Werewolf LXXXI: Under the Misty Mountains

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Izzy

Neither had even given the Day a chance to get rolling before tossing their vote away. Loslote even later asks Nerwen how she could distrust you, given the only banter posts. How could one trust only on banter posts?

How exactly did they "toss away" their votes? They voted. End of story. If they had sat on their bums for a few hours and then voted for me, the result would've been the same- Phantom gains two votes.

How is your vote any better than theirs? Let me ask you, what information do you know right now? Who has been lynched so far? Who has been Night-killed? Which roles have been revealed?

For all you know you just elected a SoE, where as I know for a fact that the ladies you are criticizing elected an orc.

[the phantom]

I remind you of a stuck-up know-it-all, Folwren?

YOU are the one telling people that their votes are stupid when they're not, and demanding that people see things your way. I'm merely pointing out facts. Again and again, since people are unwilling to grasp the points.

Originally Posted by Folwren

It is simply not logical that he could not see or concede how Sally's and Lottie's votes were indeed not logical or worth while. He could at LEAST concede that it would have made some more sense that they'd waited, but no, he argues that their votes were perfectly understandable, justifiable, and even comendable. Why? It doesn't make sense.

Originally Posted by Lottie

If he says that our votes were understandable, maybe it's because he understood them.

Precisely. I have explained my position logically and reasonably, and it's not my fault that people aren't following. For the 10th time- Lottie and Sally knew just as much as you when they voted. And oh by the way, they voted for a true orc. I mean- you can't argue with results. You really think lynching me would deflate me? *snerk* No, it would merely result in me dancing around saying, "Told you so!"

And by the way, I haven't even given the best justification for my antics and their early votes yet. In the end if I'm forced to say it I will, but the fact that more of you haven't backed off on this issue tells me that you haven't carefully considered everything about this village. Boro in particular- it's one of the main reasons I'm suspicious of you, as given your usual method of operating you would've seen two advantages in particular in doing what I have done and would have attempted to hint to me to the fact that you knew what I was doing. I mean, as far as "ploys" go this one is rather more obvious than those I typically favor.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

His push to become sole representative does bug me quite a lot

I've already explained that one, m'dear. It was largely a ploy (which could have been useful if it hadn't been blundered into and blown up so early). I remarked earlier that I knew good and well it wouldn't happen, so how can you think I honestly was trying for it? It's like me saying "I'm going to leap over the moon!" and then jumping as high as I can. Was I honestly trying to jump over the moon?

I knew I wouldn't get massive power, but I didn't mind getting a bit extra seeing as I am the only person I know is orcish and I have no intention of dying early, and votes in hand can help avoid that.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

unless I've misunderstood, the phantom's reasoning is this: "I'm too wilful to be manipulated by the wolves (cf Lottie), therefore they wouldn't try to make me a puppet-ruler, therefore all votes for me are probably trustworthy."

Erm, what? I don't recall ever ever saying or implying anything like that. All of my defenses of my voters have been primarily a reaction to people seeing something fishy about them when in fact it wasn't that big of a deal at all if considered cooly and realistically.

As a matter of fact I don't believe I have ever even declared my voters as being trustworthy or true orcs. I have merely been defending them against a specific attack which I saw as being a perplexing stretch of reasoning. In general when I see more than one person grasping onto the same legless argument I am quick to suspect that something odd is going on.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

What? What about hanging around and telling us who you suspect and helping the reps making their choices?

Nope. You said I needed vacation right? So, I'm going to take it. I can't vote and I'm not going to lobby for anyone's death. My standard approach when I do have a vote on Day 1, it is to try and not do anything catastrophically stupid. I read all the posts, figure out a few of the people who look good and trustworthy, but not so much who looks bad. Thus, with no information other than what people decide to say openly, my Day 1 votes become based on who I don't want to see lynched at that point and not so much a vote on who I think is definitely evil.

For this is something that phantom is right about, when it comes to sally, Lottie, and Mira's votes for him. Anyone who looks like they know too much either really does know too much or is faking it for some reason. I don't see much benefit to an SoE looking like they know too much, because it is that very act which usually gets them in trouble. Thus, some one faking they know too much is probably an ordo trying to paint a target on their backs so the SoEs kill them and not the seer, or they really do know too much and it's good chance that person is evil.

Beyond that, I won't be able to add much, sorry. I mean I could say a bunch of random comments like "phantom is up to something," but saying phantom is up to something, is like saying I will drink anything...like really...anything. This thread is already going to get epically long, I care not to clog it up more with captain obvious statements. You know who I feel pretty decent about, and who I don't. I'm not going to lobby for anyone's lynching when I aint got a clue.

Now if I understand Shasta, Nerwen, and Foley's objection to those who voted phantom as a rep, instead of feigning information, it looks like they are feigning ignorance and are hiding behind random votes to look innocent. Eh, as silly as it is, I don't think there's evil intent there. I've already shared my opinion on those three votes, and one thing I will not stand for is to be mis-represented *glares at Rune*

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

I have been very surprised with the passion that Boro attacked Sally and Lottie's votes for the Phantom. He clearly put a lot of effort into the trash talking of these people. I am not totally unsympathetic to the points he made, but I don't think I have ever seen Boro act in that manner on a Day1. Just like Lommy he seems to have undergone some sort of change, only Lommy's change seems more natural to me.

I did not attack either of their votes. I said their votes actually looked innocent.

With regards to Mira, it's funny, because Foley said something about how it looks like she hasn't been paying attention, but Mira said that exact thing in her posts. Mira has no method to her decisions beyond "I like what you're saying, you've got my support. I don't like what you're saying, I'm going to kill you." It makes her a formidable wear-bear because it's nearly untrackable. But ultimately a poor wolf strategy, because you need to work with others and come up with some plan of attack. Trust me, you'd be able to tell if Mira was evil, because even if she would still have no method, her excitement at being evil is simply uncontainable. You would literally be able to read it straight out of her posts.

My disappointment was more to say "Really, Mira? That's all it takes to get bribed? Psh...easy. You should get lynched for that and I won't take the noose for you this time."

Originally Posted by the phantom

Boro in particular- it's one of the main reasons I'm suspicious of you, as given your usual method of operating you would've seen two advantages in particular in doing what I have done and would have attempted to hint to me to the fact that you knew what I was doing. I mean, as far as "ploys" go this one is rather more obvious than those I typically favor.

Like I said, you're always doing something, but I can't read your mind here. I can see what you're doing, I just don't know whom for yet. You know I will drink with ye, but I carry a blade and never turn my back for a reason. I trust nothing here except my own eyes and ears. I look out for myself, and make sure the good businesses here stay in business, that's it. I care not what happened centuries ago, and I care not to partake in any of it. I these no-good-uppity Elves think they can come in here and start a fight because they can't let go of a grudge, I say bring it. But if anyone is going to insist we deserve what the SoE's are coming here to do because of something that happened centuries ago, or insist I would have partaken in it, is no lad of mine.

Edit: crossed with Wilwa and Nerwen

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Trust me, you'd be able to tell if Mira was evil, because even if she would still have no method, her excitement at being evil is simply uncontainable. You would literally be able to read it straight out of her posts.

My disappointment was more to say "Really, Mira? That's all it takes to get bribed? Psh...easy. You should get lynched for that and I won't take the noose for you this time."

It's true. Also dear, you're contradicting yourself. You just said I'm not evil, but deserve to be lynched. Why advocate lynching someone who you said yourself isn't evil?

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Mirandir

It's true. Also dear, you're contradicting yourself. You just said I'm not evil, but deserve to be lynched. Why advocate lynching someone who you said yourself isn't evil?

There's a difference between choosing not to oppose something, and advocating for it. Even if it was Day 1, you were bribed by phantom far too easily. Show a little more care with your votes, which would be deserving that I risk my neck for you, and you know I will. Until then, I've said my thoughts on your alignment, the Reps can listen or not, either way doesn't matter to me. You haven't done anything to show you'd be a terrible loss even if I think you're innocent.

[Eönwë]

Oh, and sorry. I promise I'll try to do the vote list if I'm still alive toMorrow.

Goodnight.

[Eönwë]

Actually, I have a few more things to say:

• We haven't had enough people voting, which is never good.
• Those not posting much are being ignored, as if they're being rewarded for not being around. Now, I know it can be hard to have time when you have a lot to do IRL, but it doesn't mean those people should get a free pass- and the intentionally quiet ones generally just slip by easily, letting the vocal players kill each other off.

And as for my opinion on some people:

• Kath- What I've seen looks good, but she's good at hiding evilness and plays almost the same way whatever her alignment.
• Shasta- Not sure if I like him or not. I can never read him, especially when he's evil.
• Greenie- I'm getting evil undertones from her. There's definitely something darker (or is that lighter) about her more recent posts.

Also, I don't really like the Celuien suspicions. I mean, she only has 9 posts, which is hardly enough to begin to properly suspect someone from lynvhing.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Celuien has already been modkilled, but I agree - all those who suspected Celuien the most (I'm mostly looking at you here, Rune) - how is it you can suspect someone of Elfishness when they've made nine posts? Definitely seems like the easy out to me.

Sorry for not being around, I worked all day. I'm not going to bother answering any of Lommy's allegations, as they basically come down to 'gut feeling', which is unanswerable (sorry, love, but they do).

[Kath]

all those who suspected Celuien the most (I'm mostly looking at you here, Rune) - how is it you can suspect someone of Elfishness when they've made nine posts? Definitely seems like the easy out to me.

Pfft it's how I get lynched every time. Lack of posts is suspicious to many people ... very often to those who make many posts themselves because it seems odd to them.

Sorry that seems a bit random, but it is true.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Celuien has already been modkilled, but I agree - all those who suspected Celuien the most (I'm mostly looking at you here, Rune) - how is it you can suspect someone of Elfishness when they've made nine posts? Definitely seems like the easy out to me.

Why is it an easier way out than posting somebody that posts all the time?

I based my opinion on Celuien on what she wrote in her posts, it is the only thing I could do. If it strikes me as Elfish, then surely the only responsible thing is to suspect her! (even if she has only posted 9 times)

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

That would be the assumption that he's the best man for the job, yes?

No, I was in fact refering to the assumption that he's an orc. Since he can make that assumption, he can logically draw the conclusion that Sally, Mira, and I voted for an orc. No one else can make that assumption, so the fact that the rest of the village doesn't accept his logic does not mean that it is not logical.

Also, Lottie, why aren't you worried by phantom's promise not to lynch those who voted for him?

1. That promise was made after I voted.

2. Well, it's pretty obvious that a representative isn't likely to vote for the people they represent. It's sort of counter-productive for those who want to remain in power rather than being mistrusted by the voters for the rest of the game, isn't it?

EDIT: xed with The Puddingtom

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Phantom

For the 10th time- Lottie and Sally knew just as much as you when they voted.

Not true. Folwren had several pages of discussion to read through and form opinions before she voted, I believe, information that Lottie and Sally certainly did not have when they voted.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Loslote

No, I was in fact refering to the assumption that he's an orc. Since he can make that assumption, he can logically draw the conclusion that Sally, Mira, and I voted for an orc. No one else can make that assumption, so the fact that the rest of the village doesn't accept his logic does not mean that it is not logical.

No, but the logic doesn't go very far, does it?

Originally Posted by Loslote

1. That promise was made after I voted.

I know, but you specifically mentioned that it didn't bother you– that's what I was asking about not, "why did you vote him?"

Originally Posted by Loslote

2. Well, it's pretty obvious that a representative isn't likely to vote for the people they represent. It's sort of counter-productive for those who want to remain in power rather than being mistrusted by the voters for the rest of the game, isn't it?

Yes, but isn't promising not to vote the people one represents counter-productive for those who want to hunt wolves– er, I mean, Elves?

True, I won't be voting Greenie or Legate just for a default–lynch. But if either of them starts looking distinctly Elvish, that's a different matter.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Me

For the 10th time- Lottie and Sally knew just as much as you when they voted.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Not true. Folwren had several pages of discussion to read through and form opinions before she voted, I believe, information that Lottie and Sally certainly did not have when they voted.

Your response has nothing to do with my statement. I did not say L & S had the same number of posts to read over when they voted, but rather that they knew the same exact amount when they voted. Actual knowledge. Something you can bank on. Reading through five pages of "I don't like those early votes!" and "I don't like Phantom!" and "You're wrong!" and "Let's not split votes!" does not qualify as gaining actual real knowledge. You can try and form a hunch based upon such things, but that is all.

Meh- I want to say something to you, but I really shouldn't. Just... read everything I've said today, and consider it from all angles and think what sorts of things an orc-Phantom would want to accomplish and how things I have done might fit in line with those goals. Let me know if it falls into place.

[the phantom]

All right, extremely tired. *yawn* I'll be around most of tomorrow.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Okay, so it's done for the first Day - the Reps have been chosen. Now I am really, really curious as to what they are going to do with their newly acquired power. Speaking of that, I think it would be very nice if the Reps wrote, if only in a few words, whether they have some basic ideas on whom they would vote and so on (if they do), just so that we, the common folk, are not entirely left out of the game of the mighty. That said, in any case, I would like to urge the "common folk" to continue participating as much as we can, even continue toDay as if it was a normal Day and we ourselves were supposed to vote - I think that way, the extended 48-hour Day's full potential can be used.

Just a few notes to the ongoing phantom debate. I think I am beginning to partially see phantom's point of view, at least to a certain extent - at least, I know it is true that he considers Day 1s just random rubbish, and I can see the inner logic in what he says. Of course, he would behave like this whether he is innocent or not (and I disagree with him on several matters - like the argument with the probability of electing an innocent randomly; statistics, in my experience never work). The more I am actually interested in how he plans to use his votes, of which he now has several. And, that said, I am not really so keen on lynching him already on Day 1 just because he is the phantom. Unless he manages to lynch our Seer or something like that, which is not very probable, he won't be that dangerous even in his position. I mean, I there's been a bit of unnecessary demonisation of him. Let us just look at him as at one of our Reps, and judge him based on his actions.

I have to go now, but will hopefully pop in during the Day in several hours and then I will be back late in the evening (also metaphorically, time-wise: close to the DL). But meanwhile, keep it up, ye who be around...

[Isabellkya]

Originally Posted by Rune

In my humble opinion it is downright silly to make a "rule" that say only two votes per representative. You should vote for the person you find fit for the job and not some half-random person whos only merits is that they don't have two votes yet. . Not only does it provide excellent cover for SoE, but more importantly it is no fun.

I want political intrigue, I want representatives who abuse power and then get brutally punished come next election time. . . or more realistic, gets re-elected.

In my ideal world we would have one person with something like 49% of the votes, so that the rest of the representatives where forced to work together in order to get any influence. Then we would have dynamic system, with lots of negotiating and stuff to analyse. . .

Isn't this the same as the 'two votes per Rep' suggestion? Trying to make a rule in terms of how you vote for your Representative? Because you would need to have one, for a single person to get that much sway. I don't like this idea, because it in no way forces that player with that much power, to work for the better good. Their only consequence would be what? Lynched the next Day for acting poorly with votes? But that would be further detriment to the Cave.

I do agree, that we should all be voting for who we think would do a good job; but who we think is an Orc first. Because an Elf could do a splendid job, but that is counterproductive.

But I have no clue about the alignment of my rep either (Cel). And you don't know what your rep's alignment is. And when it comes to hunches, we have zero kills and lynches to help us decide and haven't reached a stopping point (night) where we can go back and reread the day's action.

I never claimed that I knew for certain the alignment of who I voted for. However, I did give it thought - which is a difference between the votes. If people were unable to get information from other players in regards to their alignment, then what exactly is the point of having a Day phase? Hmm? You seem to think that information relies solely on what occurs during Night. Which is ridiculously .. flawed and lazy. Your entire stance is rather odd, and it definitely shows you are up to something - but when aren't you. It also seems like you are faking here, and I question how it is productive and good for the Cave.

Oh come on, you walked straight into a point I made earlier- the fact that other votes have merely been, as you stated, a reaction or counter to the first votes! Basically, you're basing your actions upon something that you say shouldn't have happened in the first place, which means that had everyone followed your advice and not jumped the gun, you wouldn't have had any reason to vote later yourself, thus proving me correct when it comes to how incredibly flimsy our day 1 rep voting is going to be.

I said my vote in particular. I didn't vote solely on the thought of trying to counter what you and your lackeys tried doing. I also thought of alignment, and who I thought was a possible Orc. Again, a rather large difference.


I think the phorc/Loslote/Sally triangle needs to be figured out at one point or another, otherwise it will continue to vie for attention.


Currently wouldn't vote for:
Folwren
Lommy
Nog
Shasta
Wilwa
Dun
Mira

Every one else is pretty iffy, or no read. I have Mira up there because I think she was in a 'no time, must vote' state of mind.

[Thinlómien]

Feeling tired and lazy. Shall go through the posting more or less (probably "less") carefully and then vote.

Un-reps, who would you like to see lynched toDay?

[Thinlómien]

Wait...

Lottie #9

This makes sense, and looks rather innocent of you, but I'm going be around, so Phantom, no vote for you.



...yet.

tp #10

And Lottie, really, there is no need to delay. Every last villager is going to vote me as representative today, as it would entertain the mods as well as be historic and funny. As a matter of fact, it wouldn't surprise me if I received all the rep votes every day of the contest. If the Sons win then all the orcs can say, "That blasted Phantom didn't vote well and lost it for us! Let's make fun of him!" And that would be great fun, of course. Or if the Sons lose then all the orcs can say, "Ha- I chose my rep well, didn't I?" And that would be fun as well.

Lottie #14

Or, of course, you turn out to be evil and utterly destroy us all. And then we can all go "oh, that Phantom!" and we'd all be having a right good time!

tp #17 and #18

PS If you haven't voted me as your representative yet, please do so. Let's make history.

Well no, but I would have a good time, so it all balances out, yes? So yeah, um, vote for me. Vote for me now.

Need a second opinion? Let's ask Emperor Palpatine-

Emperor Palpatine: "Do it!"

Lottie #19

I'm honestly considering it...I won't be able to get online until an hour before DL, and I'll probably not have much time to catch up, much less form opinions, and it is Day 1, after all...you know what, fine.

++The Puddintom for Representative

What the???

Lottie, I've heard your resonings but this is plain weird. Is your mind really that easily turned?

Btw if I may discuss phantom I'd like to say that he'd just love his fellow wolves to vote him as rep because
1) then he gets power and he probably believes to be the most able to use it in the wolf team anyway
and
2) then he has a good excuse not to vote his fellows for a lynch because he hates doing that.
Makes me think that if phantom dies and is proved a wolf, I would really look at Lottie, Sally and Mira. (Just imagine if they would be our four wolves! That would be almost ingenious in its absurdity.)

Back to reread...

[Thinlómien]

Lottie is really very careless and confident in the beginning of Day1. Reminds me of a wolf who's happy with her pack and thinks they'll win... or a happy-happy orco. She also gives the impression that she is voting first and then coming up with reasons afterwards. Hmm... Wonder if I should change my mind about her.

I might also take my word back on not voting phantom. His frolicking really irks me... doesn't he really have more important stuff to say? Admittedly, he's been speaking more sense lately.

Legate's wishy-washiness sort of disturbs me but I think it's just his style and I always suspect him based on that to some extent or another. I think I also suspect Glirdan mostly based on his style as always.

I would put Nerwen and Zil to the same category - I like what they're saying but I don't really trust them. Shasta could almost be there too, but I both trust and distrust him more than the other two. Mostly because I'm imagining him laughing his wicked laugh behind the screen.

Kath should be here. I shouldn't be surprised she misses a Day1 but this one is twice as long as a normal one. (Ha! random non-native English speaker 'downer: "Kath, what do you call this kind of meat?" Kath: "Long." <3)

I'm trying to determine whether Nogrod seems (on second thought) suspiciously refrained - because of wolvishness or because of lack of internet access. Or both? Or neither? Anyway you get my point.

Folwren is smart and funny but I'm wondering if she's as innocent as she seems. There's something quite careful about the way she posts, which could indicate guilt. All in all there is some honest straightforwardness in her habit nonetheless, so I'm not too worried in the absence of further "proof".

Also wondering what to make of the large anti-phantom front (like, people opposing his thoughts and questioning his logic). It might be as simple as that many people saw the flaw in his (honest or schemical) argumentation.

Read the first 2 pages now and starting a new post for further points if there are any... see, I'm keeping the discussion active and learning to make shorter posts!


edit: xed with everybody - good, I'll read and reply before continuing the reread!

[Thinlómien]

I like Eönwë's style except for how he keeps coming back to phantom.

Somehow my concentration is failing...

There really is something fishy in Celuien's manner. I think she is too calculationg and too captain obvious-ish.

Now I have reread up until the end of the first half of the Day. Currently feeling like voting Lottie, or possibly splitting to give one gut-feeling vote to Cel.


edit: xed with everyone

[Thinlómien]

Feeling a bit better about Izzy.

Hmm. That's apparenlty all I have to say about this latter half of toDay!

Shall think about these things but preferably going to sleep in 20 minutes...


edit: xed with Noggggg

[Nogrod]

Hah. I finally got a place to sit and to plug my laptop into the mains...

So here's what little I managed to write down while being at home - with a few addenda skimming fast what has happened meanwhile...


Depending on the answer the phantom might have given to my questions (if he has), I’m pending my opinion whether to call for the “historical feat Fea would love so much” and lynch him on D1, or whether to give him a chance to show his qualities this time as well…

ADD: I'm probably not advicing anyone to lynch him but I might complain about his latest explanation anyway.


I think I see where you tp are coming from, but that doesn’t remove the fact that Sally’s vote was soo stupid. I will not vote for Sally for a representative in this game. I can’t let that kind of judgements decide on life and death issues – even if it was made on D1. Really. That’s a promise. Sorry Sally, but you're too reckless. Your try of turning the gaze on Shasta and Nerwen after your return was kind of pathetic – and don’t say you just joked.

I don’t mean playing werewolf should be a grave matter or that winning is important (actually I do prefer a good game lost to a lousy game won), but one should at least try to play by the rules – in their spirit, not only by the book. Light-heartedness can be fun and constructive at the same time. Now it feels Sally just tried to duck the fence from the lowest point to get through to the next Day by allying herself with tp who she knew would then talk on behalf of her if she flattered him enough…

Lottie seems to go to and fro in the beginning and her efforts of trying to cover tp (and her own choice) later have been eyebrow-raising to say the least. The basic problem here is that I know I normally end up suspecting Lottie when she’s innocent and so I’m wavering a bit here. But really, Lottie can’t defend tp for his arguments “containing no illogical jumps” (as she says in response to Foley). Actually this way of clinging to an explanation of her vote provided by the phantom in retrospect looks pretty fishy – whatever phantom’s role.

I do like Nerwen’s attitude but there are two little things you might say are irrelevant, but I find them disturbing enough: she calls those she decides to suspect “orclings” and the suggestion of someone signaling to others when she tried to suspect Lottie is quite odd indeed… like she tried just to add on top of some already existing general suspicions with no real basis…

ADD: Also her latest open suspicion on Mira is more like an easy throw away than anything she would have really contemplated on. I dislike Mira’s vote as well, but really, it looks like she just didn’t read the thread…

And then there’s this.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Maybe he means he can't be around?

Now this looks a bit odd indeed. Why to run on defence of Boro on such a minor point? I mean the wolves oftentimes feel the threats to be more major than they are (everyone who has been a wolf knows that) and thence they feel the need to defend themselves or their friends in situations where no specific “defence” is needed (see the “confused” smilie there).

Originally Posted by Lommy

Then to the rep choices... I kind of like them, but I have a feeling there's at least one if not two SoE among them simply because so many people I think innocent are NOT among the reps.

Interesting point from Lommy. I do belong to those people who think we can lynch a villain on D1 in a normal game, and that those who diss D1’s are more often than not villains themselves (villains love randomness – or talking about the randomness of D1 - as it leaves no trace to them), but in this kind of a game I think it would turn out actually good to see one or two enemies on the lines of the representatives on D1. Maybe even toMorrow. Whatever. The point is we should choose also the enemies as representatives on D1 and not only those leaning on the success of the village: that’s the best way to put them into danger. On D1 – and possibly on D2 – probably not much later in the game.

Remember the first things we can read in any way are the choices of the representatives. If all the reps are innocents, and an innocent is lynched, we’re quite easily led to concentrate only on innocents toMorrow. Therefore at this point (at this point, mind you) we need some SoE’s for representatives. I think you Lommy see this, so why bother wailing on it?

ADD:

Originally Posted by Boro

I'm not going to lobby for anyone's lynching when I aint got a clue.

Being a bit too modest or withholding something are you? Really. This just doesn't make sense. And let's not argue about the meaning of the term "lobbying".

EDIT: X'd with Lommy & phantom

[Kath]

Ahem ... hi. Apologies for limited participation toDay. I will read and comment briefly but it won't be particularly in depth!

[Nogrod]

Great udders of relief! Kath is here, naturally - on technical terms - missing D1...

[Kath]

Shasta was pretty forceful earlier. Not sure if that's good or bad.

phantom and Nerwen are playing hints. Irritating but normal for those two.

Legate is picking up Lommy's flipflopping. 'Let's not talk about phantom all day.' ... leads to a post all about phantom. But then so was everything else all Day.

Haha and Lommy was either sleepy or just plain grumpy when she wrote her first post! Good points about the early votes though - why vote because you're not around if you're then around. That said in RL werewolf she's evil when acting this way.

Inzil said we don't have to vote anyone for rep, but Fea in the admin thread said that those who don't vote should and will have that used against them. It's a matter of balance I suppose. Do the SoE risk being focused on for not voting, risk voting a fellow SoE to give themselves more power, or risk voting an ordo and hoping they mess up.

I quite like Nog voting for someone he knows to be quiet for Rep. Izzy might not have picked up votes by osmosis like the loudmouths but I think she's a good choice. She's often very good at picking wolves.

With regards to Kath, I've got a feeling she will not be making an appearance today. To the pits with you! Celuien will probably, she's usually pretty busy and quiet, but far less forgetful than Kath.

I love this comment.

I kind of like where Lommy says "I'm not too happy about phantom and me having more power than the others". Just makes me feel good about her.

So that's pretty much what I was thinking as I skimmed through. Not sure what the Reps want from those of us without the power to vote. I'm going to leave it at this as I'm headed to bed.

[Eönwë]

So... finally caught up... sort of.

Comments to come.

[Eönwë]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Indeed. It would be nice to have a couple more who can approach or rival tp's power, for balance.

Why is everyone focusing on either giving the phantom power or negating him? can't we just treat him like a normal representative.

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I've been leaning toward Boro, but I could possibly go for Lommy or Wilwa as well, since both seem reasonable at the moment.

So here Inzil is basically repeating Boro's post about balancing phantom with others, even down to the same suggestion of people: Boro and Lommy. I don't know why, but I don't like the implications of this. Of course, he does also mention Wilwa, but he's still mentioning the same thing. If we make phantom the centre of the game we won't be able to catch any elves.


And since everyone's been commenting on it, I just want to say:

Originally Posted by the phantom

You know better than this, Boro. To vote for me at that stage was frankly quite impressive in some ways. On one hand, it displays a "Might as well" attitude, which shows nerve as well as an understanding of where we are on this first day.

Basically, I hope that this was just a joke/spoof that your later comments were just a continuation. In my opinion, it is almost always better to wait (if possible) until people have actually posted before voting, so that you can see what you think of them.

Originally Posted by the phantom

I'm uncertain of what you're trying to accomplish. Do you wish to keep me in the attractive lynch category without actually accusing, but rather make it look somehow like a logical option to lynch me? That's a typical elf trick. "You'll see I didn't actually suspect him, but he was the logical choice! Don't blame me!"

Hm... It takes one to know one. The elves always accuse others of using "elf trick"s as you call them.


edit: x-ed with Lommy. Also, just note that I wrote this before the phantom officially became phorc.

[Isabellkya]

I find that Boro's stance on essentially staying out of things, since he does not personally have a vote. To be rather copping-out and taking the lazy, "don't want to get my hands dirty" route. What is the difference between lobbying with a vote and lobbying without a vote?

I think that ultimately, we should still play the same way as normal. Just with some not having a vote for this part of the Day. Since the opinions of the Non-Reps still matter. I've been in the same situation before, and it can be easy to just 'la la la' away, basically.

Shasta. Why do you want to see Sally lynched?

@ Phantom. I am not opposed to a Boro lynch for the reasoning at the top of this post.
Why those choices in your #275 list?

I believe Lommy voted correctly. Not sure about Greenie's and Nerwen's. If we are using both/all votes for one person, to we need to signify that somehow, like voting for them twice. Or does once, as in Greenie's case, automatically count as both/all?