Character Analysis Thread

[MatthewM]

Originally Posted by skip spence

To be fair, when it's said that Boromir was of like mind, it means that he too thought that no one could rival himself, not that no one could rival his kid brother. As heroic Boromir might have been, humility wasn't one of his chief traits.

I disagree - Boromir believed nobody could rival his brother.

"It proved otherwise at the test" - the proof is right there. The test was the temptation of the Ring. Boromir tried to take it, thus he failed the test. Faramir opted to let Frodo go. Thus he passed the test.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Like skip, I've always understood the line about Boromir being of like mind as a tongue-in-cheek reference to Boromir's high opinion of himself. I can see that the words can be interpreted differently if a reader wishes to see them more positively in regard to Boromir, but I never read that meaning from them. It is precisely the roundabout way of expression which is so slyly accurate!

[MatthewM]

It seems to me that after Tolkien had just talked about the love the brothers had for one another and the lack of jealousy present between the two, that it only makes sense for Tolkien to be speaking about Boromir believing that nobody could rival his brother. The other meaning, although I can see how you get it, just doesn't fit for me, given because I've never thought it before and also given what Tolkien was just talking about prior to saying it.

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by MatthewM

"It proved otherwise at the test" - the proof is right there. The test was the temptation of the Ring. Boromir tried to take it, thus he failed the test. Faramir opted to let Frodo go. Thus he passed the test.

Still I'm afraid you're mistaken... Let me break it down. This is how you've interpreted the quote:


Faramir thinks that Boromir is the top man in Gondor.

Boromir thinks that Faramir is the top man in Gondor.


To say "it proved otherwise at the test" is to say that what they thought beforehand didn't turn out to be true. But to say that both were mistaken wouldn't make any sense in the context of the story. Who then was the top man in Gondor? It must be someone else.

If you read the passage as I (and Estelyn) do however it makes perfect sense to say "Yet it proved otherwise at the test":


Faramir thinks that Boromir is the top man in Gondor.

Boromir thinks that Boromir is the top man in Gondor.


It proved otherwise because Faramir passed the test his elder brother failed, like your said yourself. They were both wrong: Faramir, not Boromir, was the unrivalled one.

[skip spence]

I'm going to cook some dinner now but later tonight I think I will write a little bit about Boromir. I understand that you like this character a lot and feels that he's been misunderstood. I agree completely.

[Boromir88]

Nice stuff on Boromir.

I would just like to add a couple things. Boromir seems to catch a lot of flack for being "weak" and falling to the Ring's temptation, but when you look at the person he was, he is very admirable, and actually reaches a level of maturity not many people are able to do. That is his acceptance of personal responsibility.

Let's say Jim and Kim fail a test. Jim blames the "F" on the teacher, on the kid sitting in front with the distracting red hair, on the "tough" questions...blames everyone (and everything) but himself. Kim on the other hand realizes perhaps she didn't study enough, perhaps she didn't get a good nights sleep...etc. The bottomline is she knows she is to blame for failing her test. She has accepted personal responsibility.

Other characters like Grima and Gollum all fall short of redemption because they constantly blame others for their misfortunes. Grima blames Saruman for "making" him kill Lotho:

"You told me to; you made me do it," he hissed.~The Scouring of the Shire

He blames Saruman for being unable to "leave" him (and Gandalf tells Grima to "Do it!" then):

The beggar turned and slouched past whimpering: "Poor old Grima! Poor old Grima! Always beaten and cursed. How I hate him! I wish I could leave him!"
"Then leave him!" said Gandalf.~Many Partings

Gollum blames Deagol for Deagol's own death. Gollum's justification was it was "his birthday" and Deagol "ought to have given it" to him. The only actions we control are our own, and these two are never able to accept the responsibility for their own actions.

Boromir on the other hand does. He first blames trying to take the Ring from Frodo on the "madness" that consumed him. I'll note that Boromir is actually telling the truth, the Ring did fill him with "madness." However, on his deathbed he no longer blames the Ring, but he accepts responsibility, and accepts the consequences of his actions:

"I tried to take the Ring from Frodo," he said. "I am sorry. I have paid."~The Departure of Boromir

He not only admits to Aragorn what he did, but he realizes he is to blame for what he tried to do ("I am sorry"),and he accepts the consequences of his actions ("I have paid.")

Coming to that realization that you are personally to blame for your own failings is something extremely difficult to do (I'll admit there's lots of times when I like to throw the blame at others). It is because of this, though, that I believe Boromir dies a much better man...well...than anyone else really.

[skip spence]

Boromir was the captain of the White Tower, proud and strong, and a born leader and champion. He had a strong sense of duty, and his main duty, as he understood it, was to protect Minas Tirith and serve his father. And much thanks to him, Gondor had been able to fend off the attacks from the east so far. He had great faith in his people's ability to defend themselves, but the enemies of Gondor always seemed to come in greater numbers and strenght, while the list of allies was ever shortening. Where were the elves? Nowhere to be seen. What about other men? They were either fighting for Sauron or busy defending themselves. The Dwarves? You got to be kidding! From his perspective Gondor stood alone. And he knew very well that they eventually would fall unless they recieved aid. Sauron was just too strong, he knew this. He was desperate, or else he wouldn't have left Gondor and made the long and perilous journey to Rivendell begging for help.

Here in Rivendell he learns that the One has been found and is in the hands of the wise. He is told that Sauron's victory would be complete the very moment the ring is back on his finger, and that he desperately seeks to win it back. He's also told that Sauron's greatest fear is that the ring will be used against him which would seriously threaten his plans for world domination.

Then, to his amazement, Galdalf and Elrond suggest that the midget uhm hobbit Frodo should go to Mordor and throw the ring into the Crack of Doom (that name always cracks me up hehe). A fool's hope Gandalf calls it. Yet Galdalf is a Maia who was present at the Great Music, and he has a profound understanding of the designs of Eru. Gandalf knows this is their best hope. But for Boromir this hope is indeed a fool's hope. He has spent his life within sight of the mountains of Mordor and knows that no one can have any hope of getting within sight of Mount Doom , let alone reaching the Crack of Doom. From his point of view, they are just going to hand the ring over to the enemy. And from his point of view of course, this is utter madness. Maybe they can't use the ring, he can accept this, but why throw it away? At the very least they should take it to the vaults of Minas Tirith - then at least they would have a fighting chance.

When the counsel decides that Frodo must seek to destroy the ring, he accompanies them, partly because he wants to do what he can to help, partly because his home lies south, but mostly because he hopes to convince the party to come with him to Minas Tirith. At Parth Galen, where a decision must be made, he must have been torn apart inside. One the one hand he has sworn to protect Frodo, his companion, and it would be completely against his principles to use force and take the ring from him. On the other hand he believes that his father would have wanted him to take the ring to him, by any means possible, and he also firmly believes that Frodo is doomed to fail if if tries to destroy the ring. Thus, he makes a desperate attempt to convince Frodo to come with him, but when that doesn't work he's finally overcome by the temptation of the ring. When Frodo escapes, he finally understands the full truth behind the warnings from Gandalf, Elrond and Aragorn; he understands that he did wrong because of the ring, and that the same thing would happen to anyone who tried to wield it. In his life he was a great man, and he died with his honour intact.

So put yourself in his shoes. Would you have acted any differently? Boromir certainly wasn't an evil man. Perhaps he was too proud, but he always did what he thought was right and what he deemed to be in the best interest of his home country Gondor.

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Jim blames the "F" on the teacher, on the kid sitting in front with the distracting red hair...

Yeah red-heads are the only discriminated-against minority not protected by law ...we get blamed for everything...

*hoping from some solidarity will protect her from digression skwerls, because they are a bit ginger too... *

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Skip Spence

So put yourself in his shoes.

Of course, those of us who are hobbits might politely decline this command as an unnecessary encumbrance.

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Coming to that realization that you are personally to blame for your own failings is something extremely difficult to do (I'll admit there's lots of times when I like to throw the blame at others). It is because of this, though, that I believe Boromir dies a much better man...well...than anyone else really.

It is interesting to consider that, in a story which in part is devoted to "the gift of man", we actually have so few characters dying other than the unnumbered many unidentified foot soldiers of both sides and some hobbits, Saruman and Grima in The Scouring of the Shire.

There's the Witch King, to whom no possibly of redeption is depicted. And Denethor himself who is usually accounted mad and therefore not fully responsible.

We have Gollem, whose final leap is the quintessential conundrum of the story. We have Frodo, who apparently dies in the Undying Lands, although of course his tragedy is that he blames himself all too much. (This could be debated I suspect.)

And in the Appendix we have Aragorn's heroic, idealised death, chosen, and not left to the sorry decline of infirmity. And then Arwen's sorrowful, lonely, achingly sad experience of the grim, private reality of death.

No, I'm not sure we have enough examples to justify saying that Boromir dies the better death.

Thanks, Naz, for the reference. It is so nice to be able to rely on the kindness of strangers and those who reread Tolkien constantly.

[ArathornJax]

I think that Boromir is a very tragic figure in LOTR and has many good qualities, yet he is very human. I believe he is very human because of the weaknesses that open him up to being tempted by the ring. The ring plays on his desire to protect his city/country/people and on his own ego, his desire for personal glory. Thus like many of us, he is very noble in many ways, yet his ego also leads to temptation and mistakes.
Boromir is also valiant, brave, courageous, and helpful. He looks after others and basically lives up to a very chivalrous code (as we see at the attempt at the Redhorn among one example). So in the end, it is his human weaknesses that leads him to yield to the enticings of the ring. He quickly realizes what he has done, and then gives his life in defended Merry and Pippin. Before dying he confesses his error to Aragorn, and then surrenders up his life.

One thing that many people fail to realize also, is the role that Boromir as a character plays to the plot. Though the actions of the day when Boromir tried to seize the ring and its consequences are seen as evil with the breaking of the Fellowship, it is really an unhappy day. The day is unhappy because of the death of the noble Boromir, but those the events of the day seem evil, they result in the greater good. Frodo escapes Boromir (and thus Sauron twice) and leaves to Mordor with Sam in which eventually the ring will be destroyed. Merry and Pippin are taken, but eventually escape and come to Treebeard and the Ents and aid in rousing them to action against Saruman. This also leads to Merry stabbing the Witch King and Pippin saving Faramir. Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli reunite with Gandalf the White and free Theoden from Wormtongue's influence and control. This allows Rohan to defeat the armies of Saruman and then go to Gondor's aid via several directions. Thus in a way, all of this would not have happen, even the final victory, if Boromir had not given in to his temptation for glory and protection of himself and his people and thus resulting in the Breaking of the Fellowship. I like to think that not only is there a ballad or two made after the War of the Ring in rememberance of Boromir, and of his valiant and noble deeds.

[Ibrîniðilpathânezel]

One could actually say that by his death at that particular moment, Boromir saved Gondor and Minas Tirith. If the Fellowship had not broken that day and Boromir had lived, Aragorn would either have gone to Mordor with Frodo or he would have gone to Minas Tirith with Boromir. Though Rohan might have been stirred into action by Gandalf after his return, any road Aragorn took but the one to Dunharrow would NOT have sent him on the Paths of the Dead, to eventually stop the Black Fleet from coming up the Anduin and turning the battle of the Pellenor into a resounding defeat. We are regularly reminded in LotR that chance "as it is called" is not so random a thing as it seems. The board on which the game is set has many pieces in motion, and what seems like the untimely loss of a knight too early in the game can actually lead to the final checkmate. If Boromir had known what would happen as a result of his death at Parth Galen, I suspect he would have done whatever was necessary to achieve that end; if he believed, like his father, that the protection of Gondor was the only hope of the West, he would have laid down his own life to ensure it. That he gave his life in defending Merry and Pippin without any knowledge of a later good that would come of it showed that he was genuinely noble at heart -- moreso, I think, than his father. He could have wallowed in despair but did not; he pulled himself together and did his duty, a test of heart and will with no promise of greater glory, a trial his father could not pass.