Radagast's ultimate fate

[Man-of-the-Wold]

I've always felt that Saruman would have had him eliminated

[Alcuin]

The purpose of the Istari was (UT, “The Istari”)

to advise and persuade Men and Elves to good, and to seek to unite in love and understanding all those whom Sauron, should he come again, would endeavor to dominate and corrupt.

…the memory of the Blessed Realm was to them a vision from afar off, for which (so long as they remained true to their mission) [the Istari] yearned exceedingly. …

…Radagast …. became enamored of the many beasts and birds that dwelt in Middle-earth, and forsook Elves and Men, and spent his days among the wild creatures. Thus he got his name … “tender of beasts”…

It wasn’t that Radagast was evil or malicious. Gandalf called him “the honest Radagast” in the Council of Elrond, and reiterated his trust in his integrity, pointing out that it was because of Radagast that Gwaihir the Windlord came to Orthanc, found Gandalf Saruman’s captive, and rescued him. Gandalf successfully used Radagast as a reference in his initial encounter with Beorn.

Radagast simply lost focus on his mission. He was sent to Middle-earth by Yavanna because Aulë sent Saruman. (This part of the legendarium smacks of the kind of jealousy seen in Greek myth between Zeus and Hera, for instance.)

I think that means that Radagast must have remained in Middle-earth until well into the Fourth Age. I don’t believe he still yearned exceedingly for the Blessed Realm, and being a Maia, he would not die of natural causes. The Men of the Vales of Anduin should have had some recourse to him for that time, as well as the Kings of Gondor and Rohan, if they thought to seek him out. Because of his relationship to Yavanna, one wonders why he was not an obvious ally of Treebeard and the Ents; but perhaps he was, and Tolkien did not inform us of it, or else it is not published. (There is a hint in Treebeard’s conversation with Merry and Pippin that he know might know more wizards than just Gandalf and Saruman, so it is quite possible that he knew Radagast, too.)

I think I met Radagast many years ago in Berkley, California. He was running a Ben & Jerry’s, wore Birkenstocks, had a staff, and was followed around by a couple of deer and lots of birds and furry critters.

[Rumil]

I wonder, should he have decided/been allowed to stay in Middle Earth, if he joined or helped Celeborn's new elvish realm of the Greenwood in the Fourth Age?

I imagine that Dol Guldur and the environs needed 'cleaning up' after Sauron's defeat, perhaps R aided in some way. Rhosgobel was just by the eaves of Mirkwood so at least technically Radagast might come under the area that Celeborn ruled.

I'd like to think that Radagast was forgiven for his failings, for he had never turned to evil per se, unlike Saruman. Maybe he elected to stay in ME, eventually becoming a Bombadil-ish anomaly, or hitched a lift with Gimli and Legolas on the last ship?

[Alfirin]

Originally Posted by Alcuin

Radagast simply lost focus on his mission. He was sent to Middle-earth by Yavanna because Aulë sent Saruman. (This part of the legendarium smacks of the kind of jealousy seen in Greek myth between Zeus and Hera, for instance.)]

Actually that brings up a interesting point. It suddenly occurs to me that another reason R. might wish to stay was on the possibility that the blue wizards were still alive (as Saruman, and R. himself demonstrate in the case of wizards "failed in mission" does not automatically translate to "dead") and he had to stay as a counterbalnce. Alatar and Pallando were after all, sent by Orome and so might be a little too fond of hunting (all of the other Istari seem to show proclivites remiscent of the Valar that chose them, so the blues presumably do as well). Maybe dawn of the forth age Radagast was a little worried that, shoud Alatar and Pallando return from the East (If their role truly had been to forment resistance against Sauron in the East, with Sauron gone, they might have wandered more freely) and that ME needed him around to play Lorax.



I think I met Radagast many years ago in Berkley, California. He was running a Ben & Jerry’s, wore Birkenstocks, had a staff, and was followed around by a couple of deer and lots of birds and furry critters.

[/QUOTE]

It may be, though personally Ive always though of Radagast as looking quite a bit younger (the Ishtari were only supposed to age through the rigors of their labors. Since R. seems to have gone native pretty quicky, and his native live seems (at least until the very end), largely stress free, I imagine he aged less than Gandalf or Saruman. I tend to think of him has having Gandalf's build more or less, tall and slender but with hair and bear that are still largely brown (The image I keep getting is basically somwhere between Ron Moody's Fagin in a pointy hat and Kirby's version of Rincewing plus ten years)

As for Saruman possibly planning to eliminate R. had he come to power, I think this is almost certain. To me, at least the litany Saruman accused Gandalf of wanting were things that Saruman himself desired; had he suceeded in his desires he no doubt would have wished to take Barad-Dur's keys (along with Barad-Dur itself likey) and the crowns of kings. Taking all of the wizards rods, making himself the one and only wizard; holder of all power, would likey sit high on his list. He did desire all five staffs, in fact (If you belive some of the possible fragments about what happened to the blue wizards) he may have already had three of them, as he technically already had one crown, Isildur's original one (mentioned at the end of "The Disaster of the Gladden Fields" in the UT)

[Ibrîniðilpathânezel]

Originally Posted by Alcuin

I think I met Radagast many years ago in Berkley, California. He was running a Ben & Jerry’s, wore Birkenstocks, had a staff, and was followed around by a couple of deer and lots of birds and furry critters.

Ah, I needed a good laugh!

My personal opinion has always been that Radagast, in focusing too strongly on the flora and fauna of Middle-earth that he so loved, lost sight of his mission to aid and guide the people in the resistance against Sauron, and just plain forgot who and what he truly was, and where he came from. Not evil or malicious in his failing, but failed nonetheless. I believe he remained in Middle-earth either until something happened to kill his human body, or until he finally did something that jogged his memory.

Somewhat facetiously — but not entirely — I once postulated that Radagast was Merlin, who, after helping put Arthur on the right path, was "lured" away by "Nimue," another Maia who was sent to finally bring him home, having at last fulfilled his original mission to help the beleaguered residents of Middle-earth (another member of the board on which I first postulated this was kind enough to write a charming little piece of fan fiction about the event). In an odd way, it makes sense, partly because of the ambiguity about Merlin's origins and fate in the many variations of the Arthur legend, and partly because it would place a small connection between Tolkien's invented British mythology and Britain's most prominent legend.

[Pitchwife]

Radagast as Merlin? That's not such a weird idea at all - especially if you consider the original Merlin we meet in the Black Book of Carmarthen, Myrddin Wyllt, the mad hermit of the Caledonian woods who addressed his prophecies to pigs and apple-trees and appeared at his ex-wife's second wedding riding on a stag. Quite a Radagastly figure.

[Rumil]

And did he turn up later as St Francis of Assisi?

Hmm, who's he now then- David Attenborough?

[doug*platypus]

In the spirit of speculation rather than textual citation, I would hazard a guess that Radagast remained in Middle Earth out of choice after the fall of Sauron, so enamoured was he of the beasts and birds in Mirkwood and around. Whether he actually did help out in the rehabilitation of Mirkwood after it's rebranding as Greenwood the Great is a matter for even more speculation, but I think it's highly possible that without Gandalf and Saruman around to guide his actions, he just did his own thing. He seems to play the part of the disengaged employee in modern terms. As mormegil put it so well in the other thread:

The comparision [sic] between Radagast and Sauruman is equivalent to the difference between a sin of omission and a sin of commission.

Radagast was a failure not because of his actions as Saruman was, but because of his inactions. Not that he was no help at all, it's just that as far as using his abilities to their fullest, he was no Gandalf to put it mildly.

I imagine that eventually over the years, Radagast, Maia though he was, faded as did those of the Firstborn who remained in Middle Earth through the ushering in of the Dominion of Men... what was it, dwindling to a rustic folk of wood and dell. It is possible that eventually when his body faded, which I believe it would do as he was sent to Middle Earth in the form of an old man with the other Istari, with the sole purpose of fighting the good fight against Sauron, that he was able to seek admission back to the Undying Lands. Would his enquiring spirit be swept away as Saruman's was, though? I cannot say. But I think he would stand a better chance of forgiveness and acceptance.

[Boromir88]

Going back to my first post I found the references to the different histories of the Blue wizards I mentioned.

In Letter 211 it seems like Tolkien thought they had a special mission to go east but failed (only in a different manner) like Saruman and Radagast.

"I really do not know anything clearly about the other two- since they do not concern the history of the N.W. I think they went as emissaries to distant regions., East and South, far out of Numenorean range: missionaries to ’enemy- occcupied lands, as it were. What success they had I do not know; but I fear that they failed , as Saruman did, though doubtless in different ways; and I suspect they were founders or beginners of secret cults and ’magic ’ tradiitons that outlasted the fall of Sauron."

This is where the idea that they started their own "cults." However, Tolkien was rather uncomfortable with the cult-practice part of religion in his stories. I think that's where we see a change, and in Home XII: Last Writings it's a completely different history. The Blue wizards actually arrive in the Second Age (when according to LOTR the Istari didn't come until the Third Age). Anyway, Alatar and Pallando were specially sent to the East in the Second Age and crucial in minimizing Sauron's swelling army.

"But the other two Istari were sent for a different purpose. Morinehtar and Romestamo. Darkness-slayer and East-helper. Their task was to circumvent Sauron: to bring help to the few tribes of Men that had rebelled from Melkor-worship, to stir -up rebellion...and after his first fall to search out his hiding (in which they failed) and to cause dissension and disarray among the dark East. They must have had very great influence on the history of the Second Age and Third Age in weakening and disarrayinbg the forces of the East...who would both in the Second and Third Age otherwise have outnumbered the West."