The door of durin.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

I think that Gandalf said "Moria" because he was not only translating, but also explaining to the Fellowship. He used the term that would be better understood.

Personally, that's the explanation that makes the most sense to me. As for the depiction of the Doors in the book, wouldn't that have been the work of Frodo, since LOTR is taken from the Red Book? If Frodo were to draw a picture of the Doors from memory, it seems logical he might have rendered the inscription just as he'd heard Gandalf say it, using "Moria".

[Galin]

Here's what we have (harping on this string for those not interested in Appendix F):

A) Moria -- Elvish
B) Hadhodrond -- Elvish

(either name is possible on the actual doors! and A might be in Frodo's original drawing, as suggested)

C) unknown Dwarf-name, inner -- Dwarvish language
D) unknown Dwarf-name, outer -- Mannish language

(D is the likely name for a 'public' door like the Doors of Moria)

_____

E) translated (outer) Dwarf-name -- Old Norse

(these appear in the drawing in the book published in the 1950s: Durin, Narvi hail from Old Norse and represent some unknown outer names of these bearded beings)

_____

If known, A through D can appear on something original to Frodo's day, like the doors, a tomb, a letter. All these languages are 'internal' and are imagined to be actually spoken way back when the story takes place.

Example E is wholly different, and cannot be found on anything supposed to be original (anything made in Frodo's time).

[Nerwen]

In case anyone's still not getting it: according to the "translator conceit", only names derived from Tolkien's own conlangs are "real". Anything from another source is supposed to be merely a latter-day "translation".

[Galin]

Thank you Nerwen! Your concision trumps my 'chart like' post!

The translation conceit can get quite complicated (for instance 'Meriadoc' was really Kalimac... but seemingly Tom Bombadil is really what the Hobbits called this being 'back then')... but that's what makes it fun in my opinion!

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Galin

Thank you Nerwen! Your concision trumps my 'chart like' post!

I think the chart's necessary; the concept of the Dwarves having both real and false (i.e. "translated") pseudonyms is a bit brain-twisting.

Originally Posted by Galin

The translation conceit can get quite complicated (for instance 'Meriadoc' was really Kalimac... but seemingly Tom Bombadil is really what the Hobbits called this being 'back then')... but that's what makes it fun in my opinion!

Ah, well, as a semi-exception to what I said I my last post, Tolkien mentions that some of the hobbits' names are "real" (though usually with different endings), and just happen to resemble certain modern names ("Tom" being short for "Tomba", not "Thomas").