WWJ XI: When World's Collide

[Boromir88]

'Between Sleepy and Gil, I think Gil is more likely a wolf. It's rather hard to tell because he is, I think, acting rather bold for a wolf. He's mysterious, quiet, contradicts himself a lot, just doesn't seem to be how the lone wolf would be acting in this situation. But see this is where I get into trouble, I often think that someone is too bold to be a wolf, therefor that person can't be a wolf.'

'Then there's Gil, who lashed out just a little bit today. I din't think he's been useless, and as Kath points out he's had things to say. Though I think Gil looks like he's in a desperate spot, as I've never known one from his family to act the way he's done today.'

[Kath]

Kath had not found anything in her mug to make her any the wiser and it was getting late.

"It is time for me to vote, and though my thoughts have proved wrong in the past lets hope I have it right this time.

++LOMMY

My suspicions haven't changed in the last few hours, and I can't shake the feeling that there is something wrong about Lommy. My analysis of her holds more concrete reasons why."

And with that, she left.

[Boromir88]

Boromir realized that he may not have been so clear in his last post so, to clear everying up, he addressed everyone in the Inn 'When I said 'It's hard to tell because he is,...' The he, I meant was Sleepy, just in case if that wasn't clear.'

[Macalaure]

With a deep sigh Macalaure lifted himself off his chair.

"I think I will vote for Gil-Galad today. He seemed very tense to me, and there should be no reason to, as were doing good at the moment. Also, why did Valesse not vote for him yesterday?
Still, I'm not very happy with my vote. After all I'm not that suspicious of him, but I'm even less suspicious about the rest...

So,

++Gil-Galad"

[Thinlómien]

"Well, I'll start with myself" Thinlómien said, "after all we Elves are not that interested in mortals and their matters." She smiled.

"Now, Kath to your accusations:

Also, again there's that contention issue of whether Lommy was trusted by the rest of the village at the time, she thinks yes, I think no.

Oromë save me, I never believed I was trusted! I just wasn't suspected. They are two very different things.

Votes Di because she's the only suspect she can get lynched, but then takes a drink 'in memory of Di in case she's innocent'. Apologising for killing someone before their role has been discovered has often been seen as suspicious, and though this isn't technically an apology it's as close to one as you can get without actually saying sorry.

I guess there is nothing to say, but that I wished not to be harsh for Diamond. And I was so unsre about her guilty. (If you read through you will discover that though she was a suspect of mine, she was not a main suspect.) Besides, we Elves tend to respect those going to die, that weird gift of Ilúvatar's.

Then says she will re-look at Boro, Noggie and Mac to see how important they were in Menel's lynching. But this follows the sentence saying she will leave them be because of Menel's lynching. Still, I suppose this could be typical Lommy flip-flopping.

That is typical Lommy flip-flopping; not expressing thoughts clearly and contradicting myself though I have a clear thought. I trusted Noggie, Mac and Boro in principle, but wanted to check their actions once again. I did not except to find anything incriminating; I believed I would only get a confirmation for my belief that they all played an important part in Menel-wolf's lynch. Now, this might seem flipflopperish to you too, but I can't explain it any further, so you must either take that as a normal way for me to speak and think or regard that as a suspicious. That's it.

This is all great, it’s just that she seems to be working off and trying to argue against the summary I came up with on Day 2, which by this time was out of date already.

Believe or not, your summary didn't even cross my mind while doing that.

Votes Kath due to edginess in her words (still looking for an explanation on that Lommy)

It was just general impression, not any specific comment. Your answers were uncharacteristically sharp and defensive. It troubled me.

Gil and Sleepy suspicious, but without reasoning.

True, about both of them it was more a general feeling than reason. Though if you look back, Gil says some really suspicious things. (Just ask, and I'll find the quotes, but I'd rather not waste my time on it.)"

Thinlómien rose up and paced around the table. "We must get rid of one unsure today, I understand, but I'd rather not have it being me as I'm innocent. Lynch me, fellow villagers, if you will - that's not a great loss since there's only one wolf left and six innocents - but I'd recommend us to lynch the wolf instead."

The elf stablehand sat down again. "I have limited time. That's enough for a defense. Now, to more important matters. I'm probably going to do a Naria and a Kath-analysis, or at least take a closer look at them."

EDIT: xed with Macalaure

[Thinlómien]

"Here is the long-expected Kath-analysis from me:

On Day One she:
(147) Dashed in, voted Valesse (because she was the only one she heard to speak), apologised and dashed out. Now, this speaks good for her. I don't believe that a wolf would use her fellow wolf in such a trivial accusation and vote. If she's not lying, she did not know the situation at all, so it might have been fatal to vote Val.

On Day Two she:
(182) Made her famous summary of Day One's events. Expresses suspicion of Boro's, mine, Nogrod's and Mac's actions. Speaks of a careful coreagraphy made by the wolves.
(184) Told Naria she did put commentary in her summary. Said she was suspicous of me, Noggie and Boro based on the way Menel treated us and we treated him. Spoke of a careful coreagraphy made by the wolves. Said it's nice that Naria's taking a more active role and that more input from her would be lovely.
(198) Apologised possible confusion. Voted me because in her opinion I was surprised of being accused and imagined being in a position of trust.

On Day Three she:
(244) Explained that she did not suspect Mac. Explained her "plan"-thing. Asked me about "her being quite radically against the general opinion". Disliked Boro speaking of his innocence as a truth. Said she thought the Menel-lynch went pretty much the opposite way than I said it went, didn't know what to think of that. Explained her comment on Naria. Voted Boro because:

It is possible that I am reacting to his tone and the way he says things, but he is the most suspicious to my mind. His posts are somehow superior and from what I can see he has barely posted toDay, with what he has said being argumentative in nature rather than helpful. To be perfectly honest what I would really like is absolute proof of his role, and bar a dream we have no way of getting that other than lynching.

On Day Four she:
(262) Jokingly suggested that she should let Noggie, Boro and Volo find the last wolf. Said she will be back later with thoughts.
(273) Analysed me, Sleepy and Gil. Summarised it as:

“My findings therefore are that Gil is innocent, and that Lommy and Sleepy both look pretty guilty but Lommy more so. However, given my track record that probably means that we should lynch Gil and assume Lommy is innocent! . . . I just wish I could be sure of what I’m thinking.”

(281) Voted me based on her analysis.

Today she:
(294) Suggested going through Boromir's posts for hints. Says she'll keep an eye on me and Sleepy.
(295) Analysed Boro. Concluded from the narration Boro had only three dreams. Says he probably dreamed of both Menel and Valesse. Said I, Volo and Naria are suspicious."

Thinlómien took a long breath before continuing:

"And here's Naria:

On Day One she:
(122) Talked about pancakes.
(125) Talked more about pancakes. Wondered why people don't show up and regarded it as suspicious. (Glirdy had been murdered 6h before this, so there was no real hurry.) I still see this as a quite suspicious action. Or then it was provocation to speak up.
(170) Voted me the only reason being:

"Well...might as well add another name to the pile, eh."

I think she should have had a better reasoning after following through all that had happened during the day. Even a vague suspicion.

On Day Two she:
(177) Was amused by the term Nariatic.
(183) Woke Nogrod. Said Kath did not put personal thoughts in her summary.
(188) Took her words back about there being no comments in Kath's summary. Asked Boro why he thought Kath had five suspects, disagreed with him.
Did not vote.

On Day Three she:
(217) Was unsure of Valesse, slightly positive about Gil's innocence, willing to keep an eye on Kath, baffled by Nogrod (because he was not taking the bull by the horns as usual in her opinion), did not understand Boromir (said he wanted always to make a point but always reiterated himself), thought Sleepy was hiding something and I too trusting, named Mac her prime supect (because:

mainly for your banterings where you seem to know a little too much on how werewolved woud/should act f.ex. "having fun" when they kill. I mean sure they might(and most likely do),but who in Arda would come right out and say that...that post sounds like you are bragging and trying to see if you can get away with it

) and said Volo seemed strange, like he was guided.
(221) Was not impressed by Boro's sarcasm. Expressed suspicion of Gil because he said:

wow... there goes my suspicons... do you know that the werewolves have either saved me or condemned me, because if i wanted to vote valier i wouldn't have killed her as a werewolf... very paradoxing eh?

(That was in fact one of the susspicious statements by Gil I mentioned before.)
(238) Voted Mac.

On Day Four she:
(274) Found me, Kath, Mac and Boro innocent, says she never suspected any of us. (But what did she say in 217? Slightly contradicting, or not? Check: http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpos...&postcount=217). Found Gil mildly suspicious because "some things he has said". Suspected Sleepy, for being flip-floppy and being "dodgy with queries that come his way". Said Nogrod is the most suspicious, because in her opinion he was continuously biased towards each day's main supect and he's too sure of Boro's innocence and after he had said Valier's a great asset she was murdered. Not very great reasoning in my opinion.
(287) Voted Nogrod based on the reasons above.

Today she:
(297) Was dismayed of Gil's lynch and said she would take a good look at those who voted him. (Though she thought him mildly suspicious the day before. Flip-flopping, I say. It's so easy to be wise afterwards.)"

Thinlómien took some applejuice for herself seeing that Wilwa was not present. Sipping it, she opened her mouth again. "Kath looks pretty innocent to me, though I can't help wondering that she never joins bandwagons and always has a not-very-popular-suspect. (Means someone who is not about to get lynched.) I've heard tales of wolves who act exactly like this, and less of innocents."

She lowered her cup and looked at the depths of it. "Naria, in the other hand, looks quite bad. She flip-flops more than I do, has no sound reasoning and changes her suspects almost daily. (Except Nogrod.) I think she might be the one I'm going to vote today."

"Sleepy's suspicious to me too. He purposefully raises a veil of mystery between him and the others by not sharing his suspects though he has them etc. and I find this quite worrying. Had someone else behaved like that, he surely would have been lynched already. Besides, I have a feeling our remaining wolf is a he."

Thinlómien took a long gulp from her cup. "I must vote soon. It is Sleepy or Naria."

xed with Sleepy

[Thinlómien]

"My books of general lore tell me that the members of the Sleepious Family are fond of being mysterious, so that might be normal. Besides, my most convincing argument against Sleepy is probably the he-argument. He is difficult to have a grasp of or make a picture about. So, Sleepy, please be open and share you thoughts that no one else has to judge you based on such limited information you've given this far."

Thinlómien the Elf emptied her cup. "I hold Sleepy and Naria equally suspicious, but as my feeling of Naria being suspicious is more based on arguments and Sleepy on feelings, I will be rational and vote

++NARIA

I do not imagine to have guts like Valier's, so it trust my wits (though they aren't that wonderful either)."

Thinlómien cast an amused look at Nogrod and especially at Kath, and giggled mischeviously, before she said: "Naria, if you're not a wolf, but a fellow victim, I apologise for trusting my wits more than my guts."

She left the inn.

[Macalaure]

"I just took a look at the people who voted Gil yesterday and those who didn't:

1) Gil -> Mac
2) Lommy -> Gil
3) Sleepy -> Kath
4) Volo -> Sleepy
5) Kath -> Lommy
6) Mac -> Gil(2)
7) Boro -> Gil(3)
8) Naria -> Nogrod
9) Nogrod -> Gil(4)

Unfortunately, all those ghastly Gil-waggoners are now proven innocent, so I don't think we can make much of Lommy's vote for him. They all shared the reason "I don't think he's sooo suspicious, but I have no one better".
Looking at the other votes, Volo is proven innocent, Sleepy's looks bad because of the reason, Kath's and Naria's were backed by reasons.

I'm afraid this doesn't really help...

One thing that caught my eye:
The wolf chose the same victim the last two days. Did s/he choose Boromir because s/he thought he was generally dangerous to him/her, or because s/he already suspected him of being the seer. I would suspect the latter. If so, then there's one thing the wolf wouldn't want the seer to do on his last day: leave obvious hints.

Originally Posted by Sleepy Ranger, yesterday

I'd like to ask the seer to leave clues in any manner they deem safe. Just something for us to build on in case the wolf does get lucky.

If my thoughts are correct, then Sleepy would be a mad wolf, or none at all."

With a deep sigh Macalaure sat down.

"Would anybody tell me whom to vote for today? I'm at one hell of a loss..."

[Nogrod]

"Lommy wait!" Nogrod cried for the elf and pulled quickly inside the bar.

Sorry brothers and sisters, I'm in a hurry, Lommy is already going... we have an adventure but will be back, later on Day6. Sorry.

But I would have to vote. I share the angst with many that have spoken toDay. There seems to be not a lot of good cases and I haven't time to go through things at this hour. But I'll vote and give a reason for it. That's a principle of mine."

Nogrod seemed to think for a second and then said.

++ Naria

I don't like this as it's already a second vote for her and given in haste. But there are things I can say about her I can't of the other three unknowns.

- I agree with Maca that I've an odd feeling about her, hardly agreeing with anything she says.

- Lommy's analysis showed her off pretty bad.

- It looks like she's intent of getting me killed with whatever way possible and at least in her first speech toDay she tried to pull our attention out of the important questions (do we actually have three innocents or not) to blaming Gil-voters and pointing at my care for the ranger (and her accusation, if it was one, I admit I didn't quite get).

All this counted, it might look like she is trying to twist our ways. Trying to prevent us from succeeding. The thought from earlier on passes my mind: what if this has to do with the possible trickery we were forewarned of? A cobbler might act just like that: being able to be bolder than a wolf but still thriving to the same end?

Not so much wits but guts and imaginative theory here... Sorry, but I can't do better at the moment.

I hope to see as many of you alive toMorrow evening!"

With that he ran out from the bar and went after Lommy.

[Nogrod]

"My reason to think of Gil as a wolf relies mainly on what Valesse did last night. So it's not his own making, in a sense. Within the same breath, I agree with the point made by some, that his quite verbal and passionate defence was something my lorebooks stand in dark contrast to. It might be genuine and as such I could understand it very well. But for a veteran family like his is, it assuredly seems an odd difference in behaviour. And there still is the problem of Valesse last evening. Maybe she was totally baffled, tense, over-agitated, late, whatever? Out of her wits - or at least anything like a better judgement - she must have been if Gil is not a wolf. That fact I think is hard to get around. And it casts a grim shadow over Gil."

Nogrod was toying with his empty pint and tried to concentrate a bit more before going to get another one.

"The things said over our sister Lommy and brother Sleepy deserve a second look by all of us. That's what I think. And I try to think of them even this evening. But all the three can't be wolves as there is only one left - if there are no extra tricksies involved. I kinda have a bad feeling about that last possibility. Like something in my dreams before we got thrown in here would have said that there could be something like that... So there might be still a surprise awaiting even if we get the things right with normal standards."

Nogrod thought his own words for a while and then stood up, getting to the desk only to see that Volo had already left. He walked to the other side of the desk and poured himself a new pint, leaving a few coins to the counter.

"So getting it right toDay would be the best. That's why all of us still awake and present should speak out now. Together we see more than anyone of us alone, and basically there's only one wolf along to muddy the waters. Of other things we do not know and thence can't quite openly react to them. But that just to remind us..."

Nogrod was staggering somewhat as he went back to his place.

EDIT: X-talked with a burst of discussion...

[Boromir88]

'This is the most unsure I've been so far' Boromir said surprisingly weakly and with little confidence in his voice. 'Gil's been the most suspicious one today.'

++Gil-galad

[Nogrod]

"I've just tried to recollect things Kath said in her summary over Lommy and taken a short look of my own." Nogrod said and took a look over the remaining villagers at the bar.

"We have three votes left, brother and sister. Let's use them wisely.

Firstly and the most condemningly: she was almost too happy to go after Gil this morning. I mean it looked a bit strange, check yourselves. If she were a nervous loner-wolf, it would be understandable. Someone had made a credible case against someone else than the last remaining wolf (herself?), so that would have been all she could hope for and she was all too happy to jump the waggon - or trying to create it in the first place? This really makes me think...

Two lesser notes still.

A more experienced Lommy, taught by her grannies of several generations, might have learned her the trick of using that flip-flop as a tactics. What's better for a wolf than not having to make any points and stand behind them as everyone just waits her to contradict herself on the next speech?

Secondly her "saying sorry" about Di as pointed out by Kath. I know we all feel guilty and insecure after we have voted for another villager. Surely we don't know the outcome of our votes but just hope for the best. But who would underline that with her own vote if not the wolf?

But will these make a case over her? The first one looks bad, the others might be explained away. I still think I'm going for Gil with the kind of clear reasons in his case. I'll try to have a time for Sleepy too, but the time seems to be running out..."

Nogrod fell back to lean to the chair and took a small sip this time.

X-sipped my beer over Boro

[Nogrod]

Nogrod realised what had happened while he had been sipping his latest sip. He counted the votes in his head once again, trying to make it right. "Okay Gil-pal, you are lynched tonight. And I think that so far you are the best candidate.

++ Gil-Galad"

Just hope we don't have to continue this toMorrow anymore... With that he fell back to the chair once again, taking a long draught of the ale.

X-talked with Naria

[Nogrod]

"Oh Naria. I just heard what you said but I'm not sure whether you have listened to what I have said in my turn. If we are around tomorrow, let's discuss this.

But just a short note to the ranger - sorry if you already thought of that. But be careful with your choice toNight. It will most probably be a wasted choice as the one of the last night will be killed toNight anyway (if the rules are what they have used to be so no guardianship of the same person two nights in a row - maybe you should check that out?). So think carefully, who you would like to protect the Night after the upcoming one. Sorry. No undervaluing of your thinking skills here, just a remainder if you had forgotten. I mean: If the one killed toNight is not the seer, and the wolf is still at loss, that is most important...

Just felt I had to say that one out."

[Gil-Galad]

sigh... fine, end my torture here, actually i'll even help you!! the sooner you vote me off the better!

--Macalaure

++Gil-Galad

(not sure about retractable votes)


Gil-Galad - Ordinary Villager, may the villagers rest in peace at the injustice.

[Gil-Galad]

also, you do know that you are leaving your discussions about whose the wolf and voting me out instead, a unnessercery side-step.

also, after my lynching i would look at everyone that voted for me, because a wolf would probably go with majority to save himself if he gets accused for voting for an innocent, then the wolf will bring up the other villagers that voted.

[Naria]

Originally Posted by Mac

Why would he urge the lynching of two wolves and get himself in this not-so-good situation?

"Well first of all that is what a fanged Nogrod would do. Two of his comrads are dead. He needs to do something. So yeah, that would be the perfect plan...he is more than capable of looking after himself without the other two's help. He knows he can do it...just a little schmoozing with the right people is all it takes. And obviously by this

Originally Posted by Volo

Nogrod is a real genius mastermind with some really wierd strategy or then he is innocent

his plan is working .

And once again Noggy you are jumping on who is 'the most popular today game'. How incredibly evil of you, Naria said with a sarcastic giggle. Gil is by no means a threat...he never has been and maybe never will be. You mentioned something about reacting 'over-defense' in regards to my theory post. Well I wasn't talking about overly defensiveness, no I was talking about a comment...that's all just a comment. Come now Nog...you know that you can't resist when you are an ordo."

If I happen to be alive tomorrow...I will continue this discussion then...for now I will cast my vote."

++Nogrod

Oh and to the Seer...I think it would be a really good idea to have a dream about Nogrod tonight. I know I am on to something here