WW: LXXXIV - Middle Earth in Fifteen Minutes

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

A thought before I go (got a few minutes extra time since my friend is late):

can somebody count if toDay would be a Day for reveals? If both seer and ranger revealed themselves and their information, we could have 3-6 known roles. :eek: :D Of course there is the danger of false reveals, somebody should also count if we can afford it.

Will be back to see what happens! Exciting.

I think there's no doubt we'll see a reveal today, but I guess people want to see some reactions to yesterday's craziness first. It's my belief that yesterday was close to perfection for the villagers. I'm very glad this Heir business is out of the way. :)

[wilwarin538]

Ok, I think I can afford a short break from studying.

A thought before I go (got a few minutes extra time since my friend is late):

can somebody count if toDay would be a Day for reveals? If both seer and ranger revealed themselves and their information, we could have 3-6 known roles. :eek: :D Of course there is the danger of false reveals, somebody should also count if we can afford it.

Will be back to see what happens! Exciting.

K, so where we are at now: 3 Gifteds, 3 Wolves and 3 Ordos. Right? If both the Seer and Ranger reveal (Hunter revealing is bad), and the Seer has had 3 dreams, hoping that they are all still alive, then we would know 2 of the Gifteds and have a couple more known innocents and maybe a wolf. Then whoever the Ranger protected last Night, obviously innocent. So yeah, out of the 9 players we could know the identity of up to 6 of them. That could be very good. Now we'd likely lose one of them toNight, but the wolves would have a tough time figuring out who is being protected, unless their kill choice from last Night narrows it down for them. We could potentially still have our Seer tomorrow for another dream, though, which takes away some of that risk.

But yeah, false reveals are very possible, and oh so annoying. But again, doesn't take long to figure out who's lying, so it could be worth taking the chance.

Personally, I think we could afford it, though I wouldn't suggest both the Seer and Ranger revealing. Maybe the Seer first (especially if they have a wolf), unless all of their dreamed people are dead (though they'd have to be pretty unlucky for that to happen), then they shouldn't. Once the Seer is out we'd really want to have our Ranger still hidden in order to keep the Seer protected. So yeah, not both at the same time. Maybe Seer toDay (potentially) and Ranger tomorrow?

Sorry if some of that didn't make any sense, I can only afford to take a couple minute break before I get too distracted, so I wrote this fairly fast. I'll try to come back again later.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Personally, I think we could afford it, though I wouldn't suggest both the Seer and Ranger revealing. Maybe the Seer first (especially if they have a wolf), unless all of their dreamed people are dead (though they'd have to be pretty unlucky for that to happen), then they shouldn't. Once the Seer is out we'd really want to have our Ranger still hidden in order to keep the Seer protected. So yeah, not both at the same time. Maybe Seer toDay (potentially) and Ranger tomorrow?

I'd be very surprised if it wasn't the Seer who was successfully protected last night, and that would mean we need some hard information out in the open today.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Hey, don't tell me all that's been said in the past few hours was this little! We have the first Day when we can say something - come on...

I think there's no doubt we'll see a reveal today, but I guess people want to see some reactions to yesterday's craziness first.

Me too, but I still hoped to see more people posting here...

I'm popping in just now, other stuff to do came up, but I'll appear sometime still...

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

I tend to agree, Legate, but this happens sometimes.

I'm pretty suspicious of you, by the way. ;)

But there's only one person whom we should lynch today and I've named him already, former packmate of mine - I wish Loslote had kept her sight on you! :p

[Boromir88]

No one else thinks Lommy's over reaction to my random and poorly reasoned vote is the mark of an unsure wolf? Why worry so much about an early vote I said needed to be random because I have little time available through the rest of the week?

It may be better to lynch me at this point, because I know I'm being no good to anyone other than being a giant and most unusual questionmark. I've been able to do no thorough reading or thinking of any kind (honestly I've read nothing from day 2 other than some plan was made to lynch the hunter who then chose wrong and killed Nogrod. If anyone can, read who pushed that idea, as it backfired). I've considered tipping out, as I haven't been able to play the way I usually like to and give Shasta my best effort. But that won't do much good either and I figure as long as I can still post at least once a day and cast a vote, than there'd be no point to bow out.

So, if I'm being a terribly migraine causing question mark that you need to figure out, go for it and lynch me sooner rather than later. I still say Lommy very very over-reacting to my vote yesterday.

++Lommy

I think there's no doubt we'll see a reveal today, but I guess people want to see some reactions to yesterday's craziness first. It's my belief that yesterday was close to perfection for the villagers. I'm very glad this Heir business is out of the way. :)

Me too...so care to be kind and reveal your sinister wolvery now? :p

[elronds_daughter]

Gracious, I haven't talked yet toDay... Can't say I've got much to contribute, though. My brain is rather a jumbled mess at the moment, but to gather what brief thoughts I can...

I'm finding my first instinct is to agree with Eomer that Inzil feels a tad slippery. Odd as this may sound, he just doesn't seem suspicious enough to not be suspicious. By which I mean, he doesn't seem to be throwing enough blame around. Which may just be coincidence, or may be an attempt to get by under the radar. And by "blame" I mean "large concentrations of suspicion". He's flung little bits and pieces of "it could be you" around at nearly everyone, but, even looking back through everything, I can't find any substantial claims.

Legate has spent some time analyzing myself and Nessa and come to a middle-of-the-road, maybe-or-maybe-not conclusion on both of us. This seems all well and good to me, if a bit unnecessary. But I suppose someone's got to be thorough, now that Nog is gone.

Greenie is very quick to vote for Boro. "Hrmmmmm" is all I have to say about that.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

I'll think about other villagers in a bit, in order to gain some ideas for tomorrow; but for now it can be only:

++INZILADUN

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Wilwa - shouldn't be overlooked
Boro - quite suspicious, as usual, but not convinced
Elronhubbard - shouldn't be overlooked mk 2
Greenie - I think she's probably innocent
Inzil - obviously a wolf and must die in a gruesome fashion
Lommy - it would go against tradition to argue against her lynching :p
Legate - I am suspicious - reminds me of Inzi, a lot
Nessa - pure and innocent

[Thinlómien]

Third, sorry, Eomer, for voting for you twice in a row with terrible reasons, I was pretty sure you were the Hunter.Oh, I knew that. :D Makes me consider you more innocent.

Greenie said Boro is fishy 'cos he suspects me everyday but for a different reason. And this Day kind of proves the point! I think Boro is overreacting, not me. Feeling threatened, eh?

Glad somebody did the maths for me. I think at least the seer should reveal toDay (hope it's not Greenie) and the ranger and the hunter can use their own judgement 'cos I guess there'd sides to them revealing and not revealing.

I'd be very surprised if it wasn't the Seer who was successfully protected last night, and that would mean we need some hard information out in the open today.Sadly that seems like a likely scenario... I think in most cases successful ranger saves are made to protect the seer.

Now I have to go and I won't be back. Play smartly.

++Boro

However, I wouldn't be too sad to find Zil dead after toDay either. Don't really have time to explain, but as pointed out, he is quite fishy and false-seeming.


edit: xed with Eomer

[Nessa Telrunya]

I'm not so sure if I would go for an all out reveal today, but a few might be okay. It's just that there's so many of us now that it would be a huge mess.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, this is starting to get at least a bit more active, though in a rather random way, so to say...

I must say some things are shaping rather curious, especially the Boro-Lommy exchange, each basically using the same arguments against the other. Lommy to me seemed all the time like her generally innocent self, with Boro I don't know, there really is not much what he said apart from this sort of several-day long crusade.

Now I am really thinking about the possible Seer reveal. I have to go and vote in probably a short time, as I want to get some sleep. I could vote Boro, although there are reasons why I am unsure to do it straightaway, and he probably is not around more so that we could read anything from him... or I could vote Zil, who already has one vote too.

And where is Nessa?

EDIT: x-ed. There.

[Nessa Telrunya]

Zil, you're being quite a slippery fellow, aren't you?

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Going to bed now. All I can really think of is: don't waste today's lynch. Kill Inziladun. He should have went yesterday instead of Nogrod.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, I have to vote and I want to go to sleep. I think the time of awaiting miracles is basically passing...

Of my two options:

Inzil: basically the thing about being "too smooth" at some points. Okay, if you read his posts, he actually seems sensible, but question is more about whether he is being sensible, as in: trying to help, or if it is simply calculated. And I can well imagine a Inzilwolf acting that way...

Boro: has an ongoing crusade against Lommy who, in my opinion, looks innocent; moreover, he sort of keeps bringing it back urgently... otherwise, not really around. In any case, he is not being particularly "helpful", a questionmark... now I noticed he said this thing where he basically says he does not mind himself being lynched, which at least puts one doubt I had about him away, however on the other hand, it raises the question whether he would say that as a Wolf, to offer himself like that... though on the other hand, the village is not anymore in the position to lynch innocents, so it does not really make much sense for the ordos to do this, and possibly Wolf might use it as a cover.

In any case, I don't really want to vote any of the others apart from these two right now and in any case, spreading the votes any more does not make any sense, especially in these numbers, and I am not going to vote for Lommy.

Just a few moments more then, and then I will probably post for the last time and really go to sleep...

EDIT: x-ed with Eomer

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, I think from my part, Boro can wait.

++Inzil

And I guess this will be all for toDay. Let's hope it goes well. Vote well, and good Night, village... may it be similarly lucky to the previous one...

[wilwarin538]

I'm going to have to vote and run...

I've skimmed through people's reasoning for suspecting Boro and Inzil, and the reasons make sense to me, so I'll go for one of them (admittedly I haven't read things through very thoroughly):

++Inzil

I really am sorry for my lack of participation. I don't really want to drop out of the game because we started off with so few, but I can't do anything to make my participation any better. Good luck!

x'ed with Legate

[Inziladun]

Ha! You are striking me as pretty much the definition of a smooth, agreeable, eager-to-please wolf, Inzi.

Really? Evidence, please, instead of empty words?

I'd be very surprised if it wasn't the Seer who was successfully protected last night, and that would mean we need some hard information out in the open today.

That could be the case, but there's no way to know it.

Zil, you're being quite a slippery fellow, aren't you?

Latching unto unfounded, unexplained accusations, are you?

Inzil: basically the thing about being "too smooth" at some points. Okay, if you read his posts, he actually seems sensible, but question is more about whether he is being sensible, as in: trying to help, or if it is simply calculated. And I can well imagine a Inzilwolf acting that way...

Okay, I think from my part, Boro can wait.

++Inzil

And I guess this will be all for toDay. Let's hope it goes well. Vote well, and good Night, village... may it be similarly lucky to the previous one...

I'm going to have to vote and run...

I've skimmed through people's reasoning for suspecting Boro and Inzil, and the reasons make sense to me, so I'll go for one of them (admittedly I haven't read things through very thoroughly):

++Inzil

I really am sorry for my lack of participation. I don't really want to drop out of the game because we started off with so few, but I can't do anything to make my participation any better. Good luck!

And yet more. Would it be too much to ask for someone to give decent reasons before killing me?

[Nessa Telrunya]

It just ocurred to me that what strikes me as odd about your behavior ,Inzil, is that you're more upset with "lack of reasons for killing you" than pleading more on the basis of being good. Usually someone about to be lynched is all "Fine, whatever, you'll see I'm good once I'm dead and then you'll feel bad".

But you're spending so much more time defending yourself than going after others that I can't help but feel that you're getting a little desperate at being backed into a corner.

[Inziladun]

It just ocurred to me that what strikes me as odd about your behavior ,Inzil, is that you're more upset with "lack of reasons for killing you" than pleading more on the basis of being good. Usually someone about to be lynched is all "Fine, whatever, you'll see I'm good once I'm dead and then you'll feel bad".

But you're spending so much more time defending yourself than going after others that I can't help but feel that you're getting a little desperate at being backed into a corner.

Aren't you being a bit self-contradictory? You say I should be "pleading" my innocence, yet at the same time "defending myself" makes me look "desperate".

Funny how you didn't seem to find me all that suspicious until Eomer came out with his completely unexplained "case".

[Nessa Telrunya]

Aren't you being a bit self-contradictory? You say I should be "pleading" my innocence, yet at the same time "defending myself" makes me look "desperate".

Funny how you didn't seem to find me all that suspicious until Eomer came out with his completely unexplained "case".

And what, goodsir, are you implying?

[Inziladun]

And what, goodsir, are you implying?

That you're at worst a wolf, and at best an innocent latching onto a flimsy excuse to vote someone.

[Nessa Telrunya]

That you're at worst a wolf, and at best an innocent latching onto a flimsy excuse to vote someone.

Referencing the odd way your posts has sounded hardly sounds like a flimsy excuse.

[Nessa Telrunya]

Well, I'm about to hit the hay, so I'd better vote.

++Inzil

Nothing personal, I'm just glad to be able to go after wolves now that the heir-business is out of the way.

[Inziladun]

Come on, little Innocents! All I wanna do is play some mmuuusssiic (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-_ck7AHKKE)! :p

[Inziladun]

Divination is an very imprecise branch of magic, you know. Eomer is a right old fraud (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdLa9yYt_jw). :cool:

[elronds_daughter]

Would it be too much to ask for someone to give decent reasons before killing me?

Zil, your defense does seem desperate. You're asking for people to give reasons why, but you haven't yet offered any reasons not to (except the recent above nonsense).

Divination is an very imprecise branch of magic, you know.

And what on earth was that supposed to mean?

[Inziladun]

Isn't it DL?

[elronds_daughter]

Not for another hour or so.

[Inziladun]

10 PM CST? That's now.

[elronds_daughter]

The dear Mod God changed it, since he himself was late the first time or two.

[Inziladun]

DL is currently set to be 10 pm CST, but if this a problem for anyone please let me know as it's easily changeable on my end.

I don't recall seeing anything to the contrary in the Game Thread.

[Inziladun]

The dear Mod God changed it, since he himself was late the first time or two.

I thought that was only for that one occasion, when he himself explicitly said it had been extended. If there was no such extension for toDay, I would think the DL is the standard time.

[elronds_daughter]

Seems so, but he's notified us of DL at 11:30 CST every Day since.

EDIT: x'ed

[Inziladun]

Well, whatever.

Like I said though, I would think that if it had been permanently changed that would have been noted somewhere.

[elronds_daughter]

Point taken.

Still, there appears to be time left for you to argue your innocence. By my count, there's 4 votes for you, 2 for Boro, and one for Lommy. And neither of us have voted yet. (Unless you did and I missed it? In which case, apologies.)

So. Convince me.

[Inziladun]

If DL has passed, we shouldn't even be talking.

I'm simply going to assume I'm dead at this point.

[elronds_daughter]

If DL has passed, we shouldn't even be talking.

I'm simply going to assume I'm dead at this point.

Well, all right.

Shasta, could you clear up this confusion about DL?

[Shastanis Althreduin]

It's been 11:30 since the game started, ever since I mentioned it.

Inzil the Wolf is dead, though.

Night 4 begins.

I dislike not having my book to write proper scenes with. :(

[Boromir88]

I see we've got 30 hours, alright, I may be able to pick up activity now that this week is concluding.

2 wolves left, and we've lost Galadriel, yes?

So, this one time, I might actually not vote Lommy as I'm really suspicious by the back and forth between Inzil and Nessa the previous day.

[wilwarin538]

Hmm, the way he was so sure about Inzil yesterDay, I'm not surprised he ended up being the Seer. I remember he mentioned a few times that he was sure the Seer would reveal, but I guess he decided not too. But this post of his was probably his way of getting all his information across, without actually revealing:

Wilwa - shouldn't be overlooked
Boro - quite suspicious, as usual, but not convinced
Elronhubbard - shouldn't be overlooked mk 2
Greenie - I think she's probably innocent
Inzil - obviously a wolf and must die in a gruesome fashion
Lommy - it would go against tradition to argue against her lynching
Legate - I am suspicious - reminds me of Inzi, a lot
Nessa - pure and innocent

So the only one's he's totally definite about is Nessa (innocent) and Inzil (guilty). Then there are some that he seems to feel as being guilty/innocent, but doesn't say it with the same certainty: Boro, Greenie, Lommy and Legate. Then for me and Elronhubbard he seems to just be unsure of.

So I would say that Nessa was definitely a dream of his. He wouldn't have said she was innocent so adamently if he hadn't dreamt her, knowing that if he died we'd look so closely at his supicions.

But that only covers 2 of his 3 dreams. Considering that those are the only two he's definite about, I would venture that his third dream must have been someone who was dead by yesterDay. (maybe someone should look back and see what he says about those who are dead?) I would think if his third dream was alive he would have given a definite indication like he had with Inzil and Nessa. (well at least that's what I would have done in his position, he very well could have been thinking something else)

I have an exam in the morning (probably, if the schools aren't closed from all the snow!), but after that my last one isn't for a week, so I have some spare time, so my participation this Day should be way better (more in the second half of the Day though).

[wilwarin538]

Where is everybody?

Hopefully there will be stuff here by the time I get back from my exam. It's the one day so far I've been able to participate, so there better be things for me to comment on! ;)

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well, I am here.

I must say I have been also thinking about Eomer's likely Seerishness earlier yesterDay, I think he was "sticking out" a lot (aside from one brief moment when I started to become unsure about it, since he did not seem to reveal, while I'd have expected him to - but even though he didn't, he still he gave us clues, I believe, in his lists).

So as for what we might get from his posts about the players' roles, I think it is obvious from his voting that he dreamed about Zil, and aside from this, I concur with what wilwa said about Nessa. The formulation "pure and innocent" is somewhat straightforward amidst all the "I think" and "maybe"s. It is quite possible that the remaining dream might have been about somebody who is already dead. Will take a look at his earlier posts quickly just to see if there isn't something that will give any confirmation...

In any case, now I think the best place to start from is to look at Inzil, if any info about a possible relationship with other players can be seen. Also, looking at the votes would be in order too. Gonna do it straightaway...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

So, votes yesterDay in order:

Greenie=>Boro
Boro=>Lommy
Eomer=>Inzil
Lommy=>Boro (2)
Legate=>Inzil (2)
Wilwa=>Inzil (3)
Nessa=>Inzil (4)

Did not vote: Elronhubbard, Inzil

Generally, I think the early votes do not tell us much, as they might've gone either way (unless the Wolves expected already then that Inzil is threatened and wanted to stop it by creating an opposite bandwaggon straightaway). Probably Lommy's vote and LRH's no-vote look to me probably the most suspicious right at this moment. With Lommy's vote, one could see it as a sort of attempt to create a "save Inzil" bandwaggon, of course in case that Boro is not a Wolf as well: in such a case, it would not make any sense. (But then again, I doubt Boro and Lommy would be WWs together... though huh, if it was, then it'd be really disgusting!) Wilwa's vote looks quite good, as it was in a rather decisive moment, similarly with Nessa (which was more like an almost-last nail into the coffin).

As for Elronhubbard's non-vote... What Boro said about Nessa's exchange with Zil, I could actually say the same more like about LRH, because she seemed to sort of flip-flop there. Inzil was pretty surely going for lynch at that point, but if the two of them voted for Boro, as I believe the last one voted is lynched, then Inzil could actually still have lived. I could very well imagine the sort of "final flip-flopping" being a sort of inner dialogue of two Wolves (and especially if I imagine LRH as a newbie-Wolf) "so should I try to save you or not?" At that point, voting Inzil would not probably have given a Wolf-on-Wolf vote much more credibility anyway, so can it be that Elro-wolfwould just decide not to vote at all?

Of course, that's one possibility. If Boro, the second person with most votes, was a Wolf as well, then it would definitely not make sense for the two to even think about the chance of saving Inzil by instead sacrificing him (therefore also, I am led to believe that if either Boro or LRH are Wolves, then the other isn't).

[elronds_daughter]

I see how you'd find me worrisome, Legate, but the reason for my non-vote was simply the confusion that Inzil raised about DL. I had hoped Shasta would be able to clear up the confusion before DL...but 'twas not to be.

I am perhaps too forgiving - I just wanted to give Zil a chance to redeem himself, but since he gave up so easily...I considered just voting for him anyway, without letting him give a proper defense, but I was exhausted that night and fell asleep before I could (sorry...11:30 for Shasta is half-past midnight for me...I think I may be getting too old for late nights).

Anyway.

Going by what Eomer said, I think Nessa's all right. Apart from the unfortunate Nerwen vote, she hasn't done anything really suspect (unless I've overlooked something).

I'm not quite sure about anyone else yet.

[elronds_daughter]

Still not entirely sure about anyone other than Nessa, but the fact that Legate is worried about my behavior makes me think he could be innocent.

[A Little Green]

Summarising my opinions on people. I'm going to leave Nessa out - if she's a wolf, I'm going to deep-fry both her and Eomer.

Wilwa:
Day 1: mostly about tactics, random vote for Lottie
Day 2: agrees with the Hunter-lynch plan, votes Lottie
Day 3: calculating the reveal plan (whether or not it's smart for the Seer/Ranger to reveal. Votes:

I've skimmed through people's reasoning for suspecting Boro and Inzil, and the reasons make sense to me, so I'll go for one of them (admittedly I haven't read things through very thoroughly):

++Inzil
Conclusion: most likely innocent - I have a hard time seeing a wolf making that vote. Boro and Inzil were in a draw at that point. Would a Wolwilwa have sacrificed a fellow that way?

[A Little Green]

Elra:
Day 1: half-serious self-defence, votes Nerwen She seems shady(est) to me at the moment. (Terribly sorry if I'm wrong.)

Day 2: Suspects Legate, then backs off:
I concur, Boro. Lommy and Legate are both looking a bit unfriendly to me at the moment... Legate mostly because of the completely fallible logic in trying to reason out why Sally got dead. Those kinds of reverse-psychology leaps are just plain weird. But, I may be reading too much into it. (Especially since Lommy herself pointed out how little sense Legate was making.)

But it's still entirely possible that I'm wrong on both accounts.
Noted. Like I said, I'm potentially wrong on both accounts... Legate's logic just seemed odd to me. But maybe it wasn't a bad odd and my interpretation is off.
Sees Nog's point about the blind agreement on trusting Hunter-Lottie. Votes Lottie anyway.

Day 3: agrees with Eomer about Inzil being fishy.

Greenie is very quick to vote for Boro. "Hrmmmmm" is all I have to say about that. I was quick because, like I think I explained yesterDay, I was only there for less than an hour. I had to be quick. As for why I voted for Boro - a part of it, I admit, was that I thought Lommy sounded Seerish. (After rereading her I came to the conclusion that she definitely wasn't one, already before Eomer was killed.)
Point taken.

Still, there appears to be time left for you to argue your innocence. By my count, there's 4 votes for you, 2 for Boro, and one for Lommy. And neither of us have voted yet. (Unless you did and I missed it? In which case, apologies.)

So. Convince me.I'm not sure Inzil's fellow would say this. She didn't vote, and explained it toDay.

Conclusion: not sure if a new wolf would jump on a fellow before it was evident he was going down – unless so instructed by fellows. In general she's quick to back off (all the "I might be wrong"'s), quick to self-defend. Could be just newness though.

[Thinlómien]

Hi everybody I'm in the middle of writing a post but I wanted to post this meanwhile because I'm thinking we are lacking something important...

The dead
Nerwen (ordo) - lynched on Day1
Sally (ordo) - killed on Night2
Lottie (hunter) - lynched on Day2
Nogrod (ordo) - taken by the hunter on Day2
Zil (wolf) - lynched on Day3
Eomer (seer) - killed on Night4

The living
Wilwa
Boro
Elronhubbard
Greenie
Lommy
Legate
Nessa

So we have 7 people left, 3 ordos, 2 wolves and the ranger and the hunter.

[Thinlómien]

'K... not really surprised to find out that Eomer was the seer. Too bad to see him go. It actually even crossed my mind at some point yesterDay, the way he talked about Zil. But I was far from sure, so I didn't want to jump on the Zil-wagon based on a vague seer suspect since I didn't have a clear opinion on Zil himself and I also thought Eomer would reveal if he really was the seer so there'd be enough votes for Zil if he really was a dreamed wolf. But hey, we got one wolf, which is great. Too bad it just rings a bit false to my own ear to be happy about that since I still feel like we're losing the game with 5 against 2 whose identities could be almost anything.

I'm surprised how people are kind of downplaying Eomer's dreams. People seem to agree that he dreamt Nessa, but I also think he might well have dreamt Legate of Amon Wolf or A Little Ordo. I need to check his posts to make a theory I can believe in, but Wilwa and Legate's easy acceptance that the third seer dream was lost smells fishy to me.

I think somebody should go through Zil's posts and others' posts about him. I won't have time in operations like that, like I said before joining. However, if nobody else does it, I think I'm going to do it and take the time from my sleep or something, since it's pretty vital. ;)

So, up next:
- a list to help me figure out what I think about people
- checking Eomer's posts (I'm glad he writes no novels!)


edit: xed with Greenie and myself

[A Little Green]

Lommy:

Day 1: The Heir - well nothing much to speculate about.:D Had to quote this, I found it so cute. After that, she tests Elra (wants to find out if she'd make a ”newbie wolf mistake”) and speculates about the Heir. She was the one to start actively pushing the village to speak sense. Makes a list:

Wilwa - under the reindeer. Quite honestly no idea but more positive than negative vibes, maybe.
Lottie - active and helpful but maybe even too nice as Nog said.
Boro - I don't remember anything he said except that he suspects me for some vague reasons. No good, Mr88, my bororadar doesn't flash innocent - but not guilty either, given your inactivity this far.
Sally - hasn't been around, or...?
Nerwen - weird and overtly bantery and slightly aggressive. Err???
Elronhubbard - kind of touchy, but maybe we should give her the newbie pass.
Eomer - sneaky but maybe more innocent than guilty.
Greenie - no read. Seems slightly confused but eager to make a point.
Inzil - funny (in the ordinary sense of the word). But that's it, mostly.
Nogrod - philosophering all around in a slightly artificial manner. Makes me raise my eyebrows a bit.
Legate - philosophering around in sort of "I have already given up" manner. Not sure what to make of it.
Nessa - chirpy. Sort of tries to make people like her? Anyway I'd be sad to see her go before I have had enough time to study her and save the data in my werewolf lorebook for next time we play together.She votes for Nerwen, adding that she can't remember when she's last given such flimsy reasons for a vote:
Has been very weird and slightly unconstructive.

Day 2: questions Legate's logic, says we should start hunting wolves; questions the sense in lynching Nerwen on Day 1, suspects Inzil and Nog:Ps. Currently suspecting Zil (too happy, for example: "I wonder if an 13-way tie has ever happened before?") and Nog (somehow artificial, can't pharse it better).After this, there's suddenly this:
Beep beep beep! Boromir88 is a wolf let's lynch him. Honestly, this is not a joke. He is just false. I admit part of my reason to think him weird is that he is not around as much as normal, but what he says seems weird. He is non-committal and doesn't give me the good solid honest Boro (who might be annoyingly tricksy but who's still always nice) feeling. He just seems off. And no, this is not knee jerk suspicion, although 1) his suspicion seems weird and 2) I'd be tempted to say he's a wolf and anxious to see me go because I have scared him enough by boasting about my infallible bororadar. (Which is not btw infallible but rather good! I tend to figure him out but at times I'm unsure and thenm it can go either way.)Another list:
Wilwa - quiet, and nicely under the radar.
Lottie - is most probably <3
Boro - see what I said earlier. My top suspect atm.
Elronhubbard - slightly weird, touchy and making kind of eyebrow-raising choices. Then again, didn't we all do that first time? Difficult.
Eomer - kind of like him and his logic. I tend to suspect him too easily so for now I'm just ignoring his style.
Greenie - mostly seems like her busy and uninvolved ordo self who nevertheless brings up good points.
Inzil - seems more reliable toDay, and not only because I agreed with him about the hunter issue.
Nogrod - slightly difficult to read. I wonder if he's evil or if we just disagree. Wondering if he'd known that any ordo can be the heir if he was one himself.
Legate - difficult again. Leaning innocent, but also kind of under the radar.
Nessa - umm... no idea to be honest.She votes Hunter-Lottie, would like her to hunt Boro.

Day 3: can somebody count if toDay would be a Day for reveals? If both seer and ranger revealed themselves and their information, we could have 3-6 known roles. Of course there is the danger of false reveals, somebody should also count if we can afford it.

Will be back to see what happens! Exciting.Not sure if a wolf would have brought that up. That quote is also a part of why I thought she might be the Seer (I didn't, in my hurry, notice that her conviction of Boro's wolvery didn't appear right from the beginning of the Day, as it probably would have had she been the Seer). Continues the Boro-crusade. Votes Boro. However, I wouldn't be too sad to find Zil dead after toDay either. Don't really have time to explain, but as pointed out, he is quite fishy and false-seeming.Would you have time to explain now?

Conclusion: Her sudden jump on Boro is similar to what I remember an innocent Lommy doing before (on Mac, if I remember correctly). If she's a wolf, hats off for the acting. Her flip-flopping on Inzilwolf makes me raise my eyebrows though. During Day 2 she goes from suspecting him to finding him more reliable, then on Day 3 she wouldn't be sad to see him dead because he's "quite fishy and false-seeming".


EDIT: x-ed with 2x Lommy (talk about the devil!) - btw how can you x-post with yourself?

[A Little Green]

I'm surprised how people are kind of downplaying Eomer's dreams. People seem to agree that he dreamt Nessa, but I also think he might well have dreamt Legate of Amon Wolf or A Little Ordo. I need to check his posts to make a theory I can believe in, but Wilwa and Legate's easy acceptance that the third seer dream was lost smells fishy to me.I don't think it probable that he dreamed a Legwolf. It would have been awful stupid for a Seer who has dreamed two wolves out of three to not come into the open.

[Thinlómien]

Day1
The only one he mentions is Legate whom he votes. His comments are contradictory. ("Gotta kill someone, right? Bloodlust to sate, and all that." and "I simply see more of a wolvish look in his posts. Nothing substantial, though. Or maybe I'm subconsciously detecting a Hunter-vibe in him.")

Day2
However, they definitely want to kill the Seer, even though another will appear, because otherwise - as has happened - our seer has info on (probably) two people. Just hope dreams weren't spent on Nerwen or Sally. The phrasing makes me quite confident he didn't dream Nerwen or Sally.

Loslote, I am most happy to assume and believe that our wonderful and clever Hunter is going to choose correctly. ;) That was before she came out. Now, I wonder if this means he dreamt her. Looks a little like he knew her role, whether by dreaming or guessing, that we can't know... Although later he says: That's why we might as well allow the Hunter a free kill; it's as likely to be accurate as any village lynch - perhaps more so as it's uninfluenced by wolves. Let's just get this heir-business over with! If the Hunter's still around, that is. :/ I would be inclined to think he wouldn't say that if he knew it was Lottie - but again the other hand, when Eomer posted this, Lottie hadn't been around for three hours, but then again, she hadn't voted and he should have thought about her being American ie around later. Gah? See how this continues...

Wilwa - sweet and innocent, seemingly designed to trick me
Lottie - willing to believe she's our hunter
Boro - very hard to tell due to lack of time - I give a pass for now
Elronhubbard - she seems fishy but it's all mysterious with her
Greenie - I always think she's evil but I guess it's possible she's not a wolf
Inzil - yeah, um, tricksssy... I'll let the Hunter decide on him
Nogrod - I've played with Nogrod many times, and he seems innocent to me
Lommy - I've played with Lommy many times and I always want to kill her
Legate - really unsure about him, could go either way
Nessa - I think she could be evil and wolvish
Most interesting, eh? Nothing very clear, except that Nessa clearly was dreamt on Night3. That means he must have dreamt Zil earlier and just kept quiet about it. This makes me think he probably didn't dream another wolf (Legate) because he would've been crazy if he had had two wolves under his belt and kept hiding and not even leaving clear hints about them. I wonder who his other earlier dream was, though. Greenie? Nogrod? The famous Lottie?

Day3
Boro's an interesting one, as is Legate. I wouldn't worry about Nessa, though. Further proof he didn't dream Legatewolf. Makes me think he is quite a gambler though (see his Day1 vote).

It's my belief that yesterday was close to perfection for the villagers. I'm very glad this Heir business is out of the way. Close to perfection? Does this mean almost perfect, like nothing went wrong? Or almost perfect in that we lost two a seer-dreamed innocent? Confused.

I tend to agree, Legate, but this happens sometimes. I'm pretty suspicious of you, by the way. But there's only one person whom we should lynch today and I've named him already, former packmate of mine - I wish Loslote had kept her sight on you!Again, his suspicion of Legate most probably wasn't dream-based.

Wilwa - shouldn't be overlooked
Boro - quite suspicious, as usual, but not convinced
Elronhubbard - shouldn't be overlooked mk 2
Greenie - I think she's probably innocent
Inzil - obviously a wolf and must die in a gruesome fashion
Lommy - it would go against tradition to argue against her lynching
Legate - I am suspicious - reminds me of Inzi, a lot
Nessa - pure and innocentSo, like I've said, after Nessa the most probable seer dreams would be Greenie or Legate. However, I think I've basically proved it's impossible he dreamt Legate, so I'm willing to give that up. Greenie? Not sure. Compared to what he says about Nessa, though, it looks so unsure that it makes me doubtful of his dreaming her. And of all the phrasings, he chose "I think" which implies at rationality, not divine knowledge.

All I can really think of is: don't waste today's lynch. Kill Inziladun. He should have went yesterday instead of Nogrod.A subtle hint that he had dreamt Nogrod?


Conclusions:
Night1 dream: Nogrod (had he dreamt a wolf, I think he'd have revealed given that he suggested a seer reveal and lynch or at least given a hint in case he took the knwledge to the grave with himself)
Night2 dream: Zil (ha! this makes sense now, all of it. Didn't bring the suspicion up too poiuntedly because wanted to lynch the hunter and have her take him down with herself.)
Night3 dream: Nessa (the obvious change of opinion and the phrasings, need I say more?)


edit: xed with Greenie

[wilwarin538]

Alright, I'm back (and the exam went well), so I'll go through both Eomer and Inzil's post now.

[Thinlómien]

I don't think it probable that he dreamed a Legwolf. It would have been awful stupid for a Seer who has dreamed two wolves out of three to not come into the open.Eomer is one of the few players I could see gambling that. But no need to speculate about that anymore...

edit: xed with Wilwa

[Thinlómien]

Wilwa - difficult. Not around much, kind of gives innocent vibes but then again slips under the radar.

Boro - still suspicious of him. Wondering, though. I'm kind of torn: my gut-feeling definitely does not say he's innocent, unlike most times when he is. On the other hand, he's been around so little and focused his energy on attacking me, so to be fair I think that could have blurred my perception on him. On the third hand (:p) I think it is fairly suspicious he uses all his energy on attacking me. It wouldn't be so bad if he had good reasons, but because his reasons are pretty much grasping at straws, I think it's rather eyebrow-raising worthy that he uses his limited time only for talking about me (although maybe I should just be flattered :Merisu: ). All in all, 2/3 suspicion, 1/3 confusion.

Elronhubbard - hmm. Like Greenie said, she is quite quick to take back her words and rather fishy. On the other hand, she's new. Honestly no idea but I'd be still kind of be willing to give her the benefit of doubt.

Greenie - almost exactly like Wilwa. Curious about her summarising project though - it's something that takes a lot of time and I wonder if she'd bother doing it if she was a wolf. On the other hand, she could be a wolf looking for logical suspects. Not too worried about her though, especially as she did not suspect Nogrod which is something she'd probably have done as a wolf because she can always get away with that as it's a tradition. :D

Legate - he's been slipping under my radar for most of the game. He doesn't strike me as particularily furry but he hardly ever does even if he is a wolf. He has been considering me innocent a lot, which kind of makes me suspicious: I think he knows I'm bad at suspecting people who strongly imply they think I'm innocent. Garr. I should definitely pay more attention to him.

Nessa - our known innocent, I think. Glad to be able to discount somebody.

So:

innocent
Nessa

likely innocent
Greenie
Wilwa

unsure
Ronnie
Legate

suspicious
Boro

I'm waiting for someone to go through people's relations with Inzil for me, it will undoubtedly alter the situation somehow. If there's no incirminating evidence, though, I think I'm (again) going for Boro toDay too because he's the best suspect I have atm.

Off now for a while because I have an essay to write. Will be back.

[A Little Green]

Aand going on..

Legsy
Day 1: Expresses dismay over the silence, makes a slightly pointless list:
Wilwa - no info
Lottie - one remark about possible relations of Inzil and LRH, seeming sort of innocent-ish to me, but nothing much in the end, really
Boro - no info
Sally - no info
Nerwen - a bit of chatter here and there, but nothing of substance. Possibly a bit of pressing on the LRH thing, but it seems more like she considered it fun all the time...
Elronhubbard - actually funny enough, being a newbie but posting basically the most. In any case, gets a newbie pass today, but even otherwise does not seem any suspicious straightaway.
Eomer - nothing much, a few remarks. If I was supposed to say from whom I am getting bad vibes, it is him, but it is simply the feeling and nothing more - so that means nothing.
Greenie - basically nothing
Inzil - attempt to engage in dialogue, but not really standing out in one way or another
Nogrod - no info
Lommy - tries to be active, in contrary to many others, and at least gives some opinions and such. I'd grant her pass just for that.
Legate - that's me
Nessa - nothingHe then debates the possibility of voting randomly. This following one I found rather interesting:
Myself, I'd at least prefer keeping the Heir as a "backup", like I said before, in case we managed to lynch a Gifted toDay, or even if we e.g. lynched an ordo and the WWs killed a Gifted at Night (which is not so unlikely scenario to happen, I think). Of course, like Lommy said, if we really lynched e.g. a Hunter now, we'd be sure that the Wolves don't use the Heir to their advantage. But then again, imagine if we lynch a Hunter and he kills the Seer...I'm not saying an innocent Legate couldn't have said this, but I can't help thinking that a wolf would find this attitude advantageous.
I am a bit uncomfortable perhaps with Boro, because he wants to lynch Lommy, who seems sensible to me. But that's like the best shot I have. Votes Boro, with a cryptic addition: Good Night. Sleeping village, cockerel's cry, soft wind blowing in the trees, peace of mind, feel at ease...

Day 2: Weird theories on the Sally kill; I think these have been discussed enough.

Hey, certainly not that! I say that's really the worst thing we could do. If we do this, and the WWs do this, and we do this, and the WWs do this, then the WWs eventually win. Like, imagine the newspaper headlines: "Village lost by intentionally lynching only ordos!" Honestly!!! <3. That's all.

Wilwa - not really so much to go with, but when she is around, at least speaks, does not set off any alarms
Lottie - seems quite thoughtful, also does not really set off any alarms
Boro - okay, his vote today was rather weird, but I am not really going to judge him based on that... I think it'd be nice to see more from him, and possibly our village'd have needed his sort of decisive spirit in matters such as "lynch-or-not-to-lynch-whomever"...
Elronhubbard - became a bit more active at some point, not bad, I think there was something a bit curious about some of her posts, but nothing really "big"
Eomer - looks active to me, possibly with somewhat daring behavior, could be either, but does not really make me think him any highly suspicious
Greenie - seems sort of like Alice in the Wonderland, either confused, or acting it very well. It could be many of the under-the-rader-Greenwolves, but there's no real other evidence for that.
Inzil - contributive, but some of his posts especially earlier toDay made me think of him as if he assumed the role of "Mr.Agreeable" here, which might be a smoothy-Wolfdoing
Nogrod - I don't know what to think of him, on one hand, he seems active, but more strongly, he brings some rather dangerous suggestions which would, in my opinion, benefit only the WWs if being advocated - on the other hand, he is sometimes advocating things which are just confused-seeming (lynching the Heir), which would point more to innocence; but overall I am worried about him probably more than less
Lommy - I don't see anything suspicious about her
Nessa - has some interesting points. For some reason though, I think when reading her posts, I keep mixing her up with LRH (sorry both), I think one "homework" for me is to go through the posts of them both carefully to make a really proper opinion...The list at least Eomer and I found eyebrow-raising. Legate is always wishy-washy, but in this particular list it looks calculated.
He then says he would likely go for Nog, votes Hunter-Lottie.

Day 3:
Hey, so at least something positive! I guess we could sort of take it the way that this compensates well for the loss of Nog yesterDay. Still, I think whatever the outcome of yesterDay's lynch was, at least we got the business with the Heir done. Now we still need to catch our first Wolf, but now at least we can start playing "properly", like not thinking about whether or not to lynch Wolves or whatnot...

As for the Aragorn-action, definitely it bought us more time. Whether it was a coincidence or not that somebody was targeted and protected, I think might be shown, but after reading this and the last bit of yesterDay, I actually have a certain suspicion now.

In any case, I hope toDay is going to be successful - we definitely should not go to any kind of inactivity, quite the opposite, as now we finally can do something. I am going to review some things and will be around from time to time during the day... The underlined part doesn't strike me as something a wolf would come up with. Otherwise, I don't like the tone of this post. He then analyses Elra and Nessa without concluding much. Suspects Zil. Finds the Boro-Lommy exchange curious, with Lommy looking innocent and Boro unsure. Voting options Boro and Inzil.
Of my two options:

Inzil: basically the thing about being "too smooth" at some points. Okay, if you read his posts, he actually seems sensible, but question is more about whether he is being sensible, as in: trying to help, or if it is simply calculated. And I can well imagine a Inzilwolf acting that way...

Boro: has an ongoing crusade against Lommy who, in my opinion, looks innocent; moreover, he sort of keeps bringing it back urgently... otherwise, not really around. In any case, he is not being particularly "helpful", a questionmark... now I noticed he said this thing where he basically says he does not mind himself being lynched, which at least puts one doubt I had about him away, however on the other hand, it raises the question whether he would say that as a Wolf, to offer himself like that... though on the other hand, the village is not anymore in the position to lynch innocents, so it does not really make much sense for the ordos to do this, and possibly Wolf might use it as a cover.

In any case, I don't really want to vote any of the others apart from these two right now and in any case, spreading the votes any more does not make any sense, especially in these numbers, and I am not going to vote for Lommy.He ends up voting Inzil, bringing him to a tie with Boro.

Conclusion: Well, he's wishy-washy, says a lot without concluding much. He's always more or less that way, but this time I'm debating if it's calculated. His vote for Inzil was given at a pretty crucial moment though, not the most likely timing for a wolf-on-wolf vote unless it was planned beforehand. In sum I'm not sure about Legate, no precious, not sure at all.


EDIT: x-ed with a load of Lommies and a Wilwa

[wilwarin538]

For both I just looked at what they said about other people, looking at what they said about game mechanics is kind of pointless.


Inzil
#29: says Lottie’s meta-reasoning about him and ED not being packmates makes her look innocent, and that ED looks a bit defensive but gets a newbie pass

#103: considers voting Nog or Nerwen, and trusts Lommy

#108: thinks Lottie is likely to be innocent, votes Nerwen, restates that Lommy looks good

#270: questions Nessa’s reasoning

So: he doesn't really say much about people or interact with many. Most of the time he just talked about the Heir business. He mentions that he trusts Lommy more than once, so I would say that makes her look better (he wouldn't be that obvious if she was a wolf). Also points out things about Lottie that he trusts, but not in the same way as he did Lommy.

~*~*~*~*~*~

Eomer

#73: votes Legate, saying “gotta kill someone, right?”

#78: says about Legate: “I simply see more of a wolvish look in his posts. Nothing substantial, though. Or maybe I'm subconsciously detecting a Hunter-vibe in him.”

(day 2)
#129: says this about the wolves: “they definitely want to kill the Seer, even though another will appear, because otherwise - as has happened - our seer has info on (probably) two people. Just hope dreams weren't spent on Nerwen or Sally”

#197: says a list of Legate’s seems a bit off

#208: a list:
Wilwa - sweet and innocent, seemingly designed to trick me
Lottie - willing to believe she's our hunter
Boro - very hard to tell due to lack of time - I give a pass for now
Elronhubbard - she seems fishy but it's all mysterious with her
Greenie - I always think she's evil but I guess it's possible she's not a wolf
Inzil - yeah, um, tricksssy... I'll let the Hunter decide on him
Nogrod - I've played with Nogrod many times, and he seems innocent to me
Lommy - I've played with Lommy many times and I always want to kill her
Legate - really unsure about him, could go either way
Nessa - I think she could be evil and wolvish

(day 3)
#236: not surprised by the Ranger save

#241: says “Boro’s an interesting one, as is Legate. I wouldn’t worry about Nessa, though.”

#253: says he’d be surprised if it hadn’t been the Seer who was protected

#255: says he’s suspicious of Legate, but that there’s only one person we should lynch today (referring to Inzil)

#259: posts the list that I quoted earlier

So: I'm still rather surprised he didn't reveal yesterDay, because he said more than once he was expecting someone too. He seemed to think that he was the wolve's target and had been protected, so that would lead me to think that he had said something the Day before that he felt made him look Seerish. I would guess that it's because in that first list he points some suspicions at Inzil (so he probably dreamt him one of the first two Nights). In that same list he is really unsure of Nessa, but then the following Day is sure of her innocence, so it looks like she was his Night 3 dream. I'm not sure who his third dream would have been. He is fairly consistently suspicious of Legate, but the way he said yesterDay that "there's only one person we should lynch today" makes me think he didn't dream Legate as a wolf, or else he would have gone after him the same way, and obviously didn't dream Legate as innocent or else he wouldn't be suspicious of him at all. Kind of a similar situation to Boro. I doubt one of them was his 3rd dream.

I just scrolled down and realised Lommy's already done this :rolleyes:, and come to similar conclusions. I suppose Nog was a possible Night 1 dream, but it doesn't seem all that clear, obviously not a wolf or else he would have said more about it. Maybe another Gifted, didn't want to give them away? It's really hard to say.

edit: x'ed with Greenie

[A Little Green]

Right - I just figured out it's midnight soon so I'd better vote soon and go to sleep. The thing is, after a bit of analysis I think everyone could be a wolf or could not. I didn't have notes on Boro because I had already gone through him yesterDay. I'd like a new look though, might do that if I'm not feeling sleepy. For now I don't trust him.

I will definitely not vote Nessa the as-good-as-known innocent, probably not Wilwa either. Which leaves me with Boro, Hubbard, Lommy and Legate. I would be fine with any of these actually. Least maybe Lommy.

[Nessa Telrunya]

Oh wow, a lot's happened. We lost a seer and killed a wolf, so it's sort of a double-edged sword.

I am, however, glad to have my innocence reassured. :p

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I see how you'd find me worrisome, Legate, but the reason for my non-vote was simply the confusion that Inzil raised about DL. I had hoped Shasta would be able to clear up the confusion before DL...but 'twas not to be.

I am perhaps too forgiving - I just wanted to give Zil a chance to redeem himself, but since he gave up so easily...I considered just voting for him anyway, without letting him give a proper defense, but I was exhausted that night and fell asleep before I could (sorry...11:30 for Shasta is half-past midnight for me...I think I may be getting too old for late nights).
Noted, but this is of course as well what a Wolf might have said too... the point is mainly that there was this sort of "debate" with Zil in the first place. Non-votes can of course happen, but my point was that if I look at the votes, yours (resp. your non-vote) is among the most suspicious.

Loslote, I am most happy to assume and believe that our wonderful and clever Hunter is going to choose correctly.
That was before she came out. Now, I wonder if this means he dreamt her.
Personally I would say so. If he addresses Lottie like this, then why would he say that if he didn't think she has anything to do with the Hunter. Of course, he might have guessed it, and not dreamed of her, but it would make a lot of sense that way, I think.

The possibility of dreaming about Nogrod is also there, although it seems that this one is far more likely, given the above.

Close to perfection? Does this mean almost perfect, like nothing went wrong? Or almost perfect in that we lost two a seer-dreamed innocent? Confused.
I would imagine simply the fact that he means that no Wolf was killed by the Hunter. And, if it was two seer-dreamed innocents, then you mean that he would have dreamed about Nog and Lottie (and thus Inzil the other Night, and no Nessa?). That sounds rather awkward to say that...

Now I want to really go through Inzil's posts myself, so will be back in a minute with that... or I hope it will be "minute"...

EDIT: x-ed with Nessa

[Thinlómien]

Or almost perfect in that we lost two a seer-dreamed innocent? Confused.And, if it was two seer-dreamed innocents, then you mean that he would have dreamed about Nog and Lottie (and thus Inzil the other Night, and no Nessa?). That sounds rather awkward to say that...*facepalms* I originally wrote "two seer-dreamed innocents", then realised Eomer had only three dreams not four so I made a mistake so I wanted to edit it to "a seer-dreamed innocent" but somehow I managed to post it as "two a seer-dreamed innocent" which doesn't mean anything. :rolleyes:

[A Little Green]

Hmm, I think I'm going to go for

++ Boro

I think that's my best bet toDay. Good night.

[Thinlómien]

1. Greenie -> Boro
"So, looks like it's going to be Boro or Legate for me toDay. I'm rather torn right now - I suspect Legate a bit more, but I might feel better voting Boro since I have actually checked his posts." ToDay she also said she thought I was the seer and I had dreamt a Borowolf.

2. Boro -> Lommy
"I still say Lommy very very over-reacting to my vote yesterday."

3. Eomer -> Zil

4. Lommy -> Boro (2)
"Greenie said Boro is fishy 'cos he suspects me everyday but for a different reason. And this Day kind of proves the point! I think Boro is overreacting, not me. Feeling threatened, eh?"

5. Legate -> Zil (2)
"Okay, I think from my part, Boro can wait."

6. Wilwa -> Zil (3) xed with Legate
"I've skimmed through people's reasoning for suspecting Boro and Inzil, and the reasons make sense to me, so I'll go for one of them (admittedly I haven't read things through very thoroughly)"

7. Nessa -> Zil (4)

Comments to follow...


edit: xed with Greenie

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, so Inzil actually really didn't say much anything about anybody. During the first Day, he hardly mentioned any name at all, and even generally, he mostly just quoted somebody, commented on it, and moved on... All people he voted are dead too, so nothing to gain from that either.

If there ever was anything, he mentioned trusting Lommy:Like I said, I think Lommy looks fairly innocent, and there's the added appeal of not adding another name to the mix.
That once again would make me think her more innocent, unless it is some sort of double-bluff, which however would be rather weird (given that she's the only one person he basically addressed before his dismissal was getting near). After he started to get the lead in the lynch, he started to question everybody who voted him or said they suspect him (Eomer, Nessa, me, wilwa), saying that he wants to see "evidence".

To Nessa, he said:
That you're at worst a wolf, and at best an innocent latching onto a flimsy excuse to vote someone.
But since she is, in the light of what Eomer had left, most probably innocent, neither of this has any importance for us...

Then he was around for a while yet, and talking with LRH, which was mostly just about DL, and anyway with very little initiative on his part; his words end by
If DL has passed, we shouldn't even be talking.

I'm simply going to assume I'm dead at this point.

So all in all, he was very "unsocial"... the main argument for me would be the bit for Lommy's innocence, there's basically nothing more.

Okay, eurgh, it's getting rather late here... I am probably going to think about my vote toDay.

[Thinlómien]

Okay, so it comes down to wondering if the wolves had any reason to go w-on-w yesterDay.

It depends a lot on if they realised Eomer was the seer. Given that they knew Zil's guilt and Eomer was being rather adamant, I think it's likely.

So they could have thought that once they kill Eomer, Zil will be dead anyway so they wouldn't have shied away from taking part in his lynch.

On the other hand 1) they could have delayed Zil's death by voting someone else (but would they have looked bad?) and 2) they could not have been sure about Eomer's role and I think they'd have wanted to avoid overreacting because the numbers were getting advantageous for them (them being 3/8).

So I end up with the amazing conclusion that they could either have gone wolf-on-wolf or not. :rolleyes:

Voted someone else than Zil: Greenie, Boro, me
Voted Zil: Legate, Wilwa
Didn't vote: Elron

And there's the interesting thing that Legate and Wilwa xposted, which gives their votes equal suspiciousness/innocence status, whatever it is. I think it's incredibly funny if they are the two wolves.

Kind of in summary, Greenie and me voted someone who was suspected who was not Zil (although he was suspected mostly by the two of us :D). Boro voted someone who wasn't generally suspected (me), so kind of throwaway. Legate and Wilwa both thought they'd level Zil with Boro, but together they actually put him on the lead.

Try to conclude anything from that! *deep sigh* Kind of thinking it unlikely both Legate and Wilwa are wolves. Legate's vote looks better with him giving up the option of Boro and Wilwa looks better in general.

I'd hate to suspect Greenie, especially with her me-seer theory because it sounds quite innocent.

And if this leads me to suspect Boro and Elron I hate it because they seem like the "easiest suspects" for me. I'm pretty sure one of Wilwa/Legate/Greenie is a wolf, but not sure which one. And one is Boro/Elron, leaning heavily on Boro. Although I have to say I'll regret it if we lynch him and I turn out to be wrong because that would mean I've lost my touch when it comes to figuring him out. On the other hand, I'll probably be even more sorry if we don't lynch him and he wins as a wolf.

So, most likelily voting Boro toDay unless something drastic happens. (Btw I'm pretty sure Greenie is innocent if Boro is guilty.)


edit: xed with Legz

[Thinlómien]

(forgot I had something to reply to)

Would you have time to explain now?To be honest, it wasn't about time. It was about me wondering if Eomer was the seer who had dreamt Zil.

Her sudden jump on Boro is similar to what I remember an innocent Lommy doing before (on Mac, if I remember correctly).Oh that was a dreadful game... such an epic fail from my part. (For those who don't know or remember, it was Sally's game, I was the ranger and convinced Mac was guilty. I was right about him being a wolf, but he managed to get me lynched by revealing as the ranger and I was too proud to counter-reveal... oh dear.) But anyway the point was, I was right that time. Trust my innocent hunches. ;)

[Thinlómien]

++Boro

1) He is suspicious. Like I said, he doesn't have the honest air he normally does when innocent. He also concentrates 90% on one person (me) which is the kind of narrow-mindedness an innocent simply can't afford. Plus, he is very edgy and seems more focused on that I am suspicious more than why I am suspicious.

2) I could concentrate on other people better if he was dead. Now I'm kind of happy with my current lack of suspects because I'm always thinking "oh but I'm quite sure Boro's a wolf, I'm not so clueless, it's ok to be unsure about others". And I'd never ever forgive myself if I let him go at this point and he was a wolf and won the game.

That's it from me for toDay. Although the DL is at an almost tolerable hour this time (9.30 am my time) I know it's not realistic to think that I'd get up earlier to play ww as I have to leave from home around the DL, especially as it's already past 1 now. So good night!

PS. I just realised I might sound hypocritical when I blame Boro for narrow-mindedness ill-suited for an innocent, but if you go through my posts, you will realise I have really suspected other people a lot (although Boro the most) while he has hardly mentioned anyone else than me as suspicious...

[elronds_daughter]

Right. Now that I've read everything up to this point, and since I don't have time to draw enough of my own conclusions... Everyone seems pretty sure that a wolf is either Boro or me, and I know it's not me. So:

++ Boro

Sorry to vote and run (and for the relative lack of posting toDay), but I have a ridiculously difficult exam to take in the morning that I must start cramming for now. I hate finals week. :rolleyes:

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

So, as for vote:

Nessa is a dreamed innocent. Lommy to me looks more innocent than not, I am certainly not going to vote her on any experimental basis, also because we are, even though we lynched a Wolf, still rather low in numbers. Similarly with Wilwaand Greenie. Wilwa's vote for Inzil makes her look good, and with Greenie, I don't have any strong reason for suspicion either.

It comes down to either Boro or LRH. I am really wondering about the possibility of LRH being a newbie Wolf with Inzil. I would possibly prefer her right now, although on the other hand that would mean letting Boro escape the noose once again, and of course it would be brilliant to find he was a Wolf only after doing that for several days. Since I believe there was already one vote cast for Boro, and not sure how people think about LRH, it might be just logical to simply vote Boro. The question is, though, after he is lynched and if he is found guilty, who is the other Wolf. Greenie? Wilwa (meaning Wolf-on-Wolf vote yesterDay)? Lommy? (meaning ridiculous Wolf-on-Wolf campaign all the time? I'd find that really ridiculous) Because there is the thing that I find it unlikely, like I have said earlier, that Boro and LRH would be Wolves together.

But truth is, Boro remains an enigma, and I concur with what's been said that keeping him around still keeps the questionmark hovering over village.

I'll go brush my teeth or something and decide.

EDIT: crossposted with Lommy and LRH! Okay...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Right. Now that I've read everything up to this point, and since I don't have time to draw enough of my own conclusions... Everyone seems pretty sure that a wolf is either Boro or me, and I know it's not me.

Okay, so this is really like - what more to say. Of course probably both innocent and Wolf would save their skin by voting like LRH just did (though I'm not sure if the threat was so imminent...), but just right now seeing it formulated like this, it just strikes me as underlining what I have been thinking about.

Hm, I find it still quite likely that it's going to be Boro who is lynched, but after this...

++Elronhubbard

I am still probably fine with either of those two being lynched. But just right now, I feel rather positive on Hubby.

Good Night, village...

[Nessa Telrunya]

I'm debating right now between Boro, Lommy, and Hubby.

For one, I'm a little suspicious of the back and forth between Inzil and Hubby, but I can't help but raise my eyebrow at the voting-vendetta I'm seeing with Boro and Lommy. Boro's been very under-the-radar for a good portion of the game, yet Lommy has been quite assertive and witty in a manner I'd expect from a wolf.

I'll just peruse the thread and see if any new developments occur before I make my choice. :cool:

[Boromir88]

The part of your Boro-radar you are missing right now Lommy is the one that says wolfBoro will defend himself ferociously and gets paranoid of the slightest suspicions.

This has been more of, I've had a rubbish game so far, and trying not to make a big scene to be a major distraction but still do what I can to give a non-sinister vote. But I realize I've been a strange enigma, so do what you must and go with my apologies for the rubbish play.

I can assure you to not be too disappointed, Lommy with what you find, because you should know I would go down with more of a fight as a wolf. I mean you saw what I did as a Fenris were-penguin. I still think you're a wolf though, cus I think you would know I don't throw in the towel when I'm an evil wolfy.

++Lommy

[wilwarin538]

Votes so far,

Greenie -> Boro
Lommy -> Boro (2)
Elronhubbard -> Boro (3)
Legate -> Elronhubbard
Boro -> Lommy

Left to vote: Wilwa, Nessa


Is this the second day that Lommy and Boro have voted for each other? It's really strange the way that the two of them are so adamant about each other's guilt. I feel quite good about Lommy, and just a bit unsure of Boro. He is acting out of character, but it seems likely that that's just due to the fact that he can't be around as much as usual. So I don't really feel comfortable voting either of them. LRH, though some things she's said have been a little off, I think it's mostly just newbiness. So...

I don't know who to vote for. I'm afraid I'm in that weird position I seem to always be in where everyone looks shiny to me. So....I'm not going to vote, because it would either be a throwaway, or for someone I'm not suspicious of, and I would prefer not to do either.

Anyway, I'm off to bed, because I've been studying and doing exams all weekend and I need rest so that I can fully enjoy my day off tomorrow.

[Boromir88]

Shasta's unable to be here and thus asked if I'd be able to close the DL today.

Works out good too, seeing as you've lynched me! :( And also with the Mod's permission can reveal that this ordo is now dead.

'Tis night.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Sorry for the lateness.

Greenie was killed at night, but Legolas took down no one.

Day begins.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Oh my Eru...

So now there is five of us (!), still with one Gifted; I think there is no need to point out that we need to get a Wolf toDay.

So now I think every piece of evidence is important. First thing to consider is why Greenie was killed (while Nessa as a known innocent was not, but quite possibly the Wolves assumed she is going to be protected), which has a sub-question, since she was the Hunter and did not kill anybody, she could not have targeted a Wolf last Night (unless she'd forget to send her pick, but I think that unlikely). At the same time, the question is whether the Wolves targeted her knowing, or suspecting that she is the Hunter, because if yes, then it would have been deliberate and the Wolves would have assumed that she is not targeting either of them, otherwise they probably wouldn't dare to take the risk.

The mere fact that she did not get the Wolf is the worst thing, as it raises questions about some things. In her last post, Greenie said:

I will definitely not vote Nessa the as-good-as-known innocent, probably not Wilwa either. Which leaves me with Boro, Hubbard, Lommy and Legate. I would be fine with any of these actually. Least maybe Lommy.

Boro is dead, so if we try to come up with who was on her list, we can go through the remaining names. If her thoughts remained the same, then she did not definitely choose Nessa, probably not Wilwa or Lommy either, and so I would say the person she targeted would be either me or Elronhubbard. If it was the former, then from my part it does not in any way challenge my thoughts, but if it was the latter, then I would have to start doubting and wonder whether the Wolves are not Lommy and Wilwa together, since otherwise Hubby would have been dead by now. That said, I think Hubby would probably not target LG intentionally if she knew she was the Hunter, but that by itself wouldn't say anything about the nature of the Wolves anyway, only about their possible motives (as it might be simply that they targeted Greenie exactly because they thought she was not the Hunter or something...).

Anyway, after the death of Boro, it narrows down my choices a lot. Basically, the options for me (unless Eomer totally screwed up), are that the Wolves are Elro-Lommy, Elro-Wilwa or Lommy-Wilwa. The last of these options sounds the least probable for me, if it's the two of them, hats off; I probably wouldn't have even considered it if there was not this possibility that Hunter would have targeted LRH (although again, one of them it is). Still, I find LRH the sort of "safest" option, the most likely one. It is strange to imagine that Lommy would go after Boro so much if she was a Wolf, as it would put herself under suspicion. With Wilwa, on the other hand, there is the vote for Inzil, which I believe a Wolf would not really cast at that moment.

In any case, I would really like to see people post toDay...

[Nessa Telrunya]

I apologize for my Voteless state yesterDay. I just couldn't decide who to vote, because at this point, it's easier to do more harm than good.

But, with the death of Boro, I'm really starting to look at Lommy. Sure, it would be a bit risky to bring that much attention to yourself with going consistently after one person, but it would also be a great way to be unpredictable-a perfectly wolfish strategy.

I'm going to go back and reread her posts...

[wilwarin538]

Greenie? Well....I guess they figured Nessa would likely be protected, and so they didn't want to take the risk of not getting their kill. They probably didn't believe Greenie to be the Hunter, with so few people left and the fact that they could win toDay with the proper lynch, I doubt they'd risk the Hunter taking one of them down. So they may have felt she was the Ranger?

Anyway, so this is who's left:

Wilwa
Lommy
LRH
Legate
Nessa

That's 2 wolves, 1 Ranger and 2 Ordos. And Nessa is a known innocent.

So my options for who to vote for are the 3 L's. I am fairly equaly unsure of all 3 of them. YesterDay I know I wasn't really suspicious of anyone, but now that'd be a really dumb way of thinking, considering 2/3 of those people are wolves. :rolleyes: So I'm going to go take a closer look at their posts.

[Thinlómien]

Argh. Placed my bets in the wrong place last Night, it seems. On the other hand, so did apparently Greenie herself so maybe I shouldn't feel bad. And yes, I'm trying to say:

I'm Aragorn, also known as the ranger.

The successful save was Eomer, as you have probably guessed. I'm not going to say a word about the other picks though, because the wolves shouldn't know if I have protected myself already or not.

So that narrows the possible wolves down to Legate, Wilwa and LRH, which means there are two wolves in those three. Nicely done, guys, but toDay we have 2/3 hitting one of you and once we do, you're going to have tough time with me still alive. :p

I was rereading the thread yesterday and I made some observations on people, I'm now going to edit my notes to some form which might be readable. Basically I ended up thinking the wolves are LRH and Wilwa, but I was terribly annoyed with Legate and Greenie because I was going to be so mad if they managed to fool me (again). Now I'd be inclined to think either LRH or Wilwa is actually innocent and Legate is guilty because my first reaction was that he'd been the least likely pick by Greenie. Have to check her posts to get a better idea, though.

One more thing. Nessa, you are of utmost importance toDay, because you are, for sure, innocent. So please play as much and think as throughly as you can, because if we fail toDay, we lose the game. I hope I'm not sounding too patronising but this game is seriously killing me with all the pressure...

[Thinlómien]

Okay so here come my quotes/points...

1. I haven't played with you before, so I won't be voting for you toDay. Typical newbie pass. Hyper-nerviness is a common wolf-cub trait, however.Zil to Rondie. Is this subtle advice?

2. Why did the wolves kill Eomer in the first place? Because he suspected Legate or for some other reason?

3. I find it interesting that when Sally died, Legate speculated about her death but failed to mention the most probable reason for her being killed: the wolves wanting to kill an ordo. Would a wolf have the cheek to do this? Wilwa, on the other hand quickly agreed with my thory about the wolves targeting Sally for ordoness. Now I know one of them has to be a wolf, but I'm just wondering which is a more furry approach: avoid mentioning the real kill reason (assuming I and various others were right) although it's obvious or agreeing with the innocent Captain Obvious who points it out. If it helps to know, Zil agreed with me.

4. "Hey, certainly not that! I say that's really the worst thing we could do. If we do this, and the WWs do this, and we do this, and the WWs do this, then the WWs eventually win. Like, imagine the newspaper headlines: "Village lost by intentionally lynching only ordos!" Honestly!!! "This looks like genuine frustration to me. I mean, a wolf could point the same thing out as it's kind of obvious Nog's suggestion was silly, but would a wolf be so outraged by it?

5. If so, for that matter, should we "vote" whom we'd like to see Hunted, or something like that? If even just for the record...Would a wolf suggest this? Could...?

6. Hmm, I don't see that likely being the case (her [Lottie] being a wolf), the wolves really wouldn't have all that much to gain by doing that. Yeah, they get the Heir, but then the village would know right away that Lottie wasn't the real hunter, so we'd look at her posts tomorrow and maybe be able to narrow down her mates, and we'd still have all 3 of our original Gifteds. Atleast with lynching the Hunter the wolves can hope that another innocent is taken down with them, but if the Hunter is left up for them to kill then they are the only one's at risk.

Plus, I would think if she was lying the real Hunter would have come forward and said something by now, so that they could be sure to be the one lynched instead of the fake one (gosh, that is a weird thing to say, wanting to lynch the real Hunter instead of the known wolf ). Actually, that's another reason Lottie is likely not a wolf. The real Hunter could have easily come forward, been lynched instead, and taken her down with him (giving the Heir to the village, and accomplishing nothing positive for the wolves).

So basically I still think this was a good idea. We just hope Lottie is lucky enough to take a wolf, and then we get the Heir (so we still have all of our Gifteds), then tomorrow we can just start playing like usual.

I don't think I'll be able to come on again, I am so sorry at my awful participation, hopefully Day 3 will be better for me.

++LottieThis post made me cry wolf. Not that the tone is off, but I find it weird Wilwa is around so little but she still manages to think about the tactical situation quite thoroughly and manages to think from the wolves' pow. I'm not saying thinking from the wolves' pow is criminal - I always do it and for a certain reason have been doing it extra much this time - but the relative amount of Wilwa's insightfulness has come from making smart comments on the wolves' probable thoughts, so it's really making me wonder. This post is a good example.

7. Legate made analyses of Nessa and LRH the Day before yesterDay. Would he have been drawing spotlight to a newbie fellow like that? Seems a little unfair and unlikely. If Legate and LRH are not fellows, Wilwa is a wolf for sure.

8. I'm finding my first instinct is to agree with Eomer that Inzil feels a tad slippery. Odd as this may sound, he just doesn't seem suspicious enough to not be suspicious. By which I mean, he doesn't seem to be throwing enough blame around. Which may just be coincidence, or may be an attempt to get by under the radar. And by "blame" I mean "large concentrations of suspicion". He's flung little bits and pieces of "it could be you" around at nearly everyone, but, even looking back through everything, I can't find any substantial claims.Is this wolf-on-wolf? Not sure...

9. So which is more guilty this (including a vote for Zil in the following post) or this (xpost of the other)? Can't honestly say, and one of them has to be a wolf. I think it's more likely Wilwa is furry but I'm not sure at all.

10. Still not entirely sure about anyone other than Nessa, but the fact that Legate is worried about my behavior makes me think he could be innocent.?????

11. Legate wanted to go through Zil's posts himself and not rely on others. Now, I'm often like this as innocent but seldom as wolf. Just wondering if Legate functions by the same logic...

12. Rondie's vote yesterDay was fishy.

13. Absolutely no idea what to make of Wilwa not voting yesterDay...

Now, I have a 5-6 page essay to write toDay but honestly this is such a Day that I just have to devote time to this game - now or never - so I'll be here as much as I can. I want to look through everybody's posts yesterDay because the wolves were obviously trying to avoid the hunter and maybe hit the ranger, so who wasn't picked by them might tell a lot, as well as if we managed to figure out Greenie's pick, because they are innocent.

Btw, while typing this post I realised exactly how important toDay is. One innocent vote gone wrong and game's over because the wolves can just jump on the bandwagon. So please please Nessa and you unknown innocent, be careful. I will be careful too.

Although if I have to say something, I think Wilwa is the safest bet for lynch toDay, both because LRH and Legate don't very much look like fellows, Legate gives me the most innocent vibes out of the three and LRH is the kind of easy lynch victim whom I wouldn't vote at this point without double-checking my own reasoning...

Anyway, far from decided now! As I said, going to do some rereading but first I'll start on the essay, especially as no one else seems to be around.

[Thinlómien]

Couldn't concentrate on the essay, so decided to have look on yesterDay. Trying to think from the wolves' pow and be objective, but can't guarantee I think the same way they did. Judging hunter picks as if hunters acted straightforwardly (hunted the same people they suspect) which is admittedly not even close to waterproof.

Greenie
probable hunter picks: maybe Elra or Legate not Wilwa or Lommy
giftedish behaviour? impossible to say
good kill for: Wilwa. Kind of good for me. Elra and Legate would've been gambling.

Legate
probable hunter picks: Elra, not Lommy, Wilwa or Greenie
giftedish behaviour? gives failry ungifted vibes if you ask me. (Now I know that sounds pretty mean but it was only meant in the ww role sense. :D)
good kill for: Wilwa, Lommy. Not for Elra.

Lommy
probable hunter picks: maybe Elra or Legate not Wilwa or Greenie
giftedish behaviour? I don't think I was being obvious but I'm not maybe the best judge for this.
good kill for: Wilwa. Elra and Legate in danger.

Rondie
probable hunter picks: not Legate
giftedish behaviour? no...?
good kill for: Legate, others would be very unsure.

Wilwa
probable hunter picks: not Lommy
giftedish behaviour? kind of - it would have been a brilliant move for the hunter not to vote or mention more suspects, I wonder if the wolves thought about this.
good kill for: nobody or anybody, depends how you read it. Best for me, unless she was double-bluffing.


So in total (leaving myself out)
Good kills for Wilwa: Greenie, Legate and Lommy. Elra not a bad choice.
Good kills for Elra: Wilwa. Others suspected her, Legate the most.
Good kills for Legate: Elra. Wilwa totally random, Greenie and me slightly dangerous.

So:
Good kills for Wilwa+Elra: None. Okay kills: Greenie, Lommy (but Legate would've been in danger).
Good kills for Elra+ Legate: Best kill undoubtedly Wilwa because Lommy & Greenie bot suspected them both
Good kills for Legate+Wilwa: I say Elra would've been the best bet since she trusted Legate and didn't say anything about the others. Okay kills: Greenie, Lommy (but Legate would've been in danger).

Greenie probably hunted Elra or Legate, so at least one of them is innocent. Ergo, Wilwa is a wolf.

If you look just at suspects, Greenie would've been the best kill for a team of Wilwa+Rondie, other teams would have probably gone for someone else. I think this logic is fairly valid because the wolves definitely wanted to avoid the hunter taking down one of them, especially as (as far as I see) there were not any special reasons that would make killing someone especially beneficial or especially harmful kill (ie clear ranger or hunter) universally.

Of course, Elra and Legate were probably the most suspected ones yesterDay, so it would have kind of made sense to leave them around to gather votes. But then again, it might have been smart not to attack Wilwa too (dangerous hunter because lack of opinions) or me or Greenie (likely-ish lynch material after Boro proven innocent), so I would regard the suspicions better proof.

Currently quite positive Wilwa is a wolf. Elra and Legate don't look like fellows (if they are, hats off!), and Wilwa looks the least innocent out of the three (although she has been marvellously unsuspicious all along, I have to say). Like I said, the kill points more towards Elra being the other wolf than Legate (and so does my common sense) but I'd prefer lynching Wilwa toDay to lynching Elra because I feel more sure about Wilwa and (sounds so mean to say!) I'd rather meet the wolf cub Elra in next Night's gamble than Wilwa who is an experienced player.

[Thinlómien]

Still no one else around, huh? Not the best Day to be quiet... Then I guess it's timezones. Anyway, I'm going to stop flood-posting for now and since I now know where I stand until new evidence appears I can maybe concentrate on the esaay without being agonising over this game all the time... :D I'll be online at the same time, though, and refreshing this thread every now and then.

[elronds_daughter]

Unfortunate that toDay is so...momentous. Real life has me writing an entire minuet, due to be performed in less than three hours, and it's not quite half finished.
But I shall take a moment here before I go back to the world of 18th-century counterpoint....

Lommy...I believe you. I think. And I'm inclined to think Wilwa's a wolf. Probably Legate too, if you are who you say you are. (If you aren't, shame on me, but it seems an elaborate lie for this late in the game. So, I think you're being truthsome.)


Right. Now back to channeling Bach.

[Thinlómien]

*bangs head against wall*

*curses Legate*

*wants to explode*

That was a darn innocent post. LRH is innocent or then she is really awfully quick to give up her partner in crime. I wouldn't think that so unlikely if she suspected Legate a lot and Wilwa a bit less, but the fact that she suspects Wilwa more - when Legate is not her fellow, just can't be, or I'll eat my shoes - makes me pretty sure she's innocent. Or then she's just very cunning. Aiergh.

Then again, if Legate is a wolf, he's been just brilliant. I mean, wonderful. Argh. The funny thing is, if we lynch Wilwa toDay like I'd strongly suggest, then we (hopefully me and Nessa both still alive ;)) are still facing the same decision - Legate or LRH - tomorrow. :rolleyes:

Anyway, toDay should tell us something. Hmm, I just got an idea how to avoid writing my essay: I could go through Wilwa's interactions with Legate and LRH and see which one looks more guilty. :D

Okay, okay, I won't, at least not yet. I still have lots of work in the essay and I think I'll just shut up until people show up. I'm most interested to see what Legate and Wilwa have to say. And I miss you, Nessa. Starting to feel paranoid alone, and also getting a superhero complex: I'm thinking I have to save the village alone. (Would be funny if it wasn't so stressful!)

Off to write essay. Hopefully someone appears soon. I'll be checking what's happening every now and then.

[wilwarin538]

Or then she's just very cunning. Aiergh.

That one. I know you've no reason to believe me, but if you kill me, we lose. Simple as that. Legate and LRH are the wolves, I know that for sure (since I'm inclined to believe you, I can't see a wolf false-revealing right now when they have the oppurtunity to win toDay).

And I don't like that you've become totally convinced of my guilt. Your whole case is assuming that the wolves thought Greenie was a possible Hunter, maybe they had some strong reason to believe she was the Ranger, or a strong reason to believe that someone else was the Hunter (and therefore Greenie was not). You're making a big assumption, and it's taken you to the incorrect conclusion.

[Thinlómien]

And I don't like that you've become totally convinced of my guilt. Your whole case is assuming that the wolves thought Greenie was a possible Hunter, maybe they had some strong reason to believe she was the Ranger, or a strong reason to believe that someone else was the Hunter (and therefore Greenie was not). You're making a big assumption, and it's taken you to the incorrect conclusion.I'm simply thinking they would've been scared of the hunter. Can't disagree, can you?

I have to say I've actually surprised myself with my conviction of your guilt. BUT even apart from the Greenie kill theory you look the most guilty and I feel sorry to say this because you've played so well: but Legate and LRH don't really sound like fellows at all. Take all Legate's spotlighting of LRH and LRH saying to Legate that his suspicion of her makes her think him innocent... it's quite a stretch.

Also, if both LRH and Legate are guilty, it means Greenie hunted me or you last Night. That's possible, but I'd think it slightly unlikely given how she seemed to have "rational" points for our innocence, and if you're innocent it's quite difficult to fabricate rational reasons and not believe in them at all.

Anyhow - call this lommy-flip-flopping or whatever you will - I'm not 100% sure you're guilty. I think lynching you is the safest option we have. However, like I said, my opinion may change, depends on what you and Legate and LRH say before my bedtime. I know I kind of killed the situation by rushing to state my own opinions but I can't play in a more calculated manner even if it makes sense. Well at least now I can see who is the most eager to buddy me up. :p

[Nessa Telrunya]

Okay, I think, even though before I had suspicions, Lommy, it'd be ridiculous for a wolf to false-reveal at this point, when they've nearly won already. So, I do believe you.

I'm not sure, however, that I can believe Wilwa to be a wolf. She posted so seldom for the longest time, and that seems extremely strange behavior for a wolf...

[Thinlómien]

I'm not sure, however, that I can believe Wilwa to be a wolf. She posted so seldom for the longest time, and that seems extremely strange behavior for a wolf...Well, she has been busy, I think. That's explanation enough for me. Schedules often matter more than your role.

But I'm not going to brainwash you into voting anyone. If there's something I value toDay, it's your independent thinking because otherwise it's just me and my superhero complex. :rolleyes: :D So tell me what you think, who looks the most suspicious, what looks like the most probable wolf combo etc and let's see if we get any wiser together. Most of all the two of us shouldn't vote hastily, because it's us who actually decide toDay (scary, eh?) because the unknown innocent can't vote wrong (good for them!) unless s/he decides to vote me or you.

I have a few points against each of LRH, Wilwa and Legate in store but I think I'll shut up for a while and let you others talk and think and observe. After all, I still have the essay too.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Great, so Lommy's revelation makes it all clear at least for me: obviously. The trouble we have is that each of the three of us is going to say the same. Whichever way it ends, though, I am glad that I was right about LRH. Her partnership with Wilwa makes quite a lot of sense when looking at it now.

Nessa and Lommy, in fact you are in the place to save the village, because if you lynch me, then we have lost. Basically, it does not make much of a difference from my pov whichever you lynch, wilwa or LRH, simply don't lynch ME.

That said, I am afraid that we won't be able to get much further from here. I guess we can try to make some arguments and try to see why they are Wolves, but ultimately, this is just what it comes down to.

EDIT: x-ed with Lommy and Nessa

[Nessa Telrunya]

I am really suspicious of the Inzil-Hubby conversation on Day 1... It's something to start with right? Trace the other wolves from the one we know. And she's been chipping in at just the right moments to tip the Votes.

[elronds_daughter]

I am really suspicious of the Inzil-Hubby conversation on Day 1... It's something to start with right? Trace the other wolves from the one we know. And she's been chipping in at just the right moments to tip the Votes.

Completely coincidental, I assure you.


Right. Well. I stand firm in my belief that the wolves are Wilwa and Legate.

I have a feeling those two will vote for me. At this point, I'm the only other unknown.

They've already been through the "By the gods, I don't care who you kill, just don't lynch ME" routine, so that's old, so I won't bother with it.

All I ask is that you, Nessa and Lommy, think carefully about who you're sending to the noose.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

I have looked once again at the thread, now when I look at it retrospectively, all of the things stand out in a completely different light.

LRH indeed acted many times in the manner of the sort of basic Wolf, or newbie-Wolf attitude. Her Day 1 "of course now everybody is suspecting me, just because of a little bit of self-preservational instinct" was probably a genuine Wolvish fear, likewise, she seemed to me like using the tactic of "buttering up" players from time to time - I even believe that her yesterDay words that because I suspect her, she thinks I am innocent might have been something like that - I mean, that's a thing you might suppose to throw many innocents off-balance if they are suspecting you. Her way of e.g. suspecting me and Lommy early on was made in the sort of classic "I am suspecting them, but of course I might be wrong" way, to make herself an escape route, if need be. And the Inzil-debate was just the last thing.

Wilwa, on the other hand, was all the time generally subtle, I would say that she was basically avoiding making her own decisions. Her posts early on contain basically no real content, that way, she managed to slip past by and "fly under the radar". Her vote on Day 1 was random, her vote for Lottie was merely one in the crowd, with Inzil, she probably planned to cover herself with a Wolf-on-Wolf vote. Last Day she did not vote at all. She did not make much of a contact with anybody, not really any direct links, except for mentioning the Lommy and Boro business, which however was sort of "in course" back then. I am sure it was all just calculated. Basically, she is the sort of elusive type of Wolf, leaving no direct trace.

That's sort of to do justice to everything - you can see for yourselves.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well, is anybody around?

The time is getting late for me. I am going to remain around for some amount of time still, but I need to go to sleep too. Lommy, Nessa, if you are debating between Wilwa and Hubby, simply choose one of them which you think is likely, but make sure you choose the same one. I can follow your vote, just as long as it is one of them. Then we can hopefully lynch the other one the following Day. But simply make sure that it is one of them, or we are finished already now.

[Thinlómien]

Nessa,

I'm currently thinking our wolves are Wilwa (wasn't her post exactly like a wolf's that has given up?) and probably Legate. There is something that rings false in his manner (but ok I admit I suspect him everytime he takes that tone and sometimes he's innocent). Not exactly sure what to make of Elra's "And I'm inclined to think Wilwa's a wolf. Probably Legate too, if you are who you say you are. (If you aren't, shame on me, but it seems an elaborate lie for this late in the game. So, I think you're being truthsome.)" (emphasis mine). It just seems weird. However, her tone rings the most innocent in total to me. Like I said, Wilwa is giving up too easily and sounds like a cornered wolf (is not contributing etc) and Legate on the other hand seems kind of too quick to assure we're on the same team with him. Elra seems the most honest.

I'm not sure at all about Legate being a wolf, but I'm pretty sure Wilwa is one. That's why I'd feel by far the safest to lynch her and will vote her unless you absolutely forbid me to. I'd love to check the three's interactions with each other and Zil, but it's 3am here and I still have an essay to finish, so honestly I'm not sure if I can.

Do you have any specific thoughts? Anything new?

[Nessa Telrunya]

I suppose, if either Hubby or Leggy were a wolf, wilwa would be a logical packmate for either. We should go for whoever has the most possibility, and everyone needs to vote together to be effective.

[Thinlómien]

I suppose, if either Hubby or Leggy were a wolf, wilwa would be a logical packmate for either. We should go for whoever has the most possibility, and everyone needs to vote together to be effective.Right. One reason - I know I keep repeating this - I suspect Wilwa above all is that it seems so unlikely LRH and Legate are fellows/ both wolves.

So my preference would be to lynch her toDay and make the decision between LRH and Legate toMorrow when at least I have more time to go through Zil and Wilwa's interactions with them. With good luck (50% chance ;)) we are both still here to ponder that toMorrow and at least one of us will be.

All of this of course assuming I'm not totally wrong and LRH and Legate are in cahoots. In that case I take full responsibility for the innocents losing (although please still don't neg-rep me, after all I made a save and all ;)) and say they actually deserved it with putting up such a show.

So, huge objections against lynching Wilwa toDay anyone? I'm considering going to sleep very soon and finishing the essay tomorrow since there's 2h 15min at least between the end of my lecture and the deadline...

[Thinlómien]

And haha as a total piece of randomness I get the most wolvish vibes from Nessa atm. Epic fail gut-feelings, eh? :D

(Eomer would deserve a flogging if Nessa was a wolf.)

[Nessa Telrunya]

And haha as a total piece of randomness I get the most wolvish vibes from Nessa atm. Epic fail gut-feelings, eh? :D

(Eomer would deserve a flogging if Nessa was a wolf.)

Haha, I guess I'm a total creeper. XD

But in all seriousness, I think Wilwa, being the most logical packmate for either of the two, should be our vote.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Brilliant, just as long as we don't epic-fail toMorrow, but I think if you read the posts toMorrow carefully, it will be clear. So can I count on you voting wilwa? Because otherwise, even if you vote somebody else, we lose, because if I vote wilwa and you vote otherwise, the two of them can simply join and vote me or one of you.

edit: x-ed with Nessa

[Nessa Telrunya]

Brilliant, just as long as we don't epic-fail toMorrow, but I think if you read the posts toMorrow carefully, it will be clear. So can I count on you voting wilwa? Because otherwise, even if you vote somebody else, we lose, because if I vote wilwa and you vote otherwise, the two of them can simply join and vote me or one of you.

edit: x-ed with Nessa

++Wilwa

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, one, two, three -

++wilwa

It's up to you.

EDIT: x-ed

[Thinlómien]

++Wilwa

Huh, now I can go to sleep.

However, even though I sleep tonight, I won't be sleeping toNight.

Have fun, lone wolf. At least I'm giving you almost as much headache as you are giving me. :p


PS. Let's just hope there will be a Night. :rolleyes: :D


edit: xed with Legate who isn't celebrating so we probably chose correctly... yay... or then he's just really mean! Anyway, going now.
edit2: okay he actually xed with Nessa... eek.

[wilwarin538]

Oh common. I didn't give up, I had to leave! And then before I have time to beg for mercy you all go vote me all at the same time!

*glares at everyone*

I go the whole game with like no suspicion, and then *poof* when I'm this close, then suddenly everyone hops on me? :rolleyes:

[wilwarin538]

Just because I find great enjoyment in doing this sort of thing:

++Wilwa

Let's just make it unanimous!

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Great! There will be Night.

I just wanted to remark how funny it is when you are simply voting for a known Wolf... I think I actually have never experienced that, like, not from my perspective (it's been always just like some other Seer said it and I followed, but I don't recall that it would ever be me who would be the one knowing it by myself).

Anyway, good Night, and let's hope for a good toMorrow too.

EDIT: x-ed with wilwa...

[Thinlómien]

Oh common. I didn't give up, I had to leave! And then before I have time to beg for mercy you all go vote me all at the same time!

*glares at everyone*

I go the whole game with like no suspicion, and then *poof* when I'm this close, then suddenly everyone hops on me? :rolleyes:Sorry darling, I told you you were good, but Legate and LRH kind of sealed your fate by being very un-fellowy and so did Greenie by failing to kill anyone.

Feeling relieved now. :D Now I can sleep peacefully. Yay.


PS. Wilwa don't be too unhappy, even though I plan to make a save toNight there's still a fair chance your team will win due to a tad too many mislynches by the village and you having a slight advantage of numbers in the beginning. :p


edit: xed with poor Wilwa and fishy-ish Legate

[wilwarin538]

Since my dear Pop and Cake enjoy doing this sort of thing, I've decided to provide you with some entertainment (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4Lx5Bmpojw).

x'ed Lommy, haha, I don't feel all that awful, I get lynched so rarely as a wolf that it's nice to have a change once in a while :p

[elronds_daughter]

<sigh of relief>

++ Wilwa

Now it's unanimous. :)

[Shastanis Althreduin]

The site just now came back up for me.

In any case, Wilwawolf is no more.

It is now Night. Last wolf and Ranger please make your choices.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Internet is dead. Updating from phone. Nessa is dead. Go.

[elronds_daughter]

Poor Nessa. She was the obvious choice....

I'm tempted to just vote for Legate right here and now, but I want to see at least a little conversation before I do. I doubt there will be some sudden revelation of innocence/guilt, but one never knows.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Poor Nessa. She was the obvious choice....

I'm tempted to just vote for Legate right here and now, but I want to see at least a little conversation before I do. I doubt there will be some sudden revelation of innocence/guilt, but one never knows.

I am not quite sure what revelation would you expect.

As for Nessa, if you say she was the obvious choice, then you probably know it best yourself. This Day is decisive anyway, whichever of the known innocents would have been alive, so now it's up to Lommy. There is probably not much more to add, although it would be nice to hear from her before she votes. We've gone quite far, basically lynching one Wolf sort of "above the abyss", it would be really nice to finish this "with a clean slate".

I don't think there is any reason to delay with my vote, as I am not going to vote anybody else anyway. I can still talk after that, of course.

++LRH

[elronds_daughter]

Right.

++ Legate

Up to you now, Lommy....

[Thinlómien]

*would like to offer a few words if this wasn't a family-friendly site*

I knew that. I agree it was the obvious choice. And I'm sorry I failed but I had no ther choice. Should have played my cards differently earlier.

Anyway:

To whatever audience is enjoying my agony right now,

please don't judge me too harshly. If I make the wrong choice, please remember it was me who nailed Wilwa and gave Eomer one more Night and Day. So I have not epic failed totally.

Okay okay, I have, I admit. It is my fault if we lose. Now I'd love to quote some stuff. Like:

"I wish it need not have have happened in my time," said Frodo.
"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."

Yes, I've always been one to hate the end-game Days rather than find them exciting. Anyhow, I will think and analyse as much as I have time for (which might not be enough).

But just how can you judge two people so different: a relatively quiet new ww player whom you barely know and a veteran loudmouth who is your boyfriend?!?

Just let's hope I don't yeild to the temptation and end up voting Legate just because I would take it too personally if he fooled me. :p :rolleyes:

[elronds_daughter]

I shan't hold a grudge if you choose wrongly, Lommy. It's a tough decision.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Well, obviously the decision is hard (and unfortunately you seem to fall to a similar position rather often). But like you said, Lommy, you have protected us and we got a Wolf yesterDay... so I would not worry about that. But seriously, I think if one considers all the evidence, I think it is easy to see that Hubby is the Wolf.

And as for your last idea, heij! Well, I might take it as a compliment, but the rest of the village would probably not approve of such a reasoning. :rolleyes:

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

All right, I think I am going to sleep at this hour, which means leaving this thread for good and letting it for Lommy to decide.

I just hope Lommy will make it here to vote, otherwise the WWs win by default only because Hubby voted later, now that would be surely rather silly way to end...

[Thinlómien]

Legate, if you're there, you can go to sleep in peace. I'm here and just about to decide the fate of the village.

Now, off to reread and think. I shall vote within an hour because it's disgustingly late here.

[Thinlómien]

++Legate


1) If Elra and Zil staged their disagreement of the DL, I have to admire them. I would expect fellow wolves to be equally aware of the DLs.

2) I have realised I can't make anything out of Elron's posts. So for me, it's just "could Legate be the last wolf, yes or no?" And the answer looks like yes.

3) Okay this goes slightly meta, but I think an innocent Legate would try to plead with me more. He's now being very diplomatic, which could be because he'd feel bad trying to exploit my RL trust in him for ww purposes. As an innocent, he wouldn't probably even think of it. Or that's how I'd feel in his place - of course we have quite different personalities so I might be wrong if I try to judge him based on what I'd do.

4) This (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=644715&postcount=327). Lynching Elra is the safest option on the decisive Day? Brilliant.

5) I might be underestimating the newbie, but this (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=644747&postcount=334)would be mighty cunning from a newbie wolf.

6) Like Kath told me, if you're unsure, be nice to the newbie.


In case I'm wrong -

hats off Elra, that was brilliant! And so sorry Legate. But I know you can forgive me. :p

And in case I'm right

YAY YAY YAY! I made the right decision. Thanks for headache, darlings.

Shall check this once I wake up. Good night, no more Nights!

[Shastanis Althreduin]

And that's game!



One team wins.


But which?



It's....


The....










Innocents! Legate was the last wolf! Great job everyone.

[Loslote]

1. Yay Shasta for a mind-nubbing and exciting game! :D

2. *does obligatory "I knowed it" dance around Inzilawolf*

3. So sorry Nog! :o

4. Yeah. Um. Thought process: "I know Zil's a wolf, but I can't see any way Nog's an innocent..."

And then I chose the wrong one, of course.

5. Well done Lommy! :D

[Loslote]

Also also?

So my options are between letting Nerwen, who I don't really suspect, die, or tieing the vote (and thus killing) Nessa, who I also don't suspect.

I lied. I was never considering voting for either of them - I was going to vote for myself. :p That didn't end up working out, but it actually would have had the same result as it did the next Day - I would have hunted either Zil or Nog. The only difference was that, at that point, Zil was the more likely of the two. :p

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Yaaasss!!! :D

I had a blast in this game. Great fun. More comments will follow later, but thanks to everyone who played and especially Shasta - who battled on despite connection issues. :p

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Ah, well! So close!

But amazing game nevertheless, in fact, I haven't played such a brilliant game for some time! And I am not even sad for the loss, it was really cool to get that far.

Lommy, good job. You have been really active during the last few Days especially, and really successful in uncovering all the truths. It was really difficult to find some ways to counter you. I am proud of you :)

Elra, now that's what I call a first game, I think you can call yourself a great survivor. I mean, a memorable beginning for sure (it probably won't happen to you so often that you'd survive until the last Day). That said, I hope you enjoyed this and will continue WWing with us :)

My dear packmates! You have been both absolutely wonderful. You're a large part of why I have enjoyed this game so much. Zil, a pity that you had to go, but still I think you have been around long enough to make up for our last Wolving together. It was a decent enough retribution, I'd say. Wilwa, you were brilliant too, and definitely supplying us with good ideas during the Nightly planning. I am really sorry for having a hand in lynching of you both, but I assume there was no other way... in the second-but-last Day, I was thinking of impersonating the Ranger, but I couldn't have known whether Nessa is not the Ranger (and known innocent contesting me would mean a clear end to any impersonations), and later I have decided that it is perhaps better to rely on that Nessa or Lommy are going to choose wrong. Alas, they didn't.

A few things I would generally like to bring to peoples' attention, which I think all of us Wolves found rather funny:

There have been quite many votes for a fellow Wolf. I have voted for both of my packmates.

Me and Wilwa have voted for a fellow Wolf at exactly the same point and cross-posted (it wasn't any problem, by voting him we have expected to have him gone, it was just interesting to find we have done so at the same point. A pity this hasn't been considered the sign of innocence more strongly). For that matter, I don't know exactly what the mindsetting of my fellow WWs was, but it was certainly not a plan to get rid of Inzil that Day from the beginning, it was just like "if it happens, we are going to sacrifice him". Sadly, it happened.

Already on Night 1, Wilwa brought up the idea to make the village lynch the Hunter on Day 1, as we also considered it advantageous if it was done. I think we were a bit doubtful whether such a suggestion won't be considered suspicious, but in the end as we see, there have been so many ideas and perspectives flying around that being suspected for something was completely out of the way. Anyway, before wilwa could do it, Lommy proposed exactly the same thing. Once again shows how relative the advantage of different outcomes was.

And it seems to have become a tradition for me that whenever I am a Wolf and on one of the last Days I target one of the sisters, I do so because I think they are not the Hunter, yet they are, yet they don't target me. In my first game, the same thing happened with Lommy. This time, okay, we have been considering the possibility that Greenie is the Hunter, but more like in brackets; and I had a rather elaborate reasons why I thought she was the Ranger. Totally off, of course. That said, at least I have been thinking for quite some time that Lommy could be the Hunter.

Speaking of knowing other roles, Eomer, we have of course discovered you must be the Seer as early as the Ranger did, and we thought the Ranger did too, but we targeted you still, just to be on the safe side. And that said, I didn't like you since the beginning, but we wanted to go for a safe kill the first Night (indeed, in order to "throw the ball" back to the village), and next Night, it was already too late.

Anyway, it was a perfect game, from everybody; and of course most thanks go to our poor-internet-disconnection-pursued Mod :) The Heir role surely was something special, and I personally have enjoyed the early Days' debates "what the heck are we going to do?"

[Nerwen]

Yay, Lommy! :)

And Elra, congratulations on surviving to the end. Sorry I picked on you. It was fun, though...:smokin:

[elronds_daughter]

And Elra, congratulations on surviving to the end. Sorry I picked on you. It was fun, though...:smokin:

No worries, Nerwen, I forgive you! I'm enritely astonished that I survived as long as I did.

Bravo, Lommy for lynching the wolf!

This was lots of fun. When can we do it again? :)

[wilwarin538]

Ooh, soooo close. Good job Lommy, you deserve the win. Especially the way you somehow managed to make an extremely solid case against me that I didn't even see coming, and could not think of a way to argue out of. ;)

That whole game was so crazy! I wasn't around much at the beginning, so most of the time I just skimmned through the thread and the WW PMs, haha, I didn't even really know why they wanted to kill Sally, I was just like "sure, yeah, great idea". Then me and Legate both voting for Inzil at the exact same moment, that was kind of priceless. I wish Inzil didn't have to go, but at the point it just seemed highly likely that he would, so I decided voting him early would look good for me, and Legate thought the same thing. Kind of like the way he voted me yesterDay, he's just a little backstabber. ;)

I really wish you guys had lynched LRH instead of Boro, cause I think if Lommy had had to choose between me, Legate and him, she would have chosen him, and we would have won! Oh well! And Greenie was a bit of a gamble actually, it was really me who was utterly convinced she was the Ranger, so when Legate was like "well, if she's the Hunter she could be going for me, it'd be risking my life" I was all like "whatever, she's not anyway, so I'm choosing her" with no consideration for him! Clearly as wolves the two of us only care about our own survival. :p

Anyway, that was very fun! Kudos to Eomer for getting a wolf and leaving wonderful hints, and to Lottie for sacrificing herself for the good of the village. And Shasta of course, for an extremely exciting game, and a wonderful new role!

[Thinlómien]

YAY! You know when I woke up toDay at 4pm ( :rolleyes: but my last post on this thread was from 5.30 am and then I got stuck talking with a friend who was staying overnight for yet one more hour) I was so sure I had chosen wrong. So, when Agan who had checked the thread when she woke up told me "btw the village won" I was quite happy.

I have to say it's been a long time since there was a game to give me so much headache. (Probably the last time I was the ranger. Funny.) I so much wanted to make a second save and be really cool, but alas that didn't happen! At some point I thought it'd be better to be predictable than a fail (that's why I protected Nessa the Night when Greenie died - funnily, I protected Greenie the Night before! - and was only able to protect myself the last Night. I was quite unhappy to realise that because I thought dying the last Night and leaving the mess for Nessa would've been quite a nice way to do it and more heroic than failing on the last Day. :p Legate - did you figure out I protected Nessa the Night before, or why did you kill her?)

And you wolves - you were just brilliant! I had my suspicions of Zil, but as somebody pointed out, I flip-flopped quite a lot. I'm not sure what would've happened without Eomer's dream. (Hats off Mr. Of The Rohirrim!) But Wilwa and Legate... oh my. You were just incredible. Too bad Eomer had delivered us a known innocent and Boro was lynched earlier on. After all, it was really evident LRH and Legate can't be wolves together, so that's what killed Wilwa. And as for Legate - well, that really was unclear for me, a few shaky arguments to support my suspicion of him over Elra and some luck. Had the game gone differently, I have no doubt you'd have won. It was so close even now.

It was a blast of a game. Thanks everybody - especially Shasta for giving the roles to whom you did and inventing the heir and for the wolves for being the kind of adversaries you can really take pride in beating, knowing it could so well have ended the other way but this time it didn't.


PS. My picks: Night2 Lottie (I figured the wolves would go for someone who looks as ordoish as possible - and btw I was really hoping Sally to be the hunter, that would've been brilliant from her!), Night3 Eomer (smelled of seer to me), Night4 Greenie (thought that if the wolves weren't sure about the identity of the seer, Greenie would be the other option, and also, like I told Shasta, Greenie is an Eomer (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpost.php?p=552350&postcount=227)of sorts too), Night4 Nessa (also considered protecting myself, but decided rather to be safe than sorry), Night5 myself (no other choice, obviously!).

PPS. What can we learn from this game: 1. Don't trust the police. 2. Don't trust the sweetest girl you know. 3. Don't trust your boyfriend. ;)

[Inziladun]

Lousy do-gooder Seer. :p

Well. for the first time as a wolf I've been found out by a Seer-dream. Having been evil the past three out of four games, I was wondering if some psychic aura of lupinity was clinging to me. :rolleyes:

Still, I was rather optimistic coming into things, and Legate and Wilwa were great fun to plot with. We'd fingered Eomer as the Seer, I think, because he'd seemed so certain about Lottie being innocent. We'd agreed to go for him Night 3 and take the chance on the Ranger protecting him, thinking that even if that happened we'd know we could get him the next Night.
Day 3 I knew from the first he'd dreamed me. I was waiting for him to reveal, but he never did. I was then just watching and waiting. As the votes for me piled up and it seemed clear I was going to be the lynch, even without Eomer revealing, I made a conscious effort not to say too much about anyone else, fearing to give the village something more they could use.
When Nessa arrived late in the Day, I tried to talk her around, but nothing doing. As what I thought was the DL, 10 PM CST, approached, there was no sign of LRH. Since it seemed obvious I was going out, I decided to accept it and have a bit of fun. Of course, had I known the DL had been permanently extended, I would have done my best to convince LRH to go for Boro. I'm rather doubtful it would have worked, though.
I'd like to echo others saying LRH was very good in her first game.

Shame we couldn't get the Heir with us, but I thought going along with the plan to lynch Lottie-Hunter could reflect well on me. Didn't quite work out that way, though. I knew Lottie had been suspecting me, but I was hopeful that my acceptance of the plan in spite of that might make her change her target from me.At least I wasn't killed that way.

Nice job Eomer, getting me and giving the village a known innocent in Nessa.

Hats off to Lommy-Ranger for the save on Eomer. If not for that, I think we'd have had the game.

And mates, it was an honour. No hard feelings about the wolf-on-wolf. I was hoping it would help you both out, especially when Greenie and Lommy both tried to kill Boro instead of me.
One day we'll have better luck, Legate. ;)

Thanks to Shasta for modding.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

It was a bit of a head-desk moment when I saw Lottie had killed Nogrod instead of Inzil. :p That would have been tremendously epic if the plan had worked. Not to worry, though, because we still got the benefits. I'm curious, Lottie: when did you realise I had dreamed about you?

One more thing: I had not considered the Heir-possibilities until the game had started. I was just thinking 'let's wait and see how things turn out' - I enjoyed the ensuing madness greatly!

Did you feel honoured, Greenie?

P.S. I obviously keep giving rep to the same people. :rolleyes: :p

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Oh, Lottie: the youtube videos you posted early on. Were they designed so that people could hint to you? I spent ages thinking of a Spanish Inquisition reference to point to Inzil, but couldn't settle on one. I ended up just quoting Inzi and telling him that I did, in fact, expect said inquisition.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Kind of like the way he voted me yesterDay, he's just a little backstabber. ;)
I am flattered, of course :)

Legate - did you figure out I protected Nessa the Night before, or why did you kill her?)
No, it was still a gamble for me. I mean, both options were still open: we could not have known whether you haven't protected Nessa already the Night after you protected Eomer (since of course, by then it was clear to us that Nessa was his dream, but we had to kill him first, the question was whether the Ranger a) already realised the same about Nessa now being "known innocent", b) would have protected her already, because it could have been assumed that we'd go after Eomer that Night anyway). So it still might have been that you'd be able to protect Nessa that Night. Personally, in the beginning, I was thinking that I would have preferred to kill you, because you have suspected me more and in fact, I thought it more likely at one point that Nessa will be protected. But in the end, two things have influenced my thoughts: even if you made a save, it wouldn't matter for the village, as you two still had to choose between me and LRH, and if you chose wrong, I would kill one person at Night (as I would know who was protected the last Night) and then simply win. Secondly (and a pity that this did not work out), I thought that if I targeted you and failed, it would be clear to you that it was me, because the probability of you or Nessa being protected was more or less the same; it was then a question of personal preferrence. Nessa suspected LRH more, you suspected me more. I thought that killing Nessa might make you think - at least a bit more - that it was LRH who'd want to do it more. It came down mostly to that.

One day we'll have better luck, Legate.
Yes, "emerging from a game alongside Inzil victoriously and unscathed" has been officially put on my to-do list. ;)

[Loslote]

I'm curious, Lottie: when did you realise I had dreamed about you?

...I didn't? To be honest, I thought for a while that Boro was the Seer, and then I just had no idea whatsoever...

Oh, Lottie: the youtube videos you posted early on. Were they designed so that people could hint to you?

...not really. I just have fun with the beginning of Day Ones.

I spent ages thinking of a Spanish Inquisition reference to point to Inzil, but couldn't settle on one. I ended up just quoting Inzi and telling him that I did, in fact, expect said inquisition.

I'm seriously awful at hints. I write them all off as banter. :p Really, though, no one should ever try to hint at me. Even when Sally tells me after I've died "there's a hint in this post" I'll be like, "um..." and she's like "I said I'm Athena" and I'm like "...really?" and she's like "yes!" and I'm totally clueless still. :rolleyes::p

[Nessa Telrunya]

Great game everyone, it was loads of fun! And thanks to Shasta for making such an intriguing game!

[Nogrod]

Way to go Lommy! *bows*

You really made a difference!


And oh my, you bad-bad wolfsies! I was more or less at the back-alley with you this time... Yeah, I felt Zil to be bad at the time, as well as Legate and Wilwa, but never enough to pick you out from others who felt more or less similarly bad... So nothing to boast there for me, on the contrary, this was one one the worst games for me looking at my "wolf-radar".

And hey Lottie, no problem, those th ings happen! And to be earnest, my RL was (and is) soo crowded it was a relief to go down that way that early...

Kudos to all who tried their best!

And to Ms. Hubbard especially for reaching the final stages on your first game! Well done!