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Old 05-31-2012, 04:54 PM   #24
Lalwendė
A Mere Boggart
 
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Lalwendė is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Lalwendė is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boromir88
In the mind of say Sauron (and at a later point Saruman), the lesser rings would be "toys" and "trifles" because they're not important to their ultimate goal of subjugation. These rings are insignificant, but it's interesting to me that Gandalf still appears to find ALL rings of power dangerous.
There's that phrase which Gandalf uses though: "to my mind", which suggests to me that this fear of what powers other rings may possess is a fear that Gandalf knows he is either alone or in a minority with. It may be that Gandalf is more than a bit spooked having direct experience of watching what use of the One Ring does to someone, and is therefore more worried than other are. The question here is whether he is justified in his caution. But he knows it's his opinion, and not a universal truth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by radagastly
So three-hundred years of instruction preceded the beginning of the work on the Great Rings which took another hundred years to complete, before Sauron forged the One to trap them. I think that in three-hundred years many lesser rings, or practice rings, were made under Sauron's tutelage and likely had ever improved skill and ever increasing power and scope.

It may also be significant that it specifies "the smiths" of Eregion, rather than "the elves" of Eregion. Perhaps these smiths were already making rings with some kind of power, or "magic" even before Sauron showed up. Maybe they did invent the idea after all, and Sauron merely guided their development in a direction of his choosing.
I agree, given that expansive time frame, it's possible that some of these 'essays' might have been more powerful than expected. How long would it take to craft a ring (maybe the answer is similar to 'how long is a piece of string...')? Would a smith become suspicious should a ring, once made, possess unpleasant or dangerous properties?

I like the idea that Sauron came to Eregion in part to learn and improve on his own ring lore and ring making skills. Maybe watching how these items were made and thus working out how he might make one which surpassed all others. It fits nicely (in a metaphorical sense certainly, and perhaps more) with the appearance of the One Ring, which is a plain gold which only reveals its secret once plunged into fire.

Quote:
Originally Posted by littlemanpoet
Not only in shape, but think of the ring's prominence in (at least western) human culture. It is the symbol of the promises/vows binding two people together in marriage. Thus, culturally, rings are linked to bondage, whether willing or forced.
And building from this, note how the Nine and the One seem to 'break' the bonds set by Eru on the body and spirit (hroa and fea) of Men in particular. With the Nine, the hroa fades away and with the One it temporarily disappears entirely. I'm still convinced, from everything I've read, that the way these rings work is by exposing the fea and thus the minds of Men who wear them to Sauron. The Elven rings work in a similar but more subtle and appropriate way.

On Morgoth, from Osanwe-Kenta:
Quote:
For he would come by stealth to a mind open and unwary, hoping to learn some part of its thought before it closed, and still more to implant in it his own thought, to deceive it and win it to his friendship.
And a little something on Sauron:
Quote:
his desire was to set a bond upon the Elves and to bring them under his vigilance
Again, this is a quote from Osanwe-Kenta:
Quote:
And much of the strength and will of Sauron passed into that One Ring; for the power of the Elven-rings was very great, and that which should govern them must be a thing of surpassing potency; and Sauron forged it in the Mountain of Fire in the Land of Shadow. And while he wore the One Ring he could perceive all the things that were done by means of the lesser rings, and he could see and govern the very thoughts of those that wore them.
"the lesser rings" - what does Tolkien mean, exactly, here?
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