Name for the Fell Beasts - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Keeper of Dol Guldur · 10-08-2002, 02:54 PM

Sure, everyone has gotten used to calling the winged steeds of the Nazgul, fell-beasts, or whatever. But in the book Beregond in terror refers to them as Hell-Hawks. And that name seems to stick in my mind. So if anyone ever wonders what in the heck a hell-hawk is when I use it, it's just that. Also, if anyone knows the elvish. Like Udunhawk, Udungil, or something along those lines.

Birdland · 10-08-2002, 10:37 PM

K.D.G - I zipped over to the Encyclopedia of Arda, to see if there were other names listed for the "fell beasts", and they don't even have an entry for them. (???)

I suppose they regard the term as just a descriptive phrase, and not as an actual "name". And "Google" only lists "fell beast" in reference to LoTR gaming, through there is a reference to a "fell beast" in Dante's Inferno as well.

I guess they're just a good, ol' garden variety Nameless Horror.

[ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

Fallen King of Angmar · 10-08-2002, 10:51 PM

interesting topic. Eowyn calls the Nazghul a Dwimmerlaik (correct spelling?) or is she talking to his steed?

Tirned Tinnu · 10-09-2002, 12:15 AM

Yep, that's it, FKoA:

Quote:

‘Begone, foul dwimmerlaik, lord of carrion! Leave the dead in peace!’

Hrmm....she was definitely talking to the Nazgul. Now - as for the "fell creature" I remember it being described as a bird without wings, it's skin rubbery, it's neck long and having terrible talons. Well, as I've seen time and time again, I always thought it was a pterydactil. You know, the prehistoic birdie that looked more reptile than fowl?
Evil nasty thing. [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img]

Dimaldaeon · 10-09-2002, 02:23 PM

The pterodactyl wasn't a type of half bird half lizard it was a reptile that had evolved to fly. I believe that you are thinking of the Archaeopteryx, a dinosaur similar to Compsognathus that had feathered wings. In my opinion slap some bat-wings on as Diatryma (Terror Bird) and you have a fell beast.

Evenstar1 · 10-09-2002, 10:50 PM

Interesting comparisons, Dimaldaeon!

I guess I always thought the Fell Beasts/Creatures looked kind of like giant vultures...? And perhaps, since there is no other name available we, the Ringers of this board, have stumbled across both an opportunity and a duty to come up with a suitable name for one of the Professor's Nameless Horrors.

How about gierwargs from the Afrikaans "gier" (vulture) and "warg" (well, we know what those are...).

Anyone else?

Dimaldaeon · 10-10-2002, 12:12 PM

How about baistúin salach ein (the filthy bastard birds) [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Diamond18 · 10-10-2002, 12:38 PM

I can't imagine feathers of any kind being on the fell-beasts. Feathers are just so, I don't know, soft and harmless. Something you stuff a pillow with.

I picture them with leathery or scaly skin, very dinosaurish, but not necessarly pterodactyl.

As for names, I can think little. I am not that proficient in Elvish, Rohirric or anything else. But "Morhawk" tickles my funny bone, at any rate. [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]

Tirned Tinnu · 10-13-2002, 06:46 AM

Hmm... the reason why I said it was possibly like a Pterydactil and not an Archaeopteryx is because the description did not say "covered in feathers" or "partially feathered". Tolkien described something more like a flying reptile. Pterydactil is just that- a flying reptile. Archaeopteryx is too birdlike. (My brother was a dinosaur fan, that's why I remember these darn names.)
I do, however, think it could have been closer to a bat, in many ways - but then again, there was no fur spoken of either. [img]smilies/confused.gif[/img]

[ October 13, 2002: Message edited by: Tirned Tinnu ]

The Fifth · 10-13-2002, 09:31 AM

The fell beasts were described as being ugly carrion birds with no feathers. I never imagined them to be pterodactyls or any other form of dinosaur. We should merely call them "Fell Beasts".

the mortal elf · 10-13-2002, 12:05 PM

Does anyone have the J.R.R. Tolkien Calendar with ilustrations by the brothers Hildebrandt? I have it, and it has a picture of Eowyn fighting the fell beast. Their interpretation was more or less a small dragon. It was about 3 times the size of Eowyn, has bat like wings with skin/scales instead of fur, has back legs, but not front ones. The feet look like vulture or eagle feet with big talons. It has three horns near the back of its head and one large one on the end of it's snout, and it has an enormous mouth. It also has what looks like a barbed tail.

In RoTK, I'm pretty sure it said that it has a slender neck, and that it stank. It also said large carrion bird, etc. but you guys already took care of that [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

And I don't think they should be given a 'scientific name'. Calling them fell beasts just makes them more of a mystery, and hopefully keeps them frightening.

Nar · 10-13-2002, 06:53 PM

I like 'hell-hawks' too. I shall alternate the two names. 'Udungil' sounds good to me also, providing 'gil' means bird, hawk, vulture or bird of prey.

10-13-2002, 08:02 PM

The word 'gil' means 'star'. Hell-star? The Sindarin words for bird would be either fileg or aew, so Udunaew, or Udunfileg.

Nar · 10-13-2002, 08:23 PM

Much obliged to you for answering my question. Udunaew looks good to me. Am I right in thinking that's pronounced 'OOdoonow'?

Eruialiwen · 10-13-2002, 09:12 PM

So they're basically Wyverns, dragons which have no front legs? [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

Helkasir · 10-13-2002, 09:19 PM

I say we call em stink birds, like stink bugs.What's the elvish for THAT?

Evenstar1 · 10-13-2002, 09:32 PM

Tee hee! So let's see, so far the list includes:

hell-hawks
gierwargs (vulture wargs)
baistúin salach ein (the filthy bastard birds)
Morhawks
Udunaew (Hell birds)
stink birds (or the elvish translations, thereof)
and just plain ol' Fell Beasts.

(I think that was all...?)

Keeper of Dol Guldur · 10-16-2002, 05:12 PM

Udunaeuw (Is that right?) sounds good. But it did just occur to me that Gil means star. Thoro means eagle. That's a big duh. God that was a stupid mistake. Anyway, I like the name. Ringwraith Hell Hawks, Nazgul Udunaeuw. But speaking of Nazgul, in the chapter "Minas Tirith" didn't Pippin refer to the wraithes as Black Riders and then the winged versions Nazgul. Maybe it was his mistake, but they are called Black Riders until they get the beasts. I mean, I know they're all nazgul and not the birds but who knows?

Diamond18 · 10-16-2002, 05:54 PM

Black Riders was just what the Hobbits called the Nazgûl before they knew their proper names. At Minas Tirith Pippin wasn't making a mistake, just merely using his expanded vocabulary.

doug*platypus · 02-15-2003, 04:19 AM

Names for the Fell Beasts: Dancer, Prancer, Donner, Blitzen, Rudolph... help me out here... damn commercialised hallmark holiday... razzafrazza Coke owns Santa...

Sorry. I think the best name for the winged Nazgûl (sorry, not exactly the Fell Beasts) is the one Gollum gives them:

Quote:

Wraiths! Wraiths on wings! The Precious is their master.

Sounds and seems more horrific than all the other references to them. Gollum's absolute fear of them makes them seem pretty scary. Elsewhere in the books (and especially the TTT movie), they appear impotent (teehee!).

02-15-2003, 04:59 PM

Hell hawk:"sauron bred these foul,winged creatures-which resemble gigantic, featherless carrion-birds with leathery wing-as steads for the nazgul"

form the LotR rpg core book PG.296

10-08-2002, 02:54 PM	#1
Keeper of Dol Guldur Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: 315, CNY Boys and girls. Posts: 405	Name for the Fell Beasts Sure, everyone has gotten used to calling the winged steeds of the Nazgul, fell-beasts, or whatever. But in the book Beregond in terror refers to them as Hell-Hawks. And that name seems to stick in my mind. So if anyone ever wonders what in the heck a hell-hawk is when I use it, it's just that. Also, if anyone knows the elvish. Like Udunhawk, Udungil, or something along those lines. __________________ "I come from yonder...Have you seen Baggins? Baggins has left, he is coming. He is not far away. I wish to find him. If he passes will you tell me? I will come back with gold." - Khamul the Easterling

10-08-2002, 10:51 PM	#3
Fallen King of Angmar Haunting Spirit Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Minas Morgul Posts: 51	interesting topic. Eowyn calls the Nazghul a Dwimmerlaik (correct spelling?) or is she talking to his steed? __________________ "Come not between the Nazghul and his prey! Or he will not slay thee in thy turn. He will bear thee away to the houses of lamentation, beyond all darkness, where thy flesh shall be devoured, and thy shrivelled mind be left naked to the Lidless Eye."

10-09-2002, 02:23 PM	#5
Dimaldaeon Wight Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ireland & damn proud of it. Posts: 125	The pterodactyl wasn't a type of half bird half lizard it was a reptile that had evolved to fly. I believe that you are thinking of the Archaeopteryx, a dinosaur similar to Compsognathus that had feathered wings. In my opinion slap some bat-wings on as Diatryma (Terror Bird) and you have a fell beast. __________________ Dear Saddam, Do not disunderestimate me.Yours G.W.Bush You're not drunk if you can still hold onto a blade of grass to stop yourself from falling off the face of the Earth

10-09-2002, 10:50 PM	#6
Evenstar1 Wight Join Date: May 2002 Location: Colorado (just east of the Misty Mts.) Posts: 111	Interesting comparisons, Dimaldaeon! I guess I always thought the Fell Beasts/Creatures looked kind of like giant vultures...? And perhaps, since there is no other name available we, the Ringers of this board, have stumbled across both an opportunity and a duty to come up with a suitable name for one of the Professor's Nameless Horrors. How about gierwargs from the Afrikaans "gier" (vulture) and "warg" (well, we know what those are...). Anyone else? __________________ - Eve

10-10-2002, 12:12 PM	#7
Dimaldaeon Wight Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ireland & damn proud of it. Posts: 125	How about baistúin salach ein (the filthy bastard birds) [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] __________________ Dear Saddam, Do not disunderestimate me.Yours G.W.Bush You're not drunk if you can still hold onto a blade of grass to stop yourself from falling off the face of the Earth

10-08-2002, 10:37 PM	#2
Birdland Ghastly Neekerbreeker Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the banks of the mighty Scioto Posts: 1,751	K.D.G - I zipped over to the Encyclopedia of Arda, to see if there were other names listed for the "fell beasts", and they don't even have an entry for them. (???) I suppose they regard the term as just a descriptive phrase, and not as an actual "name". And "Google" only lists "fell beast" in reference to LoTR gaming, through there is a reference to a "fell beast" in Dante's Inferno as well. I guess they're just a good, ol' garden variety Nameless Horror. [ October 09, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

10-10-2002, 12:38 PM	#8
Diamond18 Eidolon of a Took Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: my own private fantasy world Posts: 3,460	I can't imagine feathers of any kind being on the fell-beasts. Feathers are just so, I don't know, soft and harmless. Something you stuff a pillow with. I picture them with leathery or scaly skin, very dinosaurish, but not necessarly pterodactyl. As for names, I can think little. I am not that proficient in Elvish, Rohirric or anything else. But "Morhawk" tickles my funny bone, at any rate. [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img] __________________ All shall be rather fond of me and suffer from mild depression.

10-13-2002, 06:46 AM	#9
Tirned Tinnu Wight Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Patchogue NY Posts: 158	Hmm... the reason why I said it was possibly like a Pterydactil and not an Archaeopteryx is because the description did not say "covered in feathers" or "partially feathered". Tolkien described something more like a flying reptile. Pterydactil is just that- a flying reptile. Archaeopteryx is too birdlike. (My brother was a dinosaur fan, that's why I remember these darn names.) I do, however, think it could have been closer to a bat, in many ways - but then again, there was no fur spoken of either. [img]smilies/confused.gif[/img] [ October 13, 2002: Message edited by: Tirned Tinnu ] __________________ 'Perilous indeed,' said Aragorn, 'fair and perilous; but only evil need fear it, or those who bring some evil with them. Follow me!'

10-13-2002, 09:31 AM	#10
The Fifth Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2002 Location: Mordor Posts: 427	The fell beasts were described as being ugly carrion birds with no feathers. I never imagined them to be pterodactyls or any other form of dinosaur. We should merely call them "Fell Beasts". __________________ - Ringwraith #5, Servant of the Eye

10-13-2002, 12:05 PM	#11
the mortal elf Wight Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away... Posts: 201	Does anyone have the J.R.R. Tolkien Calendar with ilustrations by the brothers Hildebrandt? I have it, and it has a picture of Eowyn fighting the fell beast. Their interpretation was more or less a small dragon. It was about 3 times the size of Eowyn, has bat like wings with skin/scales instead of fur, has back legs, but not front ones. The feet look like vulture or eagle feet with big talons. It has three horns near the back of its head and one large one on the end of it's snout, and it has an enormous mouth. It also has what looks like a barbed tail. In RoTK, I'm pretty sure it said that it has a slender neck, and that it stank. It also said large carrion bird, etc. but you guys already took care of that [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] And I don't think they should be given a 'scientific name'. Calling them fell beasts just makes them more of a mystery, and hopefully keeps them frightening. __________________ My imaginary friend says you have problems.

10-13-2002, 06:53 PM	#12
Nar Wight Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 228	I like 'hell-hawks' too. I shall alternate the two names. 'Udungil' sounds good to me also, providing 'gil' means bird, hawk, vulture or bird of prey.

10-13-2002, 08:02 PM	#13
platinumclaw Guest Posts: n/a	The word 'gil' means 'star'. Hell-star? The Sindarin words for bird would be either fileg or aew, so Udunaew, or Udunfileg.

10-13-2002, 08:23 PM	#14
Nar Wight Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 228	Much obliged to you for answering my question. Udunaew looks good to me. Am I right in thinking that's pronounced 'OOdoonow'?

10-13-2002, 09:12 PM	#15
Eruialiwen Haunting Spirit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Mirkwood, Virginia Posts: 71	So they're basically Wyverns, dragons which have no front legs? [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] __________________ ~'%From the mouths of the Sea the South Wind flies, from the sandhills and the stones; The wailing of the gulls it bears, and at the gate it moans.%'~

10-13-2002, 09:19 PM	#16
Helkasir Haunting Spirit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North of the Iron Hills Posts: 89	I say we call em stink birds, like stink bugs.What's the elvish for THAT? __________________ "Onen i-Estal Edain, u-chebin estel anim."

10-13-2002, 09:32 PM	#17
Evenstar1 Wight Join Date: May 2002 Location: Colorado (just east of the Misty Mts.) Posts: 111	Tee hee! So let's see, so far the list includes: hell-hawks gierwargs (vulture wargs) baistúin salach ein (the filthy bastard birds) Morhawks Udunaew (Hell birds) stink birds (or the elvish translations, thereof) and just plain ol' Fell Beasts. (I think that was all...?) __________________ - Eve

10-16-2002, 05:12 PM	#18
Keeper of Dol Guldur Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: 315, CNY Boys and girls. Posts: 405	Udunaeuw (Is that right?) sounds good. But it did just occur to me that Gil means star. Thoro means eagle. That's a big duh. God that was a stupid mistake. Anyway, I like the name. Ringwraith Hell Hawks, Nazgul Udunaeuw. But speaking of Nazgul, in the chapter "Minas Tirith" didn't Pippin refer to the wraithes as Black Riders and then the winged versions Nazgul. Maybe it was his mistake, but they are called Black Riders until they get the beasts. I mean, I know they're all nazgul and not the birds but who knows? __________________ "I come from yonder...Have you seen Baggins? Baggins has left, he is coming. He is not far away. I wish to find him. If he passes will you tell me? I will come back with gold." - Khamul the Easterling

10-16-2002, 05:54 PM	#19
Diamond18 Eidolon of a Took Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: my own private fantasy world Posts: 3,460	Black Riders was just what the Hobbits called the Nazgûl before they knew their proper names. At Minas Tirith Pippin wasn't making a mistake, just merely using his expanded vocabulary. __________________ All shall be rather fond of me and suffer from mild depression.

02-15-2003, 04:59 PM	#21
king of the iron hills Guest Posts: n/a	Hell hawk:"sauron bred these foul,winged creatures-which resemble gigantic, featherless carrion-birds with leathery wing-as steads for the nazgul" form the LotR rpg core book PG.296