Tidbits of Curiosity - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galadriel55 · 04-23-2019, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

2. I think Grima and Maeglin are more similar than Gollum and Maeglin, as both are evil chancellors who betrayed their King.

Quote:

Originally Posted by William Cloud Hicklin

And both were bribed with the promise of an (unwilling) princess

That's true. But we don't know much about how Grima came to be who he was, as opposed to the other two whose journey to the "dark side" is well described. Do we know how Grima came to his high position, and to his betrayal? Presumably Grima had to get in contact with Saruman before he set Eowyn as the price for his betrayal. Likewise for Maeglin - but we know more of that story.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

Here are the couple of tales I wrote for Silm: https://archiveofourown.org/users/Cr...ndom_id=230931

Will read! Thanks for sharing!

Urwen · 04-23-2019, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

That's true. But we don't know much about how Grima came to be who he was, as opposed to the other two whose journey to the "dark side" is well described. Do we know how Grima came to his high position, and to his betrayal? Presumably Grima had to get in contact with Saruman before he set Eowyn as the price for his betrayal. Likewise for Maeglin - but we know more of that story.

I think it happened in the similar. Imagine someone who got a short end of the stick. Imagine there was only one person who had really shown them kindness. You get the picture.

Galadriel55 · 04-23-2019, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

I think it happened in the similar. Imagine someone who got a short end of the stick. Imagine there was only one person who had really shown them kindness. You get the picture.

I don't know. I can imagine several possibilities for why Grima ended up serving Saruman. I don't think he got served the short end of the stick; my understanding was that he became disliked after he openly started manipulating Theoden not to the benefit of the country (though not openly enough that his direct connection with Saruman was guessed).

Urwen · 04-23-2019, 07:10 AM

I am talking about how their lust came to be.

Galadriel55 · 04-23-2019, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

I am talking about how their lust came to be.

Ah, gotcha. But still. I don't think Eowyn would have shown Grima much kindness after he started manipulating Theoden. She would have been courteous to him before like she would to all the people in their house, as hostess. But Grima wasn't the same lonely confused socially awkward "teenager" that Maeglin was when he came to Gondolin. Maeglin got to where he was by birth; Grima, having no blood ties to the King that we know of, would have to rise by merit. He would have had to be liked and supported by the King, and initially also by all the other people around the King. He would have to influence all of them, which requires significant social skill - that which Maeglin lacked. So I would not put them on the same conveyor belt on this point.

Urwen · 04-23-2019, 07:53 AM

It's like a reverse-Hamlet.

Galadriel55 · 04-23-2019, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

It's like a reverse-Hamlet.

The evil nephew marrying too close a relative and betraying the rightful king?

04-23-2019, 07:10 AM	#4
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,408	I am talking about how their lust came to be. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

04-23-2019, 07:53 AM	#6
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,408	It's like a reverse-Hamlet. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.