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Old 03-03-2005, 02:33 AM   #1
burrahobbit
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Force of will. Indomitable will. Possibly magic is involved. Also: it is a device to make the deaths of those characters more symbolic and profound.
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Old 03-03-2005, 03:13 AM   #2
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Pipe Last will?

The plot device part I understand. But the other thing, the force of will part, I can't understand. Whose will? The deceased? How could they project their will?
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Old 03-03-2005, 03:39 AM   #3
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The will of the deceased, yes. I was mostly kidding with that part. Though I don't think that anybody would say that those characters were weak willed.

I would also like to add that while this topic was made as a question, and as a question is easily answered, it brings up a very important point in the legendarium, and one well worth discussing.

I was half asleep when I decided to come back downstairs and post that. You had better feel special.
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Old 03-03-2005, 10:48 AM   #4
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Boots

Is it to do with the dead 'living' somewhere else, so to speak? They are dead as far as Middle-earth is concerned but they are still able to affect Middle-earth from another place.

I find the idea of ghosts pretty untenable, but it still makes for a nice story.
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Old 03-03-2005, 12:00 PM   #5
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I think a lot of what Tolkien wrote about burial mounds comes from myth and folklore. The ancients worshiped such places as entrances to the underworld. If the person buried within was pure, then so was the mound, and it was an entry to paradise, if on the other hand the person was evil, then it was a place of dread. We see this after The Witch-King corrupts Tyrn Gorthad.
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Old 03-03-2005, 12:13 PM   #6
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This is an interesting question. I'm intrigued by Eomer's idea of the dead living somewhere else.
The spirits of dead elves (and men) go to the Halls of Mandos. Tolkien said that the elves, after a time, could be re-embodied and go to join their kin in Aman.
Perhaps from there, they are able to 'watch over' their graves on Middle Earth, as Arwen 'watched over' Aragorn, from afar?
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Old 03-03-2005, 03:14 PM   #7
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No. It doesn't have anything to do with that. Except folklore. Kind of.
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Old 03-03-2005, 05:25 PM   #8
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You are nothing if not definite in your observations Burrahobbit! That's it? End of discussion?

narfforc said:
Quote:
I think a lot of what Tolkien wrote about burial mounds comes from myth and folklore. The ancients worshiped such places as entrances to the underworld.
In Icelandic, Scandanavian, Celtic and Ancient British folklore (among others) there are also tales that have burial mounds being places where one could enter the Land of Faerie. Perhaps it is simply that Professor Tolkien was influenced by these ideas and tales when he wished to emphasise the tragic deaths of those interred in the mounds.
As far as I understand it, barrows and burial mounds are also said to be particularly strong in magnetic and or magical influence as they are often constructed at the meeting points of ley lines. I don't know much about ley lines and such, so I would not like to dismiss the idea out of hand.
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