The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Books
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-25-2004, 10:53 PM   #1
Legolas
A Northern Soul
 
Legolas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Valinor
Posts: 1,847
Legolas has just left Hobbiton.
The difference is the manner in which they failed. Saruman not only abandoned the mission, he turned against it - i.e. taking an active part for the opposite side. The other three simply ignored their mission (unless the Blue Wizards turned evil also).

Tolkien is actually the one who said that:

Quote:
Indeed, of all the Istari, one only remained faithful.
Hard to argue with him
__________________
...take counsel with thyself, and remember who and what thou art.

Last edited by Legolas; 09-25-2004 at 10:59 PM.
Legolas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2004, 07:05 AM   #2
Gurthang
Sword of Spirit
 
Gurthang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Oh, I'm around.
Posts: 1,401
Gurthang has just left Hobbiton.
Tolkien

Ah..... Very true. Thank you.
__________________
I'm on a Mission from God.
Gurthang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-26-2004, 08:05 AM   #3
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,521
Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
1420!

Maybe this belongs in the thread about Fate, but you can argue each Istari also had it's own personal quest, or maybe not "personal" maybe, it was just "fate" that it happened the way it did.

For example, Saruman represented Aule, and of course, he got greedy, and it's only natural he would lust for power, or money...etc. I mean Dwarves and Noldor both also from Aule, would greed for power or money, then we have Sauron, most like Aule, greedy. So if you get the point, I think "fate" is definately playing a role with the Istari.

Then we have Radagast, representing Yavanna, so it's only natural that Radagast would fall in love with the birds and nature. Again, is this fate? Or did Yavanna tell Radagast to tend the birds/nature of Middle-Earth.

Lastly, Gandalf, not really representing any Valar, but most closely represents Manwe, so it's only natural that he would succeed in the Istari's "task."
__________________
Fenris Penguin
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2004, 03:19 AM   #4
Gothbogg the Ripper
Wight
 
Gothbogg the Ripper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southend,U.K
Posts: 113
Gothbogg the Ripper has just left Hobbiton.
The Eye

Did Radagast not fufil his mission because he sent Gandalf to Saruman? Does this count as an act of treachery?
__________________
Thanks for abandoning me for three years guys. I really enjoyed being a total outcast.
Gothbogg the Ripper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2004, 04:19 AM   #5
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,521
Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.Boromir88 is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
1420!

I wouldn't say so, Radagast did not know that Saruman had turned evil, all he knew is that Saruman wanted to see Gandalf, Saruman is a persuasive talker after all. Gandalf said if he had sensed something wrong with Radagast he wouldn't have gone, or would have went to Orthanc more warily, so Radagast was just relaying a message, wasn't trying to get Gandalf killed.
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2004, 07:54 AM   #6
radagastly
Shade of Carn Dûm
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Washington, D. C., USA
Posts: 299
radagastly is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
I think my living namesake (Radagast) failed because he did not actively campaign against Sauron. Yes, he probably sent the Eagle Gwaihir to Orthanc when Gandalf was there, but it was not intended as a rescue because he did not know that Gandalf was in trouble. He may also have sent them to the battle before the Black Gate, if he even knew about it, but they may well have gone there on their own, seeing the battle from high above and joining in. Regardless, Radagast would have been considered a failure in his mission because he did not go himself, he took no active steps against Sauron.
__________________
But all the while I sit and think of times there were before,
I listen for returning feet and voices at the door.
radagastly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2004, 04:01 PM   #7
Keeper of Dol Guldur
Shade of Carn Dûm
 
Keeper of Dol Guldur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: 315, CNY Boys and girls.
Posts: 405
Keeper of Dol Guldur has just left Hobbiton.
Re:

I did a lot of thinking on this topic back in my post, "Of Radagast" or "Radagast the Brown" or whatever I named it. "Success of the Wizards", that's what it was called.

I've always, ALWAYS been under the assumption that Radagast wasn't exactly idle over there in Wilderland, and almost certainly (living so near) played a large role in the rise of the Beornings, keeping the Misty Mountains goblin-free, spying on Dol Goldur (also something he was quite close to), communicating with the elven wardens on the borders of Lothlorien, maintaining the levels of spiders in the forest and preventing them from spreading as much as possible, helping the woodmen, lakemen, Dale-men, and dwarves of the mountain as much as possible.

It's pretty clear that he kept his ears open and relayed a lot of information back and forth via his friendship with all the eagles and other birds (ravens, thrushes), thereby preparing the whole of Wilderland for war (which did indeed come to them).

I think he was probably asked to join the White Council, even if he declined, but as such, I think he completed his task as far as combatting Sauron.

It seems like each wizard sort of picked an area, or group to assist in their cunning, wizardly ways, and stuck with them using the best means to do so depending on each area of the map.

Gandalf went big name, acting as counsellor to all Numenor related lands (Gondor, Arnor) and was associated frequently with elves of all variety, but none more than the Deep Elves, lords like Elrond.

The other two wizards went east.

Radagast set up shop in Wilderland.

Anyway, it seems clear that being a sort of 'cousin' to Radagast was how Gandalf thought he could earn the alliance of Beorn - a chief among Wilderland's people. Which would mean, that Radagast's name precedes him in those lands as a reliable counsellor and ally, much like Gandalf's did all over his territories (of course, like Eomer mentioned, it was no longer the key to Theoden's favor).

I covered it VERY extensively in my Radagast topic, which can be found here;

http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=2094
__________________
"I come from yonder...Have you seen Baggins? Baggins has left, he is coming. He is not far away. I wish to find him. If he passes will you tell me? I will come back with gold." - Khamul the Easterling
Keeper of Dol Guldur is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:41 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.