Flaws in the Middle Earth map - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Elmo · 02-12-2007, 02:36 PM

I wonder what Christopher Tolkien meant in the prologue of the Unfinished Tales when he mentioned flaws in the map that he drew of Middle Earth. I wonder what they are, and if the map could be redrawn and improved.

Mithalwen · 02-12-2007, 02:50 PM

I think it has been redrawn - but some of the issues reconciling map to text are raised in"The Journeys of Frodo" by Barbara Strachey. If it is still in print it is a useful companion to LOTR especially for the later part with all the diverging paths.

davem · 02-12-2007, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I think it has been redrawn - but some of the issues reconciling map to text are raised in"The Journeys of Frodo" by Barbara Strachey. If it is still in print it is a useful companion to LOTR especially for the later part with all the diverging paths.

The only one I can think of without checking is the addition of Eryn Vorn. Journeys of Frodo is definitely still in print, & receives high praise from CT.

Legate of Amon Lanc · 02-12-2007, 03:10 PM

Concerning this, do you know how much correct is in this way Karen Wynn Fonstad's Atlas, if any of you have it? I think it is "revised" but I am not sure how much correct it is, and if there were not any newer clarifications which wouldn't be shown in there.

davem · 02-12-2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Concerning this, do you know how much correct is in this way Karen Wynn Fonstad's Atlas, if any of you have it? I think it is "revised" but I am not sure how much correct it is, and if there were not any newer clarifications which wouldn't be shown in there.

Again, CT praises the Atlas so I'm inclined to think it's correct. He also speaks very highly of Foster's Guide, so those are the ones I tend to reach for first.

Actually, I found out about (& joined) the Tolkien Society via an advert in the back of the 1978 Allen & Unwin edition of the Guide, which I still have - though now I also have the 'de-luxe' edition with the Ted Naismith illustrations as well. Looking at my shelves I note I still have a few of the Tolkien books I bought way back then - & a couple of the Calendars (1978 - The Silmarillion calendar & 1979), & of the ones I 'lost' (three volume p/b edition of LotR in a slip case & p/b Hobbit) I've managed to find replacements. Of all my copies of TH that 1976 p/b, found in a second hand bookshop in Derbyshire recently, is my most prized - that was the first Tolkien book I owned.

mhagain · 02-13-2007, 12:47 PM

I think CT can tend to be a little bit too self-critical regarding his own input into the whole Middle-Earth thing. It's well documented, but easy enough to forget, that his status at one point was the Principal Collaborator (a glance at any of the letters from the early 1940s will reveal this), and that his work helped shape the Middle-Earth we know and love. It's easy enough to see things that one would have done differently or better with hindsight, but sure ain't we all guilty of that to an extent?

goldfinger · 02-14-2007, 06:29 PM

The map of of Middle Earth was redrawn. It says so on the last page of the appendices just before the maps.

CSteefel · 02-14-2007, 08:48 PM

Does anybody have any idea which flaws these are??

Elmo · 02-15-2007, 08:50 AM

In the UT that he had correct the minor flaws for the map in that book but he could not change the main ones and also JRR used to point out the major flaws to him quite a lot but the professor still used the map as a basis for his tales.

02-12-2007, 02:36 PM	#1
Elmo Pittodrie Poltergeist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: trying to find that warm and winding lane again Posts: 633	Flaws in the Middle Earth map I wonder what Christopher Tolkien meant in the prologue of the Unfinished Tales when he mentioned flaws in the map that he drew of Middle Earth. I wonder what they are, and if the map could be redrawn and improved. __________________ As Beren looked into her eyes within the shadows of her hair, The trembling starlight of the skies he saw there mirrored shimmering.

02-12-2007, 02:50 PM	#2
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,449	I think it has been redrawn - but some of the issues reconciling map to text are raised in"The Journeys of Frodo" by Barbara Strachey. If it is still in print it is a useful companion to LOTR especially for the later part with all the diverging paths. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

02-12-2007, 03:10 PM	#4
Legate of Amon Lanc A Voice That Gainsayeth Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In that far land beyond the Sea Posts: 7,431	Concerning this, do you know how much correct is in this way Karen Wynn Fonstad's Atlas, if any of you have it? I think it is "revised" but I am not sure how much correct it is, and if there were not any newer clarifications which wouldn't be shown in there. __________________ "Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories

02-13-2007, 12:47 PM	#6
mhagain Wight Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: The best seat in the Golden Perch Posts: 219	I think CT can tend to be a little bit too self-critical regarding his own input into the whole Middle-Earth thing. It's well documented, but easy enough to forget, that his status at one point was the Principal Collaborator (a glance at any of the letters from the early 1940s will reveal this), and that his work helped shape the Middle-Earth we know and love. It's easy enough to see things that one would have done differently or better with hindsight, but sure ain't we all guilty of that to an extent? __________________ Then one appeared among us, in our own form visible, but greater and more beautiful; and he said that he had come out of pity.

02-14-2007, 08:48 PM	#8
CSteefel Wight Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 204	Does anybody have any idea which flaws these are?? __________________ `These are indeed strange days,' he muttered. `Dreams and legends spring to life out of the grass.'

02-14-2007, 06:29 PM	#7
goldfinger Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: KC, Missouri Posts: 60	The map of of Middle Earth was redrawn. It says so on the last page of the appendices just before the maps.

02-15-2007, 08:50 AM	#9
Elmo Pittodrie Poltergeist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: trying to find that warm and winding lane again Posts: 633	In the UT that he had correct the minor flaws for the map in that book but he could not change the main ones and also JRR used to point out the major flaws to him quite a lot but the professor still used the map as a basis for his tales. __________________ As Beren looked into her eyes within the shadows of her hair, The trembling starlight of the skies he saw there mirrored shimmering.