Deagol instead of Smeagol - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Lutfiska · 03-26-2003, 03:32 PM

Hullo!

I wonder what ME would have been like and what would have happened if Deagol had killed Smeagol instead of the other way around. Would we have had some sort of a "Dollum"? Plz tell me what you think.

Deathwail · 03-26-2003, 03:44 PM

Since we dont really know what type of charactor Deagol had its hard to say,he may of been a nice little guy and kept the ring out of trouble like Bilbo did for so long or he may of been a little creep like Smeagol and got into trouble with it and ended up a lonely outcast like Smeagol did.

I think its a safe bet the Ring could tell what one of the two would serve it the best and so it called out to Smeagol and so he lusted for it and in turn was willing to kill for it (the only person we see in the books who is willing to kill to gain the ring the second he sees it).

Just my two cents [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

eleanor_niphredil · 03-26-2003, 04:12 PM

ah, but it wasnt deagol birthday [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

I do have a point, rather than just babbling. deagol did not really want the ring, any more than anything else he could have found. If he had killed smeagol, it would have been out of defense rather than greed. Would this have an effect?

MLD-Grounds-Keeper-Willie · 03-26-2003, 04:38 PM

Quote:

deagol did not really want the ring

What makes you think that? I have to disagree...

eleanor_niphredil · 03-27-2003, 01:12 AM

Well, what I mean is, he was attacked, not fighting. He did not turn to evil.

Sophia the Thunder Mistress · 03-27-2003, 02:06 AM

I can't imagine Deagol was a nice little guy, exactly... he was Smeagol's best friend. Although, I don't think Smeagol was so much of a creep from the very beginning, I don't think he was the most wholesome sort of guy one could meet either. He's got this morbid streak and seems a little obsessive even pre-ring. So, I'd think Deagol would have to have some similar personality traits to want to hang out with Smeagol all the time.

A thought anyway [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]
Sophia

Lutfiska · 03-27-2003, 02:06 AM

Hullo eleanor

Yes I think that Deagol was less evil than Smeagol. Cause if he wasn´t why did the ring "choose" Smeagol? But I don´t think that he would have been able to do like Bilbo. Cause hobbits somehow seem more resistant than men. And "stoors" ( smeagols people) were more like men.. well thats only how i got it...

Thalionyulma · 03-27-2003, 08:16 AM

Quote:

I wonder what ME would have been like if Deagol had kept his ring instead of being killed by Smeagol (foolish Stoors)...

He probably would have ended up like Smeagol/Gollum. The Ring corrupted every bearer who bore it. Even the wise (Gandalf & Galadriel) chose to avoid bearing it. It had a will of its own, and had one goal... to be united to its Maker and Lord, Sauron.

Quote:

"...Deagol was less evil than Smeagol..."

Perhaps he MIGHT have been. But maybe the Ring attracts those who have a weaker will, enthralling them.

Er, Dollum??? Smeagol Gollum got his "nickname" because of the funny sound he made in his throat. I don't think Deagol had a similar problem.

Afrodal Fenyar · 03-27-2003, 10:36 AM

Hmm, this was written by a friend while I was eating.. It won't happen again [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

[ March 28, 2003: Message edited by: Afrodal Fenyar ]

Lutfiska · 03-27-2003, 01:17 PM

Hey....have some fantasy. The thing with "dollum" was just a joke. And if everything is ment to happen no matter what we do, do you mean that aragorn could have gone drowning himself in a river and the "goo" would have won anyway? Sounds kind of foolish to me... Plz explain more

Chancellen the True · 03-29-2003, 06:02 PM

If Deagal had killed Smeagal, the ring would have used it against him. Since Deagal's character was different then Smeagal's, probably more wholesome, the ring would have worked on him in a different way. The Ring would look for the weakness in the character of whoever possesed it. A good person is still vulnerable to the power of the Ring. That's why most of The White Counsel would not touch it. My guess is that The Ring would have used guilt from the murder of Smeagal to turn Deagal under it's will.

Now, what would have happened afterward, that's another story. Gollum loved getting to the roots of things, finding out secrets and such. That's what drove him into the mountains. Deagol's character wasn't examined to closely. It would be hard to say where The Ring would have driven him to. It could have driven him to Mordor. In a way, ME could have been lucky that Gollum had the ring. Sauron could have gotten The Ring before anyone else and a thousand years earlier too.

Elrond Jr · 03-29-2003, 09:08 PM

You know what? The ring is completely evil. Whether it was Smeagol or Deagol who got the ring, after having it for 2000 years it would manipulate either one of them into the hideous gollum creature! The will of Sauron is too strong. However one difference that may occur is since all of you seem to think that Deagol is more wholesome then he would probably be coaxed back into Deagol from Frodo easier.

03-26-2003, 03:32 PM	#1
Lutfiska Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: sweden Posts: 60	Deagol instead of Smeagol Hullo! I wonder what ME would have been like and what would have happened if Deagol had killed Smeagol instead of the other way around. Would we have had some sort of a "Dollum"? Plz tell me what you think. __________________ Go Bushie Vote yes to war

03-26-2003, 03:44 PM	#2
Deathwail Haunting Spirit Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Door of Night Posts: 99	Since we dont really know what type of charactor Deagol had its hard to say,he may of been a nice little guy and kept the ring out of trouble like Bilbo did for so long or he may of been a little creep like Smeagol and got into trouble with it and ended up a lonely outcast like Smeagol did. I think its a safe bet the Ring could tell what one of the two would serve it the best and so it called out to Smeagol and so he lusted for it and in turn was willing to kill for it (the only person we see in the books who is willing to kill to gain the ring the second he sees it). Just my two cents [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ He who arises in Might.

03-26-2003, 04:12 PM	#3
eleanor_niphredil Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: england Posts: 812	ah, but it wasnt deagol birthday [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] I do have a point, rather than just babbling. deagol did not really want the ring, any more than anything else he could have found. If he had killed smeagol, it would have been out of defense rather than greed. Would this have an effect? __________________ Here I am, brain the size of a planet, and they ask me to spend my time on this forum. And by the way, for any of you turning into a penguin, stop it. ~* I am Pippin took in the Female Fellowship*~

03-27-2003, 01:12 AM	#5
eleanor_niphredil Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: england Posts: 812	Well, what I mean is, he was attacked, not fighting. He did not turn to evil. __________________ Here I am, brain the size of a planet, and they ask me to spend my time on this forum. And by the way, for any of you turning into a penguin, stop it. ~* I am Pippin took in the Female Fellowship*~

03-27-2003, 02:06 AM	#6
Sophia the Thunder Mistress Scent of Simbelmynë Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Aboard Highwind, bound for Traverse Town Posts: 1,834	I can't imagine Deagol was a nice little guy, exactly... he was Smeagol's best friend. Although, I don't think Smeagol was so much of a creep from the very beginning, I don't think he was the most wholesome sort of guy one could meet either. He's got this morbid streak and seems a little obsessive even pre-ring. So, I'd think Deagol would have to have some similar personality traits to want to hang out with Smeagol all the time. A thought anyway [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] Sophia __________________ The seasons fall like silver swords, the years rush ever onward; and soon I sail, to leave this world, these lands where I have wander'd. O Elbereth! O Queen who dwells beyond the Western Seas, spare me yet a little time 'ere white ships come for me!

03-27-2003, 10:36 AM	#9
Afrodal Fenyar Haunting Spirit Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 94	Hmm, this was written by a friend while I was eating.. It won't happen again [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] [ March 28, 2003: Message edited by: Afrodal Fenyar ] __________________ "Out of doubt, out of dark to the day's rising I came singing in the sun, sword unsheathing. To hope's end I rode and to heart's breaking: Now for wrath, now for ruin and a red nightfall!" ~Eomer

03-27-2003, 01:17 PM	#10
Lutfiska Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: sweden Posts: 60	Hey....have some fantasy. The thing with "dollum" was just a joke. And if everything is ment to happen no matter what we do, do you mean that aragorn could have gone drowning himself in a river and the "goo" would have won anyway? Sounds kind of foolish to me... Plz explain more __________________ Go Bushie Vote yes to war

03-29-2003, 06:02 PM	#11
Chancellen the True Pile O'Bones Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NYC Posts: 22	If Deagal had killed Smeagal, the ring would have used it against him. Since Deagal's character was different then Smeagal's, probably more wholesome, the ring would have worked on him in a different way. The Ring would look for the weakness in the character of whoever possesed it. A good person is still vulnerable to the power of the Ring. That's why most of The White Counsel would not touch it. My guess is that The Ring would have used guilt from the murder of Smeagal to turn Deagal under it's will. Now, what would have happened afterward, that's another story. Gollum loved getting to the roots of things, finding out secrets and such. That's what drove him into the mountains. Deagol's character wasn't examined to closely. It would be hard to say where The Ring would have driven him to. It could have driven him to Mordor. In a way, ME could have been lucky that Gollum had the ring. Sauron could have gotten The Ring before anyone else and a thousand years earlier too. __________________ "Shall we mourn here deedless for ever, a shadow folk, mist-haunting, dropping vain tears in the thankless sea?" Feanor at Tirion upon Tuna

03-29-2003, 09:08 PM	#12
Elrond Jr Pile O'Bones Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 25	You know what? The ring is completely evil. Whether it was Smeagol or Deagol who got the ring, after having it for 2000 years it would manipulate either one of them into the hideous gollum creature! The will of Sauron is too strong. However one difference that may occur is since all of you seem to think that Deagol is more wholesome then he would probably be coaxed back into Deagol from Frodo easier. __________________ If winners never quit, and quitters never win. How did they get the phrase, "Quit while you're ahead"? Rate me, plz!