Where does Gandalf live

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

I don't know how I missed this before, but I think it's an interesting point.
Getting a "base" could be the first step, for one in a position of power and authority like the Istari, toward a mindset of domination and empire-building. After all, they were fundamentally the same creatures as Sauron. Gandalf may have deliberately kept his feet wandering not only to explore hearts and minds to see what he had to work with, but also to keep himself out of the "fortress" mentality that Saruman fell into.

Very interesting thought indeed. I suppose it's a very short step from thinking "this is the manifestation of my power" to "I am the lord of this property", and Sauronity begins. It's also very interesting that in the closest to a declaration of power that Gandalf ever made, he named himself a Stewart - knowing that Middle-Earth bears traces of his influence and power, but not appointing himself as its lord or master.

[Mithalwen]

In UT it says that he "never made for himself any lasting abode" and that he dwelllt in no place and gathered neither wealth norfollowers. It also says that he travelled mainly on foot. However we know that at times he has use of a horse and horse and cart. We also know that he made fireworks which I suspect is not something even a wizard finds convenient to do on the road. We know he borrows horses from Elrond Beorn and Rohan and while he seems to be received in mortal lands as a guest at Rivendell he seems part of the househol while he is there and while we don't witness it he no doubt is equally welcome at the Havens and Lorien. Cirdan instantly recognised Gandalf's significance as shown by his passing on of Narya to the one who seemed least of the Istari. Cirdan as Lord of the seemingly mose craft orientated elven realm may well have provided workshop space to Gandalf.

[Formendacil]

Part of the question, no doubt, must be what counts as a "lasting" abode in the course of a 2000-year incarnation-inhabitation of Middle-earth. If Gandalf rented a flat in Minas Tirith for five years, would that count as "lasting?"

I'm being mildly facetious, of course--I don't think they'd have called it a "flat" anyway.

But, that said, 2000 years is a LOOOOONG time. What is more, unlike Saruman and Radagast, Gandalf seems to have taken the time to get to KNOW the people of Middle-earth, and this suggests to me that he must have dwelt AMONG them, not just passed through now and then.

Mind you, this is no different than what has been suggested on this thread already, that Gandalf had familiar haunts where he spent a lot of time, but I would expand that list from Rivendell and the other Elven realms. Two millennia is a considerably long time. What's more, we know that Gandalf had to have spent enough time in the Shire during the Old Took's lifetime to acquire an in-depth knowledge of its families, geography, and customs. Furthermore, the suggestion that "Incanus" is a Quenya name given to Gandalf in earlier Gondor, while of only secondary canonicity (disputed as it might be by the alternative claim to be a name from Harad), might be taken as evidence that Gandalf had a base/home there in the time of the Kings that was later abandoned--perhaps he started spending most of his time in the North-Kingdom due to the near-by presence of Angmar.

As I said, I don't think I'm suggesting anything terribly new--just broadening the scope of what has been said. An abode that lasts five years might be pretty stable for me, but I hardly expect to live a century, let alone twenty of them!

Furthermore, it occurs to me that a key distinction between Gandalf and Saruman (and I include Radagast with Saruman here) is that Saruman dwells apart from the people of Middle-earth. In other words, the "sin" of a fixed dwelling is that it separates him from the people he is supposed to be among. Gandalf, on the other hand, by not having "his own" place anywhere (regardless of how long he may have settled for a time here or there), always dwells with and among the people of Middle-earth. Given the role of the Istari as kindlers of hope and prompters of action against Sauron, this seems an important point to note.

[Mithalwen]

Yes he certainly spent enough time to get to know people and become familiar enough to acquire nicknames and reputations whether good or ill. He may spend months at a time in a place. The point is he does not settle under his own establishment whether as a powerbase as with Saruman or a presumably more humble dwelling cum wildlife sanctuary as with Radagast. Gandalf saying Radagast was never a great traveller does suggest he was either in the wrong job or had a slightly different mission. Anyway I am sure it isnt a new thougt but I can't help thinking that there is a paralel with the wandering Friars..I meant to look up and see if there were blue friars as well as white, brown and grey.

[Sarumian]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I can't help thinking that there is a paralel with the wandering Friars..I meant to look up and see if there were blue friars as well as white, brown and grey.

I really like this! And totally agree with the idea that "settling" for an Istari was a first step to a failure, a way to become either "sauronish" or "bombadillish" (which they were not supposed to). Another point here are memories of the West. Istari's true home is beyond the sea and if they obtain another one, their memories of the Blessed realm, already blurred, can be forgotten together with the sense of their mission.

I should mention that Saruman initially travelled a lot and went far to the east with the Blue Wizards. He studied people and their lore deeply, as he had to read a lot in Gondor and Rivendale to develop his expert knowledge about rings' power and the Enemy. As for Radagast, it seems he proceeded directly to Greenwood (Mirkwood) and stayed there since his arrival, as he was not known even to Farngorn... Such a shame!

[Mithalwen]

I think in Rateliff's History of the Hobbit there is a mention that Tolkien decided Radagast hadn't failed.I must try and find it.

as for the Blue Friars..there is some sort of society of Masonic authors. i have seen some speculation of msonic references in Tolkien's work ut i dont remember rading ever that Tolkien was a mason himself.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I think in Rateliff's History of the Hobbit there is a mention that Tolkien decided Radagast hadn't failed.I must try and find it.

as for the Blue Friars..there is some sort of society of Masonic authors. i have seen some speculation of msonic references in Tolkien's work ut i dont remember rading ever that Tolkien was a mason himself.

Catholics were not allowed to become Freemasons. The Catholic church decreed that the deistic religion conflicted with church theology. The 1917 Code of Canon Law states that anyone who joins the Freemasons is automatically excommunicated. I would doubt Tolkien would consider membership given that.