Why do you like the Tolkien fandom?

[Zigûr]

Originally Posted by Galadriel

If you don't, I'd still like to know why.

I don't quote this because I dislike the 'Tolkien fandom', given that I really have little engagement outside the Downs, but at the same time I'm a touch sceptical about fandom in general. A shared or mutual interest can give people a sense of community and belonging, which in the right circumstances can be a very positive and healthy thing. On the other hand, I think it can also, in the wrong circumstances, enable the entrenchment of opinions, defensiveness and obsessive behaviour. Fandom worries me when it becomes an in-group, a shared self, hostile to non-fans, the out-group, the other. On a place like the Downs, where reasoned debate is the order of the day, this isn't an issue. On larger forums and elsewhere I think it's more noticeable. I could present some slightly more involved armchair psychology but that's basically the gist of my feelings. I like to think of myself as an "enthusiast."

On a related note, it's hard to pin down a fandom, isn't it? Take Tolkien as an example. I think the 'fandom' here is a touch different to the 'fandom' which posts gifs of Richard Armitage on tumblr.

[Galadriel]

Originally Posted by Zigûr

I don't quote this because I dislike the 'Tolkien fandom', given that I really have little engagement outside the Downs, but at the same time I'm a touch sceptical about fandom in general. A shared or mutual interest can give people a sense of community and belonging, which in the right circumstances can be a very positive and healthy thing. On the other hand, I think it can also, in the wrong circumstances, enable the entrenchment of opinions, defensiveness and obsessive behaviour. Fandom worries me when it becomes an in-group, a shared self, hostile to non-fans, the out-group, the other. On a place like the Downs, where reasoned debate is the order of the day, this isn't an issue. On larger forums and elsewhere I think it's more noticeable. I could present some slightly more involved armchair psychology but that's basically the gist of my feelings. I like to think of myself as an "enthusiast."

On a related note, it's hard to pin down a fandom, isn't it? Take Tolkien as an example. I think the 'fandom' here is a touch different to the 'fandom' which posts gifs of Richard Armitage on tumblr.

I would call that the PJ fandom, Zigûr.

You make some very good points about fandom becoming an 'in-group...hostile to non-fans, the out-group, the other'. I personally like to differentiate between a 'fan' and a 'fanatic'. "Enthusiast" is so erudite.

[jallanite]

Originally Posted by Galadriel

That's generally one of the reasons I really enjoy the Tolkien fandom. Foul language is usually kept to a minimum (there are exceptions!), compared to other fandoms. If there is aggresion, it is usually reserved for ideas and characters - not people.

The first web-group on Tolkien I recall joining I no longer recall the name of. But it was the official web-forum for the forthcoming Jackson films, though it had mostly moved away from the films into discussion of the books. The official moderator, appointed by the company who ran the forum, had long vanished. It seemed no-one was actually running this or any of the forums listed by the company. No moderators. Nothing.

Surprisingly this worked, because most members wanted it to work. A member who went by the name Prism-Cat was sort of unofficial moderator because everyone very much respected her and liked her. But she had no power to force anyone to do anything. That eventually became the problem.

There were two posters, teenagers, who filled their many posts with obscenities. I believe this was tolerated because there was nothing anyone could do. Eventually one of these persons became sort of a leader of a party which seemed to be increasingly attempting to take over the group.

Again there was nothing anyone could do. Eventually I and a few others left for other forums. The purveyor of obscenities eventually joined one of the other forums of which I was a member, and was banned from that forum after only three of his posts. Then one day, upon looking into the old forum, I found it entirely changed, run by a different company, with an entirely different format. I found the old forum by logging in by some other method.

There was now a moderator, an employee of the company. The old forum was no long listed as in any way connected to the film. The company moderator was involved with setting up elections to establish a new permanent moderator. The purveyor of obscenities was still around, but every one of his old posts had been deleted. But neither I or any of the others who had quit returned to posting there. We had apparently all got used to discussions free from rudeness and obscenities.

All the forums run by the company were closed down about a year later.

Originally Posted by Zigûr

On the other hand, I think it can also, in the wrong circumstances, enable the entrenchment of opinions, defensiveness and obsessive behaviour. Fandom worries me when it becomes an in-group, a shared self, hostile to non-fans, the out-group, the other. On a place like the Downs, where reasoned debate is the order of the day, this isn't an issue.

Indeed! But is academia that different? It used to be that sf and fantasy works were generally not allowed to be discussed or taught. But they have gradually crept in, originally through special courses in “popular culture”. Earlier still works by Charles Dickens were forbidden as too popular. I recall an early academic sf conference in Toronto in which someone questioned what official qualifications sf author Alexei Panshin had which allowed him to speak at the conference.

I originally mostly dropped out of sf fandom after being very active in it, being tired of the increasing mass of self-obsessed personalzines. I dropped out of Tolkien fandom in total disgust at the dishonesty of Glen GoodKnight and his Mythopoeic Society.

I partially returned when web forums began to appear when the Jackson films were announced. I dropped away and returned again to web fandom over the years. Then when I recently retired and had more time, thought of getting involved again. I started to make submissions to Tolkien fanzines which were published. I found out from the web that there was a local Tolkien Society group here in Toronto, and found out when their next meeting was.

The meeting was poorly attended. When I arrived the only other person at the pub was she who is known here as Galadriel55. Galadriel55 was very courteous and polite to a boring old geezer, and very, very knowledgeable on Tolkien matters. We talked for over two hours until a few others turned up. Galadriel55 mentioned that she was a member of a Tolkien web-forum and that it was called Barrow-Downs.  “Why I’m a member of that group!” I said.

About two weeks after the meeting I thought of checking out Barrow-Downs again to see if I could find this girl of whom I only had the first name and not her log-in. I expected it to take a day, or forever. But in fact it took almost no time at all. All one had to do was to look at a few posts by one who at the time posted more prolifically than anyone else to discover that she lived in Toronto and was of Russian origin. Bingo! Also her posts were amazing: lively, vibrant, and very, very intelligent.

It had been years since I posted here and took me about another week to get my old id back.

[Lotrelf]

I'd say maturity. (though, I've seen old people fighting like kids ) That's all I can say for now. I'll add something later, if I got to.