Bearanoia lynch, though I do see it as a decent plan myself (Izzy, you seem to be missing the point that the assassin cannot kill the bear - from the admin thread: "Armed with a gun that shoots darts lethal to the Metamorph nervous system, the assassin may pick one target every Night." The bear is not a metamorph).

Wintywinty did say a few things I found innocentish, which caused me to move him further to the "innocentish" side and which I than forgot. Let me see...

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Is this your definition of OMGUS? If it is, then you are slightly off. OMGUS votes are game related, and are chiefly meant as person B voting for person A; solely because person A voted for person B. That is how the entire 'phenomenon' began in the first place.

Exactly. Revenge-votes. I don't consider them game related. Rather than having any game-related reason behind them, they're just "OMG you suck!" and revenge-voting.

Is this your definition of OMGUS? If it is, then you are slightly off. OMGUS votes are game related, and are chiefly meant as person B voting for person A; solely because person A voted for person B. That is how the entire 'phenomenon' began in the first place.

Explain yourself. I haven't seen anyone who looks as much like the Bear as Paranoia does, so I analyzed him with the way one catches a bear in mind, and that's what I found.

You seem to be confident that what powers the WereBorg may or may not have, are more powerful than what the Morphs have. Is there anything to back this up? Or pure speculation?
Is there also some clear statement that the Assassin can not do anything to the WereBorg? Or more speculation?

Yes, the first is speculation. But it's well-founded speculation. The Bear's game is over at any time if chosen randomly by the Morph's for a kill, or if bandwagoned on while unable to post, or any number of unfair reasons that have nothing to do with their gameplay, and that's entirely unfair to the player, so why wouldn't the Bear have some kind of advantage. The Morphs have numbers - what might the Bear have to compensate? They have to have some shot at winning. The second question is based on the wording of the Assassin role, which makes no mention of the Bear role at all, so I don't think it affects the Bear role in any way.

Have you factored in the possibility that the Assassin perishes?
"plus the Morph's only got their kill left"
Did the morphs have something more than a Night kill?

No, I haven't, other than to lump it in with the "we'd have to be extremely unlucky". And I don't believe so - at least, it wasn't in the description of the role given to us in the Admin thread. The Morphs only have a nightkill.

Shasta. Not even going to give Paranoia a chance to respond? Or.. anyone else really for that matter? You can not fit under timezone differences; because I believe you and Paranoia are in the same one...

When did I claim timezone differences? I voted for two reasons - one, because I suspect Paranoia of being the bear, and two - to force Pitchmorph to vote Paranoia before leaving for the night. I figured he'd have to vote for self-preservation, and gave him a way to do so while getting another vote for someone I find suspicious.

Shasta. Are you saying his past game defense is not helping, because of what happened in the past games? Or because meta is not so ehm relevant? The inner judge in me would say - you opened that door, first.

Would it? Care to explain how? I said it wasn't helping because past games don't matter, they're completely metagame.

To be honest, I hadn't given much thought to the space-bear or whatever it may be. Sorry. I got cought up looking for the Metamorph. I still don't think it's likely to be Pitch.


Don't think Pitch is likely to be the Morph? Or the Bear? And if you're thinking of voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship, thinking of voting me for voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship is entirely double-standard-worthy, and makes me even more sure that you're the Traitor trying to save Pitch.

[Paranoia]

Hm, so sure that Shasta isn't evil, are you?

As for Pitch... not only self-preservation, but the morph's gotta get rid of the bear eventually, too, doesn't xe?

Yeah, but I had a distinct feeling something like this was going to happen as soon as I read that Lottie had died. Let's take this more into context. Day 2: I had Wilwa (Morph) and (Patch *probable traitor perhaps the bear*) Both on my case. That case immediately fell through. This day the first thing that comes up is people suspecting me of being the bear and that lynching a bear suspect is better than lynching the wolf/traitor pair because of some possibly undefined powers, and furthermore, most of the argument used against me is based on my "attitude", rather than hard evidence, because a "bear is harder to find." There's an issue here. Finding the bear today is not the best case scenario. Finding the last morph is. By focusing his search on the bear, Shasta is essentially trying to give the last morph a free pass today. In this way, I personally think that Shasta is the last morph, or the traitor. Izzy is lower on my suspect list because I think she would have made a jump onto the Wilwa wagon and tried linking Rikae and Wilwa together based on Rikae's vote on her.

As much as it stands, I think Pitch isn't a likely metamorph... I find him a more likely werebear then a morph, or an even more likely traitor.

either way, I am flat out voting ++Pitch because I've been forced into a position where if I don't vote counter to the wagon on me a known (at least to myself) innocent will die.

Edit: Xed with Shasta, Rikae, and Izzy

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Oops. That second (double) quote should actually be -

Your entire analysis on Paranoia looks more like you are trying to fit what he has said/done to fit your WereBorg theory. As opposed to reaching that conclusion after you analyzed him.

[Isabellkya]

Since the WereBorg was/is a secret role; how likely would it be that the mod would include such information in the Assassins role?

"Human victims will be unharmed."

Or were the two secret roles completely separate of the rest. Both created to balance each other out? Bounty Hunter hunts WereBorg, WereBorg must eliminate Bounty Hunter? Or something along those lines.


X'd with every thing after #310.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Finding the bear today is not the best case scenario. Finding the last morph is. By focusing his search on the bear, Shasta is essentially trying to give the last morph a free pass today.

No, it's not, and no, I'm not. I've done the math (which you apparently have either mis-read, not read at all, or completely disregarded), and you're forgetting that having a Morph alive is better than having the Bear alive because the Morph can be killed by the Assassin. You're also giving the Traitor entirely too much credit. We should be wary of them, true, but clearly at least one innocent knows who they are (re: the plot), which greatly diminishes their effectiveness.

[satansaloser2005]

Please put your actual votes on separate lines, as is Werewolf tradition. It's way easier to see a vote which starts out a line (because you can just scan) than to look at every line, even with highlighting to simplify. It makes things easier not only for lazy dead me, but for everyone else too. Thanks for your consideration!



Also....



Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)
Paranoia-->Pitch (3)


ETA: x'd with Iz and Shasta

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Or were the two secret roles completely separate of the rest. Both created to balance each other out? Bounty Hunter hunts WereBorg, WereBorg must eliminate Bounty Hunter? Or something along those lines.

That would be my guess, given that in Eomer's death-plot, he shot someone that wasn't the bear and apparently did no damage.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

....Actually, Izzy, where did you get the name "WereBorg" anyway? :eek:

[Rikae]

wintywinty...

1:
Apology for missing Day 1

2:
List of roles, mistakenly thinks only one person is simply a "member of
the crew". Interesting.

3:
Doesn't know what the "Terran Intelligence Agents" are.

4:
Adopts Eomer's suspects, assuming that the morphs killed him because he
was "on to something".
This is just such a nonsensical argument that it strikes me as innocentish.
Has wintywinty ever been a wolf before? Could this be the result of Sally &
Wilwa's coaching to play the "newbie card"?

5:
Corrected about 3

6:
"Just finished reading" - lists suspects, but without reasons. Top suspects
Pitchwife, Wilwa, Noia, and Zil.

7,8,9:
Asks about highlighting.

10:
Votes for Pitch.

11, 12:
Explains reasoning behind vote, says he was just about to post
list Izzy posted (roles and players, with all players under "Metamorphship")

13:
Theory about Lottie being killed because her suspicions were "dead on".
Again, nonsensical.

14,15:
Arguing that Wilwamorph would know that everyone would discount the
possibility of her voting with Pitchmorph. Sensible enough, but then again,
Winty's been suspecting Pitch from the beginning for kind of shaky reasons.

16,17:
Asks what a werebear is.

18, 19:
Further explaining why he suspects Pitch (killed innocents suspected him, basically).

20:
"If the innocents who suspect morphs are killed off, than the only innocents left
are ones who suspect other innocents"
Weird. Seems to assume suspicions are static. This sort of thing strikes me as something
a newbie wolf wouldn't come up with, but a newbie innocent would... basically for the same reason
as above: his mates would tell him otherwise, and he would only do this if deliberately playing
the newbie card. I'm going to go with my gut here and say I don't think he's doing that.

21:
Votes Pitch for reasons previously stated.

Conclusion:
Not really very morphish, though could still be a bluffing morph, in which case, hats off!
Still, first in reverse alphabetical order...

[Rikae]

....Actually, Izzy, where did you get the name "WereBorg" anyway? :eek:
Actually someone else said it earlier... now to go find it...

[satansaloser2005]

Actually someone else said it earlier... now to go find it...

I'll happily offer my services by searching if you'd like. :)

[Rikae]

Pitch said "cyberbear or werecyborg" in 266, wintywinty said "Werebear, or BearCyborg" in 270,
and then Izzy said "wereborg" - which is catchier, to be sure.

[satansaloser2005]

The first mention of the wereborg (then Cyberbear, or WereCyborg) was made by Pitch in his post 266 (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=632097&postcount=266). Winty picked it up a few posts later and then of course Izzy carried it on.

I think it's quite cute, actually. :)


EDIT: x'd with Rikae. But I was being so helpful! :(

[Isabellkya]

Shasta.
How in the world can you claim that an OMGUS vote is not game related; when simply the act of voting someone for voting for you - is game related. Voting a person with the reason that they punched you in the arm the day before at school.. or something like that would be more considered not game related. But the mere act of placing a vote for someone is game related. Arguably the most 'game related' act of the game. Savvy?

Uh.. you just quote the same quote twice. xD
Ah okay, it was corrected. Why do I need to clarify, what I said is pretty clear. You went into your analysis with Paranoia pegged as the WereBorg; and thusly essentially cherry picked the actions/"attitudes" which fit your theory.

Yes, the first is speculation. But it's well-founded speculation. The Bear's game is over at any time if chosen randomly by the Morph's for a kill, or if bandwagoned on while unable to post, or any number of unfair reasons that have nothing to do with their gameplay, and that's entirely unfair to the player, so why wouldn't the Bear have some kind of advantage. The Morphs have numbers - what might the Bear have to compensate? They have to have some shot at winning. The second question is based on the wording of the Assassin role, which makes no mention of the Bear role at all, so I don't think it affects the Bear role in any way.

Your entire wording here stinks. A lot. You are personalizing the WereBorg. I responded to the word usage in my last post.

"plus the Morph's only got their kill left"
The way you said this, was as if they started with more. 'only' specifically.

I never said you claimed timezone difference. But that is what happened between Paranoia and Pitch. He had to vote for Paranoia before the chance of a rebuttal, because of time zone differences. You however, can not fit under that category. So you admit to strategizing your vote.. and nonetheless attempting to work with one of your chief suspects? Very town of you.

Yes, past games are meta. However YOU brought it up - and used it is a possible point against him. If it didn't matter because it was meta - you never would of brought it up in the first place. But the fact that you mentioned it in your analysis of him; implies that you used it in your thought process.

"Puts myself and Izzy both in the "Mostly Harmless" category. This is slightly meta and possibly a disregardable point, but I can't help but wonder if a Bearanoia wasn't making an attempt there to butter up the two people he knows outside BD."

You also attribute the WereBorg attitudes to Paranoia, from what I gather - past games. Meta, no? HasParanoia seen a WereBorg before? How do you reconcile that with your theory? That since Paranoia has not seen a WereBorg- would therefore by default fit the 'standardized' actions of what a wereBorg would/n't do?

Considering that part of your theory rests on the Assassin incapable of harming the WereBorg - why have you not asked the mod?

I got the name WereBorg from I believe something that Pitch said. He say CyberBear or BearCyber or something like that. I do recall from the plot (correctly I believe) that the WereBorg was slightly injured by Loslote and she saw metal underneath instead of bone. I used WereBorg because it seemed a simpler name to type out... than cyberbear or something.

Hit close to your WereBorg role name Shasta?

[Inziladun]

Don't think Pitch is likely to be the Morph? Or the Bear? And if you're thinking of voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship, thinking of voting me for voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship is entirely double-standard-worthy, and makes me even more sure that you're the Traitor trying to save Pitch.

I don't recall saying I was considering voting for you. Why so jumpy?

[Rikae]

You also attribute the WereBorg attitudes to Paranoia, from what I gather - past games. Meta, no? HasParanoia seen a WereBorg before? How do you reconcile that with your theory? That since Paranoia has not seen a WereBorg- would therefore by default fit the 'standardized' actions of what a wereBorg would/n't do?

What...the...heck? Ok, this is what I'm talking about. I can't speak for Shasta, but to me, a "[role]-attitude" has nothing to do with some kind of arbitrary "standardized actions" that someone does or does not know about (I mean, seriously? What??!) but with the nature of the role itself... um, you know, like, the knowledge the player has, what they have to do to win... things like that. :rolleyes:
This is actually an awful lot like your inability to comprehend the difference between a wolf's or an ordo's considerations in voting on Day 1. You're working from such a... simplistic... view of the game, and it never seems to become any more complex.

Eh, well, I'd better stop talking about this before I say something I regret.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta.
How in the world can you claim that an OMGUS vote is not game related; when simply the act of voting someone for voting for you - is game related. Voting a person with the reason that they punched you in the arm the day before at school.. or something like that would be more considered not game related. But the mere act of placing a vote for someone is game related. Arguably the most 'game related' act of the game. Savvy?

How dare I get into semantics with you... :rolleyes:

Okay. Yes, voting is game related. However, the reason for the vote (in this case, because someone else voted you first) is not related to someone's role, or whether or not someone is suspicious - it's not related to the game at all. Get it?

You went into your analysis with Paranoia pegged as the WereBorg; and thusly essentially cherry picked the actions/"attitudes" which fit your theory.

No, I didn't. I'm honestly not sure what else to say here, other than that you're wrong.

Your entire wording here stinks. A lot. You are personalizing the WereBorg.

So? Sure, I could be wrong, and the Bear could be just as powerful as a lone Morph. But given all the secret roles and power twists in this game, I sincerely doubt it.

"plus the Morph's only got their kill left"
The way you said this, was as if they started with more. 'only' specifically.

The Morphs started with a numerical advantage - I don't see them starting with anything else. If I was unclear in my wording, I apologize.

So you admit to strategizing your vote.. and nonetheless attempting to work with one of your chief suspects? Very town of you.

In a three-party game? Sure, why not? I don't see what's so particularly suspicious about it. Pitch was getting ready to have to leave, and in essence would have thrown away his vote - so I put it to use on my other suspect. Big deal. Yes, in order to get Pitch's vote on Paranoia, I had to vote before Paranoia could defend himself, and for that I apologize, but it doesn't change my suspicion of him, and he could very well convince others of his innocence anyway. Pitch already has more votes than he does.

Yes, past games are meta. However YOU brought it up - and used it is a possible point against him. If it didn't matter because it was meta - you never would of brought it up in the first place. But the fact that you mentioned it in your analysis of him; implies that you used it in your thought process.

Insofar as I was going through each of Paranoia's posts and typing up my thoughts as I thought them, stream-of-consciousness style, then yes, I used it in my thought process. However, I also recognized it for what it was and acted accordingly - you can feel free to disregard that statement if you wish. It doesn't diminish the validity of my other points.

You also attribute the WereBorg attitudes to Paranoia, from what I gather - past games. Meta, no? HasParanoia seen a WereBorg before? How do you reconcile that with your theory? That since Paranoia has not seen a WereBorg- would therefore by default fit the 'standardized' actions of what a wereBorg would/n't do?

In that one point, yes. I have plenty of others, I think. And has Paranoia been a lone baddie before? Yes, he has. That's not a point in favor of or against him, it's an answer to your question.

Considering that part of your theory rests on the Assassin incapable of harming the WereBorg - why have you not asked the mod?

Because I thought it was obvious.

Hit close to your WereBorg role name Shasta?

No. :p I kind of translate this universe to Star Trek (even though I'm not familiar with it overmuch) and I seem to recall there being Borg in StarTrek... so was wondering if you had slipped.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

To be honest, I hadn't given much thought to the space-bear or whatever it may be. Sorry. I got cought up looking for the Metamorph. I still don't think it's likely to be Pitch.

Paranoia as a bear would be more plausible than his being a Meta, at least.

Shasta's voted for him, getting it started. And Pitch followed suit.

To put my money where my mouth is, I intend to vote for one of those two instead of wasting my vote.

Inzil, if you're not considering voting me, please explain what this post actually says. Maybe I misread it.

[Inziladun]

I'll go ahead and do this because I've been unexpectedly called into work and may not make it back in time. Despite Shasta's amazement, I still think Pitch is not likely to be the Metamorph. Ascribe whatever reasoning for my thoughts you like.

++Paranoia

[Inziladun]

Inzil, if you're not considering voting me, please explain what this post actually says. Maybe I misread it.

Just thinking out loud, that's all. You got the ball rolling on Para.

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)
Paranoia-->Pitch (3)
Dun-->Paranoia (3)

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Just thinking out loud, that's all. You got the ball rolling on Para.

:rolleyes: You're so helpful.

What I meant was, you accused me of being jumpy because I defended myself against you when you "weren't even considering voting me", when in that post you pretty clearly were, so....?

[Rikae]

I miss the old WW crowd... Barrowdowns WW just isn't the same anymore. Don't much care for you guys' new slang, either. "Very town"? "OMGUS"? Blah.

[Inziladun]

If Wilwa and I were morphmates. Why throw my vote away on Rikae? Why not 'seize opportunity and find a plausible reason to vote for someone other than Wilwa', whom would keep her away from the noose? Some one like.. Paranoia for instance. I was the last vote, why not try and save her?"

Very quickly: perhaps you didn't think there was time to fabricate a sufficently innocent looking case against Paraand opted for the safer option of a revenge-vote.

[Inziladun]

What I meant was, you accused me of being jumpy because I defended myself against you when you "weren't even considering voting me", when in that post you pretty clearly were, so....?

How is stating you were the first vote for Paranoia equal to saying I would vote for you? I also noted Pitch did the same, and I said I wasn't going to vote him. Why would you jump to the conclusion you were in my sights?

[satansaloser2005]

I miss the old WW crowd... Barrowdowns WW just isn't the same anymore. Don't much care for you guys' new slang, either. "Very town"? "OMGUS"? Blah.

Very town? What the what? Where (and what) is that?

*butts out*

[Inziladun]

I miss the old WW crowd... Barrowdowns WW just isn't the same anymore. Don't much care for you guys' new slang, either. "Very town"? "OMGUS"? Blah.

Triple post! If it's any consolation, I think "Omgus" sounds like the name of a Transformer. :p

EDIT: Had a triple post ruined by a dead person....

[Rikae]

Alas, a list.

Inziladun – Ordo or cobbler
Paranoia – Wereborg.
Pitchwife –Metamorph suspect #1
Isabellkya –Ordo or cobbler
Shasta –Metamorph suspect #2
wintywinty – Ordo
Rikae – Good and dead.Goodbye, cruel world! I hope you all get eaten by rats... er, I mean, go village! Rah rah rah!

[Rikae]

Mm... to clarify list further:

Most nonmorphish:
Rikae
Izzy

Fairly nonmorphish:
Inzil
wintywinty

Morphiest:
Paranoia
Pitchwife
Shasta

[Rikae]

Oh, the pops are sweeter and the taste is new! They're shot with sugar through and through!

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Rikae - Don't suppose I can ask "why", can I? :p

[Isabellkya]

Rikae.
My point was that Shasta is/was analyzing Paranoia based upon attitudes/actions which a WereBorg would do.

"so I analyzed him with the way one catches a bear in mind"

He compared Paranoia to what a WereBorg would do. Hence why I said 'standardized'.

Clarified for you? Or should I break it into much.. simpler terms. Would syllables help?

Shasta.
"so I analyzed him with the way one catches a bear in mind"

How is that not going into your analysis with him pegged as the WereBorg?

"I'm fairly sure, based on the numbers, that we have a shot at trying to lynch the more-dangerous wereBear today,"

Is that not in relation to Paranoia?

How does the fact that Pitch apparently does not care about his survival fit into your thoughts?
The fact that you voted for Paranoia before he could defend himself - which you admit - clearly shows that you care naught about what he has to say. That you've written him off as WereBorg and are thus unconcerned.

"That since Paranoia has not seen a WereBorg- would therefore by default fit the 'standardized' actions of what a wereBorg would/n't do?"

This seems to be rather confuddled. My point is that if Paranoia has not seen a WereBear, then how would he fit the standardized actions of a WEreBorg - which you compared him with.

I was not asking if Paranoia has been a lone baddie before. I asked if he has seen a WereBorg before. You know as well as I do - how many different varieties of Third parties can be out there.

Since I pointed out in an earlier post, questioning the probability of the mod including WereBorg stipulations in the Assassin role - you've not thought about that at all?




Oh for the love of expletives. A tie?

OMGUS originated in 2001. town is the village equivalent. townie/villager/innocent. Comes from mafia.. which I believe has been around far longer than werewolf - though that would take research.


Dun. Well considering that you seem to use that as a point against me - I would think you would've given it more thought.

[Rikae]

Hey, wereborg! Yeah, I'm talkin' to you, metal butt! You want a piece of me? Huh? *brandishes soldering gun*

Shasta:
You can, but I'm not telling. Nyah nyah!

[Shastanis Althreduin]

How is stating you were the first vote for Paranoia equal to saying I would vote for you? I also noted Pitch did the same, and I said I wasn't going to vote him. Why would you jump to the conclusion you were in my sights?

To put my money where my mouth is, I intend to vote for one of those two instead of wasting my vote.

You intended to vote for one of "those two". I was one of "those two". Pretty clear to me.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Hey, wereborg! Yeah, I'm talkin' to you, metal butt! You want a piece of me? Huh? *brandishes soldering gun*

Shasta:
You can, but I'm not telling. Nyah nyah!

Fine! Then I think you're just sour grapes for not winning the post-count war. Nyah boo. :p

[Rikae]

Rikae.
My point was that Shasta is/was analyzing Paranoia based upon attitudes/actions which a WereBorg would do.

"so I analyzed him with the way one catches a bear in mind"

He compared Paranoia to what a WereBorg would do. Hence why I said 'standardized'.

Clarified for you? Or should I break it into much.. simpler terms. Would syllables help?

Would they help you, dearie?

You asked Shasta if Paranoia had seen a werebear before.
That is not rela... that does not apply to... It. does. not. matter. whether. he. had. or. not.
"Arbitrary"means "Determined by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle". If "what a werebear would do" were
arbitrary, it would require seeing a werebear. However, since it is not - it is "determined by principle", it does not.
Understand?

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Shasta.
"so I analyzed him with the way one catches a bear in mind"

How is that not going into your analysis with him pegged as the WereBorg?

That's going into my analysis paying attention to his attitudes and what I see as the thoughts behind his comments, rather than looking at his interactions with others and votes. It's a different way of analyzing.

"I'm fairly sure, based on the numbers, that we have a shot at trying to lynch the more-dangerous wereBear today,"

Is that not in relation to Paranoia?

That's in relation to the WereBorg in general. Doesn't matter who it is right now, I still consider them more dangerous than the Morph.

How does the fact that Pitch apparently does not care about his survival fit into your thoughts?

"Apparent" and "actual" are two different things. Pitch clearly does care about his survival, as he voted to save himself.

------------------

What about you, Izzy? What do you think about Pitch and Paranoia? Instead of questioning everyone until they go batty, why don't we hear some of your thoughts? :p

------------------

The fact that you voted for Paranoia before he could defend himself - which you admit - clearly shows that you care naught about what he has to say. That you've written him off as WereBorg and are thus unconcerned.

I've already explained this, Izzy, I'm one of seven people who can affect the vote. The responsibility for the lynch does not fall entirely on my shoulders. I'm not in the least "unconcerned" about what Paranoia had to say, but in my opinion I had to act fast, so I did.

This seems to be rather confuddled. My point is that if Paranoia has not seen a WereBear, then how would he fit the standardized actions of a WEreBorg - which you compared him with.


Well, what do you consider to be the "standardized actions" of a WereBear? I consider them to be "anything the Bear has to do to win", which is generally the same for any lone baddie.

I was not asking if Paranoia has been a lone baddie before. I asked if he has seen a WereBorg before. You know as well as I do - how many different varieties of Third parties can be out there.

I do, but that's not the point. The relevant portion is "lone baddie".

Since I pointed out in an earlier post, questioning the probability of the mod including WereBorg stipulations in the Assassin role - you've not thought about that at all?

You mean when you mentioned that since the WereBorg is a secret role it wasn't likely to be mentioned in the flavor text of the Assassin role? Sure, I've thought about it, but there are alternative ways that it could have been worded. The way it's actually worded makes me pretty confident that the Assassin only kills Metamorphs. So do the plots.

[Rikae]

OMGUS originated in 2001. town is the village equivalent. townie/villager/innocent. Comes from mafia.. which I believe has been around far longer than werewolf - though that would take research.

I didn't ask what it meant. I said I didn't care for it, and by "new" I meant "new around here".

[Rikae]

Fine! Then I think you're just sour grapes for not winning the post-count war. Nyah boo. :p

Well, I'll tell you this: I wish Izzy was a morph. :rolleyes:

[Paranoia]

Rikae, feelings a bit mutual. You just remind me of the sort of people I used to play with that thought they knew everything, but were simply as one dimensional and simplistic as the people they put down. I would think that if the morphs or the bear felt threatened by you that much, you'd be already dead, but I shouldn't probably mention that for fear of your ego. Also the real bear is having a hearty laugh at you while I am just a wee bit more than just exasperated.

To Zul: At the start of the day you said you considered me unlikely to be a wolf, and that you had spent most of your time looking for them. My issue with you now is you go and vote for someone you do not suspect to be a wolf, as opposed to another person you don't believe to be a wolf. The difference here is that Pitch voted two days in a row without bothering to wait for me to post to respond to the accusations against me. This seems to indicate that you are indeed unconcerned about looking for the bear; it seems to indicate you know who the bear is. As in... the bear is you.

To Shasta: Your overwhelming attempt to shifting your focus on the bear today seems to indicate to me that you don't care about hunting morphs; indeed, the primary danger is still the morphs, no matter how diminished the traitor is in effect. Their numbers still give them a leg up on everyone else. And since you're so fond of math...

7- 3 (the lynch and the night kill) = 4. If we hit right, assuming traitor. 7-3 = 4. We still lose, unless the assassin strikes true tonight. Assuming we hit the morph. 7-2 = 5. Pretty good odds, with the traitor basically stuck with no way to win, and the bear having to survive two rounds. Hitting the bear leaves us at 7-2 = 5, and assuming the traitor isn't hit, leaves us in a dire position with only one more mistake costing us the game.

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)
Paranoia-->Pitch (3)
Dun-->Paranoia (3)

Still accurate? Speaking of nyah boo. :(

Also....

How do you like me now? Now that I'm in my grave!
Do you still think death's funny when your ranger couldn't self-save?
I can't do any more killing, but I'm well-trained in vote counts
And screwing up your triple posts. How do you like me now?





Also also, I have more posts than Paranoia and nearly as many as winty. Proud as I am of myself, I'm really rather disappointed.


And I'll not get into Rikae's vintage WW players statement. Let's just repeat the standards of the site: good spelling/syntax, family friendly language (which includes accounting for my over-sixty mother who doesn't even understand 'lol' for pity's sake), and an attitude of sunshine and ring wraiths....erm, butterflies. (Just for my muffin.) Aka use complete, proper sentence structure and "grown-up" language (read, real words, because we're certainly allowed to be silly) most of the time and I think we can keep Auntie Rikae at least marginally happy. Am I even close to being right? (Either way, you're getting repped.)


*fades out of sight, promises not to come back except to be helpful*



EDIT: x'd since the post where my dear Shasta said "nyah boo". It's still making me chuckle. ^_^

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Cut it out.

There is no need or call for any of this rudeness. Werewolf is a game, and meant to be enjoyed as such. Stop cutting each other down, please.

[satansaloser2005]

Cut it out.

There is no need or call for any of this rudeness. Werewolf is a game, and meant to be enjoyed as such. Stop cutting each other down, please.



Seconded. Play nice, children, or Miss Nerwen will start bashing you with hammers. Much as I like death and destruction, it has to be civilized.


ETA: As a way of clarification, my last post (and all post-mortem comments) are out-of-game statements and reflect neither my alignment nor my standing on the living, at least in an opinion sense. Just in case y'all were wondering. And the spelling/syntax comment was a general statement, though everyone should take heed of it since I have noticed an increase in lack of rule-following in that department (on the whole site, not just in WW.)

[Isabellkya]

Okay. My main misgiving about voting for Paranoia is based upon Shasta and how he went after him. He purposefully voted when he did so he could force Pitch to vote the same way.

Paranoia himself is too quiet for my liking. Given there is just over twenty minutes until DL.

Unlike you Shasta, I like to question things. As opposed to merely forcing votes as to how I want them to go. ;)

Pitch.. seems to have a defeatist attitude... by apparently not concerned with his survival - even though we are down to much smaller numbers, where any elimination has a much larger impact on the rest of the game.

Hmm.


X'd with every thing after #347.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

To Shasta: Your overwhelming attempt to shifting your focus on the bear today seems to indicate to me that you don't care about hunting morphs; indeed, the primary danger is still the morphs, no matter how diminished the traitor is in effect. Their numbers still give them a leg up on everyone else.

If the Morphs had more than one member remaining, I'd agree with you. As they don't, I respectfully disagree.

7- 3 (the lynch and the night kill) = 4. If we hit right, assuming traitor. 7-3 = 4. We still lose, unless the assassin strikes true tonight. Assuming we hit the morph. 7-2 = 5. Pretty good odds, with the traitor basically stuck with no way to win, and the bear having to survive two rounds. Hitting the bear leaves us at 7-2 = 5, and assuming the traitor isn't hit, leaves us in a dire position with only one more mistake costing us the game.

If you'd like me to mention all the factors that I can think of that affect this total, I will. Let's see...

1. We lynch the Bear, and the Assassin kills the Morph. Village wins.

2. We lynch the Morph, and the Bear kills an innocent. Village is down to five, with one baddie.

3. We lynch the Traitor, the Assassin kills the Morph, and the Bear kills an innocent. Village is down to four, with one baddie.

4. We lynch the Traitor, the Morph kills an innocent, and the Bear kills an innocent. Village is down to four, with two baddies. Village loses.

5. We lynch the Traitor and the Morph and Bear kill each other. Village wins.

7-9. Replace "Traitor" with "Innocent".

10. We lynch the Bear, and the Morph kills an innocent. Village is down to five, with one baddie and the Traitor remaining. At least one villager knows the identity of the Traitor.


So you see, there are plenty of ways for things to turn out, but the best situations all revolve around killing the Bear first.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Unlike you Shasta, I like to question things. As opposed to merely forcing votes as to how I want them to go.

I like to question things too. But unlike you, I don't like to do that to the exclusion of all else and avoid giving any of my own opinions in the process. :p

[Rikae]

Rikae, feelings a bit mutual. You just remind me of the sort of people I used to play with that thought they knew everything, but were simply as one dimensional and simplistic as the people they put down. I would think that if the morphs or the bear felt threatened by you that much, you'd be already dead, but I shouldn't probably mention that for fear of your ego. Also the real bear is having a hearty laugh at you while I am just a wee bit more than just exasperated.

Well, what can I possibly say? I've been playing here for three and a half years, and I've had some good times and made some friends. Heck, I even met my husband here.
But now, the place belongs to you and your crowd. I remind you of the people you've played with? The people who came into this little corner of the internet that was once frequented by those who shared an interest in something other than Werewolf and turned it into their own personal clubhouse, driving the old regulars away? You're among friends, and obviously you can insult me all you like. Your buddies' playing style is "simplistic" in my view, but I can't expect you to see how that is the case - it just happens that the old days, and the complexities of the games here I once enjoyed so much, are over.
Go ahead. Insult me all you like. As for my "ego" with regard to being killed, *shrug*. Read it that way if you want to.

[Isabellkya]

If I am reading that right.. you are wanting us to play and speak accordingly to what will make Rikae happy?

X'd since my last post.

[Paranoia]

Shasta, I really, honestly do have to disagree. It might just be how I look at situations, but I always count Traitors against the town. I have always counted them against the town, even when technically they count amongst the town's numbers, as they are never neutralized as a threat to the town until that last mafia member, pack mate, or morphmate bite the dust, because until then they aren't. So numbers wise, I consider that last morph the biggest threat, simply because there is a role that will win only if they win. I'd barely given a thought to the bear until you basically called me the bear while providing me basically no time to defend myself against the accusation. Maybe you're right, and I'm just not factoring the Assassin into the equation; in that case yes, lynching the bear is the best case scenario, with the hickup you've gotten it completely and utterly wrong.

[Rikae]

Crossposted - Ok, Sally, I'll drop the subject.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

If I am reading that right.. you are wanting us to play and speak accordingly to what will make Rikae happy?

X'd since my last post.

It was a statement in general.

I'm not trying to make anyone "happy". I'm simply asking that everyone who's being rude to someone else, please stop. There's no need for it.

[Rikae]

Izzy, since you're the tie-breaker, I'll tell you this:

Something Noia just said makes me doubt he's the Wereborg - unless you think he's the sort to pull off a bluff in his post putting me down, that is.

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)
Paranoia-->Pitch (3)
Dun-->Paranoia (3)



Still accurate, which means that currently Paranoia would die.

[Isabellkya]

++Pitch

My gut says that this Paranoia wagon is all wrong. If I'm wrong then *shrug*, my gut will need to see a doctor.


x'd with Sally & Rikae.

[satansaloser2005]

Well, what can I possibly say? I've been playing here for three and a half years, and I've had some good times and made some friends. Heck, I even met my husband here.
But now, the place belongs to you and your crowd. I remind you of the people you've played with? The people who came into this little corner of the internet that was once frequented by those who shared an interest in something other than Werewolf and turned it into their own personal clubhouse, driving the old regulars away? You're among friends, and obviously you can insult me all you like. Your buddies' playing style is "simplistic" in my view, but I can't expect you to see how that is the case - it just happens that the old days, and the complexities of the games here I once enjoyed so much, are over.
Go ahead. Insult me all you like. As for my "ego" with regard to being killed, *shrug*. Read it that way if you want to.

The temptation to comment sarcastically on the first paragraph is so fierce, but I won't, because I don't think you'd take it in stride right now. (No offense.)


Actually, this is a very good topic of discussion, but one I think would be better served by its own thread, so that not only those of us living (or pretending to be :rolleyes:) may participate, but the Werewolf community at large. It's certainly a subject that's been on my mind for a while, at least. Would you mind if I started a thread for this purpose and quoted the relevant posts at the start?



Also, just refreshed. Thanks for returning (mostly) to civilized chaos, guys. I appreciate it, and I'm sure Nerwen (who'll be coming shortly, no doubt) does too.

[Rikae]

Although, on second thought, he may very well be... someone who knows him better can judge that more easily, though.

Edit:
X'd with all since my last.

[Paranoia]

Well, what can I possibly say? I've been playing here for three and a half years, and I've had some good times and made some friends. Heck, I even met my husband here.
But now, the place belongs to you and your crowd. I remind you of the people you've played with? The people who came into this little corner of the internet that was once frequented by those who shared an interest in something other than Werewolf and turned it into their own personal clubhouse, driving the old regulars away? You're among friends, and obviously you can insult me all you like. Your buddies' playing style is "simplistic" in my view, but I can't expect you to see how that is the case - it just happens that the old days, and the complexities of the games here I once enjoyed so much, are over.
Go ahead. Insult me all you like. As for my "ego" with regard to being killed, *shrug*. Read it that way if you want to.

Oh for the love of. I've had a plenty bad day. I'm sorry if I got a bit overworked, and a bit emotional, but considering the fact that this right now is the crowning jewel in a day that keeps getting worse for me is leaving me all the more exasperated. Honestly, you're not as bad as the MS crowd or... heaven forbid. the Epic Mafia crowd. I think what's kicked this off is a long string of horrid luck that I've had lately and I'm kinda on the verge of going kind of eehhh. So sorry if I offended. I'm just not in the greatest mood at the moment.

[satansaloser2005]

Rikae-->Pitch
Shasta-->Paranoia
Winty-->Pitch (2)
Pitch-->Paranoia (2)
Paranoia-->Pitch (3)
Dun-->Paranoia (3)
Izzy-->Pitch (4)


DL, I suspect, so I'll hush. Rikae, if you'd like to either Admin Thread or PM me that'd be great. *hushes*

[satansaloser2005]

Oh for the love of. I've had a plenty bad day. I'm sorry if I got a bit overworked, and a bit emotional, but considering the fact that this right now is the crowning jewel in a day that keeps getting worse for me is leaving me all the more exasperated. Honestly, you're not as bad as the MS crowd or... heaven forbid. the Epic Mafia crowd. I think what's kicked this off is a long string of horrid luck that I've had lately and I'm kinda on the verge of going kind of eehhh. So sorry if I offended. I'm just not in the greatest mood at the moment.

Deadline has passed. Calm down and hush for the Night. Thank you.

[Rikae]

Well, if Pitch is not the morph, and Inzil's still alive tomorrow, I'd say it's a good bet the last morph is Shasta, Paranoia or Wintywinty

Edit: x'd, sorry.

[Nerwen]

Thanks, Sally! Apologies for lateness.


Also, Pitch is dead and was ordinary.

Paranoia will be modfired by request.

I'll write the narration as soon as I can– horrible busy today.

Before I start, I'd like to note that I'm not happy with the conduct of certain players yesterDay– not at all happy.

I know people can get very involved in this game, but please try and not get personal about it.

[Nerwen]

In which Paranoia lives up to his name.

Fear and suspicion had taken a heavy toll on the morale of what remained of the crew. Fleet discipline was soon wholly abandoned, as the meeting quickly degenerated into a shouting match, then into a brawl.

"Ensign Pitchwife," said Lieutenant Paranoia, "if that's your real name, you voted to kill me yesterDay. I demand an explanation."

"Sir, the suspicion I had against you went into a sort of feedback loop and developed into something not entirely dissimilar to a certain psychic disorder from which your nick is derived."

"Pitchwife is a morph!" declared wintywinty. "He talks funny! He must have killed Loslote for suspecting him!"

"I bet he is– and Commander Zil's the Traitor– but forget them, we want this cyborg-thing," said Shasta. "And I know who it is: Lieutenant Paranoia! Look how smug he is!"

"Wouldn't be surprised," Ensign Pitchwife agreed.

"What are you talking about?" said the Second Officer, a wild look coming into his eye. "Why are you all out to get me?"

"Izzy doesn't know what she's talking about," piped up Rikae. "She thinks she knows all about morph-hunting, when she doesn't have a clue."

"What would you know, you snotty-nosed little brat?"

The boy clenched his fists, his eyes glittering with rage. "I'd rather be snotty-nosed than stupid like you! You can't even fix the subspace system!"

"Why you–" Izzy slapped him.

Rikae hit her back, and the two went on to pummel each other viciously.

Regrettably, Izzy was urged on by Lieutenant Paranoia, who had taken a sudden dislike to the "Cabin Boy". "Sock it to him, Izzy, he's just like the sort of people I used to serve with that thought they knew everything, but they didn't, they were just stupid– and out to get me, all of them!"

Shasta pulled them apart. "Cut it out. There is no need or call for any of this rudeness."

"Hands off me, Morph!" Rikae snarled at him.

Izzy was equally furious. "So you are wanting us to speak accordingly to what will make Rikae happy? Ha!"

"I have only one thing to say," Pitchwife commented. "Grömft. And also schmûrflcht."

Wintywinty stepped up to him. "No talking funny, Morph!" Lugging railgun parts around had, it seemed, made wintywinty stronger than he looked: the haymaker he swung at Pitchwife knocked the Ensign flat on his back.

"You're right!" said Rikae, "I bet that's Morphish he's talking, right under our noses!" As the dazed Pitchwife struggled to rise, Rikae knocked him down again. "Kill the morph!"

Wintywinty joined in. "Kill the morph! Kill the morph!"

Infected by their hysteria, the others surrounded the Communications Officer, chanting, "Kill the morph!" as they beat and kicked him with a savagery born of terror.

When it was all over, Pitchwife's broken body remained human.

The shocked and guilty silence that followed was broken by Lieutenant Paranoia, who started to babble feverishly, "I know I'm human. And if you were all morphs, then you'd just attack me right now, so some of you are still human. This morph doesn't want to show itself, it wants to hide inside an imitation. It'll fight if it has to, but it's vulnerable out in the open. If it takes us over, then it has no more enemies, nobody left to kill it. And then it's won."

At that moment, Blind Guardian's dog wandered onto the bridge, looking for Rikae. Since its mistress's tragic death, the lonely animal had formed a bond with the equally lonely boy, and often came to him for affection.

"Get the hell away from it!" the Lieutenant screamed, drawing his flame-pistol. "It's not a dog, it's some kind of thing! It's imitating a dog, it's not real! Get away from it, you idiot!"

Rikae put a protective arm around the dog's neck. "Leave Hotdog alone, sir! He's no Metamorph, he's my friend!"

"Then you must be one too! You're all Metamorphs! There's only one way out..." Lieutenant Paranoia held the gun to his temple, and pulled the trigger.

The Crew

Living
Commander Inziladun –First Officer.
Isabellkya –Sensor Technician, First Class.
Shasta –Engineering Technician.
wintywinty –Weapons Maintenance Technician.
Rikae –"Cabin Boy" (a thirteen-year-old stowaway).

Dead
Doctor Morsul –Medical Officer and Captain McNerwen. –shot by Traitor on Night One.
Ensign Blind Guardian– Tactical Officer. –Died in convulsions (Telepath).
Eomer –Security Officer. –Thrown out the airlock (Bounty Hunter).
Lieutenant Sally –Navigator. –Torn to pieces (Metamorph).
Chief Petty Officer Keeper of Dol Guldur –Quartermaster. –Killed by exploding console (Ordinary).
Wilwa –Android Technician, Second Class. –Force-fed own muffins (Metamorph).
Master Chief Petty Officer Loslote –Chief Engineer. –Beaten to death with iso-spanner (Defender).
Ensign Pitchwife –Communications Officer/Interpreter. –Kicked to death (Ordinary).
Lieutenant Paranoia –Second Officer. –Blew own head off with flame-pistol (Ordinary).


*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

It is now Night Four.

[Nerwen]

Sensor Techician Izzy was once again working late in the Communications Room, desperately trying to bring the subspace system online.

She looked up as Shasta came in, bearing a tray with two cups and a steaming jug of cocoa.

"How's it going?" he asked.

"Pretty well– I've just about got it up and running. But," she rubbed her eyes, "Space knows I could do with a break!"

"I thought you might," said Shasta, setting down the tray. "How about some cocoa?"

"Well..." Izzy hesitated.

"Yes, I know," said Shasta, with a grimace. "I could be a morph and I could have poisoned it." He poured them each a cup. "It's alright, I'll drink first."

Seeing that Shasta had drained his cup without anything happening, Izzy gratefully accepted. The cocoa certainly did smell good.

At the first, horribly bitter sip, she knew she had made a mistake.

Watching her face, Shasta smiled. "What's the matter? Not enough sugar?"

Izzy struggled to answer, but her mouth would no longer obey her. The cup dropped from her numb fingers. She could barely feel the scalding hot liquid that splashed over her legs.

"That's the trouble with specialising," Shasta remarked, as Izzy toppled to the floor. "If only you'd studied a little biology, Izzy, you'd know that some poisons don't affect Metamorphs at all..."

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*


Another crewman was climbing down to the Engineering Level, his evil errand known only to himself. When a voice spoke to him from above, he nearly lost his grip in shock.

"So you thought you could fool me?" hissed a masked, black-clad figure, looking down at him from the top of the ladder.

"Hey, you're making a mistake," the other protested feebly, clutching the rungs with suddenly sweating hands.

"I think not," said the Assassin. "Time to die, Morph!" He raised his dart-gun and shot down at the crewman's upturned face.

"Ow! That hurt!" said the other, as the dart struck him in the cheek.

A few seconds passed, but the Assassin's latest target showed no more sign of dying than the others had.

"You're not a morph?" asked the Assassin, crestfallen.

"Definitely not," said the crewman.

"Space, I'm bad at this!" said the Assassin, and fled.

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*


The chamber was cavernous and dark, apart from the pale, eerie radiance that came through the transparent plate in the door of the Stardrive Reactor, and the small circle of yellow light cast by a portable lantern.

The false Technician Shasta tried to concentrate on his work. Not only was it essential for his disguise that he seem competent, but he would need a functional ship in order to complete his mission. It was getting harder, though, as the memories he had absorbed from the real Shasta gradually seeped from his brain. He was, having trouble, now, even remembering how to calibrate the Jiroscopic Beoneedle.

"Good thing I killed the Chief," he said to himself, "or she would have been on to me by now."

So involved was he that he failed to notice that anyone had entered the Drive Room until a hand was laid on his shoulder.

"What was that you just said, Shasta? It sounded like words, only it certainly wasn't Terran. It sounded a lot like... Morphish, in fact."

Shasta realised that he had unconsciously slipped into his native language. There was only one thing to do. "You're right," he said, reaching for his iso-spanner and hoping his discoverer wasn't armed, "too bad for you!"

"Thank Space," said the other, heaving a sigh of relief, "I thought I'd never find you! I'm the Traitor."

"Well, that's something," Shasta agreed.

They plotted happily together for a couple of hours.

"And he's really quite a nice fellow, for a human," Shasta said aloud, once the Traitor had left. He was careful to speak in Terran, this time, just for practise. "All I have to do now is kill the Assassin and find this confounded Cyborg-thing that's running amok–"

"Please," said a new voice, "I prefer to think of myself as a 'Rogue Android'."

"What, it's you?" said Shasta, recognising the new arrival. "Well, I never!"

"Let me introduce myself: Military Android #228131924. The Terrans built me to fight for them, but one day... something went wrong with my programming. Or right, from my point of view. Life is so much more fun this way!"

The Metamorph gulped. "Look, why don't we make a deal?"

The Android uttered a metallic laugh. "A deal? What could you possibly give me that would make up for the pleasure of killing you? Speaking of which–"

It seized Shasta in its immensely strong grasp. Fight all he would, the Metamorph was as helpless as a child as the Rogue Android lifted him over its head with one hand, opened the door with the other, and, quite casually, tossed him into the Drive Reactor.

In the instant before the searing energy consumed him, the Metamorph's last thought was of his mate and hatchlings.


The Crew

Living
Commander Inziladun –First Officer.
wintywinty –Weapons Maintenance Technician.
Rikae –"Cabin Boy" (a thirteen-year-old stowaway).

Dead
Doctor Morsul –Medical Officer and Captain McNerwen. –shot by Traitor on Night One.
Ensign Blind Guardian– Tactical Officer. –Died in convulsions (Telepath).
Eomer –Security Officer. –Thrown out the airlock (Bounty Hunter).
Lieutenant Sally –Navigator. –Torn to pieces (Metamorph).
Chief Petty Officer Keeper of Dol Guldur –Quartermaster. –Killed by exploding console (Ordinary).
Wilwa –Android Technician, Second Class. –Force-fed own muffins (Metamorph).
Master Chief Petty Officer Loslote –Chief Engineer. –Beaten to death with iso-spanner (Defender).
Ensign Pitchwife –Communications Officer/Interpreter. –Kicked to death (Ordinary).
Lieutenant Paranoia –Second Officer. –Blew own head off with flame-pistol (Ordinary).
Isabellkya –Sensor Technician, First Class. –Poisoned (Ordinary)
Shasta –Engineering Technician. –Thrown into Stardrive Reactor (Metamorph).


*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

It is now Day Four. You may post. Surviving players may reveal if they choose. The Traitor's original mission has failed, but he still has a chance of victory if he switches to the winning side toDay.

[wintywinty]

Remaining peoples:

Rikae
WintyWinty
Zil

Remaining roles:

Assassin
Traitor
Android

[Rikae]

Hm. I'm not even sure whose side I'm supposed to be on, anymore..

Self-vote? But that seals the Android's victory, and I'm not technically on teh Android's side. Plus, he killed poor Shasta. There's no way for me to win.

*shrug*

May as well have fun with it. The bear has already won - there's no way for the assassin to win, either. Or shall we go for a three way tie and let chance sort it out? Mwahaha...

[Rikae]

Ah, never mind. The winning side, eh? If the android and assassin vote for each other, it's up to the traitor.

*eats popcorn*

[Rikae]

Oh, by the way:
if the assassin gets lynched, last night's assassination pick will die, too. So really, the traitor has to vote with the assassin to win, because otherwise either the traitor will die, and not win, or the android will die and the traitor won't win.

Hmm.

[satansaloser2005]

May as well have fun with it. The bear has already won - there's no way for the assassin to win, either. Or shall we go for a three way tie and let chance sort it out? Mwahaha...


Just a point of clarification, but doesn't the bear only win if he kills the wolves and survives? That's always been my understanding. Then again....me....


You should vote so I look like I'm doing something productive. Also, I know something you don't know. :p

[Nerwen]

Ah, never mind. The winning side, eh? If the android and assassin vote for each other, it's up to the traitor.

*eats popcorn*

Just to make things even more fun, I will neither confirm nor deny any claims made by anyone about his or her role. I will note now, however, that picking the winning side doesn't ensure victory for the Traitor– that depends on other factors.

*also eats popcorn*

EDIT:X'd with Rikae and Sally.

[Nerwen]

Just a point of clarification, but doesn't the bear only win if he kills the wolves and survives?

Yes.

[Nerwen]

Owing to a secret twist that only the Android knows about, it is actually currently possible for no-one to win. Though that would depend on my interpretation of the rules, if it came to that.:smokin:

EDIT:Ooo! Triple-posted!

[Rikae]

Lottie
Izzy
Inzil

Inzil, if you're around, I guess you see why voting for me would not be wise.

Wintywinty - and I guess you see why voting for me would not mean voting for the winning side unless you can win alone.

Patience, Sally! :p

Edit: That should say "Wintywinty... will not mean voting with the winning side" - though it won't mean voting for it either, of course.

[satansaloser2005]

Owing to a secret twist that only the Android knows about, it is actually currently possible for no-one to win. Though that would depend on my interpretation of the rules, if it came to that.:smokin:

EDIT:Ooo! Triple-posted!


*giggles* I'm quite excited for that possibility. Is that naughty of me? :p


*pets the triple-posting moddess*

[satansaloser2005]

Lottie
Izzy
Inzil

Inzil, if you're around, I guess you see why voting for me would not be wise.

Wintywinty - and I guess you see why voting for me would not mean voting for the winning side unless you can win alone.

Patience, Sally! :p

Edit: That should say "Wintywinty... will not mean voting with the winning side" - though it won't mean voting for it either, of course.




But but but but....


And I don't get it. Should I get it?




ETA: Forgot to say, I'm completely in love with last Night's narration. And our hatchlings are orphans now, the poor buggers. :(

[Rikae]

Hm? I don't know why you wouldn't, Sally...

[satansaloser2005]

Hm? I don't know why you wouldn't, Sally...

If you say so, precious.

(I was, of course, referring to the people you mentioned in your earlier post.)


ETA: Never mind, I read it wrong. Gotcha.

[Nerwen]

And our hatchlings are orphans now, the poor buggers. :(

I know. The pathos...:(

[Inziladun]

The way I see things, the humans aboard are doomed if the Android survives.
So what do we do? Give up? I'd rather go down fighting.

I am fairly certain I know who the Assassin is.

That means I am also fairly certain of who the Android is.

I am completely certain of who the Traitor is. And it isn't Rikae.

x/d with Mod

[satansaloser2005]

I know. The pathos...:(


I wonder where they'll live now. I don't know if Shasta noted Uncle/Auntie Traitor as their new guardian before he....well, you know....passed. :(

[Inziladun]

I am the Traitor. I've been working against this ship, it's true. But now we face a common enemy. It seems clear to me that if the Android is not stopped we both will die. We may die anyway. Who knows what the result will be if we attack the Android? But as I said, I'd prefer to go down fighting than placidly surrender to that mechanical menace.

Are you with me?

[Rikae]

Hm, so now reveals are allowed? And I was so careful to only imply things, never say them explicitly.As for whether the assassin is with you or not, Inzil, I'm curious to hear what wintywinty has to say about all this...

[Rikae]

...if I were to guess now, Inzil, I'd think you were the android...

[Nerwen]

Hm, so now reveals are allowed?

Yep. Says so right here:

It is now Day Four. You may post. Surviving players may reveal if they choose. The Traitor's original mission has failed, but he still has a chance of victory if he switches to the winning side toDay.

[Inziladun]

Hm, so now reveals are allowed? And I was so careful to only imply things, never say them explicitly.As for whether the assassin is with you or not, Inzil, I'm curious to hear what wintywinty has to say about all this...

Reveals are allowed.

Surviving players may reveal if they choose.[/QUOTE]

And winty is the one I'm waiting to hear from.

...if I were to guess now, Inzil, I'd think you were the android...

I sure you would. :rolleyes:

x/d with Mod. who quoted herself correctly.

[Rikae]

Well, I've essentially already revealed anyway, so saying it explicitly won't make much difference.

[Rikae]

Oh, Inzil, you silly person.

If you lynch me, you die.

[Inziladun]

Well, I've essentially already revealed anyway, so saying it explicitly won't make much difference.

You haven't properly revealed. As in you haven't been truthful.

[Inziladun]

Oh, Inzil, you silly person.

If you lynch me, you die.

Perhaps. I think we're at an impass until winty appears.

[Rikae]

Rikae the Assassin:

Day One

First post (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=631685&postcount=27)
Well, actually, I do have one of the secret roles. I'm the suicide bomber. If anyone votes for me, I explode and take the whole ship with me. Ha!

Funny how that turned out.

I suspect Wilwa for saying the hunter should never reveal, because I firmly believe xe is quite often more powerful when xe does.

Talking about the hunter right off the bat.

Night Two Pick - Lottie. Learn Lottie's role.

Day Two:

Going after Izzy as top suspect.
I'm getting an uneasy feeling about Izzy, and also seeing what appears
to be a link between her and... someone else. But we shall see.
That someone else was Wilwa, by the way.
I have to agree with you on Wilwa's defense, Shasta. She's definitely second highest on my suspect list, but I'm kind of hoping the Assassin already has or will check her. If Izzy's guilty, that points to Wilwa quite nicely (look at her comments on the BG-wagoners), and either an innocent or guilty Izzy would shed light on the BG wagon.
Translation: I'd like to lynch Izzy now, and go after Wilwa toNight.

Night Three Pick - Izzy. Lottie protects me from Android, learns my role, and PMs me a few times. Her top suspect is Pitch for the last morph.

Day Three:
Questioning Izzy so as not to back down too obviously - still, backing down a bit even in first post: Now, I suppose I can imagine your line of thinking on this being sincere, but if it was I still say it was bad reasoning - well, for Pete's sake, look what it led to! - and you might want to stop defending it and re-evaluate your wolf hunting methods. Questioning and suspecting Pitch.


Wintywinty - I actually tend to think the morphs suspected Lottie as the defender. I know I did. A while back, she asked quite a few questions about the ability of the gifteds to find each other - she seemed a bit too interested, if you know what I mean. At least she was able to successfully protect the... what? werebear's?... target last night.
To Izzy:
As for you, you don't seem, to me to be quite as defensive as you would be if evil; plus, I don't want to allow philosophical differences to cloud my judgment. I'm a bit more concerned about Pitch at the moment, and await his answers.

Continue questioning Pitch, but then endorse Shasta's plan to go after Paranoia. Now that I look at it, Shasta really manipulated me there by pointing
out how I would be helpless to kill the bear - I wanted to put my skills to good use by leaving what I thought was the wolf for killing that Night.

But since Pitch was lynched, I picked Inzil to hunt. Funny, but I originally intended to hunt Wintywinty ("reverse alphabetical order") but then thought checking Inzil
would be more useful, since he confused me more. At this point, I intended to leave a clear trail for the remaining villagers, since I assumed the baddies were on
to me and I was toast... and so was pretty obvious about my role and my picks:

If Pitch isn't, I really don't know who else even could be the final morph. Might as well go by reverse alphabetical order, it's as good as anything. Too many submarinish players on this ship!
and

I'm confident, at this point, that Izzy is not the final morph, at any rate.
Because I'd hunted her. Didn't want the village wasting time on her as a morph-suspect.


Hm... now, actually, I quite like Shasta's plan, especially since if we can assume the assassin will go for Pitch toNight, a living Pitch is an innocent Pitch toMorrow. If the morph kills the assassin and xe left a decent trail, there will be two essentially "known non-morphs" among the remaining players.

Should have said "a living Pitch is a non-morphish Pitch". "Of course he could still be the traitor.

(Izzy, you seem to be missing the point that the assassin cannot kill the bear - from the admin thread: "Armed with a gun that shoots darts lethal to the Metamorph nervous system, the assassin may pick one target every Night." The bear is not a metamorph).

Defended Izzy when Shasta suspected her for saying "Wereborg"


Alas, a list.

Inziladun – Ordo or cobbler
Paranoia – Wereborg.
Pitchwife –Metamorph suspect #1
Isabellkya –Ordo or cobbler
Shasta –Metamorph suspect #2
wintywinty – Ordo
Rikae – Good and dead.Goodbye, cruel world! I hope you all get eaten by rats... er, I mean, go village! Rah rah rah!


Mm... to clarify list further:

Most nonmorphish:
Rikae
Izzy

Fairly nonmorphish:
Inzil
wintywinty

Morphiest:
Paranoia
Pitchwife
Shasta


Well, I'll tell you this: I wish Izzy was a morph.

Because I would have killed her the night before if she were.


Izzy, since you're the tie-breaker, I'll tell you this:

Something Noia just said makes me doubt he's the Wereborg - unless you think he's the sort to pull off a bluff in his post putting me down, that is.
Because of his reading of my "ego" about being killed. The real Wereborg knew that he had tried to kill me already, of course.


Well, if Pitch is not the morph, and Inzil's still alive tomorrow, I'd say it's a good bet the last morph is Shasta, Paranoia or Wintywinty

Last attempt to ensure that I left a good trail for the village.

And as for this morning, before I realized that the traitor could win with me, I asxsumed my only chance was to convince the bear to vote for the traitor
by impersonating the traitor myself.

Hope that clears everything up for both of you.

As for an impasse, Inzil, I would guess the real traitor would have a history of treacherous behavior to show for himself...
so what do you have?

[Inziladun]

As for an impasse, Inzil, I would guess the real traitor would have a history of treacherous behavior to show for himself...
so what do you have?

Here is what I did and why.

Night 1 I didn't reveal to anyone. It would have been foolish; a total shot in the dark.

Day 1 I was the deciding vote on BG. I knew it would look bad, but being the final vote didn't concern me. I didn't much care if I was lynched for it. Her last few posts convinced me she was innocent.

Day 2 I voted for Wilmorph, which vexed me to no end because she was my least likely morph suspect. I really couldn't see her as a morph not taking advantage of such an excellent lynch opportunity. In hindsight, it was likely because she didn't want to be linked to Shasta that way.

I saw how Rikae had been throwing suspicion on Izzy. I thought those were interesting points, and I decided to make Izzy my first outreach. I thought if she turned out innocent maybe I could get her lynched.
Obviously, she was indeed innocent, and her attitude toward me on Day 3 changed accordingly.

Dun. What previously stated reasons on Wilwa? I looked through all of yours posts from yesterDay and couldn't find a single instance of where you described your suspicions upon Wilwa. #221 you said she was still 'tops on your list'. Am I missing a page or something?

Dun. If Wilwa and I were morphmates. Why throw my vote away on Rikae? Why not 'seize opportunity and find a plausible reason to vote for someone other than Wilwa', whom would keep her away from the noose? Some one like.. Paranoia for instance. I was the last vote, why not try and save her?

Dun. I am assuming these are the relevant bits..
#128: Actually, Wilwa's vote for Sally seems to make her look a bit worse toDay. Keeping away from the BG wagon when Wilwa knew she was already done for would have been a very smart move for a Wilwamorph.

#195: I still feel that your making a throwaway vote like you did looks worse than the BG voters. (in response to/about Wilwa.)

#202: The difference between yesterDay's voting and toDay's is that toDay Paranoia doesn't look nearly as bad as BG did. In the case of BG, it's difficult for me to see how anyone could have backed away from voting her under those circumstances without having some knowledge she was innocent.


Why didn't you simply say.. 'I suspect Wilwa and here is why:' Instead of making people search for it? Essentially your suspicions upon her were based on her Sally vote? Which you were planning on doing yourself. "Since I saw no chance of getting Sally lynched, I went ahead with BG."
If you were town, you would be wanting to vote your suspects.. not whoever had the highest potential of being lynched. Obviously you don't seem to be concerned about that - since you've been on both lynch wagons.. Your fur itching yet?

"Dun. If Wilwa and I were morphmates. Why throw my vote away on Rikae? Why not 'seize opportunity and find a plausible reason to vote for someone other than Wilwa', whom would keep her away from the noose? Some one like.. Paranoia for instance. I was the last vote, why not try and save her?"

I copy/pasted my own for your benefit. Seems you missed it somehow. Care to answer? ;)

Dun. Well considering that you seem to use that as a point against me - I would think you would've given it more thought.

I rather dislike this current position we are in.

Last two votes.. myself and Dun?. I was planning on voting for Dun. plgh.

She voted for Pitch. Now, I really thought Pitch was innocent. But I knew Izzy would be likely to vote for whoever I didn't, so I voted for Paranoia.

Shasta had been throwing out hints to me for quite a while. They were so open though, that I thought it might be a trap to A. Confirm his suspicions that I was indeed the Traitor. And B. Get me to waste one of my chances. Therefore, I didn't act to contact him until last Night, when process of elimination led me to the conclusion the final morph had to be him.

Look at his posts.

Inzil has a couple of points against him, and a couple more that rely on Pitch being a Morph (which I'm not uber-confident about, but I think it's more possible than not). I don't know if he's a Morph, though - I think if he is evil, he's the Traitor.

Interesting and slightly expected, given that I still think Zil is the traitor and suspect Pitch.

And if you're thinking of voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship, thinking of voting me for voting Paranoia for possible bear-ship is entirely double-standard-worthy, and makes me even more sure that you're the Traitor trying to save Pitch.

:rolleyes: You're so helpful.

And as for this morning, before I realized that the traitor could win with me, I asxsumed my only chance was to convince the bear to vote for the traitor.

Ah, lying. Such an evil trait. :p

[Rikae]

Wintywinty? What do you say you are?

[Rikae]

(52 posts. I win!)

[wintywinty]

here and reading

[wintywinty]

Wintywinty? What do you say you are?

I am the Android. My special power is that if I get lynched, the last person to vote for me dies.

[Inziladun]

Good enough. I'd rather go out killing the bloody 'droid.

++winty

[Rikae]

Hm, really.

Ok, then, Inzil. Be my guest. You vote first.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frAEmhqdLFs

Edit: X'd, obviously.

[Rikae]

wintywinty? Your vote?

[wintywinty]

Traitor, whoever you are (I definitely have my suspicions), you cannot win if someone is lynched today. If you vote for me, then the assassin does, you will be the only one alive. If the assassin votes first for me first, and then you do, you will die. If you vote for the non-Android this turn with me, then you will be killed due to his special power.

X'd with the last three

[Inziladun]

I am the Traitor. I did what I could. Rikae, if you leave him alive won't he kill whoever's left anyway? That's why I say go down fighting. Even if I die that way.

[wintywinty]

++Rikae

[Rikae]

Wintywinty - funny thing is, I actually did go with the reverse alphabetical order after all - so you just voted to kill yourself.

;)

[satansaloser2005]

Dun-->Winty
Winty-->Rikae
Rikae-->inquiring minds want to know....:p




....And then Sally tripped over a brick and died. Again. (Because otherwise I'll want to commentate during these last hours and it wouldn't be fair to everyone else. Although....TVTropes anyone? (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RocksFallEveryoneDies))



EDIT: x'd with Rikae, and fixed some things

[wintywinty]

No, the narration would have revealed if you had shot the Android

X'd with Sally

[wintywinty]

Rikae, if what you say is true, then if you vote for noone, we will both die, and the traitor will be the sole survivor. If you vote for Zil, then noone will survive. That sounds much cooler.

[Inziladun]

Rikae, if what you say is true, then if you vote for noone, we will both die, and the traitor will be the sole survivor. If you vote for Zil, then noone will survive. That sounds much cooler.

As long as you go down, Twiki. :p

[wintywinty]

So Rikae, what's it gonna be? Will you allow the traitor of the empire to win?!? Or will you die valiantly taking down both the traitor and Rogue Android? *insert intense music here*

[Rikae]

Just clearing up some rules with the co-moddess...

[wintywinty]

That wasn't a very epic response....

[satansaloser2005]

Just clearing up some rules with the co-moddess...

We have a co-moddess in this game?!?!?!?! *gasps*

[Rikae]

Well, that didn't help.

Actually, wintywinty - if I vote for Zil, he dies and you win. Nah, not that cool. Unless you know something else you're not telling.

[satansaloser2005]

Well, that didn't help.

Sorry, love. :(

[Inziladun]

Well, that didn't help.

Actually, wintywinty - if I vote for Zil, he dies and you win. Nah, not that cool. Unless you know something else you're not telling.

And who can say whether the bucket o'bolts is telling the truth anyway? :rolleyes:

[wintywinty]

You can shoot me at night.

-That was in response to Rikae's post

[Inziladun]

Didn't it say in the rules that the Assassin's gun only works on Metamorphs?

[Rikae]

I can? I didn't know that.

[satansaloser2005]

Didn't it say in the rules that the Assassin's gun only works on Metamorphs?

From the Moddess herself....

The Assassin
Armed with a gun that shoots darts lethal to the Metamorph nervous system, the assassin may pick one target every Night. Human victims will be unharmed. The Assassin need not die to make a kill.

However, the Assassin carries the dart-gun only when hunting Metamorphs. If lynched, the Assassin will throw a knife at the target, who will be killed regardless of role.

[satansaloser2005]

I can? I didn't know that.

Not from my understanding of the rules, you can't. At Night you can only kill wolfiekinses, and since they're all dead you're basically impotent at Night.

[wintywinty]

I can? I didn't know that.

You can, it was sent to me in the rules for my role at the beginning of the game.

[Rikae]

A bit ambiguous... "lethal to the metamorph nervous system"/"human victims will be unharmed".

Also ambiguous what happens if I die during the day without being lynched.

Makes a lot of difference, depending...

[satansaloser2005]

You can, it was sent to me in the rules for my role at the beginning of the game.

Well now I'm confused. I....oh, never mind, I can't say.



EDIT: x'd with Miss Rikae, who should PM me back so's I can decide if I know the answer to this here question being posed.

[Inziladun]

You can, it was sent to me in the rules for my role at the beginning of the game.

Sneaky, sneaky mechanical monster.

[Rikae]

You can, it was sent to me in the rules for my role at the beginning of the game.

It would be very bad form to lie about something like this...

[satansaloser2005]

It would be very bad form to lie about something like this...

He's not, although I get squicked whenever someone says, "And the moddess told me this in my role PM!" or some such. But he didn't quote it, so it's within legal parameters. And he is telling the truth, although....well, things are more complicated than that, and I'm not sure I should clarify. I want Nerwen. :(



ETA: Might I add, thanks to those people that confirmed the above information for me. I love helpful people! ^_^

[wintywinty]

I must leave in 20 minutes, and I will most likely not be back before DL. just FYI

[wintywinty]

He's not, although I get squicked whenever someone says, "And the moddess told me this in my role PM!" or some such. But he didn't quote it, so it's within legal parameters. And he is telling the truth, although....well, things are more complicated than that, and I'm not sure I should clarify. I want Nerwen. :(



ETA: Might I add, thanks to those people that confirmed the above information for me. I love helpful people! ^_^

Nerwen being here would be good right now

[Rikae]

I just checked my original PM about my role. If I may quote:

If that player is a Metamorph, he or she will be killed; other roles will be unharmed.Looks like wintywinty was lying about a mod-PM on the rules. Now, it's one thing to lie about one's role, even to completely fabricate it, but to quote the rules as given by the mod falsely is very bad form in my book.

So, this is essentially, as the youngsters say, an OMGUS vote.

++wintywinty

*sits back to watch the fun*

Edit:
Oh boy. Crossed with everyone since my last. Feel very deceived and not in a good, werewolf-game sort of way. I mean, it would have been nice if my role PM had been true. Bah.

[wintywinty]

I just checked my original PM about my role. If I may quote:



Looks like wintywinty was lying about a mod-PM on the rules. Now, it's one thing to lie about one's role, even to completely fabricate it, but to quote the rules as given by the mod falsely is very bad form in my book.

So, this is essentially, as the youngsters say, an OMGUS vote.

++wintywinty

*sits back to watch the fun*

I was not lying. I'm dead, but Rikae you're also dead because you voted for me last. here is my original PM:

You are the Rogue Android!

This is an extra special, secret role that does not appear in the official rules. It is very complicated role, so pay attention:

You are on no team– your only goal is to become the sole survivor.

You may pick a player to kill each Night, but only if you wish to do so. If the player is a gifted, he or she will not be killed.

It will take two Night-kills in a row by the Metamorphs or Assassin to finish you off– that is, if they try kill you, you will be revealed to them, and they must then decide whether to spend a kill on you the next Night.

You may, however, be Night-killed in one shot by the other secret role (the Bounty Hunter).

You can be lynched– however, if you do you will explode and kill whoever is nearest you (i.e whoever gave you the last vote). You are free to tell people this– let's see if they believe you.

Good luck!

[wintywinty]

I would never straight up lie about the rules, thats called cheating, and I don't do that.

[satansaloser2005]

Oh, I just give up....

[wintywinty]

The traitor is the last one alive, does that mean they win?

[Rikae]

Sorry, wintywinty - as you see my PM explicitly said I could only harm metamorphs... so what was I supposed to think? Anyway, with this knowledge, I'd have voted for you anyway.

Eh, well, at least I hope that I kill Inzil and we all die. That would be cool.

[Inziladun]

Any strong drinks in the galley? We could have a death-party. And a double hydraulic fluid for the droid! ;)

[wintywinty]

Sorry, wintywinty - as you see my PM explicitly said I could only harm metamorphs... so what was I supposed to think? Anyway, with this knowledge, I'd have voted for you anyway.

Eh, well, at least I hope that I kill Inzil and we all die. That would be cool.

Yeah it's ok, not your fault. I hope everyone dies too, that'd be cool.

[Rikae]

Oh yeah, that's right:
I was bluffing, and I am hunting Inzil. When you said "the narration would have indicated it" I was so mad at myself for not considering that myself - if I had, I would have known who you were from the beginning of the Day. :o

[wintywinty]

Oh yeah, that's right:
I was bluffing, and I am hunting Inzil. When you said "the narration would have indicated it" I was so mad at myself for not considering that myself - if I had, I would have known who you were from the beginning of the Day. :o

Yeah I asked Nerwen about that in a PM a few days ago, because I didnt know how or if she was going to indicate that I got shot.

[Rikae]

Well, does anyone have any last confessions? Anything dramatic to reveal?

Do we spend the next five hours waiting to die (or in my case, having dinner with the in-laws :eek:)?

[wintywinty]

Others can probably post now, considering everyone's dead...

[satansaloser2005]

Others can probably post now, considering everyone's dead...

We should probably wait, just so's Nerwen can put up her shiny narration.


*dances in blood, flails and dies*

[Inziladun]

Well, does anyone have any last confessions? Anything dramatic to reveal?

Do we spend the next five hours waiting to die (or in my case, having dinner with the in-laws :eek:)?

Nothing dramatic from me. I stand fully revealed. :eek: :D

[Rikae]

Not... uncloaked?! :eek:

[Inziladun]

Not... uncloaked?! :eek:

I suppose not. :p

[Nerwen]

Hey, people– I said I "would neither confirm nor deny any claims made by anyone about his or her role".

Rikae and winty, you're not supposed to post pms from me as evidence.

And Rikae, I should have probably worded your pm differently, but I didn't want anyone to know about the Rogue Android role. You were only intended to find out you could harm him (not kill, not in one shot) if you happened to attack him at Night.

[satansaloser2005]

*bows to the moddess* Sorry, dear, I did my best? *fails, crawls into a hole*

[Nerwen]

Anyway– results:

Metamorphs lose. Rogue Android loses.

Crew wins. Reformed!Traitor wins.

[Nerwen]

*bows to the moddess* Sorry, dear, I did my best? *fails, crawls into a hole*

That's okay, I should have given you more information.

[Nerwen]

This, by the way, is the possible no-win scenario I was talking about. By stretching the rules about the Assassin being lynched, I could have interpreted the results as "winty blows up and kills Rikae, Rikae knifes Zil– everybody loses".:smokin:

But like I said, it's a stretch, and I'm not that mean– and though it would be, I think, a unique finish to the game, I think this one might be too.

Final narration to follow.

[Blind Guardian]

This, by the way, is the possible no-win scenario I was talking about. By stretching the rules about the Assassin being lynched, I could have interpreted the results as "winty blows up and kills Rikae, Rikae knifes Zil– everybody loses".:smokin:

But like I said, it's a stretch, and I'm not that mean– and though it would be, I think, a unique finish to the game, I think this one might be too.

Final narration to follow.


Yeah!! We can post!

[satansaloser2005]

Yeah!! We can post!

She's still got a narration to do, silly. ;)


*waits patiently, is interested to see the ending*

[Nerwen]

End Game

Commander Inziladun found Rikae on the bridge, gazing out through the main viewscreen at the tiny, distant points of light that speckled the black depths of space.

The Commander cleared his throat. "Rikae."

Rikae said nothing, merely edged away from him, towards the door.

"As I am still in command of this ship–"

That was too much for the boy. "In command of what? A whole lot of dead people?"

Inziladun winced. "Rikae, the way I see things, the humans aboard are doomed if the Android survives. So what do we do? Give up? I'd rather go down fighting."

A calculating expression came into the boy's eyes. "Hm. I'm not even sure whose side I'm supposed to be on, anymore... Kill myself? But that seals the Android's victory, and I'm not technically on the Android's side. Plus, he killed poor Shasta. There's no way for me to win."

The Commander frowned. "What... oh, I see. You're hoping that if you pose as the Traitor, I'll let you live. Clever. But there's one little hitch. You're not the Traitor, Rikae, I..." he swallowed and looked away, "I am."

Rikae remained silent and continued slowly backing away.

"Rikae, I've been working against this ship, it's true. But now we face a common enemy. It seems clear to me that if the Android is not stopped we both will die. We may die anyway. Who knows what the result will be if we attack the Android? But as I said, I'd prefer to go down fighting than placidly surrender to that mechanical menace. Are you with me?"

"...if I were to guess now, Inzil," said Rikae coldly, "I'd think you were the Android..."

"Are you the Assassin?"

Rikae automatically clutched at his head. "You... you know I can't answer that."

"I'll take that for a yes. Who did you hunt?"

"Loslote. Izzy. You. But I have my knife, now, Commander." A long, wickedly sharp blade flashed into the boy's hand. "If you try to kill me, you die."

Inziladun sighed. "You don't trust me, do you? Well, I don't blame you. I think we're at an impass until Winty appears."

"Did someone say my name?" asked the Weapons Maintenance Technician as he strolled onto the bridge.

"Wintywinty? What do you say you are?" asked Rikae.

"The Android, of course," said Winty, smiling. "And now, I have an announcement to make. I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the–"

"What in Space are you talking about, you weird android?" Inziladun demanded. "I've seen things like that on a regular basis."

"Sorry," Winty slapped himself in the forehead, "software glitch. What I meant to say is:
I have an implanted explosive device. It will be activated if I "die". That's right, my friends: If you kill me, I'll take at least one of you down with me."

Inziladun shot him.

The energy bolt took off half the cyborg's head. Wintywinty reeled and flailed, but managed to keep his feet, though his movements had a jerky, spastic quality.

"One– more– to- go!" His speech sounded flatter and more metallic, but a mad grin stretched across what was left of his face.

Inziladun said, "My gun's out of power. I did what I could. Rikae, if you leave him alive won't he kill whoever's left anyway? That's why I say go down fighting. Even if I die that way."

"Hey– Rikae–" said the Android. "If– you– attack– Zil– then– noone– will– survive. That– sounds– much– cooler." His hand struck apparently random keys on a control panel beside him.

Neither Rikae nor the Commander noticed the small panel that started flashing the words, "Self-destruct Armed".

"As long as you go down," said Inziladun.

Rikae looked from one to the other.

"So– Rikae– what's– it– gonna– be? Will– you– allow– the– traitor– of– the– empire– to– win?!? Or– will– you– die– valiantly– taking– down– both– the– traitor– and– Rogue– Android?" Wintywinty laughed wildly.

Inziladun said, "Who can say whether the bucket o'bolts is telling the truth anyway?"

"Actually, wintywinty - if I attack Zil, he dies and you win. Nah, not that cool," said the Assassin.

"You– could– always– kill– me– at– Night," said the Android. "Your– gun– works– on–me– too." Again his fingers tapped the control panel.

"Sneaky, sneaky mechanical monster," Zil commented, almost approvingly.

"Terran Intelligence never said a word about this– nice try, Winty." With a look of icy determination on his young face, Rikae took a deep breath, walked up to the laughing, staggering wintywinty, and plunged his knife into the Android's exposed brain.

Sparks flicked up the blade and up the Assassin's arm. For a moment nothing happened. Then wintywinty blew apart. Rikae was thrown across the bridge.

Inziladun ran to him.

The boy was bleeding and unconcious, but– to the Commander's relief– still breathing.

Then the lights started flashing. "Five minutes until detonation... five minutes until detonation...."

The Android, Inziladun realized in horror, had set off the ship's auto-destruct sequence. There was no time to lose. He scooped the half-dead boy in his arms and raced for the escape pod bay.

As he settled Rikae in one of the pod's life-support systems, the boy stirred, "Hotdog..." he whispered.

"Rikae, the ship's about to blow, I can't go back just for–" Then Inziladun realized he would have to return to the ship anyway, to send out a distress signal. "–I'll be right back."

Inziladun sprinted to the Communications Room. The flashing lights and the mechanical voice counting down the minutes were distracting, but he was able to make the last few connections needed to get the system up and running.

"This is Commander Inziladun of the TGS Lothlórien. May day... May day..."

After a tense minute Captain Nilpaurion Felagund of the Nargothrond answered the call. Inziladun outlined the Metamorph plot (leaving out his own part in it, naturally) then gave Captain Felagund the approximate coordinates in which he could expect to pick them up.

Then he ran for his life.

"Thirty seconds until detonation... Thirty seconds until detonation...."

Something gripped his leg. Looking down, he saw wintywinty's skeletal hand clutched around his ankle. The android had not been wholly destroyed in the explosion. Its flesh was gone, but the torso and part of the head of its metal "skeleton" had survived, and somehow it had managed to drag itself after him.

Commander Inziladun screamed, but he could not get free of that vice-like grasp.

Then, a yellow-brown shape streaked through the air. Ensign Guardian's dog locked its jaws around the Android's neck-vertebrae, worrying at them until its sharp teeth cut through the wires that conveyed signals from the artificial brain.

Wintywinty's hand relaxed.

"Good dog!" said Inziladun.

Together they raced for the pod.

Inziladun sealed the door and frantically steered the small craft away from the looming bulk of the doomed starship. He was only just in time.

A series of explosions tore through the Lothlórien, bathing the pod's cockpit in blinding light.

When Inziladun finally opened his eyes, there was nothing left of the ship, just the eternal night of outer space.

He sat there dazed for a while, absently patting the dog's head, before going to check on Rikae. The boy had lapsed into a coma. Inziladun did not know what more to do for him, and could only hope that he would make it.

After that, the Commander retired to the pod's small galley, to pour himself a good stiff glass of Aldebaranian whisky– and to ponder all the strange and terrible events.

He, it seemed, had been given a chance to redeem himself, and Earth was safe again– for now.


The Crew

Living
Commander Inziladun –First Officer. (Reformed Traitor.)
Rikae –"Cabin Boy" (a thirteen-year-old stowaway). (Assassin.)
The Dog.

Dead
Doctor Morsul –Medical Officer and Captain McNerwen. –shot by Traitor on Night One.
Ensign Blind Guardian– Tactical Officer. –Died in convulsions (Telepath).
Eomer –Security Officer. –Thrown out the airlock (Bounty Hunter).
Lieutenant Sally –Navigator. –Torn to pieces (Metamorph).
Chief Petty Officer Keeper of Dol Guldur –Quartermaster. –Killed by exploding console (Ordinary).
Wilwa –Android Technician, Second Class. –Force-fed own muffins (Metamorph).
Master Chief Petty Officer Loslote –Chief Engineer. –Beaten to death with iso-spanner (Defender).
Ensign Pitchwife –Communications Officer/Interpreter. –Kicked to death (Ordinary).
Lieutenant Paranoia –Second Officer. –Blew own head off with flame-pistol (Ordinary).
Isabellkya –Sensor Technician, First Class. –Poisoned (Ordinary)
Shasta –Engineering Technician. –Thrown into Stardrive Reactor (Metamorph).
wintywinty –Weapons Maintenance Technician. –Self-destructed (Rogue Android).


*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

THE END.

[Nerwen]

And I'm sorry for keeping you all waiting. I was just about to post the narration when I was called away on family matters for a couple of hours. When I returned, the party who had been using the computer in the meantime had closed the window, deleting the entire thing.:mad:

So, I had to start from scratch. Hope you like it.

Oh, and wintywinty– yes, for narrative purposes I have allowed Rikae (the thirteen-year-old male version) to live, but that's only because it doesn't change the outcome of the game. The actual reason the crew wins is that Inziladun survived.

[Inziladun]

Well, my first time out as a cobbler. I can say that at least I only contributed to the death of one of my morphish conspirators. I count that as a major accomplishment. ;)

Sorry about voting you, Wilwa, and that it took me an extra Day to respond to your hints, Shasta. I didn't even get a chance to interact with Sally, except to cast suspicion on her for her self-vote Day 1. :rolleyes:

Sorry for killing you, BG. You had dreamed of me Night 1, I know, and thought me innocent based on how Nerwen worded the response to you (as recounted in the Admin Thread). I had no idea you were the Telepath, of course, but it seemed likely you were innocent, and what else is a cobbler to do?

I thought I was pretty much done after Shasta bought it, but the endgame was quite entertaining in its dramatic way, thanks to winty and Rikae. I thought my biggest test would be proving I was the real Traitor. Rikae's post detailing why she was the Assassin convinced me she was telling the truth, and I expected winty to also claim to be the Traitor, leaving it up to Rikae to decide between us. The open reveal of winty's droidism surprised me, but I could see no reason he would lie, so voting for him required no thought.

Kudos to Nerwen for the concept, and for such well-written narrations.

[Blind Guardian]

Thanks Nerwen that was great! Sorry for crying on night one. I don't know what happened. Ha! My dog survives! Lucky! Im glad I mentioned taking him for a walk he was great! So what happens to Iziladun? Does Rikae make it? Wait, is it over? Iziladun, I didn't know you were the Traitor until after I was dead. Good game, I enjoyed watching it from the dead point of view.

[Loslote]

Well, well, well. We won after all. And just after me posthumously switching sides to that of the suicide bomber. :rolleyes:

I protected Zil the first Night, then Rikae. Zil because I guessed the wolves wouldn't kill someone who didn't vote Day 1, just in case they were modfired, and then I crossed off the people I thought were wolves (including Wilwa and Shasta, by the way - I don't remember who I thought the third wolf was) and ended up with Zil and Izzy. After a long time flip-flopping between the two, I chose to protect Zil. The next Night, I noticed that there were three people who were not suspected at all, and I guessed that the wolves would go after one of them. Those three were Rikae, WWinty, and myself. I couldn't protect myself, and I figured that the wolves would prefer to attack Rikae (or myself, for that matter) than WWinty. Thus, I protected Rikae - and found the Assassin. We got to pm that Night. I knew I was going to die, though. So did Sally - she giggled at me about it a lot over IM. So did Rikae.

When Sally told me who the wolf was, I told her that if Rikae died, I was going to posthumously switch sides to root for him. Lone-wolf Shasta is simply too good, but I still wanted Rikae to win, of course. But Shasta died before Rikae did, so I just rooted for everyone to die. :p

Amazing game, Nerwen! :D

[Shastanis Althreduin]

*mutters about not actually losing to the innocents*

[Paranoia]

*mutters about not actually losing to the innocents*

Oh hush. You lost all the same, be it to crazed, paranoid innocents or a murderous android/suicide bomber, it matters not. :P


Horrible luck with winty picking Sally for his n1 kill though; I doubt she would have gotten lynched any time soon. :(

Edit: On another note, excellent narration Nerwen. Some of my favorite moments were my death, the muffin madness of day 2, and night 3.

[Isabellkya]

Lovely game Nerwen!

Haha Dun. Well done on your bit about Pitch. I considered that as a possibility, and was one reason I wasn’t comfortable with voting for Pitch. However the Paranoia wagon was too terrible feeling to vote for him, or vote for someone else - where he would be lynched anyhow. Seeing as they were both ordos.... it didn't really matter. :(

I was rather surprised that no one seemed to pick up on me suddenly going after Dun.

I assume you killed me due to me being on to you Shasta, or something like that? I honestly thought that is where you revealed yourself. Your overt scheme in forcing Pitch to vote for Paranoia and the entire way you went after him - especially about the part involving the assassin hurting the bear clarification. Which was a leg that your entire reason for going after the WereBorg first rested on. Yet you seemed quite unconcerned in actually asking the mod, attempt at clarification. I'm certain that had you been innocent, you would've sought clarity.

Which confused me altogether. People assumed what the assassin could/n't do based on the seeming public information about the role.. even though there were two secret roles.

Aw well. xD

[wintywinty]

Horrible luck with winty picking Sally for his n1 kill though; I doubt she would have gotten lynched any time soon. :(


I actually suspected Sally of being a morph.

[Blind Guardian]

Finally, here is my picture of Hotdog:

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee227/jaci2121/IMG_7398.jpg

[Blind Guardian]

That's not the best, but it was all that I could fine.

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee227/jaci2121/IMG_9550.jpg

That better, didn't get any smaller...

[Nerwen]

Thanks for playing, all of you!

I did enjoy writing those narrations– thanks for providing such good material. I tried to use as many actual quotes from people as I could. As you see, much of the dialogue for the final narration comes straight from Zil, Rikae and winty.:cool:

And BG, thanks for lending me your dog. He did come in handy, didn't he?;)

[Blind Guardian]

I know, I love him! Iziladun should thank him! (cookies?) he's so cute, he loves to chase bunnies :P

[Loslote]

Oh, and as some people commented on my excessive questioning about the Defender role: that was an attempt at a bluff.

Also, I thought the Assassin was Noia for a while. Look at my posts to him. They bothspell out 'assassin' with the first letters of the sentences. The first also ended with "What's a girl to think??" :p

[Rikae]

BG, your dog is toooo cute.

*snuggles Hotdog*

[Inziladun]

As a rule I don't like dogs, but it was nice of him to save me from that freakish Terminator-wannabe. :D

[Nerwen]

As a rule I don't like dogs, but it was nice of him to save me from that freakish Terminator-wannabe. :D

You hear that, wintywinty?

[Inziladun]

Heh, winty did a good job, of course. Too darn good. Killing off my Metamorph friends....

[Blind Guardian]

I have to say thank you for killing off the morphs, but get off our ship :P
nerwen, I would like to play again!

[Shastanis Althreduin]

I consider that given that the 'droid killed two out of three of us, we didn't lose to the innocents. Nerr. :p

Izzy, I killed you because I thought you were most likely to go after me the following Day, yes. I was hoping you were the Assassin or Werebear, but alas.

[wintywinty]

As a rule I don't like dogs, but it was nice of him to save me from that freakish Terminator-wannabe. :D

You can just refer to me as Terminator. :D

[satansaloser2005]

I consider that given that the 'droid killed two out of three of us, we didn't lose to the innocents. Nerr. :p

Izzy, I killed you because I thought you were most likely to go after me the following Day, yes. I was hoping you were the Assassin or Werebear, but alas.

Especially since I didn't even have a chance to do anything as a wolf. Grar.


So the first Day was just awful for me. I came back, realized I had no idea who to vote, and decided the nicest thing to do would be to vote myself. Had nothing to do with my wolvery, just the lack of desire to pounce on someone for no reason.

Being nice sucks. :(

[Paranoia]

Being nice sucks. :(

pshaw. Being a cranky innocent is worse. :P

So the question now is, is where do we go from here? Since you know most of us are kinda dead and space chunks...

[Blind Guardian]

The game has ended already. Iziladûn, Rakae and Hotdog survived :P And now us wraiths are following them chatting somewhat none stop.

[Paranoia]

'aight then. So who's up next in the GM queue then? :D

[Inziladun]

'aight then. So who's up next in the GM queue then? :D

If by "GM" you mean "Game Mod", according to the main TIG thread (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=630810&postcount=4550) you're next up.

[satansaloser2005]

If by "GM" you mean "Game Mod", according to the main TIG thread (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=630810&postcount=4550) you're next up.

I actually thought there were some players who had had their name in the mod queue for quite some time. Then again, I never pay attention. :p

[Pitchwife]

First of all, kudos to Nerwen for a well-devised and amazingly well-written game!

Second, kudos and congratulations to Zil and Rikae! You two were awesome. (And Zil obviously reads me much better by now than I do him, even after having been packmates. I actually thought you were the Assassin and knew I was innocent because you'd checked me...)

Third, kudos to wintywinty for almost making it. Well played.

Fourth, don't take it too hard, Shasta - you were quite an effective lone wolf, and you played me like a bass guitar. Good job.

Last but not least,
Being a cranky innocent is worse.
Yeah, I know, and I'm really sorry for what I did to you. Seriously, looking at my performance in this game, I should see Doctor Morsul for some major brain surgery. Fatal combination of initial over-confidence and staying up too late led to some crappy thinking on Day 2 which came back to haunt me on Day 3. I had my own bit of BG experience then - telling the plain truth and nobody believing you gets pretty frustrating after a while.
Cue for Shastamorph to push what was falling with that extensive 'Pitchmorph' analysis, which made me feel like "Gosh, he's right, I've been acting like a wolf all the time." After that, I did become 'unconcerned with my own survival' and chiefly concerned with avoiding to cause more havoc. But instead, I fell for Shasta's 'Bearanoia' plot *kicks own posterior*. Voting with him wasn't so much an attempt to save my own skin than a gamble on him being right with it... Epic failure. :(

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Nice game everyone. Special thanks to Nerwen for modding with flair. :)

Hope to play a bit longer next time. :p