Tol-in-Gaurhoth L: Battle of the Fandoms

[Mithalwen]

I asked Boro if he wanted to be lynched because he could have ensured his own safety and didn't. Most of us would want to save our own skin innocent or not. After all unless you thought a gifted was going down you would want to keep yourself as an innocent alive. Wolves obviously want to stay alive. Only cobblers and confident hunters might do otherwise.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I asked Boro if he wanted to be lynched because he could have ensured his own safety and didn't. Most of us would want to save our own skin innocent or not. After all unless you thought a gifted was going down you would want to keep yourself as an innocent alive. Wolves obviously want to stay alive. Only cobblers and confident hunters might do otherwise.

Page 4.



4:57 - Do you want to get lynched, Boro?
4:59 - Voting for CoD because of not wanting to lose Boro.
4:59 - Boro says he wouldn't be the biggest loss anyway.

[Macalaure]

A look at Nilp:

Day1: Nothing of importance. Misses vote.

Day2: Captain-voters look innocent. Thinks Nogrod looked suspicious on Day1, but now no longer. Is convinced by Nog's case against Brin. Boro and Nerwen look innocent. Brings up the chumminess of Boro and Nogrod which he later takes back. Doesn't give any additional reasons against Brinn, and his reasons against Gwath... *shakes head* (though I'm probably not the one to criticise flimsy Gwath-suspicions). Suspects Fea and Shasta of being wolves together. Votes Gwath. Expects to get under fire the next day (which strangely he hasn't very much so far).

The way Nilp takes up Nogrod's points, I have a hard time imagining the two are in cahoots. I could see this as Wolfnilp copying points of Nogrod that he knew were wrong.

Day3: Wants Fea to be looked at and

The problem, really, is I can't find the time to pore over the thread and get my own ideas, so I just read a well-written accusation, think 'Hmm, yes', and go with it.

Well, well, I understand. I'm not happy with it, though. The question is, of course, why would Nilpwolf have killed Brinniel? It took away his only suspect. Did Nilpwolf fear retaliation? It will be interesting to see what he comes up with later toDay. I'll reserve my judgement til then.

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I asked Boro if he wanted to be lynched because he could have ensured his own safety and didn't. Most of us would want to save our own skin innocent or not. After all unless you thought a gifted was going down you would want to keep yourself as an innocent alive. Wolves obviously want to stay alive. Only cobblers and confident hunters might do otherwise.

*ponders*

[satansaloser2005]

Quickly (finally got my computer working again and I'm running out the door for class) I still feel uneasy about Nogrod. I hate that I'm concentrating on just one person but he seems too....blah. Just not good.


From the beginning (well, semi the beginning) he's made a grasp-at-straw case against Gwath and finally got him lynched. Guess what? Gwath's an ordo.

His interaction with Boro seems unnatural and the way he spoke to me yesterDay seems very suspicious (he seemed to me to be making too much of a fuss in that one post, if you ask my little opinion)



For some reason Lal and Nilp jump out at me as well, and Mac doesn't want to suspect me even though he thinks I'm suspicious. Not that I'm not flattered, but why? Meh. I wish I had more time.


I'll be back a bit before the deadline (unless class gets out early) to vote and such.

[Lalwendë]

My problem right now is whether I should vote for Mithwolf or Borowolf.

Boro had me lined up from day one with no good reason, especially on day one when he actually had much better reasons to vote for Brinniel or CoD who were his co-runners for lynching. He leaves voting until after Mith has voted (and also poked him to vote quickly) and he is then safe to vote for me - as was no doubt planned by them. Note that Mith's excuse that they voted at the same time doesn't wash as wolves could have planned this exit stratgy all along beforehand.

Then on the next day, he builds a mild case to vote for me again, while Mith cunningly avoids voting for me and builds a slight suspicion (and gets Gwath out of the way without attracting suspicion by leaving a trail).

Today, following the murder of Brinn, they are straight in with the accusations based on the spurious excuse of me forgetting to read the rules. Yet when I was looking at evidence today, I found a post I made towards deadline on the first day, where I mention something about holding on to my vote for Brinn and not changing it even after she made a good defence.

Very cunning, to have a plan and not join together on it until the 3rd day...however, it does depend rather on there being a bandwagon forming.

It could, however, be possible that only one of them is the wolf and that Page 4 is simply an example of one wolf trying to signal to a cobbler who they are. In which case, if this is a Mith/Boro wolf/cobbler thing (it would be Mith as Wolf and Boro as cobbler, if you look at page 4) our votes are being split and someone else is trying to rope in votes for another victim elsewhere. Divide and Conquer. It won't matter which one the wolves see lynched, because they will be able to eat the runner up tonight, and there will always be at least one of them undetected...so far.

[Boromir88]

The last comment (shouting "I'm an ordo, I'm an ordo!" just before the deadline could be the reaction of a seer who suddenly noticed he was a bit too open, or a reverse-psychology hint to the ranger for the same reason)~Mac

Or an ordinary innocent who knows it's no big loss if he gets lynched.

Day2: His theory about Brinn... you can explain it as often as you like, to me, it still carries the smell of getting her to make herself look bad with a defense and then sitting back and enjoying the show.~Mac

Umm...that's not how it happened, I didn't sit back. If I did what you are suggesting why did I go back and defend her when Nogrod went after her defense?

How is this for a wolf-strategy: Pick a villager (Lal) who isn't listened to much but who is also unlikely to get lynched quickly, and then consistently go after her. Your cases will look sensible and consistent but it will take a long while until the victim's death makes you look bad and forces you to make wrong cases against somebody new.~Mac

You should know by now, as a wolf, I have no troubles about casting the lynching, seal the deal, vote for an innocent. I don't know why I'm saying this, because you're going to say I'm using reverse psychology and Nogrod is going to say "ya that's what you want us to think" but whatever...

If I was a wolf I would have had no problems lynching Brin on Day 1, no matter what I said throughout the day, I would have had no problems doing it. Because you better believe I could come right back the next day and defend it.

Nogrod wants to see the straight forward, no outrageous conspiracy Boro...well why don't you go back and just look at the hard evidence Mac (the votes). Dump all the reverse-psychology crap and just look at it, why would (as a wolf) I not either attempt to save CoD (by voting for Brin) or vote for CoD and sacrifice him? When you look at it, it's right in front of your face, I had absolutely no idea what I was doing, I just knew I didn't want to vote for Brin, I didn't want to vote for CoD, I'm not going to vote for myself, so I went with my top suspect.

Edit: crossed with Lal...I hope anyone with brains can see how misleading that post is...

Boro had me lined up from day one with no good reason, especially on day one when he actually had much better reasons to vote for Brinniel or CoD who were his co-runners for lynching.

When did I state that I had much better reasons to vote for CoD or Brin over you? I didn't buy into Mac's reasons for suspecting her, and the only time I mentioned CoD was when I said I think he's going to be the victim of a wolf bandwagon. I specifically came out and stated my reasons for suspecting you:

Lalwende, 1 point for posting and being present, yet not giving us any sort of depth as far as her thoughts. Seems like she's got an evil secret to hide. 1 point for being careful and staying out of any sort of confrontation. .5 for referring to me as fishy, then claiming:

I don't think anyone needs to be told they weren't good reasons, but to me, they were as good as any from Day 1.

Note that Mith's excuse that they voted at the same time doesn't wash as wolves could have planned this exit stratgy all along beforehand.

So, you're saying that during the first night, Mith, CoD, and I, set up this scheme to get two of us in trouble and then Mith chooses which one of us she wants to save? And I thought Nogrod was far fetched! Sorry Lal, but anyone who knows my wolvish habits, knows I never pre-plan going into the village...never! I wait to see how the village is acting, what things they're looking for, and then I plan.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

Or an ordinary innocent who knows it's no big loss if he gets lynched.

That's the question.

Originally Posted by Boro

Umm...that's not how it happened, I didn't sit back. If I did what you are suggesting why did I go back and defend her when Nogrod went after her defense?

You're right there, "sitting back" doesn't describe it correctly. You used the opportunity to make yourself look better after Brinn had been lynched. Or let's say, if you're a wolf, that's what you did. The problem is that there's always a way to interpret a thing both ways. My feeling tells me the evil way is the right one.

Originally Posted by Boro

You should know by now, as a wolf, I have no troubles about casting the lynching, seal the deal, vote for an innocent. I don't know why I'm saying this, because you're going to say I'm using reverse psychology and Nogrod is going to say "ya that's what you want us to think" but whatever...

Well, you will have to admit that the "If I was a wolf, this is the way I would play" argument is not the most convincing one.

Originally Posted by Boro

Nogrod wants to see the straight forward, no outrageous conspiracy Boro...well why don't you go back and just look at the hard evidence Mac (the votes). Dump all the reverse-psychology crap and just look at it, why would (as a wolf) I not either attempt to save CoD (by voting for Brin) or vote for CoD and sacrifice him? When you look at it, it's right in front of your face, I had absolutely no idea what I was doing, I just knew I didn't want to vote for Brin, I didn't want to vote for CoD, I'm not going to vote for myself, so I went with my top suspect.

I overlooked that first, and now that Mith pointed it out, it's what I'm thinking about.
You say you had absolutely no idea what you were doing. If it applies to Bordomir, it could apply to Wolf-Boromir as well...


edit: crossed with Boro's edit

[Boromir88]

Mac, what are you thoughts on Lal?

[Nerwen]

I second that. What are your thoughts on Lal, Mac?

In fact, anyone's thoughts on Lal would be welcome. Who's played with her before? Is she normally like this? Can she have been serious about thinking she was on the menu?

And while we're waiting, I'll give you my thoughts on Mac.

Out of everyone, he does appear the most innocent– and not just because of his fortuitous Day One vote. Everything he's done since then has simply shone with purity... so much so that I fully expected him to be the one eaten last Night.

In fact so innocent does Mac appear that if he's still alive toMorrow, I suggest the Seer check him out, just to be on the safe side.

EDIT: X'd with Lal.

[Isabellkya]

To Boro:

I didn't say everyone. I suppose it is more phrasings used when making an argument. Either way, it rang bells to see "what the heck's" used two posts after I used them, in conjunction with the same person - when I don't recall seeing them before that.

I said that, because of how the two of you interacted. 'What do you think about this person'; 'I'll do this if you might do that'. It gave me the feeling of two people out picking curtains, or a new couch - not wolf hunting.



X'd with Nilp.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

When did I state that I had much better reasons to vote for CoD or Brin over you? I didn't buy into Mac's reasons for suspecting her, and the only time I mentioned CoD was when I said I think he's going to be the victim of a wolf bandwagon.

You had no need to state any reasons to vote for CoD or Brinn, they were on the lynching bandwagon along with you, so only a suicidal cobbler would choose not to vote for them in that situation (and everyone would go yeah, cool, he's just saving his skin) - unless of course, like you, he had just been Saved By The Mith

[QUOTE]

So, you're saying that during the first night, Mith, CoD, and I, set up this scheme to get two of us in trouble and then Mith chooses which one of us she wants to save?

Not a plan to get into trouble, but a rescue plan if you did

And I thought Nogrod was far fetched! Sorry Lal, but anyone who knows my wolvish habits, knows I never pre-plan going into the village...never! I wait to see how the village is acting, what things they're looking for, and then I plan.

I keep hearing you and Mith vehemently state you Do Not Do That In Werewolf but what a perfect smoke screen to cover up for evildoing, eh?

[Boromir88]

I keep hearing you and Mith vehemently state you Do Not Do That In Werewolf but what a perfect smoke screen to cover up for evildoing, eh?

We don't. It would be foolhardy to come up with a plan before knowing how the village is reacting.

It's interesting Lal, that for the last two days you said my Day 1 vote doesn't make me look like a wolf. I turn the pressure up on you and now I must be a wolf? Mith jumps on and thus we both must be wolves. You've completely ruled out any possibility that we're innocent.

I have to go...

++Lalwende

[Nerwen]

Well, we can't accuse Boro of inconsistency, can we?

[Boromir88]

Oh and a couple more things, if I'm lynched, so be it...it'll be your loss.

If Lal tries any sort of fake reveal, I would ask the real gifted to not step out to save me. It wouldn't be worth it.

Lal if you're lynched and innocent, I'm sorry for being so dead wrong.

Edit: crossed with Nerwen the last 2 times.

Well, we can't accuse Boro of inconsistency, can we?

I guess not...I've only voted for somebody 3 straight days once (Formendacil).