THIS exists in M-E?

[Son of Númenor]

Bilbo himself is furthermore fairly easy to place both socially and even chronologically. If one did not have the rest of the book [The Hobbit] to go on, one would have to place him, on internal evidence, from a time after the discovery of America, for he smokes a pipe, and indeed the last words of the whole book are 'tobacco-jar' ('tobacco' is not recorded in English by the OED till 1588). But one could be more precise than that, for when Bilbo wishes to discourage Gandalf he takes out 'his morning letters', which are clearly routinely delivered early every day. Bilbo must live, then, after the introduction of a postal service - our familiar system dates, in England, from 1837. In a more indirect way Bilbo might also be thought to date from a time after railway-engines, for though it is the narrator's term not his own, when his nerve finally breaks he shrieks 'like the whistle of an engine coming out of a tunnel' (the first freight-and-passenger steam railway in England opened in 1825, the first railway tunnel dating from five years later). (Shippey, J.R.R. Tolkien: Author of the Century, Chapter I: The Hobbit: Re-Inventing Middle-earth)

This tidbit just fell into my lap as I began reading Shippey's book (which I highly recommend thus far!). The chapter goes on to discuss the ways in which Bilbo begins his journey through the ancient fairy tale world of The Hobbit as an anachronistic traveler, a solid connection to Victorian and Edwardian values. Gradually the playing field is leveled, so to speak, to the point where he becomes 'worthy', in Shippey's words, of interaction with the mythic.

The LotR passage in question in this thread is one of the final snips at the tether that binds the hobbits safely to contemporary English-ness; after the first few chapters they are thrust squarely into the ancient mythological landscape with only a few glimpses backward.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Son of Númenor

This tidbit just fell into my lap as I began reading Shippey's book (which I highly recommend thus far!). The chapter goes on to discuss the ways in which Bilbo begins his journey through the ancient fairy tale world of The Hobbit as an anachronistic traveler, a solid connection to Victorian and Edwardian values. Gradually the playing field is leveled, so to speak, to the point where he becomes 'worthy', in Shippey's words, of interaction with the mythic.

The LotR passage in question in this thread is one of the final snips at the tether that binds the hobbits safely to contemporary English-ness; after the first few chapters they are thrust squarely into the ancient mythological landscape with only a few glimpses backward.

Good, isn't it? Both book and idea? I more or less agree with what Shippey says here, and it adds grist to the mill that the whole 'express train' image was on the part of the narrator. I have to say it doesn't really intrude for me as The Shire sounds such a familiar, not very far-away, place.

Now on the gunpowder...an idea springs to mind...the substance clearly exists and Gandalf clearly has an almost supernatural grasp of using it in fireworks (as shown by Boro's explanation of how modern fireworks are made and how they couldn't hope to compete with the splendid stuff put on display by Gandalf) while Saruman uses it for more nefarious and bloody purposes. Maybe Tolkien is showing us something here? Telling us a lesson about the application of science in the form of technology? Gandalf uses it to make things of beauty whereas Saruman uses it in the application of war. Presumably Gandalf could do this too, but he didn't. So I think that maybe shows us something of Tolkien's thought on uses and abuses of technology?