Cellar Door

[Luthien_ Tinuviel]

Now, what interests me is exactly why he considered "cellar door" to be such an illustrious phrase. It does sound quite nice, but I think we must consider the accent he was accustomed to - "cellar door" sounds much better to me as an Englishman would say it than with American pronuciation!

But how did he choose the phrase as an example? I don't suppose we'll ever know, really... and it would be hard to think of a particularly beatiful-sounding word or combination off the top of one's head. Yet I still wonder if there's some sort of a history to his choice.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

sounds much better to me as an Englishman would say it than with American pronuciation

Perhaps that's my problem... I find the only down side of being American is the "Americanization" of the English language. "I don't speak English, I speak American." Well, I say revert to English... it's a prettier language than the garble most people consider speech around here. That and MacDonalds... can't go anywhere without seeing gigantic, mustard yellow, arches glaring at me. But back to my point; how exactly would 'cellar door' be pronounced in English English? I didn't realize it would have that much difference...

Fea

[The Saucepan Man]

Well then, in Welsh, for me *cellar doors* are extraordinarily frequent ...

But wouldn't "cellar door" in Welsh (and indeed Elvish) be pronounced Kellar Door? Hmm, Celedor - a relative of Celeborn, perhaps?

That and MacDonalds... can't go anywhere without seeing gigantic, mustard yellow, arches glaring at me.

Alas, I think that you'll find that's the same the world over these days.

Well, I say revert to English... it's a prettier language than the garble most people consider speech around here.

Well you know what they say - the Americans and the English: a people divided by a common language.

OK, first lesson:

Garbage = Rubbish
Hood = Bonnet
Color = Colour
Sidewalk = Pavement
Apartment = Flat
Movie = Film
Theatre = Cinema

...

Hehe, I could go on for ever ...

[Lalaith]

Saucepan Man, I think Tolkien used "cellar door" there to describe a kind of generic moment of aural appreciation, and he meant that Welsh was full of those kind of 'moments'.
I rarely hear Welsh spoken, but I do love the accent. The English are generally rather snooty and unkind about the Welsh so I'm glad Tolkien sticks up for them.

Rimbaud - hehe, I know what you mean, I got all excited as soon as I saw the words 'cellar door' written on the blackboard...
Mirabella, I too spent some years thinking "seleborn" and "selebrian" to myself, when I read the books. I still find the hard C difficult to remember, particularly "kelebrian" which sounds a bit masculine to me.

[Lalaith]

Oh, and I did actually think of the Barrowdowns while watching the film, even before the 'cellar door' reference...when the school bans the Graham Greene story, I thought of the poor kids on here whose schools censor Tolkien, Harry Potter etc.

[The Saucepan Man]

Saucepan Man, I think Tolkien used "cellar door" there to describe a kind of generic moment of aural appreciation, and he meant that Welsh was full of those kind of 'moments'.

Doh! Sometimes I think that my attempts at (so-called) humour are entirely unsuitable for the internet format, smilies or no smilies. Sorry Lalaith, I did follow Tolkien's reasoning, but was just being impertinent.

The English are generally rather snooty and unkind about the Welsh so I'm glad Tolkien sticks up for them.

As someone with Welsh blood, and despite taking great pride in England, my country of birth, I'm with the Professor on that one.

[Lalaith]

*bows* No, it was me being slow on the uptake. Late night last night, you understand.

[mark12_30]

OK, so Kellar Dewar was Tolkien's favorite "sound". More or less.

So what's yours? What is the word or phrase that you think is prettiest of all? And if you had to invent a language around it, what kind of people would speak the language, and what kind of mythology would they have? Are there any sounds you would leave out entirely? Why?

I'm sure we'll all do this anyway, but of course, your answers should be Tolkien-related. Otherwise count this as food-for-thought.

If your favorite word would make a good springboard for a new Middle-Earth race, language, and mythos, how would it fit in?

You are of course free to create your own language, people, and corresponding mythology as Tolkien himself did; naturally, this thread is not the place to do that. May i recommend the "Are you writing serious fantasy" thread, or perhaps lmp's excellent worldbuilding projects in FaerieWordWeavers.