Outrage?

[davem]

Is it possible that Tolkien gives us a text which invites us to fall into the elvish habit of nostalgia, to enjoy it and revere it and be inspired by it, but in the end he provides subtle suggestions that such nostalgia is a false or misplaced longing? Does Tolkien undercut the major response he seems to create in his readers? Are we to repent of our reading?

We wonders.... Was this diichotomy set up deliberately by Tolkien, or was it a reflection of his own inner conflict.

(Sorry for the long quote - this is from Verlyn Flieger's 'A Question of Time' pps 111 - 112)

But its just here that Tolkien falls foul of his own ambivalence about the passage of time. For all his stated philosophical position, he cannot help imbuing his narrative with a mixed message, a rueful rationale for change covering a deep nostalgia for what has passed and is passing, in spite of all its Hobbit jollity, its mushroom and pipeweed, its victories and celebrations, The Lord of the Rings is suffused with a sense of transience and loss. The Shire changes, the Ents never find the Entwives, Frodo loses his Ring, his finger, and himself and cannot really go home. “However the fortunes of war go," Theoden says to Gandalf, "may it not so end that many fair things pass from the earth?" (Two Towers 155). It does so end, and all the renewal and rejoicing do not put back what was lost. Theoden speaks for Tolkien, but so does Gandalf, when he replies to Theoden: "To such days we are doomed,"
The fact is that like his Elves, Tolkien hoarded memory, He, too regretted the past; he, too, was unwilling to face change and wanted to arrest history, to keep hold of the past in the present. He, too, wanted escape from what he called "the Robot Age," escape from the 'grim Assyrian' absurdity of top-hats, or the Morlockian horror of factories" (“On Fairy-Stories" 148, 150). And so, in a sense, he subverts his own message, surrounding his Elves and their lands with an aura of such golden nostalgia that their appeal is almost impossible to resist. But he also knew that real escape is impossible. We are where we are, and we cannot go back to where we were; we can only long to. Tolkien is susceptible to the Elven impulse and yet capable of seeing its fallacy, subject to the confusion of the heart that feels one thing and the head that knows another. And so there is a concealed sting in Lorien's beauty. Its timelessness is not the unspoiled perfection it seems. Rather, that very perfection is its flaw. It is a cautionary picture, closer in kind to the Ring than we'd like to think, shown to us in all its beauty to test if we can let it go.
The Lord of the Rings is, among many other things, a story about the ability to let go. The Ring is the obvious example, the clearest picture of the possessiveness engendered by possessions, and the corruption that grows with the desire to keep. It is easy to see the Ring as evil, and while Frodo's inability to give it up is both unexpected and inevitable, what happens to him appears to be an extraordinary tragedy, not something the reader can readily identify with. The timeless beauty of Lorien is the deeper example. It is more difficult to recognize as such, because, unlike the Ring, Lorien and everything about it in the narrative make us want to keep it, make us want, like Frodo, to stay there. We love Lorien, as, quite clearly, its author loved it. The beauty of Tolkien's Elves and their Elven lands blinds us to their significance in his world and his narrative.
Nonetheless, this very sense of passing and loss that on one level Tolkien mourned, on another level he celebrated. For to be capable of living is also to be capable of dying, and without death there can be no rebirth. Elves preserve. Men grow and die and grow again. It is in this respect that the Contrast between Elves and Men is of such importance to Tolkien's vision. But while the contrast itself is apparent to any reader of Tolkien's work, it is a safe bet that many readers mistake its overt purpose and consequently ap. predate the wrong values in each culture, valuing immortality above mortality and Elves above Men.

[drigel]

We wonders.... Was this diichotomy set up deliberately by Tolkien, or was it a reflection of his own inner conflict.

I think we are, in a roundabout way, doing what the author intended - to contemplate the nature of mortality of man.

I am here suggesting that Galadriel is used as a model for a prime 'reader' of Middle-earth and that when we decode her reading as tragically wrong, we step back and see if this decoding can be applied--applicability!--to our own readings of Middle-earth. (Or those of some of us.)

Nice! I would suggest rather that Galadriel is used in LOTR as a model for a prime reader for the psychology of High Elves. You get a lot of history with Elrond and Cirdan. But with Galadriel, sigh, you get as close to Valimar as a mortal can be.

[Lalwendë]

Maybe this explains the Gift of Death - that Men are not doomed to resisting change, they never have to fight the urge to live in a pickled version of the distant past, as it simply will not happen to them; they will die long before that 'doom' affects them. I think in Tolkien's work we see that change is inevitable. It might not be nice, but it is going to happen whether we like it or not. The Gift of Death allows Men to escape this tragedy; Aragorn will not live to see all his efforts in the War of the Ring fall, eventually, to nothing. And perhaps this is why Elves are naturally expected to live in the Undying Lands, as once there, they are protected from death and decay and change.

We visit this secondary world just as that 'magic' is about to decline and fade. I wonder if our own world ever had any of that magic anyway? We'll never know, but we can be sure that there was plenty of suffering in all periods of history, and in Tolkien's world there is plenty of suffering too. Not only is there the suffering of our 'heroes' like Frodo, but there is the suffering of the peoples enslaved by Sauron, the Ents who know they are going to die out, Hobbits made to starve when the Shire is taken over - it might be a fantasy world, but it's no Utopia.

Galadriel in Middle-earth is really a big fish in a small pond, and she is no fairy princess, she is an Elf who has ambitions. She wants to create and rule her own realm, and it is to these desires that Celebrimbor panders when he tries to woo her with gifts such as the Elessar and Nenya. They are gifts of power and potency, not trinkets. She knows that when the Rings lose their power she has two choices: go back to the Undying Lands and be one of many fish in a pond, or stay in Middle-earth but lose her realm, and become as one of the 'common Elves' who she rules.

[Raynor]

I think in Tolkien's work we see that change is inevitable. It might not be nice, but it is going to happen whether we like it or not. The Gift of Death allows Men to escape this tragedy; Aragorn will not live to see all his efforts in the War of the Ring fall, eventually, to nothing. And perhaps this is why Elves are naturally expected to live in the Undying Lands, as once there, they are protected from death and decay and change.

I think it is easy to see the elves as mourning for a lost condition and wanting to linger in Middle Earth, where they are superior just by their nature. But do these really describe them (completely), esspecially the noldor? Does Galadriel maintain a "Machinistic" kingdom, steadfast in time? I don't picture it as such..

The noldor are described as the most skilled of the elves (surpassing even their teachers - Aule, the smith of gods and his followers); the manifestations of their sub-creative talents are the most extraordinary of all elven Art.

Is ME change something that elves (completely) dread? I doubt it (from Dangweth Pengolodh, HoME XII):

But to the changefulness of Ea, to weariness of the un-changed, to the renewing of the union: to these three, which are one, the Eldar also are subject in their degree. In this, however, they differ from Men, that they are ever more aware of the words that they speak. As a silversmith may remain more aware than others of the tools and vessels that he uses daily at his table, or a weaver of the texture of his garments. Yet this makes rather for change among the Eldar than for steadfastness; for the Eldar being skilled and eager in art will readily make things new, both for delight to look on, or to hear, or to feel, or for daily use: be it in vessels or raiment or in speech.

It can further be said that the elves would dread the steadfastness defining the 'undying' lands, rather than the change of ME - or at least in the matters of language, which brought them much delight (same source):

Speech is fully living only when it is born; when the union of the thought and the sound is fallen into old custom, and the two are no longer perceived apart, then already the word is dying and joyless
[However]
Yet long since, AElfwine, the fashion of the World was changed; and we that dwell now in the Ancient West are removed from the circles of the World, and in memory is the greater part of our being: so that now we preserve rather than make anew. Wherefore, though even in Aman - beyond the circles of Arda, yet still with Ea - change goes ever on, until the End, be it slow beyond perceiving save in ages of time, nonetheless here at last in Eressea our tongues are steadfast; and here over a wide sea of years we speak now still little otherwise than we did - and those also that perished - in the wars of Beleriand, when the Sun was young.

A steadfast language = dead language (at least from their point of view).

According to Letter #181, the elves represent "the artistic, aesthetic, and purely scientific aspects of the Humane nature raised to a higher level than is actually seen in Men. That is: they have a devoted love of the physical world, and a desire to observe and understand it for its own sake and as 'other' - sc. as a reality derived from God in the same degree as themselves - not as a material for use or as a power-platform. They also possess a 'subcreational' or artistic faculty of great excellence". Their ennoblement of the Men race (at least through the union of the blood lines) is part of a divine plan. In the same text quoted above, Dangweth Pengolodh, it is stated that:

Others perceiving that in nothing do Men, and namely those of the West, so nearly resemble the Eldar as in speech, answer that the teaching which Men had of the Elves in their youth works on still as a seed in the dark

And in Myths Transformed it is stated that "in their association with the warring Eldar Men were raised to their fullest achievable stature". Legolas notes that those exiting Lothlorien are "changed" - for the better.

My conclusion would be that the elves had a certain critical role in ME: to raise Men to a higher level, a point illustrated by the above refferences; yet in Middle Earth, the marring of Melkor threatens to accelerate not only the waning of the elven hroa due to the fire of their spirit but also their means of existence (general decay nature, which affects even the gift of the valar, lembas, whose corn can neither grow under the shadow of 'normal' plants, nor can it withstand the evil winds bearing the influence of Melkor). In order to conclude their mission to its fullest success, the elves need protection against such factors, a protection given by the power of their rings. I see Galadriel's realm as one in which the elves are allowed to manifest their sub-creative skills in all matters of life, to successfully resist Sauron and to ultimately fulfill a critical part of Eru's plan: the raising of Men to a higher level of their potential.

[davem]

I see Galadriel's realm as one in which the elves are allowed to manifest their sub-creative skills in all matters of life, to successfully resist Sauron and to ultimately fulfill a critical part of Eru's plan: the raising of Men to a higher level of their potential.

I could see this applying to Rivendell, but hardly to Lorien. Lorien is increasingly cut off from the world of Men as a direct consequence of Celeborn & Galadriel's policy.

[Lalwendë]

I think that Men are able to 'reach their potential' without the Elves - as shown in Men like Faramir - he may look fondly on his Numenorean heritage but he is living in Gondor, a long way from the Elves. The only Man we see who has had extensive dealings with Elves, and with Lorien, is Aragorn. In this respect I can see that he must have received a great deal of learning and guidance from the Elves, but again, it must from Rivendell that he gains the greater influence. Lorien's isolation from the world of Men has resulted in it being viewed with great suspicion by Men, so if the Elves were meant to help Men achieve their potential then those in Lorien have failed, surely?

[Nogrod]

Isn't it also in a way, that we have two traditions present at the same time, at least in the west. The one would say, that the mankind has fallen from paradise and continues to fall. Everything that is, is less than what was. The second would say, that we, as a mankind, are climbing the ladders of enlightenment and evolution, to the future, that will be all the better for everyone?

[=Raynor] According to Letter #181, the elves represent "the artistic, aesthetic, and purely scientific aspects of the Humane nature raised to a higher level than is actually seen in Men. That is: they have a devoted love of the physical world, and a desire to observe and understand it for its own sake and as 'other' - sc. as a reality derived from God in the same degree as themselves - not as a material for use or as a power-platform. They also possess a 'subcreational' or artistic faculty of great excellence". Their ennoblement of the Men race (at least through the union of the blood lines) is part of a divine plan. In the same text quoted above, Dangweth Pengolodh, it is stated that:
Quote:

Others perceiving that in nothing do Men, and namely those of the West, so nearly resemble the Eldar as in speech, answer that the teaching which Men had of the Elves in their youth works on still as a seed in the dark

And in Myths Transformed it is stated that "in their association with the warring Eldar Men were raised to their fullest achievable stature". Legolas notes that those exiting Lothlorien are "changed" - for the better.

My conclusion would be that the elves had a certain critical role in ME: to raise Men to a higher level, a point illustrated by the above refferences; yet in Middle Earth, the marring of Melkor threatens to accelerate not only the waning of the elven hroa due to the fire of their spirit but also their means of existence (general decay nature, which affects even the gift of the valar, lembas, whose corn can neither grow under the shadow of 'normal' plants, nor can it withstand the evil winds bearing the influence of Melkor). In order to conclude their mission to its fullest success, the elves need protection against such factors, a protection given by the power of their rings. I see Galadriel's realm as one in which the elves are allowed to manifest their sub-creative skills in all matters of life, to successfully resist Sauron and to ultimately fulfill a critical part of Eru's plan: the raising of Men to a higher level of their potential.

I must say, I'm at odds with this "raising men to a higher level of their potential". Isn't Tolkien more like a romantic, who kind of lays before our eyes, what we could have been, but which we never were?

The elves of Middle Earth need protection, yes. But why are they entangled with such "technological" devices as rings? Isn't this just a story of a great fall, when even the (once fallen?) elves had to cling with artifical things to maintain even a part of what they had been?

The times', they are a changing? So decay everywhere? Clinging on to the first story. Tolkien's story of it?

Tolkien's vision of art might be a subject to another discussion. He surely was a child of his time (as we too are, of course). But some basic, conceptual things could be opened from the vantage point of history...