WW LXXXVII - The Valley Forge

[Bom Tombadillo]

I'm torn between keeping phantom around to admire his brilliance (before killing him for being an eeevil li'l schemer) and just plain killing him to, as G55 says, save us some headaches.

Also, phantom's fixation on killing the KD this early seems like a Forger trying to get an obstacle out of the way during the day, when the Watchdwarf can't protect him.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Bom Tombadillo

I'm torn between keeping phantom around to admire his brilliance (before killing him for being an eeevil li'l schemer) and just plain killing him to, as G55 says, save us some headaches.

Also, phantom's fixation on killing the KD this early seems like a Forger trying to get an obstacle out of the way during the day, when the Watchdwarf can't protect him.

In both cases it sounds like you plan on dispatching him eventually, so why would you make yourself wait and go through the headaches?

[Bom Tombadillo]

Because he's amusing, of course.

Oh dear. I seem to have become part-sally.

[Pitchwife]

Sorry everybody, had no internet all day till now. Catching up.

[Galadriel55]

1.5 hour left. And there's nothing new.

Who do I want to lynch? Not wilwa. Not Glirdy (obviously). I don't have a solid opinion on most people. Nerwen is sensible and reasonable, like always. She doesn't give me evil vibes. Phantom is... well... phantom.

I'm torn between voting some submarine or tp. The problem is, almost anybody except for tp is kinda sub-ish. Including me. And it's soooooooooo tempting to lynch phantom. At least just to show him that it can be done... But, on the other hand, I'd hate to lose "the second most deadliest person in the village" (or whatever it was that Bom called him) if he's innocent. But I'd dance on my head if he'll be a fenris.

Edit: 1 hour 13 minutes now.

[Galadriel55]

This looks like it's going to be very last-minute...

[Bom Tombadillo]

Wait, is DL really that early? I thought it was an hour later than that (4:00 my time).

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Bom Tombadillo

Wait, is DL really that early? I thought it was an hour later than that (4:00 my time).

*headdesk* You're right! It's still 2 hours to DL. I thought it was just one. I got that 4:00 EST into my head, but it's 5:00 EST.

I'm sorry.

Edit: xed with Boro

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Edit: 1 hour 13 minutes now.

2 more hours til DL (5 pm EST - 9 PM Downsian time (which I think is GMT)).

It was extended an hour, at I believe sally's request.

[Pitchwife]

I can empathize with people being exasperated with tp, but even if I'm not 100 % sold on his plan, I have an idea why he's doing what he's doing, and I'm for now inclined to think his reasons are innocent; so I won't be voting him toDay. (As to his vote for me, I take that as a placeholder; we have retractables, remember?)

Why I'm not sold on his plan yet: OK, the hints the KD can give to the NWD will be sketchy, but if nothing else, he can get himself (and thus indirectly the Sweetheart) protected at least twice, forcing the Forgers to pick another victim, and thus slightly increasing the chance that they hit the Sweetheart directly, giving him a revenge kill. In this case, he'll die as well, but we'll be spared wasting a lynch on him and can concentrate on lynching the Forgers. Also, there's these secrets about the KD and Sweetheart that Foley's been talking about and which could be for our benefit (as wilwa and G55 have pointed out).

tp's plan, on the other hand, has the charm of being straight and simple and avoiding the chances of multiple/revenge kills backfiring. Still, I'd prefer to lynch a Forger toDay if we can and give the Sweetheart at least one Night to find the KD.

Oh and Mith, not that Jon Snow. This one.
(Btw, ever wondered why the trilogy format is so popular in fantasy? Yes, Tolkien, I know, but there's four winds, four seasons, Four Branches of the Mabinogi...)

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

I can empathize with people being exasperated with tp, but even if I'm not 100 % sold on his plan, I have an idea why he's doing what he's doing, and I'm for now inclined to think his reasons are innocent; so I won't be voting him toDay. (As to his vote for me, I take that as a placeholder; we have retractables, remember?)

Possibly, but they have to be highlighted anyway, so the vote is void and phantom can be such a stickler for reading rules, he's making a few errors so far.

I've realized I'm missing the Premier League game I had wanted to watch, and while it should end before the DL, I don't want to deal with a frantic mess of mass cross-voting at the end.

Add sally to the vote list, because that's the easiest way for me to figure out her guilt or innocence, and so is doing this.

++sally

I may be back yet.

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Oh and Mith, not that Jon Snow. This one.
(Btw, ever wondered why the trilogy format is so popular in fantasy? Yes, Tolkien, I know, but there's four winds, four seasons, Four Branches of the Mabinogi...)

LOTR aint a trilogy it is a classic triple decker..... but some random bloke with a woluf means nothing to me... oh Vienna... Anyway I don't like Phantom's idea on so many levels. Apart from feeling that it isn't sporting as when Somerset declared in a limited overs game in order to win the overall title (sorry I know it is only Nerwen for whom cricket is a culturally appropriate reference and she prolly wasn't born at the time) I really think Foley doesn't deserve people playing silly beggars with her game. She may have more generosity of spirit than I with regard to player taking the law into her own hands but she has already had to defer and alter deadlines and the like and it just isn't fair. I have to admit I am only playing because I regarded myself as committed before I became definitively disenchanted with werewolf but since I am playing I will play and not seek some quick get out on a technicality. Anyway now to find someone to vote for.

[Folwren]

Deadline. Stop posting. Narration will come in time...probably an hour or so, because I'm not home yet and am just passing through a place that happens to have a computer and internet access. Yay!

-- Folwren

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Because I wouldn't like to see tp lynched toDay? Is that good enough?

You feel that good about him 'eh?

All his plan business, I highly doubt he was being serious with doing it, because of how ridiculous it would be to try. It was more likely fodder to be served as discussion. The question is whether it's a red herring to use later (ie he's a snickering Forge members) or if he was trying on of his infamous trap ploys.

--sally

++Bom

[Folwren]

Night Two

Find someone who can help you. Someone who you can trust and send ahead to warn people. That had been the advice given to him, and now was the time to take action on it. As darkness fell, before he was required to be at the forge to meet about what to do, he waited and watched, hoping to find the one who could help him. But who could it possibly be? Most of the dwarves slunk off to their homes, bolting their doors behind them, as though that could keep them safe.

Then he saw the one. A dark, hooded figure standing in the shadow of an alley. He glanced up and down the street and then ran across, coming up behind the hood stranger silently.

“Friend, can you help me?”

The dwarf whipped about, and Galin turned his face away. “No, do not try to see me. It is better if you do not know me. But listen, I will bring word each night about this time of whom the Forge may seek to kill. I cannot promise that I will know, but it will be my best guess.”

“Why should your guess be any better than anyone else’s of who the Forge will kill?” the dwarf asked.

“Because I am one of them, but I am also the king’s messenger. So, hark, this night protect with your life. . .” and he whispered a name so low the other could scarcely hear. But he did hear, and he nodded.

“Good luck, friend,” Galin said, and turned away.

The debate at the forge was hot that night. They were angry and distraught, frightened at what Bom’s death foretold them. They knew they had to strike back, hard and swift, and sure, but how? The decision was not quite made and dawn was coming swiftly. “The first one we come to,” they decided. “Quickly now, we must be ready to face them come day break.”

They leaped up, loosed their daggers in their sheaths as they went and exited into the cold open air.

They almost immediately caught sight of the same hooded dwarf Galin had spoken to. Galin recognized the dwarf at once, and he stopped dead in his tracks, struck dumb with horror as his campanions hurried on, locked into their kill.

It was over quickly, and the body was left in the street. When the first dwarvish citizen dared to open his door and peek his beard out, he found the cloaked body of one of their women. He drew back the hood.

It was Wilwarin.

Alive
Sally
Inzil
Nerwen
Boro
Galadriel
Eruhen
Glirdan
Finduilas
Rikae
McCaber
Pitchwife
the Phantom
Mithalwen

Dead
Folwren - Moddess
Bom - Member of the Valley Forge
Wilwa - Night Watchdwarf

[Inziladun]

Well, they got their revenge for yesterDay.

More immediately, can anything be learned from Bom's comments and interactions?

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Well, they got their revenge for yesterDay.

Yep. Dang.

Originally Posted by Inziladun

More immediately, can anything be learned from Bom's comments and interactions?

Other than that he was eager to be rid of tp, he seemed to suspect you and McCaber to be in some kind of collusion IIRC (possibly together with tp). But I'll go back and look if there's more.

Speaking of McCaber - Rikae, please enlighten me:

Originally Posted by Rikae

and I don't know what McCobbler is doing (but I know for a fact he's not the KD!)

How can you know that "for a fact", unless you're a member of the Forge and he is not?

[Mithalwen]

Hi I am around ... inspired with a rare "catch" I have been doing some note taking... nearly done will be back soon with conclusions.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Pitchwife

Speaking of McCaber - Rikae, please enlighten me:

How can you know that "for a fact", unless you're a member of the Forge and he is not?

Um, because I'm one of the three people he named?
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[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Um, because I'm one of the three people he named?

"And I know of course I'm innocent (although I obviously can't prove it), so if he suspects me, he can't know my role"?

[the phantom]

I'll be leaving shortly, but I'll return after 2-3 hours and be around the rest of the day. (Sorry for not being around yesterday. No choice.)

Anyway, I'm definitely not caught up on the specifics of yesterday, but in my quick skim it looked like Sally never explained my vote, so here's the explanation-

Watch

It's a running gag with Sally, Fea, and a couple others to imitate Spike in their Facebook posts and such, saying four words and adding the insult to the end.

While I was visiting Sally a short while ago she did it to me (several times), and suddenly I was struck with the idea to use the joke on the Downs only with Pitch inserted in place of the word that the mods here probably don't want me using as a way to label another member.

The original plan was to say- "You are a Wolf- Pitch", but it didn't fit in these circumstances (there being no wolves in this village), so I changed it to "You must be lynched- Pitch".

Probably not the least bit amusing to non-Buffy fans, but I know at least two people found it extremely funny.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Well, they got their revenge for yesterDay.

Sure did. And Wilwa hardly said anything at all!

I can't stay for long or go searching for interactions and etc, but from toDay's posts, Pitchie's case against Rikae feels a bit... fabricated. I'll be back later with my thoughts in full...

Edit: xed with Mith

[McCaber]

So, yesterDay I forgot it ended at 4 instead of 5. This means that with work I'm going to need to vote quite early, and that I missed the previous vote by like 15 minutes.

So, phantom's plan got discarded early? Makes sense. I thought it was a bit too good to be true. Fortunately, it seems we hit on a Forger anyway.

I'll take a look at posts by and about the lateBomand see if anything trips my radar.

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by McCaber

So, phantom's plan got discarded early? Makes sense. I thought it was a bit too good to be true. Fortunately, it seems we hit on a Forger anyway.

.

So in ch that case why did you jump straight in to complying with it?

I have notes on everyone and at the moment Pitchwife looks pretty innocent to me. He picked up on Bom early and so his vote was consistent, Discussed the situation and TP's plan and was calm in the face of TP's fairly bizarre vote. Also in no hurry to dispose of the only other player in a close timezone...

Galadriel worries me a lot. I may be a poor judge because she was my abandoned cub the one and only time I have played with her but I have filled twice as much paper on her but it is a bit careful. Not much original - she agrees with Nerwen a bit, says Boro's predicitions is coming true. She does pick up on Eruhen's odd "nothing to add" in the face of TP's plan and points out that the plan is a de facto reveal - but seems to be looking for a way round it. On the less original side there are vote counts within 4 posts of each other, a list that draws no real conclusions - Wilwa and Pitch seem more innocent. Sort of stuff that makes a player look diligent but doesn't actually commit them - and all the misguided panic over the deadline- taking up Nogrod's cyber sheepdog role. Then the last minute attack on the bandwaggon.. just seemed it might be a fausse-naive bluff....

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

I don't see what good could come for one of the Forgers to die in an attempt to look like the KD, not after having Bom and Gal lynched. Unless if somehow Gal was the KD, and Rikae covered for the rest of her pack to make it look like she was? Again, I don't see the benefit there.

Well, let's see what G55 said yesterDay that might be of interest.

This is going backward from the end of the Day. Smilies removed.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Throwaway Day One votes are sometimes ok. But I don't like throwaway Day 2 votes.

--Pitch

++G55

But I tell you, he's evil. He is. I said, HE. IS. There. And so it TP.

I might not be able to post until after DL, so good luck, my friends, even though you all want to lynch me.

That definitely looks like she wanted to pose as the KD. If she was , the other two Forgers are obvious. If not, she was merely trying to set them up.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Got 5 minutes, wanna say this



OK, I believe what you're saying about the cross-voting. But you - and everyone else - forgot to notice that I also crossed with Zil's vote. And I did indicate that.



If this isn't the worst reason out there for suspecting me.

Here she defends herself.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

No, I don't think you're a long-legged elven blonde, I'm not that nuts yet...

But I will not rest, and most definitely will not be assured, until I see my suspicions proven.

++Pitchie

Seriously, he said and did too many things with double-meanings that just smell like Forgery. I will probably have the chance to duck in again before the DL, but just in case I'm voting now. I doubt that anything will come up that will make me change my mind.

The vote for Pitch, whom she'd been after all Day. It was a very iffy case she was making on him, IMO, which was a major reason I voted for her.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

That's right as far as I know. Anyone with a Forge mark (ie wolves and KD) will be called a Forge Member if they die. I think we'll know that it's the SH if she's lynched. If she's killed - obviously.

The fact that the KD's role is not revealed upon death makes things much more difficult for the village. It complicates things for the wolves as well, but they have the benefit of knowing something. Also, they can take information from Nightly conversations. For instance, the KD would try to influence the kill, and a wolf could detect that. But ordinary innocents won't know anything.

Interesting how she mentions the pack gleaning info on the KD during the Nightly chats. Didn't Nerwen bring that up as well?

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

That's for all of you who couldn't find a single KD clue. ^.^ We know now that he's not the KD, but for all we - and the wolves - kne yesterDay, he mighta been. Though this is the only KD hint I found, and it was said when votes were already starting to fall on him...



I get what you're saying. But, IMO, pressing the point and saying that she may as well be Forging at Night, is a case. And it just sounded ridiculous. The sentense he quoted, albeit a statement, sounds more frivolous than a serious declaration. Reminds me of myself in your game, when I tried to lynch someone for a joke-post.

Upon rereading, I come to be more and more suspicious of Pitchie and Phantom. I can see the twain awake at Night together. "Their swords and their councels may have two edges".... or something of that sort.

And it certainly makes it more difficult for villagers and wolves alike if they don't know the KD's identity. But especially villagers.

She defends her suspicions of Pitch, and brings tp into it again.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

I found something else rather curious. TP voted Pitch. Pitch voted Bom. Bom voted TP. Interesting triangle. Contradictory conclusions are the only ones that come to my mind atm, so I'll have to address this again after a night of sleep. From the first look, Pitch and Phantom come out clean and shiny from yesterDay's vote. But I won't rule out a wolf-on-wolf yet. Fine. Forger-on-Forger. But I will still call them wolves. Evil werewolf spirits remain such regardless of who they posess and what shape they take. *stares at phantom*

And since I'm here, I can also say that Pitch is acting abnormal toDay, making an elephant out of a fly with Rikae. This isn't supposed to be related to my previous statement - at least in my head, - but they both stand... I think...

That's it. Bedtime. I'm stuttering in typing.... if that made any sense..... *head drops, eyes close*

Links Bom, Pitch, and tp by their Day 1 votes.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Sure did. And Wilwa hardly said anything at all!

I can't stay for long or go searching for interactions and etc, but from toDay's posts, Pitchie's case against Rikae feels a bit... fabricated. I'll be back later with my thoughts in full...

This was the first post of Day 2, and where she started in on Pitch.

She was consistent on Day 2, keeping on Pitch, and to an extent, tp. She doesn't really come across as the KD early in the Day. If she wasn't the KD, all the suspicion against Pitch and tp was a frame-up. But that would implicate Forgers in her lynch.

[Folwren]

The day was filled with fierce argument amongst the villagers. The members of the Forge mingled amongst them, offering their opinions beside those of their innocent victims. One dwarf was very vocal, his shouting rising above the general discourse of the others.

“Ever since the King has sent his dwarves back here to try to solve our problems for us, the Forge has merely become more violent. Folwren was killed because she aided the King’s messenger! What more will happen if we keep him in our midst? Kill him now!”

“How could you offer to kill someone sent to help us?”

“Help us?” the loud dwarf said. “Help us! He hasn’t helped us! Perhaps he could help us if we could force the names of the members of the Forge out of him before we stretched his filthy neck!”

The crowd about him surged in anger, some agreeing with his words, others fiercely arguing for the opposite. Galin Ironfist laughed inside. If they wished to kill him, they would have to discover his identity first, and even the Forge members had not been able to find that out before letting him join them. He bid his time, and waited.

“That’s a marvelous good idea, my dear fellow,” said one dwarf. He ambled up and amiably clapped the loud dwarf on the shoulder. “While we’re asking everyone if they’re the King’s Dwarf, why don’t we ask if they're the Forge members, too? Perhaps they’ll just up and say who they are! Make our job a great deal easier.”

“I don’t like your tone, fellow,” a dwarf at his elbow said. “What’s your name, and are you a member of the Forge?”

“I’m called Bom. Of course I’m not. I was just saying it’d make it easier.”

“You talk too much.”

Bom looked from the dwarf to the others standing about. Their eyes were fixed on him. “Hey, now, it’s all in jest, right? You don’t really think I’m serious…I wasn’t really expecting…”

“We’re tired of jesting. This isn’t a jesting business! We’re being killed one by one! If you can take others’ deaths lightly, perhaps you can laugh at your own!”

An approving murmur ran through the crowd, and the murmur grew to a great grumbling growl. The dwarves reached out and took hold of Bom, dragging him down from where he stood by the loud dwarf, and taking him to the center of the village. They were a blood thirsty and frightened group and no one was there that knew better or who could hold them back. The members of the Forge stayed quiet, and Galin Ironfist remained silent, too, for this was the beginning of his victory.

Someone produced an axe – no one knew who’s it was – and handed it to another. Several dwarves overpowered Bom and tied him, hand and foot. He kicked and thrashed about until the dwarf with the axe stood by his head, then he laid still, his eyes gleaming.

“You’ll be sorry. Every last one of you will be sorry!”

The axe lifted high in the air and descended swiftly. A skilled and clean stroke, and Bom’s head rolled off into the ditch.

The crowd was silenced with the stroke. They looked at the body. The sun dipped behind the mountain’s shoulder and a shadow fell across the square. A cold wind blew silently up the street and the people shivered and turned away, their blood lust sated for the day and dread of the night beginning to set in.

Galin alone stood waiting until the street was clear. Then he approached and took the head by the beard and laid it by the body. He drew his dagger and cut away the cloth of Bom’s shirt by his shoulder and pulled it back, revealing the brand of the Valley Forge.


Alive
Sally
Inzil
Nerwen
Boro
Galadriel
Eruhen
Glirdan
Finduilas
Rikae
McCaber
Wilwarin
Pitchwife
the Phantom
Mithalwen

Dead
Folwren - Moddess
Bom - Member of the Valley Forge