Scarburg Meadhall Discussion Thread

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

I say we should keep Eodwine as eorl, but simply keep in the background of the story and focus on the other characters. Make him part of the set, part of the scenery. Just as Eodwine is too much lmp's character, Scarburg is too much Eodwine's endeavor. He needs to stay for the time being.
Those are my thoughts.

That is true - but it will be difficult for me and Nogrod to direct the storyline if our characters are mere a carpenter and an all-around household woman plus one kid. Thus it would be easier to write if there was a new Eorl or some other important new character story. Or then Foley'll have to be the one to take over after all as she writes the Lady and the almbudsman (or whatever the word was). But I got the picture that won't work for her.

[Gwathagor]

What if one of you was playing Eodwine's right hand man? He could receive his orders from Eodwine and you'd still be able to direct affairs around the Burg. Just an idea, but I'd love to see Eodwine stay if possible.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

What if one of you was playing Eodwine's right hand man? He could receive his orders from Eodwine and you'd still be able to direct affairs around the Burg.

That would be Thornden aka Foley's character... We should have to wait first what she thinks of the idea of Thornden taking the reins.

I would be happy with it.

Myself and Lommy could take some other characters then to be more involved with the running of the Mead Hall - like if the King would send there some aids to take care of organizing the things or whatever.

Anyway a carpenter, a half-dunleding wife of his and their child surely are in no position to kind of roll the plot forwards anyway...

But we have to think about this...

[Gwathagor]

Of course. I'm just brainstorming, don't feel like you have to listen to me. You two are in charge here.

[Folwren]

Originally Posted by Gwathagor

What if one of you was playing Eodwine's right hand man? He could receive his orders from Eodwine and you'd still be able to direct affairs around the Burg. Just an idea, but I'd love to see Eodwine stay if possible.

Thornden is Eodwine's right hand man. I'll tell you all now that if this story gets interesting again, as it has in the past several times, I will find time to write. It'll be like a good book that I can't put down and I'll keep having to come back to it.

I liked the idea of a less-than-good Eorl coming to take Eodwine's place, but I didn't like the idea of sending Eodwine off. That didn't seem like a characteristic thing for him to do. He's not an 'old man' by any long shot. He still has many years of ruling ability left in him. Now, Elempi was considering talking about killing him off, but I shied away from that idea at the time - probably because I was hoping Elempi would change his mind and stay - but now he's gone, I understand the hesitance to take his character. Elempi IS Eodwine...or Eodwine is Elempi, hard to say which.

So, what I'm driving at...what if we go ahead and have Eodwine ... well ... killed. It'll be sad as all gets out, but Elempi's gone, and because of that, I almost think it's fitting if his character leaves, too, seeing as they're so close together in our minds.

If that happens, I also like the idea of Saeryn being pregnant with their first child. That'll add some interest to me and probably others around here.

Then we can bring in a new Eorl and someone else can actually play the man. I want someone to play the main role of the Eorl and I'd prefer it not to be me...I'm afraid of messing up. But, if I can create a BAD Eorl that we can expect to mess up, then I woudln't mind as much. I just can't fill Elempi's/Eodwine's shoes.

K, I've got to run to class. I'll talk later. You all discuss this.

-- Folwren

[Gwathagor]

Ooooh.

[Groin Redbeard]

If we are going to kill of Eodwine, how is it going to be done? Shall it be an accident? Say if Eodwine is putting on the roof and he "accidently" steps on a loose beam and whoops! bye bye Eodwine. It could also be a hunting accident, or something similar to that.

Also, in the beginning of the thread Elempi mentioned that there might be tensions between the local farmers/peasants and Scarburg. Is it time for a little death and destruction? I'm just throwing out ideas, I am satisfied if Nogrod, Lommy, and even if Folwren or Gwathagor takes up Eodwine as a character.

I don't have a lot of time in the near future and I have a semi-light load of work this weak. Is the situation stable enough for posts to be made?

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Groin Redbeard

Also, in the beginning of the thread Elempi mentioned that there might be tensions between the local farmers/peasants and Scarburg. Is it time for a little death and destruction?

Yup... That is what we I had thought with Lommy and discussed it with elempi. YOu shall see it quite soon...

And if we are really going to kill lord Eodwine we might make it tragic as well (notes to what I said earlier). That could raise emotions with the residents of the Mead Hall to be sure...

Is the situation stable enough for posts to be made?

Sure! And I think Lommy already mentioned you should feel free to write something that fits the "now" in the story (or the next morning if you wish).

It will take a few RL days from Lommy and me to work out some outlines of the plot (and we'll be hanging together a few days today onwards).

Then we will probably make a jump in time to some near future (a week or two I suppose, depending on the general outlook of things).

[Folwren]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Then we will probably make a jump in time to some near future (a week or two I suppose, depending on the general outlook of things).

If we're really actually planning to take Eodwine out of the story in the next time jump, let's please make it more than a week or two. Give Saeryn a little bit more time than that.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Before I say anything, I just want to say that me posting here is NOT me coming back. No promises for any sort of activity, because I'm not particularly reliable these days and I don't want to make promises I can't keep.

That being said, I've got thoughts about what I'm reading, as I'm reading it.

Originally Posted by Folwren

I almost think it's fitting if his character leaves, too, seeing as they're so close together in our minds.

If that happens, I also like the idea of Saeryn being pregnant with their first child. That'll add some interest to me and probably others around here.

1) I concur that it is fitting for Eodwine to die upon LMP's departure. I also believe that it would add a significant amount of literary drama to the story. And as a story which so often revolves around the day to day life of The Common Man, a bit of drama can never go amiss.

I was also taught that if you hit a standstill in a story and writing just doesn't seem to be happening, kill a main character and then you can fill the rest of the book with everybody's reactions.

As far as an appropriate end to a beloved character, I think it would be more fitting for him to die in the pursuit of an exciting story than for a hesitant writer to try [and probably fail] to continue his existence. I've taken on other people's characters before, and I promise, they never entirely feel like yours. No matter how good you get at them, no matter how long you do it, there's always a nagging feeling that you're not doing it quite right, because you're not doing it the way the original writer would have done.

So I approve of killing Eodwine. Quite possibly in a really anticlimactic way, such as a riding accident or an infection. There's not really any need for, say, a band of raiders to show up and attack. That would take attention away from the Mead Hall and divert it to a bunch of stock characters that showed up solely to kill someone. More believable and more appropriate would be if Eodwine's life was lost in the course of his daily activities.

That being said,

2) Foley: Saeryn is a twin. Twins run in families. Just sayin'.

Originally Posted by Groin

tensions between the local farmers/peasants and Scarburg. Is it time for a little death and destruction?

Or there's that.

But bear in mind that the King (and the rest of the Eorls) won't kindly put up with a peasant uprising, as it gives other peasants dangerous ideas and threatens the stability of the entire country in terms of society and economy. Uprisings aren't popular with those in power, and if there is one (especially since Degas's holdings just had one), it's going to cause some serious political problems.

Presumably the King would assign a trusted and heavy handed Eorl to Scarburg at that point, to quash further troubles before they start.

Which would not go very well given Saeryn would presumably still be alive as the Lady of the Hall, pregnant with what may well be the heir, and Degas, having just promised Eodwine that they're brothers and all, would show up very displeased with any upstart that had ideas about taking the title of his knocked up sister.

No! This is bad! I was trying to write Degas out and all y'all are providing a really great reason for him to come back!

He can't govern two holdings!

Of course he would, in that situation. Or he would try.

In the event that Eodwine would die, Degas would petition the King to allow him to govern Scarburg as a steward whilst Saeryn dealt with having a baby. Degas would cite the bride price/dowry as well as citing Saeryn's position.

If Eodwine dies, Degas will fulfill his oath to protect the land and his sister.

If Eodwine dies, you jerks, I'm going to have to come back and write Degas.

Jerks. You jerks. You did that on purpose!

Nog, you should be ashamed of yourself.

Originally Posted by Nog

But lord Eodwine will take ill just a little before the meeting of the landlords... He is seriously ill... (and will be removed with anyone wishing to accompany him to Edoras where they could try to heal him)

I vote infection.

Or pneumonia. Everybody loves a good bout of pneumonia as a way to knock off a character.

Originally Posted by Nog

We'd only need to find a writer for Rowenna in that case. Anyone interested and not having too much to write already?

I'll write her.

Okay, so I'm caught up.

Nog, you're writing a new Eorl with a new wife?

I like that, but I'm concerned. Because of Degas's oath that should anything happen to Eodwine, he'd take care of business, I don't see him reacting too well to somebody new coming in.

Which might in fact work extremely well for some drama if Degas's petition to the king was refused and somebody else was brought in. Degas would not be at all happy and would consider it a slight against both him, his sister, and the memory of Eodwine. As well as a deliberate stripping of the title of Saeryn's as yet unborn child[ren].

So to get to my final point, would you, Nog, be opposed to Degas being opposed to your new Eorl?

PS: i totally wasn't going to come back, I was just going to read the thread and offer some opinions.

Grumble grumble.

[Nogrod]

I love you Fea!!!

It would be fabulous if Degas stayed. And you writing Rowenna would be great as well.


What we have in mind as like now is the following...

The autumn after the games & the marriage festivities goes in working with the reconstruction of the hall to become a real Mead Hall.

Then it was a plan of Eodwine's to call the local landlords to pay homage to him (and to the king) on certain day X when the Hall itself is more or less ready. After their allegiance would have been secured he could move on to other lesser masters and the common peasants - and thus establish the Mead Hall as part of King Eomer's governance there. Meaning they would pay taxes to the Mead Hall and the MH in turn would provide the people with protection and be the place where king's law would be executed. Civilising the territories that is - or putting them under the king's rule if one wants to say it differently.

Now just before the day the local landlords have been invited lord Eodwine falls badly ill... high temperature, vomiting... whatever you wish. The people would try to cure him or at least ease his pain but nothing would work. And then they would decide that he should be sent to Edoras to get the best medical attention possible - and their eyes will follow the carts taking him to the city with heavy hearts knowing they might never see him again...

It could then be firstly Saeryn, Degas or Thornden who would try to settle things with the landlords that come to visit. And they would not be easy guys to settle things with as they will not at all like the idea of the crown coming to their "personal property" trying to tax them from all they they gather themselves from the neighbouring areas and from the backbones of the peasants...

That would be what we should write the next... in a few days that is.

(We will produce a narration to move us to the moment when the landlords arrive in a few days and will then either "play" the landlords ourselves or hire up some quest-writers to do some of them so we can move this forwards pretty soon.)

After whatever happens with the landlords - that's for you to write how it goes - then the new eorl and his entourage will arrive (maybe a week or two after Eodwine has left, gametime that is and probably jumped ahead in the game) with only the message that lord Eodwine has been taken to Minas Tirith, to the houses of healing, and everyone just hopes for the best even if the predicament is bad indeed. But there would be now the new eorl and he would take the things under his control untill further notice.

The idea sure is that all the people will assume lord Eodwine dead and gone - as he most likely will be. But we'd still leave a door open if elempi decides one day, a year or two from now, to wish to come back even if only to visit the place. So there would be no news about lord Eodwine after he's gone (and what the new eorl would have to tell when he comes in).

Originally Posted by Fea

Nog, you're writing a new Eorl with a new wife?

Yes. And Mnemo will write my wife - and Lommy our two trouble-maker sons...

We're still waiting for a few strong characters to join the entourage (like a housekeeper, right-hand man for the eorl, maybe some soldiers, others... like more children to shuffle that pack also etc.), hopefully being new writers to the Mead Hall as well...

[Folwren]

AAAAHHH! There's so much going on! I can't keep up! But I am SO excited!!!!!!

I'll see if I can catch up tonight and get some of my opinions up. I've been wanting to write something for the past day or more, but haven't done it (obviously). Later, folks!

-- Folwren

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

I'm trying to figure out if it's plausible that Saeryn would stay if Eodwine was going. I'm thinking if she was pregnant and they worried that her traveling would be disruptive to it?

But wouldn't somebody tell Saeryn for sure whether Eodwine lived or died? While it's good to keep it ambiguous if LMP wants to come back at any point, it's not entirely plausible in terms of characters. Surely somebody would inform his pregnant wife that he was either alive or dead.

Honestly, I think the best way to deal with it is to just have him die. LMP is quite firmly gone, and intended to be gone ages ago. But if he does return and wants to play, I have the utmost faith in his creative ability to find a way to fit himself back into the action.

And if he dies, then Rowenna (I'm more or less planning on shortening her name to a fondly used 'Wenna') would have far more reason to return, no longer having to see him. The home she has been most comfortable in no longer contains the element which tore her up inside, you know? And without the competition between her and Saeryn, Rowenna could easily become almost a nursemaid for any impending children. Indeed, her loyalties might easily transfer from the man she wished to marry to the child-in-progress that he left behind. A sort of "If I couldn't have him to care for, I can at least make certain that that which he left behind thrives."

Of course she would be downright vitriolic, I'm thinking, to an interposer.

Sorry, Nog, love, but a new Eorl is just asking for trouble.

Saeryn, whether she wants it or not, will - if she's there - find herself at the center of a very disgruntled group of individuals who are outraged on her behalf.