WW XXIIX - Queer Lodgings

[Anguirel]

I don't want to turn today into a trial of my guilt or innocence, as I know that that would be a complete waste of time better spent pursuing actual wolves. Naturally, Nori, I do not expect you to believe me.

However I must echo Rune's point that your accusation doesn't add up in this particular:

1. You think you've spotted me as a wolf because I've been right about two innocents

2. You say you think I've been "very crafty"

I agree with Rune that blabbing about innocent villagers would be exceedingly dim of a wolf. You can't have it both ways, Nori88 - accuse me of stupidity, but don't accuse me of cunning.

I flip-flopped on Gloanna, actually, to my annoyance in retrospect. I should have defended her properly, and voting would have helped as well...

So I haven't actually given unqualified support to both of the lynched innocents. Which means, I suppose, I could still be a cunning wolf.

If you are a wolf, Nori88, you're getting surprisingly hot under the collar - you've been known to behave with more savoir-faire - so I'm willing to grant you a stay of execution. I still think that statement of Voloin's was extraordinary, and that he is probably a wolf working with you or Bofgrod, but I now doubt that it's both of you.

[Anguirel]

The wolves' most deadly weapon, my friends, is consensus.

Originally Posted by Bofgrod

There seems to be quite a common consent forming around here... Bomburlass is generally accepted as an innocent, Glóanna is a wolf, Valier looks suspicious, Voloin is somewhat suspicious and Nori88 somewhat more to the innocent side... I do share these sentiments at the moment.

Originally Posted by Voloin

Nogrod, he doesn't look wolfish, he is a big help and I'm pretty sure that the seer has either already checked him or will check him soon. Just like he himself said about Boromir88, such wolves are for the seer to catch. I trust both names here.

Unintentionally or through ingenious subtlety, these two players here both encourage a kind of defeatism, suggesting that certain suspects are off-limits, not to be worried about, safe to assume about. That worries me.

[Valier]

Ahhh I see what you are saying Ang. I saw this post of Nogs and thought along the same lines (well in different words) But I did miss Volos. Now I see what makes him so suspicious. This could be a gifted ploy though to try and leave hints incase they die. Hmmmmmm

[Anguirel]

Nori, like Gloanna I am too exhausted to argue with you, and I would not be that surprised if my fate turned out to be similar.

As it happens, I do have some positive action I'd like to pursue - a closer look at Bomburlass. However, at the moment I intend to vote for Volo.

I think that you, Nori, are probably innocent, if blinkered, because of the force with which you're pressing your case. But I would enjoy lynching you a lot, so my eye won't stray from your fabulous oratory...

[Anguirel]

Finally I'd like to note that having read over my sparse posting yesterday, I wasn't critical of Gloanna's lynching. I even semi-endorsed it before I vanished and, moronically, got distracted and didn't come back...I said something to the effect of "I might even vote for Gloanna".

I also did not spend this morning pointlessly "lamenting over the dead"; rather I brought up a possible link between Volo and Nori and/or Bofgrod, which Nori88 seems rather touchy about.

This is sinking into a duel which I would really rather not sully myself with, so I will concentrate for the moment upon other suspects, namely the unimpeachable Bomburlass and the apparently naive Voloin.

[Meneltarmacil]

I see two main suspects here, Anguirel and Boromir88.

Ang seems to have gone after Boromir a great deal, and offered little insight for most of Day One, though he did get better later on.

As for Boromir88, his Day One mysteriousness seems to have vanished, but his accusations against Anguirel, while possibly believable, do present a problem in that Anguirel's only objection to Kitanna's lynching occurred on Day One, and was mainly more of an observation on her behavior. He later cites this as evidence that Ang and Kitanna may be working together. This does not appear to be the act of a wolf, for if Kitanna dies and is confirmed as an innocent, then the idea of their both being wolves falls apart. Nevertheless, Boromir really strikes me a sodd in that he continues to be suspicious of Anguirel after the fact and twists his words a different way than before to continue to make him look suspicious.
I also intend to keep Kitanna's last words in mind:

I will say this, it seems whenever my ancestors have played with Boromir's he's been utterly convinced I've been a wolf and made sure I was the lynched one (innocent I might add). Yet when the game ends his ancestor remains standing, having led his fanged friends to victory. Keep that in mind.

Make no mistakes, Boromir88. I'm going to keep my eye on you.

[Anguirel]

Originally Posted by Meneltarmacil

I see two main suspects here, Anguirel and Boromir88.

Can I stress that I'd really rather this did not happen? Everyone, keep your minds open and do not get distracted by possibly mutually misguided duellists. Look all about you, rule out no-one out and watch for casuistry, consequentialism and consensus - the three cs of the lupine code.

[Boromir88]

Can I stress that I'd really rather this did not happen? Everyone, keep your minds open and do not get distracted by possibly mutually misguided duellists.~Anguirelshield

For once I agree with you and this puts some bad light on Menel.

I also did not spend this morning pointlessly "lamenting over the dead"; rather I brought up a possible link between Volo and Nori and/or Bofgrod, which Nori88 seems rather touchy about.

No, I wasn't actually touchy about that, if you look I gave you credit for finally stepping out and proposing something. But your first post of the day was a lamentation.

Anyway Valier and Orilin seems innocent...Runi I'm going to wait and see more of. He seems to be rather joyfully sitting back and watching the action.

Anguirelshield is probably a smooth conniving wolf.

Meneltarbo and Voloin have just started to trouble me.

Nobody else has uttered a word today, which taking a look at things this day is supposedly going to be one of the queit ones. This whole day is frustrating.

[Anguirel]

Bofgrod won't be back for most of today if I recall, which is annoying because I want to inquisit him rather.

Nori88, you snivelling, contumacious, cocky little naysayer of your lord and master, if you want a fight I'm perfectly prepared to give you one. You're being foolish, and blustering, and starting to have to backpedal, and you're infuriatingly stubborn, and if you are none of these but guilty then you are the equal of the Necromancer himself, and I'm still considering that option.

Ha.

[Durelin]

Too bad there's no double...triple...quadruple lynchings. I'd like to off all the perpetually quiet ones... They frighten me because I will never be able to really have any even gut feelings about them...well, other than worry.

Menel - Once again your logic confuses me. Why would you ever suspect Boro and Ang together, and basically for the same reason: that they've gone at each other a bit.

Odd.

Originally Posted by Nori88 or what have you

Anyway Valier and Orilin seems innocent

How boring, Boro! Perhaps I was right in calling you "Boro-lite." You disappoint me.

[Meneltarmacil]

Okay, following the advice on avoiding duelists, I've been looking over Runi's posts.

He seems to post mostly in-character stuff the first Day and has a sort of rivalry going with Nogrod that I find somewhat unusual. The people he suspects have mostly turned out to be known innocents, Valier being an exception.

He makes a couple of statements about it being strange that Nogrod is agreeing with him early on and suspecting the same people he does. Nogrod suddenly starts fighting with him after Runi has repeated that sentiment. This I find quite suspicious. It resembles something werewolves typically do: If one of them is acting suspiciously, one of its furry friends will "suspect" it and mention said suspicious behavior, hoping the other wolf will cease its suspicious actions.

With this in mind, combined with suspicion of known innocents, I find it likely that Runi is a wolf. I'll follow up with an analysis of Nogrod later.

[Nogrod]

Back for an hour+, about. I need to check the situation, but as I saw you Ang had something to ask from me, please do it in near future.

[Boromir88]

Anguirelshield, stubborn I'll take as a compliment, cocky...a little. But I will not have my integrity insulted. Even if you be of nobler blood than me I will not bow to one who insults my integrity. I feel passionate about my brothers, I will argue for them with passion, and I will die for them with passion. Once one wolf is down they will all crumble.

I tell you this Anguirelshield, son of Gurthain II, if you be innocent indeed this scrap does nothing to help us. It only impeeds us, and for that I will move on. But if you be fanged may the wrath of Darael the Deathless and your entire house fall upon you for your treachery. This does not clear you, but we've had all we need to say to eachother, and now it's time to move on to more constructive things. Perhaps we can save this Day yet.


Let me look at the Kitanna voters...there sure be a lot of them:

Nilp
Menel
Thinlo
Volo
Bofgrod

(Excluding me I think that's all of them).

The two here that look the worst are Menel and Volo. Menel seems to be subscribing to a lot of things and just simply moving along with everyone. Pretty much a bandwaggoning wolf. And as Bofgrod and Anguirelshield have reinforced there is a village consensus going on...which means we do have bandwaggoning wolves.

Menel's post about myself and Anguirelshield being the two big suspects is exceedingly strange. On Day 1 he was doing a lot of 'yesing' He agreed with me that Kitanna looked strange, he agreed with Durelin that it was quiet and that wasn't good...only wolves like quietness. Then he jumps onto a Kath vote.

On Day 2 he says I don't worry him as much as before, he's not ready to lynch Nogrod yet and will probably go for Kitanna. All of which was generally what the village was thinking at the time...and this just seems like an over-explanation:

Now if anyone thinks I'm trying to say Volo is completely innocent, that isn't the case. It is possible that he's a wolf; however, he is not at the top of my list.

He tries to tell people that Volo is probably double-bluffing (talking about the Eomi voters), but then goes back to play the 'this doesn't mean he's not a wolf' card.

Menel, Volo is there a connection between those two?

Of the Kitanna voters as well, Bofgrod worries me too. I found him suspicious after his role in the Eomi wagon...and let's take a look at yesterday:

Please give me a bit more credit... Were I a wolf I would have voted conveniently for Glóanna or Kathin about an hour before the deadline (were they innocents) as I had had some points against them earlier and just watched the things unfold with a grin.

Personally I never believe anybody who says things like 'If I were a wolf I would have done things differently' that just gets me more suspicious. As many times my ancestors have been wolves, they have all night to think up some sort of defense. And in any village, any wolf can think of a reasonable defense for any vote they make. Basically I'm not buying the 'if I were a wolf I would have jumped onto Kath and Gloanna.'

Of those who did not vote for Gloanna yesterday, Runi looks the most strange. A definite safe vote for Valier where he probably wouldn't face a lot of pressure for as Valier has been mostly absent and is a good spot to hide if a wolf does not want to stick their paws in the Gloanna lynching.

Edit: x-posted with Durelin, Menel, Nogrod

[Anguirel]

Right. Bofgrod:

1. Why were you so quick to take Gloanna's despairing words as an out and out confession? Could you give us some rationale? Do you regret acting the way you did?

2. Why were you so unwontedly happy to follow the consensus emerging about various suspects, even as, to your credit I suppose, you highlighted it?

3. Would you consider it fair to say that at present you have quite a lot of influence in this house?

[Nogrod]

What a mess...

Now how come, when my line is innocent all the people find me suspicious at least a couple of Days or the wolves kill me the first or second Night, but when my family-members are cobblers or wolves, they slip trusted to the end if the Seer does not come in between...

Well, I'm very short on time toDay and I have a feeling that the wolves wish to get me done with. YestrerDay I had time to fight back, but toDay I won't be. So if they manage to turn your minds to serve their mischevious ends, look closely tomorrow who have been the ones to keep this recurring suspicion of myself rolling. Not probably the ones who are the loudest, but those who add to it some little bits to keep the "case" going.

Some answers first, but then I really don't think I should use my scarce minutes on this. (Okay, I know you can't trust my word - but do not go with every whimsical idea some malignant creatures offer you either)

Originally Posted by Nori88

Personally I never believe anybody who says things like 'If I were a wolf I would have done things differently' that just gets me more suspicious.

Personally I can't say I would categorically believe or disbelieve any kind of thing. It depends on who says it and what s/he seems to imply with it. Think of the context, please. If I was most worried about my own skin (ordo or wolf) I should have done just as I said I should have: voted not too early but early enough, for someone about whom I had raised some points already. That's probably the reason my family doesn't get suspected when they're on the dark side as then they play carefully, trying to save their necks. But as an innocent I just try to do whatever I can. Sometimes it goes right, sometimes it goes wrong.

Ok. I saw Ang had questions to me. I'll leave this here this time...