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Laconic Loreman
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I wonder if Tolkien met to create these parallels, or not, but I've thought of the connections between this chapter, and the previous chapter. Previous chapter, Aragorn and Eomer beging to form this long lasting friendship, and a long lasting friendship between their respected kingdoms, Gondor and Rohan. In the Uruk-hai chapter we get to see how good the two bad guys work together, Sauron and Saruman. Sauron's Northerners vs. Sarumans Uruk-hai, and it doesn't work out as well. I think this stresses the fact that the "evil" forces aren't united, the orc frays that break out between the Northerners and Isengarders, show that they don't trust one another, and are plotting to undermine eachother while trying to fight the "good" side. The "good" side unites in the previous chapter, and now Gondor has a willing ally in Rohan, and vice-versa.
We also get a sense that Eru is watching this struggle from above. Quote:
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Fenris Penguin
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Illustrious Ulair
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
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This chapter struck me on my first reading as a kind of ‘linking chapter’, simply a way of accounting for Merry & Pippin’s necessary appearance in Fangorn, but obviously there’s much more than that going on. This is the first (only?) time in the whole legendarium where we see Orcs as more than simple ‘monsters’. We see, for instance, that they aren’t simply stupid thugs (well, not all them).
Forgive this long quote from Brian Rosebury’s Tolkien: A Cultural Phenomenon: Quote:
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This shows how wrong critics like the ones mentioned by Rosebury are: ‘critics who have convinced themselves that the Orcs’ malign utterances betray Tolkien’s disdain for ‘mere working people’’ (ie John Carey in the Listener). These orcs are not members of the uneducated ‘working class’; they are educated thugs. Why is it necessary for Tolkien to make this so clear - possibly because we are about to witness the wholesale slaughter of these creatures by our ‘heroes’, but more likely because Tolkien wants us to understand the real nature of ‘Evil’ - that Evil is not something that arises from ignorance, from not really knowing what you’re doing. Evil beings in Middle earth areaware of what they’re doing, & its that very awareness, that deliberate infliction of suffering on others in full consciousness, that makes it necessary for our ‘heroes’ to stand against them - its a moral necessity to oppose that evil. This chapter brings that home - there can be no sympathy for the ‘bad guys’ from now on. This isn’t a battle between two groups, both of whom are ‘morally ‘equal’ but on opposite sides’. The ‘Evil’ side is not ‘Evil’ simply because its the side our ‘heroes’ are fighting - its not an ‘abusive’ label they’ve applied to their enemy. The Evil side is Evil, & there is a moral imperative in operation. |
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Deadnight Chanter
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With a proviso - some orks are not only intelligent, but have free will as well. I suppose that almost all named orks in the story fall under latter category - i.e. Grishnakh, Gorbag, Shagrat, Ugluk (the latter more so, as, allegedly, he's a 'man-ork' (or ork-man)). And such a proviso brings a loadful of difficulties about. But about difficulties, later.
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Egroeg Ihkhsal - Would you believe in the love at first sight? - Yes I'm certain that it happens all the time! |
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A Mere Boggart
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: under the bed
Posts: 4,737
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This chapter tells us something of the nature of Hobbits. In dire circumstances, being abducted by a band of creatures straight out of a Hobbiton fireside horror story, Merry and Pippin still manage to show how brave they are. Boromir 88 has already noted how clever Hobbits can be, so I won't go over that again, but I also noticed what strength of character Hobbits can show.
Here Pippin is afraid and in pain, but he has the presence of mind instead to focus on what is going on about him and listen to what the orcs are saying: Quote:
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Gordon's alive!
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#5 | |||
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Laconic Loreman
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I also wanted to note again Boromir's horn, we first got a description in Moria.
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Lastly I wanted to point out the power of the lembas. Reminds me a lot of what we discussed in the Lothlorien chapter. Quote:
Pippin was the first to come back to the present.
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Fenris Penguin
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Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: The World That Never Was
Posts: 1,232
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My resounding memory of this chapter is racing out of the theatre to read it after seeing Fellowship for the first time! I'd not finished reading Fellowship yet, and was very distressed at seeing my favourite characters being carted off by a pack of Uruk-hai. Since then, this chapter has been a favourite of mine.
![]() I whole-heartedly agree with Lalwendë on all counts. This chapter certainly shows the inate strength and tenacity possessed by all hobbits. (And proof to all the fangirls who don't appreciate Merry and Pippin! )Quote:
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![]() Abedithon le, ~ Saphy ~
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The Hitchhiking Ghost |
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#7 | |
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Regal Dwarven Shade
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,593
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That is about as final and desperate as it gets.
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...finding a path that cannot be found, walking a road that cannot be seen, climbing a ladder that was never placed, or reading a paragraph that has no... |
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