What are your most hated parts about the L.O.T.R movies? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

alatar · 09-07-2005, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Only Real Estel

So you're safe.

Didn't think so, but you never know...especially as I've posted pretty negatively in regards to PJ's depiction of the Gandalf-WK encounter (which is why I joined the forum in the first place). That scene really torqued me off, and I felt that I had been betrayed. The night that I first viewed ROTK:EE, I got my torch and pitchfork and set off for New Zealand

. Stopped at the 'Downs along the way and, after a few (hundred?) bellowing and whining posts, put down my riot paraphenalia and got over it, thanks to some sense sent by some fellow wraiths.

Tuor in Gondolin · 09-08-2005, 10:26 AM

Yess. This is easy, precious. It's Gandalf beating up the
Steward of Gondor while his elite guards are
apparently comotose. The istari were expressly
forbidden to try to force/coerce/dominate the free
races of Middle-earth. We hates it, we hates it forever!

P.S. I consdier FOTR by far the best of PJ's three movies.

P.P.S. And how come Pippin and Merry shrank back to
normal hobbit size in ROTK.

P.P.P.S. Real posting total for myself is over 1,000. Had to
change and start over in losing my old computer and
going to Yahoo.

Essex · 09-09-2005, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuor in Gondolin

Yess. This is easy, precious. It's Gandalf beating up the
Steward of Gondor while his elite guards are
apparently comotose. The istari were expressly
forbidden to try to force/coerce/dominate the free
races of Middle-earth. We hates it, we hates it forever!

From the Pyre of Denethor

Quote:

Thereupon the door which Beregond held shut with his left hand was wrenched open, and there behind him stood the Lord of the City, tall and fell; a light like flame was in his eyes, and he held a drawn sword.
But Gandalf sprang up the steps, and the men fell back from him and covered their eyes; for his coming was like the incoming of a white light into a dark place, and he came with great anger. He lifted up his hand, and in the very stroke, the sword of Denethor flew up and left his grasp and fell behind him in the shadows of the house; and Denethor stepped backward before Gandalf as one amazed.

Boromir88 · 09-09-2005, 05:00 AM

Essex, only thing with that quote is I think Gandalf had a ligitimate reason to whack Denethor. (Though I've seen it been debated whether Gandalf actually hit him, I seem to think he did). But, Denethor has totally lost his mind at this point and was about to kill his son, hence Gandalf's emergency and no time to dilly-daddle.

Anytime before this, despite their hate for eachother, Gandalf and Denethor were always able to keep themselves atleast respectful and show restraint.

In the movies the main scene I think that comes to mind when Gandalf hits Denethor is when Denethor comes running out and says "Abandon your posts." I don't know about others, but to me this would warrant Gandalf whacking him on the head, he is running out like a mad man telling everyong to flee, Gandalf had to shut him up. The only problem is Gandalf just doesn't hit him once to shut him up he cracks him multiple times. Is there really a reason for this, except for PJ to get people guffawing at "HAHA old mad man gets his butt beat down!"?

When I view this scene, if Gandalf wants to shut Denethor up from screaming all this madness and fleeing, all he'd have to do is hit him over the head once to knock some sense into him. That's what he did, he saw the huge army facing him and he went mad, Gandalf simply had to knock some sense into him. And after the first crack on the head, it seemed like Denethor got his senses back (by just looking at Noble's expression), but no, it doesn't stop, Gandalf (and PJ) have to turn it into a beating (which to me takes it too far). He then jabs him in the stomach, cracks him over the head again and knocks him out. There's no reason for this, I'm surprised Gandalf didn't kick him while he was down and spit on him when walking away.

Essex · 09-09-2005, 08:43 AM

Quote:

But, Denethor has totally lost his mind at this point and was about to kill his son, hence Gandalf's emergency and no time to dilly-daddle.

and jackson brought this 'madness' forward in time in his movie, so he could show Gandalf taking control of the city at that time. Hence we have him striking out and asserting his authority at this moment in time. I don't particularly enjoy this scene either, just trying to put in a counter point for discussion that ties in (loosely) with Tolkien's text.

Beanamir of Gondor · 09-10-2005, 06:11 AM

The whole Denethor-beating thing, as Boromir has mentioned, and I think I've probably babbled of in other threads, was just kind of pointless. There was no reason to carry it on that far, other than COMIC RELIEF. Then again, Gimli was stuck in the cave of the Pirates of the Dimholt Mountain, so we hadn't had any comic relief for a while.

Eowyn was one of my favorite characters in the book, and the fact that we completely lost Dernhelm and the element of Merry's surprise ticked me off. Would it have killed them to let Eowyn look like a man for a while, and have Merry be confused??

Again with the tiny little things bothering me... literally, I was saddened at the lack of 'neeker-breekers'. That would have been a fun addition to the scene where Frodo hears Aragorn singing.

Bandobras Took · 09-10-2005, 06:44 AM

I agree with The Saucepan Man. I think you should just enjoy the movies and not just go around looking for faults.

But if I must...Faramir

09-08-2005, 10:26 AM	#2
Tuor in Gondolin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Southeast Pennsylvania Posts: 3,651	Yess. This is easy, precious. It's Gandalf beating up the Steward of Gondor while his elite guards are apparently comotose. The istari were expressly forbidden to try to force/coerce/dominate the free races of Middle-earth. We hates it, we hates it forever! P.S. I consdier FOTR by far the best of PJ's three movies. P.P.S. And how come Pippin and Merry shrank back to normal hobbit size in ROTK. P.P.P.S. Real posting total for myself is over 1,000. Had to change and start over in losing my old computer and going to Yahoo. __________________ The poster formerly known as Tuor of Gondolin. Walking To Rivendell and beyond 12,555 miles passed Nt./Day 5: Pass the beacon on Nardol, the 'Fire Hill.'

09-09-2005, 05:00 AM	#4
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,521	Essex, only thing with that quote is I think Gandalf had a ligitimate reason to whack Denethor. (Though I've seen it been debated whether Gandalf actually hit him, I seem to think he did). But, Denethor has totally lost his mind at this point and was about to kill his son, hence Gandalf's emergency and no time to dilly-daddle. Anytime before this, despite their hate for eachother, Gandalf and Denethor were always able to keep themselves atleast respectful and show restraint. In the movies the main scene I think that comes to mind when Gandalf hits Denethor is when Denethor comes running out and says "Abandon your posts." I don't know about others, but to me this would warrant Gandalf whacking him on the head, he is running out like a mad man telling everyong to flee, Gandalf had to shut him up. The only problem is Gandalf just doesn't hit him once to shut him up he cracks him multiple times. Is there really a reason for this, except for PJ to get people guffawing at "HAHA old mad man gets his butt beat down!"? When I view this scene, if Gandalf wants to shut Denethor up from screaming all this madness and fleeing, all he'd have to do is hit him over the head once to knock some sense into him. That's what he did, he saw the huge army facing him and he went mad, Gandalf simply had to knock some sense into him. And after the first crack on the head, it seemed like Denethor got his senses back (by just looking at Noble's expression), but no, it doesn't stop, Gandalf (and PJ) have to turn it into a beating (which to me takes it too far). He then jabs him in the stomach, cracks him over the head again and knocks him out. There's no reason for this, I'm surprised Gandalf didn't kick him while he was down and spit on him when walking away. __________________ Fenris Penguin

09-10-2005, 06:11 AM	#6
Beanamir of Gondor Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: the Shadow Gallery Posts: 276	The whole Denethor-beating thing, as Boromir has mentioned, and I think I've probably babbled of in other threads, was just kind of pointless. There was no reason to carry it on that far, other than COMIC RELIEF. Then again, Gimli was stuck in the cave of the Pirates of the Dimholt Mountain, so we hadn't had any comic relief for a while. Eowyn was one of my favorite characters in the book, and the fact that we completely lost Dernhelm and the element of Merry's surprise ticked me off. Would it have killed them to let Eowyn look like a man for a while, and have Merry be confused?? Again with the tiny little things bothering me... literally, I was saddened at the lack of 'neeker-breekers'. That would have been a fun addition to the scene where Frodo hears Aragorn singing. __________________ The answer to life is no longer 42. It's 4 8 15 16 23... 42. "I only lent you my body; you lent me your dream."

09-10-2005, 06:44 AM	#7
Bandobras Took Pile O'Bones Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: The Green Dragon Inn Posts: 22	I agree with The Saucepan Man. I think you should just enjoy the movies and not just go around looking for faults. But if I must...Faramir