So, Best and Worst Characters? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Mithalwen · 12-29-2004, 02:39 PM

Although I love Christopher Lee, until I watched the EE this morning I thought that he had missed the "seductive" aspect to his voice but he captured it perfectly. I wish they had had more of the "we will have peace scene" - For me the acid test is whether film image has "overwritten" my mental image from the books and radio version. In many cases it has - Boromir, Galadriel, Elrond, , Theoden, Eomer and despite initial misgivingsMerry and Pippin & Aragorn and Eowyn. Gimli, Gandalf are neutrals ..... the cracks of doom scene made me forgive "sam and Frodo" a lot but I reaqlly think they played Frodo to young and Sam too fat... (and for me Ian Holm and Bill Nighy are just perfect in the radio version). However Faramir, Denethor and Arwen ...................... nnnoooooooooooooooooo Faramir - the part was awful rather than the actor and the same with Denethor ... what ever Denethor's mental state I am sure his table manners would not allowed him to slurp his food like that. And Arwen .... too wooden, too trout pouty, too irritating...

Gurthang · 12-29-2004, 03:39 PM

I agree with Boromir and King of the North.

When I first saw this post, I was thinking Denethor for the worst character. His potrayal was horrible. From the books, I thought him a once kind man who had been driven mad with despair. The movies made him wholly evil. Even in the flashback with Boromir, Faramir and him in Osgiliath, he was a complete jerk! He did have some good lines, but helik a manicdepressant most of the time. You'd turn your head and he'd change from a grieving father to a power-hungry psycho. It was ridiculous.

But after reading King's post, I agree that Legolas is worse. His image was really good in FotR, but was just bad the last two. Seriously, even if the uber-stunts weren't bad enough, he had this whole overplayed I'm-better-than-Gimli-in-everything attitude .

Now, on a better note, I personally thought that Viggo Mortensen did an excellent job playing Aragorn. He at first appeared as a simple ranger who had given up who he might become. But slowly he realized that his path was leading him to a kingship. And as he grasped that role, I thought he really did a good job of taking control of the plot.

BTW, I thought Gimli's character was hilarious in RotK, if somewhat unrealistic.

Boromir88 · 12-29-2004, 04:00 PM

The only thing that gets me from not choosing Denethor, is John Noble's acting. I put aside my own personal view of Denethor (from what I learned from the books) and I just said, John Noble plays a wonderful scum bag. However, I agree with Mith, I think the food shoveling is just over the top. I don't care how evil PJ makes Denethor, it's unnecessary to make the guy a slob too. My view is, I still have my view of Denethor from the books, the movies don't change that, the movies are purely entertainment, and since Noble did such a great performance, and a guy that you too would want to hit with a staff if you had it, then I give a thumbs up to him.

Tuor of Gondolin · 12-29-2004, 05:04 PM

As has been noted above, there are a remarkable number of good
characters/portrayals in the movies. While Gandalf and Boromir (among others)are well acted and the casting by PJ and friends was good I'd say Eowyn, partly because I had significant doubts that the character could be adequately portrayed in the movies.

The worst must again be mentioned, Denethor!
While not depicted in the book as kindly (ala Theoden) I see him as more
a tragic hero, flawed but dedicated to Gondor, and to some extent, the West as a whole. Although in one of his Letters JRRT takes a surprisingly negative view
of Denethor. His movie bits were awful not just as a one-dimentional "crazy"
but for the ridiculous Gandalf/Denethor interactions.

Morgul Queen · 12-29-2004, 07:51 PM

Denethor got some of the best lines in the EE *happy sigh* but, as much as I love him, I have to nominate Théoden for best character in the movie. I love the look on his face when he sees Ol' Witchy swoop down towards him, I love his lines, I love his armor and I especially love his sword.

*giggles* But, and I bet you saw this coming a mile off, Legolas for worst. the horrible lines ("A Diversion!" Gee, ya think? *lightbulb*), the stilted acting (Is it too much to ask to have some emotion and variation in his speech? When the extras are better actors than you are something has to be up), that blimmin' scene with the Mumuk, pure cheese there!

*groans*

But to the new Denethor lines I have only one thing to say:

Neurion · 01-01-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

The only thing that gets me from not choosing Denethor, is John Noble's acting. I put aside my own personal view of Denethor (from what I learned from the books) and I just said, John Noble plays a wonderful scum bag. However, I agree with Mith, I think the food shoveling is just over the top. I don't care how evil PJ makes Denethor, it's unnecessary to make the guy a slob too.

Actually, I don't think his table manners are that bad by medieval standards.

Boromir88 · 01-01-2005, 09:39 PM

Come on now, I think PJ just has an obsession of slobbish eaters. Take FOTR, with PJ's cameo, bites into a carrot and belches. TTT, Gimli stuffing his face full in Theoden's hall (I seriously doubt a dwarf would do that, especially in a king's hall, oh yeah then Gimli belches). Then ROTK, a steward spitting cherry juice, and chomping while Pippin's singing, highly inappropriate for a steward surely.

Neurion · 01-01-2005, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Come on now, I think PJ just has an obsession of slobbish eaters. Take FOTR, with PJ's cameo, bites into a carrot and belches. TTT, Gimli stuffing his face full in Theoden's hall (I seriously doubt a dwarf would do that, especially in a king's hall, oh yeah then Gimli belches). Then ROTK, a steward spitting cherry juice, and chomping while Pippin's singing, highly inappropriate for a steward surely.

Three instances do not an obsession make.

Eomer of the Rohirrim · 01-02-2005, 01:02 PM

Regarding Elves, I think that they were made to be so beautiful because, well, they are more beautiful than Men in general. Fact.

The femininity is shining through because females are arguably more beautiful than males.

I thought Legolas and Haldir looked really good. There were other aspects of the characters that brought them down, especially dialogue in Leggy's case!

12-29-2004, 02:39 PM	#1
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,461	Although I love Christopher Lee, until I watched the EE this morning I thought that he had missed the "seductive" aspect to his voice but he captured it perfectly. I wish they had had more of the "we will have peace scene" - For me the acid test is whether film image has "overwritten" my mental image from the books and radio version. In many cases it has - Boromir, Galadriel, Elrond, , Theoden, Eomer and despite initial misgivingsMerry and Pippin & Aragorn and Eowyn. Gimli, Gandalf are neutrals ..... the cracks of doom scene made me forgive "sam and Frodo" a lot but I reaqlly think they played Frodo to young and Sam too fat... (and for me Ian Holm and Bill Nighy are just perfect in the radio version). However Faramir, Denethor and Arwen ...................... nnnoooooooooooooooooo Faramir - the part was awful rather than the actor and the same with Denethor ... what ever Denethor's mental state I am sure his table manners would not allowed him to slurp his food like that. And Arwen .... too wooden, too trout pouty, too irritating... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

12-29-2004, 03:39 PM	#2
Gurthang Sword of Spirit Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Oh, I'm around. Posts: 1,401	I agree with Boromir and King of the North. When I first saw this post, I was thinking Denethor for the worst character. His potrayal was horrible. From the books, I thought him a once kind man who had been driven mad with despair. The movies made him wholly evil. Even in the flashback with Boromir, Faramir and him in Osgiliath, he was a complete jerk! He did have some good lines, but helik a manicdepressant most of the time. You'd turn your head and he'd change from a grieving father to a power-hungry psycho. It was ridiculous. But after reading King's post, I agree that Legolas is worse. His image was really good in FotR, but was just bad the last two. Seriously, even if the uber-stunts weren't bad enough, he had this whole overplayed I'm-better-than-Gimli-in-everything attitude . Now, on a better note, I personally thought that Viggo Mortensen did an excellent job playing Aragorn. He at first appeared as a simple ranger who had given up who he might become. But slowly he realized that his path was leading him to a kingship. And as he grasped that role, I thought he really did a good job of taking control of the plot. BTW, I thought Gimli's character was hilarious in RotK, if somewhat unrealistic. __________________ I'm on a Mission from God.

12-29-2004, 05:04 PM	#4
Tuor of Gondolin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Pennsylvania, WtR, passed Sarn Gebir: Above the rapids (1239 miles) BtR, passed Black Rider Stopping Place (31 miles) Posts: 1,548	As has been noted above, there are a remarkable number of good characters/portrayals in the movies. While Gandalf and Boromir (among others)are well acted and the casting by PJ and friends was good I'd say Eowyn, partly because I had significant doubts that the character could be adequately portrayed in the movies. The worst must again be mentioned, Denethor! While not depicted in the book as kindly (ala Theoden) I see him as more a tragic hero, flawed but dedicated to Gondor, and to some extent, the West as a whole. Although in one of his Letters JRRT takes a surprisingly negative view of Denethor. His movie bits were awful not just as a one-dimentional "crazy" but for the ridiculous Gandalf/Denethor interactions. __________________ Aure Entuluva!

12-29-2004, 07:51 PM	#5
Morgul Queen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dontgonearthe Castle Posts: 414	Denethor got some of the best lines in the EE happy sigh but, as much as I love him, I have to nominate Théoden for best character in the movie. I love the look on his face when he sees Ol' Witchy swoop down towards him, I love his lines, I love his armor and I especially love his sword. giggles But, and I bet you saw this coming a mile off, Legolas for worst. the horrible lines ("A Diversion!" Gee, ya think? lightbulb), the stilted acting (Is it too much to ask to have some emotion and variation in his speech? When the extras are better actors than you are something has to be up), that blimmin' scene with the Mumuk, pure cheese there! groans But to the new Denethor lines I have only one thing to say: __________________ Athrabeth is still doing the wave for Boromir the Disco-King Oh...and call me Morgy!

01-02-2005, 01:02 PM	#9
Eomer of the Rohirrim Auspicious Wraith Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 4,859	Regarding Elves, I think that they were made to be so beautiful because, well, they are more beautiful than Men in general. Fact. The femininity is shining through because females are arguably more beautiful than males. I thought Legolas and Haldir looked really good. There were other aspects of the characters that brought them down, especially dialogue in Leggy's case! __________________ Los Ingobernables de Harlond

12-29-2004, 04:00 PM	#3
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,521	The only thing that gets me from not choosing Denethor, is John Noble's acting. I put aside my own personal view of Denethor (from what I learned from the books) and I just said, John Noble plays a wonderful scum bag. However, I agree with Mith, I think the food shoveling is just over the top. I don't care how evil PJ makes Denethor, it's unnecessary to make the guy a slob too. My view is, I still have my view of Denethor from the books, the movies don't change that, the movies are purely entertainment, and since Noble did such a great performance, and a guy that you too would want to hit with a staff if you had it, then I give a thumbs up to him.

01-01-2005, 09:39 PM	#7
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,521	Come on now, I think PJ just has an obsession of slobbish eaters. Take FOTR, with PJ's cameo, bites into a carrot and belches. TTT, Gimli stuffing his face full in Theoden's hall (I seriously doubt a dwarf would do that, especially in a king's hall, oh yeah then Gimli belches). Then ROTK, a steward spitting cherry juice, and chomping while Pippin's singing, highly inappropriate for a steward surely.