What if Boromir had taken the ring? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Earendil evening star · 11-25-2002, 02:34 PM

What if Boromir had managed to get the ring from frodo????
Would he have turned out like our good friend Gollum???
Or would he have taken it to Gondor and then let it turn him evil?
tell me what you think
love
Earendil evening star
xxx

Dimhuanion · 11-25-2002, 03:03 PM

If Boromir had managed to take the rings it would have turned him into something like Golum but in my opinion he would have had much more Power, but it would also overwhelm his mind and thoughts jsut as it did to Golum.
In the First book we see the effect that the ring has on Boromir's mind, he tries to take it from Frodo, and at heart he is only trying to do what he thinks is best, but the ing has such a power that even before he can get hold of it, it has taken control of his mind. This is a perfect example of showing how a hobbit is so resiliant to the power of the ring.
Boromir would have probably taken the ring to Gondor and used it to protect it from the dark forces of Sauron but in the end he would of ended up using it for a bigger evil if he even managed to overcome Saurons forces and defeat the Dark Lord.

thorondil · 11-25-2002, 05:11 PM

I think he would have become more like a lesser Ar-Pharazon at first, and then eventually a wraith completely under the domination of Sauron, but not like gollum.

Beren87 · 11-25-2002, 05:59 PM

I believe that he would use the ring originally to do good, and under his will could perhaps even defeat Sauron. But nothing done with the aid of the ring could be turned to good and it would eventually overwhelm his mind.

Elven-Maiden · 11-25-2002, 06:17 PM

I agree with Beren87, good point!

Eru · 11-25-2002, 06:23 PM

how could he defeat sauron without destroying the ring? hadn't that already bee tried once before? when Isildur cut the One Ring from Sauron's hand, his sprirt fled. he wasn't destroyed only defeated until he could regain his strength. so, if boromir had taken the ring, it logical follows that he would have brought the ring to minis (sp?) tirith to battle with sauron. but the ring filled with sauron's malice and everything that goes with it, would have taken control of him ere long. sauron, knowing the one ring was found would have most likely sent everything he had against Minis Tirith to take back the ring. and as gandalf states, no one but sauron truly knew how the ring worked.

-Lenwa

Legolas · 11-25-2002, 10:06 PM

You can't destroy Sauron and still have the Ring. The Ring is Sauron's power; the Ring is Sauron - for Sauron to be destroyed, it would have to be destroyed.

Arathiriel · 11-25-2002, 10:21 PM

Here's a scarier thought: Boromir takes the Ring from Frodo and then manages to get all the way to Minas Tirith where his father, Denethor, somehow gets his hands on it!

As unstable as that old man was, I find that to be a VERY disturbing scenario!!!

greyhavener · 11-25-2002, 10:59 PM

The ring would have betrayed Boromir just as it betrayed Isildur. Boromir would have died anyway. The ring would have taken a different journey, this time perhaps into Sauron's hands. Perhaps not. After all, "There are other forces at work." Perhaps some other Hobbit or another creature would have found it and fulfilled the quest instead of Frodo. Gandalf, Aragorn, and Elrond would have remained vigilant and perhaps found another opportunity.

If their time passed, others would have taken up the torch. The story might be altered, Middle Earth might have experienced another Dark Age, but while good remained, I do not believe the Valar would abandon Middle Earth. Where there are true and faithful hearts, hope remains.

[ November 26, 2002: Message edited by: greyhavener ]

Gwaihir the Windlord · 11-25-2002, 11:20 PM

I remember reading this one somewhere:

Quote:

ALTERNATE ENDINGS TO LORD OF THE RINGS
'- Boromir takes the Ring, travels back to Minas Tirith, defeast the armies of the Dark Lord and becomes a wise and benevolent ruler. Book ends 38 chapters shorter...'

Although I agree that was impossible. I don't think Boromir would become like Gollum; because of his greater strength of mind, valour and opposition to Sauron, he would try to attack Sauron. That was, after all, why he wanted the Ring in the first place, to save his people. Gollum was just greedy.
Gandalf, Aragorn etc. would have no chance to stop him. He would just slip away into the trees... although it is possible that in Minas Tirith, Denethor or Prince Imrahil may take it from him.

Beren87 · 11-25-2002, 11:46 PM

My entire thought process there was baced upon the occurence in the book when Frodo claimed the ring for himself at the entrance to Mt.Doom. In that moment the very footers of Barad-ur shook, surely one with a greater will and more power when claiming the ring would bring down Sauron. As Galadriel said,

Quote:

In the place of a dark lord you would have a queen!! Great and powerful...

I think the key word there was "in place" as in the usurpation of Sauron.

Túroch · 11-26-2002, 12:43 AM

If Boromir had taken the ring he would have probably been able to overthrow Sauron and usurp his place, if at least for a little while. His reign might be okay for a few years but it just a matter of time. The ring would corrupt him but he wouldn't totally replacec Sauron like Gandalf, Galadriel, or Saruman would. He is a great and powerfull warrior but not that powerfull. As the years past the shadow os Sauron would come over his heart and he would fall totally under the sway of the dark lord. Bad news in the end.

the witch king · 11-28-2002, 01:27 PM

may b the uruks would have still found and killed him in this case it would have endid up eather back 2 its true master in mordor or in the hands of saruman

Helkahothion · 11-28-2002, 02:16 PM

I think if Boromir toke the ring he wouldn't come far. If he killed Frodo to get it Sam would have killed him. And if he did not kill Frodo then Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli would have taken it from him and sedid Boromir back to Gondor.
________
MAZDA MXR-01 HISTORY

Kalimac · 11-29-2002, 11:21 PM

Hmmm, hard one to untangle. The only chance Boromir really had to take the Ring was when he quarreled with Frodo at Parth Galen, and it's hard not to remember that at this time he was (a) near a river and (b) unbeknownst to him, on the verge of being attacked by a very surly group of Uruk-Hai. For some reason the first idea that comes to mind is that it might have been a repeat of Isildur's fate; Boromir would have had the Ring only briefly - long enough to attract the attention of the Nazgul et al but probably not long enough to have them actually come to him before the Uruk-Hai attacked. The Uruk-Hai attack and, intoxicated by the Ring, he decides to take a pass on defending Merry and Pippin and instead leaps into the Anduin to escape while the Fellowship is being attacked, the Ring slips off his finger, and...continue from there. Of course, this time Sauron would have known exactly where the Ring was and it would have taken him all of a few minutes to collect it unless the remaining members of the Fellowship did some very swift search-and-recovery work. Possibly Boromir could have used the Ring to command the Orcs, but it doesn't seem likely somehow. The Orcs don't listen much, and Boromir also wouldn't really know how to use it like that with so little experience.

Undoubtedly Frodo would have had to be dead or nearly dead to let Boromir get the Ring, but I doubt Sam would have killed Boromir for revenge simply because he never would have had the chance before the Fellowship was attacked; everyone was split up and confused by that point. And it's hard to picture Boromir trying to defend the hobbits after he's let the Ring get under his skin.

MLD-Grounds-Keeper-Willie · 11-30-2002, 01:05 AM

I think that boromir would have taken the ring to minas tirith and repel the orcs. He would have stayed strong against the ring's will but it would still be growing on him. He would realize this and would decide to destroy it himself rather than give it to anyone else. He would have made it to Mount Doom and had a great struggle to destroy it but in the end, he would destroy it. He would be exhausted and left weak-minded lying on the floor of Mount Doom. MD would explode and boromir would die.

However, before Boromir could get that far, Aragorn would stop it. He would not want to have Boromir use it so he would claim his kingship over gondor and demand boromir to hand the ring to him or Frodo. after that, I don't know.

Nieninque · 11-30-2002, 07:25 PM

Quote:

MD would explode and boromir would die.

Aren't you optimistic... you don't like Boromir, do you? Just kidding ^^ I doubt Boromir would be able to actually do anything with the Ring, because he has no magical powers that the Ring could use... he might become like Gollum or turn into a Nazgul *shudders* Poor Boromir...

Lindril Arvilya · 11-30-2002, 07:40 PM

Do you really think even if Denethor claimed the Ring from his son ("brought back as a gift for his lord, spolis of war" on so on), that Boromir would give it up? Not very likely, in my opinion. I doubt he would yield the ring to anyone.

Denethor: Just let me try it on, Boromir.... come on... I raised you since you were this high, you little twerp! Give me the damn... Boromir? Boromir? Where'd you....

Inderjit Sanghera · 12-01-2002, 01:46 PM

I think that Boromir would have went to Minas Tirith, thus taking the ring to Denethor. He might have given the ring to his father, but I doubt it. Meanwhile, without the arousing of Theoden and the Ents, Rohan would’ve been taken. Denethor, or Boromir would have marched to Mordor, or maybe on the fields of Pelennor and he would have been defeated, since Sauron would have sent a stronger force then he did in Pelennor. They would have captured Denethor/Boromir and brought him to Sauron, who would have taken the ring off him. Rohan was destroyed, as was Gondor and Mirkwood and Erebor would’ve fallen. With the humans down and out, Sauron, with the one ring, would’ve shifted his attention to Lorien and Rivendell. They would’ve been taken and everyone would’ve died, including the fellowship and Gandalf.

engwaalphiel · 12-01-2002, 02:50 PM

What a happy little thing you are Inderjit Sanghera ! I don't think if Boromir had taken the ring that things would end quite as you described
Remember that there were most probably greater forces at work here .

Quote:

They would’ve been taken and everyone would’ve died, including the fellowship and Gandalf.

A little far fetched perhaps ! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
Most probably the ring would not have taken boromir under his power quite so quickly and one of the fellowship would have stopped him from reaching Minas Tirith with the ring .
Would he become like Gollum ?
hmmm..... Probably not , I suppose he would be more likely to become wraith-like .

[img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

-Imrahil- · 12-01-2002, 06:21 PM

Wow that's despressing Inderjit Sanghera. It's impossible to tell, maybe the ring would betray Boromir, maybe he would overthrow Sauron with it, who knows. But guessing is definately fun as Inderjit Sanghera shows us. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

12-01-2002, 08:41 PM

he would have used it. no question. it would eventually curupt his mind and he'd end up a wraith...assuming he managed to keep it from Sauron long enough, which isn't likely because I can't see him harnessing the power.

Inderjit Sanghera · 12-02-2002, 05:37 AM

Yes, I know that 'other forces' were at work, and that they were being guided, but I think that if he took the ring, then that would have been the last straw, and they would have recieved no guidance from Eru or Manwe or anyone, because men keep on messing up (Uldor, Ar-Pharazon, Isildur). Remember, the whole point of the quest was for the 'weak' who are good to triumph over evil.

03-13-2003, 11:57 AM

Had Boromir gained possession of the one ring, he wouldn't have had the knowledge nor personal power to put it to use. The ring would have quickly fallen into Sauron's hands.

Aragorn, Gandalf, Galadriel, Saruman and the like were suffiently powerful in and of themselves to wield the one ring. Of that number only Aragorn Elessar is human, and he is Isildur's heir and of Númenórean and Elvish blood (by way of his ancestor Luthien.) Boromir, by contrast, was not of significantly noble stock. He was in addition rather weak minded and rash. He wouldn't have been able to do more than the disappearing trick with the one ring, which of course would have made him very conspicuous to the nine and the Eye.

[ March 13, 2003: Message edited by: Valarungol ]

Estelyn Telcontar · 03-13-2003, 01:04 PM

"What if..." topics are being placed on the Novices and Newcomers forum, since they ask for opinions and speculation, not actual book discussion. Please continue reading and posting there. Thanks!

11-25-2002, 02:34 PM	#1
Earendil evening star Animated Skeleton Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Scotland Posts: 26	What if Boromir had taken the ring? What if Boromir had managed to get the ring from frodo???? Would he have turned out like our good friend Gollum??? Or would he have taken it to Gondor and then let it turn him evil? tell me what you think love Earendil evening star xxx __________________ "Earendil,the Evening Star,and most beloved of the elves,shone clear above" Chapter vII

11-25-2002, 03:03 PM	#2
Dimhuanion Pile O'Bones Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11	If Boromir had managed to take the rings it would have turned him into something like Golum but in my opinion he would have had much more Power, but it would also overwhelm his mind and thoughts jsut as it did to Golum. In the First book we see the effect that the ring has on Boromir's mind, he tries to take it from Frodo, and at heart he is only trying to do what he thinks is best, but the ing has such a power that even before he can get hold of it, it has taken control of his mind. This is a perfect example of showing how a hobbit is so resiliant to the power of the ring. Boromir would have probably taken the ring to Gondor and used it to protect it from the dark forces of Sauron but in the end he would of ended up using it for a bigger evil if he even managed to overcome Saurons forces and defeat the Dark Lord. __________________ Fly Fools

11-25-2002, 05:11 PM	#3
thorondil Haunting Spirit Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 53	I think he would have become more like a lesser Ar-Pharazon at first, and then eventually a wraith completely under the domination of Sauron, but not like gollum. __________________ only that Part from which he came

11-25-2002, 06:17 PM	#5
Elven-Maiden Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 297	I agree with Beren87, good point! __________________ Tout ce qui est or ne brille pas, Tous ceux qui errent ne sont pas perdus. Mobilis in Mobile

11-25-2002, 06:23 PM	#6
Eru Haunting Spirit Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Middle Earth Posts: 71	how could he defeat sauron without destroying the ring? hadn't that already bee tried once before? when Isildur cut the One Ring from Sauron's hand, his sprirt fled. he wasn't destroyed only defeated until he could regain his strength. so, if boromir had taken the ring, it logical follows that he would have brought the ring to minis (sp?) tirith to battle with sauron. but the ring filled with sauron's malice and everything that goes with it, would have taken control of him ere long. sauron, knowing the one ring was found would have most likely sent everything he had against Minis Tirith to take back the ring. and as gandalf states, no one but sauron truly knew how the ring worked. -Lenwa __________________ "Utúlie'n aurë! Aiya Eldalië ar Atanatári, utúlie'n aurë! The day has come! Behold, people of the Eldar and Fathers of Men, the day has come!"

11-25-2002, 05:59 PM	#4
Beren87 Master of the Secret Fire Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Between fire and ice, death and life Posts: 2,241	I believe that he would use the ring originally to do good, and under his will could perhaps even defeat Sauron. But nothing done with the aid of the ring could be turned to good and it would eventually overwhelm his mind.

11-25-2002, 10:06 PM	#7
Legolas A Northern Soul Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Valinor Posts: 1,847	You can't destroy Sauron and still have the Ring. The Ring is Sauron's power; the Ring is Sauron - for Sauron to be destroyed, it would have to be destroyed. __________________ ...take counsel with thyself, and remember who and what thou art.

11-25-2002, 10:21 PM	#8
Arathiriel Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: The Blessed Realm Posts: 284	Here's a scarier thought: Boromir takes the Ring from Frodo and then manages to get all the way to Minas Tirith where his father, Denethor, somehow gets his hands on it! As unstable as that old man was, I find that to be a VERY disturbing scenario!!! __________________ 'I love him. He's like that, and sometimes it shines through, somehow. But I love him, whether or no.' - Samwise Gamgee

11-25-2002, 10:59 PM	#9
greyhavener Wight Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: austin Posts: 169	The ring would have betrayed Boromir just as it betrayed Isildur. Boromir would have died anyway. The ring would have taken a different journey, this time perhaps into Sauron's hands. Perhaps not. After all, "There are other forces at work." Perhaps some other Hobbit or another creature would have found it and fulfilled the quest instead of Frodo. Gandalf, Aragorn, and Elrond would have remained vigilant and perhaps found another opportunity. If their time passed, others would have taken up the torch. The story might be altered, Middle Earth might have experienced another Dark Age, but while good remained, I do not believe the Valar would abandon Middle Earth. Where there are true and faithful hearts, hope remains. [ November 26, 2002: Message edited by: greyhavener ] __________________ Do justly, love mercy, walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8

11-26-2002, 12:43 AM	#12
Túroch Wight Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Oklahoma State University Posts: 102	If Boromir had taken the ring he would have probably been able to overthrow Sauron and usurp his place, if at least for a little while. His reign might be okay for a few years but it just a matter of time. The ring would corrupt him but he wouldn't totally replacec Sauron like Gandalf, Galadriel, or Saruman would. He is a great and powerfull warrior but not that powerfull. As the years past the shadow os Sauron would come over his heart and he would fall totally under the sway of the dark lord. Bad news in the end. __________________ For the valour of the Edain the Elves shall ever remember as the ages lengthen, marvelling that they gave life so freely of which thay had on earth so little. But it is not for thy valour only that I send thee, but to bring into the world a hope beyond thy sight, and a light that shall pierce the darkness." Ulmo - Lord of waters

11-28-2002, 01:27 PM	#13
the witch king Wight Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Minas Morgul, Morgul Vale, Mordor Posts: 201	may b the uruks would have still found and killed him in this case it would have endid up eather back 2 its true master in mordor or in the hands of saruman __________________ 'Whenever death may surprise us, let it be welcome if our battle cry has reached even one receptive ear and another hand reaches out to take up our arms.'~ Che Guevara.

11-28-2002, 02:16 PM	#14
Helkahothion Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: The inside of Legolas' lungs Posts: 1,005	I think if Boromir toke the ring he wouldn't come far. If he killed Frodo to get it Sam would have killed him. And if he did not kill Frodo then Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli would have taken it from him and sedid Boromir back to Gondor. ________ MAZDA MXR-01 HISTORY Last edited by Helkahothion; 03-07-2011 at 02:02 AM.

11-29-2002, 11:21 PM	#15
Kalimac Candle of the Marshes Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Flyover Country Posts: 780	Hmmm, hard one to untangle. The only chance Boromir really had to take the Ring was when he quarreled with Frodo at Parth Galen, and it's hard not to remember that at this time he was (a) near a river and (b) unbeknownst to him, on the verge of being attacked by a very surly group of Uruk-Hai. For some reason the first idea that comes to mind is that it might have been a repeat of Isildur's fate; Boromir would have had the Ring only briefly - long enough to attract the attention of the Nazgul et al but probably not long enough to have them actually come to him before the Uruk-Hai attacked. The Uruk-Hai attack and, intoxicated by the Ring, he decides to take a pass on defending Merry and Pippin and instead leaps into the Anduin to escape while the Fellowship is being attacked, the Ring slips off his finger, and...continue from there. Of course, this time Sauron would have known exactly where the Ring was and it would have taken him all of a few minutes to collect it unless the remaining members of the Fellowship did some very swift search-and-recovery work. Possibly Boromir could have used the Ring to command the Orcs, but it doesn't seem likely somehow. The Orcs don't listen much, and Boromir also wouldn't really know how to use it like that with so little experience. Undoubtedly Frodo would have had to be dead or nearly dead to let Boromir get the Ring, but I doubt Sam would have killed Boromir for revenge simply because he never would have had the chance before the Fellowship was attacked; everyone was split up and confused by that point. And it's hard to picture Boromir trying to defend the hobbits after he's let the Ring get under his skin. __________________ Father, dear Father, if you see fit, We'll send my love to college for one year yet Tie blue ribbons all about his head, To let the ladies know that he's married.

11-30-2002, 01:05 AM	#16
MLD-Grounds-Keeper-Willie Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: San Francisco Posts: 573	I think that boromir would have taken the ring to minas tirith and repel the orcs. He would have stayed strong against the ring's will but it would still be growing on him. He would realize this and would decide to destroy it himself rather than give it to anyone else. He would have made it to Mount Doom and had a great struggle to destroy it but in the end, he would destroy it. He would be exhausted and left weak-minded lying on the floor of Mount Doom. MD would explode and boromir would die. However, before Boromir could get that far, Aragorn would stop it. He would not want to have Boromir use it so he would claim his kingship over gondor and demand boromir to hand the ring to him or Frodo. after that, I don't know. __________________ Do Not Touch -Willie

11-30-2002, 07:40 PM	#18
Lindril Arvilya Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In a box at the end of Harrison Ford's street, with a pair of binoculars Posts: 332	Do you really think even if Denethor claimed the Ring from his son ("brought back as a gift for his lord, spolis of war" on so on), that Boromir would give it up? Not very likely, in my opinion. I doubt he would yield the ring to anyone. Denethor: Just let me try it on, Boromir.... come on... I raised you since you were this high, you little twerp! Give me the damn... Boromir? Boromir? Where'd you.... __________________ Neo, watch out! Trinity's going to steal your pants! Pants thief! Pants thief!

12-01-2002, 01:46 PM	#19
Inderjit Sanghera Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Wolverhampton, England Posts: 716	I think that Boromir would have went to Minas Tirith, thus taking the ring to Denethor. He might have given the ring to his father, but I doubt it. Meanwhile, without the arousing of Theoden and the Ents, Rohan would’ve been taken. Denethor, or Boromir would have marched to Mordor, or maybe on the fields of Pelennor and he would have been defeated, since Sauron would have sent a stronger force then he did in Pelennor. They would have captured Denethor/Boromir and brought him to Sauron, who would have taken the ring off him. Rohan was destroyed, as was Gondor and Mirkwood and Erebor would’ve fallen. With the humans down and out, Sauron, with the one ring, would’ve shifted his attention to Lorien and Rivendell. They would’ve been taken and everyone would’ve died, including the fellowship and Gandalf. __________________ “If I’m more of an influence on your son as a rapper then you are as a father then you've got to look at yourself as a parent” ~>Ice Cube. "Life is so beautiful"->Don Vito Corleone

12-01-2002, 06:21 PM	#21
-Imrahil- Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Dol Amroth, upon the Bay of Belfalas Posts: 259	Wow that's despressing Inderjit Sanghera. It's impossible to tell, maybe the ring would betray Boromir, maybe he would overthrow Sauron with it, who knows. But guessing is definately fun as Inderjit Sanghera shows us. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] __________________ My body is broken. I go to my fathers. And even in their mighty company I shall not now be ashamed. I felled the black serpent. A grim morn, and a glad day, and a golden sunset!

12-01-2002, 08:41 PM	#22
pheonix Guest Posts: n/a	he would have used it. no question. it would eventually curupt his mind and he'd end up a wraith...assuming he managed to keep it from Sauron long enough, which isn't likely because I can't see him harnessing the power.

12-02-2002, 05:37 AM	#23
Inderjit Sanghera Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Wolverhampton, England Posts: 716	Yes, I know that 'other forces' were at work, and that they were being guided, but I think that if he took the ring, then that would have been the last straw, and they would have recieved no guidance from Eru or Manwe or anyone, because men keep on messing up (Uldor, Ar-Pharazon, Isildur). Remember, the whole point of the quest was for the 'weak' who are good to triumph over evil. __________________ “If I’m more of an influence on your son as a rapper then you are as a father then you've got to look at yourself as a parent” ~>Ice Cube. "Life is so beautiful"->Don Vito Corleone

03-13-2003, 11:57 AM	#24
Valarungol Guest Posts: n/a	Had Boromir gained possession of the one ring, he wouldn't have had the knowledge nor personal power to put it to use. The ring would have quickly fallen into Sauron's hands. Aragorn, Gandalf, Galadriel, Saruman and the like were suffiently powerful in and of themselves to wield the one ring. Of that number only Aragorn Elessar is human, and he is Isildur's heir and of Númenórean and Elvish blood (by way of his ancestor Luthien.) Boromir, by contrast, was not of significantly noble stock. He was in addition rather weak minded and rash. He wouldn't have been able to do more than the disappearing trick with the one ring, which of course would have made him very conspicuous to the nine and the Eye. [ March 13, 2003: Message edited by: Valarungol ]

03-13-2003, 01:04 PM	#25
Estelyn Telcontar Princess of Skwerlz Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles) Posts: 7,499	"What if..." topics are being placed on the Novices and Newcomers forum, since they ask for opinions and speculation, not actual book discussion. Please continue reading and posting there. Thanks! __________________ 'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...'