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Old 02-06-2007, 05:03 PM   #1
Macalaure
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Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Admin thread to WW XXX - Tol-in-Elendili - The Isle of the Were-Faithfuls

Númenor has been drowned in the floods of the breaking world, but the peak of the mountain Meneltarma still sticks out from the waters. A few of the once numerous people of the once star-shaped island were able to save their lives here, cursing the envious Valar and the cruel Ilúvatar. But then, at night, some of them seemed to have disappeared! Quickly the rumour spread: some of those dastard faithfuls have made their way up the mountain, too, and now seek to carry out their evil ways on the innocent survivors.
Up, loyal Men and Women of the King! Those who do not dare the deed to serve Melkor shall no longer do any deed anymore at all!

As you might have perceived, this be one of the games from the other perspective, where those usually considered to be good play the evil werewolves.


The cast:
Three Were-Faithfuls (common werewolves)
One High-Priest of Annatar (seer)
One Ranger (as always)
One Hunter (detailed rules about him will follow later)
Tar-Míriel (a cobbler. In opposition to canonical lore, the queen of this land did survive as well. But she is able to conceal her identity)
Eight innocent villagers or more

As you see, this will be a simple game. While it should still give enough of a thrill to experienced players, it is ideal for anybody new or long absent to the game. *hint*


This and that:
- no double-lynchings
- one retraction per day
- deadline: 9 PM GMT (to leave me time to do the narrations while I'm still able to concentrate, but the time is free for discussion)
- the real time counts, not the messed up forum time
- you may choose occupations if you want to, but it's not required


List of players:
Rikae
Roa_Aoife
Thinlómien
Nogrod
Durelin
Kitanna
the guy who be short
Gil-Galad
Legate of Amon Lanc
Holbytlass
Kath
Lalaith
Hookbill the Goomba
Garin
The Saucepan Man
Mänwe
The Might
Brinniel
Rune Son of Bjarne
Glirdan
Mithalwen
(this list is final now, no more new sign-ups)


Inevitably, I will be vaguely touching religious matters. It's not meant to offend anybody. Just take it as a mild parody.


PS: WW XXX sounds... funny.
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Last edited by Macalaure : 02-23-2007 at 10:13 AM.
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Old 02-06-2007, 06:45 PM   #2
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I don't mean to quivel, but oughtn't be High Priest of Anatar?
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Old 02-07-2007, 01:18 AM   #3
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When will you start? As soon as you have enough players? I'd love to participate, but I'm not sure if I'll be able to.
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Old 02-07-2007, 02:36 AM   #4
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Modding a game is the best way to get one wishing to involve oneself in actual playing!

So even though I had thought of having a break here, count me in. I have to play at least one before any breaks...

The deadline is excellent and other rules / roles looked fine.
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Old 02-07-2007, 02:47 AM   #5
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Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
I thought about to start this weekend or early next week, in case I have my desired 15+ players til then. But the starting date is open to debate for everyone.

You're right, Roa. I changed Sauron to Annatar.
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Old 02-07-2007, 04:24 AM   #6
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If you're starting that early, I could maybe play... but I have a nasty habit of staying alive 'til the last days, so I'm not 100% sure... Maybe if you could count me in with a questionmark after my name?
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Old 02-07-2007, 11:10 AM   #7
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If it gets to that point, Thin, we could just kill you off.
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Old 02-07-2007, 11:35 AM   #8
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I can't resist. I'm in.

So will we be taking on pr0n-star roles in this one...?

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Old 02-08-2007, 03:56 AM   #9
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Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
More info on the hunter role

I always wondered why this role is called the hunter. I mean, he doesn't hunt anything, does he? It's really just a villager who knows how to defend himself.

Anyway.

The common hunter chooses one villager each day and night, and if the hunter is killed or lynched, he takes this person with him, be the one guilty or not. On days, this is not a problem, as even the ones who didn't vote him still stand nearby when he goes down, so the hunter can throw his poisoned javelin at a villager of his choice. At night it gets weird: The hunter is surprised in his bed by the wolves, then maybe runs away to kill another innocent in their bed, and then returns to be killed. This makes little sense. Therefore the logical hunter was invented, who, if the person of his choice is not a wolf, gets killed without a kill of his own.

In the last game Nogrod strengthened the role of the hunter and gave him a list of his worst three suspects. I liked this a lot, but I think it makes the hunter almost unkillable for the wolves late in the game, when the hunter can note down almost the whole village.


Here's what I thought of now:

A) At day, the hunter gives me an ordered list of differing size. If the hunter gets killed I check whether there is a werewolf on the list, and the one who is highest on the list gets killed. If there is no werewolf, the innocent at the top of the list is killed.

B) At night, it's the same, only that if there is no werewolf suspected by the hunter, nobody gets hurt (except the hunter himself, of course).

C) The size of the list is at most three, but also at most the size of one third of the village (rounded down). This means, when there are 9 or more villagers, the hunter may note three of them, when there are 8 to 6, it's two, when there are only 5 or less left, it's only one.

I hope I explained it in a way that is comprehensible.

Your thoughts? Makes sense or doesn't? Too strong or too weak?
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Old 02-08-2007, 04:12 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
I hope I explained it in a way that is comprehensible.

Your thoughts? Makes sense or doesn't? Too strong or too weak?
That was perfectly comprehensible and applaudable.

I think your suggestion is a good one. I would say that in a fairly normal game it is within the balance: it makes the hunter logical and strengthens the role a bit making it nicer to play but doesn't automatically lead the hunter to be the deciding factor in the end.

Good.
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Old 02-08-2007, 07:17 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roa_Aoife
If it gets to that point, Thin, we could just kill you off.
I believe you could. And I just joked to Noggie that I should maybe ask Mac to make me a wolf and there'd be no problem of staying alive too long (see sig) ... Or then I maybe should start a Nilpish way fo playing...

Mac, I love the concept (Faithfuls as werewolves) and the name of this game!
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Old 02-08-2007, 09:12 AM   #12
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Shield

I realize joining this game could prevent me from doing homework and going into work late, but I miss WW.

I'd like to join in.
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Old 02-08-2007, 10:29 AM   #13
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Quote:
A) At day, the hunter gives me an ordered list of differing size. If the hunter gets killed I check whether there is a werewolf on the list, and the one who is highest on the list gets killed. If there is no werewolf, the innocent at the top of the list is killed.
I don't know about this- it's sounds a little close to an automatic wolf-kill. From a story perspective, if someone else if more suspicious to a hunter, why would they suddenly kill a player of less suspicion? If there are two innocents topping the list as suspects, does he get a sudden epiphany about the least suspicion person as he's dying that tips them to being a wolf?

At night it makes sense- he'd be prepared for the wolves in his home, and could take one down if he was suspicious. During the day, however, it should only be his highest suspect. He'd have them right there, and he'd be aiming for the one he was most convinced was a wolf, not the third person on his list. That makes the hunter a bit too over-powered, I think.
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Old 02-08-2007, 10:36 AM   #14
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I sort of agree with Roa, but limiting the list to a third of the village (that doesn't make sense story-wise) would keep the Hunter at a reasonable level. I say we try it out.

(oh, I'm not playing in the game... oops.)
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Old 02-08-2007, 10:43 AM   #15
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Well, at the threshold of death, he can see things as they really are.

You definitely have a point here. I will rethink this.


Something else: Should hunter and ranger be able to pm each other? If not, it is possible that the ranger and the hunter pick each other to protect/hunt the night the wolves come for the hunter. Is the hunter protected now and nothing happens, or does the hunter first slay the ranger and is killed after it? It would make an awesome narration.
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Old 02-08-2007, 02:51 PM   #16
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the guy who be short has just left Hobbiton.
Count me in please.
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Old 02-08-2007, 03:13 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
Something else: Should hunter and ranger be able to pm each other? If not, it is possible that the ranger and the hunter pick each other to protect/hunt the night the wolves come for the hunter. Is the hunter protected now and nothing happens, or does the hunter first slay the ranger and is killed after it? It would make an awesome narration.
A ranger protection always works that a kill is thwarted. The protectee doesn't even know that they've been targeted. That's how a ranger can act as a seer in a sense- when the Day starts, and the narration reveals that there was no kill, the ranger then knows that their protection worked, and that the person they protected is innocent. The protectee remains clueless. So, if a ranger protects a hunter whom the wolves attack, the hunter cannot die, or else it completely circumvents the point of a ranger. And if the hunter does not die, they make no kill.

As for communication between the two, I don't see why not, but it should be limited, such as only during the night, or something like that. I would not deem seer communications fair, though, since it lets a seer reveal info without being exposed, and that just removes the challenge for the village and makes it almost impossible for the wolves.
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Old 02-08-2007, 03:17 PM   #18
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I agree with Roa here (I must have read the initial suggestion too hastily). On lynching I think it should be the number one only. I thought the list basically for Night-time use only as it would make the Hunter a bit more powerful enemy to the wolves without sacrificing the narrational logic or overpowering her/him with a secured contra-kill with mod's whim (about who of the wolves would then be killed).
Quote:
Something else: Should hunter and ranger be able to pm each other? If not, it is possible that the ranger and the hunter pick each other to protect/hunt the night the wolves come for the hunter. Is the hunter protected now and nothing happens, or does the hunter first slay the ranger and is killed after it? It would make an awesome narration.
It would depend on lot of things... If you give the hunter a chance to kill innocents during the Night then s/he could kill the ranger, if you had decided the order of kills that way... But at least my list-thing was made just to prevent any innocent-kills by Night by the Hunter...

But one thing you should consider beforehand is which is the order of activities during the Night-phase. It would be nasty to realise that you had to decide the fate of two actual players from scratch as you hadn't thought of the order beforehand... Surely the needs of the narration might be as good grounds of resolving the Nightly actions as any other!

EDIT: X-d with Roa
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Old 02-08-2007, 04:24 PM   #19
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Tricksy rules

If it is always the first one on the list of the hunter who dies if he is lynched on a day, then the lists are useless in daylight. For this reason I still think I will keep it this way and increase the hunter's power such.

I always thought that the main reason for the logical hunter was to make the role more realistic, so that he can only take somebody with him who is present when he is killed. If the ranger protects the hunter during a wolf attack, the ranger is present, so it would be logical that he, too, could be killed. The hunter is a mightier warrior than the ranger and is known to have a light sleep.


Rule adjustments (blessed be he who invented the admin threads!):

To not give the innocents too many advantages, ranger and hunter may not communicate. They will, however, know each other's identity, and they won't be allowed to pick each other, so the discussed situation can no longer occur. Though the ranger may have good reasons to keep the hunter alive, it's not really the hunter's fate anyway.

I'll change the hunter list size to the number of wolves alive (like Mith suggested). It's simpler and also makes more sense.

I think I will break with a rule and tell a person who has been successfully protected what has happened. He would only know that he has been saved, not by whom or from whom. Let's see how this works out.

To give the wolves a little tidbit, at the end of each day, the cobbler will give me a list of the people who he thinks to be wolves at the moment. This list I will give to the wolves. Not sure what they will be able to make with this information, but it might be of interest to them.


PS: Don't fear to be confused. I'll post the final rules at the beginning of the game thread. These are just technicalities anyway. I would still consider this a fairly basic game.
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Old 02-08-2007, 04:32 PM   #20
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Well, you're the great Mod-God now, so what you say goes. We'll see how it works, and as always, it's good bit luck, and a good bit player dynamics, more than the rules, that decide how things go.
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Old 02-08-2007, 04:36 PM   #21
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That's true.

It's always the players who make a game 'just another one' or 'worthy of rememberance', never the mod or any set of special rules.
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Old 02-09-2007, 05:43 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
I think I will break with a rule and tell a person who has been successfully protected what has happened. He would only know that he has been saved, not by whom or from whom. Let's see how this works out.

To give the wolves a little tidbit, at the end of each day, the cobbler will give me a list of the people who he thinks to be wolves at the moment. This list I will give to the wolves. Not sure what they will be able to make with this information, but it might be of interest to them.
These sound really interesting modifications!
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Old 02-11-2007, 03:12 PM   #23
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Girl power!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
Rule adjustments (blessed be he who invented the admin threads!):

It was a she actually *ahem* ...but all blessings gratefully accepted
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Old 02-11-2007, 05:17 PM   #24
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Where are you people? A nice game of werewolf on a tray and no one (the seven not included) takes the bite?

You can't be serious?
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:33 AM   #25
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I can be two people if you wish.

Honestly, I haven't played for that long. I have some catching up to do.
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Old 02-12-2007, 08:55 AM   #26
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Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Macalaure is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Hmmm, not exactly an onrush of players here.

Do you all feel the need to take a break from werewolf at the moment? Shall I delay the beginning for a week or two? No problem to me.

Or should each of the seven play two people?
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Old 02-12-2007, 03:10 PM   #27
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Omg!!! (<-- I apologize for using that)

I want to be two people!!

It could maybe work, if you gave everyone "two lives." Their first life, they're one role, another in their next... Maybe start out with two wolves and two gifteds of some sort, then add more as people, though it won't necessarily be adding, because the first lives wolves and gifteds could naturally be killed...

Yes, I'll stop now.....
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Old 02-12-2007, 05:12 PM   #28
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Sure, I'll be two people!

If people die and are reincarnated, though, everyone will know what the person's role is.
I'm for being two people simultaneously!
"Rikae looks very suspicious, the way she's casting suspicion on me for no reason.."
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Old 02-12-2007, 07:27 PM   #29
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Come on! I just got back in the game! You all can't take a break now!
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Old 02-13-2007, 03:02 AM   #30
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This is quite ridiculous, but because of lack of players (means this game can't start so soon) you'll have one player less. I will have slight problems getting online next weekend and I won't have a net access at my disposal from the 22nd to 25th and I can't count on dying before that, so Mac please remove me from the list. *sigh*

(But if you're starting the game much much later than you thought (around the 25th), then you can put me back to that list...)
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Old 02-13-2007, 03:28 AM   #31
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I highly doubt I will be able to start before next week, so I'll keep you in with a question mark.


Or we could play a game of six players! One wolf, one über-gifted and four innocents...

okay, maybe not.
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Old 02-13-2007, 03:33 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
I highly doubt I will be able to start before next week, so I'll keep you in with a question mark.
That's alright. Actually, I almost hope you will suffer from a lack of players for so long that I actually get to play...

Mac
, have you pm-spammed people? That helps sometimes, you know...
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Old 02-13-2007, 03:37 AM   #33
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Right now, I would need to hook 9 people via pm-spamming. Unlikely.
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Old 02-13-2007, 07:13 PM   #34
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You never know- the last two games I was involved in were due to PM's I recieved. If it hadn't been for the PM's, I'd probably still be awol.
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Old 02-13-2007, 07:47 PM   #35
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cause roa told me too...

i'm in, but i will be away from thursday till monday just to warn you, so if you start next week then i'm good to go
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Old 02-14-2007, 02:47 AM   #36
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Welcome!


Now, for the time being, I will plan to begin next Monday at 9PM GMT with Night one. (sorry, Lommy)

I'll start some more... well.. "aggressive" forms of marketing in a few days if I have to.
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Old 02-14-2007, 03:25 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macalaure
Now, for the time being, I will plan to begin next Monday at 9PM GMT with Night one. (sorry, Lommy)
Never mind that. I guess I can cope with missing one game, (however promising it looks).


Quote:
I'll start some more... well.. "aggressive" forms of marketing in a few days if I have to.
Good! Kill them all!
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Old 02-14-2007, 08:20 AM   #38
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with Lommy's note, i will be posting late too, seeing i dn't get home till about 10-11 PM and Monday night, but i will post the next morning for sure
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Old 02-14-2007, 10:19 AM   #39
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Rikae is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Rikae is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Rikae is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
If day falls on a Tuesday or Thursday I won't be around at the deadline and will have to vote early (around 1-2 GMT) since I have classes in the (my) afternoon.
Does anyone else derive an inexplicable glee from thinking about time zones? I suppose I'm just a bit slow. Maybe it's just that the thought of the massive distances involved borders on the sublime - I digress. I'll shut up now.
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Old 02-15-2007, 12:43 PM   #40
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Shield

What about the new Barrowdowners who may never have heard of Werewolf?

*warning: horrible pun ahead*

Werewolf needs fresh blood.
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