The Ruin of Beleriand and the Fall of Fingolfin

[Aiwendil]

But haveing considering this, I think that my understanding of the movement of Morgoth army has changed. Either Tolkien changed his idea about as well, or he made himself more clear in the GA account. That army of Orcs did not come over the plain of Anfauglith. It did come from the furthest North down the coast and crossed not the passes of Ered Wethrin but that of the coastal mountain range. In view of this I agree to stick completly to the account of GA here.

I think you're right - though I had failed to notice it before, GA does seem to say that besides the forces attacking Barad Eithel from the east, there was another army that 'came down from the north' and fought with Fingon in Hithlum. So we're agreed that we'll use GA for this section.

{Haladin}[Halethrim] as name for the third clan of Dúnedain: I agree with Aiwendil that we should seek a way around the problem Gondowe has brought up. The same is true for the House of Hador in some way. Hador was no longer the leader of that clan when they entered Beleriand (that was Marach) but still he gave the clan its well known name. Thus Tolkien gave us an example how to deal with this situation.

It may actually be slightly trickier to deal with than that - Tolkien calls the third house the 'folk of Marach' when they first enter Beleriand, but (unless I'm mistaken) we don't have the name of any leaders of the Halethrim before the Orc-raid. But still, I think this is a very minor problem and one we can deal with when we come to it.

RB-SM-05: I tend to use GA Version I and mention both Ulfang and Bor in the Footnote. The construct of a sentence in brakets and an added Footnote to it, seems rather blocky in my view.

Agreed.

RB-SM-06: I suppose that will do.

Are there any outstanding points that I've missed? If not, I think we're done with 'The Ruin of Beleriand'!

[Findegil]

Are there any outstanding points that I've missed? If not, I think we're done with 'The Ruin of Beleriand'!

I dont think so.

It seems we are finished with The Ruin of Beleriand and the Fall of Fingolfin. When I remember correctly, we planed to review everything done up to this point next. And we had a shaky plan to send the now finished end of our work (from This chapter to the end of the Silmarillion) out to suposedly interested reader to gain more intrest in the project.

Respectfuly
Findegil

[Aiwendil]

When I remember correctly, we planed to review everything done up to this point next.

Yes, I have (somewhere) a bunch of notes on the texts of the chapters we've done. A lot of it is just typos here and there, but I think there are a few things that may need some discussion. I'll dig those notes out and post them as soon as I can (probably this weekend).

And we had a shaky plan to send the now finished end of our work (from This chapter to the end of the Silmarillion) out to suposedly interested reader to gain more intrest in the project.

Do you think we ought to do this right now or wait until we've reviewed the already-done chapters? It might be better to wait and send a more error-free text, I think.

[Findegil]

I look forward to your notes. Typos are welcome as well as discussable issues. Since I took up the job of the 'typer' I correcr typos silently when I come across, but any findings are welcom of course.

About the discusseable issues: I have tried my hand on the Appendix of The Ainulindalë. Probably I should post that now since it is a kind of condensed overview of our discussions.

Do you think we ought to do this right now or wait until we've reviewed the already-done chapters? It might be better to wait and send a more error-free text, I think.

Your are right. That is probably better.

Respectfuly
Findegil

[ArcusCalion]

Hi! I have one quick question about this chapter. Why was the name Meril removed as the name of Orodreth's wife? If it was decided that the footnote be taken and applied to him, then why not the name of Inglor's wife as well?

[Findegil]

Meril was removed because she was not named in the later Note on the parentage of Gil-galad. That Orodreth who loved the Mountians (supposedly that of Dorthonion) and had an Sindarin wife, would find that wife in Dorthonion is one thing, but to shift a name from the wife of Finrod to that of Orodreth is as nother kettle of fish.

Respectfully
Findegil

[ArcusCalion]

As we discussed in the Eldamar and the Princes of the Eldalie chapter, I will add the bit from the Shibboleth in here:

RB-DF-07 <GA Now Rochallor had stayed beside the king until the end, but the wolves of Angband assailed him, and he escaped from them because of his great swiftness, and ran at last to Hithlum, and broke his heart and died. RB-DF-07.1 <Shibboleth The Noldor then became divided into separate kingships under Fingon son of Fingolfin, Turgon his younger brother, Maedros son of Fëanor, and Finrod son of {Arfin}[Finarfin]; and the following of Finrod had become the greatest.> Then in great sorrow Fingon ....

[Elvellon]

In the latest version in the private forum, there seems to be a missing piece here, where the ". }" is:

<GA Morgoth learning now of the defeat of the sons of {Finrod}[Finrafin], and the scattering of the people of Fëanor, hemmed Fingolfin in Hithlum and sent a great force to attack the westward pass into the vales of Sirion>. }<LQ1 Now Sauron, whom the RB-DB-30 {Noldor call Gorthu}<LQ2 Sindar called Gorthaur>, was the chief servant of Morgoth.

In this post, Findegil suggests this edit:

<GA Morgoth learning now of the defeat of the sons of {Finrod}[Finrafin], and the scattering of the people of Fëanor, hemmed Fingolfin in Hithlum and sent a great force to attack the westward pass into the vales of Sirion>. Sauron came against Orodreth, the warden of the tower, with RB-DB-28 {a host of} Balrogs. RB-DB-29 {Sauron was the chief servant of the evil Vala, whom he had suborned to his service in Valinor from among the people of the Gods. He was become a wizard of dreadful power, master of necromancy,}<LQ1 Now Sauron, whom the RB-DB-30 {Noldor call Gorthu}<LQ2 Sindar called Gorthaur>, was the chief servant of Morgoth.

And then in this post, Aiwendil suggests this edit:

<GA Morgoth learning now of the defeat of the sons of {Finrod}[Finarfin], and the scattering of the people of Fëanor, hemmed Fingolfin in Hithlum and sent a great force to attack the westward pass into the vales of Sirion; and Sauron his lieutenant {(who in Beleriand was named Gorsodh)} led that assault{,}[.]> RB-DB-29 {Sauron was the chief servant of the evil Vala, whom he had suborned to his service in Valinor from among the people of the Gods. He was become a wizard of dreadful power, master of necromancy,}<LQ1 Now Sauron, whom the RB-DB-30 {Noldor call Gorthu}<LQ2 Sindar called Gorthaur>, was the chief servant of Morgoth.

I'm not sure which one was finally decided on. Maybe neither, and it's just a stray "}" that didn't get deleted.

[Findegil]

Thank you for catching this! reading the thread farther, for me Aiwendil editing was taken in the end.

Respectfully
Findegil

P.S.: Evellon, did you adapt your settings for no private messages?

[Elvellon]

Originally Posted by Findegil

P.S.: Evellon, did you adapt your settings for no private messages?

I just checked my settings, and I have private messages enabled.