Are the movies a good or bad thing? [Archive] - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Zoe

12-27-2000, 12:30 AM

I'm sure this has been done before, but do you think the LotR movies coming out over the next few years are a good thing? Potential benefits: -More people will hear about the LotR, and possibly read it (and become rabid Tolkien fans like we all are...) -There will be more interest in Tolkien-related sites, such as the barrowdowns, and so, boards such as this could end up with a lot more members (this could also be a bad thing, it depends on what sort of people sign up, and whether they have anything worth saying). -The movie could turn out to be a really good interpretation of the book, and you have to agree, good movies are Good Things. Potential problems: -Depending on how accurate the movie is, a lot of people coud see the movie and come out with all sorts of strange notions about the ME. -Perhaps it's impossible to make a good movie version of the LotR, anyway. Perhaps too many scenes rely on the nuances of text, and they just won't come accross well. -If a bad movie is made, people may be put off from reading the texts, presuming that they're as poor as the movie. So. Should there be a LotR movie? Are there any benefits/problems I've missed. (I'm sure there are, that was just off the top of my head.) Comments, anyone?

Orald

12-27-2000, 02:09 AM

Are the movies a good or bad thing? Hmm, I would say yes. The Hobbit movie was what turned me onto Tolkien. Of course many Tolkien fanatics will find a million things wrong with the movies and will be highly upset with them. On the other hand people new to Tolkien will not notice these things. I can almost guarantee that those people will enjoy the movie. It isn't like this is some cheap independent film. It almost has to be a good film, or films. I mean is it possible to corrupt the works of Tolkien when you are trying not to?

Salabel

12-27-2000, 04:02 AM

The movies will have mixed reviews, criticism and merits. The tolkien fans out there, thousands of them including myself will notice the smallest details that have been changed; and most, even the casual LotR reader will notice some. For example, Bombadil, the Old Forest AND THE BARROW DOWNS (including the barrow, the wight and the taking of the swords etc.) are to be cut out...numerous things support this. Arwen is doing a lot to - participating in the battle at Helm's Deep for example, but enough of that. Critics will rave about the SFX, the acting, the deep storyline, but will always have something to say about what "could have been;" the film will only be Peter Jackson's interpretation of Middle Earth and as a result many will deem things missing or incorrect - "Legolas is supposed to have brown hair...but it's BLACK in the movie" and so on. They will no doubt pull a larger audience into Tolkien's world, and sales of LotR will no doubt reach unprecendeted heights, probably the highest sales recorded since it first came out. Unfortunately, movies are all about making money so many things will be sacrificed or changed to make the movie just that bit more lucrative; Tolkien said that the movie of LotR would never be made when he was alive. In my opinion it will gross in the box office but will be something less than I would want it to be. Mainly because my interpretation will be different; my balrog has wings, his doesnt so to speak, and he will always miss something, maybe cut out a song, that I loved. Ultimately it will become a good film, thouroughly entertaining, but no-one, unless they consulted the millions of fans and made 3 films of 3 hours each, will ever make a perfect Lord of the Rings. I'll still see it though. Oh yeah. Couldn't miss it. But no Barrow Downs. :"> Damn.

Inziladun

12-27-2000, 08:13 AM

Well, Salabel covered most of what I would say about this. There will,of course be many changes from the book. These are made to an extent due to the time constraints when trying to reproduce books on film. But the enhancement of Arwen's role seems a calculated attempt to broaden the audience by modernizing the story. It will probably work,and I do think the movies will be a financial success. The only good I can see in them though,is that many people may be moved to buy and read the books. I know of no movies based on books by any author that are as good as the works that inspired them. I won't see the movies. Reason being that seeing Middle Earth in cold,hard reality on the big screen would utterly ruin the experience of the books for me. Instead of my imagination,I would have the movie images in my head when reading. And wouldn't that defeat the purpose of opening a book to begin with?

the Lorien wanderer

12-27-2000, 09:07 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I so agree. Seeing the movie will ruin the book for so many readers. Not for me because I'm a fanatic (according to Durelen's description anyway. I'm already mad at the idea of a movie). Can you imagine a human Galadriel? Or what Gandlaf will look like? And the ents will just be walking trees. And Mordor will be one black, gloomy set. Oh forget it, I'm making myself miserable. Not all those who wander are lost.

Orald

12-27-2000, 11:45 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Don't get me wrong, I am a fanatic as much as you. But I want others to get hooked on Tolkien. The easiest way for that to be done is for the movie to be released. Do you remember when Jurassic Park was released, I had already read the book and thought the movie a grouse interpretation. After a while though I found myself with a copy of it. I am not worried about the things that are left out or changed. I am worried about how the masses will respond to the movie and if their response is good, then I will be worried about their response to the books. I want people to enjoy Tolkien as I do. The only problem with converting books into movies is that the imagination doesn't get to run as free. Is this what you are worried about? Someone disagreeing with your idea of what ME is?

Orald

12-27-2000, 11:48 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? No, I can't imagine a human playing an elf. I will have to bare with it though. In reply to my second post. All I want is for others to see the splendour of the world Tolkien created.

Zoe

12-28-2000, 01:26 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I think what a lot of the 'crazy Tolkien fans' are worried about is the fact that there will be innacuracies in the interpretation. I personally am not too concerned. (If it's really bad, and all else fails, I plan to just consider the book and the movie to be two completely different things, which just happen to share the same title.) I'm also going to be happy at the coverage the books are going to get. Unlike a lot of movies-based-on-books, the LotR movie is based on a famous book so I'm sure a lot of critics will discuss the book almost as much as the films, which will be a good thing.

Salabel

12-28-2000, 02:56 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Although I never liked the idea of a movie, and never liked the changes; I never really liked the movie industry anyway and the way they corrupt storylines to broaden them, make them 'prettier' in the eyes of the public, so I'm always like that. The movie will be worth seeing though, despite the fact that whoever the hell ORlando Bloom is he will never play Legolas right. Nope. And all the elves will have REALLY pointed ears, making them that bit more faerie-like and supposedly relate them more to the audience's image of an elf, from old fairytales and whatnot; which is crap. Tolkien never intended that. It will definitely pull readers though, which is nothing but good - more people to read LotR, and more people to criticize PJ in the aftermath of the movies. Heh heh.

the Lorien wanderer

12-28-2000, 07:42 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Durelen...what I'm worried about is not people's ideas clashing with mine. What I'm worried about is that all those who see the LOTR movie will then have a fixed image of Middle earth. Then, when they read the book, they won't be able to see Fangorn and Gandalf and Lorien the way you and I have. And it won't stay confined to the movie. Remember the tacky little Gandalfs with McDonald happy meals? Not all those who wander are lost.

The Barrow-Wight

12-28-2000, 09:21 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Lorien Wanderer, I don't think that's going to happen. I saw the animated hobbit several times before I read the book, and, though some imagry did stick in my mind, I still applied my own imagination to the characters and places as I read the text. Most people are going to do this, with only the week-minded few submitting totally to Jackson's view. And I'm thinking that these people are unlikely to pick up a book in the first place. Let alone three!! I feel that these movies are going to fill the gap between the 70's and today. The gap that has grown wider each year as more and more people become unaware of the existence of Middle-Earth. Nobody's heard of JRR Tolkien anymore. But now they will. And suddenly there will be thousands of new readers running to the bookstores. And thousands of old readers reaquainting themsleves with an old friend. Watch this forum grow after the first trailer. Then be prepared for an explosion of growth next Christmas. Let's think of it as our duty to educate those people that come here. To let them in in on the things that Jackson will be forced to leave out. The Barrow-Wight (RKittle) I usually haunt <a href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">The Barrow-Downs</a> and The Barrow-Downs <a href="http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi">Middle-Earth Discussion Board</a>.

onewhitetree

12-28-2000, 12:52 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Your wisdom surpasses all, O Wight. I agree completely. But I'm still going to be ticked when I see little Sauron action figures. Ugh. The woods are lovely, dark, and deep. I am Administrator at <a href=http://pub43.ezboard.com/bfangornforest>Fangorn Forest</a>! I am also a great fan of <a href=http://pub23.ezboard.com/bminasmorgul>Minas Morgul</a>.

Mister Underhill

12-28-2000, 07:31 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Must... not... look... at... Sauron figure........... Personal vision... of ME... being... destroyed.... AAAAUUUUGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Edited by: <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000005>Mister Underhill</A> at: 12/28/00 8:35:36 pm

Orald

12-29-2000, 12:49 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I never really did like happy meals. Something I shouldn't say but will before someone else does. A balrog will be in this movie, along with elves and their...ears. Oh no, what will people think, more importantly, what will become of our imaginations(cringe)

the Lorien wanderer

12-29-2000, 01:16 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? AAAAAAAAAAARGH!!!!!!!!!!! See? That's what I mean. Then, every time anyone thinks of Legolas, he'll be blonde and have pointy ears. Ugh. Ughughughgughgughgugh. Now I'm bugged. Not all those who wander are lost.

onewhitetree

12-29-2000, 02:59 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Arwen is the worst. She definetely surpasses all on the Crap-O-Meter. Warrior Princess meets Spice Girl? Argh. Every leaf a miracle ~ The woods are lovely, dark, and deep I am Administrator at <a href=http://pub43.ezboard.com/bfangornforest>Fangorn Forest</a>! I am also a great fan of <a href=http://pub23.ezboard.com/bminasmorgul>Minas Morgul</a>.

Salabel

12-29-2000, 09:07 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Exactly! Just like I said before, all the elves including Legolas will have pointy ears. Hmmm...well at least now with no barrow-downs we don't have to see Wight action figures...

Mister Underhill

12-30-2000, 10:17 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Are you guys for real about the movies destroying your personal imaginative image of all things ME? Does the same thing happen to you when you look at Tolkien-inspired artwork? If it's going to be that bad, just avoid the movies and everything related to them. For that matter, better rip the covers off your Tolkien books so that the artwork doesn't poison your imagination. If I was really evil, I'd do something like this: Picture Aragorn with... a gold front tooth! BUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Just try getting that image out of your mind every time you think of Aragorn!

red

12-30-2000, 05:14 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I just had to pipe in a hardy AMEN to Underhill's comments above. I could not have put it better. I can't wait to see the movies. Sure, I wish Arwen were not going to be portrayed as a warrior princess, but this is PJ's movie, not mine, and there is nothing I can do about it. So why whine? These movies are gonna rock! -réd <blockquote>"With that they parted, and it was then the time of sunset; and when after a while they turned and looked back, they saw the King of the West sitting upon his horse with his knights about him; and the falling Sun shone upon them and made all their harness to gleam like red gold, and the white mantle of Aragorn was turned to a flame. Then Aragorn took the green stone and held it up, and there came a green fire from his hand." -Many Partings, The Return of the King</blockquote>

Orald

12-30-2000, 11:31 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? What do you think is going to sustain me for a year? the hope that i will get to see LoTR in theaters. What makes you think that we don't want to see it(wait, answered my own question). But still I am going to see it, and I was just saying how our discussions in the books forum are obviously going to be cleared up. heheh

KayQy

12-31-2000, 12:05 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Yes, they will rock, no matter how many small and not-so-small discrepancies there are, have faith that they will fit, and they will not be doing anything so blatantly stupid as a big-game hunter shipping a Balrog to LA or New York where it gets loose and plays Godzilla/King Kong. Take courage. I think a little bit of this discussion is just the human tendency to look on the negative side. (But who am I, Freud? Excuse me while I get off my high horse...) I have a deep sense of nostalgia about Happy Meals, but only in those boxes. Bags are cheap. Something I've been thinking about lately is how Tolkien felt/would feel about the movies. In his essay, "On Fairy-Stories," he says that "Drama is naturally hostile to Fantasy." And someone early in this thread said something about not in his lifetime...? The days are fated to be filled with marvels.

Salabel

12-31-2000, 02:31 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Hmmm...Yes I am still going to see the movie, in fact I don't think I could sustain life any longer if I didn't know that it existed. Balrog as King Kong...I can see THOSE playsets. Heh heh.

the Lorien wanderer

12-31-2000, 03:47 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Sure they'll rock. If you can forget the book they'll probably be your favourite movies. Somehow, I get the feeling that isn't what Tolkien wanted when he wrote LOTR. AAAAAAAARGH Mr. U! Thanks a lot! Not all those who wander are lost.

Mister Underhill

12-31-2000, 11:34 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I don’t claim to have read “Letters” exhaustively. I wish I had more of that letter you cited, KayQy, to put that quote into some kind of context. Personally, I have to think that if Tolkien could see the digital and makeup effects that can be done today, he’d say, “Suh-weeeeeeeeet! Where do I sign for a movie deal?”... er... or words to that effect. If you listen to the prof read LotR (is Christmas over, Saulotus Claus?) it is plain that he has some flair and passion for the dramatic. Many of his tales began as “bedtime stories” for his children. Anyone who’s ever had a good bedtime story knows that the performance of the teller is at least 50% of the experience. I think if he could see how vividly and realistically his world could be portrayed on film with today’s technology, he’d be like, “Go, baby!” Ahem. Again, I paraphrase. Anyway, someone over at the Tolkien Estate (I assume CT is still alive and kicking?) thought films would be a good idea and released the rights.

Zoe

12-31-2000, 06:05 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? That quote from "On Fairy Stories" (you can read it in the book Tree and Leaf - it's not a letter) was reffering to drama not in the sense of 'the dramatic' (as in 'a flair for the dramatic'), but to drama as in plays. Whether or not movies would fall into the category of 'drama' is debatable. (They're different genres, in my opinion, but would the Prof. view them the same way?)

BilboFrodo

01-02-2001, 08:47 PM

Movies will be very Bad The movies will be a bad thing for Lord of the Rings, it may open up more people to Lord of the Rings but in the wrong way they will be told what to think about the movies by the way Peter whatshisface has done to the movies, he hasn't even got them very accurate to what is explicit in the book like Bilbo/Frodo's door is GREEN not YELLOW (Even though thats a trivial thing, they all add up). If you see a movie its the directors interpretation of the book not yours, it turns you into a person who doesn't like to make up there own minds about books (and I would like to add a coment here but I shouldn't). May I also point out here that the Tolkien estate has not given permission for these movies to go ahead because they sold the rights already and the makers of this movie bought them from the third party. It's just they can't stop these movies going ahead. I also believe Tolkien wouldn't have wanted these movies, he loved literature not movies, and they are not the same. These movies are for those people who don't really love Tolkiens work for what it truelly is and thats the reason why I think these movies should never be made.

The Barrow-Wight

01-02-2001, 09:33 PM

If these movies test your ability to see things clearly, I suggest you stay home, turn off the television and the computer, and crawl under the covers and stay there. Elsewise, you are doomed! The Barrow-Wight (RKittle) I usually haunt <a href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">The Barrow-Downs</a> and The Barrow-Downs <a href="http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi">Middle-Earth Discussion Board</a>.

Mister Underhill

01-02-2001, 09:49 PM

*High-five to réd (belatedly, sorry réd!) and the Barrow-Wight* Is it too early to start lining up? Mann's Chinese, here I come!! Edited by: <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000005>Mister Underhill</A> at: 1/2/01 10:49:59 pm

Gwaihir the Windlord

01-02-2001, 10:49 PM

Quite frankly, I don't really care that much whether the movies get more people on to Tolkien or not. Of course, they will; but it doesn't really affect us established fans very much at all (unless they become so popular that we get sick of it). If the Barrow-Downs and Old Forest scenes are to be left out, this board won't exactly become super-popular as no-one will have heard of it. And that's a good thing; we don't want new members that haven't read the books and only seen the movies. A person who sees the movie will probably not read the books. The whole essence of Tolkien is the 'other world' that it's set in. Having read the books, we know the complete histories of Arda, but anyone who sees the movies d don't read the books will know of about two years in the history of Arda; and won't have clue what Beleriand, Aman or the Ainur are. See what I mean? Who cares about the rather impoverished tale of Lord of the Rings when you don't know the proper geography or history or Middle-Earth? Of course, someone who sees the movies and is spurred to read LotR and the rest will fill in the gaps, become ensnared, and see the real Tolkien. Which is fine. They are perfectly welcome to join the downs; and more people will read them as a result of the Movies. Just not that many more. A lot of people will get the wrong idea of the books from these movies. No Barrow-Downs? No Old Forest? Arwen in the Battle of the Hornburg? I understand the need for time restraints, but really, I'm going to have to be doing a lot of explaining over the weeks that follow... It's going to be so annoying sitting there in the theatre watching those movies. I'm going to flinch at every cut-out and mistake, and, on the whole, I don't think I'll particularly enjoy them that much. I suppose either Jackson doesn't realise, or they're aimed at those who've never read the books before. Gwaihir the Windlord <A href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">the barrow-downs</A> 'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'

Mister Underhill

01-03-2001, 01:10 AM

Impoverished? Gwaihar, I usually see eye to eye with you on most topics, but I disagree with most of what you have to say here. Tolkien was well aware that many people wouldn't care about the intricate creation which underlies the Hobbit and LotR -- and he was perfectly okay with that.<blockquote>Quote:<hr> ...those who enjoy the book as an 'heroic romance' only, and find 'unexplained vistas' part of the literary effect, will neglect the appendices, very properly.<hr></blockquote> Many (most?) Tolkien fans read The Hobbit, LotR, and nothing else. Does this make them less worthy of being fans of ME? Nope. One thing I've always liked about the Downs is that it isn't elitist or snobbish, and has welcomed Tolkien loremasters and fans who haven't even finished reading The Hobbit yet with equal friendliness. I wish more Downers had a positive, or at least open, attitude about the movies. In fact, I'm astonished to find so many loyal Tolkien fans so ready to hate the films -- hating them already, in fact, even before a proper trailer has been released! I for one don't think Bombadil will be too badly missed; unlike many here, he's not one of my favorite characters. I'd even venture to say you'd have more explaining to do to your uninitiated friends if he was in the movie. If hardcore Tolkien fans can't agree on just who the heck old Tom is, he'd certainly leave uninitiated moviegoers scratching their heads before the movie's first reel was even over. And for BilboFrodo, there wouldn't be any movies if someone at the Tolkien Estate hadn't sold the rights at some point in time, so for you and others who want to moan and groan about how LotR is just being reduced to a way for someone to make a buck, you have to start with the Estate.

Gwaihir the Windlord

01-04-2001, 02:32 AM

Mr Underhill, you've got me wrong there. I'm not meaning to exclude members who haven't finished the Hobbit, LotR or any other book, (I myself was only halfway through Sil when I joined) just saying that I don't really think loads of new members who have only seen a movie version or one book will be that useful. A few, yes, but too many and I believe the downs will be diminished. Although I suppose most of these will fizzle out rather quickly; a point which I overlooked in my post. Gwaihir the Windlord <A href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">the barrow-downs</A> 'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'

Mister Underhill

01-05-2001, 10:58 AM

Sorry if I misread you somehow, Gwaihir. I happen to agree that a flood of new members with nothing more thoughtful to post than, "The movie sucked!" or, "The movie rocked!" will do nothing to enhance the Downs. I was startled by your characterization of LotR as "impoverished" next to the rest of Tolkien's writing, and your implication that fans (whether movie fans or book fans) who aren't intimately familiar with the finer points of Middle-earth's geography and history are somehow only getting a pale shadow of the real experience. I disagree with the flat statement that people who see the movies won't read the books. Even bad movies will spur people to read the books. Bad movies might even spur more people to read the books. The awful mini-series adaptation of Dune that was on TV recently spurred me to finally go read the book. As a kid, I saw Star Wars dozens of times -- and read the paperback adaptation until the covers were dog-eared and the five or six pages of movie stills in the middle fell out. Not that I care one way or the other whether people read the books or not, or whether they get the "wrong idea" about the books or not from seeing the movie. I'm not out to evangelize the world for Tolkien as some fans seem to be. I don't even really care whether anyone likes them or not -- all three are in the can, and they will be shown. All I care about is whether I enjoy them or not -- and I tell you, they're going to have to be pretty awful to disappoint me. Movies are not books. They just aren't. And these movies will not capture every detail and nuance of Tolkien's prose. But, if PJ and his crew are lucky, the movies will find their own rhythm and their own life, and will be true, if not in every small detail, then at least to the spirit of Tolkien's masterpiece. Why not think of the movies as an artist's (or, in the case of a movie, artists') conception of Tolkien? Why not go in hoping that they will have gotten much of it right, instead of ready to flinch at every omitted line of dialogue or compressed scene? And if you're really not interested in someone else's idea of Tolkien, then why go at all?

onewhitetree

01-05-2001, 08:49 PM

I am going to watch and enjoy the movies. I already have plans with a group of friends to go wait outside on the opening night, if it turns out to be huge. It's not something I'm gonna miss! They won't be perfect, but then, what is? Maybe I'll be one of those weird dressed-up people being interviewed outside the theatres on a documentary of big movies! Every leaf a miracle ~ The woods are lovely, dark, and deep I am Administrator at <a href=http://pub43.ezboard.com/bfangornforest>Fangorn Forest</a>! I am also a great fan of <a href=http://pub23.ezboard.com/bminasmorgul>Minas Morgul</a> and <a href=http://pub29.ezboard.com/btolkiencommunity87810>Planet Tolkien</a>.

Gwaihir the Windlord

01-07-2001, 04:27 AM

Not LotR but the Movies will be rather impoverished. Someone who sees the movies, but doesn't read the books, is not really seeing Tolkien. True; they'll see a great story; but it isn't really Tolkien, if you catch my meaning. More people will read LotR and the rest after seeing these movies; inevitable! But, If I were you, I wouldn't excpect a huge popularity surge. Nor would I care. I don't want to flinch at the cut-outs, Mister Underhill. I just won't be able to help it. Elves with pointy ears! Did Peter Jackson have to be the one to make these movies? From the impression I'm getting, any one of of us here could have done a better job with it. Gwaihir the Windlord <A href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">the barrow-downs</A> 'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'

onewhitetree

01-07-2001, 06:10 PM

I know how you feel, Gwaihir. I stopped caring, though. There's nothing you or I can do about it, and complaining won't help. I will flinch too, but I will enjoy the other parts. Every leaf a miracle ~ The woods are lovely, dark, and deep I am Administrator at <a href=http://pub43.ezboard.com/bfangornforest>Fangorn Forest</a>! I am also a great fan of <a href=http://pub23.ezboard.com/bminasmorgul>Minas Morgul</a> and <a href=http://pub29.ezboard.com/btolkiencommunity87810>Planet Tolkien</a>.

Gwaihir the Windlord

01-09-2001, 02:00 AM

Thanks, onewhitetree. You are right. Gwaihir the Windlord <A href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">the barrow-downs</A> 'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'

onewhitetree

01-10-2001, 04:14 PM

Anytime. Every leaf a miracle ~ The woods are lovely, dark, and deep I am Administrator at <a href=http://pub43.ezboard.com/bfangornforest>Fangorn Forest</a>! I am also a great fan of <a href=http://pub23.ezboard.com/bminasmorgul>Minas Morgul</a> and <a href=http://pub29.ezboard.com/btolkiencommunity87810>Planet Tolkien</a>.

Raw

01-11-2001, 02:26 PM

I think that creating movies of the books are realy greate! But i hope they will be good, realy, i don't think they will be, only three movies? Thats not enough! But we will see. /RAW

Deving13

01-11-2001, 03:19 PM

Inziladun-- I'm a reporter with Newsweek magazine, and I've been combing this board to get a sense of what fans think of the upcoming films. I was struck by your statement that you probably won't see the films. I'd love to hear more about why. If you see, please e-mail me at dgordo@newsweek.com. Sorry to interrupt a lively discussion with such an individual request, but I was intrigued by what you had to say. Devin Gordon Newsweek Magazine

the Lorien wanderer

01-12-2001, 04:23 AM

I totally, totally, totally gotta go with Gwaihir here. I don't want to flinch. But I will. I don't want to see all the Happy Meals. I'll have to. I don't want to see the day when a Tolkien 'fan' will come here and say, "But of course Arwen fought in that battle!". But I'll see it. Dammit. Not all those who wander are lost.

Zoe

01-16-2001, 01:39 AM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> If hardcore Tolkien fans can't agree on just who the heck old Tom is, he'd certainly leave uninitiated moviegoers scratching their heads before the movie's first reel was even over.<hr></blockquote> Sorry this reply is so late, but I disagree. I think the problems with 'who was TB' arise as a result of knowing more about the ME. If you don't know all the history and races and such, you aren't going to have any problem with who Tom was, he'd just be Tom. It's only when you learn more and realise that he's not like anything else, but could possibly fit into all kinds of categories that the confusion arises.

Mister Underhill

01-16-2001, 11:14 AM

Deving13, I hope you aren't cooking up some story about how Tolkien geeks hate the movies and want to crucify Peter Jackson, because there are lots of us who can't wait for the movies to come out -- I'm betting at least as many as have already decided that they'll be crap. We're just not as vocal as the naysayers. Edited by: <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000005>Mister Underhill</A> at: 1/16/01 12:14:46 pm

Inziladun

01-16-2001, 01:07 PM

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> "Tolkien geeks hate the movies and want to crucify Peter Jackson"<hr></blockquote> Do I qualify as a "Tolkien geek"? I don't hate Jackson or the movies. I just don't plan to see them. And at that hour the sun went down beyond the rim of the world,as a mighty fire;and Tuor stood alone upon the cliff with outspread arms,and a great yearning filled his heart.

Mister Underhill

01-16-2001, 01:26 PM

Anyone who trolls (pun intended) Tolkien sites on the web, debates the origins of Tom Bombadil, and fires off quotes to stump fellow Tolkien-ites qualifies for a charter membership in some chapter of geek-dom. Of course, some of us are geekier than others (I did author a twelve page article on the subject of troll origins, I readily admit). Nothing personal towards you Inziladun. I'm not going to try to talk you into going to see the movies, and I respect your intention to abstain (we'll see if you'll be able to hold out when the chips are down, though!). I'd just be a bit bummed if our intrepid Newsweek reporter friend is working on a slant about how LotR fans think the movies are heresy. I guess there is that faction, after all. I just wanted Deving13 to know that there are many of us out here who think the trailers look super-promising and can't wait to see the movies.

Orald

01-16-2001, 04:08 PM

Hurray! I am a Tolkien geek, I am helping put together a new Silm. But I am still going to see the movies and I hope I like them. You see I look at it like this, there are several ways to tell a story. Just like when Aragorn said that in Rivendell you will here the story told aright. That must mean there are different versions of stories, why can't these movies be a different version of LotR.

Inziladun

01-16-2001, 09:26 PM

No offense taken, Mr. Underhill. I just thought we here were normal everyday folks. If I do break down and see the movies,it will only be to understand what everyone here will be talking about for months afterward. Right now I still don't plan on it though. As for what sort of slant the article will have,only time will tell. And at that hour the sun went down beyond the rim of the world,as a mighty fire;and Tuor stood alone upon the cliff with outspread arms,and a great yearning filled his heart.

the Lorien wanderer

01-17-2001, 09:01 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Wow. We're all Tolkien geeks. And half of y'all are Star Wars geeks as well. Not all those who wander are lost.

Gwaihir the Windlord

01-23-2001, 04:08 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Well, I suppose spending countless hours in front of our computers discussing the aspects and histories of something that doesn't exist could be classified as symptoms of geekie-ness by some. But then one begins to question the definition of 'geek'. Geek and proud. Hey, I watched Castaway the other day on the big screen. Those trailers do look good. But then if the storyline is corrupt, it still may not be very worthwhile. I'm going to wait and see what the outcome is before I see it. It won't make any difference, though. 'Like it or hate it, you can't ignore it.' They will be big. Gwaihir the Windlord <A href="http://www.barrowdowns.com">the barrow-downs</A> 'Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor, for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever, and the Dark Tower is thrown down.'

Zoe

01-23-2001, 05:32 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? <blockquote>Quote:<hr> Well, I suppose spending countless hours in front of our computers discussing the aspects and histories of something that doesn't exist could be classified as symptoms of geekie-ness by some. But then one begins to question the definition of 'geek'. Geek and proud.<hr></blockquote> Yes, I have enough troubles trying to convince myself of my sanity without the question of Tolkien-geek-ness coming into it.

burrahobbit

02-01-2001, 09:54 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? The movies are a good thing. Whether the movies are a good adaptation or not one thig is certain: they will be worth watching. If the movies are a good adaptation then they'll be great, I have no doubts about that. And if they are a poor one? I have a saying that may well apply to the general population: "I like ****ty fantasy movies." Who wants to see a bunch of fruity elves sitting around talking about the distant past? Not me! But what about samurai elves battleing hoards of scaly monsters or a crusty old man fighting a giant demon? Count me in! Movies (all of them, not just LotR) should be enjoyed on their own merits, whatever they might be. A movie based on any book can never live up to that book no matter how well of an adaptation it is, and it is silly for anyone to expect anyone other that the original writer to come anywhere remotely resembling perfection. You have to remember that movies aren't books, that they are two very different media. They each have their own, different, restrictions. When translating from one to the other certain inevitable concessions must be made. Movies are mostly visual and aural while books are almost completely mental. When making a movie from a book things that were previously only described, and perhaps vaguely described (balrog wings), must be given a concrete form, though this form may be unliked. When you go to see this movie, and most of you will eventually, don't go in with any preconceptions, they'll only hurt what could otherwise be a very enjoyable experience. What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?

Orald

02-01-2001, 10:02 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? good post

Mister Underhill

02-06-2001, 12:44 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? Aha! Look at these remarks in Letters from Tolkien regarding his reactions to a synopsis for a proposed (animated) film adaptation of LotR. It seems the prof wasn't quite as fetishistic as some of his present day fans are about preserving every little detail of his books:<blockquote>Quote:<hr> You will receive on Monday the copy of the 'Story Line' or synopsis of the proposed film version of The Lord of the Rings. I could not get it off yesterday. .... An abridgement by selection with some good picture-work would be pleasant, & perhaps worth a good deal in publicity; but the present script is rather a compression with resultant over-crowding and confusion, blurring of climaxes, and general degradation: a pull-back towards more conventional 'fairy-stories'. People gallop about on Eagles at the least provocation; Lórien becomes a fairy-castle with 'delicate minarets', and all that sort of thing. But I am quite prepared to play ball, if they are open to advice – and if you decide that the thing is genuine, and worthwhile.<hr></blockquote>These abominations (people galloping about on Eagles! Lórien a fairy-castle?!) make even Arwen swinging a sword around seem like small beans in comparison, yet the professor was willing to "play ball" and was obviously open to the idea of adapting his work into other mediums.

enep

02-06-2001, 03:35 AM

Good post. Although I think the Proffesor would have approved of the recordings than a movie (despite the remarks you quoted) as they allowed the listener to make his/her ME what he/she wanted it to be. That way the imagination and depth is not lost as it is when PJ puts his personal incarnation of ME on the screen. But I'm not complaining; I'd quite like to see the movies. Sorta. - enep

Samwise of the shire

02-10-2001, 09:46 AM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? What in the heck is wrong with Legolas with blode hair?The movies could be good but they could be bad because when people see the movies (with elves and hobbits with pointed ears)their gonna say "I pictured so and so with black hair instead of brown and so I'm gonna change my mind about so and so's hair being black"instead of going with what they think the character looks like they change their minds because of a movie that could be a bad thing,but a good thing could be that when people see the movies they might want to read the books and find out about the characters with their courage and all if you know what I mean Samwise of the shire

GothmogBalrog

02-10-2001, 04:39 PM

Re: Are the movies a good or bad thing? I believe that the movies will be a good thing, as you said it will spread the works of Tolkien, but I think the director should be prepared for much criticism beause of the movies flaws. I think that it will take years to properly draw out the movie, but a movie a year will most likely be innacurate. Middle-earth is probably best shown through cartoon form where your imagination can't create settings and characters. So the answer to would probably be yes, because I want to see my favorite books on the screen, as would all Tolkien fans.

enep

02-10-2001, 04:53 PM

Welcome! Welcome to the Forum, GothmogBalrog! Interesting name. For the sake of it: Do you have wings? Good points. I don't think anyone should really complain; Reading is one thing but I'll be first in line when the movies come out. As long as Gollum looks good... - enep

the Lorien wanderer

02-10-2001, 09:41 PM

Re: Welcome! Hi GB (yes the nicks have already started )! Just a small correction. I don't think ALL Tolkien fans are eagerly awaiting the movie. MAny of us are dreading them too. Not all those who wander are lost.

Ktflwrs

11-03-2002, 01:30 PM

Unfortunatly the ineviteble will happen, exploitation is the marketers only recourse......Dolls, figurines, toys, etc. Its such a shame, because it belittles the Author, and the validity of the books. But we must indure, this too shall pass

LePetitChoux

11-03-2002, 01:58 PM

Its interesting now that the movie HAS come out, how many of the people who posted on here still hold to their prejudices? [ November 03, 2002: Message edited by: LePetitChoux ]

Cúdae

11-03-2002, 02:29 PM

The movies are neither a good thing, nor a bad thing. How's that sound? I read the books long before the movie and I liked the movie when it came out. Sure, it ruined my image of a dark-haired Legolas and yeah, Rivendell will never be the same for me, but the movie got hundreds, thousands, etc. of people to read the books. With the decline of interest in reading these days, I'm physched that a movie has gotten so many to read a wonderful book. I'm pretty sure Tolkien would approve too. To me personally, I don't care one way or the other whether the movie is going to ruin my imaginings or not. To me, all that matters is that a movie made people read. That's all that really seems important.

Helkasir

11-03-2002, 04:54 PM

I like the movies. They're enjoyable. there, done.

TealDude3

11-05-2002, 04:29 PM

Hay, the movie won 4 Academy Awards and was nominated for Best Picture. Need I say more.My mom likes it and see never knew anything about it. She agreed to read the books, if each movie 'went home' with at least one Academy Award. She sure was shocked that spring.

Nieninque

11-05-2002, 05:41 PM

Wow this is an old topic! Anyways... well, I was just wondering, why did you all think that elves didn't have pointy ears? Before the movies came out I always envisioned them with pointy ears.About FotR... I loved it, it was really true to the book and the parts that weren't (Arwen saving Frodo w/the river-horses, etc) didn't hurt it. And about Tom Bombadil... well, I really didn't get the point of him in the book. Why was he there? Was it bad that he wasn't in the movie?I've heard that Shelob isn't in TTT. I'll have to see if it turns out OK, but Shelob in TTT would be really sweet.

aragornreborn

11-06-2002, 08:48 AM

The movies aren't a bad thing. Are they an accurate representation of the books? Certainly not. But movies never are and never can be. What useful purpose do they serve then? You can't necessarily learn a whole lot about Middle Earth from just watching the movies. These movies are good because they expose people to Tolkien and the Lord of the Rings who might not otherwise hear of them. I heard the hobbit on tape and thougt it was good, and someone even gave me the Lord of the Rings for my birthday, but I never read it. I started, but I got bogged down at the beginning. Then I saw the movie. I read all three books in the next month and the Silmarillion and the Hobbit soon after that. What the movies do is they show a huge number of people what a great story the Lord of th Rings is. Some people no doubt will just simply watch the movies and be done with it. Some will probably start the books and maybe finish them, but will never become Tolkien fans. And others will become die-hard Tolkien fanatics. In any case, everyone has still heard of the Lord of the Rings, Tolkien, and Middle Earth. The movies are great in their own fashion, and the books are better. Those who just watch the movie have seen a great movie and know a little about the incredible world Tolkien has created. Others will be inspired to read the books and will get an even more incredible insight into Tolkien's magnificent creation.