Werewolf XXXII: The Lost Age

[Macalaure]

I finally managed to read through today's happenings.

I've started to wonder why (with the exception of Menel) everybody seems to be so convinced of Eomer's innocence. I don't see this at all. That wolf-trap could just as easy have been a confused-innocent-trap of a vampire (in fact, that's how it worked out in the end). I don't say this is the case, but I wonder why nobody has mentioned the possibility so far.

Right now, I'm quite fond of Boromir's innocence. I particularly like his point about Legate and Shasta.

Is it just me or is there something mighty wrong about the way Nogrod and Espiem are argueing with each other? It doesn't leave me with the feeling of two innocents bashing it out.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Page 2 done. Time's almost up again. Will edit momentarily.

Legate, rebutting Boromir's post about my post (thanks for that, by the way):

Originally Posted by Legate

Well I think we'd agree that without accusations we'd get nowhere. However, the ones who care the most on getting someone under any suspicion are the Vampires. So I find Shastani's comment rather in place, or at least I see it "unharmful". It's good in my opinion not to give too much into feelings or first sights and so on on the first day, because we don't know anything yet, basically. Of course accusing is needed, but not just headless.

My notes: Actually, this is the first forum I've played on where first day s happen with regularity (at least, I assume they do). On the others, they're usually discouraged.

Rikae defending herself:

Originally Posted by Rikae

How have I lied? Do you mean my in-character comments about Mac? I was...flirting...with...him. Capisci?

My notes: [frivolous]Is that how you spell the word pronounced "kapeesh"?[/frivolous] It ought to be clear now that Rikae was just bantering.

Nogrod explaining his suspicion, and being caught in a lie (or misunderstanding)

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Not so much that (as I said already) but with Gil. You accuse him of in-character accusations (alongside with Spm) and I don't think he has made any. On the contrary he has been pretty reasonable in his posting so far...

My notes: Gil was the one making accusations, not Rikae.

Rikae explaining:

Originally Posted by Rikae

Gil jumped on my comments about Mac; which were (I thought) blatently in-character/meta.

My notes: I thought so too... Nogrod is suspicious in my mind now.

Kitanna making a mistake:

Originally Posted by Kitanna

It seems unlikely, but unless I've read the rules wrong the vampires have a seer, a ranger, and a hunter on their side, correct? All of those folk receive votes, as does the shade. That's four votes that the voter could lie about to the village.

My notes: It's possible that she just made a mistake, but I thought the rules were pretty clear.

Meneltarmacil stubbornly blaming Rikae:

Originally Posted by Meneltarmacil

Hmm, I must say that Rikae doesn't seem to be creating a lot of trust for me at the moment. She comes up with a meta-explanation and then tries to shift the blame onto Gil-Galad. Not that I'm inclined to think of Gil as absolutely , but given the erratic style he usually uses, he makes a good scapegoat.

I'll probably vote for Rikae toDay.

My notes: Rikae already explained that she wasn't the one accusing people with in-character banter, so I fail to see why you're still suspecting Rikae for that reason.

Diamond being a rebel:

Originally Posted by Diamond

Honestly, I don't really feel like announcing who I vote for.

My notes: Posting votes help the s, the MC said it was legal, I fail to see why you'd wish to hinder that.

Rikae casting suspicion:

Originally Posted by Rikae

OOC - rather, Menel thought me suspicious for suspecting Gil, though he admits Gil looks suspicious. This should send warning signals to anyone...but ...bah. Go ahead. Lynch me.
I am the weaver!

My notes: If Menel is suspicious of Gil, why is he suspicious of Rikae for also being suspicious of Gil?

Meneltarmacil defending himself:

Originally Posted by Meneltarmacil

Rikae, I didn't say that Gil looked particularly suspicious. He was simply an unknown on my list.

My notes: Didn't you say you "didn't think him particularly ", though? I could be wrong, I don't have that post quoted. I'll go back and look.

Roa, voice of reason - Post #60, Page 2 (more on this momentarily)

Brinniel, also suspecting Rikae:

Originally Posted by Brinniel

For now, the only one who sticks out to me is Rikae. Her accusing behaviour is most disconcerting, and I find that she is rather...what's the word...jumpy, I guess is how I could describe it. Unless someone else suddenly turns suspicious to me, she remains my most likely voting candidate.

My notes: You'd be jumpy too, if suspicion was on you.

Sixth defending Gil:

Originally Posted by Sixth

This will sound like I'm defending Gil, but last game he accused me and others relatively shakily and it turned out he was . It is quite hard with him to tell if he is or what.

My notes: I haven't played here before, so I'm not up on posting styles, so if someone could confirm this for me, I'd appreciate it.

Eomer setting a trap:

Originally Posted by Eomer

Kitanna is a vampire. I am very suspicious of what she has done.

My notes: Clever of him.

Lomia stating my thoughts:

Originally Posted by Lomia

I don't see what this mess about Rikae is. I think she seems pretty normal and bantery. Noggie and Gil seem to be allied against her, and I find it very weird.

My notes: My thoughts exactly.

Mac, suspicious of Rikae defending herself:

Originally Posted by Mac

Anyway, please, don't be suspicious of Rikae for flirting with me, I'd make me feel guilty.
The thing that does make me suspicious of her, however, is that she does little else than flirting, in-character things, self-defense and a flimsy case against Nogrod and Gil.

My notes: The case is a bit more than flimsy. Gil accused Rikae of accusing people with in-game banter, and Nogrod lied/made a mistake and accused Rikae of accusing Gil of accusing people with in-game banter.

Mac suspecting with no evidence:

Originally Posted by Mac

Boro has already said it, and I agree: Legate is being too nice for my liking, too.

My notes: Why?

Mac suspecting with no evidence, continued:

Originally Posted by Mac

I'm also perceiving some strange karma from Meneltarmacil.

My notes: Again, why?

Rikae falling in the trap:

Originally Posted by Rikae

"I think Eomer has a good point about Kitanna. I can't quite believe she would honestly make the mistake of thinking the gifteds were on the vampires' side. I would be interested in hearing more from her.
And as for you, Mac, I ought to suspect you for claiming I made a case against Nogrod when I did not.

My notes: Eomer doesn't have a point, it was a baseless accusation. Why'd you jump on it?

Rikae turning the tables:

Originally Posted by Rikae

As I recall, I said I didn't trust Esspiem and Gil. In retrospect, though, since Esspiem had self-defense to think of and Gil is almost always suspicious; Menel's reaction worried me more. I admit, I made a mistake in my response, translating "accusing people based on in-character bantering is suspicious" to "Gil is suspicious" in my mind, simply because that's what Gil did when he called me "very suspicious" for "suspecting two people" (Mac and Esspiem.)

My notes: The part about Gil being almost always suspicious doesn't really make a lot of sense, in context.

Mac apologizing for his mistake:

Originally Posted by Mac

Ack! Gil and Espiem, I meant.

My notes: This was probably an honest mistake.

Eomer springing the trap:

Originally Posted by Eomer

Rikae mentioned that I had 'a good point about Kitanna.' But I didn't. I didn't have a single point about Kitanna. All I said was that she's a vampire and then, from nowhere, Rikae and Celuien are on her case. You, Lommy, can't understand their reasoning, and neither can I.

My notes: The fact that Rikae and Celuien both targeted Kitanna says that either they're looking for an victim, or they're following someone blindly. Since I hardly believe the latter, I have to stick with the former, at least for page 2.

[The Saucepan Man]

Hmm, I have just markedly revised my opinion of you, Shasta. While I don't agree with every point that you have made, you are clearly no bumbling newbie.

And I thought that this was a very well made point:

Originally Posted by Shasta

Just because you find something to be a good thing doesn't necessarily mean others do. I was simply stating my opinion, not telling others what to do or not do.

While I tend to side with Boro on this particular issue (that accusations can be a good way of prompting telling reactions), it is worth bearing in mind that different people approach the game in different ways. Quite often, people (myself included) are far too willing to judge others by reference to what they would do in a particular situation.

[Boromir88]

Ahh...Mac if you're a vampire we are in trouble, I like your point about Eomer. It's most probable that Eomer is an innocent, though we shouldn't take that as a known fact. Your reminder that Eomer is not 'known innocent,' is quite true...though I would tell you that for now I think Eomer is one of the most innocent looking members here and I find others to look more vampire-ish.

Is it just me or is there something mighty wrong about the way Nogrod and Espiem are argueing with each other? It doesn't leave me with the feeling of two innocents bashing it out.~Mac

No alarms are raised in me about SPM, he looks innocent to me. I'm a little less sure about Nogrod and haven't reached a decision on him yet.

Both Nogrod and Boromir88 are smart enough to have thought of using such subtle tactics, so I think at least one of them is likely a Vampire.~Menel

Nothing I do is influenced by Nogrod nor anyone else here. I'm alone and make my own decisions. You are correct that if I was a vampire I would do exactly that, but see something that looks like what a vampire would do often looks like what an innocent would do as well. I thought good points had been raised against Celuien, and I agreed. Though you will see that I consistently was on Legate's case yesterday, I voted for Legate, and I don't think that's going to change today.

Boro, I think you're a bit too accusing towards Shasta as he's a newbie.~Thinlo

Perhaps, you could be right. However, Legate's subtle defense of Shasta yesterday, and Shasta 'accidentally' leaving out Legate today looks more than simply coincidental to me.

As someone who's family history has been a wolf more than just once in the past, that is alarming behavior that shouts wolves! (or in this case vampires). The little defenses of partners and the very little interaction/failing to mention of partners.

Just because you find something to be a good thing doesn't necessarily mean others do. I was simply stating my opinion, not telling others what to do or not do.~Shasta

Quite true, no one has to agree with me. I call it as I see it. Maybe 'blind accusations' just cause confusion and make the vampires jobs easier...however I hardly think sitting around and just 'waiting' for some kind of evidence to appear on someone is hardly a better strategy. Therefor, getting people interacting, accusing, suspecting, has always been helpful to me, so I do it. I encourage others to do it and naturally anyone who suggests differently I think is a bit odd and needs to be looked into more.

I too am liking Gil-galad in this game. I've always found Gil to be someone who's got good instincts and can spot the enemy, but from his times in the past he looked random and I never really took him seriously. It's different now, and I kind of like it. I think we should all pay attention to his remarks here:

wow... now you say that you don't know why you voted me, just a friendly reminder, Every Werewolf game is different, the worst thing to do is to apply what you found out of people last game and bring it here, just about everyone acts differently in every game. Just because Glirdy(using you as an example buddy) was a wolf last game doesn't mean he is going to be a wolf again this game.

Edit: x-ed with everyone past Shasta's last post

[Thinlómien]

Kitanna looks innocent-ish to me now. Even though I disagree with her I find her tone quite sincere. (Note: I'm definitely not considering her innocent!)

There's been a lot of talk about Legate and Shasta. While I don't deny the possibility of them being batmen mates, I don't think the connection between them is obvious in anyway. Vampire-Legate and Vampire-Shasta might have interacted in the way they did, but so could have innocent Legate and innocent Shasta, or innocent Legate and vampire-Shasta, or vampire-Legate and innocent Shasta... If it comes down to voting these guys, I'd rather go for Legate because of his utterly weird Sixth-vote yesterDay...

Originally Posted by Noggie

That means that at least one of our Vampires is an ethically high-level player with some confidence.

I'm inclined to agree, (although I won't be basing my theories and suspects on that assumption)...

Originally Posted by Gil

so i take it that you voted for me because i wasn't valuable to the group... ouch... you're breaking my heart here sixth... but what i jsut noticed is that he listed 2 other people... why those two hmmm? Sixth+Rikae+Nogrod= 3, there are 3 vampires on the lose.... do the math, it could be by chance or it could be sixth attempt to hide his comrades, luckily nobody paid any attention to this post... except me...

I wouldn't read that too straightforwardly. Even though Sixth is relatively unexperienced (this is his second game I believe) I don't think he'd make such a naive mistake. I rather think that in his last game he found these two people smart and reasonable, which I don't wonder at all.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Maybe Durelin's the Shade? That was my first thought when I saw this post, although I can't think why the Shade would want to reveal themselves so early on... probably just banter, but it caught my eye.

Knowing Durelin's style I think that was pretty normal of her. Early on, when there's little to say, she likes making in-character posts. And this time her character just happens to be a slightly unpleasant person.... (no offense, Dury )

PS. Shasta: you should turn yourself invisible. If you don't know how to do it: go to your user cp, then go to options and there you should find an option of "turn to the invisible mode".

[Shastanis Althreduin]

...oh! Thanks, Thinlo, I'll get right on that.