On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

[my precious]

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bit it off???

I really need to know this, but i've my books not available for some time...

</p>

[The Barrow-Wight]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

Welcome to the board, my precious. I don't recall exactly which finger it was, but by the end of the day I'm sure someone here will have the answer!

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[galpsi]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

Third finger, right hand.

</p>

[Arathorn II]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

I would guess, the finger you poin with, what we call &quot;The ring finger&quot; where I come from. When it comes to what hand, I must guess, right.

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[The Barrow-Wight]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

Actually, isn't the ring finger the one by the pinky?

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[Arathorn II]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

I don't know. <img src=ohwell.gif ALT=":/"> I haven'y got any rings...

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[galpsi]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...


It's third finger, right hand. I didn't bother to cite earlier but it's on page 282 of my 1965 inprint of RotK. Sam wakes and sees Frodo asleep with his hand resting on the coverlet. Third I assume to be the finger next to the little finger upon which wedding (and other significant) bands are worn.

</p>

[Sharkû]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

The third finger is always the middle finger. Count your fingers and you´ll see <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)">

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[galpsi]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

The answer is crystal clear -- except that it isn't. <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)"> I wouldn't have thought that you counted the thumb as a finger, owing to its own distinctive name and status. Which makes the third of four ambiguous. I went with the traditional western identification of the finger next to the little finger as the &quot;ring finger.&quot; For historical evidence, see the (anonymous German) Bridal Pair in the Cleveland Museum, Jan van Eyck's portrait of his wife in the Stedelijk Museum in Bruges, or the Titian Venus with a Mirror at the National in Washington.

</p>

[Taimar]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

One speaks of gripping an object between the thumb and first finger. I would therefore consider my middle finger to be my second finger. If this is correct the third finger would be, as Galpsi suggests, the traditional Western `ring` finger, i.e next to the pinky.

Look into the http://www.fortunecity.co.uk/library/classiccourt/77/Mirror of Desire.</a> </p>

[galpsi]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/wight.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

Does anybody else wonder whether my precious wishes that (s)he hadn't asked? <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)">

</p>Edited by <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000201>galpsi</A> at: 7/27/00 8:14:40 pm

[Gandalf12]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

I think it was his ring finger, right hand. Or something.

</p>

[The Barrow-Wight]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: On which finger had frodo the ring, when gollum...

It was indeed the ring finger on the right hand which, not including the thumb, is the third finger. Of course, afterwards Frodo's third finger would have been his little finger. <img src=ohwell.gif ALT=":/">

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[Samwise of the shire]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re:I was trying to figure it out.

I always pictured it to be the wedding ring finger but then a thought would come into my head &quot;well you cant really call your thumb a finger but if you did then the ring would end up on the one next to the third finger&quot;.Welcome to the Barrow Downs MP hope to see you here alot.
Samwise
PS.Poor Frodo,I always feel sorry for him<img src=frown.gif ALT=":(">

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[Odysseus819]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

OK just to add to this fairly arcane discussion: what finger did SAURON have the ring on (cut off by Isildur)?

</p>

[KayQy]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

yeah, it always seemed really awkward to me that Isildur just swoops in and manages to cut off that one important finger, and no others. Or does he do it after he kills Sauron, when it is relatively easier(no need to dodge)?

They cannot conquer forever!</p>

[The Barrow-Wight]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

Perhaps Sauron wore it on his middle-finger and was giving his enemies a 'salute' when it was swiped off!

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[Odysseus819]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

In The Silm (&quot;Of the Rings of Power . . . &quot;) it is implied that Sauron was &quot;thrown down&quot; by Elendil and/or Gil-galad, then the ring was cut from his finger, then his spirit fled his body. Perhaps he was stunned while Isildur did his carving.

</p>

[Gilthalion]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

I'm sure Isildur was moving fast and simply grabbed the hot ring finger of Sauron when he was down, pulling it back hard, maybe even breaking or disjointing it, and then hewing it off with a single sure stroke of the hilt-shard of Narsil.

We know that Gollum saw a nine-fingered Dark Lord.

Just couldn't reconstitute that last little bit...

...or maybe he was just sentimental, refusing to have the finger if it couldn't wear the Ring!

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[KayQy]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Digital Discussion

Ouch!

They cannot conquer forever!</p>

[Samwise of the shire]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re:Oh man

Let's get back to the Frodo topic,okay that is discusting blah

</p>

[Elenanna]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Re:Oh man

well, we're all sure that it was the right hand ring finger, which supposedly is the one next to the pinkie right?
just have to say i like the 'salute' version of saurons demise <img src=smile.gif ALT=":)"> . i think that he died with his hand splayed out, isildur saw the ring, decided he wanted a souvenir kill dark lord get magic ring free! so he hacked the ring off.

Visit me at <a href=http://pub16.ezboard.com/blorien16140>Lorien</a> friend of <a href=http://pub16.ezboard.com/bamongwareth>Amon Gwareth</a> and <a href=http://pub2.ezboard.com/brivendel>Rivendel</a> find my corpse at <a href=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi>The Barrowdowns</a> </p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000112>Elenanna</A>&nbsp; <IMG SRC=http://www.ezboard.com/ezgfx/gicons/white_star.gif BORDER=0 WIDTH=10 HEIGHT=10> at: 3/24/01 12:22:31 am

[Starwing]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Re:Oh man

I would say the 'salute version' isn't that probable, I mean, why wear a magical ring on your middle finger?
I'd say the most probable solution is that in both cases the ring was on the right hand ring finger, and just that.

</p>

[The Barrow-Wight]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/narya.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Re:Oh man

You are correct, of course, Starwing. The middle-finger hypothesis was purely speculative. <img src=smile.gif ALT=":)"> Welcome to the board!

The Barrow-Wight (RKittle)
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[arnaion]

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<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/onering.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: Re:Oh man

ok if your having trouble grasping the idea that it was on his 3 finger of the right hand. then think of this if you where a ring on the left its the one next to the pinky. and thats for a wedding ring. on th eright hand you wear the ring on the same finger. ok? its not that hard.

"Seek for the sword that was broken, In Imlaradis it dwels, There shall be councils taken, Stronger than morgul spells. There shall be shown a token, That doom is near at hand, Isildur's Bane shall waken, And the hafling forth shall stand." ~LOTR-FOTR Jrr Tolkien. Book status: pg 875 Book sixs, Return of the King. "Being forgotten is worse than death." Rat lady FFIX (forgot name) FOTR-Christmas 2001 TT-Christmas 2003 ROTK-Christmas 2003</p>

[Orfild]

How can everyone be so sure that Frodo had the ring on the right hand?
I'm not saying that he had it on the left hand, but if. It was maybe hard to use sting while having a ring in that hand, and at least I don't know how big the ring is.
Of course you can ignore this if it says anything in the books, i don't know.

[Elrian]

It was only a plain gold band, how big it didn't really say (for a hobbit finger) But didn't it shrink or expand to fit the wearers finger?

[jomy]

The reason why the wedding ring is usually worn on the left hand, on the third finger next to the pinky is of course mainly tradition but also because it´s the one place where the ringer is the most out of way for normal acting. At least if you are a right handed person.
Even a small ring can be least annoying there, I´d say.

[Yaish]

Hi, new here, both to the board and the discussion.

Anyway, the 'ring finger' is the third finger (next to pinky) by traditional western standards. Thats based off greek custom, where the wedding band was placed on the the third finger of the LEFT hand, because it was believed that a vein ran directly there from the heart (the source of love). This custom has been co-opted by most western societies.
As to Frodo, I'll try to check my books sometime and see if I can find it.

[Rose Cotton]

I always thought it was the ring finger on the right hand but that's just me.

[Airetelluma]

The reason why the wedding ring is usually worn on the left hand, on the third finger next to the pinky is of course mainly tradition but also because it´s the one place where the ringer is the most out of way for normal acting. Even a small ring can be least annoying there, I´d say.

Yes, but what if the wearer is left-handed? We're never really told which hand is Frodo's dominant, are we? I really have no idea which finger it was on; I just wanted to make a devil's advocate of myself. smilies/tongue.gif

[Gayahithwen]

I think that when some of the old greek scientologs first started to "discover" the human body, they used prisoners doomed to death or corpses and cut them up, the prisoners alive, to see how everything worked. And then they found that vein from the ring finger to the heart. Besides, when my dad had to go in for surgery, and they had to x-ray his heart, he couldn't wear his wedding ring, and he supposed it was because of that.. well, that is about all I know in the matter.. Hoped it interested someone.. :P

[Yaish]

Gayhitthwen, are you sure it was an X-ray? More likely it was an MRI, as soft tissue like hearts doesnt show up on X-ray.

MRI's use incredibly powerful magnets, so no metals are allowed, including wedding bands.

[Rose Cotton]

It's definatly his right hand because it's right there in the book. Plain as day. smilies/tongue.gif The question is whether it was the ring finger( the one next to the pinkie) or the middle one? smilies/tongue.gif

[Elendur]

I thought it was his right hand index (pointer) finger (one closest to the thumb).

And for the Sauron thing... I always imagined Sauron lying on the floor, having been defeated by Elendil and Ereinion. Isildur, having the hilt of Narsil in his hand with only about 1/4 of the blade left simply took a downward stroke onto the finger the ring was on. No bending it back and then cutting it off. smilies/smile.gif

[Ban]

Originally posted by Elendur:
<STRONG>I thought it was his right hand index (pointer) finger (one closest to the thumb).
</STRONG>

If it was Frodo's index finger, it would have been quite hard for him to write that book after the war. smilies/smile.gif Unless, of course, he *was* left-handed, as someone here suggested.

[Elrian]

It was the index finger, it certainly wasn't the ring finger in the movie anyway. But that is an interesting question, How did he write some of the Redbook, unless he was a lefty.

[elenwen]

You can wright without a indexfinger. I tried ones...

[avarerniliel]

Ring is on the finger thus, ring finger. When Gollum chomped off the finger (though he actually wasn't planning on biting the finger off, he was going to gently slip the ring off Frodo's finger, but he forgot he had webbed hands and feet. Don't ask.) he gave Frodo the absolutely beautiful nick-name of: Frodo of the nine fingers. Or, something similar.

[Rosa Underhill]

Okay, I just looked in RotK. Third finger, right hand. (Hm. I always thought it was his left hand, don't know why. And you have four fingers and a thumb. So I'd say it is what we in America dub the "ring finger". How ironic. smilies/biggrin.gif) And you can write if you're missing your ring finger so Frodo can still be right handed. (I've probably just re-stated everything that's already been said, but, well, now you all know for certain.)

[Bombadillo]

I'm surprised at the appearent consensus in this matter.

An interesting question in this respect is weather Tolkien (or perhaps his wife of mother) played the piano.
This was quite a bourgeois way of spending your time from the 1860's onward (it was respectable hobby for culturally interested people) and if Tolkien ever had piano lessons he would always have numbered the fingers from thum to little finger as 1,2,3,4 and 5.
The biting of Gollum could mean to freudians that he in fact did have to play ... and hated every minute of it!

[Amarie of the Vanyar]

Tolkien had piano lessons, but he didn't enjoyed them very much. And his mother and his wife played the piano ... smilies/wink.gif

But, I think that when Tolkien says that Frodo wore the ring on his third finger, he referred to the 'ring finger' smilies/tongue.gif

[Ainaserkewen]

I thought that it was his middle finger?
Just like Sauron's and it was supposed to be ironic or something?
I might be wrong, I'll just go back to my trusty book and find out.

[Brilcairion]

From what I know of tradition and culture, any ring that is not a wedding or engagement band is worn on the right hand on the Ring Finger. There seems to be some confusion as to what this finger is. I will explain it. Hold up your right hand. At the far left is the thumb. Next is the Index Finger. Then the Middle Finger. Then the Ring Finger. And finally the Pinky finger. If the ring is a wedding or engagement band, then it is worn on the Ring Finger of the left hand. I have a High School ring and I wear it on my right hand on the Ring Finger. This should stop all contestation as to which finger the Ring was on. As to the Sauron question I like the Movie's interpretation, where as Sauron is reaching for Isildur, Isuldur takes the hilt of Narsil and cuts all of Sauron's fingers(minus the thumb, I think) off his hand. The absense of the Ring's power causes Sauron to be defeated and to flee his physical form. Then Isildur picks up the finger and removes the ring.

I hope this helped

[Amarie of the Vanyar]

Isildur cut off only one of Sauron's fingers smilies/wink.gif

said Frodo. 'It was Isildur who cut off the finger of the Enemy'
'Yes, He has only four on the Black Hand, but they are enough,' said Gollum shuddering.
The Black Gate is Closed

[ August 07, 2003: Message edited by: Amarie of the Vanyar ]

[ August 07, 2003: Message edited by: Amarie of the Vanyar ]

[Finwe]

Yes, but realistically speaking, unless Sauron was giving Isildur the finger, it would have been extremely difficult to just cut off one finger, and precisely the right one. I think the way that the movie showed it was more realistic. What Isildur probably did was, distraught with grief and rage, he took a wild swing at Sauron with the hilt-shard of Narsil, and luckily managed to lop off a few fingers. It was pure luck that he did that, and didn't cut off Sauron's nose or something.

[Amarie of the Vanyar]

In my opinion, it is not so difficult if you look at how things really happened, which is slightly different to the version given in the movies smilies/wink.gif

but Sauron himself was overthrown, and Isildur cut the Ring from his hand with the hilt-shard of his father's sword.
The Council of Elrond, LotR

But Sauron was also thrown down, and with the hilt-shard of Narsil Isildur cut the Ruling Ring from the hand of Sauron and took it for his own.
Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age; The Silmarillion

[Sharkû]

It took a while, but I finally found the definite answer to the old question of this topic:

"My father named the penultimate finger (the 'fourth finger' or 'ring-finger') the 'third finger'; so Frodo's 'third finger was missing' (RK p. 229)." (HoME IX, 1, V, note 9)