Evolution Comes to Hobbiton - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Child of the 7th Age · 11-17-2002, 06:44 PM

There is another body of evidence which suggests the close ties between Gollum and the Shire, and that is the riddle game of The Hobbit. Bilbo and Gollum were able to match each other stroke-for-stroke, riddle-for-riddle. That would not be possible unless they shared a common body of culture and folklore. A riddle game is not just an isolated intellectual exercise, but draws upon the common associations of both players.

I think there may be another way to interpret Gandalf's words about the tale being "very long ago." Since he is telling this tale to a hobbit, perhaps he is using terms that a hobbit would understand, rather than giving the true pespective of a Maia.

Remember that hobbit history is very short. There is no example of recorded hobbit history before 1050 T.A. Nor are there even any hobbit legends before that time. In effect, 1050 T.A. is the "Adam and Eve" story for the hobbits, since they can not trace their lineage back any further. This short history is totally unlike other peoples of Middle-earth.

Therefore, to a hobbit, 500-600 years old would be very old. You can understand this better if you compare a present day European with an American. I may brag about a 250 year old building and say it is very old. A person from England or France would laugh at this and point to some buildings from almost 1,000 years ago. Thus, our perspective on old is influenced by our own culture, and perhaps Gandalf is adopting the references his audience would understand.

[ November 17, 2002: Message edited by: Child of the 7th Age ]

11-17-2002, 06:44 PM	#6
Child of the 7th Age Spirit of the Lonely Star Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 5,133	There is another body of evidence which suggests the close ties between Gollum and the Shire, and that is the riddle game of The Hobbit. Bilbo and Gollum were able to match each other stroke-for-stroke, riddle-for-riddle. That would not be possible unless they shared a common body of culture and folklore. A riddle game is not just an isolated intellectual exercise, but draws upon the common associations of both players. I think there may be another way to interpret Gandalf's words about the tale being "very long ago." Since he is telling this tale to a hobbit, perhaps he is using terms that a hobbit would understand, rather than giving the true pespective of a Maia. Remember that hobbit history is very short. There is no example of recorded hobbit history before 1050 T.A. Nor are there even any hobbit legends before that time. In effect, 1050 T.A. is the "Adam and Eve" story for the hobbits, since they can not trace their lineage back any further. This short history is totally unlike other peoples of Middle-earth. Therefore, to a hobbit, 500-600 years old would be very old. You can understand this better if you compare a present day European with an American. I may brag about a 250 year old building and say it is very old. A person from England or France would laugh at this and point to some buildings from almost 1,000 years ago. Thus, our perspective on old is influenced by our own culture, and perhaps Gandalf is adopting the references his audience would understand. [ November 17, 2002: Message edited by: Child of the 7th Age ] __________________ Multitasking women are never too busy to vote.