I am going to try to do it... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

ninja91 · 07-24-2006, 06:41 PM

Well, Hookbill, thank you for the advice. You are right; there is more trouble than it is worth trying to get the rights to Sindarin, so, I might as well develop a completely new elvish language. Plus, it is the thrill of creating something new, to me at least.

alatar · 07-24-2006, 08:21 PM

Good luck with your work.

And I hope that you're able to maintain the enthusiasm, as you seem to be in for a long haul. Note that I be on that long list of people that was going to write the next big epic, but after a few chapters I got distracted, got bogged down in a word or two, then never quite found the time...the fire may be out but there's still a pilot light in there somewhere (if you understand what that is).

So do what you can, try to finish even a small bite or two, and make time for it each day/week and stick to it.

And let the Tolkien stuff go, as stated above. Make your own languages, characters, places, etc, and let the next generation face your team of lawyers...

Lalwendë · 07-25-2006, 03:58 AM

You only have to look at some of the great work coming out to realise that fantasy does not have to copy what Tolkien did! You don't always have to have Elves, Wizards, Dragons etc if you don't want them.

I'd always recommend some reading to see what others have achieved. Here's an entirely unbiased list of some of my faves.

Try Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell for a truly weird and immense work that combines fantasy with the late 18th Century - plenty of politics and military detail.

Sandman comics show just how far you can go, how extensive and complex a work you can create without necessarily creating languages and maps. These also show that you can deal with gender politics and other modern and adult issues in fantasy.

Harry Potter of course has great plotlines whatever other readers think about Rowling. It also combines the modern world with the fantastic.

Mists Of Avalon is a long and complex novel which weaves a more Pagan take on the Arthurian legends, together with a lot of 'psychological' insights.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 07-25-2006, 08:31 AM

I'm going to give advice contrary to whatever everyone else is saying. Don't feel like you have to censor out the Sindarin immediately. Don't hack into your story to pull out anything that looks like it might not fly. Not until you finish it. If you censor yourself early on, worrying about what's already been written, you'll lose you initiative and start writing averagely. You don't want average.

Write what feels right for your story. Don't bother editing. Just let the story out. You can always edit later.

And ignore every single person that mumbles the words "you can't". What they mean to say is that they can't. They'll only cripple you with uncertainty if you listen.

And no. I'm not writing an epic. I'm writing a macabre pseudo-realist novel set in modern times. *shrug* I'm not ready for fantasy yet.

And above all, good luck!

Folwren · 07-25-2006, 10:23 AM

Good luck! Even if you don't end up getting it published, keep writing. In time, you may well write something that can get published, even if it isn't what you have in mind now. I think writing is one of the best things a person can do to escape the bounds of regular, boring, busy life.

I've been working on stories in my own world for four years now and have written several stories. Only one of them, which I have just now finished, is possibly worthy of getting published, but I've only now begun thinking about it, so there's yet a long road to walk. What's more, I didn't have any other languages in it, and it only involves Men, and I think it would be more difficult to publish if it did have all that in it.

Keep working on it!

-- Folwren

ninja91 · 07-26-2006, 08:47 AM

Wow! Thanks to everyone for all the advice! As I said before, I have decided to create a new language instead of using Tolkien's Sindarin elvish. And, as a sidenote, wizards wont be entirely present like Gandalf and Saruman were. Any person who is powerful enough will be able to call upon some magic: it just depends how powerful the user is. Remember, if there are any questions, let me know.

Lalwendë · 07-26-2006, 02:42 PM

Making words for a new language of your own isn't as scary as it seems. Tolkien was a language expert so it might never be as complex as his, but the basics of what he did was to look at existing and ancient words and create new words from roots. Also he would 'retrieve' an old word and give it new/alternate meaning - e.g. how Ent, Old English for Giant was used.

The difference might be that while Tolkien created the story so he could use his invented languages, you might be inventing a language to fit the tale; not all that difficult if you do it while you are writing, and of course we have the benefit of computers for handy cross-referencing.

It might be worth having a look at some other books where writers have created new words, e.g. 1984 and A Clockwork Orange.

07-24-2006, 08:21 PM	#2
alatar Doubting Dwimmerlaik Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Heaven's basement Posts: 2,466	Good luck with your work. And I hope that you're able to maintain the enthusiasm, as you seem to be in for a long haul. Note that I be on that long list of people that was going to write the next big epic, but after a few chapters I got distracted, got bogged down in a word or two, then never quite found the time...the fire may be out but there's still a pilot light in there somewhere (if you understand what that is). So do what you can, try to finish even a small bite or two, and make time for it each day/week and stick to it. And let the Tolkien stuff go, as stated above. Make your own languages, characters, places, etc, and let the next generation face your team of lawyers... __________________ There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.

07-25-2006, 03:58 AM	#3
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	You only have to look at some of the great work coming out to realise that fantasy does not have to copy what Tolkien did! You don't always have to have Elves, Wizards, Dragons etc if you don't want them. I'd always recommend some reading to see what others have achieved. Here's an entirely unbiased list of some of my faves. Try Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell for a truly weird and immense work that combines fantasy with the late 18th Century - plenty of politics and military detail. Sandman comics show just how far you can go, how extensive and complex a work you can create without necessarily creating languages and maps. These also show that you can deal with gender politics and other modern and adult issues in fantasy. Harry Potter of course has great plotlines whatever other readers think about Rowling. It also combines the modern world with the fantastic. Mists Of Avalon is a long and complex novel which weaves a more Pagan take on the Arthurian legends, together with a lot of 'psychological' insights. __________________ Gordon's alive!

07-25-2006, 08:31 AM	#4
Feanor of the Peredhil La Belle Dame sans Merci Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: perpetual uncertainty Posts: 5,517	I'm going to give advice contrary to whatever everyone else is saying. Don't feel like you have to censor out the Sindarin immediately. Don't hack into your story to pull out anything that looks like it might not fly. Not until you finish it. If you censor yourself early on, worrying about what's already been written, you'll lose you initiative and start writing averagely. You don't want average. Write what feels right for your story. Don't bother editing. Just let the story out. You can always edit later. And ignore every single person that mumbles the words "you can't". What they mean to say is that they can't. They'll only cripple you with uncertainty if you listen. And no. I'm not writing an epic. I'm writing a macabre pseudo-realist novel set in modern times. shrug I'm not ready for fantasy yet. And above all, good luck! __________________ peace

07-25-2006, 10:23 AM	#5
Folwren Messenger of Hope Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a tiny, insignificant little town in one of the many States. Posts: 5,076	Good luck! Even if you don't end up getting it published, keep writing. In time, you may well write something that can get published, even if it isn't what you have in mind now. I think writing is one of the best things a person can do to escape the bounds of regular, boring, busy life. I've been working on stories in my own world for four years now and have written several stories. Only one of them, which I have just now finished, is possibly worthy of getting published, but I've only now begun thinking about it, so there's yet a long road to walk. What's more, I didn't have any other languages in it, and it only involves Men, and I think it would be more difficult to publish if it did have all that in it. Keep working on it! -- Folwren __________________ A young man who wishes to remain a sound atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. - C.S. Lewis

07-26-2006, 02:42 PM	#7
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	Making words for a new language of your own isn't as scary as it seems. Tolkien was a language expert so it might never be as complex as his, but the basics of what he did was to look at existing and ancient words and create new words from roots. Also he would 'retrieve' an old word and give it new/alternate meaning - e.g. how Ent, Old English for Giant was used. The difference might be that while Tolkien created the story so he could use his invented languages, you might be inventing a language to fit the tale; not all that difficult if you do it while you are writing, and of course we have the benefit of computers for handy cross-referencing. It might be worth having a look at some other books where writers have created new words, e.g. 1984 and A Clockwork Orange. __________________ Gordon's alive!