Zep's Stairway and Tolkien - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

turgon · 11-01-2004, 07:20 PM

Battle of evermore... could not be about anything but JrrT's world. Despite what Robert Plant said. There is another song in which Plant names gollum but I can't remember the title

Sapphire_Flame · 11-01-2004, 08:14 PM

Quote:

There's a feeling I get when I look to the west,
And my spirit is crying for leaving.
In my thoughts I have seen rings of smoke through the trees,
And the voices of those who stand looking.

That verse always reminds me of Frodo, after the quest. *sigh*

I agree that the song is not about LotR. But that's not to say that it couldn't have been influenced by it somewhat, even unintentionally. Be honest: how many people have written a poem, or drawn something, that when you looked at the finished product you find connections to things that you love, even if that's not what the piece is about? That may be some of the case with "Stairway".

"Battle of Evermore" is a great song about LotR, and the Battle of the Pelennor Field in particular. I know there's a site somewhere that analyzes the similarities, but the address escapes me at the moment. *headdesk* >.< Anyone else know it?

Abedithon le,

~ Saphy ~

Encaitare · 11-01-2004, 09:41 PM

Here are a couple of good links:

Zeppelin and Tolkien Relations Page -- This site asserts that Stariway to Heaven is not LotR-related

LedTolkien.com -- all too short, but it makes some good connections

I myself am not nearly as brushed up on my Led as I should be... I must make a note to save my pennies and buy an album.

As for Blind Guardian, their Nightfall in Middle Earth CD doesn't make just references to LotR, but it's the Silmarillion, rock opera style. Very hardcore. I'm not sure about their other albums, though.

Estelyn Telcontar · 11-02-2004, 01:19 AM

[Tongue-in-cheek]"rings of smoke" is an obvious reference to Gandalf!

And "our shadows taller than our soul" comes from one of Tolkien's 'minor' works, Smith of Wootton Major, in which Smith's shadow is giant-sized after he comes back from Faery.[/Tongue-in-cheek]

Morgul Queen · 11-02-2004, 09:06 PM

*grins* Why do you think I love the Nightfall in Middle-earth album so much?

Time Stands Still (At The Iron Hill) is very good. But while we're on the subject, Pink Floyd has at least one Tolkien referance, but I can't remember the song.

Ah well, there's nothing for it. *grabs Echoes and starts listening while her mother yell for her to 'Turn That Racket Down!'*

Lalwendë · 11-03-2004, 02:13 PM

I've had to go and get my copy of Led Zep 'bible' Hammer of the Gods (title drawn from the masterpiece Immigrant Song)by Stephen Davis, to copy a quote; Tolkien is not mentioned as an inspiration for the song, although Plant appears to have been reading much mythology at the time. The book says:

Quote:

Robert had been pouring through the works of the British antiquarian Lewis Spence. He later cited Spence's "Magic Arts in Celtic Britain" as one of the sources for the lyrics to "Stairway".

The interesting thing is that so many people associate the song with Tolkien, I always did until I read that passage, and still do - that kind of idea doesn't go away easily. Jimmy Page apparently said that Plant wrote most of the lyrics "on the spot" - so they must have a stream of consciousness quality about them.

Anyway, here is a quote from the author of the book that 'Downers might like:

Quote:

Stairway to Heaven seemed like an invitation to abandon the new traditions and follow the old gods. It expressed an ineffable yearning for spiritual transformation deep in the hearts of the generation for which it was intended.

Strangely, this expresses my feelings about reading Tolkien!

Bêthberry · 11-03-2004, 02:38 PM

*comes walking out of the land of ice and snow and takes her tongue out of her cheek*

What would be the reason for Zep to use the Tolkien allusions? I mean, what are the similarities between his world and vision and that of the pounding sound of Led Zep? Or are they just tapping into some kind of northern heroic ideal, guy-type stuff?

Edit: I mean, other than a use of very vague allegorical references which ignore some of the more contemporary allusions which Tolkien would likely not condone. What I am getting at, in a very inellegant way, is, is there anything specific to Tolkien about the allusions or are they just similar images out of a celtic past? I am trying to distinguish between, say, fantasy and Tolkien fantasy.

InklingElf · 11-03-2004, 06:28 PM

I apologize for being so abrupt but I would think Led Zepp would be one of the numerous bands in the 60s-70s that was influenced by Tolkien so it is natural for their lyrics to have references to his books no matter how vague the explanation for such a reference to exist within the song.

Someone mentioned "Battle of Evermore" -- I think this song is more into this "fantasy motif" than "Stairway to Heaven" and in my opinion my opinion is probably a little ode to Mr.Tolkien and his own genre of fantasy.

11-01-2004, 07:20 PM	#1
turgon Haunting Spirit Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Annagroth Posts: 57	Battle of evermore... could not be about anything but JrrT's world. Despite what Robert Plant said. There is another song in which Plant names gollum but I can't remember the title __________________ "What I have left behind I count now no loss, needless baggage on the road it has proved. Let those that cursed my name, curse me still, and whine their way back to the cages" " MIGHT IS RIGHT, DISSENT IS INTOLERABLE"

11-02-2004, 01:19 AM	#4
Estelyn Telcontar Princess of Skwerlz Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles) Posts: 7,500	[Tongue-in-cheek]"rings of smoke" is an obvious reference to Gandalf! And "our shadows taller than our soul" comes from one of Tolkien's 'minor' works, Smith of Wootton Major, in which Smith's shadow is giant-sized after he comes back from Faery.[/Tongue-in-cheek] __________________ 'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...'

11-02-2004, 09:06 PM	#5
Morgul Queen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dontgonearthe Castle Posts: 414	grins Why do you think I love the Nightfall in Middle-earth album so much? Time Stands Still (At The Iron Hill) is very good. But while we're on the subject, Pink Floyd has at least one Tolkien referance, but I can't remember the song. Ah well, there's nothing for it. grabs Echoes* and starts listening while her mother yell for her to 'Turn That Racket Down!'* __________________ Athrabeth is still doing the wave for Boromir the Disco-King Oh...and call me Morgy!

11-03-2004, 02:38 PM	#7
Bêthberry Cryptic Aura Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 6,003	Jimmy's reason why, or, Let me Plant this question. comes walking out of the land of ice and snow and takes her tongue out of her cheek What would be the reason for Zep to use the Tolkien allusions? I mean, what are the similarities between his world and vision and that of the pounding sound of Led Zep? Or are they just tapping into some kind of northern heroic ideal, guy-type stuff? Edit: I mean, other than a use of very vague allegorical references which ignore some of the more contemporary allusions which Tolkien would likely not condone. What I am getting at, in a very inellegant way, is, is there anything specific to Tolkien about the allusions or are they just similar images out of a celtic past? I am trying to distinguish between, say, fantasy and Tolkien fantasy. __________________ I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away. Last edited by Bêthberry; 11-03-2004 at 03:37 PM. Reason: just some more thoughts.

11-01-2004, 09:41 PM	#3
Encaitare Bittersweet Symphony Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: On the jolly starship Enterprise Posts: 1,814	Here are a couple of good links: Zeppelin and Tolkien Relations Page -- This site asserts that Stariway to Heaven is not LotR-related LedTolkien.com -- all too short, but it makes some good connections I myself am not nearly as brushed up on my Led as I should be... I must make a note to save my pennies and buy an album. As for Blind Guardian, their Nightfall in Middle Earth CD doesn't make just references to LotR, but it's the Silmarillion, rock opera style. Very hardcore. I'm not sure about their other albums, though.

11-03-2004, 06:28 PM	#8
InklingElf Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 402	I apologize for being so abrupt but I would think Led Zepp would be one of the numerous bands in the 60s-70s that was influenced by Tolkien so it is natural for their lyrics to have references to his books no matter how vague the explanation for such a reference to exist within the song. Someone mentioned "Battle of Evermore" -- I think this song is more into this "fantasy motif" than "Stairway to Heaven" and in my opinion my opinion is probably a little ode to Mr.Tolkien and his own genre of fantasy.