An Unexpected Journey, or the morning after - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Rhod the Red · 04-03-2013, 06:06 AM

I want to make two points that is more in disagreement with non-forum members but might address some confusion anyway. On the council meeting & Radagasts' portrayal.

In the WC meeting one might be puzzled by Gandalf's bowing & the contradiction of Gandalf most of the time by the others. As others have said Saruman outranked Gandalf, which was no little feat. Even if Saruman was on the up-and-up and not already falling into league with Sauron, it would have been his right and duty to call Gandalf into question. ATM, Saruman is the proven superior wizard. Verbally berating him for 'plans and schemes' made behind his superior's back.

Everything Gandalf believes right now, ref Sauron (which this is all foreshadowing of) are suspicions and gut instincts. Concrete proof is needed. He is calling into question things basically set in stone as far as everyone in the know is concerned. His preliminary propositions are radical to the extreme.

As to Galadriel and Elrond, they are powerful beings in their own right, separate from wizards, likely superior to wizards in some ways and lesser than wizards in others. Elrond is sort of looking upon Gandalf as unproven & unfounded in so much as his suspicions are concerned. Also, realising that elves are not all-knowing and flawed, I can sympathise with why he thinks it's a ridiculous notion to return Thorin and his kin to what is now Smaug's lair. Whuch one poster in page one said he was puzzled by the opposition. What a needless risk it looks like to stir a dragon from his lair in a foolish suicide mission, one that won't only affect Thorin, Gandalf, & the company but potentially countless innocents who have nothing to do with the attempt.

Galadriel I believe admires Gandalf above all others. She alone is wise and insightful enough to appreciate his full potential. Had she wanted to call his deception out before the others, she could have done so. Instead, she remained silent, granting him opportunity to obtain the proof he needed and to rise in everyone's eyes.

On Radagasts' portrayal, his usefulness appears to be missed by many. People who complain so much weren't paying much attention. Radagast was actually the one character who succeeded at every challenge put before him. He saved Sebastian the hedgehog, drove away the spiders and tracked their activity back to Dol Guldur, took on and defeated the ghost of the Witch-King(?)/Ringwraith, escaped the Necromancer alive & reported back to Gandalf & the White Council with valuable evidence, & then drew off the attack by the wargs. Radagast got stuff done while Saruman sniped from the sidelines & Gandalf played bodyguard to the Company.

LordPhillock · 04-23-2013, 05:09 PM

I really liked what Zigûr said. Especially since I've been trying to keep a record of what I wanted to have done in the "Hobbit" movie.

Also, I really enjoy these discussions too.

Zigûr · 04-30-2013, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LordPhillock

I really liked what Zigûr said. Especially since I've been trying to keep a record of what I wanted to have done in the "Hobbit" movie.

Why thank you. Honestly the whole thing feels like one missed opportunity after another in a certain light to my mind. I mean, take away all the additions to the story and the plot is relatively faithful, but the mood and tone is still all over the place. Consider the "good morning" sequence which was one of the most faithfully retained. Instead of the bluff Bilbo disguising his anxiety with more and more politeness we get the routine Martin Freeman bemused-and-cagey performance. Maybe it's just the strength of my mental images but a lot of the film's scenes seem to lack a certain gusto which is found in the source material.
In every one of these films there's something that stops me dead when I even consider rewatching them: incoherent wounded Frodo or dunderhead Treebeard or "go home Sam" or something like that. I think for "An Unexpected Journey" it has to be Thorin. What a bore.

Galadriel55 · 06-30-2013, 09:51 AM

Yesterday I had a group of friends over "to watch The Hobbit". By the time it got to Rivendell we had to pause for a second bathroom break, and since no one was paying any attention anyways to the movie and talking about random stuff instead we quit the movie and looked up funny LOTR/Hobbit-related videos, and then played board games. We decidedly decided that we are better off without TH.

Now what does that tell you about the movie? Too long and not interesting.

Michael Murry · 06-30-2013, 07:03 PM

"Pirates of the Third Age," based upon a New Zealand amusement park ride of the same name. Look for future installments in years to come.

alatar · 07-01-2013, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Yesterday I had a group of friends over "to watch The Hobbit".

Friends?!? Friends?!?

True friends do not invite friends over to watch The Hobbit.

Inziladun · 07-01-2013, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Yesterday I had a group of friends over "to watch The Hobbit". By the time it got to Rivendell we had to pause for a second bathroom break, and since no one was paying any attention anyways to the movie and talking about random stuff instead we quit the movie and looked up funny LOTR/Hobbit-related videos, and then played board games. We decidedly decided that we are better off without TH.

Now what does that tell you about the movie? Too long and not interesting.

This has happened to me on every rare occasion that I've tried to watch the LOTR films. It's the only time cleaning the catbox seems inviting.

Inziladun · 07-01-2013, 12:49 PM

just isn't in the cards for me.

My wife bought it on DVD when it was released, and then lent it to someone. From whose home it was stolen. Confusticate and bebother!

Morthoron · 07-01-2013, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inziladun

This has happened to me on every rare occasion that I've tried to watch the LOTR films. It's the only time cleaning the catbox seems inviting.

It is said the Egyptians constructed the pyramids while watching the LotR films.

Galadriel55 · 07-02-2013, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alatar

Friends?!? Friends?!?

True friends do not invite friends over to watch The Hobbit.

Thing is, though they didn't love it on the first viewing, they liked it well enough. And, despite all my grumpiness, so did I. However, the second watching was just beyond human abilities...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morthoron

It is said the Egyptians constructed the pyramids while watching the LotR films.

The reason being, most likely, that the Chinese have reserved the Hobbit movies for their Great Wall.

04-03-2013, 06:06 AM	#1
Rhod the Red Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: May 2006 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 257	I want to make two points that is more in disagreement with non-forum members but might address some confusion anyway. On the council meeting & Radagasts' portrayal. In the WC meeting one might be puzzled by Gandalf's bowing & the contradiction of Gandalf most of the time by the others. As others have said Saruman outranked Gandalf, which was no little feat. Even if Saruman was on the up-and-up and not already falling into league with Sauron, it would have been his right and duty to call Gandalf into question. ATM, Saruman is the proven superior wizard. Verbally berating him for 'plans and schemes' made behind his superior's back. Everything Gandalf believes right now, ref Sauron (which this is all foreshadowing of) are suspicions and gut instincts. Concrete proof is needed. He is calling into question things basically set in stone as far as everyone in the know is concerned. His preliminary propositions are radical to the extreme. As to Galadriel and Elrond, they are powerful beings in their own right, separate from wizards, likely superior to wizards in some ways and lesser than wizards in others. Elrond is sort of looking upon Gandalf as unproven & unfounded in so much as his suspicions are concerned. Also, realising that elves are not all-knowing and flawed, I can sympathise with why he thinks it's a ridiculous notion to return Thorin and his kin to what is now Smaug's lair. Whuch one poster in page one said he was puzzled by the opposition. What a needless risk it looks like to stir a dragon from his lair in a foolish suicide mission, one that won't only affect Thorin, Gandalf, & the company but potentially countless innocents who have nothing to do with the attempt. Galadriel I believe admires Gandalf above all others. She alone is wise and insightful enough to appreciate his full potential. Had she wanted to call his deception out before the others, she could have done so. Instead, she remained silent, granting him opportunity to obtain the proof he needed and to rise in everyone's eyes. On Radagasts' portrayal, his usefulness appears to be missed by many. People who complain so much weren't paying much attention. Radagast was actually the one character who succeeded at every challenge put before him. He saved Sebastian the hedgehog, drove away the spiders and tracked their activity back to Dol Guldur, took on and defeated the ghost of the Witch-King(?)/Ringwraith, escaped the Necromancer alive & reported back to Gandalf & the White Council with valuable evidence, & then drew off the attack by the wargs. Radagast got stuff done while Saruman sniped from the sidelines & Gandalf played bodyguard to the Company. __________________ Head of the Fifth Order of the Istari Tenure: Fourth Age(Year 1) - Present Currently operating in Melbourne, Australia

06-30-2013, 09:51 AM	#4
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,521	Yesterday I had a group of friends over "to watch The Hobbit". By the time it got to Rivendell we had to pause for a second bathroom break, and since no one was paying any attention anyways to the movie and talking about random stuff instead we quit the movie and looked up funny LOTR/Hobbit-related videos, and then played board games. We decidedly decided that we are better off without TH. Now what does that tell you about the movie? Too long and not interesting. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-30-2013, 07:03 PM	#5
Michael Murry Haunting Spirit Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 85	Pirates of the Third Age "Pirates of the Third Age," based upon a New Zealand amusement park ride of the same name. Look for future installments in years to come. __________________ "If it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic." -- Tweedledee

07-01-2013, 12:49 PM	#8
Inziladun Gruesome Spectre Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Heaven's doorstep Posts: 8,039	Watching AUJ... just isn't in the cards for me. My wife bought it on DVD when it was released, and then lent it to someone. From whose home it was stolen. Confusticate and bebother! __________________ Music alone proves the existence of God.

04-23-2013, 05:09 PM	#2
LordPhillock Animated Skeleton Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 33	I really liked what Zigûr said. Especially since I've been trying to keep a record of what I wanted to have done in the "Hobbit" movie. Also, I really enjoy these discussions too.