Predestination in Middle-Earth - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Iarwain · 09-22-2003, 08:44 PM

Such well worded newcomers we have lately! 'Twas a most kind manner of addressing this topic, especially when you have negative views on it. I'm happy you posted, Elfwine. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] And I'm even happier that I didn't misjudge you from your first post.

That, however, doesn't change my dissagreement. While the precise Theology of Eru, will remain mysterious, I see no reason to ask questions of the events shown in Tolkien's works. What remains is a discussion of whether or not choice can be caused. From any and all scenerios in Middle-Earth, do we see potential for complete freedom of choice wherein one "good" cannot be placed over another "bad" in immediate consequences, or do we see a world in which characters are biased by their experiences, histories, and connections, making the scale more unequal and unsure than eternity might reflect. Perhaps, we might even see a Middle-Earth in which choices are visibly eternal, and the actions of a single person mark their infinite course onward through cause and effect towards or away from the ultimate goal. It is all a matter of vision: do characters see the future as immediate and infinitely limited to the present, or do they see reality as an expanse that has to be mapped as they take on the journey, or do they have a birds eye view on life, living all at once and once forever?

That was, of course merely a rephrasing of the topic post, but I hope it has made everything a bit clearer.

Iarwain

09-22-2003, 08:44 PM	#32
Iarwain Pugnaciously Primordial Paradox Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Birnham Wood Posts: 800	Such well worded newcomers we have lately! 'Twas a most kind manner of addressing this topic, especially when you have negative views on it. I'm happy you posted, Elfwine. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] And I'm even happier that I didn't misjudge you from your first post. That, however, doesn't change my dissagreement. While the precise Theology of Eru, will remain mysterious, I see no reason to ask questions of the events shown in Tolkien's works. What remains is a discussion of whether or not choice can be caused. From any and all scenerios in Middle-Earth, do we see potential for complete freedom of choice wherein one "good" cannot be placed over another "bad" in immediate consequences, or do we see a world in which characters are biased by their experiences, histories, and connections, making the scale more unequal and unsure than eternity might reflect. Perhaps, we might even see a Middle-Earth in which choices are visibly eternal, and the actions of a single person mark their infinite course onward through cause and effect towards or away from the ultimate goal. It is all a matter of vision: do characters see the future as immediate and infinitely limited to the present, or do they see reality as an expanse that has to be mapped as they take on the journey, or do they have a birds eye view on life, living all at once and once forever? That was, of course merely a rephrasing of the topic post, but I hope it has made everything a bit clearer. Iarwain __________________ "And what are oaths but words we say to God?"