The Silmarillion Survivor - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Celuien · 10-17-2005, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Saucepan Man

Er - probably exactly the way that Anguirel stated it ...

Pardon me for trying to inject a spark of controversy into this thread but doesn't this all become rather, um, predictable if we vote exactly the way that the AngMod wants us to every day ...

You may not get another crack at Morgoth - at least for a while.

I'm thinking downstream, with the Idril as ruler of Gondolin and Maeglin vs Tuor.

I'm willing to wait on Morgoth. Really, I'd like to get rid of the Doom of Mandos first and see if we can't get the Eldar and Edain to unite and defeat him on their own since it appears that uncanonical events are permitted.

Anguirel · 10-18-2005, 12:06 AM

Votes

Sauron-1
Morgoth-3
Turgon-5

Turgon, thou hast fallen! Voting closed. Results up soon.

Gothmog · 10-18-2005, 12:32 AM

You know, I haven't been on winning side one single time so far. Maybe I'll vote with Ang next time? On second thought NO, I'll make this the task of my life, DOWN WITH THE MOD!

Anguirel · 10-18-2005, 01:01 AM

RESULTS OF DAY THREE (M-e)

One afternoon, Turgon happened to be strolling on the ramparts of Gondolin with Glorfindel and Ecthelion.

They described his fall in awed tones. "He just...sort of slipped...it was dreadful..."

Both happened to be anti-isolationism.

Later on, two riders were admitted-the lost Lady Aredhel, and an unknown, tall, handsome Sinda, whose face was her very image...and yet not...

They were followed by another mounted Sinda-Eol, the Dark Elf. He demanded the return of his wife and son. The new Queen Idril claimed them as her King, and him also. He insisted on returning with them. A compromise was reached by Idril's wisdom. Eol returned to Nan Elmoth, Aredhel remained at Gondolin; and Maeglin went between them, spending half a year at each; and while at Gondolin, proved a shrewd adviser...

~~~

RESULTS OF THE CHALLENGE

Now Morgoth's army presented itself, the largest that had yet been gathered. Sauron commanded the left wing, Gothmog the right; Eonwe and Curunir held the centre. Its vast power's greatest element was the fire of Glaurung; and as no Dwarves had come to the battle, it was nigh on impossible to resist.

In that fell hour were slain Aegnor and Amras, last of the expendable princes of the Noldor, to the Dragon's might; and it seemed that the host of the Noldor must break. Finrod was caught in a circle of foes, though rescued by Barahir's folk at great cost.

But a few warriors of Gondolin-three, in fact-had crept unnoticed to join the battle in the train of Fingon. Idril, Ecthelion, and Maeglin they were. And they caused some bitterness in Morgoth's triumph.

For Idril struck down Curunir the Subtle, and his spirit was dispersed. And Ecthelion in the midst of combat sought out Gothmog, with his Troll-guard occupied with the sons of Feanor, avenging their brother, and Ecthelion pierced the foul captain's heart, though he himself was immolated in its ruin. As for Maeglin, he drew his sword of star-metal Anguirel and set upon Glaurung.

Long was their struggle, inconclusive its end. Maeglin was sore wounded by fire, and was carried out of the fray by Idril; but the dragon Glaurung, afraid and hurt, retreated from the battle.

But still the numbers of Morgoth prevailed; and the Elves retreated, their lands, and those of Dorthonion, in ruins. Fingolfin defied Morgoth, and fought with him to the last; but he was conquered, and with no Eagles about his body was despoiled. Finarfin was shot down as he fled...

Dor-Lomin and Brethil had been saved, but of Dorthonion only outlaws remained, the houseless women and children being spirited into Gondolin or sent to Dor-Lomin or Brethil.

The contestants:

Tribes

VALAR

Elbereth
Ulmo
Mandos, Doom of

NOLDOR

Maedhros
Maglor
Celegorm
Celebrimbor
Caranthir
Curufin
Fingon
Idril
Aredhel
Maeglin
Finrod
Orodreth

TELERI/SINDAR

Olwe
Thingol
Celeborn
Galadriel
Mablung
Beleg
Daeron
Eol

MAIA/ELF

Luthien

MAIA

Melian
Uinen
Huan
Tilion (with Moon)
Arien (with Sun)

DWARVES

Azaghal of Belegost
Telchar of Nogrod
Mim the Petty-dwarf
Khim
Ibun

MEN

Barahir
Beren
Hador
Galdor
Halmir
Haldir

FORCES OF EVIL

Morgoth
Sauron
Eonwe
Draugluin
Glaurung

It's Day Four in Middle-earth. The fourth task is: MESALLIANCE. Without ejecting Beren or Luthien, make their marriage as difficult as possible to achieve.

EDIT: Decided not to kill Eonwe. Seemed like overdoing it...

Lalaith · 10-18-2005, 02:16 AM

Lovely write-up.

But oh, you wicked AngMod. The best way I can see to achieve the challenge is to evict Melian, but what ghastly can of worms will that open up?

Lalaith · 10-18-2005, 03:39 AM

Oh and of course my humble and abject apologies to Alcarillo for such careless confusion.

Celuien · 10-18-2005, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anguirel

It's Day Four in Middle-earth. The fourth task is: MESALLIANCE. Without ejecting Beren or Luthien, make their marriage as difficult as possible to achieve.

Cruel, cruel Ang-mod. What did Beren and Luthien ever do to you?

It might make things more difficult if Morgoth goes. I'm assuming that Beren still has to get the Silmarils or accomplish some sort of task to marry her. If Morgoth takes them to the Void those Silmarils would be pretty hard to find. Or, if the sons of Feanor reclaim them, he might not have a task at all and could just be sent home by ole Thingy.

Beren: Please, can I marry your daughter?
Thingy: Prove your worth.
Beren: Name the task. I shall be victorious.
Thingy: Can't think of a thing for you to do. Sorry, go away.

Anguirel · 10-18-2005, 06:26 AM

I reassure you (sort of) that whatever you do, you will probably not succeed in stopping the marriage of Beren and Luthien. I do realise that my Celegorm/Luthien wish is pretty unfeasible, and Beren and Luthien (unless you're especially ingenious!) will end up together.

You can't have the Silmarillion without the Silmarils, so if Morgoth were to be evicted, they would not follow him. I have a fate planned for them actually in such a case, but let's keep it a surprise...

Lord Melkor · 10-18-2005, 07:23 AM

Hmmm, a tough challenge this time. In order to thwart Luthien's and Beren's marriage we must make sure that Thingol will be as obstinate and narrowminded as possible so we must remove the sole voice of reason from his court, so that his bootlickers and lackeys can reinforce his own bigoted beliefs about Beren. Therefore I agree with Lalaith 's assessment: Melian must go! I never understood what a pretty Maia like her saw in that bloated oaf Thingol anyway.

++ Melian

Tuor of Gondolin · 10-18-2005, 07:47 AM

If the goal is to make it difficult, but not impossible, to thwart Luthien's and Beren's marriage, then it would seem that evicting Huan would serve the purpose.
Melian would still be around to moderate Thingol's arrogance (rumor has it Beren once said "You can't do business with that hothead"). Without Huan it would
be humongously difficult to get even one Silmaril. So:

+ + Huan

(hope I did that right).

Anguirel · 10-18-2005, 08:01 AM

You're half way there, Tuor! Bold it as well next time...++HUAN, for instance. (Example, not vote.)

I have the following suggestions:

Melian and Huan, for reasons stated above, would both be good options

If Barahir were to be ejected, Beren would endure more danger early on, having to lead the Outlaws

Finrod Felagund (I know, I know, it hurts a lot) gave Beren aid and saved Beren's life

Maedhros (even worse) possibly kept his younger brothers Celegorm and Curufin under a measure of control

Telchar forged Angrist-but has probably given it to Curufin by now, so isn't much of a candidate

Tilion and Arien may be the only means of rescuing the lovers aerially...

Out of such a list, I shall back Tuor and vote for the irritating talking animal, which betrays its true master-

++HUAN

Eonwe · 10-18-2005, 08:04 AM

I thought of huan. It certainly seems like a better choice than Melian (to me). Although Melian is a bit expendable (as much as i hate to say it), i just can't seem to let her go.

But lets look at what will happen if we get rid of huan:

Celegorm will have a much better chance of killing Luthian, or Beren, or both. We what to make the marriage hard, not kill it off.

Sauron. Didn't Luthian faint? I might have made taht up, but i don't think so. So that would also be bad.

So i don't think huan would be a good idea.

What if we evict Arien (with Sun). This would make it much easier for teh forces of Morgoth to range far and wide. I suppose this would make it hard of Beren and Luthian, traveling through the wild as they do...just a thought.

10-18-2005, 12:06 AM	#2
Anguirel Byronic Brand Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The 1590s Posts: 2,778	Votes Sauron-1 Morgoth-3 Turgon-5 Turgon, thou hast fallen! Voting closed. Results up soon. __________________ Among the friendly dead, being bad at games did not seem to matter -Il Lupo Fenriso

10-18-2005, 12:32 AM	#3
Gothmog Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Where I lay my head is home Posts: 421	You know, I haven't been on winning side one single time so far. Maybe I'll vote with Ang next time? On second thought NO, I'll make this the task of my life, DOWN WITH THE MOD! __________________ Three switched witches watch three Swatch watch switches. Which switched witch watch which Swatch watch switch? He who breaks a thing to find out what it is has left the path of wisdom ~Lurker...

10-18-2005, 01:01 AM	#4
Anguirel Byronic Brand Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The 1590s Posts: 2,778	RESULTS OF DAY THREE (M-e) One afternoon, Turgon happened to be strolling on the ramparts of Gondolin with Glorfindel and Ecthelion. They described his fall in awed tones. "He just...sort of slipped...it was dreadful..." Both happened to be anti-isolationism. Later on, two riders were admitted-the lost Lady Aredhel, and an unknown, tall, handsome Sinda, whose face was her very image...and yet not... They were followed by another mounted Sinda-Eol, the Dark Elf. He demanded the return of his wife and son. The new Queen Idril claimed them as her King, and him also. He insisted on returning with them. A compromise was reached by Idril's wisdom. Eol returned to Nan Elmoth, Aredhel remained at Gondolin; and Maeglin went between them, spending half a year at each; and while at Gondolin, proved a shrewd adviser... ~~~ RESULTS OF THE CHALLENGE Now Morgoth's army presented itself, the largest that had yet been gathered. Sauron commanded the left wing, Gothmog the right; Eonwe and Curunir held the centre. Its vast power's greatest element was the fire of Glaurung; and as no Dwarves had come to the battle, it was nigh on impossible to resist. In that fell hour were slain Aegnor and Amras, last of the expendable princes of the Noldor, to the Dragon's might; and it seemed that the host of the Noldor must break. Finrod was caught in a circle of foes, though rescued by Barahir's folk at great cost. But a few warriors of Gondolin-three, in fact-had crept unnoticed to join the battle in the train of Fingon. Idril, Ecthelion, and Maeglin they were. And they caused some bitterness in Morgoth's triumph. For Idril struck down Curunir the Subtle, and his spirit was dispersed. And Ecthelion in the midst of combat sought out Gothmog, with his Troll-guard occupied with the sons of Feanor, avenging their brother, and Ecthelion pierced the foul captain's heart, though he himself was immolated in its ruin. As for Maeglin, he drew his sword of star-metal Anguirel and set upon Glaurung. Long was their struggle, inconclusive its end. Maeglin was sore wounded by fire, and was carried out of the fray by Idril; but the dragon Glaurung, afraid and hurt, retreated from the battle. But still the numbers of Morgoth prevailed; and the Elves retreated, their lands, and those of Dorthonion, in ruins. Fingolfin defied Morgoth, and fought with him to the last; but he was conquered, and with no Eagles about his body was despoiled. Finarfin was shot down as he fled... Dor-Lomin and Brethil had been saved, but of Dorthonion only outlaws remained, the houseless women and children being spirited into Gondolin or sent to Dor-Lomin or Brethil. The contestants: Tribes VALAR Elbereth Ulmo Mandos, Doom of NOLDOR Maedhros Maglor Celegorm Celebrimbor Caranthir Curufin Fingon Idril Aredhel Maeglin Finrod Orodreth TELERI/SINDAR Olwe Thingol Celeborn Galadriel Mablung Beleg Daeron Eol MAIA/ELF Luthien MAIA Melian Uinen Huan Tilion (with Moon) Arien (with Sun) DWARVES Azaghal of Belegost Telchar of Nogrod Mim the Petty-dwarf Khim Ibun MEN Barahir Beren Hador Galdor Halmir Haldir FORCES OF EVIL Morgoth Sauron Eonwe Draugluin Glaurung It's Day Four in Middle-earth. The fourth task is: MESALLIANCE. Without ejecting Beren or Luthien, make their marriage as difficult as possible to achieve. EDIT: Decided not to kill Eonwe. Seemed like overdoing it... __________________ Among the friendly dead, being bad at games did not seem to matter -Il Lupo Fenriso Last edited by Anguirel; 10-18-2005 at 01:09 AM.

10-18-2005, 02:16 AM	#5
Lalaith Blithe Spirit Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,779	Lovely write-up. But oh, you wicked AngMod. The best way I can see to achieve the challenge is to evict Melian, but what ghastly can of worms will that open up? __________________ Out went the candle, and we were left darkling

10-18-2005, 03:39 AM	#6
Lalaith Blithe Spirit Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,779	Oh and of course my humble and abject apologies to Alcarillo for such careless confusion. __________________ Out went the candle, and we were left darkling

10-18-2005, 06:26 AM	#8
Anguirel Byronic Brand Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The 1590s Posts: 2,778	I reassure you (sort of) that whatever you do, you will probably not succeed in stopping the marriage of Beren and Luthien. I do realise that my Celegorm/Luthien wish is pretty unfeasible, and Beren and Luthien (unless you're especially ingenious!) will end up together. You can't have the Silmarillion without the Silmarils, so if Morgoth were to be evicted, they would not follow him. I have a fate planned for them actually in such a case, but let's keep it a surprise... __________________ Among the friendly dead, being bad at games did not seem to matter -Il Lupo Fenriso

10-18-2005, 07:23 AM	#9
Lord Melkor Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 78	Hmmm, a tough challenge this time. In order to thwart Luthien's and Beren's marriage we must make sure that Thingol will be as obstinate and narrowminded as possible so we must remove the sole voice of reason from his court, so that his bootlickers and lackeys can reinforce his own bigoted beliefs about Beren. Therefore I agree with Lalaith 's assessment: Melian must go! I never understood what a pretty Maia like her saw in that bloated oaf Thingol anyway. ++ Melian __________________ 'I am the Elder king: Melkor, first and mightiest of all the Valar, who was before the world, and made it. The shadow of my purpose lies upon Arda, and all that is in it bends slowly and surely to my will.'

10-18-2005, 07:47 AM	#10
Tuor of Gondolin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Pennsylvania, WtR, passed Sarn Gebir: Above the rapids (1239 miles) BtR, passed Black Rider Stopping Place (31 miles) Posts: 1,548	If the goal is to make it difficult, but not impossible, to thwart Luthien's and Beren's marriage, then it would seem that evicting Huan would serve the purpose. Melian would still be around to moderate Thingol's arrogance (rumor has it Beren once said "You can't do business with that hothead"). Without Huan it would be humongously difficult to get even one Silmaril. So: + + Huan (hope I did that right). __________________ Aure Entuluva!

10-18-2005, 08:01 AM	#11
Anguirel Byronic Brand Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The 1590s Posts: 2,778	You're half way there, Tuor! Bold it as well next time...++HUAN, for instance. (Example, not vote.) I have the following suggestions: Melian and Huan, for reasons stated above, would both be good options If Barahir were to be ejected, Beren would endure more danger early on, having to lead the Outlaws Finrod Felagund (I know, I know, it hurts a lot) gave Beren aid and saved Beren's life Maedhros (even worse) possibly kept his younger brothers Celegorm and Curufin under a measure of control Telchar forged Angrist-but has probably given it to Curufin by now, so isn't much of a candidate Tilion and Arien may be the only means of rescuing the lovers aerially... Out of such a list, I shall back Tuor and vote for the irritating talking animal, which betrays its true master- ++HUAN __________________ Among the friendly dead, being bad at games did not seem to matter -Il Lupo Fenriso

10-18-2005, 08:04 AM	#12
Eonwe Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: In a world grown ever smaller. Posts: 678	I thought of huan. It certainly seems like a better choice than Melian (to me). Although Melian is a bit expendable (as much as i hate to say it), i just can't seem to let her go. But lets look at what will happen if we get rid of huan: Celegorm will have a much better chance of killing Luthian, or Beren, or both. We what to make the marriage hard, not kill it off. Sauron. Didn't Luthian faint? I might have made taht up, but i don't think so. So that would also be bad. So i don't think huan would be a good idea. What if we evict Arien (with Sun). This would make it much easier for teh forces of Morgoth to range far and wide. I suppose this would make it hard of Beren and Luthian, traveling through the wild as they do...just a thought. __________________ I've got bridge club on Wednesday, Archery on Thursday, Dancing on a Friday night!