Dwarf Wraiths - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Gorin Icearms · 03-19-2002, 06:16 PM

I was just curious, why weren't there any Dwarf ringwraiths? Most likely it's because the Dwarf rings were just designed to increase wealth (I think that was the main purpose) and greed. But could someone with profound knowledge clear this up for me?

(And yeah, I'm gonna read about the Rings again, but I'm not a very smart person. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img] )

Alchrivëwen · 03-19-2002, 06:24 PM

When gandalf was talking about knowing it was the One he said all the nine and sevenhave been accounted for and the three have never been lost so Sauron had the ringgs, also at the council of elrond Glion sttod up and told about what happened at the lonely mountain where a ringwraith offered him the sven and moria back if he could tell him where Bilbo was

Lyliac · 03-19-2002, 07:56 PM

i think that the dwarfs are harder to make evil than men.

Bruce MacCulloch · 03-19-2002, 09:16 PM

There were no Dwarven Ringwraiths because the Dewarves could not be turned so easily as Men. Their motivations were too different.

Quote:

Seven Rings he gave to the Dwarves; but to Men he gave nine, for Men proved in this matter as in others the readiest to his will. And all those rings that he governed he perverted, the more easily since he had a part in their making, and they were accursed, and they betrayed in the end all those that used them. The Dwarves indeed proved tough and hard to tame; they ill endure the domination of others, and the thoughts of their hearts are hard to fathom, nor can they be turned to shadows. They used their rings only for the getting of wealth; but wrath and an over-mastering greed of gold were kindled in their hearts, of which evil enough after came to the profit of Sauron. It is said that the foundation of each of the Seven Hoards of the Dwarf-kings of old was a golden ring; but all those hoards long ago were plundered and the Dragons devoured them, and of the Seven Rings some were consumed in fire and some Sauron recovered.

Silmarillion, "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age"

Orodhromeus · 03-20-2002, 02:01 PM

The fate of the Seven can be found in LotR, Book 1, Ch. 2:

Quote:

"Seven the Kwarf-Kings possessed, but three he [Sauron] has recovered, and the others the dragons have consumed." -Gandalf

Marileangorifurnimaluim · 03-20-2002, 02:12 PM

Gandalf wasn't 100% certain of the fate of all the Dwarven rings. I've long felt Gloin's sudden discomfort at the Council in Rivendell when the subject of the lost dwarven rings was brought up indicated he new more than he wanted - or was free - to say.

It's just like the dwarves to keep this kind of secret, not lie directly, but simply leave out a crucial secret fact. I suspect Dain had one of the unaccounted for rings (though not the one that was meant to go to Thorin). Part and parcel of why he was not tempted by Sauron's offer.

On the subject of why the Dwarves were not so easily turned and there are no Dwarf ringwraiths, it's mentioned in the Silm. that Aule specifically made them tough and resistant to Melkor and his works (Melkor is also known as Morgoth and Sauron was his servant). Dwarves were not imagined in the original song, but fashioned in the image of elves due to Aule's impatience to bring living thinking beings to ME.

Since they were imagined by him after the betrayal of Melkor, Aule added specifically to their make-up a resistance to him. Men and Elves were conceived of before Melkor turned to evil, though they came into being later.

[ March 20, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ]

Birdland · 03-21-2002, 12:08 AM

Quote:

I've long felt Gloin's sudden discomfort at the Council in Rivendell when the subject of the lost dwarven rings was brought up indicated he new more than he wanted - or was free - to say.

Interesting. I'd always attributed his reaction to either sorrow or shame that the Dwarves had lost the Rings, along with so much else, through the centuries.

The dwarves are secretive, but I have a feeling that if they did still possess a Ring it would have come to light in the story.

03-19-2002, 06:16 PM	#1
Gorin Icearms Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 67	Dwarf Wraiths I was just curious, why weren't there any Dwarf ringwraiths? Most likely it's because the Dwarf rings were just designed to increase wealth (I think that was the main purpose) and greed. But could someone with profound knowledge clear this up for me? (And yeah, I'm gonna read about the Rings again, but I'm not a very smart person. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img] ) __________________ The Moon is Rising! Oh hey, I'm a wight now. WORSHIP ME IN ALL MY WIGHTNESS!!! MUAHAHAHA!!

03-19-2002, 06:24 PM	#2
Alchrivëwen Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Everywhere and aywhere, look behind you! Posts: 56	When gandalf was talking about knowing it was the One he said all the nine and sevenhave been accounted for and the three have never been lost so Sauron had the ringgs, also at the council of elrond Glion sttod up and told about what happened at the lonely mountain where a ringwraith offered him the sven and moria back if he could tell him where Bilbo was __________________ A Elbereth Gilthoniel!

03-19-2002, 07:56 PM	#3
Lyliac Pile O'Bones Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: The Dead Marshes Posts: 25	i think that the dwarfs are harder to make evil than men. __________________ "Atheism is a non-prophet organization" [img] C:\Documents and Settings\user1\My Documents\My Pictures\sig1.gif [/img]

03-20-2002, 02:12 PM	#6
Marileangorifurnimaluim Eerie Forest Spectre Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Buried in scrolls of fanfiction Posts: 798	Gandalf wasn't 100% certain of the fate of all the Dwarven rings. I've long felt Gloin's sudden discomfort at the Council in Rivendell when the subject of the lost dwarven rings was brought up indicated he new more than he wanted - or was free - to say. It's just like the dwarves to keep this kind of secret, not lie directly, but simply leave out a crucial secret fact. I suspect Dain had one of the unaccounted for rings (though not the one that was meant to go to Thorin). Part and parcel of why he was not tempted by Sauron's offer. On the subject of why the Dwarves were not so easily turned and there are no Dwarf ringwraiths, it's mentioned in the Silm. that Aule specifically made them tough and resistant to Melkor and his works (Melkor is also known as Morgoth and Sauron was his servant). Dwarves were not imagined in the original song, but fashioned in the image of elves due to Aule's impatience to bring living thinking beings to ME. Since they were imagined by him after the betrayal of Melkor, Aule added specifically to their make-up a resistance to him. Men and Elves were conceived of before Melkor turned to evil, though they came into being later. [ March 20, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ] __________________ Deserves death! I daresay he does... And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them?