The plants of middle earth

[Alfirin]

Alatar, If they did they must have left a lot of them as there are dozens of plants called "dragons blood" most famously Draceana draco (www.mgonlinestore.com) the dragons blood of medicine and violin manufacture. As a warning I would also point out not to go smearing croton sap on you wounds unless you know what you are doing as Croton is in the Spurge family (Euphobiacae) most of whose members are famous (or more acurately infamous) for having unbelivablly corrosive sap.

by the way check out this plant www.infojardin.com. Its called Chiranthodendron pentadactylon or in common name hand flower, anyone think that this could be a vegitative remmenent of Saruman's legacy?

I'm not surpised your grandfather's (that is what gaffer means right?) williow fence took root and grew. Willow is famous for doing that. It's one of the main reasons whiy some cultures used williow trees as symbols of immortality and resurrection.

By the way a though ocurred to me with regards to wether a true ebony could yield a piece of wood staight and large enough to yield a staff of hobbit size. As I recall an ebony staff is the badge of office of the so called "Black Rod", the king or queen's liason to Parliament. However never having seen a Parilamentary opeing I have no idea as to how large this staff is. If any of our UK members are here and have perhaps they could enlightent us. If it really is a full size staff that would prove that a solid ebony walking stick could at least be possible.

[Lalwendë]

A question that can only be answered by one of Her Madge's servants like me

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/81909.stm

The 'rod' is what gives him his title - Gentleman Usher of the Black Rod. It is more like a fancy long, slender walking cane than a staff - it is made of ebony topped with a Lion's head. He has to tap it on the door of the Commons three times before they will let him in - after having already slammed it in his face of course.

The State Opening is worth watching for quirky old things and posts such as The Cap Of Maintenance, The Earl Marshall, The Sword Of State - all ancient symbols.

Nice image below:

http://www.parliament.uk/about/image...e/blackrod.cfm

[William Cloud Hicklin]

I notice that to make up the length the woodwright had to join two pieces together- also that it's (to my mind) too skinny to be much of a shilleleagh.

[Alfirin]

Originally Posted by William Cloud Hickli

I notice that to make up the length the woodwright had to join two pieces together- also that it's (to my mind) too skinny to be much of a shilleleagh.

Thanks, well there goes that theory for Lebethron, along with one of my short story ideas (there was a short story I was writng (non-tolkein) where a minor plot point involved a whisky barrel made of persimmon heartwood.)

By the way since the question of the mushrooms was broached I have another agricultural question which came up in a disagreement I had with someone. Though not stated implicity do you think that Tolkein meant to imply that hops are grown in Middle-Earth, based on the fact that beer and ale are made an drunk there. I am aware of the fact that hopping of beer is near nearly unversal but I am also aware that it is possible to make beer without hops. (as in St. Peters King Cnut) Hopping became a common practice in english beer around the late middle ages so its a bit unclear as to whether Tolkiein meant for middle earth beer to be hopped or not. What do you all think?

[William Cloud Hicklin]

My deduction is that Tolkien intended the Shire to feel like a late-Victorian English village- that's why hobbits drink beer, and I would expect that beer to be hop-flavored English ale, not lager, nor any ancient-world concoction.

[Lalwendë]

Yes you can make beer without hops - the hops simply add bitterness and extra flavours; without them, beer would be quite sweet and very yeasty. They were introduced to Britain around 1400, but beer-drinking was a well established pursuit before then Prior to the introduction of hops, other things would be used to add flavours, from the innocent such as Heather to the hallucinatory such as Wormwood and Henbane. Unhopped beer used to be known as 'ale' but in modern times 'ale' means beer that has been made with yeast that ferments 'at the top' in warm temperatures as opposed to 'lager' which uses the opposite process.

Almost all beer and lager now has hops in it including Ale - but you can get 'revival' beers which are brewed with herbs instead if you really search - you can sometimes find Heather Ale in Scotland, usually marketed by also telling you the tale of the last Pict who hurled himself to his death from the Mull of Galloway rather than tell the invading Scots the secret recipe for Heather Ale...

[alatar]

I know that this is off-topic, not being about plants and all, but I just wanted to finish off my thoughts about genetically engineering glowing trees (note that we would want the leaves to glow as the bark is like dead skin). You can see here how some 'mad' scientists are using glowing genes to make fish that detect clean water - or make cool pets - and so theoretically it's possible.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Alfirin

Alatar, If they did they must have left a lot of them as there are dozens of plants called "dragons blood" most famously Draceana draco (www.mgonlinestore.com) the dragons blood of medicine and violin manufacture.

Would explain what happened to all of the Worms, especially the ones that consumed the Dwarven Rings of Power.

As a warning I would also point out not to go smearing croton sap on you wounds unless you know what you are doing as Croton is in the Spurge family (Euphobiacae) most of whose members are famous (or more acurately infamous) for having unbelivablly corrosive sap.

Noted; however, hope to never find myself lost in the Amazon, and as I live in a dying former steel town, probably experience rain that is more caustic (and have evolved to think it quite normal).