Is it possible: 1 Silmaril found: The Arkenstone - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

William Cloud Hicklin · 03-19-2008, 08:28 PM

A good discussion. I think that the Arkenstone was somewhat informed by the pre-existing description of the Silmarils, as much of The Hobbit's geography resembles but isn't quite that of Beleriand: it's especially worth noting that in Tolkien's Anglo-Saxon translations of the Annals he uses the OE word 'eorclanstanas' to translate 'Silmarils.' But the word literally means nothing more than 'precious or sacred stones.'

Ibrîniðilpathânezel · 03-20-2008, 08:04 AM

"somewhat informed" I like that.

There are so many things from the unpublished Silmarillion that crept into the published Hobbit and LotR that one cannot help but think that Tolkien had despaired of TS ever being published and didn't want all that hard work and creativity to go to waste. The Arkenstone would look to be one. If it were an actual silmaril, though, I would wonder how Smaug, a creature of evil, would manage to keep it around without being either burned or driven mad by it.

skip spence · 03-20-2008, 08:22 AM

Nope, I don't think so.

To begin with the Lonely Mountain must've been very far from the place where Maedros threw the silmaril down a firery pit. I find it highly unlikely that it would have travelled under the crust of the earth to be refound countless leagues east of where it was originally lost.

zxcvbn · 03-21-2008, 12:55 AM

There are plenty of stories about famous jewels in Middle-earth. The Arkenstone and the Silmarils are two different things with different histories.

Groin Redbeard · 03-22-2008, 06:50 PM

There has been a lot of talk about how the Arkenstone couldn't have been a Silmaril because only the good can touch it without being burned, and Thorin wasn't at all good. This I think isn't true in the case of Thorin, although he seemed mean on the outside with confronting the men of the Dale and the elves the way that he did, but when he was on his death bed that's when his true colors showed. So yes I do believe that the Arkenstone is a Silmaril.

Rune Son of Bjarne · 03-22-2008, 11:54 PM

I agree. . . being stubborn and narrow minded does not = evil

Eönwë · 03-23-2008, 05:18 PM

Also, he is not of the original children of Illuvatar- maybe the same standards don't apply.

03-19-2008, 08:28 PM	#1
William Cloud Hicklin Loremaster of Annúminas Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 2,330	A good discussion. I think that the Arkenstone was somewhat informed by the pre-existing description of the Silmarils, as much of The Hobbit's geography resembles but isn't quite that of Beleriand: it's especially worth noting that in Tolkien's Anglo-Saxon translations of the Annals he uses the OE word 'eorclanstanas' to translate 'Silmarils.' But the word literally means nothing more than 'precious or sacred stones.' __________________ The entire plot of The Lord of the Rings could be said to turn on what Sauron didn’t know, and when he didn’t know it.

03-20-2008, 08:04 AM	#2
Ibrîniðilpathânezel Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Back on the Helcaraxe Posts: 733	"somewhat informed" I like that. There are so many things from the unpublished Silmarillion that crept into the published Hobbit and LotR that one cannot help but think that Tolkien had despaired of TS ever being published and didn't want all that hard work and creativity to go to waste. The Arkenstone would look to be one. If it were an actual silmaril, though, I would wonder how Smaug, a creature of evil, would manage to keep it around without being either burned or driven mad by it. __________________ Call me Ibrin (or Ibri) :) Originality is the one thing that unoriginal minds cannot feel the use of. — John Stewart Mill

03-20-2008, 08:22 AM	#3
skip spence shadow of a doubt Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Back on the streets Posts: 1,125	Nope, I don't think so. To begin with the Lonely Mountain must've been very far from the place where Maedros threw the silmaril down a firery pit. I find it highly unlikely that it would have travelled under the crust of the earth to be refound countless leagues east of where it was originally lost. __________________ "You can always come back, but you can't come back all the way" ~ Bob Dylan

03-22-2008, 06:50 PM	#5
Groin Redbeard Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Facing the world's troubles with Christ's hope! Posts: 1,635	There has been a lot of talk about how the Arkenstone couldn't have been a Silmaril because only the good can touch it without being burned, and Thorin wasn't at all good. This I think isn't true in the case of Thorin, although he seemed mean on the outside with confronting the men of the Dale and the elves the way that he did, but when he was on his death bed that's when his true colors showed. So yes I do believe that the Arkenstone is a Silmaril. __________________ I heard the bells on Christmas Day. Their old, familiar carols play. And wild and sweet the words repeatof peace on earth, good-will to men! ~Henry Wadsworth Longfellow

03-23-2008, 05:18 PM	#7
Eönwë Flame Imperishable Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Right here Posts: 3,928	Also, he is not of the original children of Illuvatar- maybe the same standards don't apply. __________________ Welcome to the Barrow Do-owns Forum / Such a lovely place

03-21-2008, 12:55 AM	#4
zxcvbn Wight Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In front of my PC Posts: 164	There are plenty of stories about famous jewels in Middle-earth. The Arkenstone and the Silmarils are two different things with different histories.