WW LXXXIX: The Terror of Tol Fuin

[Bom Tombadillo]

*ahem* It's well known that the first three people to post are the wolves. This means that while I agree with you, Nilp, about Sally being evil, so are you and . . . er . . . me. Um, maybe I should've thought that through more.

By the way, does anybody know whether votes are retractable? If it's in the rules, then I missed it.

If they are, then I'll be voting for DeathWish!Sally until such time as further evidence is presented.

"But she doesn't have a death wish," you say?

If I don't withdraw, I'll have to be killed at some point . . .

You will note that she has not withdrawn, ergo, according to her own (totally not-taken-out-of-context!) words, she will have to be killed.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Of course I'm evil. I thought everyone knew that.

Whether I am a friend of this impromptu village or not, well, that shall have to remain unknown.

(After all, y'all won't trust me if I told you I'm back to being an Ordo again, would you?)

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by Nilpaurion Felagund

(After all, y'all won't trust me if I told you I'm back to being an Ordo again, would you?)

Regardless of role, I'm rather certain you're never ordinary.

[Nerwen]

So... nothing much to report, is there?

We have Nilp and cohorts (by the way, I don't believe I've had the pleasure of Alice's acquaintance) threatening to... let me guess... self-vote?

We have Sally claiming to be an ordo– which almost counts as a reveal, in a small game like this.

We have Bom Tombadillo stating his intention of voting Sally:

Originally Posted by Bom

By the way, does anybody know whether votes are retractable? If it's in the rules, then I missed it.

If they are, then I'll be voting for DeathWish!Sally until such time as further evidence is presented.

"But she doesn't have a death wish," you say?

You will note that she has not withdrawn, ergo, according to her own (totally not-taken-out-of-context!) words, she will have to be killed.

If votes were retractable, the rules would have said so (unless Zil wants to come to life to correct me).

Now, here's a question for you, Bom. Obviously, your reason for voting Sally is a joke. What about your intention of voting her as a placeholder candidate? Was that a joke too?

[Mithalwen]

Yeah..I haven't played much since the werewolf procedures were codified but I think fixed votes are the default setting unless I am the mod in which case it is retractable votes and major league hissy fits when they are abused . So I concur with Nerwen.

Otherwise ..yeah I am glad I spent the past few hours sleeping...
Nilp - evil? *gulp* no you are just err..different.

Well time to get the kettle on and then consider if there is anything more to the posting so far than froth and bubble. Why is Shasta anxious about not posting in it? Was he traumatised by some silliness related incident in WW whatever that has gone down in legend? It just seemed a slightly peculiar thing to say. Excited but reluctant to post .... hmm... maybe just a subtle version of the Day one thing.

[Loslote]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Why is Shasta anxious about not posting in it? Was he traumatised by some silliness related incident in WW whatever that has gone down in legend? It just seemed a slightly peculiar thing to say. Excited but reluctant to post .... hmm... maybe just a subtle version of the Day one thing.

Erm...well, Ordo!Me might have sort of accidentally gotten Seer!Him killed on Day 1 once...but it wasn't all my fault...there was this bandwagon...mostly on his banter posts...yeah that fits your description pretty much.

[Mithalwen]

Ah ok then ... right I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now then...

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Originally Posted by Bom Tombadillo

*ahem* It's well known that the first three people to post are the wolves. This means that while I agree with you, Nilp, about Sally being evil, so are you and . . . er . . . me. Um, maybe I should've thought that through more.

By the way, does anybody know whether votes are retractable? If it's in the rules, then I missed it.

If they are, then I'll be voting for DeathWish!Sally until such time as further evidence is presented.

"But she doesn't have a death wish," you say?



You will note that she has not withdrawn, ergo, according to her own (totally not-taken-out-of-context!) words, she will have to be killed.

There's the post in question. I can't believe how much attention it's garnered; and I would also say that if it was made by a regular player everyone would skip over it. The last line is, to my mind at least, pretty funny.

[Loslote]

I'm here! And I have First Impressions.

Sally is probably my dear sweet cupcake, and I would not like to lynch her toDay at all.

Bom is a dear sweet newish player who, from what little he's posted, sounds like last game when he was innocent. I'd like to leave him be, too.

Galadriel's posts hit me over the head a little like a baby fish, but it's her first game ever, so she gets a newbie pass out of the category of "say what now".

Kit's post I saw and instantly "whaaaaaaat"ed because I forgot she was playing in this game. But I don't know how to read her yet, I just wanted to mention that.

The rest of you I've got no real impressions on yet. More noise-making, please!

Edit: Xed with two Sallys

[Kitanna]

Originally Posted by Loslote

Kit's post I saw and instantly "whaaaaaaat"ed because I forgot she was playing in this game. But I don't know how to read her yet, I just wanted to mention that.

Thanks dear :P

++Sally
My hat I say!

I have to go now. Best of luck to the village for the rest of today.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Oh, we have to highlight our votes, don't we? Haven't done this in a while so let's just see if I can remember....

Yes. Good. Um... as you were.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

++Galadriel55

So you'll remember me forever as the first person ever to vote for you in Werewolf. Har!

Seriously: too much defending of Sally, too much attacking Bom and a weird interpretation of Kitanna. I think there's something lupine with this one!

[Mithalwen]

It does have a certain familiar ring but the main thing I associate with you is ranting about people voting at the last minute when you always vote at the last minute yourself And the last time we played was Rikae's game which maybe shouldn't be dwellt on. But it is common sense. Frothy posting can be irritating but it may be the froth conceals something substantial - as with a Macchiato

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Originally Posted by Loslote

I'm here! And I have First Impressions.

Sally is probably my dear sweet cupcake, and I would not like to lynch her toDay at all.

Bom is a dear sweet newish player who, from what little he's posted, sounds like last game when he was innocent. I'd like to leave him be, too.

Galadriel's posts hit me over the head a little like a baby fish, but it's her first game ever, so she gets a newbie pass out of the category of "say what now".

Kit's post I saw and instantly "whaaaaaaat"ed because I forgot she was playing in this game. But I don't know how to read her yet, I just wanted to mention that.

The rest of you I've got no real impressions on yet. More noise-making, please!

Edit: Xed with two Sallys

Sally and G55 seem completely intent on making people suspicious of them; again today, pretty much soon as Inzil opens the new day, both of them are posting and defending their votes. Here we have Loslote defending both of them yesterday.

I promise not to just pick on you two but you both worry me quite a bit!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

The G55/ Loslote relationship is interesting.

I shouldn't let my suspicions of G55 conceal the likelihood that the evil Loslote voted for an innocent villager on Day One. So you've definitely got that going for you.

But because I'm suspicious of her, it looks to me like Loslote kind of backed herself into a corner when it came to her vote choice. She first defended G55 (I quoted the post above), but then mentioned her as a suspect - I believe after I (and Sally!) had raised questions about G55. I know as a wolf it can be hard to come up with reasonable assessments of villagers and it looks like Loslote simply failed to do it - she maybe ran out of time. Either way, she ended up with only G55 as a possible vote.

But she did put herself at pains to sway other people from voting G55, repeating over and over that she felt bad about voting G55 on her first day of Werewolf.

[Mithalwen]

[QUOTE=Eomer of the Rohirrim;657707]The G55/ Loslote relationship is interesting.

I shouldn't let my suspicions of G55 conceal the likelihood that the evil Loslote voted for an innocent villager on Day One. So you've definitely got that going for you.

QUOTE]

Loslote didn't actually vote though did she? I can't see it and Nilp hasn't listed it. Not that I am not listed out atm. I may vote for the most annoying listmaker at the moment if you haven't gone definitively Greenie

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

[QUOTE=Mithalwen;657770]

Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim

The G55/ Loslote relationship is interesting.

I shouldn't let my suspicions of G55 conceal the likelihood that the evil Loslote voted for an innocent villager on Day One. So you've definitely got that going for you.

QUOTE]

Loslote didn't actually vote though did she? I can't see it and Nilp hasn't listed it. Not that I am not listed out atm. I may vote for the most annoying listmaker at the moment if you haven't gone definitively Greenie

You're...... right? I must have imagined something that didn't happen.

So G55 doesn't have the consolation of being voted for by the evil wolf.

[Nogrod]

Just a quick one here, more later when I have time to look at this properly.

It is interesting that Kit decided to concentrate her effort toDay (well, thus far) into close-reading those who got LottieWolf lynched. Now wolf-on-wolf votes do happen every now and then and I'm not suggesting some people should be made immune or putting them beyond suspicion just because they voted / lynched a wolf. But Kit's priorities look interesting: like she wishes to turn the discussion away form somewhere else?

Another interesting thing. Lottie tends to get lynched on D1 more often than the average player. Therefore I was not suspicious of her at first when the suspicions started to gather around her as I thoguht it's just her normal "looking suspicious" -behaviour - and I have been lynching her on D1's quite a few times already. But then I saw that slip regarding Kitanna - and that really started to make me suspect her for real.

Now if I'm right about it, that I suspected Lottie from the correct reason, then it would point to Kitanna being a second baddie.

So, for the two reasons given here, I see my eyes focusing toward Kit toDay. I'll try to take a closer look on her posting as I come back.


But anyway, we had a great Day yesterDay even if it looked a bit mild and lazy for the first 20 hours... but the last four hours rocked!

[Mithalwen]

Hello, I am now around but I may not be very active til later - have been a little unwell overnight and not feeling quite the ticket yet. However v impressed by the amount there is to read .though I haven't quite grasped the detail yet. There are certainly some interesting interractions.

Just as a by the way before I get down to digesting the analyses (and Mithalwen's second law of werewolf is to check such things for wolf may lurk therein - some are faux helpful rather than faux-naif).

I would point out that this fascinating little Ranger twist (dont' remember anything quite like it in games I have played),means that while in ranger games the wolves will always have weigh the risk of not getting a kill against trying to get the players most dangerous to them out of the way - and if there are readable seer hints it will alert both Ranger and wolves potentially. This game there is the risk that one of them will die as well as not getting the desired kill. Dependent on how likely the surviving wolves feel any potential Seer is to have dreamt of them early they may think that risking another dream and getting a more certain kill is a better path than going for the most obvious first and possibly starting day 2 down to a lone wolf (even with seer/ranger out of the way). OK that was a verbose way of saying that the choice of Shasta may not be of major significance.

[Thinlómien]

I think we got quite lucky with Lottie - at least I didn't suspect her very seriously and voting her was partly laziness of thought from my part. Either way, I'm glad we are one wolf down already. Now we can safely fail a few Days.

Shasta the seer suspect? The obvious conclusion is that the wolves thought him to have dreamt of Lottie. However, like others have pointed out, it's curious why the wolves picked exactly this kill - was it fear of the ranger like Mith suggests or were all the other suspicions/trusts standing out just way off?

Also, someone implied Lottie, Sally and G55 trio? Huh, that would be totally insane.

Now off to reply to some points from toDay...

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

[ . . . ]I would point out that this fascinating little Ranger twist (dont' remember anything quite like it in games I have played),means that while in ranger games the wolves will always have weigh the risk of not getting a kill against trying to get the players most dangerous to them out of the way - and if there are readable seer hints it will alert both Ranger and wolves potentially. This game there is the risk that one of them will die as well as not getting the desired kill. Dependent on how likely the surviving wolves feel any potential Seer is to have dreamt of them early they may think that risking another dream and getting a more certain kill is a better path than going for the most obvious first and possibly starting day 2 down to a lone wolf (even with seer/ranger out of the way). OK that was a verbose way of saying that the choice of Shasta may not be of major significance.

When I grow up, I wanna be as smart as my Mummie.

(Trans: That's something I haven't thought of. Heh.)

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

It is interesting that Kit decided to concentrate her effort toDay (well, thus far) into close-reading those who got LottieWolf lynched. Now wolf-on-wolf votes do happen every now and then and I'm not suggesting some people should be made immune or putting them beyond suspicion just because they voted / lynched a wolf. But Kit's priorities look interesting: like she wishes to turn the discussion away form somewhere else?

Another interesting thing. Lottie tends to get lynched on D1 more often than the average player. Therefore I was not suspicious of her at first when the suspicions started to gather around her as I thoguht it's just her normal "looking suspicious" -behaviour - and I have been lynching her on D1's quite a few times already. But then I saw that slip regarding Kitanna - and that really started to make me suspect her for real.

Now if I'm right about it, that I suspected Lottie from the correct reason, then it would point to Kitanna being a second baddie.

Are you talking about Lottie's claim that she "didn't know Kit was playing"? I don't know– it was, of course, suspicious, with hindsight– but it might have been meant as a more general "look at me, I'm a clueless innocent" ploy, rather than having anything to do with Kit herself. On the other hand (or paw) Lottie did make quite a point of it: at #106 she says, Did I miss something? I could well have - I totally forgot Kit was playing at all, I might have forgotten there was a cobbler, too...

Originally Posted by Nilp

(Trans: That's something I haven't thought of. Heh.)

Seconded. That would explain a few things– it's been suggested the wolves thought Shasta was the Seer because of his case on Lottie and/or comments about Sally, but I find that unlikely (unless they panicked). It's just so hard not to think of getting the Seer as the lupine priority.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

"Neither of us" - speaking for both of ye, are you, G55? That smells fishy.

Sally already went ahead and explained hers before I did. She said herself that she wanted to clarify her vote toDay (in her first post toDay). If she thinks her vote should be explained - that's her choice.


Anyways, time to vote really soon for me. Bom still hasn't made his promised appearance.

I will probably be voting for Kit. She's the highest on my suspect list up to now.

Edit: xed since Lommy. You have come, Bom!