Are You Writing Serious Fantasy? II

[Saraphim]

Almost all of my characters are based, at least loosly, on people I know. The main group of people in my story is based on my group of friends. They may not look the same, or indeed be the same gender, but there they are.

It came to me as I was watching one of my idiot friends light his shoelaces on fire, and another idiot friend spray his Cologne onto the said shoe today.

No, not that I need new friends. That the idiotic, yet lovable characters in my story are based on the idiots I know and love myself.

An odd tale, I know.

[Lhundulinwen]

Congratulations Sirithheruwen! Starting can be really hard sometimes, even when you know basically where the story is going! Does anyone have a ritual or something they do especially when starting a project? I read about how one author always starts a new novel on January 8th every year. And how about music? I almost allways have some type of music going in the background. (Yes, I confess. It generally is FOTR or ROTK soundtrack, but hey they are really good music.)

[Kitanna]

I have a little ritual I do when I write. I almost always listen to music. Mostly the ROTK soundtrack, but sometimes the Gladiator soundtrack of Gustav Holz's The Planets. If music cannot be played I'm usually in German class blocking out my teacher's annoying voice. I don't know if that counts as a ritual, but it's how I do it.

[Saraphim]

Kitanna: I am also plagued by a German teacher with an annoying voice. You have my pity.

Anyway, I get some of my inspiration for stories and especially for fighting scenes from music. I listen to a lot of Tool, which is a great band and quite inspirational, for me at least. I recommend it, if you don't mind cursing.

When I'm writing a particularly profound scene, it often helps me to listen to a song that the scene relates to.

The way I see writing and writers is that they, (and people in general, actually) are genuinly affected by the things thay are exposed to.

My friend doesn't like to read or see movies, because he is afraid it will affect his writing and make it un-original. I keep telling him that whatever he does will affect his writing, but he doesn't listen. It could have something to do with the fact that I tell him to do stupid things with volatile chemicals as well, but oh well.

[Imladris]

Watching TV does numb your mind...but I think that that is more of the dumb comedy/soap operas that do that...I don't think movies do, though I, too, am becoming a bit paranoid and worry that I'm watching too much TV.

However, if he's still concerned about it, you should tell your friend to read tons of books, because books will increasue and develope the imagination.

[Nurumaiel]

I know how watching TV can numb your mind. I never watch TV unless there's a really good movie or such on. The worst movie I ever saw in my life was on TV, and if I hadn't kept on the defense while watching it, it might have infested my mind and affected my writing. To write better now I only watch movies that are good without a doubt.

It's the same way with the books I read. If I read books that are badly-written, etc. it influences my writing for the worst. Now I try to stick to only well-written books by trustworthy authors, such as Tolkien, Chesterton, Dickens, etc.

So, Imladris, when you say,

you should tell your friend to read tons of books, because books will increasue and develope the imagination.

I agree, but I suggest you mention to your friend to read good, well-written books unless he's able to resist the temptation of letting bad books influence his writing.

[Sirithheruwen]

Congratulations Sirithheruwen!

Why, thank you!

I don't really have a ritual. I do listen to music, however. I prefer music without any words, it helps me concentrate better. The ROTK soundtrack is really good, as is the Pirates of the Caribbean one. However, I love love LOVE the theme for Requiem for a Dream. I also got an idea for a battle scene from the exact same music I got my death scene from. I don't think it will go in this book though, because there won't be many battle scenes. It also helps to write when I'm in a particularly emotional mood. Mad, sad, happy, whatever. It just helps to get my creative juices flowing. When I wrote said death scene, I was frustrated with my sisters, so I just went upstairs, turned on my music, and wrote.

I try not to watch TV also, and I don't really. Not that I have time to watch TV anyways. Actually, one of my main characters came from a TV show -- don't laugh -- called Teen Titans. Hey, I told you not to laugh! The show wasn't particularly inspiring, but something triggered my creative juices. Ah well...

Happy Writings!

[Sirithheruwen]

Hmmm....I wonder if LMP knows this thread has been resurrected. I should like to know how his novel is coming...

[Lhundulinwen]

Nothing wrong with using a TV show like Teen Titans! I once wrote a 3 page journal entry on the first X-men movie. (Don't ask....I still like that movie!!)

Personally, I try not to read or watch television shows that are related to whatever subject I happen to be writting about, unless I'm writing nonfiction. (Which doesn't happen often.) But I read and watch a lot of TV & movies, but all of them must have an emotional strength to them, usually within the first 5 minutes, or I don't get into them.
Ex. The Mel Gibson movie The Patriot. I ended up crying during most of the film, just because it was so sad what all was sacraficed by this one man. So I watched it and obsorbed (sp) those feelings and threw them into a poem. That is the only reason to watch TV or a movie, at least for me.

[Imladris]

I believe that tv has it's place in the writing area. As with everything else, you need to watch it with moderation, and when you do watch it, watch something that is unique, etc. But I think that the main main thing is that a writer must read. Must read everything: the classics, Shakespeare, etc. The combination of reading and television will fill you with good ideas...a fertile imagination.

I listen to music to primarily get into the mood. I find that music such as Linkin Park and soundtracks such as Edward Scissorhands does the trick very well. I was listening to Edward and I came up with the most awesome death for an RPG character.

[Orual]

I think that being exposed to a wide variety of influences is a good thing. Of course, I think that when writing a book reading novels and short stories is the best thing to do...especially if you read a lot of different styles and authors. Reading plays can also be beneficial, and not only Shakespeare: Sheppard, Williams, or more modern authors like Jane Martin (Anton in Show Business).

And I agree with Imladris when she says that a combination of reading and watching television, as long as it's good television (no, "The Bachelor" does not count), will help you write. With the rise of 'reality TV', smart shows are getting more and more difficult to find, but there are still some. Some shows I watch to get my creative juices flowing are...

The West Wing. You've got to love a show that doesn't dumb itself down for its audience. If you don't get it, they don't care--the writers are relentlessly intelligent and witty. My favorite characters are the dry, sarcastic C.J., and the often unintentionally funny Josh.

Babylon 5. Another show that won't pander to the lowest denominator. Past the cool, cutting-edge-for-when-it-was-made FX, its web of characters and relationships takes five seasons to play out, and it pays off brilliantly in the end. Favorite character: Londo Mollari, clever and never without a retort.

Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel. I classify them together because they are from the same creator and they share many of their directors and writers. Some of the episodes are a little conceptual and disconnected, but they remain my two favorite shows because of the depth of the characters. Buffy (the character) is my number one inspiration for my heroines...she's a female warrior, but the fact that she's a girl who fights doesn't supercede her personality. Favorite characters: Spike, who evolves through the series more than almost any other character I've ever seen on a television show, and the naive, blunt Anya, who always says exactly what she means.

Sometimes I write fanfiction to get into the mood of writing. Mostly, though, I use television as a springboard for characters.

[Lathriel]

I have been writing before I ever read LOTR and LOTR wasn't my first fantasy book. I had a whole poetry phase but I gave up since i don't think my poems are that good however I still like it when the poetry unit comes along in english class.

I don't like writing fan fiction and I have only written one. I don't like fanfiction because I want to be original.
For me starting is easy, it is the finishing that is difficult because while I write I am afraid that I would bore whoever reads it. I have only finished my short stories. However now I have written two stories that are 40 pages or a little less and they are far from being done. (That might be about 60 pages in paperback. YEEEHHH!!)

Sometimes I write in class and people ask what i am doing. I tell them I am writing a story and when I tell them that it is 40 pages long they look at me in amazement. I don' think that it is that extroadinary but they seem to think so.

I like to just start writing with no plan so whenever we have to plan in english class for our short story I silently grind my teeth. My story just comes as I am writing, I can't plan ahead.

I don't know about you guys but ideas come to me in the dozen if i had written all my ideas down i would at least have 12 different stories at one time. AAAAAHHHHHHH!

As for T.V, as long as you read lots too I don't think it would affect you too much. Maybe what would help is to get involved in music, you know play an instrument or sing. I think that playing an instruiment gives the brain exercise and therefore you can think of lots of new stuff.

I'm starting to ramble now so i should probably stop.

[Imladris]

As for T.V, as long as you read lots too I don't think it would affect you too much. Maybe what would help is to get involved in music, you know play an instrument or sing. I think that playing an instruiment gives the brain exercise and therefore you can think of lots of new stuff.

Music is a story. It tells a story. And music is stimulating to your mind. Studies have been done that says that young children who listen to the classics are smarter as they grow older, as well.

[Maeggaladiel]

I always listen to music while I write. It helps me go to my *happy place*. Just kidding. Actually, it does help me write. I write different things, depending on what music I'm listening to. Evanescense usually makes my characters get into depressing situations. Rolling Stones makes my characters tough and adventurous. It's kinda weird, actually.

And I get ideas from television and books. I don't steal the plots, but they inspire me to work on my own stories. Trips to the bookstore always make me want to write and get something published. (Although at this rate, I won't have a finished book until I'm seventy-five!)

Another thing: I have problems with writing my plots. I get this great idea for my characters, and then I'm stuck again. Once I killed off a character, and then I found that I needed her later. Somehow I resurrected her (it's fantasy, they can do that sort of thing, okay?) and now she's stuck somewhere else. I wrote this great scene for her. I loved it. It's so perfect, but now I don't know how to follow it up! Anybody else have this problem?

I think I write serious Fantasy, Tolkien has influenced me.

In 7th grade, the first LOTR movie was released, I was really captured by the way he thought. So I read the books...and I decided that I wanted to try and be just as good as he was, to write something people would love.

I've been working on it for...going on...four years now. It's been really hard.

I think I write serious fantasy because I have created my own worlds, races, languages, but they are complex yet easy to understand

I'm taking my time, I hope it goes well...best of skill.

-Tumsy

[Nurumaiel]

Anybody else have this problem?

Oh yes, Maeggaladiel, most assuredly I do! All the time. In fact I just recovered from being stuck for a week. I was at a very important part in the story. The conflict has just been introduced, the conflict that will be the main driving point for the story. But then... the characters fell silent. They didn't want me to do anything with them, they didn't want me to give them any dialogue... they just remained stubbornly silent.

And then just yesterday they opened their mouths. Two boys going with the soldier? How ridiculous, they cried! Our friend Barin is coming too! And then the second chapter opens up with characters never heard of... characters thousands of miles away from the people I was previously dealing with! A king and queen and their daughter, and her 'Instructor?' Where did they come from. But now they're there and the story has hope again.

EDIT: Yikes! To use a Tolkien example, I can say that one of my characters in the White Horse has told me something very unexpected. He fought in the War of the Ring, and he was Bard to King Theoden?! I'm very surprised but if that is true I suppose... it is.... I guess. These characters will never give me peace of mind!

I never force myself to write when I'm stuck. I get stuck for good when I do that. I've tried it before and good books have had to be set aside until they're rekindled in my mind. When I force myself to write when I'm confused and unwilling to write because I don't know what's happening all that gets put in the book. The book becomes confusing, forced, and boring. I give myself the opportunity to practice the virtue of patience and I wait. I think about it during the night when my imagination is working best. I think out scenes and atmospheres, and I wait for the characters to tell me what they did next. I let the characters be themselves and let them do what they want. I make them become real people and I'm their biographer. They tell me what happened; I write their history. Sometimes they fall silent and won't tell me and if I make up what they say and do they get mad at my faulty interpretations and remain silent for months.

Just wait. Take a walk and think about it, listen to music... something like that. I've mentioned that I act out my stories before, and I'll say now that it helps when I'm stuck. I'll act out a scene already written and oftentimes it will keep going and I'll know what happens next. Patience and time... that's what I need to get past the silence of my characters.

Happy writing to all!

[Imladris]

I was reading The Chronicles of Narnia and it suddenly occurred to me that you don't really get inside the character's head. You don't hear their thoughts, etc. This is, in my opinion, somewhat true in Tolkien's works as well. You certainly get to know a character better in LotR, but you don't really get inside anybody's head in that story either. So, do you prefer to write grand, historical epics where the story is being told to you, or do you prefer to write stories where there is one character and you draw the reader into his head?

[Lhundulinwen]

For me, it really depends on how many characters are in the story. Like in LOTR, at some points in the story, Gandalf, Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas, Frodo and Sam are all in different places. If made more sense to follow each of the groups up to a certain point and then go back and pick up another group. But if a book has a main character who is withdrawn most of the time, or is alone a lot (without monologues of course) there is no way for the reader to really know what is going on during most of the story. Plus, when you're not in a character's head, you can figure out the other characters personalities without having to see it through there eyes. I once read a book where you root for the main character through most of the book, but at the end you find out she was really a horrible person and leader. It was an odd book.

But then again, when you get into a character's head, you can see where they are coming from a lot better, especially if they are acting unrational on the outside. So, if a character is say, beating up their best friend, for example, you won't know why unless you've seen the action that caused the reaction or the character tells someone why. So, in that case it would be better to be in their heads I think.

[The Mushroom]

Ooooh... I write a bit of fantasy. I guess I like writing fantasy because for me it just comes easiest. I can't see myself writing something like... oh... a historical novel for instance. That's just not what I do. I think Tolkien has influenced my writing a little but not drastically (I don't think).
Anyway, I like it when an author takes their reader "inside the head" of one of the characters. It connects the reader to that character a little more.

[Eowyn Skywalker]

I find it rather annoying to know exactly what the charactes are thinking, and so on, because, with the style of writing that I do, and like reading, it would give too much of the plot away. You really must think on that, to have the characters thoughts would give away plot lines, and then, later on, things wouldn't come as a surprise. Straying away from Lord of the Rings, I will comment on Star Wars here... if, for example, you had known what Darth Vader was thinking on Cloud City , the fact that he was Luke's father would've never came as a shock. (Couldn't think of a LotR example for my point). So, therefore, I dislike first person, and stories that really let you know what's inside the characters mind. I tend to feature around a group of characters, anyhow, so it would be pointless, and would reveal too much to let you know what's on inside their heads.

Just my two cents. Not that I have any sense, nor do I usually make any sense...

-Eowyn Skywalker

[Sirithheruwen]

Well, as you know, my story has four protags. The bulk of the story will be in one of the protag's POV (N.). The rest of the story, though, will be alternating chapters between the other three protags (V., E., and F.)

Well, Ms. Skywalker (too tired to type the whole thing), you say that if you get into the character's heads, you destroy plotlines. Well, that's true, you could destroy the plotlines you were thinking of, but you could also open up new plotlines as well. I could tell you an example from my story, but that would be telling.

Well, that's all folks...
(Well, don't blame me, Ms. Skywalker took the good ending! )

[Imladris]

Usually when you're inside a character's head, it's only one person usually. There are exceptions, of course, for stories with more than one character.

Edit: Yeah mark12_30 *points to mark's post below*, that's what I mean.

[mark12_30]

Immy, I think you mean stories with more than one POV character.

Consider LOTR: POV is Frodo for quite a while til the breaking of the fellowship; Pippin carries POV in Fangorn etc; POV for Paths of the dead etc is Gimli. Also at Breaking of the Fellowship, Frodo's POV lessens, and begins to slowly shift over to Sam, til Sam carries most of it by Cirith Ungol forward.

So we are really "inside" a few minds, not everyone's mind. We never get inside Gandalf's mind that I am aware. Nor Elrond, nor Galadriel... for those people we see and hear, but do not mind-read.

[Firefoot]

From my standpoint, it depends on the story whether you should show character's thoughts and feelings. For some stories, like Eowyn Skywalker pointed out, it destroys the plotline. For other stories it is very beneficial and sometimes even necessary so that the reader can understand what is going on.

Something I always have trouble with as a writer is coming up with names for my characters. I have a great plot in mind but I can't start writing because I can't think of names for the characters and as a result the story either a. doesn't get written or b. has names for characters that I'm not satisfied with. Any suggestions on this?

[Sirithheruwen]

I'm sorry, Firefoot, but I don't know what to say to you. My names come naturally to me, without any trouble at all. I could be sitting in the middle of chemestry or taking a shower, and a name will come to me. I'll scribble it down in my notebook or just say it over and over so I don't forget it. (Once I even wrote a couple names on the back of my algebra test. ) Usually when I think of one or two names, a lot more come after that. That's all I can really say. Sorry.

[Eowyn Skywalker]

(Ms. Skywalker is an ok nickname, do not worry)

Okay, about names... well, it depends on the character. With 'Earthling' characters, I usually give them real names, such as Ann-Marie... but, with fantasy characters, they usually just come to me. There's no trick to finding names, just pull out a name generator, or a name book, or something. For future type names, use the BD name gererator, and the Dwarven last names sometimes work... sometimes. For first names, something short, and zippy sounding works... like Zoe, or Luke... or a plant, or bird sometimes, as in Willow, or Raven... those also work nice for past names. With say Elf names, come up with something that sounds cool, as in Arawyn Telessa, and make up a meaning. Names have always been easy for me, I just make something up, and give it some cool meaning.

That's the best I can give on that idea, is those for tips. Hope I made sense, though I'd rather make dollars...

-Eowyn Skywalker

[Maeggaladiel]

Wow, I wish I could come up with character names as easy as you guys. It takes me forever to think up a good name, and even after I find a name I have to make sure that I really DID make it up. I've had problems with making up character names, only to find that they already exist.

However, I have a list of about thirty five names for pirate ships scribbled on a paper. I was writing a story about pirates, and I needed some ship names. Suddenly, ship names were flying out of my head. I would be doing something completely different, and BAM! A new ship name! If only I needed thirty five ship names. I ended up only using "The Tempest" and "Warhammer" out of the entire list. I'm trying to create new characters so I can use some other names. I've got some cool ones.

[Lathriel]

I usually don't have troubles of making up names however I always have a back-up for when I do get stuck. I printed out about 50 names of the internet and then I pick out ones I like. I change the ones that I like and then it becomes an original name without me having to spend hours to think of the right name.

[Imladris]

I do a few things to discover names.

A. Take a word from a foreign language (Latin and Greek for me normally), and "transform" it into a name.

B. For fantastical names, I try to find odd names -- names that aren't too common, and then spell them differently. Sometimes, I'll scramble letters as well.

As for deciding names: I believe that this is an off shoot of letting the story write itself. Sometimes you just *know* the name of your characters and all's well and dandy. Sometimes, as some of you have expressed, you don't. My recomendation would be to just pick a name you are somewhat satisfied and continue to write using that name. When you finally decide the name of your character, you can go to your word processor and replace the name, etc. However, if you don't like writing a character with an unsatisfactory name (like me), I would recommend to hold off writing the story. I've found that when I force a story, it doesn't work at all.

[Lhundulinwen]

Well, I guess I'm lazy. I finally bought a baby names book. It has foreign names, out of date names, and variations of names. I can take any of the names in the book, and twist them, or put them with regular fiction characters or fantasy characters. I know some writers who use web databases to find names also.

[Enorëiel]

I like to think of myself as a serious fantasy writer but sometimes I wonder...

My biggest problem is the fact that I'm a hard critic on myself. Others look at my work and think it's great but the whole time I'm comparing my work to others and thinking that mine is really pathetic and immature. Anyone else have that problem?

I find my characters' names in a really odd way... I type random letters on the computer until they look authentic, unique, or at least somewhat plausible .

[Eowyn Skywalker]

Oh, do I ever have that problem. I write... and most people think it's good... everyone but me, that is. What I'd like to do is actually find someone else who writes, and is about as good as I am, and then we could send each other's stories back and forth, and actually give advice, and correct, and all that. I am one of my worst cridics (sp?).

Back to names for a moment though, I know what you all mean... tha characters can usually find their own names. One of my characters was origanally called Tiffany, after a friend of mine, and she was meant to be the 'girl' of the group. But, as her character went on, she proved herself unworthy of the name, and so I gave her a new name, an 'elvish' name that suited her better... and so the character just found her new name. My first experience with this 'finding' of names was with a halfy character. He had a name in my first scribbled drafts by hand... he was meant to be evil, and all... I called him Yanindil, or something else like that... but, when I started writing the story on my computer, suddenly the character changed, and he had a new name. It was odd. Names just come to me, and come to the character... like Arawyn Telessa... I made that up on the spot, and yet, I already know what her character will be like. She's a human, one of a seafaring race, and her people are slowly dying out... as the lands are growing, and the seas were she was born are receeding. She is not royal, but has some bloodline leading her to the throne, so, if the persent royals were to die, she would have to take leadership. But she is not that type... she is a free spirit. And that just comes from the sound of her name. (PS: This character just came to me, I won't be using her anywhere, anyhow... anyone can borrow her)

Yeah, that's that. I hope I made some sense... I know I didn't make dollars... sigh.

-Eowyn Skywalker

[Estelyn Telcontar]

When I need names for an RPG, I often take real life names of family and friends and change them to suit the race/people to whom the character belongs. For example, 'Mark' became 'Markal'...

[TheBladeThatWasBroken]

Originally Posted by Morquesse

How did you decide that you wanted to write fantasy? What kind do you write?

Has Tolkien influenced your writing? If so, how?

1. I used to write fanfictions for anime and stuff... it was fun when I first began writing, but as I wrote, the feeling of satisfactory lessened everytime I recall that I didn't create the world that my fanfictions took place in. And after reading Professor Tolkien's works, I've decided that I'm going to write in my own world as well... and that's how I began

2. I think Professor Tolkien has influenced, however little, every fantasy writers' writings... after all, you could call him the Father of Fantasy Fiction.

My problems are that I'm extremely lazy, and I just wish that my stories will come out on paper on their own exactly the way that I had pictured them in my mind, so that I don't have to go through all the grammar and stuff. And my other problem is that, being a non-native speaker, my writing skill isn't at its best... you could probably already caught several grammatical errors in this post itself =_=

Argh, I wish I could write better.

And while we're on the subject of names, I find myself disliking real names. So when coming up with names, I use the widely popular word-manipulating method. Only that I manipulate word roots of different languages, and that the meaning behind those roots will have some relationship to the place/object/person with that name.

For ex. the world in which my story takes place is named "Jahanneth" and it came from the Persian word Jahan which means "the World."

Just in case anyone's interested, here's the site that I use: Behind the Name - Etymology and History of First Names

And that's about the longest post I've posted in the Downs so far =_=...

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Some good, intelligent and helpful discussion here. On the subject of names; It is not names of characters that trouble me, rather names of places.

It is really troubling me. Does anyone else have difficulty with this, as opposed to character names?

[Eowyn Skywalker]

Oh yes, the evil art of place naming. I actually have became more adept at places to people, actually... being as I can follow some basic ideas for them. Now, for planets... that is easy, just come up with a name that's two or three syllables (sp?) long, such as Lanathaá... most are like that... Coruscant... Tatooine... Corriellia... many of the Star Wars planets are like that. Cities, on a fantasy world can contain 'fort' or 'tower' or something else of the like, if it is large... such as Fort Aleaon (made up on the spot). Towns tend to contain desriptive words, that are like the town, village, whatever. Such as Willow Creek, or Two Hills, or Rock Hollows... yeah. Things like that. Forests and mountains are easy to name. Here's my tip for creating a world, and that's to draw a map right off the bat, and come up with names, places, etc. That's what I did... drew a few maps... and now I have *counts on fingers* Akk... I can't even remember all my worlds... heh.

-Eowyn Skywalker

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Oh yes, I love drawing maps! I keep putting off the actual task of writing because I want to refine the maps.

[Lathriel]

What makes naming places for me easier is to look where they are situated on your map. If the place is far north I tend to give it a simple northern name like for example ice town or I look for celtic like names.

If the place is south than I try to find a somewhat southern name.

[Elennar Starfire]

For names, I usually think of someone I know that's like the character I'm trying to name, and scramble up the letters in their name until I get something I like.

Place names are a nightmare...

[Encaitare]

I currently just write fanfiction, but I have a couple of concepts for original fantasy that I'd like to use someday. Of course Tolkien is an influence, being the Master of all things Fantasy, but I only fear that I can never create anything to do my source of inspiration justice. Oh well, I'll give it a shot and see what happens... maybe when the new school year starts and I have plenty of time to slack off.