The Common Tongue and Latin - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galin · 02-01-2020, 10:42 AM

If you mean Westron is English, then no . . . but if you mean Tolkien has, in theory, translated Westron with English, then yes!

In any case, we have very few examples of actual Westron. Some linguists will count the somethings that appear in drafts for Appendix F . . . but yet were not ultimately published in Appendix F however, for "whatever reason".

Anyway, a few examples from Appendix F.

Hobbitish Westron kuduk English (invented English) "Hobbit"

Westron banakil "Halfling"

And note the similarity between the word for "Halfling" and -- as a certain kuduk was called in Westron -- Banazîr "Half-wise"

Or Ban for short, for "Sam"

Galadriel55 · 02-01-2020, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galin

If you mean Westron is English, then no . . . but if you mean Tolkien has, in theory, translated Westron with English, then yes!

I actually did mean English - specifically English in the current time. A language that many people learn as a second language, that aids in communication between people from different places (like the Downs!), that is the go-to for any large scale communication. I would argue that the Common Tongue is the functional equivalent of modern English - not because of anything Tolkien "translated", but because of its usage by the characters.

Galin · 02-01-2020, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

I actually did mean English - specifically English in the current time. A language that many people learn as a second language, that aids in communication between people from different places (like the Downs!), that is the go-to for any large scale communication. I would argue that the Common Tongue is the functional equivalent of modern English - not because of anything Tolkien "translated", but because of its usage by the characters.

Sorry for the ambiguity. I was "talking to" R.R. J Tolkien. I knew what you were getting at.

And that said, a linguist named Elhath has just added a very interesting post (elsewhere) which looks at a number of actual Westron forms compared to Catalan.

And as not-a-linguist, I'll shaddap for now

02-01-2020, 10:42 AM	#1
Galin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,036	If you mean Westron is English, then no . . . but if you mean Tolkien has, in theory, translated Westron with English, then yes! In any case, we have very few examples of actual Westron. Some linguists will count the somethings that appear in drafts for Appendix F . . . but yet were not ultimately published in Appendix F however, for "whatever reason". Anyway, a few examples from Appendix F. Hobbitish Westron kuduk English (invented English) "Hobbit" Westron banakil "Halfling" And note the similarity between the word for "Halfling" and -- as a certain kuduk was called in Westron -- Banazîr "Half-wise" Or Ban for short, for "Sam"