Feedback and Suggestion Box - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Fordim Hedgethistle · 06-14-2004, 10:23 AM

I do realise that this is probably a 'nothing' post, soon to be deleted by a mod if not by the BW himself, but. . .

I just had a peek at the Who's Online (I admit: I am a stalker -- bad Fordim!) and saw that at the moment there are no fewer than six people viewing the 12 hour old Prologue Thread.

I think that this bodes well for getting people involved!

Bêthberry · 06-14-2004, 11:07 AM

About the attractiveness of short posts, the phantom, I concur. There was a reason why Diamond18 called this place the burra-Downs.

And about the number of times that the more senior (older?) (arthritic?) members of the Downs have read the books: not all of us have read them annually over decades.

I first read LOTR as a furtive, 'guilty pleasure' read for fun to balance my 'required' reading for my studies. Then later as I was slogging my way through translating the Old English works I came to know Tolkien's academic stuff and learnt how much of his writing gives new breath and life to the old language and culture. Four years ago, I reread The Hobbit as preparation for escorting a school class to a live theatre production of The Hobbit (brilliant performance from the actor/gymnast who played Gollem!). Three years ago, at the bedside of an ill relative undergoing painful and extensive medical tests, I reread LOTR and became aware for the first time of how prevalent are the themes of loss and death. Thus, this Chapter by Chapter reading will be only my third reading.

I post in perpetual fear that the "annual readers" will always find some obscure line that will undo me.

*Varda* · 06-16-2004, 02:08 PM

I'm sure more people will begin posting as we go into the actual chapters. I only lately saw that this was happening, and have spent the evening reading the entire thread on the Prologue (not an easy task...) after a long and regretted departure from the forum. (I will try and stay back here, this time!)

As for the discussion being more 'accessible', I really think that depends on the individual reader. While perhaps some members could use less shockingly big words

(that, I confess, do daunt me sometimes) it won't kill some people to pick up a dictionary and look up a word.

Like me.

Just give it a little bit more time, and some more people will drop by to see what's going on.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 06-17-2004, 07:38 AM

Quote:

perhaps some members could use less shockingly big words

Oh, but *Varda*, why go through all the effort of typing up a half dozen different words, when one does the trick so nicely?

Actually, to be more serious about the big word issue... I don't know if this holds true for anybody else, but when I'm speaking or writing, I use whatever word comes to mind, and it rarely occurs to me that somebody may not know what it means. I got accused a couple of weeks ago in class of "giving a definition that needs a definition." I believe I was asked to define 'ubiquitous' and I said 'omnipresent.' It didn't occur to me until I got yelled at by my friends that the teacher was the only person who knew what I meant. So although we can *try* to ease up on the university lingo, a lot of our Big Word Posters may not even realize that they're doing it.

Fingolfin II · 06-19-2004, 11:41 PM

I don't see that using big words is really much of a problem. It's one thing to use a seemingly large word to better describe something, but it's another thing to be verbose and use 'university language' for the sake of using it. I agree with *Varda* that if people don't know the meaning of a word they should take two seconds to look it up in the dictionary.

06-20-2004, 12:52 AM

Feanor of the Peredhi

Very interesting, however, it is the writers job to make themselves understood not the readers job to do so.

Big words do not for intelligence make. Some of the most profound statements in human history are said in very few words and are totally understandable to those of higher and lesser intelligence than the writer

Lalaith · 06-21-2004, 03:23 AM

Hmmm.....but what would Tolkien do?

Should his editor have told him "hey JRR, you can't come out with all this 'begone foul dwimmerlaik' stuff because it's alienating and elitist and in fifty years time a bunch of college kids won't know what the hell you're talking about. What's wrong with simple English - 'beat it you creepy monster'."

This is a forum devoted to the works of a professor of philology. Philology is the study of words but it literally means 'love of language.' If you come across a word you don't understand, in a book or on this forum or anywhere else, do Tolkien the honour of looking it up in a dictionary.
Ok you won't find dwimmerlaik in most dictionaries, I admit,

but the advice holds good otherwise.

06-14-2004, 11:07 AM	#2
Bêthberry Cryptic Aura Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 6,003	A quick comment and a confession About the attractiveness of short posts, the phantom, I concur. There was a reason why Diamond18 called this place the burra-Downs. And about the number of times that the more senior (older?) (arthritic?) members of the Downs have read the books: not all of us have read them annually over decades. I first read LOTR as a furtive, 'guilty pleasure' read for fun to balance my 'required' reading for my studies. Then later as I was slogging my way through translating the Old English works I came to know Tolkien's academic stuff and learnt how much of his writing gives new breath and life to the old language and culture. Four years ago, I reread The Hobbit as preparation for escorting a school class to a live theatre production of The Hobbit (brilliant performance from the actor/gymnast who played Gollem!). Three years ago, at the bedside of an ill relative undergoing painful and extensive medical tests, I reread LOTR and became aware for the first time of how prevalent are the themes of loss and death. Thus, this Chapter by Chapter reading will be only my third reading. I post in perpetual fear that the "annual readers" will always find some obscure line that will undo me. __________________ I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away.

06-16-2004, 02:08 PM	#3
Varda Maiden of Tears Join Date: May 2002 Location: Valinor. Posts: 571	I'm sure more people will begin posting as we go into the actual chapters. I only lately saw that this was happening, and have spent the evening reading the entire thread on the Prologue (not an easy task...) after a long and regretted departure from the forum. (I will try and stay back here, this time!) As for the discussion being more 'accessible', I really think that depends on the individual reader. While perhaps some members could use less shockingly big words (that, I confess, do daunt me sometimes) it won't kill some people to pick up a dictionary and look up a word. Like me. Just give it a little bit more time, and some more people will drop by to see what's going on. __________________ 'It must often be so, Sam, when things are in danger: someone has to give them up, lose them, so that others may keep them' ~Frodo "Life is hard. After all, it kills you." - Katharine Hepburn

06-19-2004, 11:41 PM	#5
Fingolfin II Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Where you want me to be Posts: 1,036	Dictionary.com- the great online dictionary ;-) I don't see that using big words is really much of a problem. It's one thing to use a seemingly large word to better describe something, but it's another thing to be verbose and use 'university language' for the sake of using it. I agree with *Varda* that if people don't know the meaning of a word they should take two seconds to look it up in the dictionary. __________________ Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta.

06-14-2004, 10:23 AM	#1
Fordim Hedgethistle Gibbering Gibbet Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Beyond cloud nine Posts: 1,844	I do realise that this is probably a 'nothing' post, soon to be deleted by a mod if not by the BW himself, but. . . I just had a peek at the Who's Online (I admit: I am a stalker -- bad Fordim!) and saw that at the moment there are no fewer than six people viewing the 12 hour old Prologue Thread. I think that this bodes well for getting people involved!

06-20-2004, 12:52 AM	#6
Arkenstone Guest Posts: n/a	Feanor of the Peredhi Very interesting, however, it is the writers job to make themselves understood not the readers job to do so. Big words do not for intelligence make. Some of the most profound statements in human history are said in very few words and are totally understandable to those of higher and lesser intelligence than the writer

06-21-2004, 03:23 AM	#7
Lalaith Blithe Spirit Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,779	Hmmm.....but what would Tolkien do? Should his editor have told him "hey JRR, you can't come out with all this 'begone foul dwimmerlaik' stuff because it's alienating and elitist and in fifty years time a bunch of college kids won't know what the hell you're talking about. What's wrong with simple English - 'beat it you creepy monster'." This is a forum devoted to the works of a professor of philology. Philology is the study of words but it literally means 'love of language.' If you come across a word you don't understand, in a book or on this forum or anywhere else, do Tolkien the honour of looking it up in a dictionary. Ok you won't find dwimmerlaik in most dictionaries, I admit, but the advice holds good otherwise.