Tolkien taught in school

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

On the subject of teaching Tolkien, my school does. We have a biannual Trilogy class, that gets switched up with Creative Writing on the off-years. In respect to the time-frame needed to get a good grasp of what you're reading... we begin in September, finish in June, and usually don't manage to read the Appendices, although we do finish the book proper. Requirements for the class are to be serious about examining literature, and you've got to be a fantasy fan (what's the point, otherwise?). It's also happily looked upon if you've already read the books (or I suppose seen the films), thus leaving you with the gist if the stories, before you go detail scouting. Newbies are in no way, shape, or form turned away, and intentional spoilers by the class 'wizards' are received by an immediate and astounding drop in your G.P.A.. The class is fun, the discussions enlightening, and it tends to be an all-around good time, what with the hard-core fans correcting the teacher on small points of little interest (not that I'D happen to be one of those fans... ). Tril. is an elective. On the subject of incorporating the Lord of the Rings into the syllabus of a required English class? I don't like the idea.

As was said before, required reading tends to be looked at negatively by the masses. Just look at the number of you with Macbeth horror stories. My own required reading nightmares included East of Eden, Flowers for Algernon, Of Mice and Men, The Red Pony, and one that I can't remember the title of, that dealt with a slightly mental kid being extremely jealous of his best friend, the plot culminating in said best friend dying because of actions of said mental kid. Those are just a few examples of what I hated, simply because I had no choice in reading them. If I'd read it on my own, I probably would have enjoyed East of Eden at least, if not the others, but if I'd been forced to read LotR? Out of sheer spite and perversity of nature, I'd have no doubt forced myself to find all the flaws available to the scrutinous eyes of an above-average highschool student.

In short... I agree that everybody should read LotR, probably because I'm prejudiced in its favor... but I don't think they should be forced to, regardless of the sixty bijillion awesome qualities that the books possess.

Fea

[Lalwendë]

Alas I don't teach now, I work in an office instead. But, without giving away exactly what I do, it is an office which deals exclusively with education! Teaching scared me at the time. It was the realisation that I was responsible for the futures of all those who I taught. I think I could enjoy it now I'm older, without that thought lurking in the back of my mind too much, but I wouldn't like all the directives and targets that get heaped onto the profession. They stifle teachers and turn schools into little more than exam machines.

I'm intrigued though, it sounds as though some schools in other countries are much larger and so some can give their students the chance to specialise more. I only know of choosing subjects, not areas within a subject, although my own teacher did discuss with us what we would like to study at 'A' Level - which was highly unusual.

I studied Of Mice and Men with the terrible teacher I had. We spent the class time reading aloud in turns, and our homework consisted of twenty comprehension questions to answer on what we had just read. This continued for every lesson. Obviously the whole class soon stopped doing homework and also began to mess about in lessons. That's just one example of a bad teacher making you hate a good book (I like this book now I don't have to do such dull work around it).

What's 6th grade? Is that like Year 6, age 10 to 11?

[Encaitare]

What's 6th grade? Is that like Year 6, age 10 to 11?

Yes indeedy.

I agree with Feanor; we tend to take a cynical or negative view towards almost everything that is required of us, and schoolwork certainly not the least. I know I have begun most books in English class with dread and boredom, and sometimes I've been pleasantly surprised by the material. And it's been the reverse as well: I thought things boded well for "1984" because it had appendices on language (which is always a good thing!) but alas, I didn't like it at all.

I think the Trilogy Class is a great idea though, and it sounds really fun.

In short... I agree that everybody should read LotR, probably because I'm prejudiced in its favor... but I don't think they should be forced to, regardless of the sixty bijillion awesome qualities that the books possess.

Yes, and plus we'd be forced to answer study guide questions on them, and write essays (although the essays I wouldn't mind)... isn't it interesting how the things we gripe about in English class (having to read, reread, and analyze till the sun goes down) are currently going on over at the Chapter-by-chapter section of the books forum, all by our own free will?

[Morsul the Dark]

I enjoy writing essays and anallysing literature, all parts and books. it depends on the type of teacher you get as well... I certainly would hate English it werent for my last three english teachers. (Ms. S., Mr.C,(had 2 years in a row ) and Mrs C.)

Flowers for Algernon- read that with Miss S. it was excellent I liked it
Of Mice and Men -only read an excerpt but seemed good
Beowulf-Loved it
The Odyssey- Awesome

Well no need for me to go on with all the books Ive read over the past 4 years I will say however that Tolkien's works even if it isn't LOTR are very useful in lessons. Fea I envy you, you have the best school, The only Author Friendly class we have is Shakespeare I and ShakespeareII, I joined them but I guess not enough students were interested so they dropped the class Mr. C was going to teach it as well...(If you hadn't noticed Mr. C. is probably my favorite teacher at my school)

[Encaitare]

Flowers for Algernon depressed me. I'm not sure what the curriculum is for this year, but I'm pretty sure we'll be reading Beowulf (yay! I read it already! ) and Canterbury Tales. I didn't really enjoy the Odyssey, although I am sure I would have if I'd read it on my own. Has anyone else noticed that the prose versions of epic poems are never as good?

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Fea I envy you, you have the best school

Fea hastily hides an outburst of laughter behind a fake-sounding cough.

I assure you, it's not that great. I love my school, if only because familiarity breeds content, and I tend to get preferential treatment (teachers' pet and all that) even if I niether try nor ask for it. However... it is the teachers who make or break a school or class. I do not like my Tril teacher. I know perfectly well that she pushes her "more promising" students harder, but when she hands me back a paper that is far better than anything else people scratched out in an hour, with red marks, cross-outs, side notes, and a big fat C on top... it's hard to remind myself that she is making me a better writer when my G.P.A. suffers for it. Or perhaps she knows that I write what I know will get a certain grade and no further, so I can concentrate my efforts on writing that I care more about... I hope not, otherwise my grades would plummet. Oh wait... I have Mr. D this year instead! I'm looking forward to Hamlet, and I'm told that D gives weekly journal topics to write on. That should be excellent. Anyhow, to stay on topic... I think it is the perversity of most teenagers to want to rebel against most things school-related (admit it, you've been annoyed with assignments as well, simply because they don't let you choose), so by forcing LotR into curriculum... no doubt we would be, in essense, forcing teens to dislike it.

Fea

[Morsul the Dark]

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

(admit it, you've been annoyed with assignments as well, simply because they don't let you choose), so by forcing LotR into curriculum... no doubt we would be, in essense, forcing teens to dislike it.

Fea

Yes as in business class hated the charles linbergh assignment(we were studying criminal law i know of you went Lindbergh...business ????? )

But I do suppose it is natural for students to rebel against whats forced on them

teachers' pet and all that

ah yes I know this one as well math class...0 homework average(I detest homework! ) my highest quiz grade 75 got a C+ ask me how that works and I'm stumped. Math used to be my best subject but as has been stated the teacher is a big part and my teacher had a very heavgy accent and had a bogus teaching method.


To stay on topic:Perhaps we don't need new literature although it would help but perhaps more fun assignments to go along with the literature we learn.

[InklingElf]

Originally Posted by Encaitare

Yes indeedy.

I agree with Feanor; we tend to take a cynical or negative view towards almost everything that is required of us, and schoolwork certainly not the least. I know I have begun most books in English class with dread and boredom, and sometimes I've been pleasantly surprised by the material. And it's been the reverse as well: I thought things boded well for "1984" because it had appendices on language (which is always a good thing!) but alas, I didn't like it at all.

Enca thanks for mentioning 1984 and am sorry you didn't enjoy it (may I ask why not?) but I love being an Orwellian!!! hehehehe.

I just hate having to read at the same pace with a class -- which I think is the main thing alot of us lose interest in alot of these amazing books.

[gorthaur_cruel]

My only reservation, and it is quite a big one, is that frequently students grow to hate any literature studied at school, and as a Tolkien fan, I would hate this to happen.

Too true. Before I knew Tolkien, my sister studied The Hobbit in 7th grade. I even remember her acting out Riddles in the Dark. Well, anyway, she detested it. She came home and told me what a horrible book she's studying in school, so I naturally thought, "what a bad book it must be". Some years later, my mom said I should try reading LotR, as it was when FotR was first released and LotR craze was on. I actually refused, remembering how my sister convinced me that the Hobbit was a bad book. Well, my mom just made me try it, and there's enough said

[Gorwingel]

Well it is interesting that this thread was the first one that I saw when I logged on to the B-D's from a brand new location... college

Because today I have been thinking a lot about the dear professor, and the literature that I am required to read in school.

Today I went to buy my books ($$$$), and in one of my classes I had to purchase nine different books. Including Beowulf, The Canterbury Tales, and an anthology that includes British Literature from the Middle Ages to the present (But alas no LOTR).

I am excited, but kind of scared. I am just hoping that I will enjoy the novels, and that maybe as an added bonus it will help me to understand Tolkien and his works a little more

No Tolkien classes at my school (which is to note a Catholic college), but if we had one I of course would be one of the first to sign up. I do wish that they did include LOTR a little more in school. I doubt it would be detramental to it's popularity, just because it is such a popular book with such die hard fans who already desire to know as much about it as they possibly can (It would have to be a elective class in my opinion).

[Morsul the Dark]

You will enjoy them I am sure rest assured Beowulf and the Cantebury Tales are excellent works, I myself did plenty of extracredit reports and analyseses on both.

Secondly congradulations for getting into college. I hope to be in college next year.

I do agree with inkling the biggest thing holding back good literature is the seperate paces of reading and comprehension. Its like a drive through window in a fast food place(dont worry this has a point) t's a bit high for cars and yet a little low for SUVs

Thats how the reading pace is in schools too low for the more literate and book oriented folk and a bit high for those who already arent fond of reading.

[Child of the 7th Age]

Tolkien seems to be creeping into the university syllabus a bit more of late. Just two examples. I live in Houston and Jane Chance teaches at Rice University. (She has written several books on Tolkien.) She is a specialist in medieval lit and normally teaches LotR every other spring. Enrollment is said to be strong. I assume similar courses exist at other colleges where there are professors who have written about LotR or Tolkien.

This summer, we were searching for a "pre-college" program for a member of our family. This is where a high school student goes to a college campus and spends anywhere from 2-6 weeks in classes taught by university professors. That way, the student gets a better idea what college classes are like and also campus life. Generally, the student takes no more than one or two classes. I noticed several schools with classes focusing on Tolkien. The best one seemed to be at the University of Chicago. The course sounded fascinating. Unfortunately, I don't think I can pass myself off as a pre-college student so I am unlikely to get in!

In both the situations above, the classes are elective: students enroll because they have a particular interest in the subject. I think this is far preferable to making Tolkien "required reading" in required classes. That's where you are apt to turn folk off.

There are ways to incorporate Tolkien in classes like this. Quite often, there may be a paper or presentation where students select books from a particular list. If the book is presented as an option, but not a requirement, I think the results will be far more positive. This happened at my daughter's middle school in 5th grade. She was able to read The Hobbit as an AR (Advanced Reading) book, which she did. She now has the option of any of the three volumes of LotR as well. My son's high school is considering a Tolkien course as part of winterim (a two-week period after Christmas break when the regular curriculum is dropped and all students are given the chance to focus on three elective courses.) So, bit by bit, Tolkien is creeping into the curriculum, although often through the back door and generally not part of basic, required classes.